[cctalk] Re: Recordak Magnaprint Microfiche Printer Free

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

SMECC had similar but never  got much microfilm so were sent to  historical 
society  to use on Reels  of news paper microfilm. Heh cleared  a bit counter 
space  30 years ago!---'the liquid was same as the old wet type copiers used. 
Is this pr the paper media available  still?  Not sure... but not many exist 
anymore.The one in that brochure is the classic model and that brand is an 
innovator. 
Ours was a generic looking thing and no where classy as the brochure model. And 
that  company was THE innovator I think of that tech 
YEA  FIND  SOME WHERE TO SAVE IT!
Ed#    SMECC

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Tue, May 7, 2024 at 1:46 PM, Don via cctalk wrote:  
 Hello all,

I have a Recordak Magnaprint microfiche printer/reader. It appears to be in
decent cosmetic condition but I am not sure if it works or if it is
complete. This thing used photosensitized paper and some kind of developer
to make positive copies of microfiche reels or sheets.

https://archive.org/details/TNM_Recordak_Magnaprint_Reader_microfilm_reader-p_20171102_0036

I don't have space to keep this thing, but I would like to save it from
being scrapped if possible. Free for pickup near Buffalo, NY. Contact me if
interested!

Don
  

[cctalk] Re: Altair 8800 50th birthday...

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

How well I had to remember the early deadline before the date something was 
really going to be hit the streets I did photography work for magazines and 
yeah you had to have it in early just because it was going to be a December 
issue I bet you had to have stuff in there generally several months ahead of 
time are you lost out some editors wanted stuff even earlier just depended on 
how they were and what they were doing and what schedule they were working on 
and what their time frames were but yeah I think we all nailed it down on that 
date then thanks everybody for chipping in on the information!

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Mon, May 6, 2024 at 10:19 PM, Smith, Wayne via 
cctalk wrote:   "November 19, 1974" is what is written 
on the "Date of Publication of This Issue" line in Copyright "Form B" (for 
periodicals) used at the time.  The form then states "The copyright law defines 
the 'date of publication' as '. . . the earliest date when copies . . . were 
placed on sale, sold or publicly distributed."  The form is then signed 
pursuant to 17 U.S.C. sec. 506(e), which provided for a substantial fine in the 
event that any false representation was made on the form.

There is no reason to doubt the date of publication in the notice.  In fact, 
there is every reason to believe it is correct.  In the magazine business it is 
a routine business practice to have actual publication occur months prior to 
the "cover date" the publisher places on the magazine.  The reason for this is 
so that the magazines could remain on the newsstands for at least a few months 
without appearing to be stale.  This is particularly the case with magazines 
published on a monthly cadence.

Just as a check, I looked up the publication date of the January 1975 issue of 
Playboy.  According to the copyright registration, it was November 20, 1974.

> Date: Mon, 6 May 2024 01:27:28 + (UTC)
> From: ED SHARPE 
> Subject: [cctalk] Re: Altair 8800 50th birthday...
> To:    "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts"
>     
> Cc: Sellam Abraham 
> Message-ID: <1726519925.3966543.1714958848...@mail.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
> 
> Perhaps After doing the layout work in the November  it was perhaps
> copyrighted Immediately during layout But it did not ship Until January
> Think!  back in those days things did not instantly happen and we're instantly
> shipped Ed#
> 
> Sent from AOL on Android
> 
>  On Fri, May 3, 2024 at 7:09 AM, Sellam Abraham via
> cctalk wrote:  On Fri, May 3, 2024, 1:28 AM Smith,
> Wayne via cctalk 
> wrote:
> 
> > I looked up the Jan. 1975 issue of Popular Electronics in the
> > Copyright Office's Periodicals Digest.  It was published on Nov. 19,
> > 1974 if you are looking for an actual anniversary date.
> >
> 
> The January issue was certainly not available in November of 1974.
> 
> When did it actually get sent out and start showing up in people's mailboxes?
> 
> Sellam
> 
  

[cctalk] Re: Altair 8800 50th birthday...

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Perhaps After doing the layout work in the November  it was perhaps copyrighted 
Immediately during layout But it did not ship Until January Think!  back in 
those days things did not instantly happen and we're instantly shipped 
Ed#

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Fri, May 3, 2024 at 7:09 AM, Sellam Abraham via 
cctalk wrote:   On Fri, May 3, 2024, 1:28 AM Smith, 
Wayne via cctalk 
wrote:

> I looked up the Jan. 1975 issue of Popular Electronics in the Copyright
> Office's Periodicals Digest.  It was published on Nov. 19, 1974 if you are
> looking for an actual anniversary date.
>

The January issue was certainly not available in November of 1974.

When did it actually get sent out and start showing up in people's
mailboxes?

Sellam

>
  

[cctalk] Re: BASIC

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Then there  was Phantasm for basic  Gavin wrote!

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Wed, May 1, 2024 at 8:44 PM, Gavin Scott via cctalk 
wrote:   BASIC was always a popular language in the Hewlett-Packard world. From
the HP 2000 timesharing BASIC that was popular in educational settings
similar to the original DTSS, To BASIC/3000 on the HP 3000 which was a
first-class language with both interpreter and compiler (producing
very fast code), to the HP 250/260 which used BASIC as their primary
development language, Rocky Mountain BASIC in the technical world, the
Series 80 microcomputers, HP Business Basic again on the 3000 which
was probably largest and most complex language system ever created for
the Classic 16-bit 3000 systems and which was intended to be both a
migration path for 250/260 applications to MPE and to be a new
standard Basic across multiple HP platforms.

From 1980-1986 or so I worked for an HP OEM / ISV whose "ERP" (we
didn't call them that yet) package was written in BASIC on the HP
3000. It was limited to Letter-digit variable names but was quite
performant and had its own API into the IMAGE DBMS etc.

BASIC got used for lots of "serious" development.
  

[cctalk] Re: Bomar 901b My wife found in my stuff. Is this as scarce at it seems?s,?

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

I bought mine 30 years ago at garage sake. For 50 cents

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 4:38 AM, Adrian Godwin wrote:   
901B is the first pocket calculator I remember - I don't know if there were 
earlier ones. I don't think they're exactly rare but later ones such as MX10 
are certainly easier to find. They're often in the same case as a 901B but with 
slightly enhanced functionality such as 10 digits. % key etc.

On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 12:31 PM ED SHARPE via cctalk  
wrote:

Yes. Cell phone horrible typing
The Consumer Electronics Hall of Fame: Bowmar 901B
Ok can not find b pricevonly c and d

Sent from AOL on Android 

  On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 3:41 AM, Will Cooke via cctalk 
wrote:   I think he means Bowmar
https://spectrum.ieee.org/the-consumer-electronics-hall-of-fame-bowmar-901b



> On 04/16/2024 5:34 AM CDT ED SHARPE via cctalk  wrote:
>
>
> No bomar brand
>
> Sent from AOL on Android
>
> On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 7:15 PM, Wayne S wrote: 
> Bomar as in the Bomber Aircraft?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Apr 15, 2024, at 19:04, ED SHARPE via cctalk  
> > wrote:
> >
> > Bomar 901b My wife found in my stuff. Is this as scarce at it seems?s,?
> >
> >
> > Sent from AOL on Android

Grownups never understand anything by themselves and it is tiresome for 
children to be always and forever explaining things to them,

Antoine de Saint-Exupery in The Little Prince


  

[cctalk] Re: Bomar 901b My wife found in my stuff. Is this as scarce at it seems?s,?

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Some one got a deal on a non-working. Sunday 12 orv23 bucks

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 4:38 AM, Adrian Godwin wrote:   
901B is the first pocket calculator I remember - I don't know if there were 
earlier ones. I don't think they're exactly rare but later ones such as MX10 
are certainly easier to find. They're often in the same case as a 901B but with 
slightly enhanced functionality such as 10 digits. % key etc.

On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 12:31 PM ED SHARPE via cctalk  
wrote:

Yes. Cell phone horrible typing
The Consumer Electronics Hall of Fame: Bowmar 901B
Ok can not find b pricevonly c and d

Sent from AOL on Android 

  On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 3:41 AM, Will Cooke via cctalk 
wrote:   I think he means Bowmar
https://spectrum.ieee.org/the-consumer-electronics-hall-of-fame-bowmar-901b



> On 04/16/2024 5:34 AM CDT ED SHARPE via cctalk  wrote:
>
>
> No bomar brand
>
> Sent from AOL on Android
>
> On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 7:15 PM, Wayne S wrote: 
> Bomar as in the Bomber Aircraft?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Apr 15, 2024, at 19:04, ED SHARPE via cctalk  
> > wrote:
> >
> > Bomar 901b My wife found in my stuff. Is this as scarce at it seems?s,?
> >
> >
> > Sent from AOL on Android

Grownups never understand anything by themselves and it is tiresome for 
children to be always and forever explaining things to them,

Antoine de Saint-Exupery in The Little Prince


  

[cctalk] Re: Bomar 901b My wife found in my stuff. Is this as scarce at it seems?s,?

