Re: [digitalradio] Move away from PSK63 /31 in NBEMS?
Hi all, I would like to test one of these ARQ modes. Anyone around for a test on 40- or 80m? I am calling cq on 3585 usb in Thor right now. 73 de LA5VNA Steinar kh6ty wrote: >> 1. Is it correct that just because a mode is listed in the NBEMS mode >> list, does not mean that you could not use it with flarq as an ARQ mode? >> > > Yes, but some modes cannot be used as an ARQ mode due to either too much > latency or ascii or control code support. The only modes tested with flarq > are DominoEx, MFSK16,32,64, PSK31,63,125,250, Thor (all speeds) and > MT-63-2000. The latency of MT-63 is so great, only the fastest speed is > enough to enable ARQ to work. > > >> Therefore, any of the modes could theoretically be used, even if not >> recommended or even if they might not work very well but flarq will ARQ >> any of them? >> > > See above. Of the available modes for ARQ, the ones listed for NBEMS are the > ones recommended for messaging. However, on VHF when signals are near the > noise, it is sometimes easier to tune with PSK31 (because the idle carriers > stand out more clearly against the noise background on the waterfall than > the multi-tone modes) and then switch to MFSK16 or DominoEx11 without > changing the tuning. > > >> 2. Could you explain how the MFSK modes are made more robust and yet can >> still work with other programs? >> > > We worked with ZL1BPU, one of the authors of MFSK16, to implement several > enhancements, one of which is called "puncturing", which averages the signal > level and if a signal sample is significantly above the average, it is > assumed to be a static burst and the AFC is momentarily disabled. The fldigi > MFSK modes are compatible with MFSK16 or MFSK8 in other programs, but it is > necessary to use fldigi in order to get the advantage of the enchancements. > > >> On another note, thanks for confirming what I suspected about the drift >> issue. I recently was told that I my preference for purchasing only TCXO >> rigs was overkill, even for VHF, but when you look at the ppm issues >> with modes such as MFSK, even a few Hz is a problem. >> > > Generally, not on HF so much, as transceivers tend to have less drift on HF, > especially on 80m and 40m, but definitely on VHF, where excessive drift can > often be a serious problem for some digital modes. > > 73, Skip KH6TY > NBEMS Development Team > > > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com > Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.6.5/1620 - Release Date: 19.08.2008 > 06:04 > > >
Re: [digitalradio] Move away from PSK63 /31 in NBEMS?
> 1. Is it correct that just because a mode is listed in the NBEMS mode > list, does not mean that you could not use it with flarq as an ARQ mode? Yes, but some modes cannot be used as an ARQ mode due to either too much latency or ascii or control code support. The only modes tested with flarq are DominoEx, MFSK16,32,64, PSK31,63,125,250, Thor (all speeds) and MT-63-2000. The latency of MT-63 is so great, only the fastest speed is enough to enable ARQ to work. > > Therefore, any of the modes could theoretically be used, even if not > recommended or even if they might not work very well but flarq will ARQ > any of them? See above. Of the available modes for ARQ, the ones listed for NBEMS are the ones recommended for messaging. However, on VHF when signals are near the noise, it is sometimes easier to tune with PSK31 (because the idle carriers stand out more clearly against the noise background on the waterfall than the multi-tone modes) and then switch to MFSK16 or DominoEx11 without changing the tuning. > > 2. Could you explain how the MFSK modes are made more robust and yet can > still work with other programs? We worked with ZL1BPU, one of the authors of MFSK16, to implement several enhancements, one of which is called "puncturing", which averages the signal level and if a signal sample is significantly above the average, it is assumed to be a static burst and the AFC is momentarily disabled. The fldigi MFSK modes are compatible with MFSK16 or MFSK8 in other programs, but it is necessary to use fldigi in order to get the advantage of the enchancements. > > On another note, thanks for confirming what I suspected about the drift > issue. I recently was told that I my preference for purchasing only TCXO > rigs was overkill, even for VHF, but when you look at the ppm issues > with modes such as MFSK, even a few Hz is a problem. Generally, not on HF so much, as transceivers tend to have less drift on HF, especially on 80m and 40m, but definitely on VHF, where excessive drift can often be a serious problem for some digital modes. 73, Skip KH6TY NBEMS Development Team
