I think you should describe the job as a trainee. You can do anything you want after that. Just don't call it an apprenticeship.
On Tue, Apr 28, 2015 at 8:45 PM, Ray Walters <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi Bob; > > That's an excellent point. I'm trying to figure out what is a fair > arrangement: 4 years of training is worth quite a sum of money vs. 4 years > of labor in the off grid mines. > Straight up $10/ hr and I'll train them for as long as they can be trained > with raises as they reach milestones like: they can go on a troubleshooting > visit on their own. > I think some off grid living experience is a prerequisite as mentioned > before, also they've got to be able to deal with basic math and electrical > equations. > Any other prerequisites before I create an unobtainable person? > > R.Ray Walters > CTO, Solarray, Inc > Nabcep Certified PV Installer, > Licensed Master Electrician > Solar Design Engineer303 505-8760 > > On 4/28/2015 2:03 PM, Bob-O Schultze wrote: > > An apprenticeship is the original 4 year degree. If the trainers are good, > high quality workpersons, and the apprentice WANTS to learn, the apprentice > will learn the trade. It's exactly the same in a college situation except > that the newly minted journeyman, unlike a college graduate, will actually > HAVE a trade and experience. > > On Apr 17, 2015, at 5:41 PM, Chris Mason wrote: > > The US currently puts little value on craft versus academia, now everyone > smart is expected to go to college. Consequently there is a stigma on > vocational education. When I did my electrical apprenticeship in Ireland, > we did two years of college, one year of training school and one year in > the field. There were 8, 000 applicants for a handful of positions. > I had a third year electrical apprentice from the US work for me on a > three month project we took on. He was absolutely unqualified and could not > answer the most basic questions on electrical theory. > I recommend you detail the educational opportunities and fund adequate > training enabling the apprentice to acheive the target qualification. > On Apr 17, 2015 4:53 PM, "Ray Walters" <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Hi All; >> >> Thanks for the replies so far; I apologize for my misunderstood attempt >> at humor in my initial post. I agree with Chris here, I hire contract >> labor all the time, but an apprenticeship is different. Laborers top out >> pretty quickly and just aren't capable of learning the nuances of off grid >> electric design. Much of the time that's all that's needed: pick this up >> and take it over there,dig here, etc. I'm not looking for labor, as much >> as someone who could some day take over the business ( I'm 50 now) and go >> out and troubleshoot systems on their own. I consider off grid solar to be >> more of a craft than mere construction contracting. >> An apprenticeship implies a much longer term arrangement where they may >> be paid less, but can expect training to the point of getting their >> electrical license and making a career out of it. I'm having a much harder >> time finding the sort of person that wants to make that sort of commitment >> both in time and in learning. Folks that have the smarts and ambition >> necessary are already busy. >> >> Thanks, >> >> R.Ray Walters >> CTO, Solarray, Inc >> Nabcep Certified PV Installer, >> Licensed Master Electrician >> Solar Design Engineer303 505-8760 >> >> On 4/17/2015 6:22 AM, Chris Mason wrote: >> >> I'm not sure how the term is used in America, but generally "apprentice" >> does not mean cheap labour. An apprentice program should be an education >> path to a qualification with state recognized standards, such as >> Electrician or Plumber. if you just want inexpensive labour, that's not an >> apprentice, that's a helper, labourer, intern. As someone who started life >> as an electrical apprentice, I object to seeing apprenticeships >> shortchanging the applicants. >> >> On Thu, Apr 16, 2015 at 7:27 PM, Dana <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> I interview & definitely check references including: look at a tape >>> measure and tell me what those little marks are between 0 & 1”, & I look in >>> their truck or car. >>> >>> If it’s clean they may take care of your vehicle then same and if it’s a >>> mess that’s what you can expect them to do to your truck. >>> >>> Are they smokers? Is that OK in your truck? >>> >>> Can they work without checking their cell phone every time it goes Ding >>> or rings? >>> >>> Do they have their own tools and do they know how to operate tools like >>> your hydraulic draw punch or wire tugger without F%$ing it up or hurting >>> themselves? >>> >>> >>> Does anyone