Re: [ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs
Thanks everyone for your responses. I've tried to summarize the suggestions and feedback from this thread: - This was a very small sample size, but overall ConturELN (http://www.contur.com) from Accelerys was the most popular option, followed by Labguru (http://www.labguru.com). Two others were mentioned, ELN from biochemlabsolutions.com and PiMS (http://pims.structuralbiology.eu). Google docs was also suggested as an option. ConturELN - It was mentioned that there is no client for MacOSX for ConturELN, but there it going to be a web version available very soon that will correct for this problem. - Contur was stated to be simple to use, and not too sophisticated. - Contur is primarily cloud based, so the data is not stored locally. I believe there is a server option available, however it appears to be significantly more expensive. - Cost for the cloud based platform is 10$/user/month. Labguru - from Chen Guttman cloud-based ELN and laboratory management solution. This tool encompass the management of experiment and projects, connects between experiments and individual samples, manages the different storage facilities down to the single tube and inter-connects the knowledge base of your labs (protocol, articles) to every experiment/project - free accounts are available but lack the sharing capabilities offered by the lab platform, which costs 12$/user/month. ELN from biochemlabsolutions.com - data is stored on your own servers - free license - I tried this software in our lab and had two other test it as well and we all found it hard to use. There are also some annoying bugs so we have already scratched it from our list of potential platforms. PiMS - from the website description: PiMS has features to support work on ORF Targets and Complexes, including primer design, cloning, expression and protein purification. PiMS records data for Targets, Constructs, Samples and Experiments. Customized workflows are created with Protocols -configurable, reusable Experiment templates. Anastassis Perrakis sat on a committee two years ago to select an ELN for the NKI. Here is a link to his reponse in full as I believe it is worth reading for those considering a move to an ELN system: https://www.jiscmail.ac.uk/cgi-bin/webadmin?A2=ind1201L=ccp4bbD=0P=201318 Seiji On Mon, 16 Jan 2012 16:28:35 -0500 Seiji Sugiman-Marangos sugim...@mcmaster.ca wrote: Hi, off-topic question regarding electronic laboratory notebooks. Our lab is planning on moving from paper to digital record keeping and I was wondering which of the available ELN platforms are being used by the ccp4 community. We are primarily a crystallography lab but we would also need some versatility in the platform as some of our lab members are more focused on biochemistry. Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated! Thanks, Seiji
Re: [ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs
Hi - Here at the NKI, we had formed a committee to look at ELN solution two years ago. We had interviewed three vendors, and run two tests with twenty users. A brief description of the outcome: 1. None of the twenty test-users was satisfied with any of the two solutions - and each was annoyed for a different reason. 2. If that would work at all, better be prepared to dedicate one person for technical support (unless security considerations allow you to have cloud-based usage or remote hosting) and another person for scientific support (making templates for experiments - else in a year you would have 37 templates for how to run a gel filtration column). I would add, that for the whole thing to work at all you need an IT department that are really good and collaborative, and especially for cloud-based solutions you need a fast network. My personal conclusion - and not that of the NKI which continues to be dedicated to implementing an ELN solution may I clarify - was that I have wasted enough time, and I quit from the committee before Christmas. And, with no offense as well to my friends in the PiMS project, besides spending time and resources on that between 2004-2008, I also do not think that this is a solution for small lab like mine - admittedly it works well for bigger and better organized labs. Sorry for the negative vibes. A. On Jan 16, 2012, at 22:28, Seiji Sugiman-Marangos wrote: Hi, off-topic question regarding electronic laboratory notebooks. Our lab is planning on moving from paper to digital record keeping and I was wondering which of the available ELN platforms are being used by the ccp4 community. We are primarily a crystallography lab but we would also need some versatility in the platform as some of our lab members are more focused on biochemistry. Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated! Thanks, Seiji P please don't print this e-mail unless you really need to Anastassis (Tassos) Perrakis, Principal Investigator / Staff Member Department of Biochemistry (B8) Netherlands Cancer Institute, Dept. B8, 1066 CX Amsterdam, The Netherlands Tel: +31 20 512 1951 Fax: +31 20 512 1954 Mobile / SMS: +31 6 28 597791
Re: [ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs
