Re: [libreoffice-documentation] Re: [libreoffice-projects] Documentation Team Meeting next Wednesday, July 27: What is the best time for you?

[Olivier Hallot]

Hello Jean, All

Em 25/07/2016 18:16, Jean Weber escreveu:
> Olivier,
> What platform is used for the meeting? IRC? Google Hangouts? Something
> else? I'll probably need to learn how to use whatever it is. --Jean

Google hangout. Let me know if you have trouble puting it to work. I
also recomend using headphones instead of computer speakers.

I'll send the link to all thru this mail and the doc' IRC.

We use the following pad for the minutes:

http://pad.documentfoundation.org/p/documentation

Kind regards
-- 
Olivier Hallot
Comunidade LibreOffice
Rio de Janeiro - Brazil - Local time: UTC-03
http://ask.libreoffice.org/pt-br

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RE: [libreoffice-documentation] How to count downloads of user guides?

[toki]

Oliver wrote:

>This sample shows us that the software is download by many thousands but
the books are by hundreds.

Is there a breakdown by either language, or country, or both, for
downloads of LibreOffice?

jonathon



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Re: [libreoffice-documentation] How to count downloads of user guides?

[Olivier Hallot]

Hello Jean

Em 25/07/2016 04:33, Jean Weber escreveu:
> On Sun, Jul 24, 2016 at 8:51 PM, K-J LibreOffice  wrote:
>> Hi Jean,
>> Am 24.07.2016 um 10:19 schrieb Jean Weber:
>>>
>>> How can we count the number of downloads of user guide files
>>> (individual chapters and books) from the wiki? Is there a plug-in for
>>> the wiki that will do this? I think we need this information.
>>
>>
>> Maybe Dennis (CC'ed him) can give an answer. Or you should ask someone from
>> Infra-team. I don't think that many of them read this ml.
>>
> 
> Thanks! Olivier, I'll turn this over to you to pursue, if you think
> it's a good idea.
> --Jean
> 

It is a significant information to help us make the documentation
products a true asset for LO and users. I'll handle it.

Regards
-- 
Olivier Hallot
Comunidade LibreOffice
Rio de Janeiro - Brazil - Local time: UTC-03
http://ask.libreoffice.org/pt-br

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Re: [libreoffice-documentation] How to count downloads of user guides?

[Olivier Hallot]

Hi Milos

Thanks for the data.

This sample shows us that the software is download by many thousands but
the books are by hundreds.

Let's fix this.

Olivier

Em 25/07/2016 08:12, Milos Sramek escreveu:
> Hi,
> 
> fyi: this is the download statistics of the Slovak translation
> April-July 2016. Only full downloads were counted (apache log status 200).
> One can see that the full book + Chapters 4, 5 and 6 are preferred, in pdf
> 
> Milos
> countcount pdf+odtFull download March – July 2016   
> 1277/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/ZacinameSLibreOffice42.odt   
> 200  - the full book
> 276277/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/ZacinameSLibreOffice42.pdf   
> 200 - the full book
> 59207/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4204-ZacinameWriter.odt200
> 148207/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4204-ZacinameWriter.pdf200
> 46165/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4205-ZacinameCalc.odt200
> 119165/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4205-ZacinameCalc.pdf200
> 35114   
> /files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4202-NastavenieLibreOffice.odt200
> 79114   
> /files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4202-NastavenieLibreOffice.pdf200
> 15108/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4206-ZacinameImpress.odt200
> 93108/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4206-ZacinameImpress.pdf200
> 23107/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4200-Uvod.odt200
> 84107/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4200-Uvod.pdf200
> 2099   
> /files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4201-PredstavenieLibreOffice.odt200
> 7999   
> /files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4201-PredstavenieLibreOffice.pdf200
> 2596/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4208-ZacinameBase.odt200
> 7196/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4208-ZacinameBase.pdf200
> 2087/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4213-ZacinameMakra.odt200
> 6787/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4213-ZacinameMakra.pdf200
> 2084/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4207-ZacinameDraw.odt200
> 6484/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4207-ZacinameDraw.pdf200
> 2078/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4203-StylyASablony.odt200
> 5878/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4203-StylyASablony.pdf200
> 1665   
> /files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4214-PrisposobenieLibreOffice.odt200
> 4965   
> /files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4214-PrisposobenieLibreOffice.pdf200
> 2063   
> /files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4216-OtvorenySoftverStandardy.odt200
> 4363   
> /files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4216-OtvorenySoftverStandardy.pdf200
> 1662/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4212-VytvarameWebStranky.odt200
> 4662/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4212-VytvarameWebStranky.pdf200
> 1559/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4209-ZacinameMath.odt200
> 4459/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4209-ZacinameMath.pdf200
> 1659/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4215-KlavesoveSkratky.odt200
> 4359/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4215-KlavesoveSkratky.pdf200
> 1058/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4210-TlacExportEmail.odt200
> 4858/files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4210-TlacExportEmail.pdf200
> 1757   
> /files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4211-GrafikaGaleriaPismomalba.odt200
> 4057   
> /files/ZacinameLibreOffice/GS4211-GrafikaGaleriaPismomalba.pdf200
> 
> 
> On 2016-07-25 11:56, Olivier Hallot wrote:
>> Hello Jean
>>
>> Em 25/07/2016 04:33, Jean Weber escreveu:
>>> On Sun, Jul 24, 2016 at 8:51 PM, K-J LibreOffice  
>>> wrote:
 Hi Jean,
 Am 24.07.2016 um 10:19 schrieb Jean Weber:
> How can we count the number of downloads of user guide files
> (individual chapters and books) from the wiki? Is there a plug-in for
> the wiki that will do this? I think we need this information.

