So Francona and Epstein are fabricating their own short comings - inability to reach players, conditioning - to cover up for players' bad performances?
On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 3:18 PM, Steve Ouellette <[email protected]>wrote: > It doesn't make for good copy, but yes, they failed repeatedly, they > had injuries and they had bad luck. > > Lackey just plain sucks, and did the whole year. Wakefield is old, and > sucks, and over the past few years has sucked more the deeper into the > season he went. Kyle Weiland has fifth-starter potential, but he's not > ready, and he sucked. Andrew Miller was a good gamble, but he sucked > like he has for most of his major league career. Erik Bedard is a > capable starter with good stuff, but he missed a large chunk of the > season with injury, came back without rehab, hurt himself again, then > came back again down the stretch -- out of desperation, and again with > no rehab -- and sucked. > > All of those guys certainly could have pitched better than they did in > September, but they didn't. It was a confluence of suckiness. > > The loss of Buchholz was huge, taking away an above-average pitcher > and replacing him with sub-average ones. What hurt the most down the > stretch is that Lester and Beckett collapsed. That's the part that we > couldn't foresee. I don't have the energy to look up the numbers, but > I don't think that's been the history of Beckett and Lester. But I > have a hard time blaming Curt Young's not watching their beer > consumption as the problem. > > Both of those guys missed starts in September with injuries -- isn't > it entirely possible that neither one was at 100 percent, but they > rushed back due to the dire situation? > > I was actually worried about Lester most of the summer. He went on the > DL with the strained Lat in July, and when he got back, Tito > immediately insisted on riding him hard -- with big pitch counts -- > even in games where the Sox had big leads, even when the Sox had a big > lead in the standings. He didn't have good command for most of the > second half of the season. Yes, if Lester was in NFL-linebacker > physical condition, maybe he wouldn't have worn down, but he's never > been in that kind of condition. > > I think just plain bad pitching was the reason for the epic collapse. > The pressure once the collapse started certainly didn't help, but > clubhouse chemistry and beer are just scapegoats. There wasn't a > single whiff of complaint in either regard on Aug. 31. It wasn't until > after the fact that everyone started searching for a narrative to > explain things. > > Anyway, glad to see both the Rays and Yanks done. > > Steve O > > > > On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 2:32 PM, Tom Salemi <[email protected]> wrote: > > Steve, what is your reason for the epic collapse? They tried their best > and > > just failed...repeatedly? Just bad luck? > > Yes, the team lost because they didn't play well. But there might be > things > > that led to that. > > I'm not really buying the beer thing either, but if pitchers strayed from > > programs that made them successful in the past than that's a very real > > thing, and a problem. > > > > > > On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 2:29 PM, Steve Ouellette <[email protected] > > > > wrote: > >> > >> There are a lot of successful fat pitchers. Curt Schilling was hefty. > >> David Wells was enormously successful in the postseason. They're > >> baseball players, not athletes, and the whole beer thing is just a > >> convenient excuse for the epic collapse. > >> > >> Steve O > >> > >> On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 2:11 PM, Ray <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > I've come to the conclusion that I agree with Tom. The season was lost > >> > to fat pitchers who couldn't pitch. > >> > > >> > For this I blame the pitching coach who let them get fat. > >> > > >> > I blame Francona for protecting our fatsos in the media and protecting > >> > the enabling pitching coach. > >> > > >> > Finally I blame Theo for bringing us Dice-K and Lackey, and for > letting > >> > the pitching staff get fat. I think that the Sox developed a culture > of fame > >> > with no pressure or expectations. > >> > > >> > Pressure won't make you pitch better in a game, but it will keep the > >> > beer from your lips and get you to push back from the buffet table. > >> > > >> > -- > >> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > >> > Groups "Red Sox Citizens" group. > >> > To view this discussion on the web visit > >> > https://groups.google.com/d/msg/redsoxcitizens/-/NkMuGU0mLpMJ. > >> > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > >> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> > [email protected]. > >> > For more options, visit this group at > >> > http://groups.google.com/group/redsoxcitizens?hl=en. > >> > > >> > > >> > >> -- > >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > >> "Red Sox Citizens" group. > >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > >> [email protected]. > >> For more options, visit this group at > >> http://groups.google.com/group/redsoxcitizens?hl=en. > >> > > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "Red Sox Citizens" group. > > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > [email protected]. > > For more options, visit this group at > > http://groups.google.com/group/redsoxcitizens?hl=en. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Red Sox Citizens" group. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > [email protected]. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/redsoxcitizens?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Red Sox Citizens" group. 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