Garth, yep, I know stack and reach.  To my weird brain though, if I know 
PBH, and I also know the goofy  
measurement on a bike that I know fits me well, then I'm an instant away 
from seeing whether another bike can be configured to fit me well ... 
whether I have stork legs and t-rex arms, or stumpy legs and chimp arms.  I 
don't think you can say the same for PBH-only bike sizing.

If you take that latter goofy measurement on a bike that fits you well, and 
cut a piece of string to that length, then 'overlay' it on a bike you're 
thinking about getting, you'd be able to see in an instant whether you can 
get a stem with the right reach (and height) -- plus a saddle with enough 
adjustment in the rails for proper setback -- for the new bike to fit you 
just as well as your existing bike.  Assuming your PBH is also accommodated.

I know, weird, and likely overkill if you're in the middle of the PBH 
range. But there are many who are in between PBH ranges, and/or don't have 
'normal' upper/lower torso ratios.


On Tuesday, April 10, 2018 at 11:52:17 AM UTC-4, Garth wrote:
> Tom,  The standard measurement these days by more and more frame makers is 
> called the reach, along with the stack.  Riv has recently added these to 
> their geometry chart and can reveal how deceptive TT alone can be, let 
> alone any 1 certain measurement by itself. 
> All of the numbers are meant as a guide of course, as every body is 
> unique, some more/less flexible and feel best in this or that 
> position...not what someone else tells them is best for them. 
> There are many articles explaining it, here's one ... 

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