Re: Schneier vs. Brin
On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: jon louis mann said the following on 3/8/2008 5:33 PM: I found myself disturbed that I'm attracted to the idea of carrying an MP3 recording device at all times, just in case I get stopped by law enforcement and want my own recording of the event. Ray writes: I felt the same myself the other day when we were stopped by the Border Patrol near White Sands NM. We were rudely treated and harassed by an officious officer because we did not have our passports with us. It had never been mentioned to us that this was a US Govt requirement. I insulted him by proffering my new South Dakota driving license! A note has been made on your record that you have been informed that next time you are liable to be arrested. Left a real sour taste in the mouth. This is the first person we have come across in our first four weeks traveling through the US who has been unfriendly. In general, people have been fantastically helpful and friendly. A question just comes to mind.Do US citizens need to carry ID? In Texas, if you're an adult, you cannot be outside your residence without an ID. If you're white and female, you can probably get away with it for decades as long as you're not actually driving without having your license on you. If you're black and male, you're going to find yourself in a world of hurt pretty darn quickly if you go out without your ID one day, especially in certain parts of the state. (These statements are based on the experiences of people I know.) Julia (who has accidentally left the house without a license once in the past 5 years, and went back for it in a hurry as soon as she realized - not that she's ever gotten pulled over for anything other than expired stickers, but that's not a risk anyone really wants to take, right?) ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Schneier vs. Brin
Julia Thompson said the following on 3/9/2008 10:53 AM: In Texas, if you're an adult, you cannot be outside your residence without an ID. Is that a state law or the way it is? --[Lance] -- Celebrate The Circle http://www.celebratethecircle.org/ Carolina Spirit Quest http://www.carolinaspiritquest.org/ GPG Fingerprint: 409B A409 A38D 92BF 15D9 6EEE 9A82 F2AC 69AC 07B9 CACert.org Assurer ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Schneier vs. Brin
At 09:53 AM Sunday 3/9/2008, Julia Thompson wrote: On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: jon louis mann said the following on 3/8/2008 5:33 PM: I found myself disturbed that I'm attracted to the idea of carrying an MP3 recording device at all times, just in case I get stopped by law enforcement and want my own recording of the event. Ray writes: I felt the same myself the other day when we were stopped by the Border Patrol near White Sands NM. We were rudely treated and harassed by an officious officer because we did not have our passports with us. It had never been mentioned to us that this was a US Govt requirement. I insulted him by proffering my new South Dakota driving license! A note has been made on your record that you have been informed that next time you are liable to be arrested. Left a real sour taste in the mouth. This is the first person we have come across in our first four weeks traveling through the US who has been unfriendly. In general, people have been fantastically helpful and friendly. A question just comes to mind.Do US citizens need to carry ID? In Texas, if you're an adult, you cannot be outside your residence without an ID. Not even standing in your back yard? So you have to carry your wallet when you're mowing the lawn in mid-summer wearing nothing but shorts (men) so as not to get heatstroke, or lounging by your swimming pool in a bikini (I'm not even going to mention the possibility that you have a hot tub), or dumping some extra-stinky garbage (e.g. used cat litter or a full diaper) into your garbage can late at night? -- Ronn! :) ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Schneier vs. Brin
On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, Ronn! Blankenship wrote: At 09:53 AM Sunday 3/9/2008, Julia Thompson wrote: On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: jon louis mann said the following on 3/8/2008 5:33 PM: I found myself disturbed that I'm attracted to the idea of carrying an MP3 recording device at all times, just in case I get stopped by law enforcement and want my own recording of the event. Ray writes: I felt the same myself the other day when we were stopped by the Border Patrol near White Sands NM. We were rudely treated and harassed by an officious officer because we did not have our passports with us. It had never been mentioned to us that this was a US Govt requirement. I insulted him by proffering my new South Dakota driving license! A note has been made on your record that you have been informed that next time you are liable to be arrested. Left a real sour taste in the mouth. This is the first person we have come across in our first four weeks traveling through the US who has been unfriendly. In general, people have been fantastically helpful and friendly. A question just comes to mind.Do US citizens need to carry ID? In Texas, if you're an adult, you cannot be outside your residence without an ID. Not even standing in your back yard? So you have to carry your wallet when you're mowing the lawn in mid-summer wearing nothing but shorts (men) so as not to get heatstroke, or lounging by your swimming pool in a bikini (I'm not even going to mention the possibility that you have a hot tub), or dumping some extra-stinky garbage (e.g. used cat litter or a full diaper) into your garbage can late at night? On your property, I should have said. Julia ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Schneier vs. Brin
