I like Zappos :). (I've actually never used Zappos before). Toshi
On Mon, Oct 29, 2018 at 6:30 AM Bill Lindsay <tapebu...@gmail.com> wrote: > Steve Cole said: "I don't believe we should have to make large cash > outlays to understand whether a component will work well for us." ...."I > believe bike shops have an important role to play that many are not > filling." > > What role is that, exactly? What would the shop have done exactly to make > this your ideal transaction? Is there another equipment industry that does > things 'the right way' rhat the bike industry should emulate? > > > Bill Lindsay > El Cerrito, Ca > > On Monday, October 29, 2018 at 3:19:50 AM UTC-7, Steve Cole wrote: >> >> I guess I did leave everyone hanging. About two weeks ago, I had my >> local bike shop trade out my old bars, shifters and grips for the new ones >> I'd chosen. Since then, I've been away about half the time. My initial >> impression having ridden may 100 miles is that the new setup is much better >> for me than the old one. A few observations: >> >> First, the grips I chose were the Ergon GC-1s. I'd used Ergons on my >> Scott and found them immensely comfortable. The key, I believe, to finding >> comfort with a low-sweep handlebar, and no doubt other bars, is to ensure >> bar height minimizes pressure on the wrists. Bars should be not too high, >> not too low, just right. The shape of the Ergons is designed to support >> the "heel" of the hand. At the right bar height and grip angle, this >> should reduce pressure on the wrist/hand. The GC-1 is spec'd for >> handlebars with a modest sweep -- Bullmoose bars have a 30 degree sweep >> (GP-1s are for lower sweep bars). One other note on this. I wrapped my >> bars inside from the shifters to the stem with Lizard Skins Bar Tape, which >> is a soft polymer for a second comfortable place to hold on. I've used >> cork, leather and cloth tape over the years. A friend recommended this tape >> and I'm pretty impressed. >> >> Second. while I'm fairly confident in the decisions I've made, I find the >> bars are a little wider than I would like. They are 670mm wide. In use, >> my hands tend to slide to the inner part of the grips. For me, I think my >> arms should be roughly 90 degrees from my torso when my hands are at the >> optimal place on the grips. I plan to cut them down this week about 1/2 >> inch or 15mm. I'll try that and hopefully will have found the sweet spot. >> If not, I'll cut them down a little more. >> >> Third, I love indexed trigger shifters and the Shimano XTs are working >> flawlessly. I used Shimano Dura Ace bar end shifters with my Albatross >> bars, These are also indexed shifters or can be set to be friction. I >> know there have been many threads discussing the benefits and costs of >> indexed vs friction shifters. I'll leave that discussion for elsewhere, >> only to note that index shifting, for me, is simple, intuitive, and >> mindless and helps me just enjoy the ride. >> >> I appreciate very much the comments left by others. One reaction to one >> comment. I don't believe we should have to make large cash outlays to >> understand whether a component will work well for us. Unfortunately, once >> we try it out, it's no longer new and can't be returned as such. That's >> why I believe bike shops have an important role to play that many are not >> filling. Perhaps the fact that switching out components without expense or >> effort reflects the fact that most people are content with the as-is bikes >> they purchase from the shops or on-line. For me, I am an inveterate >> tinkerer always seeking ways to make my ride even better. I'm grateful to >> my list colleagues who have tried something, chosen not to keep it and >> offered it for sale on the list. I've spent more than I care to say on >> items I've purchased here. Some day, I'll have my own parts bin sale. >> >> All best, >> Steve Cole >> Arlington, Virginia >> >> >> >> On Sunday, October 28, 2018 at 7:22:42 AM UTC-4, Steve Cole wrote: >>> >>> John Hawrylak posted recently about converting a Riv Bike to low trail. >>> Joe Bernard replied that he had done this only to find out he did not like >>> low trail and that it was a little costly to find this out. Boy, did this >>> resonate with me. >>> >>> I have found it nearly impossible to understand the effect of a >>> component change on my bike's performance without some, at least, modest >>> investment, even when I do the work switching out parts myself. While my >>> most extensive experience relates to handlebars, I've also explored >>> different