Here are some things I found out will working on 'random/secure and 'random/seed that
may be of help to others.
I wanted to completely utilize the time provided by 'now/precise as the seed for
'random/seed.
(for some cryptography related scripts)
(the following messages are from the escribe archives and console output is from view
1.2.5.3.1
>From an earlier question on using 'random Joel Neely wrote:
Date: Thu, 22 Aug 2002 15:09:45
"The documentation should state what types of values are acceptable
as seeds. I believe that you need to restrict yourself to date!,
time!, or integer! values for legitimate seeds."
And Frank Sievertsen wrote:
[REBOL] Re: True Random
Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2001 00:09:35
Try this:
random/seed checksum form now/precise
CU,
Frank
With Petr Krenzelok adding:
Date: Mon, 20 Aug 2001 00:32:38
you can even use checksum/secure ....
-pekr-
But please observe the following...
It appears that 'random/seed seeded with time ('now/precise) only seeds to the second!
...
randomize-series: func [series][
random/seed now/precise
random/secure series
]
>> loop 10 [print [now/precise randomize-series "12345"]]
15-Jan-2004/12:20:06.968-5:00 14532
15-Jan-2004/12:20:06.968-5:00 14532
15-Jan-2004/12:20:06.968-5:00 14532
15-Jan-2004/12:20:06.984-5:00 14532
15-Jan-2004/12:20:06.984-5:00 14532
15-Jan-2004/12:20:07-5:00 13524
15-Jan-2004/12:20:07-5:00 13524
15-Jan-2004/12:20:07.015-5:00 13524
15-Jan-2004/12:20:07.015-5:00 13524
15-Jan-2004/12:20:07.015-5:00 13524
... as you see the randomized string only changes with the second.
Changing the time to an integer won't work ...
>> loop 10 [print [now/precise to-integer now/time/precise]]
15-Jan-2004/12:13:32.953-5:00 44012
15-Jan-2004/12:13:32.968-5:00 44012
15-Jan-2004/12:13:32.968-5:00 44012
15-Jan-2004/12:13:32.968-5:00 44012
15-Jan-2004/12:13:32.984-5:00 44012
15-Jan-2004/12:13:32.984-5:00 44012
15-Jan-2004/12:13:33-5:00 44013
15-Jan-2004/12:13:33-5:00 44013
15-Jan-2004/12:13:33-5:00 44013
15-Jan-2004/12:13:33.015-5:00 44013
... as you can see that the integer changes only with the second.
Also, note that I only changed the time (not the date) to integer, because ...
>> to-integer now/precise
** Script Error: Invalid argument: 15-Jan-2004/12:30:15.734-5:00
** Where: to-integer
** Near: to integer! :value
... thus not using the date portion in the potential seed.
You cannot use checksum/secure on the time because ...
>> random/seed checksum/secure form now/precise
== {îen|^E€^A”d¦—Âê/Ì^K^G¬Ñý}
... and ...
>> seed: checksum/secure form now/precise
== #{70C9F0D1D65FD88B6093DF38FD972ABCA56724B3}
>> random/seed seed
== "‹`$—p*Éß¼gس_Ö¥ð8ý“Ñ"
>> random/seed seed
== "g‹_ð“ßÉ`¼pýÑÖ¥*$8—³Ø"
>> random/seed seed
== "¥`¼Ñ_—p$Øð‹ýÖÉ8*“³ßg"
... returns a value! Thus the "seed" given above is scrambled , but not passed to
random/seed as a seed.
If "checksum/secure form now/precise" was providing a legitimate seed then the
follwing sequences would be identical ...
>> seed: checksum/secure form now/precise
== #{70C9F0D1D65FD88B6093DF38FD972ABCA56724B3}
>> random/seed seed
== "“*g`Ñ‹¥¼ð³Ø$É8Ö_—pßý"
>> loop 5 [print random/secure "12345"]
53142
31254
32514
25143
32145
>> random/seed seed
== "*ýg`ÖѳßpÉ—“$¥Ø_8¼ð‹"
>> loop 5 [print random/secure "12345"]
32415
13524
15432
45231
43251
.. but they are not the same.
So, to use _all_ of the information provided by 'now/precise (all of
15-Jan-2004/12:34:16.437-5:00) as a seed to 'random/seed you must
random/seed to-integer checksum/secure form now/precise
Now we see all the behavior we expect ...
>> seed: to-integer checksum/secure form now/precise
== 1264002547
>> random/seed seed
>> loop 5 [print random/secure "12345"]
45213
41325
45321
35124
14523
>> random/seed seed
>> loop 5 [print random/secure "12345"]
45213
41325
45321
35124
14523
Notice that there is nothing returned when providing the seed and that the two
sequences are identical.
Other Observations:
'random/seed will take a date ...
>> seed: now/date
== 16-Jan-2004
>> random/seed seed
>>
.. because nothing is returned.
A 'binary is not a legitimate seed ...
>> seed: to-binary 100
== #{313030}
>> random/seed seed
== "010"
... because a value is returned.
A 'time is a legitimate seed ...
>> seed: now/time
== 22:11:03
>> random/seed seed
>>
... but remember that it is good only to the second!
So, you need to do two tests to determine if a seed is legitimate:
1) Nothing returned from 'random/seed your-seed
2) Identical random sequences produced when reseeding from the same seed.
To conclude: apparently only dates, times, and integers are legitimate seeds,
and one way to use all of a 'now (including both date and sub-second precision) is to
random/seed to-integer checksum/secure form now/precise
Here's a handy function to reseed to sub-second precision ...
randomize: func [
{Reseed the random number generator using 'now/precise, or enter a date! time!
integer! argument.}
seed [any-type!]
][
random/seed either value? 'seed [seed][to-integer checksum/secure form now/precise]
]
As a bonus (as if this wasn't long enough already!) I have included my gleanings from
the archives about 'random in the following binary!. Just decompress.
probe decompress useful-stuff-on-random: 64#{
eJztW2l720aS/rz4FW14Ziw5vADecGxHhx0p8ZHITjyJHiUBiSaJCASQBiCKzmZ+
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s9nU5rdUYcviSt82r/6u6F3plobiyhMlf03CWJzadjm2Sb3ulssVdpoubT3dWXn4
2X/K6bczOS0gle/LhLf1/8vxYh/aI7JFsmJVklkeLqHYgYDKFLLBD+1cFdLWT4Q/
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}
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