At 12:34 PM Sunday 3/9/2008, Julia Thompson wrote: On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, Ronn! Blankenship wrote: At 09:53 AM Sunday 3/9/2008, Julia Thompson wrote: On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: jon louis mann said the following on 3/8/2008 5:33 PM: I found myself disturbed that I'm attracted to the idea of carrying an MP3 recording device at all times, just in case I get stopped by law enforcement and want my own recording of the event. Ray writes: I felt the same myself the other day when we were stopped by the Border Patrol near White Sands NM. We were rudely treated and harassed by an officious officer because we did not have our passports with us. It had never been mentioned to us that this was a US Govt requirement. I insulted him by proffering my new South Dakota driving license! A note has been made on your record that you have been informed that next time you are liable to be arrested. Left a real sour taste in the mouth. This is the first person we have come across in our first four weeks traveling through the US who has been unfriendly. In general, people have been fantastically helpful and friendly. A question just comes to mind.Do US citizens need to carry ID? In Texas, if you're an adult, you cannot be outside your residence without an ID. Not even standing in your back yard? So you have to carry your wallet when you're mowing the lawn in mid-summer wearing nothing but shorts (men) so as not to get heatstroke, or lounging by your swimming pool in a bikini (I'm not even going to mention the possibility that you have a hot tub), or dumping some extra-stinky garbage (e.g. used cat litter or a full diaper) into your garbage can late at night? On your property, I should have said. Julia So if your next door neighbors tell you to come over and lounge by their pool, you'd better find some place for a wallet in your thong? -- Ronn! :) ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Schneier vs. Brin
On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, Ronn! Blankenship wrote: At 12:34 PM Sunday 3/9/2008, Julia Thompson wrote: On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, Ronn! Blankenship wrote: At 09:53 AM Sunday 3/9/2008, Julia Thompson wrote: On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: jon louis mann said the following on 3/8/2008 5:33 PM: I found myself disturbed that I'm attracted to the idea of carrying an MP3 recording device at all times, just in case I get stopped by law enforcement and want my own recording of the event. Ray writes: I felt the same myself the other day when we were stopped by the Border Patrol near White Sands NM. We were rudely treated and harassed by an officious officer because we did not have our passports with us. It had never been mentioned to us that this was a US Govt requirement. I insulted him by proffering my new South Dakota driving license! A note has been made on your record that you have been informed that next time you are liable to be arrested. Left a real sour taste in the mouth. This is the first person we have come across in our first four weeks traveling through the US who has been unfriendly. In general, people have been fantastically helpful and friendly. A question just comes to mind.Do US citizens need to carry ID? In Texas, if you're an adult, you cannot be outside your residence without an ID. Not even standing in your back yard? So you have to carry your wallet when you're mowing the lawn in mid-summer wearing nothing but shorts (men) so as not to get heatstroke, or lounging by your swimming pool in a bikini (I'm not even going to mention the possibility that you have a hot tub), or dumping some extra-stinky garbage (e.g. used cat litter or a full diaper) into your garbage can late at night? On your property, I should have said. Julia So if your next door neighbors tell you to come over and lounge by their pool, you'd better find some place for a wallet in your thong? Duh, you need your *towel*, dude. Just sew a little pocket in the corner, and you're golden! :) Julia ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Schneier vs. Brin