do a background check on new hires? >>> >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> Dana Orzel >>> >>> Great Solar Works, Inc - NABCEP # 051112-136 >>> >>> E - [email protected] - Web - solarwork.com >>> >>> O - 970.626.5253 C - 208.721.7003 >>> >>> "Responsible Technologies for Responsible People since 1988" >>> >>> *P* Please consider the environment before printing this email. >>> >>> >>> >>> *From:* RE-wrenches [mailto:[email protected]] *On >>> Behalf Of *Ray Walters >>> *Sent:* Thursday, April 16, 2015 4:50 PM >>> *To:* RE-wrenches >>> *Subject:* [RE-wrenches] Apprentice >>> >>> >>> Hi Folks; >>> >>> I am considering hiring an apprentice, and I wanted to know if any else >>> has tried this, and what advice and experience everyone had to offer. >>> Also what would be the best way to advertise: Craig's List? >>> >>> * Wanted passionate techy soul to share warm fires and cold brews with, >>> watch beautiful sunsets over off grid arrays in remote locations, sometimes >>> carry leaky hazardous materials*..... >>> mmmm. Obviously I need some help. >>> >>> Thanks in Advance, >>> >>> -- >>> >>> R.Ray Walters >>> >>> CTO, Solarray, Inc >>> >>> Nabcep Certified PV Installer, >>> >>> Licensed Master Electrician >>> >>> Solar Design Engineer >>> >>> 303 505-8760 >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance >>> >>> List Address: [email protected] >>> >>> Change listserver email address & settings: >>> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >>> >>> List-Archive: >>> http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/maillist.html >>> >>> List rules & etiquette: >>> www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm >>> >>> Check out or update participant bios: >>> www.members.re-wrenches.org >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Chris Mason >> NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer™ >> Solar Design Engineer >> Generac Generators Industrial technician >> >> www.cometsolar.com <http://www.cometenergysystems.com/> >> 264.235.5670 >> 869.662.5670 >> Skype: netconcepts >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance >> >> List Address: [email protected] >> >> Change listserver email address & >> settings:http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >> >> List-Archive: >> http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/maillist.html >> >> List rules & etiquette:www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm >> >> Check out or update participant bios:www.members.re-wrenches.org >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> List sponsored by Redwood Alliance >> >> List Address: [email protected] >> >> Change listserver email address & settings: >> http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org >> >> List-Archive: >> http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/maillist.html >> >> List rules & etiquette: >> www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm >> >> Check out or update participant bios: >> www.members.re-wrenches.org >> >> >> _______________________________________________ > List sponsored by Redwood Alliance > > List Address: [email protected] > > Change listserver email address & settings: > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org > > List-Archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/maillist.html > > List rules & etiquette: > www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm > > Check out or update participant bios: > www.members.re-wrenches.org > > > > > _______________________________________________ > List sponsored by Redwood Alliance > > List Address: [email protected] > > Change listserver email address & > settings:http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org > > List-Archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/maillist.html > > List rules & etiquette:www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm > > Check out or update participant bios:www.members.re-wrenches.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > List sponsored by Redwood Alliance > > List Address: [email protected] > > Change listserver email address & settings: > http://lists.re-wrenches.org/options.cgi/re-wrenches-re-wrenches.org > > List-Archive: > http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/maillist.html > > List rules & etiquette: > www.re-wrenches.org/etiquette.htm > > Check out or update participant bios: > www.members.re-wrenches.org > > > -- Chris Mason NABCEP Certified Solar PV Installer™ Solar Design Engineer Generac Generators Industrial technician www.cometsolar.com <http://www.cometenergysystems.com> 264.235.5670 869.662.5670 Skype: netconcepts
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