Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? @25For what it was worth, I was in that circle and helped crowdfund it. The daring to hack me thing was overblown, but I wouldn't call NVDA Remote secure by any means unless it has since been updated. There's a lot of criticism that is entirely justified that can be aimed at it.@26There's plenty of logic in it but it's not ever going to get published where you can see it because that's literally writing a hacker's manual. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594438/#p594438 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? @19, its not that I am dissatisfied. I just tried to understand its logic, but since there is no logic in it I think I will give up, for now lol. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594372/#p594372 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? @18: There was some drama over NVDA remote early on, in which people made noise about it being a hacking risk ... because they published their passwords and dared people to hack them, or something similarly stupid. I wouldn't be surprised if this resulted in someone reporting it. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594362/#p594362 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? @23 or is that what the cyber drug wants you to think? URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594358/#p594358 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? I picked up some bad habits from bgt, and I still suck at coding, but I did manage to switch from it to python. I'm happy with my decision. I've noticed an immediate impact in my work. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594329/#p594329 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? Ya know, if I were going to pick up any language, be it scripting or fully functional take your pick, I wouldn't go BGT. So much controversy, so much hate, so much negativity and so many issues on the development side of things that, I honestly don't care how easy it is to learn... I wouldn't get anything out of it with so many people hating on me for it. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594289/#p594289 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? It's a part of my life as well, and it is something I am a fan of. Is it a part of communication where as soon as someone mentions BGT, you get a bunch of people to say nonsense, which boils down to just switch away from it even if that's totally irrelevant to the current topic?@Ethin I'm not even saying you are wrong. It just doesn't matter. The first post simply asks how to work around the issue of not being able to email a BGT game to somebody. As for adding exceptions, the option wouldn't exist if it was not a viable choice. It exists precisely for this purpose. What I am not sure about is why defender allows you to add your entire C drive as an exclusion, that on the other hand seems like a really dumb choice, but other than that nothing wrong with creating a games folder and just excluding that, as long as you place nothing but BGT software in there. Defender won't allow a program to just nuke your documents folder, for example, regardless of the exceptions. Nowadays, especially with ransomware being so common Windows is especially suspicious when a bunch of files get deleted or modified at once. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594260/#p594260 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? Yup, remote seems like a super obvious one. Google Chrome also flags it as a virus, like, if someone is remoting you to download something, you won't be able to do anything since it intercepts the communication between yourself and the other client.\@15, satire is apart of the internet, plain and simple. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594250/#p594250 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? Yup, remote seems like a super obvious one. Google Chrome also flags it as a virus, like, if someone is remoting you to download something, you won't be able to do anything since it intercepts the communication between yourself and the other client. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594250/#p594250 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? @18You're being dissatisfied with answers that basically boil down to "it's trade secrets". But it's not only the executable files that get looked at. That'd be like saying "We trust Python, therefore people can't write viruses in Python, let's give up" and then all the hackers steal all the things.First I've heard of Osara being a virus though. I've installed it lots of times. NVDA Remote kinda makes sense, but guessing that Osara is at least not being flagged by Defender unless you know otherwise. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594226/#p594226 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? @Camlorn, as far as I remember, NVDA Remote is flagged as a virus. Why? It is a Python program, after all. Same with Osara, but its C ++. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594216/#p594216 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? 14 is correct. 15, It might be technical jargon to you, but the overall summary is indeed correct. There is nothing that anyone can do to make BGT apps not be distrusted by AV tools, and adding exceptions is not a method that is viable, nor is it safe. @13, BGT doesn't just have the same compilation timestamp, its got the same x86 instructions too. I'd have to check but I'm pretty sure its a one-to-one opcode match across every BGT executable, or very close to that, with minor variations based on what BGT code you've written and what its compiled to in bytecode. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594168/#p594168 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? @15And then you get to the part where his friend probably still won't be able to run it without antivirus exceptions which are specific to the program involved, which is why we've bothered to point out that this can't be fixed. I mean I sort of presume the forum is used to just adding exceptions to antiviruses to play audiogames now, or whatever, so maybe wider distribution isn't a problem after all? But it seems like if that were the case this sort of question wouldn't come up in the first place. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594150/#p594150 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? After we finish with all the sarcasm and satire, as well as technical ramblings that half of the forum can't understand, we could try helping the user send a file?It really isn't relevant in this context whether a developer does or doesn't move away from BGT.So, as you have discovered, you sometimes aren't able to send BGT files because most things nowadays have at least some form of basic virus scanning. The only way you could work around this is by zipping the file and password protecting the archive, then of course telling the password to your friend. I faced the problem of not being able to send something a few days ago, and password protected archive did the job fine. This isn't even exclusive to BGT, Windows defender would eat a large percentage of my programs if I enabled it right now because it's annoying like that. It would rather be over protective since it's included in Windows by default, and average users don't have to deal with programs that aren't well known or are obscure. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594136/#p594136 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? @9There. Is. Nothing. You. Can. Do. If your game gets flagged as a virus, too bad.