Original Message: - From: Julia Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 12:34:42 -0500 (CDT) To: brin-l@mccmedia.com Subject: Re: Schneier vs. Brin In Texas, if you're an adult, you cannot be outside your residence without an ID. On your property, I should have said. How sure are you of this Julia? I have two reasons to question this. First, Google didn't give me any hits on this...just side hits on ID requirements for beer, etc. Second, my daughter Neli (one of my two Zambian daughters) was in a car which was pulled over for DWB in the Woodlands. The people in the care were asked why they were in the Woodlands. Neli said I live here. She was asked for ID and she said I don't need ID, I'm not driving. The matter was dropped. Given that they were pulled over for DWB, if she was legally required to carry ID at all times, wouldn't they have mentioned that at the time. Heck, a constible who pulls folks over for DWB is looking for someone to arrest in my book. Dan M. ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l mail2web.com What can On Demand Business Solutions do for you? http://link.mail2web.com/Business/SharePoint ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Schneier vs. Brin
On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Original Message: - From: Julia Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 12:34:42 -0500 (CDT) To: brin-l@mccmedia.com Subject: Re: Schneier vs. Brin In Texas, if you're an adult, you cannot be outside your residence without an ID. On your property, I should have said. How sure are you of this Julia? I have two reasons to question this. First, Google didn't give me any hits on this...just side hits on ID requirements for beer, etc. Second, my daughter Neli (one of my two Zambian daughters) was in a car which was pulled over for DWB in the Woodlands. The people in the care were asked why they were in the Woodlands. Neli said I live here. She was asked for ID and she said I don't need ID, I'm not driving. The matter was dropped. Given that they were pulled over for DWB, if she was legally required to carry ID at all times, wouldn't they have mentioned that at the time. Heck, a constible who pulls folks over for DWB is looking for someone to arrest in my book. Dan M. I've heard from black men that if they're walking out on the road in East Texas, they damn well better have ID on them, and failure to produce ID will get you in some trouble. Julia ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Schneier vs. Brin
Original Message: - From: Julia Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 14:47:55 -0500 (CDT) To: brin-l@mccmedia.com Subject: Re: Schneier vs. Brin On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Original Message: - From: Julia Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 12:34:42 -0500 (CDT) To: brin-l@mccmedia.com Subject: Re: Schneier vs. Brin In Texas, if you're an adult, you cannot be outside your residence without an ID. On your property, I should have said. How sure are you of this Julia? I have two reasons to question this. First, Google didn't give me any hits on this...just side hits on ID requirements for beer, etc. Second, my daughter Neli (one of my two Zambian daughters) was in a car which was pulled over for DWB in the Woodlands. The people in the care were asked why they were in the Woodlands. Neli said I live here. She was asked for ID and she said I don't need ID, I'm not driving. The matter was dropped. Given that they were pulled over for DWB, if she was legally required to carry ID at all times, wouldn't they have mentioned that at the time. Heck, a constible who pulls folks over for DWB is looking for someone to arrest in my book. Dan M. I've heard from black men that if they're walking out on the road in East Texas, they damn well better have ID on them, and failure to produce ID will get you in some trouble. Ah, that makes sense then. There is no law against it, just like there is no law against black people driving. But, an officer has discretion concerning suspicious behavior and the Supreme Court has said that an officer can ask for an ID. So, even though its not a law, its common sense for people with certain ethnic backgrounds to carry IDs. You or I can jog in our neighborhood without them. Heck, Neli can jog here, because the police knows that she could very well be related to someone who could raise holy hell. But, a black man on an E Texas road, yeaI'll believe that. Dan M. mail2web LIVE Free email based on Microsoft® Exchange technology - http://link.mail2web.com/LIVE ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Schneier vs. Brin
On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Original Message: - From: Julia Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 14:47:55 -0500 (CDT) To: brin-l@mccmedia.com Subject: Re: Schneier vs. Brin On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Original Message: - From: Julia Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 12:34:42 -0500 (CDT) To: brin-l@mccmedia.com Subject: Re: Schneier vs. Brin In Texas, if you're an adult, you cannot be outside your residence without an ID. On your property, I should have said. How sure are you of this Julia? I have two reasons to question this. First, Google didn't give me any hits on this...just side hits on ID requirements for beer, etc. Second, my daughter Neli (one of my two Zambian daughters) was in a car which was pulled over for DWB in the Woodlands. The people in the care were asked why they were in the Woodlands. Neli said I live here. She was asked for ID and she said I don't need ID, I'm not driving. The matter was dropped. Given that