Dear Rich, > -----Original Message----- > From: Richard M. Heiberger [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Wednesday, August 13, 2014 1:30 PM > To: John Fox > Cc: Prof Brian Ripley; peter dalgaard; R-SIG-Mac > Subject: Re: [R-SIG-Mac] bypassing the R.app help browser? > > John, > > I have noticed what I think is a related issue. I normally run R > under emacs with ESS. > help files open an emacs buffer. When I run Rcmdr on the Mac, then > Rcmdr changes the help > file location to something on the Mac. It restores the emacs buffer > destination when I close Rcmdr. > Is there, or can there be, an option to leave the help files in emacs?
At the moment, help handling is in flux as a consequence of this thred. Currently in the new Rcmdr version 2.1-0 on R-Forge, there is an Rcmdr help_type option that overrides (and restores on exit) the help_type option in options(). By default, this is set to "html", but you should be able to set it to whatever works with emacs -- I suppose options(Rcmdr=list(help_type="text")) would do the trick. Please try this out and let me know if it does what you want. The Rcmdr package isn't currently building on R-Forge for reasons that I don't completely understand: R-Forge complains that some package dependencies are missing, but these "missing" packages *are* on CRAN. So you'll have to download the Rcmdr sources via svn checkout svn://svn.r-forge.r-project.org/svnroot/rcmdr/pkg/Rcmdr-current and build the package yourself. Best, John > Thanks > > Rich > > > On Wed, Aug 13, 2014 at 12:56 PM, John Fox <[email protected]> wrote: > > Dear Brian and Peter, > > > > Thanks for picking up this issue. > > > > The behaviour that Brian reports is exactly what I observed, and the > Tcl/Tk > > doc that he quotes is what I consulted. It's not surprising to me > that the R > > process waits until the Tk window calling tkwait.window() is > destroyed. I > > suppose that because the internal help browser runs under the R > process, it > > too waits, while an external browser -- as is spawned by help.start() > -- > > runs in an independent process. > > > > As I mentioned, I've removed the call to tkwait.window() in the Rcmdr > > sources (it's in a "macro" called by every Rcmdr modal dialog) and > will test > > whether there are negative consequences. I've observed none so far. > > > > BTW, the same issue arises when the Rcmdr is run inside of RStudio, > which > > directs help to its own browser. > > > > Best, > > John > > > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: Prof Brian Ripley [mailto:[email protected]] > >> Sent: Wednesday, August 13, 2014 11:08 AM > >> To: peter dalgaard; John Fox > >> Cc: R-SIG-Mac > >> Subject: Re: [R-SIG-Mac] bypassing the R.app help browser? > >> > >> On 13/08/2014 15:11, peter dalgaard wrote: > >> > This isn't unique to tcltk. Anything that blocks the keyboard loop > >> blocks the help browser too. Try e.g. opening the help for ls, type > >> Sys.sleep(15) and watch the beach ball in the help browser as you > try > >> to scroll in it. > >> > >> But Sys.sleep should not be blocking an event loop: from its help > >> > >> The intention is that this function suspends execution of R > >> expressions but wakes the process up often enough to respond > to > >> GUI events, typically every 0.5 seconds. > >> > >> The mechanisms to mesh event loops which are in place for Sys.sleep > >> are > >> R_CheckUserInterrupt (which calls R_ProcessEvents) and > R_runHandlers. > >> > >> Note that the help for tkwait says (on my box) > >> > >> While the tkwait command is waiting it processes events in > >> the > >> normal > >> fashion, so the application will continue to respond to > user > >> interac- > >> tions. If an event handler invokes tkwait again, the > nested > >> call to > >> tkwait must complete before the outer call can complete. > >> > >> but as this is X11 Tk, it means X11/Unix events. You can > demonstrate > >> that, as e.g the http server still works (use help.start() first). > >> > >> > >> > -pd > >> > > >> > > >> > On 13 Aug 2014, at 15:14 , John Fox <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > > >> >> Dear Simon, > >> >> > >> >> Here's a simple script that will demonstrate the problem: > >> >> > >> >> ----- snip ----- > >> >> > >> >> library(tcltk) > >> >> > >> >> top <- tktoplevel() > >> >> button <- ttkbutton(top, text="help", command=function() > >> print(help(lm))) > >> >> tkgrid(button) > >> >> tkwait.window(top) > >> >> > >> >> ----- snip ----- > >> >> > >> >> The problem is produced by tkwait.window(), and this call is in > all > >> Rcmdr modal dialogs. As I read the Tcl/Tk docs, it shouldn't cause > >> problems, but obviously it's causing this problem. I'm also not > >> certain whether calling tkwait.windows() is necessary and will look > >> into the consequences of removing it -- I believe that it's been > there > >> for many years, from the earliest versions of the Rcmdr. > >> >> > >> >> With respect to changing using preferences, this is done only > until > >> the Commander() exits. If getting rid of the call to tkwait.window() > >> proves problematic, I can ask the user for permission in a pop-up > >> dialog. > >> >> > >> >> Thanks for your help, > >> >> John > >> >> > >> >> On Wed, 13 Aug 2014 00:25:30 -0400 > >> >> Simon Urbanek <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >>> John, > >> >>> > >> >>> can't you address the underlying issue instead and don't block > the > >> event loop? A lot of things don't work if the event loop is blocked > and > >> I would argue that changing user's preferences behind the scenes is > a > >> violation of the CRAN policies. > >> >>> I'm happy to help if you send me a bit more details. > >> >>> > >> >>> Cheers, > >> >>> Simon > >> >>> > >> >>> > >> >>> On Aug 12, 2014, at 6:15 PM, John Fox <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >>> > >> >>>> Hi Marc, > >> >>>> > >> >>>>> -----Original Message----- > >> >>>>> From: Marc Schwartz [mailto:[email protected]] > >> >>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 12, 2014 5:10 PM > >> >>>>> To: John Fox > >> >>>>> Cc: [email protected] > >> >>>>> Subject: Re: [R-SIG-Mac] bypassing the R.app help browser? > >> >>>>> > >> >>>>> Hi John, > >> >>>>> > >> >>>>> Happy to help. I recalled seeing something previously on this, > so > >> a > >> >>>>> search using rseek.org was fruitful. > >> >>>>> > >> >>>>> The potential gotcha, of course, is if for some reason the GUI > >> exits in > >> >>>>> a manner possibly not under your control. The setting would > not > >> be > >> >>>>> returned to the default and the therefore, as you note, > retained > >> for a > >> >>>>> subsequent session where the behavior may not be desired. > >> >>>>> > >> >>>> > >> >>>> Yes, there is that possibility. > >> >>>> > >> >>>>> If this is for Rcmdr, perhaps this is something that could be > >> added to > >> >>>>> a menu, where the user can alter the behavior in either > direction > >> as > >> >>>>> desired, if that makes sense. > >> >>>>> > >> >>>> > >> >>>> As you guessed, this is for the Rcmdr, where the built-in R.app > >> browser > >> >>>> doesn't play well with dialog help buttons -- the browser is > >> unresponsive > >> >>>> until the dialog that called it closes -- while an external > html- > >> help > >> >>>> browser works fine. > >> >>>> > >> >>>> I've now successfully implemented the approach I outlined, in > >> which the > >> >>>> previous setting is restored when the Commander GUI closes. As > you > >> point > >> >>>> out, this isn't bullet-proof, but I think it is the best I can > do > >> for now. > >> >>>> Allowing the user to apply the change would be safer, but users > >> are unlikely > >> >>>> to discover the option. > >> >>>> > >> >>>>> Simon would need to comment on the potential for alternatives. > >> >>>> > >> >>>> Yes, that would be welcome. I still think that a setting via > >> options() would > >> >>>> be better. > >> >>>> > >> >>>> Thanks again for your help, > >> >>>> John > >> >>>> > >> >>>>> > >> >>>>> Best regards, > >> >>>>> > >> >>>>> Marc > >> >>>>> > >> >>>>> > >> >>>>> On Aug 12, 2014, at 3:46 PM, John Fox <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> >>>>> > >> >>>>>> Hi Marc, > >> >>>>>> > >> >>>>>> Thanks for this. It does work, and I wasn't aware of it -- > >> you've > >> >>>>> obviously > >> >>>>>> done a better job than I did of searching for a solution! > >> >>>>>> > >> >>>>>> Although this approach