wheel sizes, saddles, derailleurs, and assorted other >>> components. I'll share my handlebar experience because it seems >>> instructive. >>> >>> From the time I was 16, I rode racing bikes. It had always been clear >>> to me, at least intellectually, that racing bike's drop handlebars, in >>> addition to reducing wind resistance and increasing speed, offered great >>> variation in hand position increasing the odds of finding comfort. After >>> 45 years or so riding drops, the time came for me consider alternatives. >>> Much more of my future riding would be in the city and I believed and still >>> believe upright positions offer better visibility and thus are safer. I am >>> also no longer as limber as I once was. Over time, I found that, except on >>> steep climbs, I almost never used the drops. I had been riding almost >>> exclusively on the hoods or the crossbar. My first "city bike" was a Scott >>> Sub 20. What a revelation. The bars, Syncros, were almost flat and 640mm >>> wide with a 10 degree sweep. They offered comfort like I had not felt >>> before. Very importantly, they also seemed to offer better control. I >>> noticed that these flat and almost straight handlebars were more akin to >>> most motorcycle handlebars than bicycle racing handlebars. >>> >>> After riding the Scott for a few years, I learned of Rivendell (and as >>> importantly, Bicycle Quarterly and Compass Cycles). I was an easy >>> convert. The only question I had was which Rivendell would be right for >>> me. Ultimately, I chose a Homer. I bought a used Toyo Homer - 59cm, 700mm >>> tires -- from someone on the list. It came with racing bars, which I >>> replaced, this time with Nitto Albatross bars, seemingly the preferred >>> upright bar of the Riv community and often recommended by Riv as a great >>> bar. I rode my Homer with the Albatrosses for 5 years, a few thousand >>> miles a year. Albatross bars have, according to www.whatbars.com, a 78 >>> degree sweep. All the time I rode my Homer, which I love, I wondered >>> whether I would have the comfort and control I had enjoyed on my Scott if I >>> found a handlebar with much less sweep. >>> >>> But which bar? I spoke with friends and read the many entries on the >>> topic in the RBW Owners Bunch listserve. I read more of what I could find >>> on the internet. I considered the Jones, MAP Ahearne, several different >>> Nitto bars and settled on the Nitto Bullmoose. Unfortunately, I couldn't >>> find anywhere I could try it out. Most bike shops, in my experience, are >>> not eager to trade out components to allow customers to experience the >>> effect of the changes. At best, they'll offer different bikes with >>> different components to try. Still, I had decided I wanted to try the >>> Bullmooses. To do this, I also had to use different shifters; the bar end >>> shifters I used on with the Albatross bars wouldn't work with Bullmosse >>> bars. I searched for used Bullmooses without success so I ordered a new >>> one from Rivendell. I did find used Shimano XT 3x9 trigger shifters. >>> Together, with new grips, cables and cable housing, my investment to "try" >>> this setup (I had a bike shop do the switch) exceeded $400. This seemed >>> like a hefty investment and there was the chance that, like Joe Bernard, I >>> would find out it was a failed experiment, an expensive one at that. >>> >>> One thing I love about the industry is the amazing array of choices in >>> bikes and components. I also love the the fact the barriers to entry into >>> the industry are low -- innovation is everywhere and there are loads of >>> tinkerers in their "garages" working on that next best idea, one that will >>> improve everyone's cycling experience only if cyclists can learn about it >>> firsthand. It just frustrates me no end, however, how hard and costly it >>> can be to explore the choices available. For most cyclists, you get what >>> the industry's major players think you want or should want. Understanding >>> and especially experiencing available choices requires a bit of work and >>> often an uncommonly accommodating bike shop. More often than should be the >>> case, in my view, the cost is not trivial and sometimes proves the negative >>> -- one was better off before. So my question is what can the bike industry >>> do to help cyclists better understand the component choices they have and >>> the effects on riding will be with different components? >>> >>> Sorry for running on so long. >>> >>> Steve Cole >>> Arlington, Virginia >>> >> -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