they were pulled over for DWB, if she was legally required to carry ID at all times, wouldn't they have mentioned that at the time. Heck, a constible who pulls folks over for DWB is looking for someone to arrest in my book. Dan M. I've heard from black men that if they're walking out on the road in East Texas, they damn well better have ID on them, and failure to produce ID will get you in some trouble. Ah, that makes sense then. There is no law against it, just like there is no law against black people driving. But, an officer has discretion concerning suspicious behavior and the Supreme Court has said that an officer can ask for an ID. So, even though its not a law, its common sense for people with certain ethnic backgrounds to carry IDs. You or I can jog in our neighborhood without them. Heck, Neli can jog here, because the police knows that she could very well be related to someone who could raise holy hell. But, a black man on an E Texas road, yeaI'll believe that. Dan M. And, better safe than sorry -- if I'm in someone else's car and there's a major crash, better for me to have ID on me so they have an easier time figuring out who I am. (Also, if you're an adult, you can't get into an elementary school around here without a driver's license. They scan it, get info from a database, and print up a visitor sticker that has the picture from your license.) Julia ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Schneier vs. Brin
At 03:30 PM Sunday 3/9/2008, Julia Thompson wrote: On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Original Message: - From: Julia Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 14:47:55 -0500 (CDT) To: brin-l@mccmedia.com Subject: Re: Schneier vs. Brin On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Original Message: - From: Julia Thompson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Sun, 9 Mar 2008 12:34:42 -0500 (CDT) To: brin-l@mccmedia.com Subject: Re: Schneier vs. Brin In Texas, if you're an adult, you cannot be outside your residence without an ID. On your property, I should have said. How sure are you of this Julia? I have two reasons to question this. First, Google didn't give me any hits on this...just side hits on ID requirements for beer, etc. Second, my daughter Neli (one of my two Zambian daughters) was in a car which was pulled over for DWB in the Woodlands. The people in the care were asked why they were in the Woodlands. Neli said I live here. She was asked for ID and she said I don't need ID, I'm not driving. The matter was dropped. Given that they were pulled over for DWB, if she was legally required to carry ID at all times, wouldn't they have mentioned that at the time. Heck, a constible who pulls folks over for DWB is looking for someone to arrest in my book. Dan M. I've heard from black men that if they're walking out on the road in East Texas, they damn well better have ID on them, and failure to produce ID will get you in some trouble. Ah, that makes sense then. There is no law against it, just like there is no law against black people driving. But, an officer has discretion concerning suspicious behavior and the Supreme Court has said that an officer can ask for an ID. So, even though its not a law, its common sense for people with certain ethnic backgrounds to carry IDs. You or I can jog in our neighborhood without them. Heck, Neli can jog here, because the police knows that she could very well be related to someone who could raise holy hell. But, a black man on an E Texas road, yeaI'll believe that. Dan M. And, better safe than sorry -- if I'm in someone else's car and there's a major crash, better for me to have ID on me so they have an easier time figuring out who I am. (Also, if you're an adult, you can't get into an elementary school around here without a driver's license. They scan it, get info from a database, and print up a visitor sticker that has the picture from your license.) Julia I think we're getting to some sort of agreement here. I noticed that most of Julia's initial examples seemed to have as a basic assumption that you were _driving_ somewhere, and of course you are supposed to have your drivers license (as well as proof of insurance and in a lot of places the vehicle registration) in your possession whenever you are driving. And indeed in many jurisdictions a white woman, particularly if she is also pulchritudinous, is more likely to get a pass from the police or other authorities than a black man. And, as Dan's example shows, if you are walking or driving in a neighborhood where you do not seem to fit the neighborhood demographic, particularly late at night, you may well be stopped and asked for ID and asked what reason you have for being in that place at that time, and not just in Texas. And at any time of the day or night you might be stopped while walking or driving along if you and/or your vehicle resemble someone they are looking for, particularly if a crime has just occurred in the vicinity, and again asked for ID and why you happen to be there. OTOH, when a lot of people go jogging they don't have a pocket big enough to carry much of anything, and indeed some folks may still go out running with nothing but a door