Attached is the log from our IRC chatmeeting today.
Joachim
[INFO] Channel view for #red5 opened. -->| YOU (magog) have joined #red5 magog hi luke_red5 well we are now 3 magog strange routes to my server: luke_red5 john.. is on his way i think magog 5 15 ms <10 ms 16 ms ge7-2-pr1.FRA.router.COLT.NET [212.74.65.142] 6 16 ms 15 ms 16 ms gi0-3-rt1-ffm2.core.noris.net [80.81.192.88] 7 <10 ms 16 ms 16 ms vl604-rt3-nbg3.core.noris.net [213.95.0.197] 8 16 ms 62 ms 16 ms gi-upl.RS8K1.CISO2.hetzner.de [213.133.96.25] 9 <10 ms <10 ms 15 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO3.hetzner.de [213.239.240.194] 10 <10 ms 16 ms 16 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO4.hetzner.de [213.239.240.196] 11 16 ms 15 ms 16 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO3.hetzner.de [213.239.240.194] 12 16 ms 16 ms 15 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO4.hetzner.de [213.239.240.196] 13 15 ms 16 ms 15 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO3.hetzner.de [213.239.240.194] 14 15 ms 16 ms 16 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO4.hetzner.de [213.239.240.196] 15 16 ms 15 ms 16 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO3.hetzner.de [213.239.240.194] 16 16 ms 16 ms 15 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO4.hetzner.de [213.239.240.196] 17 15 ms 16 ms 15 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO3.hetzner.de [213.239.240.194] 18 15 ms 16 ms 16 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO4.hetzner.de [213.239.240.196] 19 16 ms 15 ms 16 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO3.hetzner.de [213.239.240.194] 20 16 ms 16 ms 15 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO4.hetzner.de [213.239.240.196] 21 15 ms 16 ms 15 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO3.hetzner.de [213.239.240.194] 22 15 ms 16 ms 16 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO4.hetzner.de [213.239.240.196] 23 78 ms 47 ms 63 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO3.hetzner.de [213.239.240.194] 24 94 ms 94 ms 31 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO4.hetzner.de [213.239.240.196] 25 15 ms 31 ms <10 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO3.hetzner.de [213.239.240.194] 26 16 ms 16 ms 15 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO4.hetzner.de [213.239.240.196] 27 16 ms 15 ms 16 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO3.hetzner.de [213.239.240.194] 28 16 ms 16 ms 15 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO4.hetzner.de [213.239.240.196] 29 15 ms 16 ms 16 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO3.hetzner.de [213.239.240.194] 30 16 ms 15 ms 16 ms gi-upl.RS8600.CISO4.hetzner.de [213.239.240.196] magog that way they won't reach the server luke_red5 loop ... magog yep luke_red5 oh dear we have broken the matrix stevengong hi joachim stevengong seems like a misconfiguration? magog yeah, but that's up to my hoster, i only rented the server there... magog ah, seems they fixed it now -->| marijan ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) has joined #red5 marijan ehm stevengong so can i reconnect now? magog just checking... -->| smn_ ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) has joined #red5 magog no, the routes now look okay but i still can't connect magog i'd say we stay here luke_red5 whats that windows irc client starting with a b luke_red5 b ** irc marijan bitch marijan no? luke_red5 isnt bitch unix marijan hm..normally there are ports for windows marijan often luke_red5 Bersirc stevengong hehe, I am using chatzilla stevengong Joachim told me about that luke_red5 ok, so i will give an update what ive been doing luke_red5 well most of this release i have been a bit awol luke_red5 but now im back :) luke_red5 i worked on the packet dropping and testing live streaming luke_red5 now im working on debug and capture tools marijan http://www.silverex.info/download/ luke_red5 i have a feeling we are taking a stab in the dark at some of the things marijan xchat is nice luke_red5 which we really need to nail it this release luke_red5 thus the focus on getting the protocol stuff right stevengong shall we make a list for the unknowns of the protocol part? luke_red5 this week I hope to do some experiments with vod to try and work out why we are getting crazy times luke_red5 yeah, good idea luke_red5 questions which need answers luke_red5 1. 