Hi Jim, > On 3 Jan 2024, at 15:53, Gould, James <jgo...@verisign.com> wrote: > > Andy, > > The TTL is an extension to the domain name update, so they are not > independent.
The draft explicitly states that TTLs may be changed out-of-band. The Change Poll extension is suggested as a way to inform registrars of such changes, but there's no way for DNS operators or registrants to be notified of changes, so providing this information in RDAP seems useful. G. > The same goes for the DNSSEC extension, where I don't believe the "events" > member of the "dsData"member is generally used. Are there RDAP servers that > include "dsData" "events" member that differs from the "domain" "events" > member? > > -- > > JG > > > > James Gould > Fellow Engineer > jgo...@verisign.com > <applewebdata://13890C55-AAE8-4BF3-A6CE-B4BA42740803/jgo...@verisign.com> > > 703-948-3271 > 12061 Bluemont Way > Reston, VA 20190 > > Verisign.com<https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://verisigninc.com/__;!!PtGJab4!5GuTiuq9XrUu8aQd2RokjKHNwmwEZ5tlC8tsJDWbNrI3g7ADTmvE53XFAntJcelbNIfCOKE7D95jcQ85rUrhGcd_$ > [verisigninc[.]com]> > > > > > On 1/3/24, 10:27 AM, "Andrew Newton" <a...@hxr.us <mailto:a...@hxr.us>> > wrote: > > > Caution: This email originated from outside the organization. Do not click > links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the > content is safe. > > > Given that the TTL can be updated independently of the domain name, > there is utility in exposing TTLs in RDAP especially if that > information can be given with the events & links as is done with the > DNSSEC data in RDAP. I know I have had times in the past when I needed > to know when a TTL was last changed. > > > Here is the example from 9083: > > > "secureDNS": > { > > > "zoneSigned": true, > "delegationSigned": true, > "maxSigLife": 604800, > "keyData": > [ > { > "flags": 257, > "protocol": 3, > "algorithm": 8, > "publicKey": "AwEAAa6eDzronzjEDbT...Jg1M5N rBSPkuXpdFE=", > "events": > [ > { > "eventAction": "last changed", > "eventDate": "2012-07-23T05:15:47Z" > } > ] > } > ] > } > > > -andy > > > On Wed, Jan 3, 2024 at 7:17 AM Gould, James > <jgould=40verisign....@dmarc.ietf.org <mailto:40verisign....@dmarc.ietf.org>> > wrote: >> >> Gavin, >> >> Agreed that the base RDAP RFCs include DNS information, but in the case of >> nameservers they are standard provisioning objects with the host EPP mapping >> in RFC 5733 and with additional attributes. I don't believe that there is >> value in replicating DNS information in RDAP that is not related to other >> information (e.g., creation date, updated date, transfer date, sponsorship) >> that may have value to the public. My recommendation is to focus management >> of TTL in EPP with its impact on DNS and leave RDAP alone. Let's not go down >> the slippery slope of bloating RDAP by replicating DNS information when >> there is no perceived value. >> >> -- >> >> JG >> >> >> >> James Gould >> Fellow Engineer >> jgo...