Well said. Sent from my iPhone
> On Oct 19, 2018, at 00:54, Billy Rojas <[email protected]> > wrote: > > Ernie: > > There were all sorts of ideas we discussed on Thursday that merit additional > thought. > > For myself, some ideas need additional clarification. But we were "thinking > out loud" > > at least half of the time and neither of us could have delivered "finished > products." > > > > I very much like the approach you suggested, about a hypothetical council to > remake > > Christianity in the years after the fall of the Temple. But this got me > thinking about > > the fact that Christianity has been re-invented several times in the past, > > including at least three times in its early history. > > > > Actually it was reinvented at some point in the late 70s or no later than > around 90 AD > > with the rise of the Gospels -which did not exist before then. Surely > various stories > > we now know from the Gospels were in circulation before that time but some > literary genius, > > whom we now call "Mark," invented the gospel genre and it changed the course > not only > > of Christian history, but all of history. > > > > We also know that in that era any number of "gospels" were written, a best > estimate being > > 35 or so, even if most are now lost or only survive in fragments. > > > > Especially interesting about Mark is the fact -there is a scholarly book on > the subject- > > that Mark, at first anyway, was performance literature. It was meant as > script material, > > something to read dramatically, to enact, and perchance to discuss afterwards. > > In the midst of this development, say 100 AD or maybe 110, came Revelation, > > which also is narrative literature, which tells an historical story > > and, to boot, a story about the future. But in this era there still could be > > question about Christianity being a special type of Judaism. The Ebionites > > were still around, for example. Also in ca 100 AD or as late as around 115, > > came the Diatessaron, which was extra-Biblical but sought to create order > > out of disparate early Christian traditions -including some that were shortly > > to pass away or be greatly modified, like the wandering Christian prophets. > > Separation from Judaism was only partly in effect in this period. > > > > > > Some time after the end of the second Jewish War, which was over by about 125, > > the final break became inevitable. Christianity had to be re-invented yet > again. > > Here's where we get Clement (flourished 170 AD until ca 210) and we get the > > Marcionists and Valentinus, plus the "great Gnostic sidetrack" as I think of > it. > > Clement is key to all of this and deserves far more attention than I have > > so far given him, which is more than a little but far from enough. > > Christianity was no longer Jewish but what it would become was still > > in question. Clement both pushed Christianity in an orthodox direction > > and also in what, by later standards, would come to be regarded as a > > quite heterodox direction. > > > > > > > > The third re-invention of Christianity took place in the era of Constantine > > and included a "war of ideas" against the Arians. While even then, "Pagan" > > ideas and motifs were in full retreat everywhere within the Church, > > there still were vestiges. There still are, of course, but they are > > hanging on by their fingernails, you might say. Back in the 4th century > > they could rise to the level of significant undercurrents or ways of thinking. > > > > You can add a 4th re-invention brought about by Augustine. No argument > > from me on that; mostly I am favorably impressed. The only thing to add is > that > > by his time just about all of the foundation was already in place, and he had > little > > to do with any of that side of things. > > > > If you were to speak of the East there would be one other re-invention, that > of > > the Assyrians, viz Nestorians, which is very important to me, personally, > > but that means little or nothing to mainstream Christians in the West > > or in the "third world" today. > > > > > > There would be still more re-inventions, especially those that came about > > during and in the aftermath of the Reformation. > > > > I think we are on the verge of another re-invention even if we can't yet see > more > > than some rough outlines or conceptualize more than a few of its basic ideas. > > > > > > > > OK, here is a beginning toward a more adequate discussion of "re-inventing > Christianity." > > > > > > > > Billy > > > > > > -- > -- > Centroids: The Center of the Radical Centrist Community > <[email protected]> > Google Group: http://groups.google.com/group/RadicalCentrism > Radical Centrism website and blog: http://RadicalCentrism.org > > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Centroids: The Center of the Radical Centrist Community" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- -- Centroids: The Center of the Radical Centrist Community <[email protected]> Google Group: http://groups.google.com/group/RadicalCentrism Radical Centrism website and blog: http://RadicalCentrism.org --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Centroids: The Center of the Radical Centrist Community" group. 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