@12Antivirus programs are proprietary but if you think of them as a regex matcher that's not *too* far off,. They develop signatures for virus, for instance "bytes 13 through 15 are". This is a massive simplification, because sometimes machine learning is involved and it's more like "if we decode the instruction stream we see..." and etc.The other part of this is reputation. As a program is installed by people, Microsoft slowly starts assuming it's safe. This is why Python doesn't have this problem, for instance. But BGT probably only has maybe 5 installs at most, and that's really small. Microsoft will err on the side of caution, and if someone makes a virus in it, well, the easiest way is to say "huh it's the BGT executable with some data appended" and match on the BGT executable and ignore the appended data. Whereas with Pythohn, it's forced to look at the appended data to tell, since Python itself is a high reputation program.This can be fixed by signing your code, or at least helped along, because Microsoft is willing to give you the benefit of the doubt if you're willing to put your real name and address and etc. on your program. But the basic signing certificate doesn't guarantee that you'll get through while still costing a couple hundred bucks, and the advanced one that almost certainly works per my reading of the docs on it costs a ton of money and requires that you have a registered company to link to it. We can't share them because the first time someone makes a virus your certificate will effectively be untrusted and everything else you've made gets flagged as well, plus legal liability for anything anyone does with it. Also, no, BGT itself can't be signed in advance, you have to sign the final executable that's going to be distributed after the data is appended or whatever.@13My money is on someone made a virus, because we have enough people around here who think that it's okay to write joke programs and stuff. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594130/#p594130 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? Of course, antivirus makers won't straight up tell you why something is considered a virus, but the main theories I've heard are that its creating of a shell of the BGT executable and adding the game's code at the end is considered virus-like behavior, or that someone created a virus with it at some point, and that got reported to Microsoft and now everything made in BGT is flagged as a result, which would make sense since all BGT programs seem to be esentially the same executable, which results in interesting things such as every BGT program having the compilation timestamp of June 1, 2014. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594115/#p594115 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? Of course, antivirus makers won't straight up tell you why something is considered a virus, but the main theories I've heard are that its creating of a shell of the BGT executable and adding the game's code at the end is considered virus-like behavior, or that someone created a virus with it at some point, and that got reported to Microsoft and now everything made in BGT is flagged as a result, which would make sense since all BGT programs are esentialy the same executable, which results in interesting things such as every BGT program having the compilation timestamp of June 1, 2014. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594115/#p594115 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? Of course, antivirus makers won't straight up tell you why something is considered a virus, but the main theories I've heard are that its creating of a shell of the BGT executable and adding the game's code at the end is considered virus-like behavior, or that someone created a virus with it, and that got reported to Microsoft and now everything made in BGT is flagged as a result, which would make sense since all BGT programs are esentialy the same executable, which results in interesting things such as every BGT program having the timestamp of June 1, 2014. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594115/#p594115 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? What makes antiviruses "think" BGT software is a virus? URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594097/#p594097 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? When games are compiled with BGT, the compiler selectively includes/excludes modules based on usage, to cut down on wasted filespace. It's possible that this results in enough differences that some files get through while others do not, but I doubt it.I filed a review request on the Swamp Map Editor, and the result was "OK, we reviewed it. It contains a virus, but you can download it as the owner. 'K that's the final ruling bye!". Which tells me that the manual review is just the same scan that is normally done, but an actual person clicks scan and sends the results. So blah I can't even anymore. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594094/#p594094 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? @9 you have to buy a sertifikit for 500 dollars or so to sign your app with URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594093/#p594093 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? @3 can you explain more please?so i first thought its the installer that makes the diffirence with the anti virus ditection, but i found some zip file games that need only to be extracted that dont make this problem, so my question is how to make the anti virus understands that this file isn't a virus.also the subject went far away in a wrong path, personally i think that bgt isn't that bad, if you want to make a project that doesn't face bgt limitations then you can go with it, its not the language that matters but its the game itself, there are many good games made with bgt. i'm not saying that bgt is the best language to use (or even near that) but if it can create the game i'm planning then i dont have to complain. still its a good point to swich to another language for future needs but thats not what i meant to discuss here at all.thanks all for the advices. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594091/#p594091 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? @7, 1. Wsh.2. Liam was developing in other languages far before BGT was even a thought, as we say locally.3. Redspot Python, SBYW Python, etc URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594087/#p594087 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? @6 not really. i've seem a lot of people that moved away from bgt and made good stuff. after all, liam developed something in bgt now isn't he? URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594074/#p594074 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? @4 and 5,Stop spreading misinformation. BGT is obviously some kind of cyber drug that's so addictive that it takes so much effort to quit that when people do quit they no longer have the energy to do anything, good. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594068/#p594068 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? confirmed. Bgt is indeeed a virus, it infected my mind a long time ago, luckily there is a vacceen for it. If you can't move away from it, just apply it, 97% chance of complet curement. The vacceen is, obviously, moving to mak, ubuntu, or any other linux distro or accessible unix like system. Rofl URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594062/#p594062 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? Yup, BGT is a virus. It infects the programming community with idontwanttomoveonitis, so they just keep using it, again, and again, and again... URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/594049/#p594049 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? you can't work around this. You have to get every user of your game to make an antivirus exception and, as you have discovered, you'll be unable to e-mail it sometimes.If you have like $1000 and an LLC there might be something you can do, but I'm not sure it works because I'm not going to spend $1000 and an LLC for a programming language I actively discourage people from using, so if you want to try to get the proper code signing certificates and have that kind of money you're on your own. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/593970/#p593970 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: bgt is a virus?
