[admin] Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
Good morning folks, As this thread is now veering away from BBEdit matters :-), may I kindly request we consider it snipped, and for interested parties to take any further discussion to direct email. Regards, Patrick Woolsey == Bare Bones Software, Inc. http://www.barebones.com/ -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
Then I went back to work in the “ever reliable” BBEdit only to find that all the icons of my PHP files had changed from BBEdit icons to Balthisar icons. Not a happy camper here. I did not ask this program to change all my icons. I am not fond of programs that make changes to my system without asking me. Not a happy camper at all. I'm sorry you don't like the icons, but this isn't Balthisar Tidy changing your operating system; it's your operating system changing your operating system. This has been standard behavior since Mac OS X 10.0. It's the reason that your PHP files even had a BBEdit icon in the first place. BBEdit also doesn't ask to change your icons; Mac OS X does it automatically when a new application with editor role is installed. Just tell Mac OS to use BBEdit for all PHP files again, or restart after deleting Balthisar Tidy. I know this is one of the most frustrating points of behavior about Mac OS X for inexperienced users, and even experienced users. Every time I try out new text editors for example, I often have to go back and reassign ownership to other applications (PHPStorm for PHP, BBEdit for TXT, etc.) because Mac OS X automatically assumes I want the new editor to assume responsibility. -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
I wasn't clear. That was a reference to the question about XML formatting, not to the original question about html tidying. On Mon, Nov 10, 2014 at 4:15 PM, WordWeaver777 wordweaver...@gmail.com wrote: On Nov 11, 2014, at 10:06 AM, Lee Hinde leehi...@gmail.com wrote: Markup/Utilities/Format.. might work for you... Lee, as noted earlier, Markup/Utilities/Format only reformats an HTML document. It does not auto-correct the HTML code itself, which is what some of us are after, now that Tidy has been dropped from BBEdit. --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com. -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
Nice thought Lee, but that command's only for formatting HTML documents, not XML. On 2014-11-11, at 13:06, Lee Hinde leehi...@gmail.com wrote: Markup/Utilities/Format.. might work for you... -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
How is it on tidying XML? My main use of the built-in tidy in BBEdit 10 is cleaning run-together XML for debugging. Sent from my iPhone On 10/11/2014, at 11:38, Jim Derry balthi...@gmail.com wrote: More importantly, I hope that you find that Balthisar Tidy is well-designed and usable (if it's the type of tool you would use, that is). -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
Markup/Utilities/Format.. might work for you... On Mon, Nov 10, 2014 at 12:07 PM, Tom Robinson barefootg...@gmail.com wrote: How is it on tidying XML? My main use of the built-in tidy in BBEdit 10 is cleaning run-together XML for debugging. Sent from my iPhone On 10/11/2014, at 11:38, Jim Derry balthi...@gmail.com wrote: More importantly, I hope that you find that Balthisar Tidy is well-designed and usable (if it's the type of tool you would use, that is). -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
On Nov 11, 2014, at 10:06 AM, Lee Hinde leehi...@gmail.com wrote: Markup/Utilities/Format.. might work for you... Lee, as noted earlier, Markup/Utilities/Format only reformats an HTML document. It does not auto-correct the HTML code itself, which is what some of us are after, now that Tidy has been dropped from BBEdit. As a quick update, I just downloaded the Balthisar Tidy 2.0.2 dev code from GitHub and compiled it in Xcode. As has been mentioned a few times, this will give you the for Work version of Balthisar Tidy, which enables you to use the app in batch mode, using an AppleScript which you can download from Jim's website. I just downloaded the AppleScript and tried it out, and it does indeed work. There are a few little bugs that Jim is currently working on, but if you want the for Work version without having to pay the measly $8.00 through MAS, this is the way to go. Personally, this app will be so useful to me once a few things are worked out, that I will probably buy the MAS version anyway, just to support and encourage Jim in his endeavors. Bill Kochman Endtime Prophecy Net -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
On Nov 8, 2014, at 9:02 PM, Fritz Anderson anderson.fr...@gmail.com wrote: On Nov 8, 2014, at 7:49 PM, LuKreme krem...@kreme.com wrote: None of that implies that the FORMATTING of the code is relevant. At all. It has never been my experience that how the text file is formatted is relevant to a search engine, nor how it realistically could be. The content of the original post may not have been clear to you. Tidy is not, and never was, just a pretty-printer. It flags, and optionally corrects, syntax and best-practice errors. It is poor at that task, however. BBEdit’s own syntax checks or the W3 valuator’s are far better suited to that task. It is reasonable to expect an indexing bot to take code quality into account when assessing the quality of a page. You’d be surprised, but that is neither here nor there. If you are relying on 10+ year old tidy code to validate and syntax check you will be in for a few rude shocks. If the page renders and has content that the search engine can index, then it indexes it. It does *not* go off an check the code for validity. The fact remains, the formatting of the source is a benefit to YOU. To other coders. It means nothing to the search engines. -- 'It's a lovely morning, lads,' he said. 'I feel like a million dollars. Don't you?' There was a murmur of reluctant agreement. 'Good,' said Cohen. 'Let's go and get some.' --Interesting Times -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