16 header wtf? stevengong 2. how to reset the absolute ts? luke_red5 3. what is the right amount of packets to drop in live streaming to ensure no lag luke_red5 i guess that also comes down to how does server load effect lag magog 4. how much do we need to drop if a client has not enogh downstream stevengong well that all depends on the bandwidth configuration stevengong and maybe not very protocol-specifric luke_red5 anything else we are unsure about ? magog okay, but we need a way to provide settings for it magog 5. ping commands magog 6. when is a sbr reset stevengong hoho, I just wanted to type it stevengong to Joachim: I am working on providing settings for streams, clients as well as connections stevengong the API is there already -->| neoRiley ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) has joined #red5 luke_red5 welcome backk magog @steven: great, let me know if i can test something magog hi john neoRiley I can't believe I figured all that out neoRiley lol stevengong hi john neoRiley hey guys luke_red5 we have renamed the project black6 while you were gone magog blame my provider neoRiley LOL neoRiley I rather like that neoRiley don't let me interupt magog too late ;) stevengong 7. could SBR control BW for client publishing? luke_red5 umm.. maybe luke_red5 but since its no stream specific luke_red5 i find it hard to think it would stevengong it's connection specific luke_red5 my guess is there is no client bandwidth control luke_red5 its all based on the quality and setting you use on the client luke_red5 john might know more ? stevengong hmm, maybe but how does client act according to SBR from server? neoRiley reading... back neoRiley yeah I think you're right from what I know Luke neoRiley the only control the client has is in what it sends for a video stream magog i think sbr is only used internally so the client can determine if the server is still online neoRiley what is sbr? stevengong well, so that value for SBR is irrelevant? stevengong Stream Bytes Read stevengong a packet that sent between client/server marijan http://www.adobe.com/devnet/flash/articles/live_video_switcher_03.html stevengong to indicate how many bytes reaceived so far neoRiley ah neoRiley brb luke_red5 yup luke_red5 from my obervation (god i cant spell) it cuts out after 2.5mb approx luke_red5 or perhaps its on a timeout and thats just how much data the client pushes in that amount of time luke_red5 are we all still here ? I had to run to phone magog yup stevengong yep luke_red5 can we have one of those :) luke_red5 would be nice to check if the client sends special events when it changes quality etc magog "ping" commands? luke_red5 yeah perhaps luke_red5 it doesnt look like the ping have enough data though stevengong so is that safe to conclude the client takes initiative on bw control when publishing? luke_red5 yup luke_red5 i dont think you need to worry about upstream bwc stevengong ok stevengong that's fine :) luke_red5 i guess we could calc the abs time like we did before by adding the relative ts together luke_red5 if the abs time lags behind the elapsed time luke_red5 we start sending warning status to the client luke_red5 then client side code could reset its self stevengong it'd be better stevengong to drop the packets stevengong when the time lags behind the elapsed time neoRiley but that sounds like a feature that the current fms doesn't do - am I wrong about that? luke_red5 true.. but that need the fp to play game neoRiley it'd be cool to at least receive notification stevengong FMS silient drops packets perhaps luke_red5 yeah.. but if the server is getting lagged packets stevengong sillently luke_red5 there isnt much point dropping them luke_red5 as the subsribers are still going to get a lagged stream luke_red5 if the subscriber doesnt haven enough bw then dropping packets does work stevengong what is the root cause for time lag marijan guys, here's a nice article about dynamic buffering: marijan http://www.progettosinergia.com/flashvideo/flashvideoblog.htm#031205 |<-- smn_ has left freenode () marijan I am quite new to this streaming stuff so no much to offer, sorry neoRiley #1 contributor is is client connection to server neoRiley #2 server abilities/que/saturation neoRiley #3 connecting clients pipe/abilities neoRiley is that what you meant steven neoRiley ? luke_red5 yup luke_red5 places i can see latency.. luke_red5 encoder, publisher connection latency, server processing speed, subscriber connection latency, decoder stevengong maybe we need to do some profiling on