Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-22 Thread Lukáš Jirkovský
On 22 June 2012 01:42, Tom Gundersen t...@jklm.no wrote:
 The tmpfiles.d fragment is documented in the tmpfiles.d(5)[0] and the
 tmpfiles utility is documented in systemd-tmpfiles(8)[1].


So there actually is man page for the systemd-tmpfiles. It is missing
from the systemd-tools, instead it is in systemd package. I'll create
a bug report for that later.

If it had been there, I wouldn't have asked this question at all, as
everything necessary is mentioned in the manpage.

Lukas


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-22 Thread Kevin Chadwick
 I'm really not sure what you are asking here, so bear with me...
 
 The tmpfiles.d fragment is documented in the tmpfiles.d(5)[0] and the
 tmpfiles utility is documented in systemd-tmpfiles(8)[1].
 
 Both in systemd and initscripts we call /usr/bin/systemd-tmpfiles
 --clean to clean up old files.
 
 If you want to add your own custom stuff instead then in initscripts
 you'd make a hook (as before) and in systemd you'd add a .service file
 [2].

Fair enough and Thanks.

I'll likely find out more about systemd malleability in due course some
time anyway. I just don't use the system with it very often.



 Why not do something good every day and install BOINC.



Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-21 Thread Kevin Chadwick
 I believe this is correct. However, I would point out that I had to
 disable tmpfs on my Linode because it was taking too much memory.

What are you doing that uses so much memory? I enable a small memory
filesystem that doesn't grow for /tmp on my web servers. You just have
to configure the cleanup (and security) routines.

 The
 ability to clean /tmp at boot should probably be preserved.

The ability I would certainly agree with but has it been removed?
Is the question, Where is the best place to add /bin/rm to init
nowadays?




 Why not do something good every day and install BOINC.



Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-21 Thread David Benfell
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 06/21/12 02:11, Kevin Chadwick wrote:
 
 The ability I would certainly agree with but has it been removed? 
 Is the question, Where is the best place to add /bin/rm to init 
 nowadays?
 
Elsewhere in this thread, someone mentions tmpfiles.d.

There is a configuration file in /usr/lib/tmpfiles.d named tmp.conf
which can be copied to /etc/conf.d and modified as needed.

- From what I've been able to piece together, one can then run
systemd-tmpfiles --clean in a cron job. But in a Linode with both
limited memory and limited disk, this seems like a really good idea.

It's hard to tell if this actually works from a directory listing
because unless you specify the right options, it won't tell you the
last date since any of these files have been accessed.

- -- 
David Benfell
benf...@parts-unknown.org


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Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-21 Thread Kevin Chadwick
 There is a configuration file in /usr/lib/tmpfiles.d named tmp.conf
 which can be copied to /etc/conf.d and modified as needed.
 

I meant a place for any shell incarnation though not a rigid??
pre-ordained facility.

 - From what I've been able to piece together, one can then run
 systemd-tmpfiles --clean in a cron job. But in a Linode with both
 limited memory and limited disk, this seems like a really good idea.

That would depend on the application though, the tmp files may vary in
lifetime etc.. You can always add shell to cron of course in that case
or use php or apache facilities for example.



 Why not do something good every day and install BOINC.



Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-21 Thread Tom Gundersen
On Jun 21, 2012 1:16 PM, Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
  There is a configuration file in /usr/lib/tmpfiles.d named tmp.conf
  which can be copied to /etc/conf.d and modified as needed.

 I meant a place for any shell incarnation though not a rigid??
 pre-ordained facility.

Nothing has changed in this respect. If you want to add your own stuff to
the initscripts it should be done by using our hooks system or
/etc/rc.local. For the record, editing rc.sysinit directly itself is
probably not a good idea as it will be overwritten on upgrade.

-t


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-21 Thread Tom Gundersen
On Jun 21, 2012 11:12 AM, Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
  The
  ability to clean /tmp at boot should probably be preserved.

 The ability I would certainly agree with but has it been removed?

It has not been removed. The standard behavior changed slightly, but as
mentioned this can be configured to revert to the default.

-t


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-21 Thread David Benfell
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 06/21/12 16:20, Tom Gundersen wrote:

 It has not been removed. The standard behavior changed slightly,
 but as mentioned this can be configured to revert to the default.
 

