RE: [backstage] feeds with live graphics?
OK - IANAL, and I'm not involved with news, or the homearchive, so this is me with the only-semi-bbc hat on. I can't see any reference to images in news's Terms of Use etc...'Fair Use' is unlikely to apply to images reused elsewhere; even if an image is 'small' it is still the image; it isn't an 'insubstantial part'. It's the difference between a thumbnail of a portrait, and a very tight crop of someone's actual thumbnail as shown in that portrait. ;-) Also, Fair use tends to only apply to private non-commercial excerpting of information. From: http://www.intellectual-property.gov.uk/faq/copyright/exceptions.htm Yes, there are a number of exceptions to copyright that allow limited use of copyright works without the permission of the copyright owner. For example, limited use of works may be possible for non-commercial research and private study, criticism or review, reporting current events, judicial proceedings, teaching in schools and other educational establishments, not for profit playing of sound recordings and to help visually impaired people. If you are copying large amounts of material and/or making multiple copies then you may still need permission. Also, particularly where a copyright exception covers publication of excerpts from a copyright work, it is generally necessary to include an acknowledgement. Sometimes more than one exception may apply to the use you are thinking of. There are more complications, too; in particular, images used on the BBC are often licensed from elsewhere. We-the-BBC thus don't have the rights to allow reuse, no matter how incidental. It could, potentially, jeopardise agreements with AP (who supply images) etc. But, like I say, I'm not a lawyer. Kim -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jonathan Chetwynd Sent: 12 June 2006 15:54 To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk Subject: Re: [backstage] feeds with live graphics? I believe for such small graphics fair use may apply... have you seen: http://www.bbc.co.uk/homearchive/ this was originally and for many months hosted here: http://www.whitelabel.org/~matthew/bbcfront/ presumably scraped on a minute by minute basis :-) cheers Jonathan Chetwynd On 12 Jun 2006, at 15:20, Graeme Mulvaney wrote: I think the copyright issue still applies as you would be re-using the images in your service despite the BBC having licensed them. There must be a few thumbnails associated with each news video clip - they show up in the viewer and on the website from time to time and would be more relevant to the story than a stock image. Perhaps these images could be made freely available, licensing would be less of an issue as they'd have come from a BBC source and would probably be more relevant to the actual story than some library images. On 6/9/06, Jonathan Chetwynd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Graeme, a picture of a beardy man can be used by an interested person without reading skills to select text for a screen or text reader to read, for example. a feed with a link to a graphic isn't re-distribution of the graphic. regards Jonathan Chetwynd On 9 Jun 2006, at 20:17, Graeme Mulvaney wrote: Generally the images don't belong to the BBC per se, so they can't re- distribute them. Besides, you'd have to question the relevance of the thumbnail images anyway :- How does a picture of a woman with a dodgy perm help you understand that the NHS has agreed to fund an anti-cancer treatment ? or a picture of a beardy man explain the situation in Iraq ? If people had problems reading the text of the stories then those images would only confuse them more. On 6/9/06, Jonathan Chetwynd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Where are the feeds with live graphics? About One in Five people in the UK is functionally illiterate**, they need and benefit from images. http://www.peepo.co.uk/mybbc/grab.png is how a simple css user style sheet can transform http://news.bbc.co.uk however for the present it would be great if a feed could provide something similar. cheers Jonathan Chetwynd ** http://www.lifelonglearning.co.uk/mosergroup/rep01.htm - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/ mailing_list.html . Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail- archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ -- You can't build a reputation based on what you are going to do. -- You can't build a reputation based on what you are going to do. - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] feeds with live graphics?
Kim, the application I am describing, promoting and developing benefits people with a learning disability so your quote may be relevant: not for profit playing of sound recordings and to help visually impaired people. furthermore, in the USA there have been recent changes in the law to allow for instance large print versions to be published, where these are not available from the original publisher, and thus prevent complaints of copyright infringement. It is possible that the recent DDA legislation, in particular with respect to the DRC may require the BBC to provide online content accessible to the 20% of the UK population who are functionally illiterate.** though I am also not a lawyer, please note the BBC are specifically included. regards Jonathan Chetwynd **I'm forwarding a formal objection to the proposed WCAG2 web accessibility guidelines in a separate email - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
Re: [backstage] feeds with live graphics?
But perhaps thumbnail graphics aren't the way to go - wouldn't a dedicated news feed that was written in plainer English be more useful, users would then be able to choose stories from that feed and then have the full versions read outto them ? Clearer news summaries would better all round. On 6/12/06, Jonathan Chetwynd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Kim,the application I am describing, promoting and developing benefitspeople with a learning disability so your quote may be relevant: not for profitplaying of sound recordings and to help visuallyimpaired people.furthermore, in the USA there have been recent changes in the law toallow for instance large print versions to be published, where these are not available from the original publisher, and thus preventcomplaints of copyright infringement.It is possible that the recent DDA legislation, in particular withrespect to the DRC may require the BBC to provide online content accessible to the 20% of the UK population who are functionallyilliterate.** though I am also not a lawyer, please note the BBC arespecifically included.regardsJonathan Chetwynd**I'm forwarding a formal objection to the proposed WCAG2 web accessibility guidelines in a separate email-Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group.To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html.Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ -- You can't build a reputation based on what you are going to do.