Re: [digitalradio] Success with FLdigi
Andy and fellow digital enthusiasts, I really like fldigi a lot. I had it running under GNU/Linux a while back and while it was extremely difficult to set up compared to MS Windows XP, the author, Dave Freese went out of his way to help me do it over a period of many days of effort. Now thankfully, I can run it on Windows XP (and even Vista) since most of the ham programs I use can only run on Windows OS. The newest version has many of the features/shortcuts/ergonomics/user interface the way I like and does it with a fairly "lightweight" design. One of the issues I have to resolve is the same one you mentioned... how do I handle long term logging? Both Multipsk and HRD/DM780 provide a direct method of logging to my master log which is DXLab's DXKeeper. No other logging program can take the place of DXKeeper since it needs to do so many things and keep it in one database that can work with the electronic QSL systems. Swapping files back and forth and keeping it all straight does not seem to be a practical method. How do you plan to handle your contacts on fldigi? The alternative is only use fldigi for public service purposes, but other than not having FAE400, Packet, Pactor FEC Mode B, and maybe a few other modes that I only sometimes use (e.g., ARRL bulletins), most everything is available in fldigi. Then you just turn on the flarq program and instantly you move to another level of performance with the ability to ARQ a given mode. 73, Rick, KV9U Andrew O'Brien wrote: > Aha, I was not thinking about frequency display...just PTT since I > lof my entries in DX Keeper. With the device router in Microkeyer you > can have full CAT control as usual and set FLDIGI to PTT2 if you wanted. >
Re: [digitalradio] Success with FLdigi
Aha, I was not thinking about frequency display...just PTT since I lof my entries in DX Keeper. With the device router in Microkeyer you can have full CAT control as usual and set FLDIGI to PTT2 if you wanted. Andy On 8/19/08, w4lde <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Andy, > > Setup similar, have the PPT working OK, for some reason I can not get > the Cat function to discover the keyer? Maybe I have another fldigi > file somewhere on the PC or a cygwin dll that maybe causing problems. > Maybe I am expecting the cat function to display the frequency on the > waterfall but thats what I think the cat function will provide. > > The XML file thats in the archive appears to be from a FT1000 and not > for a MP. > > Will keep on trying, thanks for the help. > > 73 de > Ron W4LDE > > Andrew O'Brien wrote: > > > > Ron, > > > > I have it working without hamlib, > > > > See attached > > > > > > > > Andy (K3UK) has successfully got his CAT function working through the > > > HAMlib but I wish I don't have to move in that direction. > > > > > > Anyone else out there in digi world using 3.01 with a MicroHam > > > microkeyer and has had luck with the internal RigCat function of > > discovery? > > > > > > 73 de > > > Ron W4LDE > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > -- Andy K3UK www.obriensweb.com (QSL via N2RJ)
Re: [digitalradio] Success with FLdigi
Andy, Setup similar, have the PPT working OK, for some reason I can not get the Cat function to discover the keyer? Maybe I have another fldigi file somewhere on the PC or a cygwin dll that maybe causing problems. Maybe I am expecting the cat function to display the frequency on the waterfall but thats what I think the cat function will provide. The XML file thats in the archive appears to be from a FT1000 and not for a MP. Will keep on trying, thanks for the help. 73 de Ron W4LDE Andrew O'Brien wrote: > > Ron, > > I have it working without hamlib, > > See attached > > > > > Andy (K3UK) has successfully got his CAT function working through the > > HAMlib but I wish I don't have to move in that direction. > > > > Anyone else out there in digi world using 3.01 with a MicroHam > > microkeyer and has had luck with the internal RigCat function of > discovery? > > > > 73 de > > Ron W4LDE > > > > > >
Re: [digitalradio] Move away from PSK63 /31 in NBEMS?