@verisign.com <mailto:jgo...@verisign.com> >> <applewebdata://13890C55-AAE8-4BF3-A6CE-B4BA42740803/jgo...@verisign.com<mailto:jgo...@verisign.com>> >> >> 703-948-3271 >> 12061 Bluemont Way >> Reston, VA 20190 >> >> Verisign.com >> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://secure-web.cisco.com/1G5fgdFkXdulNRG5Wp0MVgw1N8i2VEWJQUqwCuJTkvB2kDu268F7-47Eg0aesDAxPh36PrN-BVhPV2ZborUE-FR1IZFEvNJXO8R7Ccnpd9dkn-4xLoRNmcdjvygo-HiW5AILZ210BGYByHPgWFMY_t8bn4rN0Kiie59Tp9nF9VQzp64FkNBUd469D9wtTrM6babIyDlob_xhplmt2cCazwGsgYlGbD8LZCuiW8hPPfGISqINVDEjI4cfTuKnRxbHfDLfhlUrIY1E_uGUQNLS5XNkRNQVAuFoIdFHGMWCy5fY/http*3A*2F*2Fverisigninc.com*2F__;JSUlJQ!!PtGJab4!5GuTiuq9XrUu8aQd2RokjKHNwmwEZ5tlC8tsJDWbNrI3g7ADTmvE53XFAntJcelbNIfCOKE7D95jcQ85rQMSYQoj$ >> [secure-web[.]cisco[.]com]> >> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__http://secure-web.cisco.com/1G5fgdFkXdulNRG5Wp0MVgw1N8i2VEWJQUqwCuJTkvB2kDu268F7-47Eg0aesDAxPh36PrN-BVhPV2ZborUE-FR1IZFEvNJXO8R7Ccnpd9dkn-4xLoRNmcdjvygo-HiW5AILZ210BGYByHPgWFMY_t8bn4rN0Kiie59Tp9nF9VQzp64FkNBUd469D9wtTrM6babIyDlob_xhplmt2cCazwGsgYlGbD8LZCuiW8hPPfGISqINVDEjI4cfTuKnRxbHfDLfhlUrIY1E_uGUQNLS5XNkRNQVAuFoIdFHGMWCy5fY/http*3A*2F*2Fverisigninc.com*2F>__;JSUlJQ!!PtGJab4!5GuTiuq9XrUu8aQd2RokjKHNwmwEZ5tlC8tsJDWbNrI3g7ADTmvE53XFAntJcelbNIfCOKE7D95jcQ85rSjWDJ_4$ >> [secure-web[.]cisco[.]com]> >> >> >> >> >> On 1/3/24, 4:44 AM, "Gavin Brown" <gavin.br...@icann.org >> <mailto:gavin.br...@icann.org> >> <mailto:gavin.br...@icann.org<mailto:gavin.br...@icann.org>>> wrote: >> >> >> Caution: This email originated from outside the organization. Do not click >> links or open attachments unless you recognize the sender and know the >> content is safe. >> >> >> Hi Jim, >> >> >>> On 2 Jan 2024, at 14:52, Gould, James <jgo...@verisign.com >>> <mailto:jgo...@verisign.com> >>> <mailto:jgo...@verisign.com<mailto:jgo...@verisign.com>>> wrote: >>> >>> Gavin, >>> >>> I question the need for a TTL RDAP extension, since the TTLs are easily >>> assessable in DNS to the public. The management of the TTLs is provisioned >>> in EPP via the TTL EPP extension and can be made available to the >>> registrant by the registrar. There are examples of DNS information >>> duplicated in RDAP, such as the DNSSEC information in RFC 9083, but I'm >>> concerned with setting the pattern of duplicating additional DNS >>> information with no perceived value. >>> >> >> >> RDAP domain objects contain other information that can also be