RE: [backstage] feeds with live graphics?
I believe the majority of the images on the News site arent taken by the BBC themselves in other words, they dont have a team of roving photographers dispatched to news story locations. Many of them come from picture agencies such as the PA, AFP, Getty Images and the AP to name but a few, where the BBC would pay a licence fee to use it on line and I am sure the agreements in place come with many strings attached. I think the other sources of images on the BBCs site are either grabs from footage or something else, or images submitted by the general public. And then theres the slightly naff stock photography they use I think the Technology section has to be one of the worst offenders at this; how many times have I seen that hand on the mouse, that man at that old computer tilted at an angle or close up of the warning labels on a keyboard wire at the back of a computer. Or, whenever theres something legal thats ongoing or doesnt have any relevant images, out comes the generic photoshopped picture of the justice scales. In fact, I think there was a blog about this, which poked fun at the BBCs stock image usage bunny something or another. Like Graham said, placing these images in a feed wouldnt necessarily be helpful at all, especially with the generic stock images. - C From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Graeme Mulvaney Sent: 09 June 2006 20:17 To: backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk Subject: Re: [backstage] feeds with live graphics? Generally the images don't belong to the BBC per se, so they can't re-distribute them. Besides, you'd have to question the relevance of the thumbnail images anyway :- How doesa picture of a woman with a dodgy perm help you understand that the NHS has agreed to fund an anti-cancer treatment ? or a picture of a beardy man explain the situation in Iraq ? If people had problems reading the text of the stories then those images would only confuse them more. On 6/9/06, Jonathan Chetwynd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Where are the feeds with live graphics? About One in Five people in the UK is functionally illiterate**, they need and benefit from images. http://www.peepo.co.uk/mybbc/grab.png is how a simple css user style sheet can transform http://news.bbc.co.uk however for the present it would be great if a feed could provide something similar. cheers Jonathan Chetwynd ** http://www.lifelonglearning.co.uk/mosergroup/rep01.htm - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group.To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html .Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ -- You can't build a reputation based on what you are going to do.
[backstage] Re: Urgent WCAG2: formal objection: final draft
It would be even more helpful were you to post some links to the proposal and your reasons for your objections. Because, while I used to work in the voluntary sector, I no longer do, I haven't a clue what this is on about, and your post has simply served to confuse me. I'm sure it's vital stuff in the world of accessibility, but some explanation would be welcomed. Cheers, Rich. On 6/12/06, Jonathan Chetwynd [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It would be very helpful to gather contacts and support within the BBC, and backstage in particular. I have already contacted Jonathan Hassell and Andrea Callender please read the attached final draft and confirm your support. we have a strong list of supporters, including Mencap, The Rix Centre, GAWDS plus many smaller groups Skillnet, Ubisan, Better days A few other big names: FPwLD, DRC, Inclusion International... yet to reply, ... Even the BSI are independently sending in a comment. regards Jonathan Chetwynd The text of the formal objection is as follows: WCAG 2.0 claims to define and address the requirements for making Web content accessible to those with learning difficulties, cognitive limitations and others. We object to that claim. Specifically, the success criteria requirements for making content understandable ignore the needs of people with learning difficulties and cognitive limitations. Please note that there are guidelines published by other groups that will make content much more accessible to these users. However, with the WCAG claim to address learning difficulties and cognitive limitations, people will not know that they need to look further. We would like to see continued work in this field and a statement in the WCAG 2.0 abstract and introduction modifying the claim that they currently address accessibility for learning disabilities. Specifically, we recommend removing learning difficulties and cognitive limitations from the list of supported disabilities. A sentence may be added later in the abstract that these guidelines may also provide some benefits for people with learning difficulties and cognitive limitations. We would then like to see a statement of intent such as: the working group intends to build additional success criteria to address accessibility for learning disabilities and cognitive limitations. -- The aim of the objection is that: a, The working group understands that WCAG 2.0 dose not provide all the requirements for access for cognitive limitations, and b, they continue work on an extension guideline that will address these needs. The good news is that this effort is already being taken seriously by the WCAG co-chairs. It is not being seen or understood as campaigning but as a constructive criticism aimed to making a better and fairer set of guidelines. The more signatures we get now, the better the case will be made. - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/ - Sent via the backstage.bbc.co.uk discussion group. To unsubscribe, please visit http://backstage.bbc.co.uk/archives/2005/01/mailing_list.html. Unofficial list archive: http://www.mail-archive.com/backstage@lists.bbc.co.uk/
