I replied off-list on this topic, with similar thoughts as to what is
stated below. There are numerous issues, particularly with
non-professional software applications not designed for "broadcast" use
in addition to the physics and implemented technological limitations
discussed below. Any one who has watched "live" video plus audio using
these non-professional applications and hardware, probably has noticed a
speaking human in which the lips and voice are not in synchronous (audio
and video tracks mistimed, or jitter, or both). Even with high
throughput non-military/clandestine service networks (for which quality
of service keeps throughput close to purchased bandwidth), the latency
(and in some cases jitter) of the routers, etc., make the network
unsuitable for the purpose requested. An alternative, that does not
solve the speed of light issue (no Star Trek, Star Wars, etc.,
instantaneous transmission across the galaxy -- we do not know the
physics to do that, wormholes notwithstanding), is a direct laser
transmitter to a reflector in low earth orbit that allows the "beam" to
be aimed to the receiver at each end of the data stream -- not feasible
for standard civilian commercial use.
On 12/23/20 6:41 AM, Steven C Timm wrote:
In theory light could go 5000 km in 16ms. In practice it takes 105ms to
get packets from FNAL to CERN.
(speed of light is slower in fiber, fiber doesn't go straight, there are
several switches).
Even 16ms is more of a delay than you want in a musical performance.
And you have to do the round trip.
Try singing together with someone on zoom if you want to prove the
point. The high-speed network doesn't give much benefit over the
regular internet in terms of latency. it improves bandwidth but not
latency all that much. The only way all these virtual choirs work is
that they send out a base track to everyone that the people have locally
and then each person records their part on top of it.
Steve Timm
(Physicist and amateur church musician, computing and recording remotely
for last 10 months)
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* owner-scientific-linux-us...@listserv.fnal.gov
<owner-scientific-linux-us...@listserv.fnal.gov> on behalf of Keith
Lofstrom <kei...@kl-ic.com>
*Sent:* Tuesday, December 22, 2020 6:24 PM
*To:* scientific-linux-users <scientific-linux-users@fnal.gov>
*Subject:* Way Off Topic - HEP Network Symphony Orchestra
This isn't Scientific Linux, though SL and the team that
supports it would be involved in implementation.
----
AFAIK, we are still in the middle of Long Shutdown 2,
with the Large Hadron Collider /not/ sending terabytes
of experimental data through the dedicated HEP network.
Meanwhile, gathering musicians on stage for a symphony
orchestra is a big health risk during the COVID pandemic.
The speed of sound across a symphony stage is 500,000 times
slower than bits on an optical fiber. In theory, musicians
could be connected through the HEP network, spread out over
5000 kilometer distances compared to the 10 meter distance
across a symphony stage. Distances are smaller than that
between groups of European or North American cities.
There are probably more symphony fans than high energy
physics fans (many physicists are both), so using the HEP
network for concerts during the COVID crisis could earn
a LOT of political capital, and help with future funding,
including funding for the next upgraded HEP network.
It would also develop new techniques for synchronizing
planet-scale sensor networks. There are likely some
excellent astronomical and geophysical uses for that.
I'd guess that readers of this list know the people who
know the people who know how to do this. What could we
slap together in a hurry?
Keith
--
Keith Lofstrom kei...@keithl.com