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Yes. Cell phone horrible typing
The Consumer Electronics Hall of Fame: Bowmar 901B
Ok can not find b pricevonly c and d

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Tue, Apr 16, 2024 at 3:41 AM, Will Cooke via cctalk 
wrote:   I think he means Bowmar
https://spectrum.ieee.org/the-consumer-electronics-hall-of-fame-bowmar-901b



> On 04/16/2024 5:34 AM CDT ED SHARPE via cctalk  wrote:
>
>
> No bomar brand
>
> Sent from AOL on Android
>
> On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 7:15 PM, Wayne S wrote: 
> Bomar as in the Bomber Aircraft?
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Apr 15, 2024, at 19:04, ED SHARPE via cctalk  
> > wrote:
> >
> > Bomar 901b My wife found in my stuff. Is this as scarce at it seems?s,?
> >
> >
> > Sent from AOL on Android

Grownups never understand anything by themselves and it is tiresome for 
children to be always and forever explaining things to them,

Antoine de Saint-Exupery in The Little Prince
  

[cctalk] Re: Bomar 901b My wife found in my stuff. Is this as scarce at it seems?s,?

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

No bomar brand

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 7:15 PM, Wayne S wrote:   
Bomar as in the Bomber Aircraft?

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 15, 2024, at 19:04, ED SHARPE via cctalk  wrote:
> 
> Bomar 901b My wife  found  in my stuff. Is this as scarce  at it seems?s,?
> 
> 
> Sent from AOL on Android
  

[cctalk] Bomar 901b My wife found in my stuff. Is this as scarce at it seems?s,?

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Bomar 901b My wife  found  in my stuff. Is this as scarce  at it seems?s,?


Sent from AOL on Android

[cctalk] Re: IBM 360

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

A 360 front panel sold for over $4,000 I think much more on eBay recently I 
can't believe it I cannot believe it

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Tue, Apr 9, 2024 at 11:46 PM, Adrian Godwin via 
cctalk wrote:   And the 'tarpit' book is 50, dated by 
the preface.

On Wed, Apr 10, 2024 at 6:22 AM Chuck Guzis via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> On 4/9/24 22:03, ben via cctalk wrote:
> > On 2024-04-09 8:53 p.m., Murray McCullough via cctalk wrote:
> >> I had not realized the IBM 360 was 60 yrs. old this month. I worked on
> >> such
> >> a computer in the late 60s in Toronto. What one could do with 8 Kbytes
> of
> >> ram was remarkable!
> >>
> >> Happy computing
> >>
> >> Murray 
> > Real time sharing, not a 16K PDP 8?
>
> What model of a 360?  8K sounds a lot like a Model 20, which the purists
> may not consider to be a "real" member of the family.
>
>  --Chuck
>
>
>
  

[cctalk] FASTBACK Help how to recover files stored in this backup format,?

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

FASTBACK bak up ptogrsm...Help how to recover files stored in this backup 
format,?
Back when the museum was next to computer exchange  Inc. Pre '94. We put out a 
journal once a year Over 100 pages tightly leaded would like to access files 
and reprint. Would need Pagemaker 3 orveoukd data files be upward compatible 
with indesign by adob?
Thanks Ed Sharpe archivist for SMECC MUSEUM PROJECT Glendale AZ 

Sent from AOL on Android

[cctalk] Re: Intel 4004(sp?)

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

great old "Scelbi 8008 "  article in killobaud or  Byte  in one  if the  EARLY 
Issues!
Ed#
In a message dated 11/25/2023 7:34:21 AM US Mountain Standard Time, 
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes: 
Sorry if not linked correctly - looking through the list via the 
archives.."reply" option doesn't seem to work (at least for me - older Chrome) 
>but my understanding was that the 4004 and 8008 were effectively developed>at 
the same time?  And were announced or available about within one month>of each 
other? I believe they were, although I never had much experience with the 
4004...I did play a bit with the 8008 - and wrote a simulator/emulator for 
the8008 system I had, a Canadian: MIL (Microsystems International Limited) MOD8 
(Modular-8) it was also available as: GNC8 (Great Northern Computers) 8008 You 
can get MOD8 simulator from "Daves Old Computers" and actuallyexperienceusing 
an 8008 based system including the built in "MONITOR-8" ROM softwareaswell as 
"Scelbi 8008 BASIC" (one of the earliest) - source to bothprovided. If you care 
to, I included ASM88 (my 8008 cross assembler) so you can trywriting and 
running 8008 code! -Be aware that MOD8.COM itself is pretty old and is 16-bit 
DOS software.This means it WON'T run under modern Windows, but it does work 
well inDosBox (I recommend the one I have on my site) Dave Dunfield  -  
https://dunfield.themindfactory.com -- 
--Search
 "Dave's Old Computers" see "my personal" at bottom!

[cctalk] Re: Intel 4004

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Nippon Calculating
> Machine Co., they agreed that they would take a crack at taking the design
> that NCM had developed and work on partitioning it in a way that would work
> with chip complexity constraints and packaging, and see if they could come
> up with a chipset that they could get AMI to fabricate.  Computer Design
> Corp. already had the knowledge to do this from their own internal project
> to develop their own chipset.
>
> It isn't known exactly what kind of agreement was forged, and if up-front
> money was put up by NCM, but it is known that NCM put a firm deadline in
> place stating that a calculator using the chipset would have to be
> delivered in person to NCM headquarters and a presentation and demo of the
> machine made to NCM executives and engineers.
>
> Work began immediately on taking the NCM logic design and turning it into
> a batch of chips, which, by initial estimate was going to require 19 chips,
> and that was assuming higher levels of integration that were only being
> perfected by AMI at the time.
>
> As the NCM delegation was preparing to return to Japan with their hopes
> dashed of making an agreement directly with a chipmaker, a call was
> received from a fledgling chip manufacturing company that they had briefly
> visited when they were in the Santa Clara, CA. area.
>
> The company specialized in making memory chips, though, and it was
> initially thought that the huge amount of random logic that was involved in
> the NCM calculator chipset design was beyond the capabilities of this
> company.
>
> Memory devices are just repetitions of the same memory cell pattern over
> and over on the chip to make a memory array, with additional logic to do
> the address decoding and read/write (for RAM) or read(for ROM) circuitry
> and I/O buffers.  This type of chip design has some aspects that allow a
> degree of automation to be used in laying out the chips, and also had very
> little in the way of random logic to complicate the chip design.
>
> The NCM calculator design was a whole bunch of random logic...gate upon
> gate, flip-flop upon flip-flop wired together in a rats nest of logic for
> each chip.
>
> After NCM left this fledgling company named Intel, higher-ups at Intel had
> learned of the visit by NCM, and told their underlings to get back in touch
> with NCM and let them know they would see what they could do for NCM.
>
> Intel was cash-hungry at the time, and it was thought that perhaps this
> project could serve double-duty...to bring in some needed cash for Intel's
> production capacity expansion, as well as to perhaps push Intel's IC
> fabrication technology into areas other than RAM and ROM.  Intel was doing
> well with their memory ICs, but they were limited by the number of chips
> they could produce.  Chip manufacturing technology is very expensive, so
> Intel was investing everything they made in enhancing their production
> capabilities.  So, maybe working with NCM might help bring in some funds
> to help that effort.
>
> A deal was forged between Intel and NCM.  A firm deadline was part of the
> contractual language where Intel would have to build a prototype calculator
> based on the chips, and bring it to NCM's headquarters on a specific date
> and present/demonstrate it to NCM executives and engineers.
>
> In the end, the NCM chip design was set aside as it was simply beyond the
> capability to be fabricated by Intel.  Had Intel not had an idea of how to
> effectively do what the massively complex chipset did in a much simpler
> fashion, who knows what the future would have held.
>
> The solution to Intel's problem of abandoning NCM's chipset is what became
> the Intel 4004.  Intel developed and fabricated the 4004 and some support
> chips to make it into a useful controller for a calculator, including some
> shift register ICs for I/O, some combination RAM and I/O chips, as well as
> ROM and I/O chips.  They built a very simple prototype calculator that
> could do integer-only math as their demo, and presented it to NCM.  The
> Busicom 141-PF was the resulting production calculator, arguably the first
> consumer device to use a microprocessor to create its functionality.    The
> rest is history.
>
> There's a piece of the story left hanging, though.
>
> That's a very, very interesting story that will have to wait until I get
> all of my ducks in a row to tell, which I will do on the Old Calculator
> Museum website at some point in the not too distant future.  I'll certainly
> announce it here when it's finalized on up on the website.
>
> Rick Bensene
> The Old Calculator Museum
> https://oldcalculatormuseum.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: ED SHARPE via cctalk [mailto:cctalk@classiccmp.org]
> Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2023 2:00 PM
> To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org>
> Cc: ED SHARPE 
> Subject: [cctalk] Re: Intel 4004
>
> I had heard something about a f14 chip pehS being first but not avail. To
> general  public???Ed#
>
>
> Sent from AOL on Android
>
>  On Tue, Nov 21, 2023 at 2:41 PM, Joshua Rice via cctalk<
> cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> On 21/11/2023 09:03, ED SHARPE via cctalk wrote:
> > So what are the other contenders and what do they bring to table
>
> The 4004 was definitely the first commercially available single-chip CPU
> on the market, but if you include multi-chip LSI designs, the lines get
> blurry.
>
>
  

[cctalk] Re: Intel 4004(sp?)

