Re: Making a case for Autoit
2020-10-25
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — Developers room : TextAdventurer via Audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit Hey guys,I didn't watch the video, and I've never used Autoit, but I figured I'd throw my two cents on this subject anyway. First off, I'm glad someone pointed out that it can do more than automation. I spent a couple years doing a lot of automation using AutoHotKey (which was a fork of Autoit or something like that), and soon I was able to use it for pretty much anything. It can display GUI windows, interact with COM objects, call native DLLs, and one guy even found a way to get it to talk to .NET Framework objects. I'm sure some of those features of AutoHotKey made their way upstream to Autoit. But neither language has really made it outside of its niche. In fact, even in that job where I was doing a lot of automation, we eventually replaced AHK with straight Win32 calls because the hanchos wanted a "more standard programming language". And I kind of get that - I know a lot of other programmers, but I haven't met one who know AutoHotKey. But that doesn't necessarily change the fact that AHK is awesome. I'm sure the same goes for Autoit. You never know what a language is capable of until you check it out.But having said that, I'm also a big fan of using the right tool for the right project. Like okay, I'll admit it, I totally love C (a language that gets a lot of criticism). I personally feel OOP is overrated, and the simple act of decoupling data from actions has helped me fix tons of bugs even in languages that are very object-oriented (mostly _javascript_, PHP and Python). I like that C can be super-low-level (with compilers for 8-bit systems and microcontrollers like the Arduino, both of which are things I enjoy messing with) and can also be high-level (with libraries like SDL, CURL, SQLite and so on making it practical, and way easier, to create good-quality software). But as much as I love it, I would never use C to build the server-side logic behind a web app. I would go with Python or PHP for that. On the other hand, I would never try to build an audio game in PHP. PHP can be used to write shell scripts, so technically it could be done, but that doesn't make it the best choice.This weekend, I saw the movie "the Karate Kid" for the first time, and I think that movie has a perfect example: why the heck would you try to kill a fly with chopsticks? It can be done, and if you manage to do it you look pretty darn cool, but a fly swatter is objectively a more effective tool. So I have no doubt you could build a game with Autoit - maybe a really good game - but I think I'll stick to C. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/583316/#p583316 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit
2020-10-25
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — Developers room : TextAdventurer via Audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit Hey guys,I didn't watch the video, and I've never used Autoit, but I figured I'd throw my two cents on this subject anyway. First off, I'm glad someone pointed out that it can do more than automation. I spent a couple years doing a lot of automation using AutoHotKey (which was a fork of Autoit or something like that), and soon I was able to use it for pretty much anything. It can display GUI windows, interact with COM objects, call native DLLs, and one guy even found a way to get it to talk to .NET Framework objects. I'm sure some of those features of AutoHotKey made their way upstream to Autoit. But neither language has really made it outside of its niche. In fact, even in that job where I was doing a lot of automation, we eventually replaced AHK with straight Win32 calls because the hanchos wanted a "more standard programming language". And I kind of get that - I know a lot of other programmers, but I haven't met one who know AutoHotKey. But that doesn't necessarily change the fact that AHK is awesome. I'm sure the same goes for Autoit. You never know what a language is capable of until you check it out.But having said that, I'm also a big fan of using the right tool for the right project. Like okay, I'll admit it, I totally love C (a language that gets a lot of criticism). I personally feel OOP is overrated, and the simple act of decoupling data from actions has helped me fix tons of bugs even in languages that are very object-oriented (mostly _javascript_, PHP and Python). I like that C can be super-low-level (with compilers for 8-bit systems and microcontrollers like the Arduino) and can also be high-level (with libraries like SDL, CURL, SQLite and so on making it way easier to good-quality practical software). But as much as I love it, I would never use C to build the server-side logic behind a web app. I would go with Python or PHP for that. On the other hand, I would never try to build an audio game in PHP. PHP can be used to write shell scripts, so technically it could be done, but that doesn't make it the best choice.This weekend, I saw the movie "the Karate Kid" for the first time, and I think that movie has a perfect example: why the heck would you try to kill a fly with chopsticks? It can be done, and if you manage to do it you look pretty darn cool, but a fly swatter is objectively a more effective tool. So I have no doubt you could build a game with Autoit - maybe a really good game - but I think I'll stick to C. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/583316/#p583316 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit
Re: Making a case for Autoit I've obviously moved on already but I actualy learned to code with autoit, and did quite a few things using the language, from an audio player, to a drum simulator and a sqlite based gui app when I was learning databases. Is it a language good enough to be used in a mainstream app or game? Of course not. Is it good as a starting point? Yes. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/582391/#p582391 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit
Re: Making a case for Autoit I've obviously moved on already but I actualy learn to code with autoit, and did quite a few things using the language, from an audio player, to a drum simulator and a sqlite based gui app when I was learning databases. Is it a language good enough to be used in a mainstream app or game? Of course not. Is it good as a starting point? Yes. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/582391/#p582391 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit
Re: Making a case for Autoit Yeah I remember those. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/582191/#p582191 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit
Re: Making a case for Autoit Lol, actually audio games came up because creating simple games was that easy in AutoIt those days. Just like me, Ghorthalon created his first audio games, in AutoIt about 10 years back. I might even have them lying around here somewhere. They weren't the first ones, but they were pretty popular those days. Black jack, the bonus game and such... oh those times . URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/582106/#p582106 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit
Re: Making a case for Autoit I have experience in Java and c++ and I'm not knocking them but I just feel like Autoit gets lots of laughs. As for the audio, you're right. I had that fan and a lawn mower somewhere in the background. I'll work on that. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/582029/#p582029 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit
Re: Making a case for Autoit And why AutoIt. I mean not everyone programs in X86 assembly these days so... URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/582016/#p582016 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit
Re: Making a case for Autoit Bleh, I posted while you were posting, so I guess I have to double post to make the further point that not using a tool isn't disrespect. Who's disrespecting autoit? Programming languages aren't like people or something where they can go become lonely. Autoit is explicitly for the "automate a thing" crowd, and it's in no way disrespectful to anyone to say "but it doesn't work well for anything else", especially when the authors set out to do a specific thing and succeeded at doing that specific thing.I think the real problem is likely that you don't have significant experience in modern general-purpose languages, and possibly don't have significant experience doing things like i.e. backend or games or something like that. But again: who disrespected autoit? We all take it seriously, and if I was going to do system automation I'd probably reach for it. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/581987/#p581987 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit
Re: Making a case for Autoit I hate to be that guy, but no one is going to take you seriously with an autogain mic trying to compensate for an overly noisy fan. You need to find a more suitable recording environment if you intend on making videos that people will actually watch.Oh, and AutoIt is fine if you're using it for it's intended purpose, but no one's going to just be like, OK, let's make a game in this. Unless they're somehow very bored and have a lot of free time on their hands. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/581986/#p581986 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit
Re: Making a case for Autoit That would be because you're in a "when all you have is a hammer" mindset. It can do more than automation, but first I have to give up my package managers, debugging tools, cross-platform support, advanced data structures, optimized programming language implementations, libraries for somewhat difficult things that you don't want to write yourself, and well-written manuals and literally millions of Stack Overflow questions on the topic. And probably more, that's just what I know of offhand.No one is going out and bashing Autoit, but when you find yourself looking at a relatively popular programming language with a well-defined purpose and see yourself wondering why it's not being used for other things, it's not because we're all going "well it's great, but let's just not use it for no good reason". it's because the tools we do use instead offer more stuff, whether that be libraries, or better abstractions, or whatever. Autoit is proudly written for the automation crowd, the rest of us aren't the target audience. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/581984/#p581984 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit
Re: Making a case for Autoit Yes it is windows only and that is unfortunate. And yes, the development cycle is a bit slow but other than that, it should be listed with other languages and should be given respect. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/581983/#p581983 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit
Re: Making a case for Autoit Lol, I stepped away from AutoIt like 10 years back after programming for over 3 years with it. Its simply not worth it. Windows only, no OOP, inconsistent feature set, slow development cycle, comparably slow execution... guess I could go on like this for quite a while. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/581981/#p581981 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit
Re: Making a case for Autoit Strange, I found it audible. The point I was trying to make is that I have done more than simply automation using Autoit and yet it is treated as an automation tool rather than a programming language. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/581957/#p581957 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Making a case for Autoit
Re: Making a case for Autoit First: autoit is ignored because it's only applicable when automating stuff, which isn't what 99% of programming is. no one is disregarding it or anything. Second: your video is inaudible. Third: if you want to argue for programming languages, do it as a blog post or something so you can put code examples inline, I doubt talking about it in a youtube video is going to get very many people to jump on the bandwagon. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/581952/#p581952 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
