I have been an admirer of UK S scale models and modeling for years. Imagine--S being the scale spoken of in reverential terms by those unfortunates modeling in other scales :-)
Fred Tolhurst Maryville, TN -----Original Message----- From: Simon <[email protected]> To: S-Scale <[email protected]> Sent: Sat, Dec 22, 2012 9:43 am Subject: {S-Scale List} A different perspective There seems to be an interesting discussion about fidelity to scale, with to be honest more heat than light and entrenched positions. Being an S scale modeller in the UK, some of the comments strike me as being the opposite of experience here! >but simply to have them see me as someone who models in a different but >equally respectable scale, not in "S - that toy train gauge." In the UK, S scale is just about the very last scale which would be viewed as a "toy train gauge" - even Scale7 modellers, every bit as pernickety as Proto48 in the US, tend to respond to S scale in a slightly reverent manner, for a real falling out, you need to see some of the forums devoted to 00 gauge - 4mm scale on H0 track - EM gauge (4mm scale on 18.2mm gauge track) and P4 (4mm scale on 18.83mm gauge track), where "we have more fun than you" debates have been known to rage to no one's ultimate benefit. (And to be perfectly honest, most of this went on a few years back.) No, in the UK S scale - first developed in 1896! - as always been the preserve of the dedicated do it yourself merchant, with very little support outside of that provided by the UK base S Scale Model Railway Society. Which isn't to say that we don't refer to the hobby as "toy trains". Over here, S scale has one set of standards (the real thing scaled down, with a slight adjustment to gauge - .0012" over gauge - to allow for engineering tolerances. We don't have these debates! > Thanks for helping me out. Only 3 on this list seem to want Lionel to do more > for "Scale" products. Without wishing to in-flame anyone at all, and certainly not the poster of this remark, I would say that is a fair comment, but: 1) How many "scale" modellers are on the list? 2) How many S scale modellers are on the list? 3) Given the somewhat robust responses to some points made on this list, is anyone surprised that few of those interested in "scale" products have responded? Here is my own experience, as a teenager (too) many years ago, with RTR 00 gauge items, being worked up to be more scale with better wheels of the correct diameter, etc. I spent some time upgrading a set of very nice RTR 4-wheel freight cars, which had been (no unreasonably) designed to cope with train set curves. As the cars were long wheelbase, the axles were designed to pivot in a sub-frame which also pivoted the couplers in well-established Talgo style. This also applied to a small Bo-Bo I was detailing. Part of the detailing process was to replace the couplers with scale hooks and links. Because European railways do not yet routinely use "knuckle" centre-buffing couplers, the body was raised by 1mm to accommodate coupler movement (tension locks) under the buffers on radius 1 curves. Unfortunately - and I did not know this at the time - the manufacturer did not leave things there, but in a desire to get a "correct" scale height, reduced the height of the open (=gondola), van (=boxcar) and loco (=loco :) ) by 1mm, thus subtly altering the proportions of the vehicles. On the van, this was not too noticeable, but the open (gon) looked awful. I became aware of this later, when a reviewer showing how to update the models in a similar manner commented on this silly decision: it made no difference to the "train set" end of the market whether the overall body height was correct or not, but to the scale end of the market, it was important, and as they would be correcting the reasons for having the body mounted too high, then the manufacturer was effectively ruling themselves out of a part of the market - it may not have been a big part of the market, but why make a compromise which reduces sales? So, I would say to all, by all means enjoy your trains/railroads in whatever manner you wish. But to manufacturers I would add, if you get the basics right - such as body proportions - if you can make compromises necessary for one end of the market (e.g. just raise the body, or fit Talgo-type coupler mounts to trucks to accommodate curves) such that the other, smaller, scale end can modify to suit without carving things off, then you will maximise sales. Personally, I think taking a loco (for example) designed for the hi-rail market, and remounting pilots and couplers on the body, refining, replacing and upgrading the details falls into "modelling" and personalises the model. And one last point: I can't get to see the prototype, so I rely on manufacturers to get things basically right - failing that, it is really useful to know what is wrong, and how to fix it. I take such remarks positively, as they enable me to make models which are more to scale, but I am also perfectly happy that this is not everyone's cup of tea. (Earl Grey, please, with a slice of lemo.) Regards all, and best wishes for Christmas and the New Year! Simon