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

- What were the key differences between the Intelec 4 and  our Intelec 8?
- What are the possible  accessories  for Intelec 8? We have a dual floppy 
cabinet is all.
 Years I saw  an Intel blue colored standalone paper tape punch and reader(we 
would like one!)
Is there a good site that addresses  all and lots about  intelec systems anyone 
can recommend?
Thanks in advance!
Ed Sharpe archivist for SMECC MUSEUM PROJECT Glendale AZ 

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Wed, Nov 22, 2023 at 8:34 PM, dwight via cctalk 
wrote:   The Intlec 4 was no more or less a computer than the Altiar or IMSAI 
was. It didn't typically have as much RAM but one could write and run code on 
it.
As for the F14 processor. For the purpose used, it was likely a DSP. More 
intended to do matrix multiplication using adds and shifts. This would be 
similar to Intel's early try at a DSP.
The F14 processor was said to control the flight surfaces. Like the Intel 2920 
( not to be confused with the AMD bit slice part) it likely ran tight loops of 
signal processing operations using tables of lookup coefficients.
Dwight

  

[cctalk] Re: Intel 4004(sp?)

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Ibad an intellectual 4 offered to me one time that had a 4040 in it. Is t a 
4040 like a 5 but more of the aux chips integrated? Is instruction set the same?

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Wed, Nov 22, 2023 at 8:34 PM, dwight via cctalk 
wrote:   The Intlec 4 was no more or less a computer than the Altiar or IMSAI 
was. It didn't typically have as much RAM but one could write and run code on 
it.
As for the F14 processor. For the purpose used, it was likely a DSP. More 
intended to do matrix multiplication using adds and shifts. This would be 
similar to Intel's early try at a DSP.
The F14 processor was said to control the flight surfaces. Like the Intel 2920 
( not to be confused with the AMD bit slice part) it likely ran tight loops of 
signal processing operations using tables of lookup coefficients.
Dwight

  

[cctalk] Nice 32 dollar goodie to display your 4004 in!

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/276167634394?mkcid=16=1=711-127632-2357-0=J2IlG_4zQZS=4429486=8osaXa5ZQwi=_ver=artemis=MORE
Sent from AOL on Android

[cctalk] Re: Intel 4004(sp?)

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Damn typos  sorry

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Wed, Nov 22, 2023 at 1:51 AM, ED SHARPE via cctalk 
wrote:   Was there ever a COMPUTER using a 4004   that  you  cud  really  do  
something or  did  tat finally arrive with the 8008  as  in the skelby shelby  
sp? 8008 i now there  was an Intel   INTELIC 4 (?sp)    could n that  use 4004  
or one of  the  later 4000 numbered proc. We have an intelec 8 and 8 inch 
floppy  drives here at smecc musem  always  wanted  a 4!Ed#
In a message dated 11/21/2023 11:31:55 AM US Mountain Standard Time, 
dkel...@hotmail.com writes: 
There is little surviving software for the 4004. There are a few places with 
snippets of code to do things like add or subtract several digits but my 
searches of the internet have shown little actual code. The NBS has some code 
to track satellites and correct for time delays from their clocks ( think GPS 
).I'd had a spare 4004 and always wanted to do something with it. I found that 
the library for work done at the Navy Post Graduate School in Monterey 
California had 2 projects that students of Gary Kildall created. One was a load 
calculator for helicopters and the other was for calculating closest point of 
approach for ships. I'd been unsuccessful at down loading the helicopter code 
but was able to down load the ships document.I'd let the listing sit for 10's 
of years while always on the back burner. Over the years I'd acquired the 
needed parts. I did make a few substitutions, though. The original used 13 each 
1702A EPROMs. Since that exceed my budget for a PC board space, I chose the 
option of using a 4289 and a 2732 EPROM. I did use the original designs number 
of 4002s, as using RAM through the 4289 would have made significant changes to 
the software.The problem of the circuit needed to be dealt with. The document 
had a page labelled 'schematic' that turned out to be the keyboard layout and 
display layout( both of which I ignored and used my own layout that I though 
was better ).Before getting to the board design, I needed to get working 
software. The listing was done on a ASR33 with a deeply rutted platen, typical 
of hand-me-down things used by a school's command. Letters like R or P would 
look like F and 0 would look like C. Other letters were easy to figure out but 
still often had their right edge missing.After entering the list by hand, I'd 
feed it into my assembler and the tried to run it with my simulator.I'd make 
corrections as I got the code running.I need to create the circuitry for the 
keyboard decoder, that took 25 buttons to the 4 bit data bus input of the 4004. 
There was enough description in the document to create the LED display but I 
did missed one thing ( that I'll mention later ).I created the board with my 
typical incorrect wiring, requiring several extra cuts and jumpers. ( the 
concept was right but I got the pins of the 7402 mixed up.) The one thing that 
I'd missed was the order of the digit scan. I assumed left to right but the 
code was actually right to left. After so many cuts and jumpers to get the 
keyboard right, I dreaded more to fix the scan order so I made the one change 
to the original software to do right to left ( I still feel bad about that 
change ).I thought I'd talk a little about how a Closest Point of Approach 
Calculation is done. Normally it had been done by a graphical method of line 
drawing on what is called a plotting maneuver board. One used graphical 
calculations for the trig used. It was all done by pencil and parallel. It is 
so important that, I believe, that to this day a ship's pilot still needs to be 
able to do this calculation on a maneuver board, even though such graphical 
displays are capable of doing such, today. Large ships require significant 
knowledge of where they are relative to other fixed and moving objects in order 
to determine the safest path to proceed. A broken display is not time to learn 
how to do such a calculation.This 4004 calculator used a newly found way of 
doing tangent calculations, called the CORDIC method. One could clearly see the 
influence of Gary Kildall's hand in this code. It is noted that he wrote the 
division routine used and the organization of the code clearly shows the 
influence of a seasoned programmer. Bring such code back to life was almost as 
much as making a 4004 processor from discrete transistors but I felt was for me 
as part of my bucket list.Things I needed to do, included writing an assembler, 
writing a simulator, learn a PC board CAD, transcribing a poor quality listing, 
debugging the poorly transcribed listing, creating the keyboard decoder and 
instrumenting my simulator to be the calculator.Dwight   From: ED SHARPE via 
cctalk 
Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2023 1:03 AM
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts 
Cc: ED SHARPE 
Subject: [cctalk] Re: Intel 4004 So what are the other contenders and what do 
they bring to table


Sent from AOL on Android
 
  On Mon, Nov 20, 2023

[cctalk] Re: Intel 4004(sp?)

