Well Mike Casey, if I disrespected anyone here, it would be a first. It's just not me.
While the response I gave was arguably terse, I don't see where any disrespect was tendered upon Lena (or anyone). Why would I do that? You will notice I said when this issue (or the like) comes up in _other NGs_, the respondants can be unkind to say the least. Some NGs are downright brutal and nasty (classic VB is an example) at times. This forum has a more congenial feel and you will find the dialogs to be casual, to say the least, given that many of the participants have known each other for a couple of decades (and longer). I will still throw a blanket over the idea of 600 plus controls on one form as with a table with 600 plus columns. First blush would tell you that some "normalization" should be addressed to the condition of either, not withstanding (even though the form is unbound) likely some of (perhaps many) of the controls are "lookups" further entangling the display or manipulation of the form. Karen's response about adding the additional tab and additional columns until the condition Lena mentions manifested itself, speaks that the practical limit had been breached and lends credence to my "opinion" that it is an idea that should be tweaked back a bit to a managable size. Respectfully, Mike ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Casey" <[email protected]> To: "RBASE-L Mailing List" <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2011 4:40 PM Subject: [RBASE-L] - RE: RBWin 7.6 - Controls on a form limit You are going to disrespect a person for asking a general question? Unfortunately, while we do our best to guide management and our users on the form layout, ultimately they have the final say on how they want their forms to look and run. Some environments do not allow for programmers to provide input into the design process. But I can assure you that Lena is a top notch programmer with an extensive career in programming. And should be greatly respected, regardless of what questions she might ask. -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Mike Byerley Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2011 1:07 PM To: RBASE-L Mailing List Subject: [RBASE-L] - RE: RBWin 7.6 - Controls on a form limit Just so you know, most every "edit" type control has a handle (it is a window unto itself). You can see how this would become burdensome for an applications main window to know the whereabouts of the myriad child windows spawned in its instance. I was just trying to remember when the last time I can recall an application that would have had 600 plus controls hosted in one form.... Oh yeah, never. Not to say it hasn't happened before, because I know it has been attempted, and when troubles like you have described are mentioned in other NGs, the person seeking guidance is usually not handled with the greatest respect... You need to derail this idea at your earliest... ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lena Dammstrom" <[email protected]> To: "RBASE-L Mailing List" <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2011 10:26 AM Subject: [RBASE-L] - RE: RBWin 7.6 - Controls on a form limit Tom/Javier - thanks for your hints and thoughts. This is a variable form (not data bound). I do not believe I am at the systems memory limits. I do not see major fluctuations in memory, the form does not retrieve tons of data. The controls utilize various tables, although some of the controls do use the same table(s). I create temporary views in the "On Before Start EEP" and do not explicitly drop the temp views upon exit. Some of the tables do have same column names, but are by design; for they are foreign keys. I am not using alias column names in my views. Was never an apparent issue in the past, but I will have to rethink that subject. I've been building and testing this form basically tab page by tab page. The views, tables, list views were put into place towards the start my efforts. The strangeness started after about 550 controls on form with: when in design mode, clicking on the control does not display that controls attributes (height, width, position ...) after running in design mode. If I right click, I can get the display to work. The control's attribute display does update if freshly opened via design mode (before running via design mode). The error message "List index out of bounds" started after about the 648th control. The error message appears when hitting the button that closes the form. This button does some checking, issues CLOSEWINDOW which goes into the ON CLOSE EEP. On close just sets some variables and closes form. I've put in a trace, and the error message appears after the RETURN in ON Close is issued. So tracing is showing me nothing. Again this error does not appear if form is RUN out of design mode. I removed 2 of the last controls I placed on the form, and the error message goes away. If I add two variable RadioButtons, the error returns. I removed the 2 radiobuttons the error goes away. This is why I am thinking I've hit some number of controls on a form limit......... Tom - I with you on the thoughts of breaking up the form into more than one form. But my directive was to show/do everything on one form! Any other ideas? Regards Lena Dammstrom QMI Security Solutions From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Javier Valencia Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2011 6:13 PM To: RBASE-L Mailing List Subject: [RBASE-L] - RE: RBWin 7.6 - Controls on a form limit Also, if you are creating temporary tables on the "before design: and deleting them on the "on exit" EEP, the tables will no longer be there when you run the form from the designer, exit the form and return to the designer. Javier, Javier Valencia, PE 913-829-0888 Office 913-915-3137 Cell 913-649-2904 Fax Visit us at www.vtgonline.com<http://www.vtgonline.com/> ________________________________ From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Tom Frederick Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2011 5:29 PM To: RBASE-L Mailing List Subject: [RBASE-L] - RE: RBWin 7.6 - Controls on a form limit Two items: 1. You hitting your system's memory limits? 2. Do all the controls go to the same table or are they spread over multiple tables and views? Check for duplicate column names. (Same column names in a Table and a View) or (same column name in two different tables) = duplicates if used in the same form or report. It forced me to learn about using aliases in views. Sounds like you have 40 items a page. I had similar issues with an Enhanced tab with lots of pages with dense info entry. All those lookups need to get loaded when you start up. Ended up breaking it up into a Form with a menu system using Bit and Speed buttons. Each menu button has its own specific Forms with about 40 items each and is isolated from the others. Load 40 items compared to 650 at one time. Lot less memory, better control over names, unneeded variables cleared at form exit, and easier to track what was going on. Runs quick. Tom Frederick President/CEO Elm City Center 1314 W Walnut Jacksonville, IL 62650 W- 217-245-9504 F - 217-245-2350 E - [email protected] From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Lena Dammstrom Sent: Wednesday, June 29, 2011 3:54 PM To: RBASE-L Mailing List Subject: [RBASE-L] - RBWin 7.6 - Controls on a form limit Hi, I am working with RBase Win 7.6 and I have been creating a form with an Enhanced tab control with 14 pages. Within all those pages/tabs, I have about 650 controls. Labels, var labels, bit buttons, var Lookup Combo boxes, var edit, var lookup ListViews etc... I've been noticing lately as I've been adding on more controls, while in design mode; things are not acting as usual. Such as after I run form in design mode and exit the running of the form via a button, I get an error "List Index out of Bounds ###". The ### changes from 648, 649 ... 659, 660. If I take one control off the form (I think any kind of control, button, listview); I can stop the error from happening. Running form not directly from design mode, I do not get the error message. After running form via design mode: When back in design mode, and I save the form, this "save" icon does not always gray out (save completed) Also when I click on a control (again in design mode), it does not update the status lower bar that shows the controls attributes (variable, width, height...) Have I reached a per form limit of some kind? Total number of controls per form? Total number of tabs/pages per tab control? Or is there something else that is causing my form to act strangely in while in design mode??? Any tips - clues would be greatly appreciated! Regards, Lena QMI Security Solutions X1037