Re: bgt is a virus? bgt is not a virus, but according to some people its not very good at all. use your anty virus to put the file back where it was and just play it. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/593968/#p593968 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
bgt is a virus?
bgt is a virus? hi all,so i noticed that my anti virus delete/warn from a detected virus, when i extract a game written using bgt. on the other hand, i never faced this problem with bgt games that require installation, wich means it has a way to go around it.this thing was never a problem for me cause i was disactivating my anti virus and go with it, not untill today, i created a mini game and tried to email it to my friend, the gmail kept warning a a virus detection and i couldnt send it, it wasn't over the allowed email size or any other problem.so here's my question: why this problem exists and how to go around it?thanks all, and have a nice day. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/593966/#p593966 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: BGT as the virus
2020-10-03
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — General Game Discussion : camlorn via Audiogames-reflector
Re: BGT as the virus As a programmer, you can't fix this for your users save, perhaps, if you get a code signing certificate. But the code signing certificate you need requires an LLC and a rather significant chunk of change per year (I think on the order of $1000), then you get shipped a special hardware device to do the signing with. There's a cheaper one, but you have to have a lot of people install your program and claim it's not a virus before Microsoft will stop flagging it in that case. I'm not sure either will work, because I haven't had occasion to try and don't want to throw that kind of money into an experiment for a language I don't use, so take this with a grain of salt if you decide to try it for some reason. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/576819/#p576819 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: BGT as the virus
2020-10-03
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — General Game Discussion : defender via Audiogames-reflector
Re: BGT as the virus Personally I make a folder just for games, and I make sure to download all BGT games directly to it.Then I scan each game with another AV program like Malware Bytes or Avast, and if it isn't that stupid machine learning threat thing that BGT games often come up as I just let it run. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/576785/#p576785 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: BGT as the virus
2020-10-03
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — General Game Discussion : DJEPIC via Audiogames-reflector
Re: BGT as the virus You guys do know you can make exceptions for specific files, not just file types, right? If you determine that a file is safe, make an exception for just it, and use it to your heart's content. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/576778/#p576778 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: BGT as the virus
Re: BGT as the virus Yes, in the end I decided to switch to the Python programming language in terms of coding, and as far as games in the BGT programming language are concerned, I don't play games with those games in the future. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/576754/#p576754 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: BGT as the virus
Re: BGT as the virus Just make your antivirus ignore BGT and the games. They are not virus. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/576743/#p576743 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: BGT as the virus
2020-10-03
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — General Game Discussion : Munawar via Audiogames-reflector
Re: BGT as the virus I would recommend to not play these games. Adding exceptions is fine but if someone eventually comes along and does inject a virus into a BGT program, your antivirus software will happily ignore it.It's the reason I stopped playing all BGT games; these are false positives (as far as we know,) but nowadays taking the risk has too many consequences.None of us on here have the credentials to be security experts. So it's best to leave it up to the programs written by people with years of experience and Ph.D's. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/576740/#p576740 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: BGT as the virus
2020-10-03
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — General Game Discussion : DJEPIC via Audiogames-reflector
Re: BGT as the virus Or, run the BGT file in a sandboxed environment, and if you've determined it's safe, run it in your normal environment, with, or without an anti-virus exception. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/576695/#p576695 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: BGT as the virus
Re: BGT as the virus Either add an exception for your antivirus (not realy recommended), or use another language, or have a VM for games URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/576678/#p576678 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
BGT as the virus
BGT as the virus Hey all! What can I do that my computer doesn't detect games written in the BGT programming language as a virus, when I download on the websites, or compile the generated code as an exe file? URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/576673/#p576673 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