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Was there ever a COMPUTER using a 4004   that  you  cud  really  do  something 
or  did  tat finally arrive with the 8008  as  in the skelby shelby  sp? 8008 i 
now there  was an Intel   INTELIC 4 (?sp)    could n that  use 4004  or one of  
the  later 4000 numbered proc. We have an intelec 8 and 8 inch floppy  drives 
here at smecc musem  always  wanted  a 4!Ed#
In a message dated 11/21/2023 11:31:55 AM US Mountain Standard Time, 
dkel...@hotmail.com writes: 
There is little surviving software for the 4004. There are a few places with 
snippets of code to do things like add or subtract several digits but my 
searches of the internet have shown little actual code. The NBS has some code 
to track satellites and correct for time delays from their clocks ( think GPS 
).I'd had a spare 4004 and always wanted to do something with it. I found that 
the library for work done at the Navy Post Graduate School in Monterey 
California had 2 projects that students of Gary Kildall created. One was a load 
calculator for helicopters and the other was for calculating closest point of 
approach for ships. I'd been unsuccessful at down loading the helicopter code 
but was able to down load the ships document.I'd let the listing sit for 10's 
of years while always on the back burner. Over the years I'd acquired the 
needed parts. I did make a few substitutions, though. The original used 13 each 
1702A EPROMs. Since that exceed my budget for a PC board space, I chose the 
option of using a 4289 and a 2732 EPROM. I did use the original designs number 
of 4002s, as using RAM through the 4289 would have made significant changes to 
the software.The problem of the circuit needed to be dealt with. The document 
had a page labelled 'schematic' that turned out to be the keyboard layout and 
display layout( both of which I ignored and used my own layout that I though 
was better ).Before getting to the board design, I needed to get working 
software. The listing was done on a ASR33 with a deeply rutted platen, typical 
of hand-me-down things used by a school's command. Letters like R or P would 
look like F and 0 would look like C. Other letters were easy to figure out but 
still often had their right edge missing.After entering the list by hand, I'd 
feed it into my assembler and the tried to run it with my simulator.I'd make 
corrections as I got the code running.I need to create the circuitry for the 
keyboard decoder, that took 25 buttons to the 4 bit data bus input of the 4004. 
There was enough description in the document to create the LED display but I 
did missed one thing ( that I'll mention later ).I created the board with my 
typical incorrect wiring, requiring several extra cuts and jumpers. ( the 
concept was right but I got the pins of the 7402 mixed up.) The one thing that 
I'd missed was the order of the digit scan. I assumed left to right but the 
code was actually right to left. After so many cuts and jumpers to get the 
keyboard right, I dreaded more to fix the scan order so I made the one change 
to the original software to do right to left ( I still feel bad about that 
change ).I thought I'd talk a little about how a Closest Point of Approach 
Calculation is done. Normally it had been done by a graphical method of line 
drawing on what is called a plotting maneuver board. One used graphical 
calculations for the trig used. It was all done by pencil and parallel. It is 
so important that, I believe, that to this day a ship's pilot still needs to be 
able to do this calculation on a maneuver board, even though such graphical 
displays are capable of doing such, today. Large ships require significant 
knowledge of where they are relative to other fixed and moving objects in order 
to determine the safest path to proceed. A broken display is not time to learn 
how to do such a calculation.This 4004 calculator used a newly found way of 
doing tangent calculations, called the CORDIC method. One could clearly see the 
influence of Gary Kildall's hand in this code. It is noted that he wrote the 
division routine used and the organization of the code clearly shows the 
influence of a seasoned programmer. Bring such code back to life was almost as 
much as making a 4004 processor from discrete transistors but I felt was for me 
as part of my bucket list.Things I needed to do, included writing an assembler, 
writing a simulator, learn a PC board CAD, transcribing a poor quality listing, 
debugging the poorly transcribed listing, creating the keyboard decoder and 
instrumenting my simulator to be the calculator.Dwight   From: ED SHARPE via 
cctalk 
Sent: Tuesday, November 21, 2023 1:03 AM
To: General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts 
Cc: ED SHARPE 
Subject: [cctalk] Re: Intel 4004 So what are the other contenders and what do 
they bring to table


Sent from AOL on Android
 
  On Mon, Nov 20, 2023 at 9:06 PM, Adrian Stoness via 
cctalk wrote:   someone should build it in minecrsft

On Mon, Nov 20, 2023 at 7:01

[cctalk] Re: Intel 4004

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

 what  about that intel 3000 bit slice  thing is  it almost  a microprocessor   
yes  no  and   why?  Ed#
In a message dated 11/21/2023 3:34:03 PM US Mountain Standard Time, 
c.murray.mccullo...@gmail.com writes: 

There are 5 other possibilities for the honour:e  or  noe  and why?

No. 2:

  Texas Instruments applied for a “computing systems CPU” in 1971 and awarded a 
patent in 1973. The question though is: did TI have a functioning processor 
based on the TMS1000. Not sure if they did!

No. 3:

“In 1969 Four-Phase Systems built the 24-bit AL1, which used multiple chips 
segmented into 8-bit hunks, not unlike a bit-slice processor. In a patent 
dispute a quarter century later proof was presented that one could implement a 
complete 8-bit microprocessor using just one of these chips. The battle was 
settled out of court, which did not settle the issue of the first micro.”


No. 4:

 Is this the first microprocessor?

 

Here is a source: 

https://historydraft.com/story/microprocessor/pico-electronics-and-general-instrument-gi-introduced-their-first-collaboration-in-ics/425/6329

No. 5:

 

"In 1969 Four-Phase Systems built the 24-bit AL1, which used multiple chips 
segmented into 8-bit hunks, not unlike a bit-slice processor. In a patent 
dispute a quarter century later proof was presented that one could implement a 
complete 8-bit microprocessor using just one of these chips. The battle was 
settled out of court, which did not settle the issue of the first micro." 


It seems the answer depends on what is a microprocessor...I suppose when it 
comes down to capitalism patents count more than anything else!

Happy computing,

Murray    


 

 

On Tue, Nov 21, 2023 at 5:00 PM ED SHARPE via cctalk  
wrote:
I had heard something about a f14 chip pehS being first but not avail. To 
general  public???Ed#


Sent from AOL on Android 

  On Tue, Nov 21, 2023 at 2:41 PM, Joshua Rice via 
cctalk wrote:   
On 21/11/2023 09:03, ED SHARPE via cctalk wrote:
> So what are the other contenders and what do they bring to table

The 4004 was definitely the first commercially available single-chip CPU 
on the market, but if you include multi-chip LSI designs, the lines get 
blurry.

[cctalk] Re: Intel 4004

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

I had heard something about a f14 chip pehS being first but not avail. To 
general  public???Ed#


Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Tue, Nov 21, 2023 at 2:41 PM, Joshua Rice via 
cctalk wrote:   
On 21/11/2023 09:03, ED SHARPE via cctalk wrote:
> So what are the other contenders and what do they bring to table

The 4004 was definitely the first commercially available single-chip CPU 
on the market, but if you include multi-chip LSI designs, the lines get 
blurry.
  

[cctalk] Re: Intel 4004

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

So what are the other contenders and what do they bring to table


Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Mon, Nov 20, 2023 at 9:06 PM, Adrian Stoness via 
cctalk wrote:   someone should build it in minecrsft

On Mon, Nov 20, 2023 at 7:01 PM ben via cctalk 
wrote:

> On 2023-11-20 5:36 p.m., Murray McCullough via cctalk wrote:
> > On Nov. 15, 1971 Intel commercially released the 4004 microprocessor
> which
> > some consider to be the first. Nonetheless, even if not in agreement, it
> > made possible the instrument which drives the classic-computing industry
> or
> > at the very least our hobby!
> >
> > Happy computing.
> >
> > Murray 
>
>
> https://retrocomputingforum.com/t/swiss-physicist-builds-complete-intel-4004-computer-out-of-smd-transistors/3738
> THE DIY VERSION
>
>
  

[cctalk] Fw: Re: 11/15, 11/20 systems and parts, more

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
   - Forwarded Message - From: "ED SHARPE"  To: 
"lini...@portsmon.org" , "Ed Sharpe"  
Cc: "Mark Linimon"  Sent: Thu, Oct 19, 2023 at 8:29 PM 
Subject: Re: [cctalk] Re: 11/15, 11/20 systems and parts, more  I have one pdp 
11/20  aith procesdor abd  ore untested in the garage have not taken  for 
display at our museum. If you had something we likedre it could be yours
Want hp 3000 series 2 or 3
Hp 2883 or 2884 disc or 2888 disc  (plus some other stuff)
A nice large early stash of historic semiconductors 
Early wireless( as in radio no routers!)  
Anything related to mccarty wireless telephone of San Francisco 
Related things to Francis or Ignatius mccarty
ERly DeForest  radio equipment.
Exotic hp computers 
There us a few areas
Nike missile  Related hardware etc
Thanks ed sharpe archivist f or smecc museum


Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Thu, Oct 19, 2023 at 5:02 PM, Mark Linimon via 
cctalk wrote:   I sincerely doubt I could afford a 
PDP-11/20 but I still have nostalgia for the first machine I used at 
university.  So I have to ask.

mcl
  
  

[cctalk] Re: Teletypes for sale

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

We would  love the asr 35sWHAT SHAPE ARE THEY IN?
Alas smecc museum is in AZWonder how we could manage this?Ed Sharpe archivist 
for SMECC museum.