timing... marijan brb luke_red5 yup luke_red5 i think we should ignore the publisher luke_red5 as well the settings for that are in code luke_red5 so we can improve processing speed luke_red5 set things like tcp no wait = true luke_red5 and drop some packets when needed stevengong so this is to be investigated luke_red5 yup neoRiley cool magog okay luke_red5 john you want to tell us about the speaking and training neoRiley yes neoRiley sorry neoRiley back neoRiley 1. LosAngeles users group neoRiley July 21/22 neoRiley I'll be doing basic training on Red5 - lol neoRiley I laugh because, I'm the least of you neoRiley but it IS from a flash developers perspective, so I guess it's appropriate neoRiley I'm just going to go over how to setup a basic application, get SO's working as well as streaming/broadcasting neoRiley and go over some code examples etc neoRiley and build something out neoRiley I might be hitting you guys up for info in the next couple of weeks to make sure I've got my ducks in a row luke_red5 sounds ace neoRiley then, we're booked (chris and I) to speak at FITC Hollywood in October neoRiley that presentation will focus on more of the sexy parts of Red5 and show video clips neoRiley and ease of use/deployment rather than technical stuff neoRiley bunch of artsy guys/gals ;) neoRiley we've got 2 chapters in a book with friends of ED coming up as well. I'm working with the publisher to hammer out the TOC luke_red5 cool whats the book ? marijan "bunch of artsy"..use installer instead of ANT ;-) neoRiley Aral is involved as well as Nicolas, and I've been asking to have them involve Luke at some point neoRiley LOL neoRiley marijan true dat neoRiley the book neoRiley is essentailly and OPen Source review neoRiley of flash tools luke_red5 cool stevengong great luke_red5 dont forget edwin neoRiley it'll have chapters on how to setup an open source environement, debug tools, red5, AMFPHP ETC neoRiley yeah and edwin might get a chapter all his own neoRiley for screenweaver neoRiley exactly luke_red5 sweet well look forward to seeing that neoRiley Aral just contacted me about neoRiley speaking in Brighton UK about red5 neoRiley but we've not been officially invited yet neoRiley but I wouldn't doubt that'll come through knowing Aral neoRiley for that one, it'd be good to see if any of you on the other side of the pond is interested in going as well luke_red5 thats in december isnt it neoRiley I think it'd be nice, if you guys are interested, to have other people speak neoRiley yeah neoRiley first week in december luke_red5 im coming to uk in august neoRiley ah luke_red5 hmm. well lets see how it goes neoRiley sure thing luke_red5 i might be able to come back luke_red5 or joachim is not far neoRiley let's get invited first, then see who's avail neoRiley yeah luke_red5 :) neoRiley xactly neoRiley ;) neoRiley on a related note neoRiley For the LA user July thing neoRiley they're asking to do a special recording of the Red5 day luke_red5 cool, to be sold online neoRiley where they'd capture the desktop and my face at the same time and then publish it neoRiley I'm guessing or maybe not luke_red5 ok marijan nasty neoRiley I don't really care if they want to put out the $$ to do it, but not sure about charging magog sorry, was away a while neoRiley that's cool neoRiley we're talking about the trainging I'm doing in July neoRiley and they're going to spend some $$ to get a good video magog yeah, just reading the old messages neoRiley they want to do a contract and get the OK to do it from us luke_red5 "but not sure about charging" neoRiley just wanted to get everyone's thoughts luke_red5 well i think its great stevengong yep neoRiley well, it's open source, on the one hand, I get it that they pay for the video, they should be able to make some $$ back magog i think it's great to make people aware of red5 luke_red5 yeah neoRiley totaly luke_red5 no problem marijan publicity stevengong marketing issue :) neoRiley just wasn't sure if letting them charge for the video was good for us or not or if it really even matteres luke_red5 if people can sell videos the server must rock neoRiley LOL neoRiley good point neoRiley LOL magog :) neoRiley well it sounds like no body really has any objectsion to them selling it neoRiley am I right in that? magog yeah luke_red5 yup luke_red5 actually on a related note neoRiley I think then, we should just stipulate/request that they have one of us back again for a followup stevengong yep magog actually