 Maybe Dennis (CC'ed him) can give an answer. Or you should ask someone from
 Infra-team. I don't think that many of them read this ml.

>>> Thanks! Olivier, I'll turn this over to you to pursue, if you think
>>> it's a good idea.
>>> --Jean
>>>
>> It is a significant information to help us make the documentation
>> products a true asset for LO and users. I'll handle it.
>>
>> Regards
> 
> 

-- 
Olivier Hallot
Comunidade LibreOffice
Rio de Janeiro - Brazil - Local time: UTC-03
http://ask.libreoffice.org/pt-br

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[libreoffice-documentation] Fwd: Re: Documenting how to develop with & for LibreOffice - a fresh approach?

[Olivier Hallot]

(hit the wrong reply button)


 Mensagem encaminhada 
Assunto: Re: Documenting how to develop with & for LibreOffice - a fresh
approach?
Data: Mon, 25 Jul 2016 15:59:35 -0300
De: Olivier Hallot 
Para: libreoff...@lists.freedesktop.org

Hello Bjoern, Thorsten, All

Em 23/07/2016 22:48, Bjoern Michaelsen escreveu:
> Hi,
> 
> On Sun, Jul 24, 2016 at 01:50:20AM +0200, Thorsten Behrens wrote:
>> It seems interesting in a number of aspects; perhaps here's a way to
>> raise the profile & quality of our own programmability documentation
>> (by going there, or by cherry-picking good ideas)?
> 
> Hmm, I dont see much difference here between "stack exchange" and "stack
> exchange documentation". What exactly makes the difference there? Because I
> dont seem much (yet?).

I saw it as a way to create a TOC that links to entries that contains
carefully cratfted "questions" with precise and rich answers, using the
S.O. engine.

> 
> Also what is the difference between SE and ask.libreoffice.org from a
> feature perspective? For example, askubuntu.com is running on the SE stack, 
> not
> on askbot -- but TBH I dont see much difference featurewise. I assume its
> mostly done for visibility.

I'm no expert but I see 2 softwares for the same purpose: create a
knowledge base feeded by the community of users, with the expectation
that answers to any question in the universe will show up filtering
massive Q's and A's. Reality shows not so easy.

Stack Overflow and Askbot are not a panacea but the bottom line is very
positive anyway. I moderate brazilian askbot and it works. But the
quality of either questions and answers are rarely acceptable as a
reference on the topic. People never search for topic before asking,
thus lots of repetition. People also don't use the voting system or even
bother do downvote bad answers (can spark emotions if you do). Maybe
this is community-related, but it is a fact.

Therefore, as I said above, carefull questions and rich & precise
answers equals workload anyway.

> 
> In general, I _love_ the idea to move our documentation focus to dynamic 
> content
> on a platform that is easy to contribute to -- be that SE or askbot. That is
> _way_ more relevant and a much better fit to our development model than aiming
> for dead tree editions of documentation.

and wiki too. But like software development, we accept "patches" on our
doc only after peer review. Believe me, there is no better rich editor
than Writer and with a good DMS, unbeatable.