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Thu, Sep 28, 2023 at 7:17 PM, Mike Katz via cctalk 
wrote:   
Hey folks. I need to re-home a bunch of cool old Teletype Corporation 
machines. Working condition unknown, and also have some spare parts. I 
am not out to make a mint, so make offer! They seem mostly complete, in 
varying condition. Some are nicer than others. They all worked when 
stored (years ago) The following need to find new homes:
TT Model 28 ASR (3 of these)
TT Model 28 KSR (2 of these)
TT Model 28 RO (2 of these)
Extra Model 28 Parts
TT Model 28 Floor Standing Paper Punch
TT Model 32 Baudot
TT Model 35 KSR (heavy duty version of the ASR-33)
TT Model 35 ASR (Floor stand heavy duty, 2 of these, one Telex)
TT Model 40 Dataspeed
Teletype manuals and documentation for each model
Tell your friends! Delivery is possible. I can assist with loading. 
Message me for details. Located in the Midwest (Missouri)

https://www.facebook.com/groups/vintagecomputerclub/permalink/7307144265985543/

  

[cctalk] Re: ICL / Digico

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

I urge folks to contribute $$  to internet archive... The archive and way back 
machine is a great asset.Ed#        SMECC

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Mon, Jul 24, 2023 at 4:55 AM, KenUnix wrote:   
Thanks ED.
Some quite amazing pictures.

On Mon, Jul 24, 2023 at 3:16 AM ED SHARPE via cctalk  
wrote:

Maybe checkout internet archive various date versions of thier site???Ed#   
SMECC

Sent from AOL on Android 

  On Mon, Jul 24, 2023 at 12:12 AM, Christian Corti via 
cctalk wrote:   So, I was trying to contact "Pete" at 
vintage-icl-computers.com several 
times during the last years. Obiously, the site and/or the person is dead, 
no reaction whatever.
I'm hoping that someone on this list might be able to help me:
I still have a Digico Micro 16V computer that, one day, I'd like to 
restore. On the ICL site above I can see that they have (had?) the service 
manual/schematics for the system, and I would really love to get a scan 
(or at least high resolution photos) of these. Does anyone here maybe have 
them or can provide me with some pointers? Oh BTW, software (e.g. 
papertape images) would be great, too :-)

Christian




-- 
End of lineJOB TERMINATED -->> Okey Dokey, OK Boss


  

[cctalk] Re: ICL / Digico

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Maybe checkout internet archive various date versions of thier site???Ed#   
SMECC

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Mon, Jul 24, 2023 at 12:12 AM, Christian Corti via 
cctalk wrote:   So, I was trying to contact "Pete" at 
vintage-icl-computers.com several 
times during the last years. Obiously, the site and/or the person is dead, 
no reaction whatever.
I'm hoping that someone on this list might be able to help me:
I still have a Digico Micro 16V computer that, one day, I'd like to 
restore. On the ICL site above I can see that they have (had?) the service 
manual/schematics for the system, and I would really love to get a scan 
(or at least high resolution photos) of these. Does anyone here maybe have 
them or can provide me with some pointers? Oh BTW, software (e.g. 
papertape images) would be great, too :-)

Christian
  

[cctalk] Re: Did Bill Gates Really Say That?

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Weird but I even seem to remember someone saying "who woukd been more than 64k"
Ed#     SMECC

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Fri, Jun 16, 2023 at 12:43 AM, Steve Lewis via 
cctalk wrote:   I don't think Gates ever actually said 
this - but that's just based on my
own examination into this from a few years back.

But, over the years I've done some thread programming, and I was once
solving a problem by loading a lot of data into main memory (like 8-16GB of
data to process as one huge chunk, on a system that only had 32GB total).

A while later, I had a thought that actually maybe this quote has some
merit.  Maybe not the specific amount (of 640KB) - but the general notion
that there is rarely a reason for a single application to consume the
entirety of main memory.    It may be better, especially with threads or
multi-core, to work a problem in smaller chunks -- specifically, to work a
problem in chunks smaller than the CPU cache.  And in fact, I found a huge
jump in my programs performance when I kept the buffers exactly 1 byte less
than the CPU cache (at the time that was 1MB) - as soon as I went 1 byte
over, I noticed a huge (~3X) hit in performance.  Now that's just a single
data point, and the old advise of "never optimize your program for
performance too early" is probably still good.  And especially most shops
won't spend the time/resources to cache optimize their builds - I suspect
some games do at startup, they maybe profile what your L3 cache size.


Anyhow, years ago I recall coming across a quote or an article where Gates
stated the IBM PC (or maybe the 8088 cpu itself) was designed or intended
to only "last" about 10 years.  Not that the system components itself would
only last that long, but as it being a "useful" system.  In that context,
maybe he was right (if he had said it) - 640K was maybe "enough for anyone"
for the remainder of the 1980s.  I recall starting with 384KB (thinking
anything past 128KB was "huge") and doing upgrades in the late 1980s to get
to 640KB, and not getting into extended/expanded memory until the early
90s.  This would be for "typical" household applications (taxes, small
business, word processing) - obviously image processing (CAD, movie
rendering, etc.) or multi-user servers do need more memory.

I also recall that it was Intel that requested to keep it to 10 segments of
64KB (640KB), not really a Microsoft or MS-DOS doing.  i.e. aspects beyond
Microsoft wanted to reserve the "upper memory" for other stuff (video
memory).    You have 16 segments, how many to hold in reserve?  Someone
chose 6.  Quick and Dirty OS indeed.



On Tue, Jun 13, 2023 at 11:47 PM Ali via cctalk 
wrote:

> So I had always heard the quote "640KB is enough memory" being attributed
> to
> Bill Gates. However, recently I was watching Dave Plummer on YT and he said
> that it is not true:
>
> https://youtu.be/bikbJPI-7Kg?t=372
>
> And apparently the man himself has denied it as well but it just will not
> go
> away...
>
> https://abcnews.go.com/Technology/PCWorld/story?id=5214635
>
> So I guess like the napkin/disk story and the DR/IBM story this is another
> one of those vintage myths and folk lore with no real basis in reality
>
> -Ali
>
>
>
>
  

[cctalk] Re: Source for NEW (unused) punch tape

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Pun h makes all  holesEd#         SMECC 

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Thu, Jun 8, 2023 at 9:21 AM, Adrian Godwin via 
cctalk wrote:   A slitter is a wide paper feed system 
with sharp-edged pulleys over which
it passes. There are quite a few videos of this on youtube, it's
surprisingly well documented. Because slitter manufacturers are selling to
mom-and-pop outfits.

I think the tape is supplied unpunched and the tape punch makes both feed
holes and data holes. I could be wrong.


On Thu, Jun 8, 2023 at 5:10 PM Chuck Guzis via cctalk 
wrote:

> On 6/8/23 08:52, Adrian Godwin via cctalk wrote:
> > I think paper-slitters are pretty common. That is to say, if you go to
> > anyone manufacturing adding machine rolls they will have the capability
> to
> > make custom widths in rather small job lots. It's an industry comparable
> > with printing (and often combined, for when till rolls with custom
> printing
> > is desired). So it may be that although paper tape is no longer available
> > from computer stationary suppliers, it can very easily be made in quite
> > small MOQs.
>
> How does one, using modern equipment, both slit and perforate (feed
> holes) blank tape?  Color me curious.
>
> --Chuck
>
  

[cctalk] Re: First non-IBM PC-DOS Compatible PC

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Dimmemory Selliam... that computer would run  pm.or msdos on saMe box. Or 8band 
16bit... bal in 80s eone how ended up with  one.. Only one I ever saw...ED# 
  SMECC
Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Wed, Jun 7, 2023 at 7:19 PM, Sellam Abraham via 
cctalk wrote:   On Wed, Jun 7, 2023 at 4:41 PM Fred 
Cisin via cctalk 
wrote:

> On Wed, 7 Jun 2023, Yeechang Lee via cctalk wrote:
> > Hyperion was not alone in having trouble with comm ports. Columbia
> > University (my alma mater) reported in January 1984 that unmodified
> > Kermit ran on Compaq and Columbia PCs, but Eagle and Seequa needed
> > custom code.
>
> This is the first that I'v seen anybody with Seequa!
>
> The "Seequa Chameleon 325" was the only commercial PC to have 3.25" disk
> drives!  (the format that Dysan bet the company on and went under)
> I haven't heard how many, if any, of the 325 models were ever built or
> sold.
>

I can't remember if I ever added a Seequa Chameleon to my collection.
Definitely more rare than the Otrona Attache.