obtained in >> the DNS, such as nameservers, glue, and DS records. Evidently there is value >> in providing this information via an alternate channel (such as to debug DNS >> resolution issues). Providing TTL information via RDAP is consistent with >> that approach and will also be helpful in the same scenarios. >> >> >> G. >> >> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> -- >>> >>> JG >>> >>> >>> >>> James Gould >>> Fellow Engineer >>> jgo...@verisign.com <mailto:jgo...@verisign.com> >>> <mailto:jgo...@verisign.com <mailto:jgo...@verisign.com>> >>> <applewebdata://13890C55-AAE8-4BF3-A6CE-B4BA42740803/jgo...@verisign.com >>> <mailto:jgo...@verisign.com> <mailto:jgo...@verisign.com >>> <mailto:jgo...@verisign.com>>> >>> >>> 703-948-3271 >>> 12061 Bluemont Way >>> Reston, VA 20190 >>> >>> Verisign.com >>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://secure-web.cisco.com/1WDhBI4oN4MzjYkRpT_wHK79lqjo81wGLL08NPt-xFPJjyn6sDCJdab6uBhbLq1pRbsZQxa7a-hYdlAzaBWt5VYvIWxi240Q1NVtJySVMdAk6lxrVxmdYoFp5-Amk_dm1Yttc1hboIe1DVDATAgzH76CZJSIYsGU358bki6jTYAJ-HrO9QUCoSHvVDsaGkNZH4C4prAkiD8kYccHVOam8VIdp2ZwNFNw-seninyVxG0YIyBT2EcGssY9T9TijHbVhDU_D6LqjNjQF7fvL3wXJCJzbyUgycb-VgNto2S094f0/https*3A*2F*2Furldefense.com*2Fv3*2F__http*3A*2F*2Fverisigninc.com*2F__;!!PtGJab4!-twuq17rqSKX-pCKHkTFhmzOXZaiQ1nbrzbWhB81AVnwvlHzeutZfLJ89yfRnjIyun6gaZT9bPAZBBwW9FcwU_pM$__;JSUlJSUlJSUl!!PtGJab4!5GuTiuq9XrUu8aQd2RokjKHNwmwEZ5tlC8tsJDWbNrI3g7ADTmvE53XFAntJcelbNIfCOKE7D95jcQ85rdacX7T_$ >>> [secure-web[.]cisco[.]com] >>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://secure-web.cisco.com/1WDhBI4oN4MzjYkRpT_wHK79lqjo81wGLL08NPt-xFPJjyn6sDCJdab6uBhbLq1pRbsZQxa7a-hYdlAzaBWt5VYvIWxi240Q1NVtJySVMdAk6lxrVxmdYoFp5-Amk_dm1Yttc1hboIe1DVDATAgzH76CZJSIYsGU358bki6jTYAJ-HrO9QUCoSHvVDsaGkNZH4C4prAkiD8kYccHVOam8VIdp2ZwNFNw-seninyVxG0YIyBT2EcGssY9T9TijHbVhDU_D6LqjNjQF7fvL3wXJCJzbyUgycb-VgNto2S094f0/https*3A*2F*2Furldefense.com*2Fv3*2F__http*3A*2F*2Fverisigninc.com*2F__;!!PtGJab4!-twuq17rqSKX-pCKHkTFhmzOXZaiQ1nbrzbWhB81AVnwvlHzeutZfLJ89yfRnjIyun6gaZT9bPAZBBwW9FcwU_pM$__;JSUlJSUlJSUl!!PtGJab4!5GuTiuq9XrUu8aQd2RokjKHNwmwEZ5tlC8tsJDWbNrI3g7ADTmvE53XFAntJcelbNIfCOKE7D95jcQ85rdacX7T_$ >>> [secure-web[.]cisco[.]com]> >>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://secure-web.cisco.com/1WDhBI4oN4MzjYkRpT_wHK79lqjo81wGLL08NPt-xFPJjyn6sDCJdab6uBhbLq1pRbsZQxa7a-hYdlAzaBWt5VYvIWxi240Q1NVtJySVMdAk6lxrVxmdYoFp5-Amk_dm1Yttc1hboIe1DVDATAgzH76CZJSIYsGU358bki6jTYAJ-HrO9QUCoSHvVDsaGkNZH4C4prAkiD8kYccHVOam8VIdp2ZwNFNw-seninyVxG0YIyBT2EcGssY9T9TijHbVhDU_D6LqjNjQF7fvL3wXJCJzbyUgycb-VgNto2S094f0/https*3A*2F*2Furldefense.com*2Fv3*2F__http*3A*2F*2Fverisigninc.com*2F__;!!PtGJab4!