Thank you Fritz. You for one perfectly understood what I meant by code structure. LuKreme obviously did not. That is PRECISELY why I was so happy to find Balthisar Tidy; because it auto-corrects syntax, and does not just reformat. Bill K. The content of the original post may not have been clear to you. Tidy is not, and never was, just a pretty-printer. It flags, and optionally corrects, syntax and best-practice errors. It is reasonable to expect an indexing bot to take code quality into account when assessing the quality of a page. In fact, we hear exactly that from the direct experience of a professional, who turns out to be an enthusiast, but not a fool. ― F -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
I don't love their home page. I may not be the speediest reader on the planet, and it is Sunday morning, but I couldn't finish reading a single panel of that carousel before they whisked it away. I have to wonder how people who use carousels for content decide where to set the timing. Or if they even think about it. If you're a designer who is picky about usability and accessibility, you won't follow their example. http://shouldiuseacarousel.com -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
Dear BBEdit friends, Like many of you, I was very disappointed to learn that Tidy has been dropped from BBEdit 11.0, because I have depended on Tidy's HTML code auto-correction feature for many years now, even though the Tidy code is quote outdated. However, just today while again searching online for a suitable replacement, and after wading through pages which offered me Java-based apps which I couldn't get to work, source code, tarballs, binaries that failed to function under Yosemite, etc., I discovered a FREE gem called Balthisar Tidy. Folks, I am a very happy man. Aside from the fact that you have to run it outside of BBEdit, there is nothing to not like about this app, which is available both on their website -- balthisar.com -- as well as in the Mac App Store. The primary difference between the two, as you can imagine, is that the MAS version is sandboxed. Other than that, according to the developer's website -- his name is Jim Derry -- there are only minimal differences between the two. Consider this: • It is free. • It is modern, up-to-date Tidy code with the latest W3C specifications, and not the old 2004 - 2008 Tidy code. • It has a very simple, straightforward design with a lot of inline help. • It is Yosemite compatible. • You can tweak a long list of preferences to your heart's content so that your HTML docs look exactly the way that you want them to. • If you require batch processing, there is a commercial version in the Mac App Store which only costs like $8.00, and that is cheap for this gem. If you are a web designer and HTML coder who is picky about your HTML code, and who wants to make Googlebot happy, I recommend that you give this app a try. I don't think that you will be disappointed. No, I do not work for these folks; I was just so happy to find this today after learning that Tidy has been dropped from BBEdit. Rich and Patrick, I hope you don't mind me posting this being as it is for someone else's software, but I think a lot of HTML coders here will be happy to know that there is an easy and free way to fill the void that has been left by Tidy being dropped from BBEdit. If I have broken any list rules, I apologize in advance. Just delete this message. Kind regards, Bill Kochman Endtime Prophecy Net -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
On Nov 8, 2014, at 7:49 AM, WordWeaver777 wordweaver...@gmail.com wrote: If you are a web designer and HTML coder who is picky about your HTML code, and who wants to make Googlebot happy, Since when does google care at all about how HTML is formatted? -- He'd never asked for an exciting life. What he really liked, what he sought on every occasion, was boredom. The trouble was that boredom tended to explode in your face. Just when he thought he'd found it he'd be suddenly involved in what he supposed other people - thoughtless, feckless people - would call an adventure. And he'd be forced to visit many strange lands and meet exotic and colourful people, although not for very long because usually he'd be running. He'd seen the creation of the universe, although not from a good seat, and had visited Hell and the afterlife. He'd been captured, imprisoned, rescued, lost and marooned. Sometimes it had all happened on the same day. -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
LuKreme, As a long-time webmaster, HTML coder, and member of Google's Webmaster Tools, it is my understanding that the Googlebot carefully scrutinizes everything in an HTML document, including code structure. The more perfect everything is, both in your code, as well as in your actual content, the higher rating its algorithm will give your page, and the higher your pages will appear in Google's SERP's. The proof is in the pudding. Google my name Bill Kochman, or my primary website Endtime Prophecy Net and see what kind of results you get. I have been very well placed in the Google universe for years. :) But that is really all besides the point. My purpose in sharing my previous message here was to simply inform other concerned BBEdit users that I had found a free worthy replacement for BBEdit's built-in Tidy functions. In fact, Jim Derry has been actively communicating with me regarding his app via email since yesterday. He is very responsive, and is even now making some improvements to Balthisar Tidy, based on some of my comments to him. He may roll out new versions in a matter of a few days, he hopes. Oh, one other thing that he mentioned to me is that he is going to work on making his app a system service, which will more easily integrate it with BBEdit. On Nov 9, 2014, at 9:40 AM, LuKreme krem...@kreme.com wrote: On Nov 8, 2014, at 7:49 AM, WordWeaver777 wordweaver...@gmail.com wrote: If you are a web designer and HTML coder who is picky about your HTML code, and who wants to make Googlebot happy, Since when does google care at all about how HTML is formatted? -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