key hanging on a lanyard around their neck so they can get back in when they are done. (Though similarly to Julia's next-to-last example carrying some ID might be a good idea in case they get hit by a car or something, as well as following your mother's advice to be wearing clean underwear . . . ) And because of crimes which have been committed on the premises of such institutions it makes sense that you should be required to show ID and give a valid reason for being there if you want to enter a school or some other places. However, around here at least, you can still walk your dog around the block without being stopped at every corner by some guy in a brown shirt and jackboots carrying a machine gun and saying Your papers, please, comrade. And while it's been awhile since I was last in Texas, and on that trip all my father and I did was take turns driving a U-Haul truck across the state stopping mainly at places like gas stations and places to eat, no one in uniform demanded to see our papers when we stopped nor pulled us over
Re: Schneier vs. Brin
At 06:03 PM Sunday 3/9/2008, Julia Thompson wrote: On Sun, 9 Mar 2008, Ronn! Blankenship wrote: (Though similarly to Julia's next-to-last example carrying some ID might be a good idea in case they get hit by a car or something, as well as following your mother's advice to be wearing clean underwear . . . ) Well, in the immortal words of Bill Cosby, First you're going to say it, then you're going to do it! so clean underwear may not be what you need. Okay, I'm a little confused as to how that applies to the situation described, where your mother worries that after the accident when they get you to the hospital and remove the outer clothing from your unconscious person they see that your underwear is not clean . . . Underwear without extra holes induced by wear, on the other hand, is a Good Thing. Julia Depends on where the extra holes are, and how hot and humid the weather is . . . -- Ronn! :) ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Texas
-I noticed that most of Julia's initial examples seemed to have as a basic assumption that you were _driving_ somewhere, and of course you are supposed to have your drivers license (as well as proof of insurance and in a lot of places the vehicle registration) in your possession whenever you are driving. And indeed in many jurisdictions a white woman, particularly if she is also pulchritudinous, is more likely to get a pass from the police or other authorities than a black man. And, as Dan's example shows, if you are walking or driving in a neighborhood where you do not seem to fit the neighborhood demographic, particularly late at night, you may well be stopped and asked for ID and asked what reason you have for being in that place at that time, and not just in Texas. And at any time of the day or night you might be stopped while walking or driving along if you and/or your vehicle resemble someone they are looking for, particularly if a crime has just occurred in the vicinity, and again asked for ID and why you happen to be there. OTOH, when a lot of people go jogging they don't have a pocket big enough to carry much of anything, and indeed some folks may still go out running with nothing but a door key hanging on a lanyard around their neck so they can get back in when they are done. (Though similarly to Julia's next-to-last example carrying some ID might be a good idea in case they get hit by a car or something, as well as following your mother's advice to be wearing clean underwear . . . ) And because of crimes which have been committed on the premises of such institutions it makes sense that you should be required to show ID and give a valid reason for being there if you want to enter a school or some other places. However, around here at least, you can still walk your dog around the block without being stopped at every corner by some guy in a brown shirt and jackboots carrying a machine gun and saying Your papers, please, comrade. And while it's been awhile since I was last in Texas, and on that trip all my father and I did was take turns driving a U-Haul truck across the state stopping mainly at places like gas stations and places to eat, no one in uniform demanded to see our papers when we stopped nor pulled us over to ask for them, so unless things have changed tremendously since then I'm going to guess that things there are likely to be about the same as they are here . . . -- Ronn! :) i know why they have all those signs, don't mess with texas... years ago, driving through the panhandle, i was pulled over for driving over the speed limit (keeping up with traffic). i suspect it might have something to do with my california plates. i was ordered to follow the cop to the nearest post office and pay for the ticket on the spot, in cash. fortunately i had the cash on me, otherwise i would have been immediately taken to jail... -- Jon! :) Looking for last minute shopping deals? Find them fast with Yahoo! Search. http://tools.search.yahoo.com/newsearch/category.php?category=shopping ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Schneier vs. Brin