Just to clear up a few things: 1. Is it correct that just because a mode is listed in the NBEMS mode list, does not mean that you could not use it with flarq as an ARQ mode? Therefore, any of the modes could theoretically be used, even if not recommended or even if they might not work very well but flarq will ARQ any of them? 2. Could you explain how the MFSK modes are made more robust and yet can still work with other programs? On another note, thanks for confirming what I suspected about the drift issue. I recently was told that I my preference for purchasing only TCXO rigs was overkill, even for VHF, but when you look at the ppm issues with modes such as MFSK, even a few Hz is a problem. 73, Rick, KV9U kh6ty wrote: > PSK31 and PSK63 are still there for use in QSO's but neither mode is as good > as MFSK16 or MFSK32, or our new Thor modes, for ARQ messaging when high > static conditions on 80m or 40m exist, which is most of the time in the > summer or before and after a hurricane, so MFSK16 or MFSK32, wider, but the > same speeds as PSK31 and PSK63, are recommended for NBEMS messaging over > PSK31 and PSK63. The MFSK16 and MFSK32 modes are not your grandmother's MFSK > modes, but have been made more robust under static conditions on HF when > PSK63 and PSK31 get pulled off frequency by the AFC if there is a static > crash between ARQ transmissions. It was a tough decision not to include > PSK63 in the recommended NBEMS mode list, but the job of NBEMS is to > accomplish the most reliable messaging for any given speed, and the modified > MFSK modes are simply more reliable, although they are wider. > > For VHF messaging, PSK31 and PSK63 lose out again over DominoEx11 and > DominoEx22 at the same speed, because many VHF multimode transceivers have > no TCXO and drift too much to maintain tuning on 2 meters during an ARQ > transfer, whereas DominoEx has a wide tolerance to mistuning or drift, such > that no AFC is needed and provides a lower minimum S/N than the PSK modes at > the same speed. > > PSK31 and PSK63 are easier to recongnize among the background noise on VHF, > so it is often best to establish tuning with PSK41 or PSK63, check to see if > there is no adjacent frequency activity, and then switch to DominoEx for the > ARQ transfer. > > The popular IC-746Pro, for example, drifts 100 Hz between receiving and > start of transmitting, unless a TCXO is added, causing the loss of the first > few characters or words on PSK63, so I have switched our 2 meter digital net > from PSK63 to DominoEx. > > 73, Skip KH6TY > NBEMS Development Team > > >
AW: [digitalradio] Fldigi 3.0 and Flarq 4.0 posted on W1HKJ web site
WHAT ABOUT WIN98?? best 73´s de dg9bfc sigi -Ursprüngliche Nachricht- Von: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Auftrag von Steinar Aanesland Gesendet: Samstag, 16. August 2008 14:52 An: digitalradio@yahoogroups.com Betreff: [digitalradio] Fldigi 3.0 and Flarq 4.0 posted on W1HKJ web site Hi all The "Thor" is loose From [EMAIL PROTECTED] 73 de LA5VNA Steinar -- Please visit the host web site: http://www.w1hkj.com This is the official notification of the release of Fldigi 3.0 and Flarq 4.0. Together these two programs make up the newest Narrow Band Emergency Messaging System (NBEMS). Fldigi is now available for execution on Window XP, Windows W2K, and Windows Vista. Be sure to download the archive targeted for the appropriate OS revision. I would like to thank the development team and test teams who have suffered through many changes, many reinstallation, many OS reinstalls on occasion to bring this new General Public Licensed software to the amateur radio community. Fldigi and Flarq can be run right of the box ... but you should really take the time to read the documentation which available both on-line and as a pdf file which you can download. 73, Dave, W1HKJ for the development and test teams No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com Version: 8.0.138 / Virus Database: 270.6.3/1613 - Release Date: 15.08.2008 05:58