[top posting fixed] On Nov 8, 2014, at 5:00 PM, WordWeaver777 wordweaver...@gmail.com wrote: On Nov 9, 2014, at 9:40 AM, LuKreme krem...@kreme.com wrote: On Nov 8, 2014, at 7:49 AM, WordWeaver777 wordweaver...@gmail.com wrote: If you are a web designer and HTML coder who is picky about your HTML code, and who wants to make Googlebot happy, Since when does google care at all about how HTML is formatted? As a long-time webmaster, HTML coder, and member of Google's Webmaster Tools, it is my understanding that the Googlebot carefully scrutinizes everything in an HTML document, including code structure. The more perfect everything is, both in your code, as well as in your actual content, the higher rating its algorithm will give your page, and the higher your pages will appear in Google's SERP’s. None of that implies that the FORMATTING of the code is relevant. At all. It has never been my experience that how the text file is formatted is relevant to a search engine, nor how it realistically could be. htmlheadtitleFoobar/title/head looks exactly the same to a search engine as html head title Foobar /title /head But that is really all besides the point. My purpose in sharing my previous message here was to simply inform other concerned BBEdit users that I had found a free worthy replacement for BBEdit's built-in Tidy functions. Which is great and welcome news. But what I replied to was your assertion that using a tool like tidy would make Google happy. I do not believe that is true. -- 'It's a lovely morning, lads,' he said. 'I feel like a million dollars. Don't you?' There was a murmur of reluctant agreement. 'Good,' said Cohen. 'Let's go and get some.' --Interesting Times -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
LuKreme, Exactly what is your problem, sir? I tried to do a good thing by sharing my discovery regarding Balthisar Tidy with other BBEdit users here, and you are purposely making a mountain out of a mole hill, and being a real nitpicker. Do you just like to argue and debate over minutia just for the sake of arguing? If so, I am sorry, sir, but I am not interested in entertaining you. Furthermore, you have obviously misunderstood what I wrote. The phrase that I used in my previous message was CODE STRUCTURE, meaning the actual structure of one's HTML code; that is, proper syntax, opening and closing tags, etc. I said NOTHING about FORMAT. You are the one who brought that up in your original retort, which in fact detracted from what my original message was primarily about. I fully understand that spiders such as Googlebot ignore white space, line breaks, etc. I also know that is why a lot of folks like to minimize their HTML code. However, if your actual HTML code -- THE CODE STRUCTURE -- is broken in a serious way, it is my understanding that Google will penalize the page. They will do the same thing for excessive misspelled words. There is a clear and obvious reason regarding why there are W3C specifications for HTML documents. To suggest that they are not important, or that spiders such as Googlebot will ignore web pages which seriously break those specifications, is ludicrous, in my view. You may agree or disagree as you like sir; but when someone does a good deed, as I have done here, please don't try to find fault with it. Thank you. We are done here. Bill Kochman Endtime Prophecy Net -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
On Nov 8, 2014, at 7:49 PM, LuKreme krem...@kreme.com wrote: None of that implies that the FORMATTING of the code is relevant. At all. It has never been my experience that how the text file is formatted is relevant to a search engine, nor how it realistically could be. The content of the original post may not have been clear to you. Tidy is not, and never was, just a pretty-printer. It flags, and optionally corrects, syntax and best-practice errors. It is reasonable to expect an indexing bot to take code quality into account when assessing the quality of a page. In fact, we hear exactly that from the direct experience of a professional, who turns out to be an enthusiast, but not a fool. ― F -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
Re: You Will Love This: Balthisar Tidy
On 11/8/14 at 10:02 PM, anderson.fr...@gmail.com (Fritz Anderson) pronounced: On Nov 8, 2014, at 7:49 PM, LuKreme krem...@kreme.com wrote: None of that implies that the FORMATTING of the code is relevant. At all. It has never been my experience that how the text file is formatted is relevant to a search engine, nor how it realistically could be. The content of the original post may not have been clear to you. Tidy is not, and never was, just a pretty-printer. It flags, and optionally corrects, syntax and best-practice errors. It is reasonable to expect an indexing bot to take code quality into account when assessing the quality of a page. In fact, we hear exactly that from the direct experience of a professional, who turns out to be an enthusiast, but not a fool. It's a reasonable expectation, but a couple of folks from Google answered a question about it a few years ago. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2XlKn6I9rSc --steve Steve Piercy, Soquel, CA -- This is the BBEdit Talk public discussion group. If you have a feature request or would like to report a problem, please email supp...@barebones.com rather than posting to the group. Follow @bbedit on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/bbedit --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups BBEdit Talk group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to bbedit+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to bbedit@googlegroups.com.