Ronn! wrote: Julia wrote: Well, in the immortal words of Bill Cosby, First you're going to say it, then you're going to do it! so clean underwear may not be what you need. Okay, I'm a little confused as to how that applies to the situation described, where your mother worries that after the accident when they get you to the hospital and remove the outer clothing from your unconscious person they see that your underwear is not clean . . . Try first you say sh**t then you do it. Underwear without extra holes induced by wear, on the other hand, is a Good Thing. Julia Depends on where the extra holes are, and how hot and humid the weather is . . . And/or your religion? Doug ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Schneier vs. Brin
On Mar 9, 2008, at 2:04 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: concerning the carrying of IDs Ah, that makes sense then. There is no law against it, just like there is no law against black people driving. But, an officer has discretion concerning suspicious behavior and the Supreme Court has said that an officer can ask for an ID. So, even though its not a law, its common sense for people with certain ethnic backgrounds to carry IDs. You or I can jog in our neighborhood without them. Heck, Neli can jog here, because the police knows that she could very well be related to someone who could raise holy hell. But, a black man on an E Texas road, yeaI'll believe that. Dan M. Ray writes (in this clumsy manner since he cannot send mail from his mail program): My question was whether a US citizen is required to carry and produce ID showing they are US citizens if stopped by the Border Patrol in say NM, nowhere near any external borders. When I handed over my South Dakota driver's license as ID, I was castigated for not producing my passport. If I had said I was a US citizen, would I have been required to produce evidence of this on the spot? Regards, Ray. (Who had a quiet day in Carlsberg, spending many happy? hours in Walmart buying supplies etc for our trip. We are doing our best to boost the US economy! Thank goodness the Aussie dollar is worth nearly twice what it was in our short visit in 2001.) ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Texas
jon louis mann wrote: i know why they have all those signs, don't mess with texas... years ago, driving through the panhandle, i was pulled over for driving over the speed limit (keeping up with traffic). i suspect it might have something to do with my california plates. i was ordered to follow the cop to the nearest post office and pay for the ticket on the spot, in cash. fortunately i had the cash on me, otherwise i would have been immediately taken to jail... -- Jon! :) Wow, you guys are really scaring me! In Oz, we don't even have to carry our licence while driving - just be able to produce it within 24 hours. The idea that a driver's licence is insufficient ID, or that you can get in trouble for being where a cop doesn't expect you to be without an ID really bothers me, but to be taken to jail for speeding at normal traffic levels without any sort of trial or process - eeek! We get months to pay off a speeding fine when travelling interstate, not minutes! Cheers Russell C. Who's never been asked for ID other than at border crossings (ie from Canada, from Mexico, or in airports) and usually leaves his passport behind when being a tourist in US because I'm paranoid about losing it or having it taken from me. Never been further south than Virginia or California, though... ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Let us all pause for 2d8 seconds
On Wed, Mar 5, 2008 at 7:55 PM, Horn, John [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Gary Gygax has died... Seems he biffed his saving throw. [Odd aside: The person who first told me this is my Tai Chi instructor. The very last person ever whom I'd imagine would be aware of anything DD or fantasy game related. Go fig.] -- Warren Ockrassa Blog | http://indigestible.nightwares.com/ Books | http://books.nightwares.com/ Web | http://www.nightwares.com/ ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Texas
Quoting Russell Chapman [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Who's never been asked for ID other than at border crossings (ie from Canada, from Mexico, or in airports) and usually leaves his passport behind when being a tourist in US because I'm paranoid about losing it or having it taken from me. Never been further south than Virginia or California, though... Losing the passports is our big worry too. As you say, I also thought that carrying them with us at all times was a silly risk and unnecessary. At no stage during the entry formalities were we told that it was a requirement. Still think it,s utterly stoopid, but with the note the mongrel supposedly left on our records, we are in no position to ignore it (especially if we want to extend our stay in the country next year). Regards, Ray. ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Moses was high on drugs: Israeli researcher