Yes, my bad, as you've probably already discovered. :-)


- -- 
David Benfell
benf...@parts-unknown.org


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Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-21 Thread Kevin Chadwick
   There is a configuration file in /usr/lib/tmpfiles.d named tmp.conf
   which can be copied to /etc/conf.d and modified as needed.  
 
  I meant a place for any shell incarnation though not a rigid??
  pre-ordained facility.  
 
 Nothing has changed in this respect. If you want to add your own stuff to
 the initscripts it should be done by using our hooks system or
 /etc/rc.local. For the record, editing rc.sysinit directly itself is
 probably not a good idea as it will be overwritten on upgrade.


I figured that, atleast the rc.local bit. There's no exec line that can
be used in the tmpfiles.d either in arch or full systemd then running it
at the same stage of init, just out of interest. I know there is one
for getty I'm just not sure if it can apply to all unit files.



 Why not do something good every day and install BOINC.



Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-21 Thread Tom Gundersen
On Fri, Jun 22, 2012 at 1:32 AM, Kevin Chadwick ma1l1i...@yahoo.co.uk wrote:
 I figured that, atleast the rc.local bit. There's no exec line that can
 be used in the tmpfiles.d either in arch or full systemd then running it
 at the same stage of init, just out of interest. I know there is one
 for getty I'm just not sure if it can apply to all unit files.

I'm really not sure what you are asking here, so bear with me...

The tmpfiles.d fragment is documented in the tmpfiles.d(5)[0] and the
tmpfiles utility is documented in systemd-tmpfiles(8)[1].

Both in systemd and initscripts we call /usr/bin/systemd-tmpfiles
--clean to clean up old files.

If you want to add your own custom stuff instead then in initscripts
you'd make a hook (as before) and in systemd you'd add a .service file
[2].

HTH,

Tom

[0]: http://0pointer.de/public/systemd-man/tmpfiles.d.html
[1]: http://0pointer.de/public/systemd-man/systemd-tmpfiles.html
[2]: http://0pointer.de/public/systemd-man/systemd.service.html


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-20 Thread Chris Sakalis
On Wed, Jun 20, 2012 at 7:05 PM, Lukáš Jirkovský l.jirkov...@gmail.com wrote:
 Hello,
 before submitting bug report I want to make sure this isn't feature.
 My problem is that my /tmp folder is no longer cleaned up during boot.
 Now I have to do that manually which is really annoying.

 I dug through the git of initscripts and it seems to be caused by the
 replacement of the original code by the systemd-tmpfiles tool. I've
 just tried to run systemd-tmpfiles manually and it seems that it is
 not able to do even a simple task such as rm -rf /tmp/*.

 Lukas

Hello,
I do not use systemd, but isn't /tmp supposed to be mounted as tmpfs?
I think the change is relatively recent.

Regards,
Chris Sakalis


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-20 Thread Klaus
Lukáš Jirkovský schrieb:
 Hello,
 before submitting bug report I want to make sure this isn't feature.
 My problem is that my /tmp folder is no longer cleaned up during boot.
 Now I have to do that manually which is really annoying.
 
 I dug through the git of initscripts and it seems to be caused by the
 replacement of the original code by the systemd-tmpfiles tool. I've
 just tried to run systemd-tmpfiles manually and it seems that it is
 not able to do even a simple task such as rm -rf /tmp/*.
 
 Lukas

Take a look in your /etc/fstab.

Is there a line like tmpfs /tmptmpfs   nodev,nosuid0   
0
which creates a ramdisk and mounts it on /tmp. 
I think that is the standard configuration of Arch Linux.

Greetings,
Klaus

-- 
Jabber: thor...@deshalbfrei.org  PGP/GnuPG: 0x326F6D7B


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-20 Thread A Rojas
Lukáš Jirkovský wrote:

 Hello,
 before submitting bug report I want to make sure this isn't feature.
 My problem is that my /tmp folder is no longer cleaned up during boot.
 Now I have to do that manually which is really annoying.
 

See https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?pid=1118239#p1118239




Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-20 Thread Leonid Isaev
On Wed, 20 Jun 2012 18:05:38 +0200
Lukáš Jirkovský l.jirkov...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hello,
 before submitting bug report I want to make sure this isn't feature.
 My problem is that my /tmp folder is no longer cleaned up during boot.
 Now I have to do that manually which is really annoying.
 
