Re: [Ayatana] What to do with the menubar on non-full screened windows.
Klevin, you say : No, it would take more clicks than the expected, I think that, if not my idea, the button on titlebar is handlier than this. , talking about the show / hide menu-bar button. It will not take many clicks because if I need to see the menubar I click the button and the menubar will stay there as long as I need, I will not close the menu-bar in the next 2 seconds - I will set some menubars to be visible for ever and some menubars to be hidden forever - so I will use the suplemental click only one time. But my apps will stay as I've planned for them. One setting - one time - for ever - I didn't see any actions in plus here ..just economy and ergonomy ..user-based. if the the same show / hide menubar can present the menu at the right click - then we can have even more functionality. I will propose this combined solution to Ayatana but in other context not on this topic. btw - this is also about user cases - each approach ( menu-button like Firefox 4 or a button for show / hide the menu-bar) can have more or less acceptance from user-base, depend on the specific scenario for each user category. It's hard to satisfy all peoples with a single solution so they must have options - at lest the final choice will be on the user-side so complaints will be reduced to the normal. Anyway the purpose of those solutions is to save vertical space. Both approaches deserve this cause but the show / hide button will let you to choose which app. will have menu always visible all time and which not. For example Bluefish will show the menu for ever, Nautilus Elementary ..never. If you will think this way you will see also the advantages. Global menu probably fit well with the Mac user which is not so multitasking as Linux / Windows users. They do a lot with less because the good software integration and beside global-menu (which is not a good global solution), they have other good UI solutions for any kind of applications. Doing more with less - they usually don't have so many open windows at a time ( like Linux users have ). This is why general public will go with Ayatana over Gnome 3 shell. With Gnome 3 I observed I can do less with more and first impression was where I am ? how I can open this ? how I can do that ? . Ayatana is different - they search / they try / they adapt / they wrong they correct / they go forward. At the end of the day I see Ayatana UI probably the most effective OS UI paradigm. 2011/3/30 klevi...@gmail.com klevi...@gmail.com: No, it would take more clicks than the expected, I think that, if not my idea, the button on titlebar is handlier than this. 2011/3/29 SorinN nemes.so...@gmail.com it should be a clearly determined action nor a spontaneous one ..probably most of time people just want to move the window. the way Nautilus Elementary act now - is quite right - when you hide menu-bar a button come up and you can use that button as menu for most important functions. A button placed on metacity top for show / hide menu bar would be welcomed. at least will not broke anything. 2011/3/30 klevi...@gmail.com klevi...@gmail.com: Guys, I just thought on an excelent way to hide de menubar on unmaximized windows: When you hover the mouse over the window title, the menu slides out from it in the same window. How about that? 2011/3/29 SorinN nemes.so...@gmail.com good question when you have more than 2 windows, is very confusing. because I don't use small screens (21 and 24), I almost never use full-screen maximised windows. I have enough space and I'm happy with that. I've tried global menu for a while but it come to be a nonsense on a large screen. With Gnome Panel or in KDE you always know where you are. They question which arise is why you have to cross all screen with the mouse when the menubar of a non-maximised application (Bluefish for example) can be very close to your mouse ?. Global menu - on my personal opinion is just a good solution for small screens. Menu button inside window decorations provide a good alternative for saving vertical space on 16:9 and 16:10 screens - even small screens and probably more and more applications will use this solution in future. Most used items can stay visible on front, not-so-widely-used items can be hidden under menu button. 2011/3/29 Saleel Velankar svela...@gmail.com: In a nonmaximized window on a. a large screen b. with other nonmaximized windows present The global-menubar fails for these reasons. 1. Confusion on which application the menu is for. 2. Having to move the mouse an obscene amount In my 1 + 2 = not nice behavior. http://blog.martin-graesslin.com/blog/2011/03/menu-button-inside-window-decorations/ I have been reading this, and I think that the mockup provides a good compromise in non maximized windows. Thoughts? -- Saleel ___ Mailing
Re: [Ayatana] What to do with the menubar on non-full screened windows.
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Saleel Velankar wrote on 29/03/11 15:16: In a nonmaximized window on a. a large screen b. with other nonmaximized windows present The global-menubar fails for these reasons. 1. Confusion on which application the menu is for. This is a bug in the theme, not the layout. It affects not just using the menus, but the keyboard too. http://launchpad.net/bugs/534799 2. Having to move the mouse an obscene amount If it's an obscene amount, your pointer acceleration settings are wrong: you'll have just as much trouble getting to the Ubuntu button, the Trash, or the session menu. In my 1 + 2 = not nice behavior. http://blog.martin-graesslin.com/blog/2011/03/menu-button-inside-window-decorations/ I have been reading this, and I think that the mockup provides a good compromise in non maximized windows. Thoughts? ... Not only would that -- like other single-menu designs -- be much slower to use, it would also mean the menu structure changed fundamentally depending solely on how big the window is, which would be bizarre. - -- mpt -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk2S/RgACgkQ6PUxNfU6ecrh3QCghwIjRO9TeaXwsK/RFdc87G9z lsEAn0qEk8eklBauKYFOoy9CGXLo38rV =Wntf -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] window and workspace management in unity
This is already implemented in Compiz's Scale Addons plugin. Another, complementary approach would be to have a lower limit for the zoom factor when scaling—say, around 2/3—and clip windows if necessary to only show the top-left corner (top-right in RTL locales). ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] What to do with the menubar on non-full screened windows.