On Mar 4, 2008, at 6:28 PM, David Hobby wrote: William T Goodall wrote: ... High on Mount Sinai, Moses was on psychedelic drugs when he heard God William-- That doesn't make the experience more or less real, though. Objectively, it makes the experience worthless, and certainly does nothing to back up the idea of an absolute god whose rules are universally applicable. To claim on one hand that some kind of god exists who is objectively, personally present in every life -- while on the other hand asserting that hallucinogens influencing the minds of prophets are somehow irrelevant in reference to those assertions -- is to fall into the disingenuous offense that makes religion so damned unpalatable to rationalists. To be fair, though, William: This researcher has absolutely no more evidence to back up his claims' factuality than Moses did. It's probably safest to concede that both Moses and Shanon are equally brimful of shit. -- Warren Ockrassa Blog | http://indigestible.nightwares.com/ Books | http://books.nightwares.com/ Web | http://www.nightwares.com/ ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Moses was high on drugs: Israeli researcher
On Mar 5, 2008, at 9:07 AM, Andrew Crystall wrote: On 5 Mar 2008 at 12:23, William T Goodall wrote: Others might argue that the doors of perception were cleansed, letting one see another level of reality that was always there. Hallucinations are just the brain running wonky, not 'another level of reality'. Prove you're not hallucinating your life, and you're not just a brain in a jar :) (The number of contradictions in this world? Jar is a shitload simpler) He doesn't have to, Andrew. It's those who claim their experiences -- which run contrary to observable, verifiable and apparently valid reality -- that must prove *their* livers are not the illusion. As to brain in a jar: Occam would have something to say to you. The more parsimonious explanation is that the reality we appear to experience is valid, rather than the idea that this reality is an illusion covering a larger, more bizarre reality. That's just not parsimonious. Impossible? no. Unlikely? extremely. What contradictions, by the way, can you enumerate which make it a shitload simpler to believe we're brains in a jar? -- Warren Ockrassa Blog | http://indigestible.nightwares.com/ Books | http://books.nightwares.com/ Web | http://www.nightwares.com/ ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Moses was high on drugs: Israeli researcher
On Mar 9, 2008, at 9:45 PM, Warren Ockrassa wrote: must prove *their* livers are not the illusion. By consuming, of course, vast amounts of ethanol-based fluids. (Thought I'd get it before Ronn! did.) -- \/\/ ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Maybe they should try Wisk . . . ?
If Wisk worked, there would be much sadness in the community at the passing of the rings of Rhea, on par with the mourning of Pluto's passing as a planet -- one can imagine the headlines now: With a Brisk Wisky Rub: Gone, O Rhea! So be glad some things just aren't feasible. -- Warren Ockrassa Blog | http://indigestible.nightwares.com/ Books | http://books.nightwares.com/ Web | http://www.nightwares.com/ ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
Re: Schneier vs. Brin
On Mar 8, 2008, at 2:33 PM, jon louis mann wrote: Nevertheless, I like the idea of being able to listen in on high government officials planning ways to subvert the constitution. Well, the guys who _wrote_ the constitution did so in secret. Yes, they published the Federalist Papers, a PR effort to generate support for their effort, but it could scarcely be called a transparent process. Of course, Don't let this make you think that I am disappointed with the result: what this bunch of white, mostly slave-holding-friendly men cooked up in private that summer of 1787 has survived various insults and injuries by presidents as varied as Washington, Lincoln, Roosevelt and (so far) G. W. It's just a goddamned piece of paper Bush. I was with those at the Aspen Institute recently who felt that it was likely to survive this latest onslaught, too. There are times when transparency is best, and there are times when complete opacity is necessary, for a time. The trick is to know which is appropriate when. Planning an invasion of another country (let's assume, for a moment, that it is being done for the right reasons) should definitely _not_ be done with transparency, at least not in anything like real time, if it is to be successful and to protect the safety of those executing the invasion. Then again, deciding whether a certain shabby stretch of Story Road in East San Jose should be designated Little Saigon or The Saigon Business District is something that definitely should have be done in public. It might have saved the city months hard feelings, and may even save the life of Ly Tong, the protester who has been on a hunger strike over the issue for 23 days.* Dave * Yes, really: This guy is betting his life that he can convince the City of San Jose to name a crappy stretch of strip malls Little Saigon. He stopped drinking water a couple of days ago, after the city removed the designation Saigon Business District, and says that if he dies, it'll be on the head of Mayor Chuck Reed. The whole thing is making a neighborhood uncomfortably close to mine look incredibly stupid, in addition to being decidedly shoddy. ___ http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