 I dug through the git of initscripts and it seems to be caused by the
 replacement of the original code by the systemd-tmpfiles tool. I've
 just tried to run systemd-tmpfiles manually and it seems that it is
 not able to do even a simple task such as rm -rf /tmp/*.
 
 Lukas

This: https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?pid=1118239

-- 
Leonid Isaev
GnuPG key: 0x164B5A6D
Fingerprint: C0DF 20D0 C075 C3F1 E1BE  775A A7AE F6CB 164B 5A6D


signature.asc
Description: PGP signature


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-20 Thread Lukáš Jirkovský
On 20 June 2012 18:15, Klaus thor...@brothersofgrey.net wrote:
 Lukáš Jirkovský schrieb:
 Hello,
 before submitting bug report I want to make sure this isn't feature.
 My problem is that my /tmp folder is no longer cleaned up during boot.
 Now I have to do that manually which is really annoying.

 I dug through the git of initscripts and it seems to be caused by the
 replacement of the original code by the systemd-tmpfiles tool. I've
 just tried to run systemd-tmpfiles manually and it seems that it is
 not able to do even a simple task such as rm -rf /tmp/*.

 Lukas

 Take a look in your /etc/fstab.

 Is there a line like tmpfs             /tmp    tmpfs   nodev,nosuid    0     
   0
 which creates a ramdisk and mounts it on /tmp.
 I think that is the standard configuration of Arch Linux.

 Greetings,
 Klaus

 --
 Jabber: thor...@deshalbfrei.org  PGP/GnuPG: 0x326F6D7B

I don't want to use tmpfs for my tmp, as it takes a lot of RAM (I
usually have build chroots here, so its a few gigabytes).


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-20 Thread Lukáš Jirkovský
On 20 June 2012 18:20, Leonid Isaev lis...@umail.iu.edu wrote:
 On Wed, 20 Jun 2012 18:05:38 +0200
 Lukáš Jirkovský l.jirkov...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hello,
 before submitting bug report I want to make sure this isn't feature.
 My problem is that my /tmp folder is no longer cleaned up during boot.
 Now I have to do that manually which is really annoying.

 I dug through the git of initscripts and it seems to be caused by the
 replacement of the original code by the systemd-tmpfiles tool. I've
 just tried to run systemd-tmpfiles manually and it seems that it is
 not able to do even a simple task such as rm -rf /tmp/*.

 Lukas

 This: https://bbs.archlinux.org/viewtopic.php?pid=1118239

 --
 Leonid Isaev
 GnuPG key: 0x164B5A6D
 Fingerprint: C0DF 20D0 C075 C3F1 E1BE  775A A7AE F6CB 164B 5A6D

Thanks, searching forums didn't come to my mind at all, as I do not
use forums. I wonder why this hasn't been discussed on ML.

Still, I think such functional change should have been mentioned on
the NEWS page, or at least during package upgrade.

Lukas


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-20 Thread Mantas Mikulėnas
On Wed, Jun 20, 2012 at 7:05 PM, Lukáš Jirkovský l.jirkov...@gmail.com wrote:
 I dug through the git of initscripts and it seems to be caused by the
 replacement of the original code by the systemd-tmpfiles tool. I've
 just tried to run systemd-tmpfiles manually and it seems that it is
 not able to do even a simple task such as rm -rf /tmp/*.

The default configuration in `/usr/lib/tmpfiles.d/tmp.conf` tells the
tool to only remove files older than 10 days.

To override this, create an `/etc/tmpfiles.d/tmp.conf` that cleans
/tmp regardless of access time:

d /tmp 1777 root root -
d /var/tmp 1777 root root -


-- 
Mantas Mikulėnas


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-20 Thread Tom Gundersen
On Jun 20, 2012 6:05 PM, Lukáš Jirkovský l.jirkov...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hello,
 before submitting bug report I want to make sure this isn't feature.
 My problem is that my /tmp folder is no longer cleaned up during boot.
 Now I have to do that manually which is really annoying.

 I dug through the git of initscripts and it seems to be caused by the
 replacement of the original code by the systemd-tmpfiles tool. I've
 just tried to run systemd-tmpfiles manually and it seems that it is
 not able to do even a simple task such as rm -rf /tmp/*.

There was a slight change in behavior. Earlier we would delete all files at
boot, now we (or rather systemd-tmpfiles on our behalf) delete all 'old
files'. That is, all files that have not been accessed within the last then
days.