works, it has the disadvantage of > >> permanently > >> >>>>>> changing the help browser in R.app, beyond the current > session, > >> at > >> >>>>> least > >> >>>>>> until the change is explicitly undone. I think that I can > work > >> around > >> >>>>> that > >> >>>>>> by something like > >> >>>>>> > >> >>>>>> current <- system("defaults read org.R-project.R", > >> intern=TRUE) > >> >>>>>> > >> >>>>>> to discover whether the use.external.help preference exists, > and > >> if > >> >>>>> so, what > >> >>>>>> its value is; to then set the preference to YES if it's NO or > >> unset; > >> >>>>> and > >> >>>>>> finally to remove the preference on exit. > >> >>>>>> > >> >>>>>> Again, thanks -- I think that I can work with this, though it > >> would > >> >>>>> in my > >> >>>>>> opinion be better if the help browser were settable for the > >> current > >> >>>>> session > >> >>>>>> directly via options() in R, or if one could specify the > browser > >> in a > >> >>>>> call > >> >>>>>> to help(). > >> >>>>>> > >> >>>>>> Best (and thanks again), > >> >>>>>> John > >> >>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> -----Original Message----- > >> >>>>>>> From: Marc Schwartz [mailto:[email protected]] > >> >>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 12, 2014 4:04 PM > >> >>>>>>> To: John Fox > >> >>>>>>> Cc: [email protected] > >> >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [R-SIG-Mac] bypassing the R.app help browser? > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> On Aug 12, 2014, at 2:33 PM, John Fox <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>>> Dear list members, > >> >>>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>>> Is there a way to bypass the R.app help browser, and to use > >> instead > >> >>>>>>> an alternative browser, such as the one pointed to by > >> >>>>>>> getOption("browser")? > >> >>>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>>> I've tried a number of strategies, including setting > >> .Platform$GUI > >> >>>>> <- > >> >>>>>>> "unknown". The only approach I tried that works is to mask > the > >> >>>>> help() > >> >>>>>>> function with a modified version, but this produces other > >> problems, > >> >>>>>>> such as referencing unexported objects from utils and tools. > >> >>>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>>> It would be nice if the help() function had a browser > >> argument, > >> >>>>>>> similar to that in browseURL(), and defaulting to the > current > >> >>>>>>> behaviour. > >> >>>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>>> Any suggestions would be appreciated. > >> >>>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>>> John > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> John, > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> I found this post from Simon that seems to work: > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> https://stat.ethz.ch/pipermail/r-sig-mac/2009- > >> December/006908.html > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> I tried it on my Mac in the latest version of R.app, which I > >> >>>>> normally > >> >>>>>>> do not use and the help system does now popup a browser. > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> Regards, > >> >>>>>>> > >> >>>>>>> Marc Schwartz > >> >>>>>> > >> >>>> > >> >>>> _______________________________________________ > >> >>>> R-SIG-Mac mailing list > >> >>>> [email protected] > >> >>>> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-sig-mac > >> >>>> > >> >>> > >> >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ > >> >> R-SIG-Mac mailing list > >> >> [email protected] > >> >> https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-sig-mac > >> > > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Brian D. Ripley, [email protected] > >> Emeritus Professor of Applied Statistics, University of Oxford > >> 1 South Parks Road, Oxford OX1 3TG, UK > > > > _______________________________________________ > > R-SIG-Mac mailing list > > [email protected] > > https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-sig-mac _______________________________________________ R-SIG-Mac mailing list [email protected] https://stat.ethz.ch/mailman/listinfo/r-sig-mac