Didn't the Gavilan also use 3.25" disks?

I'm pretty sure I still have a Gavilan...somewhere.

Sellam
  

[cctalk] Re: Altair 8800 question

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Sellam, I hope  you do turn it up!Much cooler than an apple 1!Ed#

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Tue, May 9, 2023 at 6:43 PM, Sellam Abraham via 
cctalk wrote:   On Tue, May 9, 2023 at 4:01 PM Fred 
Cisin via cctalk 
wrote:

>
> Both UPS and Fedex will sometimes falsely claim that they had made a
> delivery attempt.


I've experienced this.


>  Does REA claim to have delivered the Altair?
>

I don't know that anyone can ever know at this point.

I'm thinking to put out a small bounty for any verifiable information
leading to knowledge of the fate of the shipment, and a larger bounty
leading to the prototype itself.  Anonimity guaranteed, no questions asked.

Sellam
  

[cctalk] do you have any western electric 498a diodes or know where I can get? Thanks ed sharpe

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

do you have any western electric 498a diodes or know where I can get? Thanks ed 
sharpe

Sent from AOL on Android

[cctalk] Re: One of Paul Allen's Museums

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

But Zane you seemed disenchanted with museums even before LCM closed...  
apparently you wee not happy with LCM?  Fill us in?

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Tue, Apr 25, 2023 at 8:11 AM, Zane Healy via cctalk 
wrote:   On Apr 24, 2023, at 11:16 PM, Tom Hunter via cctalk 
 wrote:
> 
> Hopefully the LCM will be sold as a going concern rather than just a
> firesale of the assets.
> Otherwise a lot of donors and contributors would be rightfully upset - me
> included.

I’m already unhappy, and wishing I’d not donated to the museum.

Zane  

[cctalk] Re: One of Paul Allen's Museums

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

...had the opportunity?Tell us more!

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Tue, Apr 25, 2023 at 12:39 AM, Sellam Abraham via 
cctalk wrote:   Little old Billy G?

lol, like he gives a shit. He's too busy selling his snake oil and figuring
out ways to turn bugs and chemicals into your next meal.

I literally should have strangled him to death when I had the opportunity.

Sellam

On Mon, Apr 24, 2023, 11:17 PM Tom Hunter via cctalk 
wrote:

> Hopefully the LCM will be sold as a going concern rather than just a
> firesale of the assets.
> Otherwise a lot of donors and contributors would be rightfully upset - me
> included.
> I am disappointed that Bill Gates hasn't bought it already to continue
> Paul's vision.
> Tom
>
> On Mon, Apr 24, 2023 at 11:30 PM Chuck Guzis via cctalk <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
>
> > On 4/24/23 03:18, Pete Turnbull via cctalk wrote:
> > > On 24/04/2023 06:45, ED SHARPE via cctalk wrote:
> > >> Bad link  Zane I get a weird  screen from the timeEd#
> > >
> > > Delete the strange character after the last "/" and it will work:
> > >
> > >
> >
> https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/after-3-years-flying-heritage-museum-to-reopen-in-everett/
> >
> > As I understand the situation, Jody, Paul's sister, is the named
> > executor for Paul's assets.  I've read that his instructions were to
> > sell off most of the assets and donate the proceeds to charity.  In
> > other words, the LCM will be sold; whether or not it remains intact is a
> > decision made by the purchaser.
> >
> >
> > --Chuck
> >
> >
> >
>
  

[cctalk] Re: One of Paul Allen's Museums

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Bad link  Zane I get a weird  screen from the timeEd#

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Sun, Apr 23, 2023 at 10:29 PM, Zane Healy via 
cctalk wrote:   It looks like his air museum was 
acquired by one of the Walmart heirs.

https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/after-3-years-flying-heritage-museum-to-reopen-in-everett/
After 3 years, Flying Heritage Museum to reopen in Everett
seattletimes.com

I wonder if something like this will happen with the computer museum.  

Question, were Paul Allen’s museums non-profits?

Zane



  

[cctalk] Re: Systron-Donner Block Programming

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

 Michael - most excellent as we have analog computers in the museums displays 
made by them!!! thanks Ed Sharpe - Archivist for SMECC  - Arizona 

In a message dated 3/25/2023 3:37:46 PM US Mountain Standard Time, 
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes: 
If anybody is interested in Systron-Donner Corporation, this booklet on 
“BlockProgramming For Physical Systems” was in a recent acquisition. Available 
at: https://archive.org/details/bpfps Michael.--   *Blog: RetroRetrospective – 
Fun today with yesterday's 
gear……..**Podcast*: *Retro Computing 
Roundtable * (Co-Host)

[cctalk] Re: Age of Tape Formats?

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

That reel of 3 onch tape is heavy... Ihave a reel and the 30 something track 
tape headgee I could rig a rrader ed#
Sent from AOL on Android
On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 11:16 PM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk 
wrote:
I believe that this photo shows a Datamatic 1000 tape next to a standard1/2" 
drive.
https://i.pinimg.com/564x/00/3e/7d/003e7d4e3a2478db0b9a7c94f2033252.jpg

--Chuck





  

[cctalk] Re: WTB Any storage for a PDP 8/A

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

I always wanted to build a tss8 system!
Ed#  hiding out at smecc

Sent from AOL on Android 
 
  On Sat, Feb 25, 2023 at 11:34 AM, Vincent Slyngstad via 
cctalk wrote:   On 2/25/2023 9:52 AM, 
silvercreekvalley--- via cctalk wrote:
> Thanks Vince - I knew about the RX emulators but not the serial disk - that 
> sounds interesting. Is there any documentation on that - I had a look at the 
> GitHub but seemed a bit sparse.

Suggestions on how to make it more accessible are welcome.  (Kyle and I 
are the maintainers, with some help from Doug and others.)

Basically, the idea is to take the great many existing (RK05) images, 
and convert them to work over a serial port to a server running in a 
generic POSIX environment.  There are several parts to this:

There's some documentation (SerialDisk/docs)
There are system and non-system handlers for the new device (handler).
There are a couple of choices for short bootstrap programs to get things 
rolling (bootloader).
There are a few provided RK05 images (disks).
There's the POSIX program to serve the disk images over the serial line 
(server).
There are various conversion schemes to get your RK05 image converted to 
the new drivers.

The one I use most uses the SIMH simulator to automate the ritual of 
uninstalling RK05 drivers and replacing them with SerialDisk driver. 
The Makefile there will actually convert a disk image, and you could 
just swipe the default one once it's been made.

Once the disk image(s) are converted to the new drivers, they boot OS/8 
in a simple way using one of the short bootstraps.

The other things you need (besides a PDP-8) are a PC/RasPi/whatever to 
run the server on, and as fast a serial port as you can manage.

There are also example config files for running the whole thing under 
SIMH on your POSIX box.  If you're more concerned about getting software 
developed than about the retro experience, that's also a great way to 
speed things along.

TBH, when I'm in a hurry I often just use SIMH with the cross assembler, 
and skip OS/8 altogether until I'm ready to verify that things work on 
real hardware.  You'll need more interaction with OS/8 to open files and 
such, so that might not work for you.

It is a great relief to use a proper editor, rather than the one in 
OS/8.  You might also want to hunt down the emacs-like editor that was 
done for OS/8 a couple of years ago, if you're going to be working 
native a lot.

    Vince
  

[cctalk] Re: Late '70s DEC manual covers [niche!]