Matthew If it's an obscene amount, your pointer acceleration settings are wrong: you'll have just as much trouble getting to the Ubuntu button, the Trash, or the session menu. The obscene amount is still there - you can not cut it out in just 3 words. It would be easy of course to solve problems this way. ;) Sounds like Me, then Goethe. I can ask you how do you get this point ? The arguments are vague. The mouse acceleration has nothing with that - think about a large amount of users NEVER change the initial mouse settings. In plus, Global Menu break the eye focus when you follow the mouse to the menu and back. Think about big screens. Your analogy with the Trash and Session Menu is not very clear. You normally visit Trash or Session Menu just very few times per session but the Global Menu very often because of his role. If the focus is disturbed too often - the brain will got tired sooner ..is a normal reaction. Not only would that -- like other single-menu designs -- be much slower to use, it would also mean the menu structure changed fundamentally depending solely on how big the window is, which would be bizarre. you say which would be bizarre - how bizarre ? which metric your words describe ? this is a matter of the application owner / user choice (Like Firefox personal menu I want this function == I install the add-on). Not any application must be ruled by the OS using a single measure. Hide / Show menu-bar button - can solve this problem by letting you to choose which menu you want to see and which not. Finally for Global Menu - If the global menu will not be optional, at least users should choose which app will use Global Menu and not. 2011/3/30 Matthew Paul Thomas m...@canonical.com: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Saleel Velankar wrote on 29/03/11 15:16: In a nonmaximized window on a. a large screen b. with other nonmaximized windows present The global-menubar fails for these reasons. 1. Confusion on which application the menu is for. This is a bug in the theme, not the layout. It affects not just using the menus, but the keyboard too. http://launchpad.net/bugs/534799 2. Having to move the mouse an obscene amount If it's an obscene amount, your pointer acceleration settings are wrong: you'll have just as much trouble getting to the Ubuntu button, the Trash, or the session menu. In my 1 + 2 = not nice behavior. http://blog.martin-graesslin.com/blog/2011/03/menu-button-inside-window-decorations/ I have been reading this, and I think that the mockup provides a good compromise in non maximized windows. Thoughts? ... Not only would that -- like other single-menu designs -- be much slower to use, it would also mean the menu structure changed fundamentally depending solely on how big the window is, which would be bizarre. - -- mpt -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.10 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk2S/RgACgkQ6PUxNfU6ecrh3QCghwIjRO9TeaXwsK/RFdc87G9z lsEAn0qEk8eklBauKYFOoy9CGXLo38rV =Wntf -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp -- Nemes Ioan Sorin ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] What to do with the menubar on non-full screened windows.
I use Unity on a 23 full HD monitor, and I don't find it tiring to move the mouse to the menu at all, and I use it a minimum of 8 hours per day. On Mar 30, 2011 3:34 PM, SorinN nemes.so...@gmail.com wrote: ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana] What to do with the menubar on non-full screened windows.
Sure if we compare individual by individual experience we are just few millions here - each with the best theoretic argument. That's why this argument should be probably the last fire in the battle. Fortunately Usability is a science which work with other values. 2011/3/31 Ian Santopietro isan...@gmail.com: I use Unity on a 23 full HD monitor, and I don't find it tiring to move the mouse to the menu at all, and I use it a minimum of 8 hours per day. On Mar 30, 2011 3:34 PM, SorinN nemes.so...@gmail.com wrote: -- Nemes Ioan Sorin ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana Post to : ayatana@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
Re: [Ayatana-commits] [Merge] lp:~karl-qdh/indicator-datetime/propupdatefail into lp:indicator-datetime
I can't reproduce the bug at all so this was the only inconsistency which *could* have matched the fact that the show seconds was triggering an update but the change in format wasn't. Remove the inconsistency, hopefully the bug's gone. -- https://code.launchpad.net/~karl-qdh/indicator-datetime/propupdatefail/+merge/55119 Your team ayatana-commits is subscribed to branch lp:indicator-datetime. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana-commits Post to : ayatana-commits@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana-commits More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
[Ayatana-commits] [Merge] lp:~mterry/indicator-datetime/more-error-icons into lp:indicator-datetime
The proposal to merge lp:~mterry/indicator-datetime/more-error-icons into lp:indicator-datetime has been updated. Status: Needs review = Merged For more details, see: https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/indicator-datetime/more-error-icons/+merge/55532 -- https://code.launchpad.net/~mterry/indicator-datetime/more-error-icons/+merge/55532 Your team ayatana-commits is subscribed to branch lp:indicator-datetime. ___ Mailing list: https://launchpad.net/~ayatana-commits Post to : ayatana-commits@lists.launchpad.net Unsubscribe : https://launchpad.net/~ayatana-commits More help : https://help.launchpad.net/ListHelp
