Dear Jane, et al,
Ola! Good Day All. Very cool group and posts, thanx! I hope you and yours are well and will continue to be. Yes, the supposed analysis feed us post-election, by the media conspiracy: "Nascar dads" being organized around the war and fear of terrorism; The increase in the "Evangelical" vote; Married women worried about security, the "security moms"; Hispanics more interested in "values and issues of faith"; and gays and lesbians (possibly headed up by some remocrat collaborators) who "just had to get married a year before the election", are demographic forces more responsible for the remocrats "winning" (a patriarchal addiction and delusional complex). Yet, as they're just putting the spin the corporate structure wants on these issues, to further demean the political process and devolve people into accepting the system's outcomes and fascism' inevitable increase, and devolve dempublicans into accepting this and mechanizing to meet its needs, aren't you and others playing into this by not facing the fact that fascism has to be struggled with in its every element? Do we relate how the media's analysis is stridently superficial, blatantly blind, and actually an attempt to cloud the vision of dempublicans to the facts; as well as keep them from the people's view? Most, like many in this dialogue, rather label and project superiority, I do not. First "Nascar dads" were also organized based on racism and the economic and political power inequity of the electoral college, women's wages and opportunities, etc., patriarchal "American institutions" being challenged by "we...", not just their addictions to oil, violence, and "white" privilege; and, in fact the dempublicans had some gains in this area, contrary to the polls. The "Evangelical" vote mostly got out more because the remocrats engineered state initiatives against gay marriage as presidential get out the vote processes, through fear mongering; did the dempublicans address this, I think not. The fascist organizing tools of "The Passion", and supposed Christianity as a whole, were also avoided by the dempublicans. Yes, "security moms" and Hispanics voted more for the emperor too, yet, it's more complicated than the media presented. The pronouncement that the polar ice caps are melting, the day after the election typifies this process, they plainly stated, "they don't have any plans to rectify it, yet, are working on it"; though, they've known about it for half a century! It's like Berlusconi pronouncing to Venetians who are all knee deep in water, that he "has plans drawn up to hold back the flood". My point is that everyone knows the remocrats are going to successfully drag the dempublicans along in their continual premeditated mass-earth-murdering processes for their exponentially increased supposed garnering of delusional profits and delusional pleasures from it, while they determine real deficits that are exponentially larger than their short term profits; our grandchildren will have to pay to fix the earth, unsuccessfully. So, the mentality is akin to a sinking ship. We see this in the country "going red", because they're seeing red, are being scared and terrorized by the remocrats, therefore, dempublicans running to "blue states", "security in numbers" (the beginnings of future defacto- concentration camps), is only understandable; yet, I feel it must be struggled with, as convenience doesn't further. So, the reality that "we..." have been terrorized into submission by the remocrat conspiracy purposely not preventing 9-11, our gov't 'using' that to get any and every fascist change they wanted, the corporate structure 'using' that and the supposedly "necessitated unending war on terror" to militarize every government and ruling classes people every where in a premeditated precursor to the "necessity to control the world's population" into accepting their extinction, before the impending extinction of humanity, etc., are in fact what has determined people, across the board, in embracing the devolutionary direction of society more, and unbecoming humanity more, and being, voting more fascist. The dempublicans wanting to make believe it's not so, because they're wedded to the devolution as well, won't make it go away. Instead of labeling them we can remember that the struggles of all can't be easily disregarded when you struggle, if they are it's with a real deficit determined by the supposed garnering of that delusional profit. One can't forget the lifelong struggles of those you deem 'useful' to you in yours. For, we're all threads in the whole of life's fabric, which will always need mending, yet, we can't allow it to be torn asunder. Sure education and self-knowledge have something to do with it. Yes, the more we learn, the more we're able to perceive what we don't yet know, and its vastness is larger, though, it's not accurate to say, "the more we learn, the more we don't know"; i.m.h.o.. Known and unknown are, as all words, paths of studies, not objects; yet, usually are defined by their subjective sense, with the speakers perception being described, not reality. For, literally, there are no such antithesis, dualities, dichotomies, etc., all being delusional constructs of our mind's; poorly informed by our limited abilities to perceive and perceptions. Admittedly, all delusions are only parts of walls of delusional constructs, yet, are made of bricks of illusions and our subjective aspects of mind; therefore, don't exist. Though, the commonality of illusions lends them to their universal acceptance, and aids in our ability to be compassionate towards those who aren't able to discern reality from it, regardless of them. Yet, you purposely don't criticize supposed science, even though it's little more than a denomination of the actual global number one religion of greed, like supposed Christianity, why? For, real science states that all its laws are just