Alastair:
I also have occasionally had problems with forms in RBW. The recommendation I received from RBTI tech support was to recreate the problematic form from scratch. This has fixed the problem in most cases for me. It seems that occasionally the part of the form that is saved as a BLOB in the #4 file gets corrupted and there is no way to fix it. Good luck! Tony Anthony Schmidt, JD President The Computery Ltd. One East Main Street Bay Shore, NY 11706 631-665-8100 Voice 631-969-5988 Fax http://www.computeryltd.com owner-rbase-l@son etmail.com To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> cc: (bcc: Anthony Schmidt/BayShore/SGU_LN) 06/05/2002 07:16 Subject: Re: Persistant System Crashes but TRACE reports no errors - Razzak's Reply PM Please respond to rbase-l Mike, I hadn't but I have now: warm re-boot, let everything start up normally, then close everything via a dialog if possible, then close the rest via [Ctrl][Alt][Del] except for Explorer & SysTray. Run the app from the icon and it crashes. It takes 3 error message boxes to clear the errors. I then ran the System File Checker and there are a number - I gave up after 20 or so - that were reported as different. I ignored them so that no changes were made because they looked like updates from Microsoft - presumably from the IE5 automatic Windows Update thingy. There were a couple of files that were older than the original which looked more suspicious but I didn't restore the originals of them. That said, there's not a lot of changes made on the system by new software that I install - I'm not one for getting "free" programs from the Internet every chance I can. The opposite, in fact, I like my system lean and mean as far as possible. I don't have a screen saver installed, I don't have a pretty picture on the screen, if I don't know what something is that's running I usually get rid of it (and re-install if I did need it). The only exception to that is RealPlayer (which is a pain generally but seems to be needed by the BBC website for one) which insists on having a background app running that I haven't been able to remove - yet. I do like Norton Utilities running but I try and keep its checks to a minimum - not every second as the defaults generally seem to be. Mostly I reset them to once a day which ends up as being every boot-up. I use SpeeDisk regularly to keep the files contiguous as much as possible. I find that I have fewer problems than others who don't have Norton but maybe W2000 and/or XP have passed the point where Norton is a help. I would upgrade but, in the past, I have found that upgrading Windows is a disaster and the only way to do it safely is to format the hard disk and do a full install. This hardware is 2 years old so probably not quite good enough now for XP. I still think that the form is the key to my problem. That's what I changed and got the problem. Everything worked most of the time before that. As I said, I think RBWin crashes a lot more often than RBDos but more due to app errors than program errors. Which is not to say that I don't think that trace or the error message system should not pick more of them up first instead of bombing out. No longer being able to "see" the tables that forms and reports are stored in as you could in Dos doesn't make spotting problems any easier. When you got trash in the original sys_forms table you could see it and know that it was time to restore an earlier copy or start again (or if you wanted to risk it, try editing the sys_table - it often worked and saved a lot of time and it could be backed-up easily first). Thanks for your suggestions, Regards, Alastair. ----- Original Message ----- From: "MikeB" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 8:48 PM Subject: Re: Persistant System Crashes but TRACE reports no errors - Razzak's Reply > Alastair, > Have you done as I have said and removed ALL background processes except > for "Systray" and "Explorer" > And to further conflag the situation, I would be interested for you to go to > Accessories>System Tools>System Information and from that App goto > Tools>System File Checker and run that utility. You might be quite > surprised at the number of original Windows 98 System Files that have been > trashed since your system was a young girl..... > > I know it seems picky, but I have said several times in this forum, After > ANY software installation, run this utility and restore ANY system files > that are reported changed or altered UNLESS they are from a Microsoft Patch > or upgrade... Win98 allows you to keep your system healthy with this > utility... The Later OS versions do this automatically, all the way to XPs > allowance of the same filename residing in the same directory and only being > associated with the App that installed it.. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Alastair Burr" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 12:47 PM > Subject: Re: Persistant System Crashes but TRACE reports no errors - > Razzak's Reply > > > > Thanks for all the suggestions. To take the points raised: > > > > R:Base is 6.5++p3 - ie: the latest beta running under W98SE. > > > > I, too, have been suspicious of CrashGuard but this app crashes with or > > without it and, generally, when R:Base crashes it is sometime possible to > > re-start it when CrashGuard is running. It has to be said that the Dos > > version I ran before changing to the Windows version of R:Base rarely > > crashed but it seems as if I am now lucky if I get through any R:Base > > session without some form of crash. Obviously is the syntax is wrong then > I > > expect a problem and an error message but this goes through trace without > > any. > > > > For what it's worth since I last cleared the statistics from the > CrashGuard > > log - around mid-July last year - there have been 517 crashes on my > system, > > 219 by rbg65.exe, 8 by gd132.dll, 67 unknown & 19 by kernel32.dll that are > > related to R:Base - a total of 365. The next most frequent is WinWord with > > 37 altogether then all in single figures. Before anybody asks, I have > > re-installed R:Base from the CD just prior to applying the first patch and > > again just before the second patch was added. To be fair, the majority of > > these crashes come in groups when something like this happens and I try > > repeatedly to resolve a problem > > > > Is the error code always the same (Access violation C0000005) ? Not > > exclusively, but certainly the most frequent by a long way and going back > to > > July last year when I changed to RBW. > > > > As Bob Thompson has similar problems with RHIDE does anybody else as well? > I > > thought that this feature was meant to hide the background screen not make > > it inaccessible unless the RSHOW command is run. Any error/crash between > the > > two is a problem. > > > > Yes, I have done the reload and autochk. I have autochk set to run > whenever > > I go to the R:> via a command file before I do any work an a database and > > reload is second nature with any known problem. Neither show any clues. > > > > Although it's a lot of work, I think I am going to re-create the database > > from scratch. There is not much data in it and that is easy to export and > > then import into a new copy. The creation of the form is what will take > the > > time. > > > > Regards, > > Alastair. > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Alastair Burr" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 11:29 AM > > Subject: Re: Persistant System Crashes but TRACE reports no errors - > > Razzak's Reply > > > > > > > Thanks Razzak for your swift response. > > > > > > However, there are _no_ while loops in the app. All it does is gather > some > > > info from one database and create a temp table with that data in the > > driving > > > database for use in a form for display purposes. The form does not get > > > updated as it has a number of buttons which run other apps. It has only > > > started crashing since adding the temp table with the displayed data to > > the > > > form. > > > > > > I thought that it might be the latest beta version so I reverted to > patch > > 2 > > > but that made no difference - as expected, really. I have also checked > > that > > > all the variables are pre-defined, not deleted, nor data type changed > > before > > > the form is run with edit using. > > > > > > I have found something that seems to make a difference in that I get > > crashes > > > only 50% of the time now. Running the app immediately after booting now > > > seems to work but second or subsequent attempts cause a crash. Those > > > subsequent attempts seem to fail because RBG65 is still running > according > > to > > > Windows after a crash. I suspect that the HIDE command is a problem here > > > because the crash happens before the SHOW command is reached. However, > > > removing the HIDE & SHOW commands does not stop the crashing. As far as > I > > > can see the EXIT command is run properly but maybe the form does not > close > > > correctly. I'm clutching at straws here. > > > > > > What I have changed is this: > > > > > > CREATE TEMP TABLE ToDo (Things TEXT (60), EntryDate DATETIME) > > > > > > to: > > > > > > CREATE TEMP TABLE `ToDo` + > > > (`Things` TEXT (60), + > > > `EntryDate` DATETIME ) > > > > > > ie: added the IDQuotes around the table and column names. > > > If this is a syntax error then trace does not seem to pick it up, nor > does > > > it appear to matter from the R:> when creating the table "manually". It > > > might be part of the problem when creating the table via the app. > > > > > > What I might be able to do is to reconfigure the form to use only the > temp > > > table or use the temp table as the driving table and see if that makes > any > > > difference but that seems to be avoiding the problem rather than > resolving > > > it - even if it were to work... > > > > > > Any further suggestions gratefully accepted, > > > Regards, > > > Alastair. > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "A. Razzak Memon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Sent: Wednesday, June 05, 2002 1:14 AM > > > Subject: Re: Persistant System Crashes but TRACE reports no errors - > > > Razzak's Reply > > > > > > > > > > > > > > At 12:19 AM 6/5/2002 +0100, Alastair Burr wrote: > > > > > > > > >Can anyone tell me how it is possible to run an application through > > TRACE > > > > >and consistently have no errors and yet R:Base crashes EVERY time I > > start > > > > >the app via an icon? > > > > > > > > > > > > Alastair, > > > > > > > > Looks like the WHILE loop optimization issue! > > > > > > > > SET WHILEOPT OFF at the mighty R> prompt and try it again. If it runs > > > > then you know there is a problem with an optimized command and the > > > > problem is most likely with a variable used in that command. > > > > > > > > FYI, TRACE does not use the WHILE loop optimization. > > > > > > > > WHILE loops were always considered one of the faster ways to process > > > > code because R:BASE read the WHILE loop code into memory and parsed > > > > it before beginning execution. R:BASE did not need to do line-by-line > > > reading > > > > and parsing of the code for each iteration of the WHILE loop. As it is > > > read > > > > into > > > > memory the WHILE loop code was parsed in tokens (4-byte segments). But > > > > R:BASE still needed to figure out what was what -- parse the > > expressions, > > > > find variable names and values etc. It was faster than reading and > > parsing > > > > line-by-line, but not as fast as it could be. > > > > > > > > Tips: > > > > > > > > 01. Datatype variables at the beginning of a command file or before > the > > > > WHILE loop is executed. Don't datatype variables inside the WHILE > > > > loop, they won't be optimized. > > > > > > > > 02. The variables used in any optimized command can change values as > > > > the WHILE loop iterations are executed, but they cannot change > data > > > > types and cannot be cleared (with the CLEAR VAR command). > > > > > > > > 03. The value can be reset to NULL (SET VAR vname = NULL) but not > > > > cleared. > > > > > > > > 04. If you determine that the problem is with an optimized command, > > review > > > > the rules above, you may be clearing, retyping or not data typing > a > > > > variable. > > > > > > > > Well, that should give you pretty good idea. > > > > > > > > Very Best Regards, > > > > > > > > Razzak. > > > > > > > > P.S. After the Inside R:BASE 7.0 for Windows training session this > > week, > > > > I'll post more details at: htp://www.razzak.com/fte > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ================================================ > > > > TO SEE MESSAGE POSTING GUIDELINES: > > > > Send a plain text email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > In the message body, put just two words: INTRO rbase-l > > > > ================================================ > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE: send a plain text email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > In the message body, put just two words: UNSUBSCRIBE rbase-l > > > > ================================================ > > > > TO SEARCH ARCHIVES: > > > > http://www.mail-archive.com/rbase-l%40sonetmail.com/ > > > > > > ================================================ > > > TO SEE MESSAGE POSTING GUIDELINES: > > > Send a plain text email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > In the message body, put just two words: INTRO rbase-l > > > ================================================ > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE: send a plain text email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > In the message body, put just two words: UNSUBSCRIBE rbase-l > > > ================================================ > > > TO SEARCH ARCHIVES: > > > http://www.mail-archive.com/rbase-l%40sonetmail.com/ > > > > ================================================ > > TO SEE MESSAGE POSTING GUIDELINES: > > Send a plain text email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > In the message body, put just two words: INTRO rbase-l > > ================================================ > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE: send a plain text email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > In the message body, put just two words: UNSUBSCRIBE rbase-l > > ================================================ > > TO SEARCH ARCHIVES: > > http://www.mail-archive.com/rbase-l%40sonetmail.com/ > > > > ================================================ > TO SEE MESSAGE POSTING GUIDELINES: > Send a plain text email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > In the message body, put just two words: INTRO rbase-l > ================================================ > TO UNSUBSCRIBE: send a plain text email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] > In the message body, put just two words: UNSUBSCRIBE rbase-l > ================================================ > TO SEARCH ARCHIVES: > http://www.mail-archive.com/rbase-l%40sonetmail.com/ ================================================ TO SEE MESSAGE POSTING GUIDELINES: Send a plain text email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] In the message body, put just two words: INTRO rbase-l ================================================ TO UNSUBSCRIBE: send a plain text email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] In the message body, put just two words: UNSUBSCRIBE rbase-l ================================================ TO SEARCH ARCHIVES: http://www.mail-archive.com/rbase-l%40sonetmail.com/ ================================================ TO SEE MESSAGE POSTING GUIDELINES: Send a plain text email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] In the message body, put just two words: INTRO rbase-l ================================================ TO UNSUBSCRIBE: send a plain text email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] In the message body, put just two words: UNSUBSCRIBE rbase-l ================================================ TO SEARCH ARCHIVES: http://www.mail-archive.com/rbase-l%40sonetmail.com/
