I agree fully with what you are saying, however would the law see it that
way? I'm sure (using a google search) that I found 'vehicles not subject to
European Certification do not require their towbars to be certified,
although I can't seem to find it now - just many towbar sellers giving their
'interpretation' of the legal position.
I agree it's probably best not to 'rattle any cages', and also believe that
the Quantum mountings provided are more than adequate. My experience from
the mainstream car industry indicates that some production cars are
'built -down' to be barely adequate for some features, and 'ahem' some tests
'aren't really', however I'm not going to discuss unless in an unbugged room
with running water!
As an aside, trailers are now required (if built after Oct 2012) to have IVA
or full type approval, and caravans will follow soon (Oct 2014 I believe).
All of these regs (although well-intended) seem to do though is create more
bother (or income?) and also more danger (possibly).....
I can see the scenario of old, rusted trailers being used in preference due
to their age 'advantage' and being a danger, likewise we see some kit cars
appearing on old Triumph chassis, which by any reckoning aren't as competent
as new items.
End of rant, Martin
----- Original Message -----
From: "Hamish Freeman" <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, April 05, 2013 3:10 PM
Subject: RE: [Quantum Owners] More on Tow bars
How about a different interpretation of the rules. As I understand it, any
car that has European certification has to have both a certified tow bar
attachment point and a certified tow bar / trailer hitch. For this reason I
have always argued the inclusion of a tow bar and electrics to be included
in the price when buying a Tintop so as not to fall foul of the law.
In the case of a kit car, it does not have "European certification" in the
form of a "type test" nor has there been the necessity to submit a full
Finite Element Analysis (FEA) of the structure of the car to prove that all
loads and stresses within the car are well within the legislated safety
factors under all expected operating conditions. I believe however that Old
Q did get Aston University to do an FEA on the H4?
For a kit car the means of attachment for a tow bar is not necessarily
defined or tested by the manufacturer as would be necessary for a full
certification, i.e. another hour during the FEA work to prove that the
mounting points have a desired safety factor.
If the car itself is not certified then by inference it cannot have a
certified tow bar arrangement. The implications of this are that if the
police stop you and look for the vehicle certification identity (Either with
the VIN or on the B post if I recall on a Tintop) they will not find one as
the vehicle will only have either SVA or IVA, notification of which is not
necessary on the vehicle, in which case testing of tow bar attachment points
to a given standard cannot be mandatory.
On a practical point, my Beauford had a factory tow bar attachment plate
fitted as part of the chassis and this was totally ignored during both IVA
tests - believe me the inspector did not miss a trick on anything else (
having had an accident reported back to him as an unsafe vehicle on a car
that he had passed, which to his credit was later established to have been
due to modifications made after the test) and things on which my car failed
have sailed through at other test stations, in particular the rear seat belt
attachments where the factory approach was considered inadequate and I had
to build and weld in a 50 mm square tube frame inside the rear of the car to
take the load - I have a much safer car as a result! The comment there was
either prove it is strong enough by means of a "pull test" or use something
that is "more than adequate" in the eyes of the inspectors, i.e. the "Brick
Outhouse" approach.
Any contact with VOSA will most likely lead straight back to the IVA manual.
I read the early version (pre 2010) cover to cover and do not recall
anything on tow bars so taking my experience into account, anything that we
use to attach a tow bar to a fibreglass car will certainly be "more than
adequate" in lieu of the need to spread the load over the fibreglass. As an
example, my H4 tow bar is attached by 2" heavy duty angle iron strips either
side of the boot floor at each side, the length of the boot floor with 3 off
M10 bolts each side to bolt the angles through the fibreglass to spread the
load. To these a Mondeo Estate tow bar is attached to the vertical faces of
the outside angle iron. The Mondeo bar does of course have a certification
and for much higher loads than I would ever want to pull. After ~ 10 years
no distress has been noted on any of the components above.
Sorry for the ramble but this whole subject seems to be a mess and not
necessarily sorted out by the authorities even in the case of certified
cars.
Hamish
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
On Behalf Of Eddie
Sent: 04 April 2013 22:56
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Quantum Owners] More Towbars for Eddie
Hi All
I have tried to contact VOSA without success. Basically all I get is answer
machines.
I have had a look at the tow bar that I have and I am sure it is where
Quantum started when modifying them for our cars.
However......many new rules and regulations have now come into force. Due
to these I am not happy about making new tow bars for our cars. This is due
in part that I would have to get them made by a third party. If ons was to
fail in operation, the litigation fall out could be a nightmare, so on this
occasion I will have to leave this for now.
Eddie
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