variegated probabilities, to varying degrees reality, in any moment in time, space. Yes, those supposedly 'scientific' facts and actions occur, yet, can we say we know, because we perceive patterns that most mistake for repetition? Therefore, real science can only claim to discern realisms, while supposed science claims that 'science' is the only knowledge and is complete paridigmally; which of course is not true, and allows us to know that they propagate those lies for greed, market, sociological and societal imperatives. The same can be said for most religions, spiritualities, cosmologies, worldviews, etc.. Yet, the preference of yours for science over Christianity is telling. So, the question of known and unknown has a proprietary basis, in its common usage. As the ever increasing supposed garnering of delusional profits and delusional pleasures in ever increasingly more cyclical and centralizing patterns, societies actual raison d'etre, is based on the purported better knowing and its better 'use', even though it's actually just based on the better access to, processing of information, and denial of the same to others. The mirroring of the scarcity based economic systems is evident in it, as well. Whereas, in reality, abundance is natural, and any systems based on it, economic or otherwise, evolve all life towards the realization of its potential, ones based on scarcity, don't; instead So, to a large degree the whole conversation comes down to self- knowledge as a path chosen or not, not a predetermined quantifiable goal, as the Adlerian based sociological programming process we euphemistically call education has determined it to be, instead. Yes, indeed, the self we talk about to others in various circumstances, and with varying length of knowing of the person, and dependent on the nature of those relations, plays key roles in our communications. Yet, while we all have that multitude of masks, isn't the self becoming, like a snake sheds its skin, shedding those masks? To what we've all been referring to as the more genuine, real, original self? Also, how about the self before birth, totally non- sociological self's beginnings? Though, empowering, as opposed to the position taken by you and others that they only need 'educating', which would spark their self- actuation, natural ability to desire to change themselves, is not only more honest, now, it's necessary for the existence of humanity and large mammals to even be a possibility. That independence of awareness that we could foster in them by struggling with them and their fascism would be preferable to the short-term gains progressives supposedly would, and historically have projected they've made, by projecting the problem is "their ignorance"; instead of squarely struggling with their fascism; and identifying it for exactly what it is all along the way. Of course this would necessitate our embracing education as a life long path, and struggling with our own devolution into mechanistic thought, lowest common-denominator homeostatic states of existence and action, as well. For, the supposed progressives and dempublicans having embraced the devolutionary direction of the corporate structure's convolution, have also taken it, and the collateral societal trend towards "ignorance is bliss", you term 'ignorance', for all the delusional profits and delusional pleasures it's worth; as have the remocrats, just to a far lesser degree than the GOP. This determined identification with the corporate structure's plans, for greed and supposed powers sake, has had its populist advantages for the dempublicans, that you don't point out, just as it has had them for the remocrats; which you and other 'explainers' of the dempublicans fall do point out. Yes, you and they are 'rallying the troops', lifting the spirits, yet, aren't you and they also avoiding these facts too; and to that degree perpetuating the systems upon systems of delusional constructs that you so pointedly call 'ignorance' in red states; yet, for populist reasons, project doesn't exist in blue ones? Yes, your and their projections of populist elitism might make knowing another's in their corner a comfort to the 'masses' in 'blue' states, yet, doesn't it misdirect them from the necessity to awaken to reality and the hard and necessitated struggling ahead; as there are no corners or sides, only ones of our making, intellectually speaking, aren't we, if we succumb to that delusional process, only further determining real deficits over the long run that are exponentially larger than the delusional profits we seem to reap from it in the short term? Can humanity, nay life itself, afford even this new twist on social hubris we're 'selling'? I think not. Is that defeatist acknowledgement of remocrat future failures you close with, "will destroy their purveyors in the end", as if it's possible that humanities' fragility will 'survive' them, solace to the 'people', or just another justification for our not being in remocrats faces at every twist of their fascist blitzkrieg's plans? Can't we struggle with the dempublicans to face their fascism, their embracing of the remocratic devolutionary direction, instead, and thereby struggle directly with the fact that, as you're well aware, our and global society are becoming more divisive by the minute; and insist on their growth as we do ours; and not fall, as dempublicans ever have, into the maze of the populist tendency, attempting to get agreement, more votes, and societal elitism of 'winning' and wanting to. For, we we don't want to project our thoughts, mores, morals onto people do we, especially in this area, for, their survival and ours, not just quality of life, may be at stake; which is in the realm of their choice, not ours, in the end. Though, to the degree we can keep it real, for e.g., is the degree to which that accepting of people to embrace change can realize the space