On Jan 18, 2012, at 6:17 AM, Anastassis Perrakis wrote: Here at the NKI, we had formed a committee to look at ELN solution two years ago. We had interviewed three vendors, and run two tests with twenty users. A brief description of the outcome: 1. None of the twenty test-users was satisfied with any of the two solutions - and each was annoyed for a different reason. Would you mind elaborating on any of the reasons that resonated most with you? Are these ELNs simply over-engineered? You mention the requirement to make experiment templates. This sounds cumbersome and a potential for duplicated effort. Do ELNs generally require templates or other overhead in the form of end-user effort? James
Re: [ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs
PiMS (Protein information Management System) is free for installation for academic use, and available at no extra charge to CCP4 licencees. There is also a hosted PiMS service provided by Instruct for all European academics. Here is the description of PiMS, from http://pims.structuralbiology.eu/ : PiMS is a Laboratory Information Management System (LIMS) developed to support the unpredictable workflows of Molecular biology and Protein production labs of all sizes. PiMS has features to support work on ORF Targets and Complexes, including primer design, cloning, expression and protein purification. PiMS records data for Targets, Constructs, Samples and Experiments. Customized workflows are created with Protocols -configurable, reusable Experiment templates. PiMS supports multi-site collaborations. PiMS is accessed through a web browser, requiring no installation on the individual user's computers. Chris Morris chris.mor...@stfc.ac.uk Tel: +44 (0)1925 603689 Fax: +44 (0)1925 603634 Mobile: 07921-717915 Skype: chrishgmorris http://pims.structuralbiology.eu/ http://www.citeulike.org/blog/chrishmorris Daresbury Lab, Daresbury, Warrington, UK, WA4 4AD
Re: [ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs
We use ConturELN. No complaints. cheers charlie -Original Message- From: CCP4 bulletin board [mailto:CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK] On Behalf Of Seiji Sugiman-Marangos Sent: 16 January 2012 21:29 To: CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK Subject: [ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs Hi, off-topic question regarding electronic laboratory notebooks. Our lab is planning on moving from paper to digital record keeping and I was wondering which of the available ELN platforms are being used by the ccp4 community. We are primarily a crystallography lab but we would also need some versatility in the platform as some of our lab members are more focused on biochemistry. Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated! Thanks, Seiji
Re: [ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs
Hi, we use ConturELN. It is quite simple to use, but not very sophisticated. The disadvantage is, there is no client for mac osx, so you have to use a terminal server or run Windows on your mac. Cheers Florian Am 16.01.2012 um 22:28 schrieb Seiji Sugiman-Marangos: Hi, off-topic question regarding electronic laboratory notebooks. Our lab is planning on moving from paper to digital record keeping and I was wondering which of the available ELN platforms are being used by the ccp4 community. We are primarily a crystallography lab but we would also need some versatility in the platform as some of our lab members are more focused on biochemistry. Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated! Thanks, Seiji - Dr. Florian Brückner Biomolecular Research Laboratory OFLG/102 Paul Scherrer Institut CH-5232 Villigen PSI Switzerland Tel.: +41-(0)56-310-2332 Email: florian.brueck...@psi.ch
Re: [ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs
I believe that there is a web version in the next release that will solve this Mac access problem. We are also using Contur ELN across chemistry, biology and structural biology. Cheers Ian From: CCP4 bulletin board [mailto:CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK] On Behalf Of Florian Brückner Sent: 17 January 2012 16:39 To: CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK Subject: Re: [ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs Hi, we use ConturELN. It is quite simple to use, but not very sophisticated. The disadvantage is, there is no client for mac osx, so you have to use a terminal server or run Windows on your mac. Cheers Florian Am 16.01.2012 um 22:28 schrieb Seiji Sugiman-Marangos: Hi, off-topic question regarding electronic laboratory notebooks. Our lab is planning on moving from paper to digital record keeping and I was wondering which of the available ELN platforms are being used by the ccp4 community. We are primarily a crystallography lab but we would also need some versatility in the platform as some of our lab members are more focused on biochemistry. Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated! Thanks, Seiji - Dr. Florian Brückner Biomolecular Research Laboratory OFLG/102 Paul Scherrer Institut CH-5232 Villigen PSI Switzerland Tel.:+41-(0)56-310-2332 Email: florian.brueck...@psi.ch Evotec (UK) Ltd is a limited company registered in England and Wales. Registration number:2674265. Registered office: 114 Milton Park, Abingdon, Oxfordshire, OX14 4SA, United Kingdom.
