-----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Bill Brooks Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2010 7:12 PM To: 'RE-wrenches' Subject: Re: [RE-wrenches] Two strings of Different Orientation
Peter, The issue is the same as it was last year. [#] But it hasn't been resolved to my satisfaction, yet The operating voltage of each string will be nearly identical throughout the day if the strings are the same length and not shaded. [#] This can't be the case. After all, the SE sub-array will have greater irradiance than the SW sub-array in the AM and the converse will be true in the PM Put them on a single inverter. [#] I'd dearly like to. The Fronius report was not discussing a special algorithm for dealing with this situation. It was showing that operating voltage is nearly the same for two different orientations. [#] I believe there was more to the report than that; I need to dig it out an re-read it. I am not comforted by the fact that Fronius no longer stands behind the white paper. The only way to prove this with a simulation program is to run an hourly simulation for each orientation and compare the Vmp voltage hour-by-hour. If you can get to the dc voltage data in PV:WATTS it should tell you the same story. Next you would have to calculate the difference in power that would be delivered because the inverter MPPT will be dominated by the higher power string (creating a 1 or 2% loss at worst case). I think it can be done with free software, but it will take a lot of handwork and spreadsheets. [#] PV-Syst (or a similar tool) is the most straightforward way to simulate this effect. I will soon bite the bullet to purchase PV-syst (or something similar) One day I-V curve tracers will be readily available, or inverters will be able to do the same thing, and this issue will go away. DC and ac Optimizers may also be able to provide dc voltage data that could also show this phenomenon. My fear is that just as the Sharp 3-input was sold inaccurately on the capability of tracking different orientations that optimizers will be sold the same way neglecting the more accurate benefits of these devices. Maybe it is a pipe dream, but I would like to think that designers, engineers, and knowledgeable installers will one day be able to accurately understand the irradiance and temperature impacts on I-V curves so that manufacturers will be unable to use inaccurate information to sell their wares. Call me crazy. [#] So what do people think about the Power-One inverter with "two independent MPPT inputs"? - Peter Bill. -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Peter Parrish Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2010 8:58 AM To: 'RE-wrenches' Subject: [RE-wrenches] Two strings of Different Orientation Abut once a year we encounter this problem and each time I reach out to folks for guidance. Up until last year, I don't believe that there was a readily accessible tool that accurately simulated the behavior of "two strings of modules with different orientations". PVSyst is too expensive and hard to master to solve this problem once a year. So here I go again, I have a roof with an 18 deg pitch and nearly N-S axis (actually 355-175 deg true). We want to put eight modules on each side of the roof. We can tilt the modules on each side of the roof 15 or 25 degrees (or any angle in between, if desired), producing a more southerly (but not equal) orientation for each sub-array. The results are as follows: Before (as is) Sub-array1: pitch 18 deg, azimuth 85 deg Sub-array2: pitch 18 deg, azimuth 265 deg After/Case #1 (15 degree tilt-kit) Sub-array1: pitch 23 deg, azimuth 126 deg (54 deg east of south) Sub-array2: pitch 23 deg, azimuth 224 deg (44 deg west of south) After/Case #2 (25 degree tilt-kit) Sub-array1: pitch 30 deg, azimuth 141 deg (39 deg east of south) Sub-array2: pitch 30 deg, azimuth 209 deg (29 deg west of south) My question: Can either Case #1 or Case #2 be wired to a single inverter as two parallel strings of eight modules each? Has anyone seen a PVSyst or similar took simulate this two-string situtation? Does anyone believe that the Fronius IG inverters have special algorithms that accommodate this lack of idential orientation (their White Paper notwithstanding)? We have until Monday to figure this out. Any help would be appreciated. - Peter Peter T. Parrish, Ph.D., President California Solar Engineering, Inc. 820 Cynthia Ave., Los Angeles, CA 90065 CA Lic. 854779, NABCEP Cert. 031806-26 [email protected] Ph 323-258-8883, Mobile 323-839-6108, Fax 323-258-8885 _______________________________________________ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: [email protected] Options & settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules & etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org _______________________________________________ List sponsored by Home Power magazine List Address: [email protected] Options & settings: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List-Archive: http://lists.re-wrenches.org/pipermail/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org List rules & etiquette: www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm Check out participant bios: www.members.re-wrenches.org