they are paying you for recording the video, so they can do with it whatever they want IMHO luke_red5 followup ? neoRiley yeah neoRiley Joachim, you're right neoRiley to a certain extent luke_red5 encore ! neoRiley I have rights to my talk/teaching neoRiley and I *can* tell them no way neoRiley but, I'm not saying that at all neoRiley it's just we DO have the rights to our image/work neoRiley but it's all good then neoRiley I don't care either and I think it's really good for us overall luke_red5 yup stevengong so just go ahead :) neoRiley and yeah, I would just ask them, "hey, we're all good, go make your money, but just agree to have one of us back again for another session stevengong or rock on, hehe neoRiley +\m/ luke_red5 sounds ace neoRiley cause, it'd be great to get a core developer out there and have them pay the tab for it. Great market, ideal opportunity neoRiley ok cool neoRiley one last bit o' nes neoRiley news from me neoRiley I quit blitz last week neoRiley and am going to work with Chris Allen as a contractor for a while neoRiley one thing that this does for us is neoRiley gives me a lot more time/flexibility in my schedule neoRiley so, after aug1st, I'll be a bit more excessible luke_red5 sweet magog okay luke_red5 well good luck with new job neoRiley thanks luke_red5 take it easy for a bit stevengong yep good luck neoRiley no doubt magog yeah, all the best neoRiley I think I'll feel better once my blood preasure drops to normal neoRiley thanks guys neoRiley ok, so neoRiley as for the next release stevengong take care :) neoRiley we're looking at next monday, is thart right? luke_red5 yup for an rc neoRiley right neoRiley for rc1? neoRiley call it that? luke_red5 then we will tell people its probably a week or so before we release 0.5 neoRiley great neoRiley that's prefect TR ^great news TR hey all magog yeahdepending on bugs that show up neoRiley hey TR magog hi tr neoRiley righty stevengong next week stevengong monday :) magog yep, it will be 0.5.0rc1 neoRiley ok, I'll post a message letting everyone know and I'llupdate the wiki neoRiley ok neoRiley awesome stevengong ok neoRiley if I haven't said it before, I'll say it now neoRiley YOU GUYS ROCK \M/ TR WORD :-) luke_red5 if i havent said it before luke_red5 .. lol neoRiley now, if we could all just get in the same bar together, and throw back a few asahi's luke_red5 yeah luke_red5 i was thinking about that marijan what's asahi stevengong beer... neoRiley japanese beer luke_red5 you know instead of heading to conferences around the world neoRiley LOL neoRiley yeah save our money neoRiley and meet up together luke_red5 would be great is we could meet up for a few days neoRiley yeah totally!! luke_red5 a bit of a hackathon TR lol neoRiley yeah and brainstorming/bonding neoRiley we're going to be working together for quite a long time ;) luke_red5 so.. lets start taking donations and we can book the island neoRiley LOL neoRiley alrighty neoRiley ;) luke_red5 im serious neoRiley well, we need to pick up on that discussion as we get to v0.6 neoRiley like we had put on the calendar a while back neoRiley yeah me too luke_red5 yup totally luke_red5 one thing im noticing is we are much more known now luke_red5 i just stumble across forbes and a mention of red5 at apachecon in same week TR ^dfefenitely growing interest and knowledge about THE alternative luke_red5 these are things we didnt even know about luke_red5 so things is gaining momentus luke_red5 momentum luke_red5 darn cant type neoRiley yeah stevengong cool magog yeah, meeting would be great marijan momentums? ;-) neoRiley ;) luke_red5 i think the next two releases are important for us luke_red5 esp 0.6 neoRiley yeah, so, the plans we have surrounding .6 really need to be discussed and planned marijan yup neoRiley yeah marijan especially scripting luke_red5 lets put out 0.5 to the list stevengong ok luke_red5 but not hype it neoRiley ok luke_red5 then 0.6 we can fix any remaining issues with streaming luke_red5 and add the application stuff neoRiley right magog and scripting neoRiley then blast the trumpets on that one neoRiley yeah scripting luke_red5 marijan are you interested in the application stuff neoRiley I got 2 games waiting in the wings ;) luke_red5 i saw the post on acegi good stuff neoRiley acegi post? marijan what do you understand under "application" luke_red5 umm. ok luke_red5 well the way i see it we have streaming and shared objects magog @john: well, java isn't that hard to code