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Why does it show me Samsung health screen when I download?
Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
On Sat, Feb 11, 2023 at 12:58 AM, Paul Flo Williams via 
cctalk wrote:Folks,
During lockdown I was having some fun redrawing old DEC manual coverswith 
Inkscape, specifically terminal and printer manuals from the late1970s. I've 
attached a montage of four that I printed out so I couldstick it on the wall. 
I'm aware I may be the only person, even here,who finds them attractively 
simple and coloured in such a definably1970s way.
Some of these designs were used on several manuals, but I'd like toknow if you 
know of any other designs that follow this pattern that Icould add to the 
collection? The VT102 User Guide has differentcolours, so it looks out of 
place. A copy of the LA34 User Guide iswinging its way to me as we speak.
For an infinite number of bonus points, does anyone have any clue whomight have 
designed these?
Paul





 

[cctalk] Re: 5150 cassette (Was: DLOAD BASIC command for Color Comp

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

By
Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
On Mon, Jan 30, 2023 at 6:01 PM, ben via cctalk wrote:On 
2023-01-30 1:50 p.m., Paul Berger via cctalk wrote:
>> On 2023-01-30 2:12 p.m., Fred Cisin via cctalk wrote: The 5150 had a 
>> cassette port! . . . The 5160 no longer had the cassette port. On 
>> Mon, 30 Jan 2023, Paul Berger via cctalk wrote:>>> The cassette port on the 
>> 5150 could also be used as a>>> Telecommunication Device for the Deaf (TDD) 
>> many years ago I made up>>> a ISA bus card with the same function as the 
>> cassette port for a>>> gentleman that wanted to move on from a 5150 but 
>> still needed the>>> cassette port for a TDD device. Interesting! Was 
>> that stand-alone and compatible with the ordinary TDD/TTY units?>> (and 
>> coupled to a modem)>> Or was that solely for communicating with other 
>> 5150s? Or was that to use the 5150 as a KSR terminal for a TDD/TTY 
>> handling>> the POT communication? -->> Grumpy Ol' Fred 
>> ci...@xenosoft.com>>> I don't recall all the details but I seem to recall 
>> that the cassette> interface was used to generate the modem tones and would 
>> be connected to> an acoustic coupler. I believe the software emulated a 
>> TDD/TTY but I> don't recall if it was Baudot or ACSII. It would not have 
>> been a stretch> to do it all in software as the rate is only 45 Baud and the 
>> tone> generation for the cassette interface was done in software.>> Paul.
>RTTY software might do that.Ben.
And rtth uses different tones from tdd
totally differentED#
















  

[cctalk] Re: 5150 cassette (Was: DLOAD BASIC command for Color Comp

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Hi
Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
On Mon, Jan 30, 2023 at 12:12 PM, Fred Cisin via cctalk 
wrote:>> The 5150 had a cassette port!>> . . .>> The 5160 no longer had the 
cassette port.
On Mon, 30 Jan 2023, Paul Berger via cctalk wrote:> The cassette port on the 
5150 could also be used as a Telecommunication> Device for the Deaf (TDD) many 
years ago I made up a ISA bus card with the> same function as the cassette port 
for a gentleman that wanted to move on> from a 5150 but still needed the 
cassette port for a TDD device.
Interesting!
Was that stand-alone and compatible with the ordinary TDD/TTY units?(and 
coupled to a modem)Or was that solely for communicating with other 5150s?
Or was that to use the 5150 as a KSR terminal for a TDD/TTY handling thePOT 
communication?

--Grumpy Ol' Fred ci...@xenosoft.com

Was this to actually communicate with the true Deftones for tdd work if so I'd 
be real interested in it we have a very large collection of items that are 
assistive for the deaf and hard of hearing at smecc Museum and this would 
qualify for that so yeah tell me some more thanks Ed




  

[cctalk] Re: HP3000 recently deinstalled available in Colorado for nothing.

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Please send info directly to me  can not accessing fb.  Tbanks




Sent from the all new AOL app for Android




On Thu, Jan 26, 2023 at 10:40 AM, Chris via cctalk

 wrote:

Dang it purdy.




Alas I'm 3000 miles away. 

[cctalk] Re: HP3000 recently deinstalled available in Colorado for nothing.

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Photos. Contact info???
Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
On Thu, Jan 26, 2023 at 10:37 AM, Technoid Mutant via 
cctalk wrote:I snipped this from an instant post on 
facebook, 26Jan2022 at 12:35pmEastern Standard Time.::We just de-commissioned 
our HP3000 minicomputer in December 2022 and arewilling to give it away free to 
anyone willing to pick it up. Photos tofollow, but it is the whole system, with 
2 green bar printers, manualset al.Be sure you understand what this is. It is a 
1970s era minicomputer thatis large and heavy. Sitting on our loading dock 
inside our building ittakes up maybe 10 feet of wall space. This is not a 
modern "minicomputer" like an Intel NUC or Mac Mini... this thing is a 
BEAST.Priority given to whomever can pick it up first during business 
hours(8:00am to 5:00pm). Located in Denver, Colorado near I-25 and Colorado 
Blvd.

  

[cctalk] Re: USB Attached 5.25" drives?

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

I came into this convo late isthmus for 5.25 usb? I found only 3.1/2 
disk...help,? I need 5.25 USB disk drive thanks ed sharpe 
Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
On Fri, Jan 20, 2023 at 9:32 PM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk 
wrote:On 1/20/23 16:25, Jim Brain via cctalk wrote:

> I'm game to try. I see them nominally listed for sale, so I asked for a> 
> quote for 10. We'll see if they are really available or not.

I've also seen them being offered on AliExpress...
--CHuck















































  

[cctalk] Re: DEC LINC Eight auction

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Absolutely gorgeous!Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Tue, Jan 10, 2023 at 10:01 AM, steve shumaker via 
cctalk wrote:   Popped up in a search:   A DEC LINC 
Eight up for auction in Friedens, PA.

https://hibid.com/lot/143159802/digital-equipment-corp-linc-eight-vintage
Currently has a single bid for $1.00  They are even offering shipping!



Visually looks to be in excellent shape

https://cdn.hibid.com/img.axd?id=7750162854==false===0=0===true=false=MAX=dXJczRVCwWW3aM2jOohA14P%2ful8pCw%2bs


Steve
  

[cctalk] Re: Old Silicon Valley poster

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Yes that !s what I saw! But tie that to an episode now 

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Mon, Dec 12, 2022 at 12:20 AM, John Herron via 
cctalk wrote:   I haven't found the episode yet but this 
is their website with what I
assume is the poster.
https://gspawn.com/products/apple-computer-poster-map-of-silicon-valley-in-1990-price-check.
They are asking $799.00.

In comparison they are also asking $699 for a trs-80 model 3.

On Sun, Dec 11, 2022, 6:46 PM Sellam Abraham via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> Thanks for the tip.
>
> I found the episode ==>
> https://play.history.com/shows/pawn-stars-do-america/season-1/episode-4
>
> I watched through the entire insidious thing.  Unfortunately, the Silicon
> Valley poster never comes up.
>
> However, there is a Apple ][+ that they buy for $700 (lol) at timemark
> 1:55, and at 17:21 some jabronis bring in some mini stand-up arcade games
> and then they eventually end up in their warehouse full of pinball
> machines.
>
> What an obnoxious show.  It's just Antiques Roadshow but with bad dialogue
> and annoying personalities.
>
> Regardless, if you can remember which episode the poster was in, I'd
> still like to watch that.
>
> Sellam
>
> On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 12:19 PM ED SHARPE  wrote:
>
> > Sellam, Yes the episode was there special  held in San Francisco  in the
> > pawn stars do America series that aired a week or so before  the list
> > member was selling these?  Ed#
> >
> > Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
> > <https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.aol.mobile.aolapp>
> >
> > On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 12:40 PM, Sellam Abraham
> >  wrote:
> > Ed,
> >
> > Do you remember the episode?
> >
> > Sellam
> >
> > On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 10:37 AM ED SHARPE via cctalk <
> > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> >
> > Having a good hi Def scan would indeed be nice.
> > Having this thing show up on pawn stars probably helped kick the price
> > up.Ed#
> >
> > Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
> >
> >  On Sat, Dec 10, 2022 at 6:18 PM, Don R via cctalk<
> cctalk@classiccmp.org>
> > wrote:  I’m surprised no one has scanned one for upload to archive.org.
> > Would that reduce its auction value? ;)
> >
> > Don Resor
> >
> > Sent from someone's iPhone
> >
> > > On Dec 10, 2022, at 5:01 PM, Warner Losh via cctalk <
> > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > On Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 5:59 PM Bill Gunshannon via cctalk <
> > > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > >
> > >>> On 12/10/22 18:27, John Foust via cctalk wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> Well, she went for $810 to a map dealer in London, and he had to pay
> > >>> about another $200 for the eBay global shipping program and duties.
> > >>>
> > >>> I asked one of the other losing bidders about what I had here and why
> > it
> > >>> was popular...  he said "Dealers are collecting them and
> > >>> trying to sell them at various price points. So far sales
> > >>> have been pretty minimal at anything over $1000. The
> > >>> exception is that some libraries are starting to collect
> > >>> them with an eye on the future."
> > >>>
> > >>> I'll see if I can stitch a good scan before I ship it out.
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >> I wonder what my Unix Wizard poster is worth? (not that I would ever
> > >> part with it!!)
> > >>
> > >
> > > Last I priced mine, they were going for 100-200 USD. But there aren't
> > many
> > > for sale ...
> > >
> > > Warner
> > >
> > >>
> > >
> >
> >
> >
>
  

[cctalk] Re: Old Silicon Valley poster

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

There are 2each  2 hour  episodes  each skimming might not catch it especially 
sine the poster is just one urem of a 4 item feature that us out of 4 of video! 
videos!  Yea I am calling it quitting this topic too!ED#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 6:07 PM, Sellam Abraham via 
cctalk wrote:   I watched the correct episode but posted 
the wrong link.