Re: [ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs
Thanks for the responses so far everyone. For those that have already replied, did you or your lab try out any other ELNs before deciding on the one that you are currently using? Any feedback on platforms that may not have integrated well into your lab environment? Why did you end up choosing the one that you did? At the end of the week I'm planning on putting together a summary of this discussion. Thanks! Seiji On Mon, 16 Jan 2012 16:28:35 -0500 Seiji Sugiman-Marangos sugim...@mcmaster.ca wrote: Hi, off-topic question regarding electronic laboratory notebooks. Our lab is planning on moving from paper to digital record keeping and I was wondering which of the available ELN platforms are being used by the ccp4 community. We are primarily a crystallography lab but we would also need some versatility in the platform as some of our lab members are more focused on biochemistry. Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated! Thanks, Seiji
[ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs
Hi, off-topic question regarding electronic laboratory notebooks. Our lab is planning on moving from paper to digital record keeping and I was wondering which of the available ELN platforms are being used by the ccp4 community. We are primarily a crystallography lab but we would also need some versatility in the platform as some of our lab members are more focused on biochemistry. Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated! Thanks, Seiji
Re: [ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs
Hi, off-topic question regarding electronic laboratory notebooks. Our lab is planning on moving from paper to digital record keeping and I was wondering which of the available ELN platforms are being used by the ccp4 community. We are primarily a crystallography lab but we would also need some versatility in the platform as some of our lab members are more focused on biochemistry. Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated! For an out of the box solution, you may want to take a look at Labguru ( http://www.labguru.com ). If you are looking for a 'free' alternative would consider using google sites ( https://sites.google.com/ ) to roll your own solution. I hope that helps. Take Care, Sean Seaver P212121 http://store.p212121.com/
Re: [ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs
My lab uses http://biochemlabsolutions.com/ELN/ELN.html Best, Alexei. On 1/16/2012 5:03 PM, Sean Seaver wrote: Hi, off-topic question regarding electronic laboratory notebooks. Our lab is planning on moving from paper to digital record keeping and I was wondering which of the available ELN platforms are being used by the ccp4 community. We are primarily a crystallography lab but we would also need some versatility in the platform as some of our lab members are more focused on biochemistry. Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated! For an out of the box solution, you may want to take a look at Labguru ( http://www.labguru.com ). If you are looking for a 'free' alternative would consider using google sites ( https://sites.google.com/ ) to roll your own solution. I hope that helps. Take Care, Sean Seaver P212121 http://store.p212121.com/
Re: [ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs
Hi Seiji, A nice web base solution is the iLabber from Contur. It has been a popular option for many academic labs around the globe. http://www.contur.com/home/ Cheers, Francisco Sr. Product Manager Accelrys, Inc. -Original Message- From: CCP4 bulletin board [mailto:CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK] On Behalf Of Seiji Sugiman-Marangos Sent: Monday, January 16, 2012 1:29 PM To: CCP4BB@JISCMAIL.AC.UK Subject: [ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs Hi, off-topic question regarding electronic laboratory notebooks. Our lab is planning on moving from paper to digital record keeping and I was wondering which of the available ELN platforms are being used by the ccp4 community. We are primarily a crystallography lab but we would also need some versatility in the platform as some of our lab members are more focused on biochemistry. Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated! Thanks, Seiji
Re: [ccp4bb] Off-topic: ELNs
Hi Seiji, I would recommend Labguru (www.labguru.com) which is cloud-based ELN and laboratory management solution. This tool encompass the management of experiment and projects, connects between experiments and individual samples, manages the different storage facilities down to the single tube and inter-connects the knowledge base of your labs (protocol, articles) to every experiment/project. There are both free accounts (for individual students in the lab) or paid accounts for whole lab solutions, which take use of labguru's sharing capabilities among users. The system comes with a fast and reliable human support. Take care, Chen --- Chen Guttman The Zarivach laboratory for Macromolecular Crystallography Building 39, Room 009B Ben-Gurion University of the Negev POBox 653 Zip Code 84105 Beer-Sheva Israel http://lifeserv.bgu.ac.il/wb/zarivach Tel. +972-8-6479519 Fax. +972-8-6472970 On Mon, Jan 16, 2012 at 23:28, Seiji Sugiman-Marangos sugim...@mcmaster.cawrote: Hi, off-topic question regarding electronic laboratory notebooks. Our lab is planning on moving from paper to digital record keeping and I was wondering which of the available ELN platforms are being used by the ccp4 community. We are primarily a crystallography lab but we would also need some versatility in the platform as some of our lab members are more focused on biochemistry. Any suggestions or comments would be greatly appreciated! Thanks, Seiji