serverside luke_red5 then there is all the rest of the stuff people need to build an app neoRiley @joachim: LOL, you've seen my java ;) luke_red5 so the rails.. sure most of that is available in spring magog haha :) magog it's all just practive luke_red5 but we need to offer some really simple ways for people to get job done magog practice TR :-) neoRiley yes agreed neoRiley @luke luke_red5 scripting is important, but there is more than that luke_red5 scripting without some libs and framework is.. well an island luke_red5 as it turned out in fcs :) neoRiley ha marijan btw, I have few complete applications with security/database interaction through hibernate..needs some cleanup and commenting.. luke_red5 cool marijan should I polish it and do a commit..? luke_red5 thats exactly what we need stevengong if we use rhino neoRiley maybe marijan would be good for doing the security stuff? stevengong any java code can be integrated luke_red5 there was also a guy on the list who coded rife and the jsecurity guy neoRiley hey guys, I have to get going magog @marijan: yeah, maybe to org.red5.server.samples neoRiley I'll send out that email today about rc1 luke_red5 im thinking we have quite a lot of application dev experience on the list neoRiley can someone copy this to the list? The chat history? marijan " org.red5.server.samples" is oke..I have it org.red5.server.web.. luke_red5 so in run up to 0.6 we want to get people talking and building samples marijan but is's easy to rename ;-) magog :) neoRiley @luke: yes stevengong stable API :) luke_red5 yup :) neoRiley ok guys, I'll catch up with you later luke_red5 k neoRiley gotta blast neoRiley ;) magog cya TR bye neoRiley MUCH LOVE stevengong cu neoRiley cya magog i would save "web" for something web-related like the statistics we want to add sometime |<-- neoRiley has left freenode () marijan later marijan oke marijan I'll use samples marijan package.. luke_red5 cool stevengong waiting for your cool stuff :) luke_red5 actually i feel like the application part will come from the community a bit marijan who is doing planning etc.. stevengong maybe a repo for app TR yes, i guess cummunity is willing to share examples..there seems to be much inetresting stuff luke_red5 we just meet once in a while, edit the roadmap, then get back to coding luke_red5 we have a todo list trackert magog yep, maybe we can schedule a monthly meeting luke_red5 but it has been a bit dusty of late luke_red5 mainly since issue tracker is used more for same thing now stevengong I like Trac :) magog i think the todo list is more longterm and combines mutliple tasks stevengong with mail notification magog trac is for specific bugs luke_red5 ok marijan "I like Trac :)"..stevengong, are you this spammer? ;-) luke_red5 so lets populate the basecamp site with todo TR if any volunteers for red5.org needed, let me know :-) luke_red5 and email the list to the red5 list and ask people to help marijan luke_red5, what's basecamp site luke_red5 red5.projectpath.com luke_red5 i will add you marijan aah oke luke_red5 like i said its dusty stevengong long time not logged in luke_red5 in the app part i kinda feel different people will go in different groups luke_red5 based on requirements and skills luke_red5 some spring, hibernate, eclipse, etc stevengong seems we need to setup a different server for that luke_red5 and some scripting, put this here, ok its working stevengong at lease a different SVN repo marijan btw, I was looking at acegi, and I think we'll need to provide some own interceptors... luke_red5 yeah marijan above spring ones stevengong never mind luke_red5 should we define the goals.. then ask people to get involved marijan sounds good stevengong ok, that's fine except too late for me :) luke_red5 :) stevengong gonna log off now luke_red5 ok stevengong good night everyone :) TR bye marijan see ya steve.. marijan good night TR at least u dont die off heat :-) marijan (sounds strange) |<-- stevengong has left freenode ("Chatzilla 0.9.73 [Firefox 1.5.0.4/2006050817]") magog okay, need to go back to work TR ok, im also off to work..nice to see some active people here again :-) marijan yeah..mee too TR :-) luke_red5 yeah luke_red5 lets call it a day magog yep, can someone post the chatlog to the list? marijan oke, was nice to chat with you guys marijan hm..I don't have full logs TR magog, im not sure if i can find the start TR since i also wanst ehre all the time
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