Re: Why Bullet Speed?
2020-07-07
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — General Game Discussion : ironcross32 via Audiogames-reflector
Re: Why Bullet Speed? OK, but that's single player games. You can get away with stretching the hardware to its limitations. On multiplayer games, if you do that, it'll have a negative impact for everyone. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/549761/#p549761 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why Bullet Speed?
Re: Why Bullet Speed? @Ironcross, Screen distance depended on the game and the bullets in question. In Street fighter 2 for example, chun li's kikoken would disappear if it got to the ends of the screen, this meant when she flung one, you could often evade by backing up. all other fireballs however would carry on moving however far you went back, so you'd always need to jump them. Other projectiles had really annoying movement patterns. In super cstlevania for example, Dracula had a really irritating attack where he'd spawn two very slow moving fireballs which would follow you around the screen, even as the count himself would teleport in and out. You could try whipping these out of the air, but when hit, they'd fall straight down, often hitting you, plus if you took them out, the count would summon more. So the only way I found to deal with them, was go on evading, trying to not get caught between dracula and his fireballs, whilst smacking him in the moosh witn the whip occasionally. Eventually, the two fireballs would combine into one, which would be much easier to avoid, and with enough smacks, the count would move on to a different form of attack.Then, don't get me started on all the crazy patterns of shots you'd get in some of the mega man games, especially for bosses. For example, bosses who would successively cover the entire screen in shots, and the only way to evade, was to wait until one in front of you landed, then dash past, and stop in a gap between two others. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/549754/#p549754 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why Bullet Speed?
2020-07-07
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — General Game Discussion : ironcross32 via Audiogames-reflector
Re: Why Bullet Speed? @2 While your argument holds water, one thing about it is that the range of the fireballs or bullets in question would end when they went off the screen. After that, they would no longer be objects in the game world. Also, let's say I have a weapon that I can fire at 120 units away from someone else and hit. If that bullet is traveling slowly, it would be possible to work out when to jump, but since the bullets in most of these don't have a traveling sound, it's a moot point. I think the bullets in most of these audio games could be sped up one-and-a-half times their normal velocity. They would have less lifespan in the game world, and you could still dodge, but it would be much more dependent on being further away from the shooter. I would still be an advocate of going to a speedless system though. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/549700/#p549700 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why Bullet Speed?
2020-07-07
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — General Game Discussion : BlindNinja via Audiogames-reflector
Re: Why Bullet Speed? One word... RTR. Now that was a game that actually did the bullet thing right... and also ran really, really smoothly possibly partly because of it. I'm curious about the same thing, actually. Most of the audio shooters implement this bullets actually traveling thing, until you're not really shooting anymore and it basically becomes long distance tag and jump like a maniac. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/549670/#p549670 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Re: Why Bullet Speed?
Re: Why Bullet Speed? @ironcross, dodgeable projectiles have been a staple of gaming from the atari days onwards. Lasers in berserk, fireballs and bullet bills in Marioo brothers, right up to quake and the early first person shooters.The idea is not realism, but to create a more difficult challenge for the player, since it is far more difficult for the player to need to time their position, the position and movement of their enemies and the trajectory of their shots, than simply point and bang! Likewise, making a player need to jump or otherwise avoid enemy projectiles with complex movement patterns was often a way of massively increasing a game's difficulty. Personally, I have no issue with players being able to hear and avoid projectiles in audiogames, my issue is more the old one I've brought up before about game mechanics, since if a player's speed, stopping distance, their trajectory of jumps and the speed of the projectile worked on a more complex speed and movement basis rather than simply a basic one speed movement rate or minimal incremental increase, then games would be much harder, and much more interesting. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/549668/#p549668 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
Why Bullet Speed?
2020-07-07
Thread
AudioGames . net Forum — General Game Discussion : ironcross32 via Audiogames-reflector
Why Bullet Speed? I'm struggling to understand a concept that is pervasive in online audio games. The concept of bullet speed. To me, this seems rather silly for many reasons.The first of which is realism. This isn't realistic at all, you can't outrun bullets, they are often fired at supersonic speeds. That means the bullet exits the muzzle at a speed which soon breaks the sound barrier. In short, if you shot a guy in the head or center of mass, he'd die before he ever heard the shot provided your aim was true and the weapon was functioning correctly.OK, it's not realistic, but why do we need realism in every game? We don't, but I wouldn't say it fits the arcade mold either. Yes, in much older games, you would physically be able to see the bullet fly towards you, but you mostly couldn't avoid it, and any time you did, it was sheer luck on your part. Newer games, you can sometimes see tracer rounds and I think they do that as a guide, but the impact is so fast, you can't avoid them either. In these audio games, the bullets travel so slow as to be dodgeable.I'm going to use Blood Storm as an example, not because I want to single it out for good or ill, but just because it's fresh on my mind. Did you know that even a fist has a speed? Stand next to something you can punch, then back away a few tiles and punch again. You'll hear the swing, but the impact comes later. OK? Why? Also, the bullets are ridiculously slow. I took advantage of the fact one of the admins was AFK and used him as a bit of a range practice session. At near maximum range, the time it took for the sniper's round to reach him was about a good three Mississippi. That means that someone could learn the approximate range of the weapons and jump to avoid the round. This is also true for the other types of weapons in the game as well.OK, so I've tried to establish that it's not very realistic, nor does it really fit the bill as a reasonable arcade mechanic, so let's move on. The next reason is network related. I will say that probably 85% or more of online audiogames have a lag problem. I think this is down to many reasons, but one of them is bound to be this issue right here. Now, I want to give a disclaimer. I don't know the first thing about netcode or coding clients and servers. But I do know some good practices for optimizing code. To me, it makes no sense to instantiate these bullet objects into the game world, to be sending them across the intervening distance between you and your target at a sub-optimal speed only to be destroyed. It would save on object creation and client / server negotiation to calculate the distance between player and target when the fire key is pressed. If the player is in range and aligned on the vertical axis, it registers as a hit, and if not, it doesn't. You could still have firing at inanimate objects, which other games do have, and it would simply work the same way. It's not taking anything away from the experience that I can see.Given all of this, I have two questions. If you're a developer of one of these games, why have you gone this route and what do you think players gain from having this system in place. If you are a player of one of these games, would you be OK with a system as I described above, where bullet speed isn't a factor? If not, what do you feel that having this system does for your gameplay?The last thing I have is an offer. If you are developing a game, and you want your weapons to be more more realistic, I offer myself as a consultant. While I am by no means a weapons expert, I have fired many types of weapons in my time. I've used pistols, rifles, assault rifles, shotguns and bows - though never a crossbow. I know how these weapons work, what they feel like in the hand, how fast each can fire and so on. URL: https://forum.audiogames.net/post/549662/#p549662 -- Audiogames-reflector mailing list Audiogames-reflector@sabahattin-gucukoglu.com https://sabahattin-gucukoglu.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/audiogames-reflector