for their desire to work on oneself and others, and to grow, possible. Yet, they, as all of us in the struggle, must keep the truisms like this in mind, that people don't only dislike what they can't understand, they tend to ostracize it. This is compensatory because, if it's not in their life, then they won't have to think or feel more to relate to the genuine person; which makes them "feel and think" of themselves as together. They also, thereby, hope to not "have to" actually think about their lives, feel their feelings; the going along to get along game they play on themselves. They also do this because, their conformity, a mirror image of themselves, is all they allow themselves to see, which assuages their fears that relate to acceptance and control; e.g., being liked, surviving, succeeding, fitting in, etc.. I've had difficulty, yet, kept struggling, the growth potential, alone, makes being more real well worth it; i.m.h.o. Also, it helps to keep in mind Jung's analysis that 80 % of every action, thought, feeling we have is compensatory towards our past experiences; conscious through to unconscious, individuated through to collective. You superficially, as most do, critique their supposed Christianity, being satisfied with your superior analasis of it. Since, for e.g., most people that call themselves Christians are only make believe Christians who continually defile Jesus Christ's teachings in his name, I won't call myself a Christian. Not to forget the abominations done by so-called Christians, in Jesus Christ's name. As well, I won't call myself a Buddhist or Christian because the label is usually used by the make believe ones to garner delusional profits and delusional pleasures from controlling that "group". They use it to differentiate in order to control, etc; usually. Another reason I don't use the labels is because the labels are also used to illude and delude ourselves, like the make believe students of religion do. How could I say I'm a Hindu, Jew, or Muslim, have I encompassed all that those great teachings have to offer. Don't we tend to do less when we think we've "accomplished" something, like being a "Christian"? Isn't the study of Native American Spirituality, for e.g., of such great breadth and depth that to fathom it is impossible? So, why would I assert I'm a Christian, am I really being all that that assertion would entail in that moment; or, even, any moment? Where is this humility of real study which is endemic to the studies of Jesus, et al, in the pronouncements of the emperor, of his being on a "mission", for the Pope and the Christian empire, his projections of the necessity for a "crusade", etc.? Of course, no where to be found, for, his supposed Christianity is more than your average bastardization of religion, it is more equatable with anti- Christian rhetoric, yet, do you and other critiques bother to struggle with them on their 'turf', as I have for 3 decades; or do you relegate them and the real struggle to for truth and knowledge to 'difference of opinion', and label them as 'ignorant in the end, out of convenience, when you know they're not; for, they are consciously choosing fascism. The Dominionism cult he's involved in wants the extinction of humanity, can humanity afford to not struggle with it and him; in its every aspect, and his every action? Yes, people will need time to adjust, and experientially uplift themselves, and all with them. Yet, mustn't we aid the struggling through the murky waters of struggling with mechanization of thought and action, and relegation of emotion to the pigeon hole box labeled weakness? For, feeling is power, and its denial or lack of insight on it, can have powerfully negative effects. Yet, if we discard boxes, labels, and those who would, or do pigeon hole, experience can, again, enlightened much of life. I used to say, in order to believe in sides, you have to be a square. Yet, I amended it to, not all those that believe in sides are squares. I think using evolution as a common language, as it's the thread that links every, in the fabric of life, is a good place to start. What do you all think? My groups :) VotingforNader � Voting for Nader Homepage :) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/VotingforNader/ Subscribe :) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Disabled Greens News and discussion, Group home page :) http://groups.yahoo.com/group/DisabledGreensNews/ , Abuse in Therapy, Group homepage :) http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/AbuseinTherapy/ Diffabled, Mental Health, all related issues, advocacy, and professionals: Invite link: http://passport.care2.net/invite.html? g=880 Homepage: http://www.care2.com/c2c/group/Diffabled_MentalHealth_Action "Painting is poetry which is seen and not heard, and poetry is a painting which is heard but not seen." ~ Leonardo da Vinci Goodbye. Enjoy an autumnal eve' as you can. Copy, share, as you will. Lest "we" forget, if you don't exercise responsibility, its Siamese sister, freedom, will wither, as well. Sadly, now, it first needs to be exorcized be fore its exercised. Viva la evolution! Matutinally Yours, james m nordlund reality (aja) :) For those interested :) "of or pertaining to the morning, day: relating to or happening in the morning or in the early part of the day (formal), (Mid-16th century, from late Latin matutinalis, from Matuta, goddess of the dawn.)" Music is life's song accompanying the abundance of joy's Spring. I look forward to hearing from you. No worries. ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> $9.95 domain names from Yahoo!. Register anything. http://us.click.yahoo.com/J8kdrA/y20IAA/yQLSAA/XgSolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> ----- / o o \ ===OO=====OO============================================= (4)Portals (2)News Wikis (2)Conferences - No BuSHIT! 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