-twuq17rqSKX-pCKHkTFhmzOXZaiQ1nbrzbWhB81AVnwvlHzeutZfLJ89yfRnjIyun6gaZT9bPAZBBwW9FcwU_pM$__;JSUlJSUlJSUl!!PtGJab4!5GuTiuq9XrUu8aQd2RokjKHNwmwEZ5tlC8tsJDWbNrI3g7ADTmvE53XFAntJcelbNIfCOKE7D95jcQ85rdacX7T_$ >>> [secure-web[.]cisco[.]com] >>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://secure-web.cisco.com/1WDhBI4oN4MzjYkRpT_wHK79lqjo81wGLL08NPt-xFPJjyn6sDCJdab6uBhbLq1pRbsZQxa7a-hYdlAzaBWt5VYvIWxi240Q1NVtJySVMdAk6lxrVxmdYoFp5-Amk_dm1Yttc1hboIe1DVDATAgzH76CZJSIYsGU358bki6jTYAJ-HrO9QUCoSHvVDsaGkNZH4C4prAkiD8kYccHVOam8VIdp2ZwNFNw-seninyVxG0YIyBT2EcGssY9T9TijHbVhDU_D6LqjNjQF7fvL3wXJCJzbyUgycb-VgNto2S094f0/https*3A*2F*2Furldefense.com*2Fv3*2F__http*3A*2F*2Fverisigninc.com*2F__;!!PtGJab4!-twuq17rqSKX-pCKHkTFhmzOXZaiQ1nbrzbWhB81AVnwvlHzeutZfLJ89yfRnjIyun6gaZT9bPAZBBwW9FcwU_pM$__;JSUlJSUlJSUl!!PtGJab4!5GuTiuq9XrUu8aQd2RokjKHNwmwEZ5tlC8tsJDWbNrI3g7ADTmvE53XFAntJcelbNIfCOKE7D95jcQ85rdacX7T_$ >>> [secure-web[.]cisco[.]com]>> [verisigninc[.]com]> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On 1/2/24, 9:03 AM, "regext on behalf of Gavin Brown" >>> <regext-boun...@ietf.org <mailto:regext-boun...@ietf.org> >>> <mailto:regext-boun...@ietf.org <mailto:regext-boun...@ietf.org>> >>> <mailto:regext-boun...@ietf.org <mailto:regext-boun...@ietf.org> >>> <mailto:regext-boun...@ietf.org <mailto:regext-boun...@ietf.org>>> on >>> behalf of gavin.br...@icann.org <mailto:gavin.br...@icann.org> >>> <mailto:gavin.br...@icann.org <mailto:gavin.br...@icann.org>> >>> <mailto:gavin.br...@icann.org <mailto:gavin.br...@icann.org> >>> <mailto:gavin.br...@icann.org <mailto:gavin.br...@icann.org>>>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> >>> As a complement to the EPP extension, I've just uploaded a first draft of >>> an RDAP extension: >>> >>> >>> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://secure-web.cisco.com/1khfl7WVPWF-jsGK6Nxqwpdr3f-7zS-IMW2fy2UbmOBdDxFAso7MbjPz8VXKRq0aKCyklcAbOVTwl3-v1Sj3ZbN_hKbmdfMCh__EipHieNvm5-I92wmnx5ws0ZMai6ilhvxRlPMTmOA3Vd2dZhxiJLZ9BoFxIR6aj8fH0e2-N7pjb6j6_0WNcS4ko3gaB4oUJYXmusur7WWhL8wLPMG9Cci8s3YDe1I54CR3ivBWoKIwD206EaslQuw16Q1i6ETQERIkWmEcFnZhbnBPVHToH2TG_SWtXqcuIUHJxxvY2hss/https*3A*2F*2Furldefense.com*2Fv3*2F__https*3A*2F*2Fsecure-web.cisco.com*2F1cbpvLaxkXtiMxQku8jDm2TgXvD6OlaLPfyuDyqcKICKKvoZdwaB4a-dn4H9lpfSVFKLTxRsg8H1QbTOnAYaSDJhRJc-Nej9fgazwK0PO2MWTfIZlWiACP7SIWz5WocpqC4fi3lZlo5w7y47KB2rh2vo-xSZwzoAIEvQtKrCXy9D4MMUPMwwHI2YaYxWKqyLcsEiRiVGw0TiYcU4viI_CRckheWvm9Kdzy1y10JrHdN_aHYu06YXF606kW3ME8bi2c6QoApNmUGIZRUFmKaXxD9LTcon-6ARcRBgf_afSZas*2Fhttps__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJQ!!PtGJab4!5GuTiuq9XrUu8aQd2RokjKHNwmwEZ5tlC8tsJDWbNrI3g7ADTmvE53XFAntJcelbNIfCOKE7D95jcQ85rYYlPKyY$ >>> [secure-web[.]cisco[.]com] >>> <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://secure-web.cisco.com/1khfl7WVPWF-jsGK6Nxqwpdr3f-7zS-IMW2fy2UbmOBdDxFAso7MbjPz8VXKRq0aKCyklcAbOVTwl3-v1Sj3ZbN_hKbmdfMCh__EipHieNvm5-I92wmnx5ws0ZMai6ilhvxRlPMTmOA3Vd2dZhxiJLZ9BoFxIR6aj8fH0e2-N7pjb6j6_0WNcS4ko3gaB4oUJYXmusur7WWhL8wLPMG9Cci8s3YDe1I54CR3ivBWoKIwD206EaslQuw16Q1i6ETQERIkWmEcFnZhbnBPVHToH2TG_SWtXqcuIUHJxxvY2hss/https*3A*2F*2Furldefense.com*2Fv3*2F__https*3A*2F*2Fsecure-web.cisco.com*2F1cbpvLaxkXtiMxQku8jDm2TgXvD6OlaLPfyuDyqcKICKKvoZdwaB4a-dn4H9lpfSVFKLTxRsg8H1QbTOnAYaSDJhRJc-Nej9fgazwK0PO2MWTfIZlWiACP7SIWz5WocpqC4fi3lZlo5w7y47KB2rh2vo-xSZwzoAIEvQtKrCXy9D4MMUPMwwHI2YaYxWKqyLcsEiRiVGw0TiYcU4viI_CRckheWvm9Kdzy1y10JrHdN_aHYu06YXF606kW3ME8bi2c6QoApNmUGIZRUFmKaXxD9LTcon-6ARcRBgf_afSZas*2Fhttps__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJQ!!PtGJab4!5GuTiuq9XrUu8aQd2RokjKHNwmwEZ5tlC8tsJDWbNrI3g7ADTmvE53XFAntJcelbNIfCOKE7D95jcQ85rYYlPKyY$ >>> [secure-web[.]cisco[.]com]> >>> 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[secure-web[.]cisco[.]com]>*3A*2F*2Fdatatracker.ietf.org*2Fdoc*2Fdraft-brown-rdap-ttl-extension*2F__;JSUlJSUl!!PtGJab4!-twuq17rqSKX-pCKHkTFhmzOXZaiQ1nbrzbWhB81AVnwvlHzeutZfLJ89yfRnjIyun6gaZT9bPAZBBwW9Kx0b62K$ >>> [secure-web[.]cisco[.]com]> >>> >>> >>> This extension does not require the use of the EPP extension: it can be >>> used by any RDAP server operator wishing to publish TTL information in RDAP >>> responses. >>> >>> >>> Given bandwidth constraints, I would not seek WG adoption until the EPP >>> document is published as an RFC, but wanted to publish an early draft for >>> review. Feedback welcome! >>> >>> >>> G. >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Gavin Brown >>> Principal Engineer, Global Domains & Strategy >>> Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers (ICANN) >>> >>> >>> 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<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://secure-web.cisco.com/1ncjp1vd0OpOxbP2xaNFqdfRodtZTcaquWMjFlazCgrk_cBgbXxnRAbVTuxODiCjvSu6KaWm75AgjAmTqAK_cUR5dJayicLuSUo0mUUIrpEr6OkuWD1c9Gy_xDB7XmifhyfMCR-SV56KmrKUxAfzI6hDzuvdc7a8m6yIyLw6XFY6Ko972YUULzxpGYCLy5mXERn5dqyWmXAaRHmONw0y0he6YCrzuX_OBcYFLaGzu5tP63j_XEm405Ed8SH8UnK6Ea-O2OF2mnlgB89NccSP72JSeTRbMwEKIkQ3C3QP4izc/https*3A*2F*2Fwww.ietf.org*2Fmailman*2Flistinfo*2Fregext__;JSUlJSUl!!PtGJab4!5GuTiuq9XrUu8aQd2RokjKHNwmwEZ5tlC8tsJDWbNrI3g7ADTmvE53XFAntJcelbNIfCOKE7D95jcQ85rWtCpZQK$ >> [secure-web[.]cisco[.]com]> -- Gavin Brown Principal Engineer, Global Domains & Strategy Internet Corporation for Assigned Names and Numbers (ICANN) https://www.icann.org _______________________________________________ regext mailing list regext@ietf.org https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/regext
