There are many prominent church fathers. You won't find many more hard working nose-to-the-grindstone guys than, say, John Calvin.
Humility in a Christian sense does not mean being passive or being lazy waiting for manna to fall from heaven. I agree that we have to take responsibility for ourselves. I add to your thought expressed below the achievement of an optimal state. Humility allows for the notion that an optimal state can be enhanced by a spiritual awareness of direction provided from God. Chris From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Mike Gonzalez Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 7:19 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [RC] On humility I quoted the preeminent church father himself, St. Thomas Aquinas. If we let God work through us for food, then we starve to death. At some point, we have to take responsibility for ourselves, whether that be to find sustenance or create the optimal state. On Tue, Jan 10, 2012 at 9:00 PM, Chris Hahn <[email protected]> wrote: Mike, You are missing the Christian definition of humble that Ernie referenced. It is not about submitting to one's superior in an old British sense of social class; rather, it is about listening to God. If we presume to tell God what is in our best interest, then we are lacking humility. Arrogance is the presumption that we can usurp the infinite intelligence of God with our human will. Humility allows God to work through us for a higher purpose. Ernie can probably elaborate more eloquently. One thing is clear in our discussion today... words matter. If the terms progressive or humility have loaded meanings that distract the casual reader from the true message, then we need to find better words. Chris -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Michael Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 5:42 PM To: [email protected] Subject: [RC] On humility Aristotle placed pride as the proper mean between humility and vanity. Why not fulfill our agenda with pride? One of central pieces of our ideology is that we freely usurp parts of anything right, but that doesn't mean that we need to fight placidly, as if we're only borrowing the truth. A certain sense of purpose in implementation is a virtue, even if we aren't the 'true believer' type. Keep in mind St. Thomas Aquinas' definition of humility, that it "consists in keeping oneself within one's own bounds, not reaching out to things above one, but submitting to one's superior." Is that really what we want to be- people who submit themselves to servitude? -- Centroids: The Center of the Radical Centrist Community <[email protected]> Google Group: http://groups.google.com/group/RadicalCentrism Radical Centrism website and blog: http://RadicalCentrism.org -- Centroids: The Center of the Radical Centrist Community <[email protected]> Google Group: http://groups.google.com/group/RadicalCentrism Radical Centrism website and blog: http://RadicalCentrism.org -- Centroids: The Center of the Radical Centrist Community <[email protected]> Google Group: http://groups.google.com/group/RadicalCentrism Radical Centrism website and blog: http://RadicalCentrism.org -- Centroids: The Center of the Radical Centrist Community <[email protected]> Google Group: http://groups.google.com/group/RadicalCentrism Radical Centrism website and blog: http://RadicalCentrism.org
