Re: [Callers] Grand Square in a contra?

[Bob Green via Callers]

I would reiterate Dave's comment. The dance really only has one
challenge...but it is a doozy.. Remembering whether you are a head or a
side on each interrelation of the grand square is a challenge, partly
because you have to recall  2 things...Am I a head or  a side & do I
separate or approach.

Great weekend, thanks Luke!

On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 9:46 PM, David Harding via Callers <
callers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:

> Hi Luke, thanks for a great weekend.  I'm piping up as a dancer who had
> hoped that you would call a grand square in a contra formation after the
> discussion here.  Tonight I find myself in an analytical frame of mind,
> thinking about where we stumbled, in the hope that you (and others) will
> keep calling this dance and have great success with it.
>
> I'm from Illinois, but a regular at the two Wisconsin weekends
> (IndepenDance and Squirrel Moon).  The programs tend to be dominated by
> contras, but with enough squares so most dancers are familiar with the
> basic concepts.  I haven't been keeping count, but it feels as though most
> weekends include one dance with a grand square, and I felt that there were
> sufficient dancers on Sunday who knew the grand square figure that we
> should have been fine.
>
> Personally, I struggled to remember which direction to start as we
> flip-flopped from side to side.  I think a lot of us were disoriented that
> way.  Even in a square dance with rotating partners, one role usually stays
> home and can anchor the orientation.
>
> Part of my problem was not (yet) having internalized my identity as part
> of a right or left couple in a four-facing-four.  I don't need to think any
> more when I'm addressed as a gent (or lady), as a middle or inside or
> outside.  I know when I'm a head or a side.  I know where to find my corner
> wherever I am at the moment.  But I don't recall dancing a four-facing-four
> where the right couples did something different from the left couples.
>
> My two cents in the interest of continuous improvement.
>
> -Dave Harding
>
> On 7/5/2016 12:15 PM, Luke Donforth via Callers wrote:
>
> Thanks John, that does seem like a fun bit to incorporate.
>
> I ran the Fox Hollow Foibles dance with the Grand Square happening on the
> diagonal at IndepenDance in Wisconsin. Folks seemed to have fun with it,
> but it was certainly challenging (my sense is that community doesn't do
> many squares; Grand or otherwise).
>
> On Fri, Jul 1, 2016 at 5:20 PM, John Sweeney via Callers <
> callers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>
>> Of course contra dancers like swinging, so you could try incorporating
>> this version into a contra dance:
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfqC8uVfCUo
>>
>>
>>
>> In “Cowboy Dances” (1939) there was also a version with half a two-hand
>> turn (but they called it a swing!) every time you met someone.
>>
>>
>>
>> Happy dancing,
>>
>> John
>>
>>
>>
>> John Sweeney, Dancer, England j...@modernjive.com 01233 625 362
>> http://www.contrafusion.co.uk for Dancing in Kent
>>
>>
>>
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>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Luke Donforth
> luke.donfo...@gmail.com 
>
>
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> listCallers@lists.sharedweight.nethttp://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net
>
>
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>
>

Re: [Callers] Grand Square in a contra?

[David Harding via Callers]

Hi Luke, thanks for a great weekend.  I'm piping up as a dancer who had 
hoped that you would call a grand square in a contra formation after the 
discussion here.  Tonight I find myself in an analytical frame of mind, 
thinking about where we stumbled, in the hope that you (and others) will 
keep calling this dance and have great success with it.


I'm from Illinois, but a regular at the two Wisconsin weekends 
(IndepenDance and Squirrel Moon).  The programs tend to be dominated by 
contras, but with enough squares so most dancers are familiar with the 
basic concepts.  I haven't been keeping count, but it feels as though 
most weekends include one dance with a grand square, and I felt that 
there were sufficient dancers on Sunday who knew the grand square figure 
that we should have been fine.


Personally, I struggled to remember which direction to start as we 
flip-flopped from side to side.  I think a lot of us were disoriented 
that way.  Even in a square dance with rotating partners, one role 
usually stays home and can anchor the orientation.


Part of my problem was not (yet) having internalized my identity as part 
of a right or left couple in a four-facing-four.  I don't need to think 
any more when I'm addressed as a gent (or lady), as a middle or inside 
or outside.  I know when I'm a head or a side. I know where to find my 
corner wherever I am at the moment.  But I don't recall dancing a 
four-facing-four where the right couples did something different from 
the left couples.


My two cents in the interest of continuous improvement.

