[BAROQUE-LUTE] Re: Improvising and Composing?
On Jul 7, 2008, at 12:12 AM, Michael Gillespie wrote: Does anyone have any comments on improvising trills and other accents? Or know of any good readings on the topic? Also, (just a thought) did the baroque masters compose in tablature? (that seems absurd). Are there any sources for learning notation on the lute. Did you get any replies to your query? Your original post seems to be the only one in the thread. I didn't see any replies, which surprises me. I don't quite get your first question. I don't think of trills as being improvised. I guess that you could say that one improvises where one puts them if they aren't marked, but I rather think of them as something that is obligatory at cadences in certain styles of music. What do you mean by accents? There must be heaps of reading on the internet, just google. If you want a book, Robert Donington's _The Interpretation of Early Music_ or _Baroque Music: Style and Performance_ might be useful. I'm sure others know of more recent books. The Baroque masters almost certainly composed in tablature, if by that, you mean that when they wrote down what they composed they didn't first write it in another system but wrote it down directly in tab. Why does that seem absurd? Seems logical to me. Sources for learning notation? Perhaps the easiest would be to find parallel tab and transcription editions. There are some pieces like that available on the web, I'm pretty sure. HTH Ed Durbrow Saitama, Japan [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www9.plala.or.jp/edurbrow/ To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[BAROQUE-LUTE] Re: Improvising and Composing?
Roman -- what I wanted to ask was did they compose with shapes on the fingerboard and translate that to tablature or was it composed like a species counterpoint. And did professionals play from tablature or from standard notation, aside from figured bass. On 7/6/08, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Michael Gillespie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Also, (just a thought) did the baroque masters compose in tablature? (that seems absurd). Are there any sources for learning notation on the lute. I wouldn't compose in tab myself, but I don't see why a baroque lutenist-composer wouldn't, at least for solo works. Presumably, tab would have been a natural language for them to think in since they would have been dealing with it since their early days of learning te instrument. That doesn't mean they didn't think in notes as opposed to fingerboard shapes. Professional lutenists all knew their continuo chops, which would have been improvised from a bass line in notation. There is also a significant body of later works for baroque lute in chamber settings in which the other instruments would have been written out in mensural notation. Writing this should have been no big deal for our lute guys. As for learning notation yourself - my best advice would be to just do it. Pick up something in keyboard notation and trash through it. Simple 4-voice chorales are great for this. Play the parts seperately, then the treble and bass clef hands seperately and finally combine it all. (You could also do bass and alto, tenor and soprano, tenor and alto, bass and soprano, combinations of three voices, etc.) This also gives anyone fantastic practice in figured bass, even if you've been doing it for a while. Although they may not be the most idiomatic from a technical stand point for the lute, it'll be like pumping iron for the finger coordination and musical brain. Chris Thanks, -Michael -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[BAROQUE-LUTE] Re: Improvising and Composing?
On Jul 6, 2008, at 11:12 AM, Michael Gillespie wrote: Does anyone have any comments on improvising trills and other accents? You mean...(gasp)...actually putting in ornaments just anywhere, even though they're not officially indicated in the tab? I don't know: pretty risky business! Purists will raise their voices to the moon: crying for us to stick to the script, lest order and method give way to chaos and anarchy. Next thing you know, we'll all be playing single-strung archlutes!! ;-) Seriously: IMO certainly we should improvise trills, ornaments, and in fact generally dress up the music, as we see fit. Why not? Baroque composers would have encouraged us to do that. Also, (just a thought) did the baroque masters compose in tablature? (that seems absurd). Why absurd? It's easy to write music in tablature. Besides, I can't imagine that Weiss wrote his pieces out in notation and then propped them up in front of him and transcribed them note for note into tab. That seems absurd to me. And even if he did, wouldn't we then have two versions of each one of his pieces? Are there any sources for learning notation on the lute. I don't know of any, except for the various instructions on learning basso continuo, which would teach you to read lines in bass clef. DR [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[BAROQUE-LUTE] Re: Improvising and Composing?
Roman -- what I wanted to ask was did they compose with shapes on the fingerboard and translate that to tablature or was it composed like a species counterpoint. Well, I take as evidence of people composing in tabulature Weiss' own rosicrucian entry in a friends journal, consisting of a few bars of enharmonic modulations in tab. I have no problems composing directly in tab, although this predetermines quite a few licks at least for me. And did professionals play from tablature or from standard notation, aside from figured bass. Both. Weiss certainly did. RT On 7/6/08, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- Michael Gillespie [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Also, (just a thought) did the baroque masters compose in tablature? (that seems absurd). Are there any sources for learning notation on the lute. I wouldn't compose in tab myself, but I don't see why a baroque lutenist-composer wouldn't, at least for solo works. Presumably, tab would have been a natural language for them to think in since they would have been dealing with it since their early days of learning te instrument. That doesn't mean they didn't think in notes as opposed to fingerboard shapes. Professional lutenists all knew their continuo chops, which would have been improvised from a bass line in notation. There is also a significant body of later works for baroque lute in chamber settings in which the other instruments would have been written out in mensural notation. Writing this should have been no big deal for our lute guys. As for learning notation yourself - my best advice would be to just do it. Pick up something in keyboard notation and trash through it. Simple 4-voice chorales are great for this. Play the parts seperately, then the treble and bass clef hands seperately and finally combine it all. (You could also do bass and alto, tenor and soprano, tenor and alto, bass and soprano, combinations of three voices, etc.) This also gives anyone fantastic practice in figured bass, even if you've been doing it for a while. Although they may not be the most idiomatic from a technical stand point for the lute, it'll be like pumping iron for the finger coordination and musical brain. Chris Thanks, -Michael -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
