Re: [Vo]:Anyone can "steal" IP from a patent

[Peter Gluck]

Dear Jed,,

PHOSIA is a slogan-acronym with one poisoned letter "O"
ordinary skill has to be defined for each case.
The difference between patent and know how is greater for processes than
for products.
I give you an example:
- a patent gives a recipe with ingredients in some limits, sometimes large
but actually optimum or even usable narrow limits exist;- climited
combinations,
- the patent has to give all the steps but does not give necessarily the
real order and that can be critical;

and there are some features difficult to define- please imagine a patent
for a well working FP Cell in the hands of a good PHOSITA To not use
a remote example.

Peter

On Wed, May 18, 2016 at 8:48 PM, Jed Rothwell  wrote:

> Peter Gluck  wrote:
>
> Are you aware about the differences between a patent and know-how?
>> Plus know-what, know-why and know-how- not?
>>
>
> Yes. I understand this difference. A PHOSITA has the know-how. If the
> patent does not disclose enough information for a PHOSITA to replicate --
> from the patent alone, without any inside information from Rossi -- then
> the patent is invalid. That would mean Rossi has no intellectual property
> and anyone can use his technology without paying him.
>
>
>
>> Do you have some industrial experience with this- even a minimum - IT
>> included where you are at home?
>>
>
> I do not, but a PHOSITA does, by definition.
>
>
>
>> Every industry and problem is very specific and the essentials cannot be
>> transferred from one to another.
>>
>
> If no one in the world has the appropriate background to do this, then
> there is no PHOSITA at present, so the patent will have to disclose a great
> deal more information than patents normally do. A patent *must be
> enabling,* or it is invalid.
>
> - Jed
>
>


-- 
Dr. Peter Gluck
Cluj, Romania
http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com

Re: [Vo]:Anyone can "steal" IP from a patent

[Jed Rothwell]

Peter Gluck  wrote:

Are you aware about the differences between a patent and know-how?
> Plus know-what, know-why and know-how- not?
>

Yes. I understand this difference. A PHOSITA has the know-how. If the
patent does not disclose enough information for a PHOSITA to replicate --
from the patent alone, without any inside information from Rossi -- then
the patent is invalid. That would mean Rossi has no intellectual property
and anyone can use his technology without paying him.



> Do you have some industrial experience with this- even a minimum - IT
> included where you are at home?
>

I do not, but a PHOSITA does, by definition.



> Every industry and problem is very specific and the essentials cannot be
> transferred from one to another.
>

If no one in the world has the appropriate background to do this, then
there is no PHOSITA at present, so the patent will have to disclose a great
deal more information than patents normally do. A patent *must be enabling,*
or it is invalid.

- Jed

Re: [Vo]:Anyone can "steal" IP from a patent

[Jed Rothwell]

Chris Zell  wrote:

Taking info from published patents is one of those theory vs practice
> subjects.  There are lots of patents that flat out don’t work at all, don’t
> work because of deliberate sins of commission/omission in publication or in
> the opinion of Prominent Scientist Skeptoids, violate physics  ( a bunch
> that deal with supposed triggered radioactive decay come to mind).   So,
> good luck with ‘stealing’.
>

Yes, there are many patents like that, but they are not valid. If someone
challenges them, the patent judge will rule them invalid, because they do
not disclose enough information for a PHOSITA to replicate. If Rossi's
patent falls in that category, and you cannot replicate from it, then Rossi
has no intellectual property. Even if his machine works, that would put it
in the public domain. In that case there is nothing to steal from him.
Anyone who can reverse engineer the product can then take the technology
for free and sell it without a license.

- Jed

Re: [Vo]:Anyone can "steal" IP from a patent

[Peter Gluck]

Dear Jed,

Are you aware about the differences between a patent and know-how?
Plus know-what, know-why and know-how- not? Do you have some industrial
experience with this- even a minimum - IT included where you are at home?
Every industry and problem is very specific and the essentials cannot be
transferred from one to another.
peter

On Wed, May 18, 2016 at 6:00 PM, Jed Rothwell  wrote:

> Strange voice input error:
>
>
>> With a valid patent the technology is an open book. You can replicate all
>> you like and do as many experiments are billed as many prototypes as you
>> want.
>>
>
> BUILD as many prototypes as you want . . .
>
> This is a 21st century problem.
>
> - Jed
>
>


-- 
Dr. Peter Gluck
Cluj, Romania
http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com

RE: [Vo]:Anyone can "steal" IP from a patent

[Chris Zell]

Taking info from published patents is one of those theory vs practice subjects. 
 There are lots of patents that flat out don’t work at all, don’t work because 
of deliberate sins of commission/omission in publication or in the opinion of 
Prominent Scientist Skeptoids, violate physics  ( a bunch that deal with 
supposed triggered radioactive decay come to mind).   So, good luck with 
‘stealing’.

Re: [Vo]:Anyone can "steal" IP from a patent

[Jed Rothwell]

Strange voice input error:


> With a valid patent the technology is an open book. You can replicate all
> you like and do as many experiments are billed as many prototypes as you
> want.
>

BUILD as many prototypes as you want . . .

This is a 21st century problem.

- Jed