-Dave Harding


On 7/5/2016 12:15 PM, Luke Donforth via Callers wrote:

Thanks John, that does seem like a fun bit to incorporate.

I ran the Fox Hollow Foibles dance with the Grand Square happening on 
the diagonal at IndepenDance in Wisconsin. Folks seemed to have fun 
with it, but it was certainly challenging (my sense is that community 
doesn't do many squares; Grand or otherwise).


On Fri, Jul 1, 2016 at 5:20 PM, John Sweeney via Callers 
> wrote:


Of course contra dancers like swinging, so you could try
incorporating this version into a contra dance:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfqC8uVfCUo

In “Cowboy Dances” (1939) there was also a version with half a
two-hand turn (but they called it a swing!) every time you met
someone.

Happy dancing,

John

John Sweeney, Dancer, England j...@modernjive.com
 01233 625 362
http://www.contrafusion.co.uk for Dancing in Kent


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--
Luke Donforth
luke.donfo...@gmail.com 


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Re: [Callers] tips for teaching dancing the "other" role?

[Alexandra Deis-Lauby via Callers]

:)

On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 3:36 PM, Dale Wilson  wrote:

> Exactly, it's the hand that confuses me.
> On Jul 6, 2016 1:40 PM, "Alexandra Deis-Lauby" 
> wrote:
>
>> Left hand?
>>
>> On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 1:56 PM, Dale Wilson via Callers <
>> callers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>>
>>> When I'm dancing the lady's role the only thing I consciously think
>>> about is putting my right and on the Gent's shoulder as we start to swing.
>>> If I get that right, everything else seems natural (to me).
>>>
>>> Dale
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jul 5, 2016 at 9:13 PM, tavi merrill via Callers <
>>> callers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>>>
 Regarding swing position: With good frame, differences between the
 roles in giving weight are slight. But not all dancers are accustomed to
 good frame.

 I find a mirrored ballroom hold (both dancers have right hand on the
 other's shoulder blade, left hand on the other's shoulder) offers several
 advantages:
- In general, it's a good hold for dancers to know as it saves
 space in crowded halls.
- It facilitates spinning out from a swing, useful when dancers
 encounter "string of swings" choreography
- It allows both dancers to experience both sides of good frame
 The one challenge is that dancers need to remember which side they are
 ending the swing on, as it removes "pointer hands" from the equation.

 This a bit of a tangent, but related to the chain: If we just called
 gents chains (by either hand! the courtesy turn for a left-hand chain isn't
 REALLY that complicated, folks) more often, role differences WRT chain
 would be a moot issue, and both roles would be better equipped to
 understand/offer/ask/decline flourishes. All for the effort of teaching one
 move well, one move that's out there in good choreography waiting to be
 used.

 Susan, I'm assuming this workshop is at a gender-free series, but
 geared to encourage attendance by dancers who aren't yet accustomed to
 gender-free dance? Having danced both roles widely and called a bit of
 gender-free, I'd be happy to chat by phone or IM. Feel free to ping me on
 facebook - Tavi Merrill



 On 7/5/2016 11:32 AM, Susan Pleck via Callers wrote:
> > Hi folks,
> >
> > I'm to lead a workshop/extended intro lesson at a local dance this
> > Saturday on gender-free dancing/dancing the "other" role/switching
> > roles.  Not having done this before, I'd appreciate any thoughts or
> > advice about what this should include.  For the gender-free aspect,
> > I'm not sure there's much to discuss, really; ir'd be more just
> giving
> > dancers a chance to practice responding to different terms.  For
> > dancing the other role, though, what points of emphasis do you think
> > would be most useful?  Two that come to mind are swing
> > positioning/giving weight, and figures such as a chain where the
> > actions of the two roles are different.
>
>
 ___
 Callers mailing list
 Callers@lists.sharedweight.net
 http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net


>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Turn Observation into Data. Turn Data into Information
>>> . Turn Information into
>>> Knowledge. Turn Knowledge into Wisdom. Turn Wisdom into Beauty. Turn Beauty
>>> into Love .
>>>
>>> ___
>>> Callers mailing list
>>> Callers@lists.sharedweight.net
>>> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net
>>>
>>>
>>

Re: [Callers] tips for teaching dancing the "other" role?