This behavior is configured in /usr/lib/tmpfiles.d/tmp.conf. To change the
behavior, copy the file to /etc/tmpfiles.d/ and edit it there. You can
easily configure it to get the old behavior back.

Alternatively, you could put /tmp on a tmpfs, to throw away all contents on
reboot; or create a cron job that calls systemd-tmpfiles regularly (say
once a day) to also delete old files at runtime, rather than only at boot.

Check 'man tmpfiles.d' for more details.

Cheers,

Tom


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-20 Thread Lukáš Jirkovský
On 20 June 2012 18:24, Mantas Mikulėnas graw...@gmail.com wrote:
 On Wed, Jun 20, 2012 at 7:05 PM, Lukáš Jirkovský l.jirkov...@gmail.com 
 wrote:
 I dug through the git of initscripts and it seems to be caused by the
 replacement of the original code by the systemd-tmpfiles tool. I've
 just tried to run systemd-tmpfiles manually and it seems that it is
 not able to do even a simple task such as rm -rf /tmp/*.

 The default configuration in `/usr/lib/tmpfiles.d/tmp.conf` tells the
 tool to only remove files older than 10 days.

 To override this, create an `/etc/tmpfiles.d/tmp.conf` that cleans
 /tmp regardless of access time:

 d /tmp 1777 root root -
 d /var/tmp 1777 root root -


 --
 Mantas Mikulėnas

This does the exact opposite of what I want – it never deletes any files.


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-20 Thread Lukáš Jirkovský
On 20 June 2012 18:28, Tom Gundersen t...@jklm.no wrote:
 On Jun 20, 2012 6:05 PM, Lukáš Jirkovský l.jirkov...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hello,
 before submitting bug report I want to make sure this isn't feature.
 My problem is that my /tmp folder is no longer cleaned up during boot.
 Now I have to do that manually which is really annoying.

 I dug through the git of initscripts and it seems to be caused by the
 replacement of the original code by the systemd-tmpfiles tool. I've
 just tried to run systemd-tmpfiles manually and it seems that it is
 not able to do even a simple task such as rm -rf /tmp/*.

 There was a slight change in behavior. Earlier we would delete all files at
 boot, now we (or rather systemd-tmpfiles on our behalf) delete all 'old
 files'. That is, all files that have not been accessed within the last then
 days.

 This behavior is configured in /usr/lib/tmpfiles.d/tmp.conf. To change the
 behavior, copy the file to /etc/tmpfiles.d/ and edit it there. You can
 easily configure it to get the old behavior back.

 Alternatively, you could put /tmp on a tmpfs, to throw away all contents on
 reboot; or create a cron job that calls systemd-tmpfiles regularly (say
 once a day) to also delete old files at runtime, rather than only at boot.

 Check 'man tmpfiles.d' for more details.

 Cheers,

 Tom

Already did that. I changed the config to:
d /tmp 1777 root root 0d
d /var/tmp 1777 root root 0d

but it doesn't clean anything.


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-20 Thread Tom Gundersen
On Jun 20, 2012 6:32 PM, Lukáš Jirkovský l.jirkov...@gmail.com wrote:

 On 20 June 2012 18:28, Tom Gundersen t...@jklm.no wrote:
  On Jun 20, 2012 6:05 PM, Lukáš Jirkovský l.jirkov...@gmail.com
wrote:
 
  Hello,
  before submitting bug report I want to make sure this isn't feature.
  My problem is that my /tmp folder is no longer cleaned up during boot.
  Now I have to do that manually which is really annoying.
 
  I dug through the git of initscripts and it seems to be caused by the
  replacement of the original code by the systemd-tmpfiles tool. I've
  just tried to run systemd-tmpfiles manually and it seems that it is
  not able to do even a simple task such as rm -rf /tmp/*.
 
  There was a slight change in behavior. Earlier we would delete all
files at
  boot, now we (or rather systemd-tmpfiles on our behalf) delete all 'old
  files'. That is, all files that have not been accessed within the last
then
  days.
 
  This behavior is configured in /usr/lib/tmpfiles.d/tmp.conf. To change
the
  behavior, copy the file to /etc/tmpfiles.d/ and edit it there. You can
  easily configure it to get the old behavior back.
 
