Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention
I am thinking that if you cut power, the fire is likely to go out. -Original Message- From: Seth Mattinen Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2020 1:09 PM To: af@af.afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention On 6/6/20 6:46 PM, TJ Trout wrote: So one of our sites has become pretty darn important so I was considering a 'clean agent' fire system (like Halon) Wondering what you guys use? This room has a sprinkler, should I look at getting it removed? Or build a shield over our racks? If the fire didn't get us, the water will. Ugh. Do you mean "a sprinkler" as in one single sprinkler? One sprinkler is a pretty small space and the smallest double interlock pre-action valve I've seen is 2". It will remove the water from the system except as a last resort and prevent accidental discharge (such as someone breaking it) or leaks. You can get small clean agent systems, but I'd always recommend a pre-action sprinkler system with it since it's possible the shock of the quick opening valve and gas discharge could cause the glass bulb to break. Also keep in mind a clean agent system can still destroy spinning media that's not been spun down prior to discharge, especially in small spaces. If you have a drop ceiling you will need to replace it or modify it to survive the overpressure of a discharge. -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention
On 6/6/20 6:46 PM, TJ Trout wrote: So one of our sites has become pretty darn important so I was considering a 'clean agent' fire system (like Halon) Wondering what you guys use? This room has a sprinkler, should I look at getting it removed? Or build a shield over our racks? If the fire didn't get us, the water will. Ugh. Do you mean "a sprinkler" as in one single sprinkler? One sprinkler is a pretty small space and the smallest double interlock pre-action valve I've seen is 2". It will remove the water from the system except as a last resort and prevent accidental discharge (such as someone breaking it) or leaks. You can get small clean agent systems, but I'd always recommend a pre-action sprinkler system with it since it's possible the shock of the quick opening valve and gas discharge could cause the glass bulb to break. Also keep in mind a clean agent system can still destroy spinning media that's not been spun down prior to discharge, especially in small spaces. If you have a drop ceiling you will need to replace it or modify it to survive the overpressure of a discharge. -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention
Uh. In the engine compartment though? I think that qualifies as outside the cockpit? bp On 6/9/2020 11:58 AM, ch...@wbmfg.com wrote: I used to fly a Cessna 210 that had a halon fire extinguisher. I guess being knocked our by halon is better than flying a cockpit fire into the earth. -Original Message- From: Seth Mattinen Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2020 12:45 PM To: af@af.afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention On 6/8/20 12:19 PM, Brian Webster wrote: We had halon systems in the main propulsion rooms on some of the Navy Ships (mostly gas turbine powered if memory serves me). We had things like an emergency escape breathing device you would wear on your hip while working in those spaces, you could stick that in your mouth and have a few minutes of oxygen you could use as you were exiting the spaces. There was an alarm that went off before the halon deployed and I forget what the time was you had to make the escape from the space before it would discharge (30 to 45 seconds rings a bell but’s it been a long time). The military is exempt with regard to Halon systems. For the rest of us there are a bunch of alternatives: Novec, FM-200, FE-13, Inergen, Argonite, CO2. -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention
I used to fly a Cessna 210 that had a halon fire extinguisher. I guess being knocked our by halon is better than flying a cockpit fire into the earth. -Original Message- From: Seth Mattinen Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2020 12:45 PM To: af@af.afmug.com Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention On 6/8/20 12:19 PM, Brian Webster wrote: We had halon systems in the main propulsion rooms on some of the Navy Ships (mostly gas turbine powered if memory serves me). We had things like an emergency escape breathing device you would wear on your hip while working in those spaces, you could stick that in your mouth and have a few minutes of oxygen you could use as you were exiting the spaces. There was an alarm that went off before the halon deployed and I forget what the time was you had to make the escape from the space before it would discharge (30 to 45 seconds rings a bell but’s it been a long time). The military is exempt with regard to Halon systems. For the rest of us there are a bunch of alternatives: Novec, FM-200, FE-13, Inergen, Argonite, CO2. -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention
On 6/8/20 12:19 PM, Brian Webster wrote: We had halon systems in the main propulsion rooms on some of the Navy Ships (mostly gas turbine powered if memory serves me). We had things like an emergency escape breathing device you would wear on your hip while working in those spaces, you could stick that in your mouth and have a few minutes of oxygen you could use as you were exiting the spaces. There was an alarm that went off before the halon deployed and I forget what the time was you had to make the escape from the space before it would discharge (30 to 45 seconds rings a bell but’s it been a long time). The military is exempt with regard to Halon systems. For the rest of us there are a bunch of alternatives: Novec, FM-200, FE-13, Inergen, Argonite, CO2. -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention
We had halon systems in the main propulsion rooms on some of the Navy Ships (mostly gas turbine powered if memory serves me). We had things like an emergency escape breathing device you would wear on your hip while working in those spaces, you could stick that in your mouth and have a few minutes of oxygen you could use as you were exiting the spaces. There was an alarm that went off before the halon deployed and I forget what the time was you had to make the escape from the space before it would discharge (30 to 45 seconds rings a bell but’s it been a long time). Thank you, Brian Webster www.wirelessmapping.com From: AF [mailto:af-boun...@af.afmug.com] On Behalf Of ch...@wbmfg.com Sent: Monday, June 8, 2020 11:48 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention Not sure. There is some prohibition but some exemptions as I recall. I was only in one large data center that had a halon system. You had to get trained before you entered as to what to do if it triggered. I remember big red E stop buttons around. Not sure if that cut off the halon, or turned on the ventilation system or opened the doors... something to help you survive. From: Kurt Fankhauser Sent: Monday, June 8, 2020 9:40 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention Are Halon systems even legal to install anymore? On Sat, Jun 6, 2020 at 10:21 PM Steve Jones wrote: I have no recollection of where we were getting them, but we used to huff halon from fire extinguishers into a balloon or an ambu bag. i can attest, halon puts things out (people) On Sat, Jun 6, 2020 at 9:06 PM Chuck McCown wrote: Halon will kill you if you are in the room when it goes off. No oxygen availability. Good smoke sniffer system and a rack by rack power killing system is what some use. Sent from my iPhone > On Jun 6, 2020, at 7:47 PM, TJ Trout wrote: > > > So one of our sites has become pretty darn important so I was considering a > 'clean agent' fire system (like Halon) > > Wondering what you guys use? This room has a sprinkler, should I look at > getting it removed? Or build a shield over our racks? > > If the fire didn't get us, the water will. Ugh. > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com _ -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention
Not sure. There is some prohibition but some exemptions as I recall. I was only in one large data center that had a halon system. You had to get trained before you entered as to what to do if it triggered. I remember big red E stop buttons around. Not sure if that cut off the halon, or turned on the ventilation system or opened the doors... something to help you survive. From: Kurt Fankhauser Sent: Monday, June 8, 2020 9:40 AM To: AnimalFarm Microwave Users Group Subject: Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention Are Halon systems even legal to install anymore? On Sat, Jun 6, 2020 at 10:21 PM Steve Jones wrote: I have no recollection of where we were getting them, but we used to huff halon from fire extinguishers into a balloon or an ambu bag. i can attest, halon puts things out (people) On Sat, Jun 6, 2020 at 9:06 PM Chuck McCown wrote: Halon will kill you if you are in the room when it goes off. No oxygen availability. Good smoke sniffer system and a rack by rack power killing system is what some use. Sent from my iPhone > On Jun 6, 2020, at 7:47 PM, TJ Trout wrote: > > > So one of our sites has become pretty darn important so I was considering a 'clean agent' fire system (like Halon) > > Wondering what you guys use? This room has a sprinkler, should I look at getting it removed? Or build a shield over our racks? > > If the fire didn't get us, the water will. Ugh. > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention
Are Halon systems even legal to install anymore? On Sat, Jun 6, 2020 at 10:21 PM Steve Jones wrote: > I have no recollection of where we were getting them, but we used to huff > halon from fire extinguishers into a balloon or an ambu bag. i can attest, > halon puts things out (people) > > On Sat, Jun 6, 2020 at 9:06 PM Chuck McCown wrote: > >> Halon will kill you if you are in the room when it goes off. No oxygen >> availability. >> Good smoke sniffer system and a rack by rack power killing system is what >> some use. >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> > On Jun 6, 2020, at 7:47 PM, TJ Trout wrote: >> > >> > >> > So one of our sites has become pretty darn important so I was >> considering a 'clean agent' fire system (like Halon) >> > >> > Wondering what you guys use? This room has a sprinkler, should I look >> at getting it removed? Or build a shield over our racks? >> > >> > If the fire didn't get us, the water will. Ugh. >> > -- >> > AF mailing list >> > AF@af.afmug.com >> > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> >> -- >> AF mailing list >> AF@af.afmug.com >> http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com >> > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention
I have no recollection of where we were getting them, but we used to huff halon from fire extinguishers into a balloon or an ambu bag. i can attest, halon puts things out (people) On Sat, Jun 6, 2020 at 9:06 PM Chuck McCown wrote: > Halon will kill you if you are in the room when it goes off. No oxygen > availability. > Good smoke sniffer system and a rack by rack power killing system is what > some use. > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On Jun 6, 2020, at 7:47 PM, TJ Trout wrote: > > > > > > So one of our sites has become pretty darn important so I was > considering a 'clean agent' fire system (like Halon) > > > > Wondering what you guys use? This room has a sprinkler, should I look at > getting it removed? Or build a shield over our racks? > > > > If the fire didn't get us, the water will. Ugh. > > -- > > AF mailing list > > AF@af.afmug.com > > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com > -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
Re: [AFMUG] Data center fire prevention
Halon will kill you if you are in the room when it goes off. No oxygen availability. Good smoke sniffer system and a rack by rack power killing system is what some use. Sent from my iPhone > On Jun 6, 2020, at 7:47 PM, TJ Trout wrote: > > > So one of our sites has become pretty darn important so I was considering a > 'clean agent' fire system (like Halon) > > Wondering what you guys use? This room has a sprinkler, should I look at > getting it removed? Or build a shield over our racks? > > If the fire didn't get us, the water will. Ugh. > -- > AF mailing list > AF@af.afmug.com > http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
[AFMUG] Data center fire prevention
So one of our sites has become pretty darn important so I was considering a 'clean agent' fire system (like Halon) Wondering what you guys use? This room has a sprinkler, should I look at getting it removed? Or build a shield over our racks? If the fire didn't get us, the water will. Ugh. -- AF mailing list AF@af.afmug.com http://af.afmug.com/mailman/listinfo/af_af.afmug.com
