On 03/07/2018 03:48 PM, Vladimir D. Seleznev wrote:
On Thu, Mar 01, 2018 at 09:58:58AM +0200, Panu Matilainen wrote:
On 02/28/2018 12:03 AM, Vladimir D. Seleznev wrote:
Hello, rpm-maint@!

We in ALT Linux Team implemented some new RPM tags for our RPM package
header and RPM database. Since RPM tags are numerical identifiers and we
want to keep compatibility with mainstream RPM tools and packages, we
are requesting to reserve some RPM tag range for our purpose (around 100
RPM tags) to avoid the collision with RPM tag numbers, that can possibly
will be added to rpm.org in the future.

Yes we can reserve tags, it's not like we're going to run out of 32bit
integers anytime soon. However we're not going to foster distro
proprietary development & forks by blindly handing you 100 "do whatever
you want" tags. That's not how this works.

This is not about proprietary development, all ALT rpm features are
available in git repo at git.alt [1] [2].

Yes, I know. Of course it's not proprietary in the strict sense, but for all practical purposes the results of that work are not available to anybody not using ALT. I should've said "proprietary" with quotes.

It would be better to consolidate efforts but currently ALT rpm is a
fork with more than a decade-long history and a lot of good features
implemented such as autogenerated dependency for various interpreted
languages, set-versions, checks and a lot of other enhancements, and we
just can't drop these. Still we tried to port ours changes to new at
that time rpm 4.13 to keep our rpm closer to upstream (for now it
provides rpm(8) and some other, but no rpm-build).

Yeah I know and I was glad to see that happen.

If a feature is interesting to Alt, there's more than a slight change
it's interesting to others as well, so you should always initially
target getting the thing upstream. The price of tag reservations is
discussing your plans upstream first, either here on rpm-maint or GH

And what about features ALT already has? They are integrated to ALT
package ecosystem with repositories with thousands of packages which
should be able to be installed and handled by package manager. And what
about the features like set-versions, which you don't want to integrate

Just send a patch that makes the reservations for the tags you already use, with their actual names and types and all? See the RPMTAG_MSSF* tags for an example of how to do it. If there are clashes or other issues, the only way to work them out is by laying it all on the table.

We asked for 100 rpm tags with a big reserve.
Understood, but handing out a big pile of free tags to grab and run is not going to bring your rpm any closer to upstream. Quite the contrary. I'm just trying to encourage you folks into an upstream first approach by whatever means I have available. If it feels a bit like extortion to you, sorry ;)

At the moment we want to use RPMTAG_AUTOINSTALLED in rpm db that helps
apt to determine what package was installed automatically as a
dependency of manually installed packages.

Tracking the install reason is a common need across pretty much all the depsolvers. Send a patch and we'll see where it goes from there?

Second tag we want to use is RPMTAG_IDENTITY which determine a
characteristic of package build and is represented hash of significant
tags (in opposite to RPMTAG_SHA1HEADER, that is a hash of all package

A bit hard to comment based on just that, but if I understood correctly then I don't see why not, sounds potentially quite useful in fact. Send a patch so we can discuss the specifics?

In recent years this here market has become quite a bit more open than it once was and with many more parties involved. But nothing will get upstreamed if it's not submitted at all. Even if upstream doesn't take it right away, at least people will then be aware of the work and might grow interested, which might lead to being used in other distros too -> more pressure for upstream to include it. In some cases you might even see others jump in to help with a feature, shock horror! And even if nothing else comes out of it, at the very least you'll get your tags reserved in time.

        - Panu -
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