  Alternatively, you could put /tmp on a tmpfs, to throw away all
contents on
  reboot; or create a cron job that calls systemd-tmpfiles regularly (say
  once a day) to also delete old files at runtime, rather than only at
boot.
 
  Check 'man tmpfiles.d' for more details.
 
  Cheers,
 
  Tom

 Already did that. I changed the config to:
 d /tmp 1777 root root 0d
 d /var/tmp 1777 root root 0d

Looks like a bug, if you create a bug report I'll look into it.

That said, I think you want to use 'D' rather than 'd' (check the man
page). Alternatively, you can specify an age in milliseconds, rather than
days...

Tom


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-20 Thread Lukáš Jirkovský
On 20 June 2012 18:32, Lukáš Jirkovský l.jirkov...@gmail.com wrote:
 On 20 June 2012 18:28, Tom Gundersen t...@jklm.no wrote:
 On Jun 20, 2012 6:05 PM, Lukáš Jirkovský l.jirkov...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hello,
 before submitting bug report I want to make sure this isn't feature.
 My problem is that my /tmp folder is no longer cleaned up during boot.
 Now I have to do that manually which is really annoying.

 I dug through the git of initscripts and it seems to be caused by the
 replacement of the original code by the systemd-tmpfiles tool. I've
 just tried to run systemd-tmpfiles manually and it seems that it is
 not able to do even a simple task such as rm -rf /tmp/*.

 There was a slight change in behavior. Earlier we would delete all files at
 boot, now we (or rather systemd-tmpfiles on our behalf) delete all 'old
 files'. That is, all files that have not been accessed within the last then
 days.

 This behavior is configured in /usr/lib/tmpfiles.d/tmp.conf. To change the
 behavior, copy the file to /etc/tmpfiles.d/ and edit it there. You can
 easily configure it to get the old behavior back.

 Alternatively, you could put /tmp on a tmpfs, to throw away all contents on
 reboot; or create a cron job that calls systemd-tmpfiles regularly (say
 once a day) to also delete old files at runtime, rather than only at boot.

 Check 'man tmpfiles.d' for more details.

 Cheers,

 Tom

 Already did that. I changed the config to:
 d /tmp 1777 root root 0d
 d /var/tmp 1777 root root 0d

 but it doesn't clean anything.

I finally achieved the desired result by using
R /tmp/*
d /tmp 1777 root root 0d
d /var/tmp 1777 root root 0d

However the cleanup functionality seems to be broken – even if I
selected 0d, 1s or any similar short interval, the systemd-tmpfiles
didn't clean the /tmp. And even it did nothing, it still took about a
second to finish.

Lukas


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-20 Thread Lukáš Jirkovský
On 20 June 2012 18:47, Tom Gundersen t...@jklm.no wrote:

 Looks like a bug, if you create a bug report I'll look into it.

Done, it's FS#30384

 That said, I think you want to use 'D' rather than 'd' (check the man
 page). Alternatively, you can specify an age in milliseconds, rather than
 days...

Thanks, this works too. And it's probably cleaner than using 'R'.

Lukas


Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-20 Thread Kevin Chadwick
 I've
 just tried to run systemd-tmpfiles manually and it seems that it is
 not able to do even a simple task such as rm -rf /tmp/*.

For my own understanding is it possible to add an exec line to these
systemd files like for the inittab replacements getty.service so that
you can add anything you like such as /bin/rm -R /tmp/.* /tmp/* to any
systemd unit. I know the systemd author wants rid of shell altogether
but I'm pretty confident and hoping that will never be allowed to
happen.

I like the goal of cross platform and eventually a single gui tool
(arches simple list is far better though) but the full systemd such as
fedora uses certainly seems a chore and non intuitive on the console
compared to /etc/inittab editing.




 Why not do something good every day and install BOINC.



Re: [arch-general] tmp files no longer removed

2012-06-20 Thread David Benfell
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On 06/20/12 09:15, Klaus wrote:
 
 Is there a line like tmpfs   /tmptmpfs   nodev,nosuid0   
 0 which
 creates a ramdisk and mounts it on /tmp. I think that is the
 standard configuration of Arch Linux.

I believe this is correct. However, I would point out that I had to
disable tmpfs on my Linode because it was taking too much memory. The
ability to clean /tmp at boot should probably be preserved.

- -- 
David Benfell
benf...@parts-unknown.org


-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
Version: GnuPG v2.0.19 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/

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