[Dale Wilson via Callers]

Exactly, it's the hand that confuses me.
On Jul 6, 2016 1:40 PM, "Alexandra Deis-Lauby"  wrote:

> Left hand?
>
> On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 1:56 PM, Dale Wilson via Callers <
> callers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>
>> When I'm dancing the lady's role the only thing I consciously think about
>> is putting my right and on the Gent's shoulder as we start to swing.  If I
>> get that right, everything else seems natural (to me).
>>
>> Dale
>>
>> On Tue, Jul 5, 2016 at 9:13 PM, tavi merrill via Callers <
>> callers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Regarding swing position: With good frame, differences between the roles
>>> in giving weight are slight. But not all dancers are accustomed to good
>>> frame.
>>>
>>> I find a mirrored ballroom hold (both dancers have right hand on the
>>> other's shoulder blade, left hand on the other's shoulder) offers several
>>> advantages:
>>>- In general, it's a good hold for dancers to know as it saves
>>> space in crowded halls.
>>>- It facilitates spinning out from a swing, useful when dancers
>>> encounter "string of swings" choreography
>>>- It allows both dancers to experience both sides of good frame
>>> The one challenge is that dancers need to remember which side they are
>>> ending the swing on, as it removes "pointer hands" from the equation.
>>>
>>> This a bit of a tangent, but related to the chain: If we just called
>>> gents chains (by either hand! the courtesy turn for a left-hand chain isn't
>>> REALLY that complicated, folks) more often, role differences WRT chain
>>> would be a moot issue, and both roles would be better equipped to
>>> understand/offer/ask/decline flourishes. All for the effort of teaching one
>>> move well, one move that's out there in good choreography waiting to be
>>> used.
>>>
>>> Susan, I'm assuming this workshop is at a gender-free series, but geared
>>> to encourage attendance by dancers who aren't yet accustomed to gender-free
>>> dance? Having danced both roles widely and called a bit of gender-free, I'd
>>> be happy to chat by phone or IM. Feel free to ping me on facebook - Tavi
>>> Merrill
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On 7/5/2016 11:32 AM, Susan Pleck via Callers wrote:
 > Hi folks,
 >
 > I'm to lead a workshop/extended intro lesson at a local dance this
 > Saturday on gender-free dancing/dancing the "other" role/switching
 > roles.  Not having done this before, I'd appreciate any thoughts or
 > advice about what this should include.  For the gender-free aspect,
 > I'm not sure there's much to discuss, really; ir'd be more just giving
 > dancers a chance to practice responding to different terms.  For
 > dancing the other role, though, what points of emphasis do you think
 > would be most useful?  Two that come to mind are swing
 > positioning/giving weight, and figures such as a chain where the
 > actions of the two roles are different.


>>> ___
>>> Callers mailing list
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>>> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Turn Observation into Data. Turn Data into Information
>> . Turn Information into
>> Knowledge. Turn Knowledge into Wisdom. Turn Wisdom into Beauty. Turn Beauty
>> into Love .
>>
>> ___
>> Callers mailing list
>> Callers@lists.sharedweight.net
>> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net
>>
>>
>

Re: [Callers] tips for teaching dancing the "other" role?

[Alexandra Deis-Lauby via Callers]

Left hand?

On Wed, Jul 6, 2016 at 1:56 PM, Dale Wilson via Callers <
callers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:

> When I'm dancing the lady's role the only thing I consciously think about
> is putting my right and on the Gent's shoulder as we start to swing.  If I
> get that right, everything else seems natural (to me).
>
> Dale
>
> On Tue, Jul 5, 2016 at 9:13 PM, tavi merrill via Callers <
> callers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:
>
>> Regarding swing position: With good frame, differences between the roles
>> in giving weight are slight. But not all dancers are accustomed to good
>> frame.
>>
>> I find a mirrored ballroom hold (both dancers have right hand on the
>> other's shoulder blade, left hand on the other's shoulder) offers several
>> advantages:
>>- In general, it's a good hold for dancers to know as it saves
>> space in crowded halls.
>>- It facilitates spinning out from a swing, useful when dancers
>> encounter "string of swings" choreography
>>- It allows both dancers to experience both sides of good frame
>> The one challenge is that dancers need to remember which side they are
>> ending the swing on, as it removes "pointer hands" from the equation.
>>
>> This a bit of a tangent, but related to the chain: If we just called
>> gents chains (by either hand! the courtesy turn for a left-hand chain isn't
>> REALLY that complicated, folks) more often, role differences WRT chain
>> would be a moot issue, and both roles would be better equipped to
>> understand/offer/ask/decline flourishes. All for the effort of teaching one
>> move well, one move that's out there in good choreography waiting to be
>> used.
>>
>> Susan, I'm assuming this workshop is at a gender-free series, but geared
>> to encourage attendance by dancers who aren't yet accustomed to gender-free
>> dance? Having danced both roles widely and called a bit of gender-free, I'd
>> be happy to chat by phone or IM. Feel free to ping me on facebook - Tavi
>> Merrill
>>
>>
>>
>> On 7/5/2016 11:32 AM, Susan Pleck via Callers wrote:
>>> > Hi folks,
>>> >
>>> > I'm to lead a workshop/extended intro lesson at a local dance this
>>> > Saturday on gender-free dancing/dancing the "other" role/switching
>>> > roles.  Not having done this before, I'd appreciate any thoughts or
>>> > advice about what this should include.  For the gender-free aspect,
>>> > I'm not sure there's much to discuss, really; ir'd be more just giving
>>> > dancers a chance to practice responding to different terms.  For
>>> > dancing the other role, though, what points of emphasis do you think
>>> > would be most useful?  Two that come to mind are swing
>>> > positioning/giving weight, and figures such as a chain where the
>>> > actions of the two roles are different.
>>>
>>>
>> ___
>> Callers mailing list
>> Callers@lists.sharedweight.net
>> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Turn Observation into Data. Turn Data into Information
> . Turn Information into
> Knowledge. Turn Knowledge into Wisdom. Turn Wisdom into Beauty. Turn Beauty
> into Love .
>
> ___
> Callers mailing list
> Callers@lists.sharedweight.net
> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net
>
>

Re: [Callers] tips for teaching dancing the "other" role?

[Dale Wilson via Callers]

When I'm dancing the lady's role the only thing I consciously think about
is putting my right and on the Gent's shoulder as we start to swing.  If I
get that right, everything else seems natural (to me).

Dale

On Tue, Jul 5, 2016 at 9:13 PM, tavi merrill via Callers <
callers@lists.sharedweight.net> wrote:

> Regarding swing position: With good frame, differences between the roles
> in giving weight are slight. But not all dancers are accustomed to good
> frame.
>
> I find a mirrored ballroom hold (both dancers have right hand on the
> other's shoulder blade, left hand on the other's shoulder) offers several
> advantages:
>- In general, it's a good hold for dancers to know as it saves
> space in crowded halls.
>- It facilitates spinning out from a swing, useful when dancers
> encounter "string of swings" choreography
>- It allows both dancers to experience both sides of good frame
> The one challenge is that dancers need to remember which side they are
> ending the swing on, as it removes "pointer hands" from the equation.
>
> This a bit of a tangent, but related to the chain: If we just called gents
> chains (by either hand! the courtesy turn for a left-hand chain isn't
> REALLY that complicated, folks) more often, role differences WRT chain
> would be a moot issue, and both roles would be better equipped to
> understand/offer/ask/decline flourishes. All for the effort of teaching one
> move well, one move that's out there in good choreography waiting to be
> used.
>
> Susan, I'm assuming this workshop is at a gender-free series, but geared
> to encourage attendance by dancers who aren't yet accustomed to gender-free
> dance? Having danced both roles widely and called a bit of gender-free, I'd
> be happy to chat by phone or IM. Feel free to ping me on facebook - Tavi
> Merrill
>
>
>
> On 7/5/2016 11:32 AM, Susan Pleck via Callers wrote:
>> > Hi folks,
>> >
>> > I'm to lead a workshop/extended intro lesson at a local dance this
>> > Saturday on gender-free dancing/dancing the "other" role/switching
>> > roles.  Not having done this before, I'd appreciate any thoughts or
>> > advice about what this should include.  For the gender-free aspect,
>> > I'm not sure there's much to discuss, really; ir'd be more just giving
>> > dancers a chance to practice responding to different terms.  For
>> > dancing the other role, though, what points of emphasis do you think
>> > would be most useful?  Two that come to mind are swing
>> > positioning/giving weight, and figures such as a chain where the
>> > actions of the two roles are different.
>>
>>
> ___
> Callers mailing list
> Callers@lists.sharedweight.net
> http://lists.sharedweight.net/listinfo.cgi/callers-sharedweight.net
>
>


-- 
Turn Observation into Data. Turn Data into Information
. Turn Information into
Knowledge. Turn Knowledge into Wisdom. Turn Wisdom into Beauty. Turn Beauty
into Love .