> 
> The thing that askbot/SE misses vs. classical documentation is that a 
> structure
> beyond one topic and a way to focus and highlight a set of well-maintained
> content. A possible approach to this would be to have an index of highly
> relevant and well maintained content (this index could be in e.g. in the TDF
> wiki linking to various askbot/SE topics). The problem with askbot/SE/wikis is
> not the so much providing good content, it is making this content discoverable
> (dead tree documentation is even worse at this, though) and not sink in
> outdated and irrelevant content.

right, but mixing different tools is a maintenance nightmare.
Nevertheless, discoverability of the documentation/information is one of
my concerns at them moment.

> 
> So -- a draft proposal: Lets have an index of highly relevance topics 
> somewhere
> (e.g. on the Wiki) and link the content by topic/chapter to well maintained 
> and
> edited pages on askbot/SE whatever.

It can even be the Local Help, one F1 strike far. But see below.

> 
> @Olivier: Unless there are better proposal on how to work on this, could take
> up this rough idea and with the help of others grind a diamond out of it?
> Thorsten is right, we should any inspiration we can from SE. But even more
> importantly we should focus on getting dynamic content up in shape, it is 
> _way_
> more important than printable, static dead documentation.

Today we have this documentation format scenario:

- Localhelp,  that contains a reference and a user guide, localized with
pootle, downloadable. Online version at help.libreoffice.org, XML files.

- LO Guides Books, produced in odt format, localizable with CAT by the
communities. Rich content, ease of edition.

- Askbot: on-line, user driven knowledge base, not localized, per language.

- TDF wiki: Some communities produce Q's and localized doc here.

- external, amateur blogs on LO topics, hints, tips (I'd like to
PLANETIZE this)

- other, found by googling around.

My take is that there is no one-size-fits-all, very hard not to
duplicate workload.

Books/chapters/sections are important for the training/migration
industry, and is the fastest way to port the documentation to other
languages. With a DMS (Document Management System) holding odf files and
good documentation project it can be the source for other formats.

Finally, on a totally different view, and addressing Thorsten concern on
software development documentation, 

Re: [libreoffice-documentation] How to count downloads of user guides?

[Jean Weber]

On Sun, Jul 24, 2016 at 8:51 PM, K-J LibreOffice  wrote:
> Hi Jean,
> Am 24.07.2016 um 10:19 schrieb Jean Weber:
>>
>> How can we count the number of downloads of user guide files
>> (individual chapters and books) from the wiki? Is there a plug-in for
>> the wiki that will do this? I think we need this information.
>
>
> Maybe Dennis (CC'ed him) can give an answer. Or you should ask someone from
> Infra-team. I don't think that many of them read this ml.
>

Thanks! Olivier, I'll turn this over to you to pursue, if you think
it's a good idea.
--Jean

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[libreoffice-documentation] Re: Documentation Team Meeting next Wednesday, July 27: What is the best time for you?

[Olivier Hallot]

Hi,

Just a reminder to mark your best time for the next wednesday
Documentation Team meeting. Double check your time zone in the page!

Regards

Olivier

Em 21/07/2016 12:18, Olivier Hallot escreveu:
> Hello documentation community
> 
> 1) I apologize for not being present to trigger the last scheduled
> meeting so lets set our next Documentation Meeting on wednesday July 27,
> but I need to know from you the best time, as some interested parties
> are not able to attend at 19:00.
> 
> So please let me know your preference in this Doodle poll:
> 
> http://doodle.com/poll/a5fnyrsbquxz2bep
> 
> 
> 2) Next wednesday 27, I'd like to address many of the issues we have in
> the documentation process, and here are some of them that came from
> TDF-internal brainstorming:
> 
> + How to turn the documentation job fun and thrilling?
>   + get more authors?
>   + Author's peer/community recognition
>   + Narrow gap between book release date and software release date
>   + Lowering author's entry barriers
> 
> + How can we improve our documents visibility?
> + Are our books a true LibreOffice companion product?
> + improve downloads of our books?
> + connect LO users to our docs and books?
> + get more book translators,
> + L10N contributions to documentation
> 
> + Documentation meetings in Brno.
> 
> Please don't miss these important discussions
> 
> See you there!
> 

-- 
Olivier Hallot
Comunidade LibreOffice
Rio de Janeiro - Brazil - Local time: UTC-03
http://ask.libreoffice.org/pt-br

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