Here is the link to the SF episode ==>
https://play.history.com/shows/pawn-stars-do-america/season-1/episode-3

Sellam

On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 5:00 PM ED SHARPE  wrote:

> I said
> Sf. You have link for Seattle.  Try the sf one!
>
>
> Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
> <https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.aol.mobile.aolapp>
>
> On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 5:45 PM, Sellam Abraham via cctalk
>  wrote:
> Thanks for the tip.
>
> I found the episode ==>
> https://play.history.com/shows/pawn-stars-do-america/season-1/episode-4
>
> I watched through the entire insidious thing.  Unfortunately, the Silicon
> Valley poster never comes up.
>
> However, there is a Apple ][+ that they buy for $700 (lol) at timemark
> 1:55, and at 17:21 some jabronis bring in some mini stand-up arcade games
> and then they eventually end up in their warehouse full of pinball
> machines.
>
> What an obnoxious show.  It's just Antiques Roadshow but with bad dialogue
> and annoying personalities.
>
> Regardless, if you can remember which episode the poster was in, I'd
> still like to watch that.
>
> Sellam
>
> On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 12:19 PM ED SHARPE  wrote:
>
> > Sellam, Yes the episode was there special  held in San Francisco  in the
> > pawn stars do America series that aired a week or so before  the list
> > member was selling these?  Ed#
> >
> > Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
> > <https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.aol.mobile.aolapp>
> >
> > On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 12:40 PM, Sellam Abraham
> >  wrote:
> > Ed,
> >
> > Do you remember the episode?
> >
> > Sellam
> >
> > On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 10:37 AM ED SHARPE via cctalk <
> > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> >
> > Having a good hi Def scan would indeed be nice.
> > Having this thing show up on pawn stars probably helped kick the price
> > up.Ed#
> >
> > Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
> >
> >  On Sat, Dec 10, 2022 at 6:18 PM, Don R via cctalk >
> > wrote:  I’m surprised no one has scanned one for upload to archive.org.
> > Would that reduce its auction value? ;)
> >
> > Don Resor
> >
> > Sent from someone's iPhone
> >
> > > On Dec 10, 2022, at 5:01 PM, Warner Losh via cctalk <
> > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > On Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 5:59 PM Bill Gunshannon via cctalk <
> > > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > >
> > >>> On 12/10/22 18:27, John Foust via cctalk wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> Well, she went for $810 to a map dealer in London, and he had to pay
> > >>> about another $200 for the eBay global shipping program and duties.
> > >>>
> > >>> I asked one of the other losing bidders about what I had here and why
> > it
> > >>> was popular...  he said "Dealers are collecting them and
> > >>> trying to sell them at various price points. So far sales
> > >>> have been pretty minimal at anything over $1000. The
> > >>> exception is that some libraries are starting to collect
> > >>> them with an eye on the future."
> > >>>
> > >>> I'll see if I can stitch a good scan before I ship it out.
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >> I wonder what my Unix Wizard poster is worth? (not that I would ever
> > >> part with it!!)
> > >>
> > >
> > > Last I priced mine, they were going for 100-200 USD. But there aren't
> > many
> > > for sale ...
> > >
> > > Warner
> > >
> > >>
> > >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
  

[cctalk] Re: Old Silicon Valley poster

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

more than one poster or artwork from the one seller. only episodes I 
watched were sf and seattle.Seattle..Haha to be from a seller with more than 
one offering... unless they pulled it... I am not going to rewatch them

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 6:07 PM, Sellam Abraham via 
cctalk wrote:   I watched the correct episode but posted 
the wrong link.

Here is the link to the SF episode ==>
https://play.history.com/shows/pawn-stars-do-america/season-1/episode-3

Sellam

On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 5:00 PM ED SHARPE  wrote:

> I said
> Sf. You have link for Seattle.  Try the sf one!
>
>
> Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
> <https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.aol.mobile.aolapp>
>
> On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 5:45 PM, Sellam Abraham via cctalk
>  wrote:
> Thanks for the tip.
>
> I found the episode ==>
> https://play.history.com/shows/pawn-stars-do-america/season-1/episode-4
>
> I watched through the entire insidious thing.  Unfortunately, the Silicon
> Valley poster never comes up.
>
> However, there is a Apple ][+ that they buy for $700 (lol) at timemark
> 1:55, and at 17:21 some jabronis bring in some mini stand-up arcade games
> and then they eventually end up in their warehouse full of pinball
> machines.
>
> What an obnoxious show.  It's just Antiques Roadshow but with bad dialogue
> and annoying personalities.
>
> Regardless, if you can remember which episode the poster was in, I'd
> still like to watch that.
>
> Sellam
>
> On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 12:19 PM ED SHARPE  wrote:
>
> > Sellam, Yes the episode was there special  held in San Francisco  in the
> > pawn stars do America series that aired a week or so before  the list
> > member was selling these?  Ed#
> >
> > Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
> > <https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.aol.mobile.aolapp>
> >
> > On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 12:40 PM, Sellam Abraham
> >  wrote:
> > Ed,
> >
> > Do you remember the episode?
> >
> > Sellam
> >
> > On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 10:37 AM ED SHARPE via cctalk <
> > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> >
> > Having a good hi Def scan would indeed be nice.
> > Having this thing show up on pawn stars probably helped kick the price
> > up.Ed#
> >
> > Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
> >
> >  On Sat, Dec 10, 2022 at 6:18 PM, Don R via cctalk >
> > wrote:  I’m surprised no one has scanned one for upload to archive.org.
> > Would that reduce its auction value? ;)
> >
> > Don Resor
> >
> > Sent from someone's iPhone
> >
> > > On Dec 10, 2022, at 5:01 PM, Warner Losh via cctalk <
> > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > On Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 5:59 PM Bill Gunshannon via cctalk <
> > > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > >
> > >>> On 12/10/22 18:27, John Foust via cctalk wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> Well, she went for $810 to a map dealer in London, and he had to pay
> > >>> about another $200 for the eBay global shipping program and duties.
> > >>>
> > >>> I asked one of the other losing bidders about what I had here and why
> > it
> > >>> was popular...  he said "Dealers are collecting them and
> > >>> trying to sell them at various price points. So far sales
> > >>> have been pretty minimal at anything over $1000. The
> > >>> exception is that some libraries are starting to collect
> > >>> them with an eye on the future."
> > >>>
> > >>> I'll see if I can stitch a good scan before I ship it out.
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >> I wonder what my Unix Wizard poster is worth? (not that I would ever
> > >> part with it!!)
> > >>
> > >
> > > Last I priced mine, they were going for 100-200 USD. But there aren't
> > many
> > > for sale ...
> > >
> > > Warner
> > >
> > >>
> > >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
  

[cctalk] Re: Old Silicon Valley poster

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Check Seattle also I watched both same evening...when wa mixed in with art or 
grunge rock.posters

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 6:07 PM, Sellam Abraham via 
cctalk wrote:   I watched the correct episode but posted 
the wrong link.

Here is the link to the SF episode ==>
https://play.history.com/shows/pawn-stars-do-america/season-1/episode-3

Sellam

On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 5:00 PM ED SHARPE  wrote:

> I said
> Sf. You have link for Seattle.  Try the sf one!
>
>
> Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
> <https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.aol.mobile.aolapp>
>
> On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 5:45 PM, Sellam Abraham via cctalk
>  wrote:
> Thanks for the tip.
>
> I found the episode ==>
> https://play.history.com/shows/pawn-stars-do-america/season-1/episode-4
>
> I watched through the entire insidious thing.  Unfortunately, the Silicon
> Valley poster never comes up.
>
> However, there is a Apple ][+ that they buy for $700 (lol) at timemark
> 1:55, and at 17:21 some jabronis bring in some mini stand-up arcade games
> and then they eventually end up in their warehouse full of pinball
> machines.
>
> What an obnoxious show.  It's just Antiques Roadshow but with bad dialogue
> and annoying personalities.
>
> Regardless, if you can remember which episode the poster was in, I'd
> still like to watch that.
>
> Sellam
>
> On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 12:19 PM ED SHARPE  wrote:
>
> > Sellam, Yes the episode was there special  held in San Francisco  in the
> > pawn stars do America series that aired a week or so before  the list
> > member was selling these?  Ed#
> >
> > Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
> > <https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.aol.mobile.aolapp>
> >
> > On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 12:40 PM, Sellam Abraham
> >  wrote:
> > Ed,
> >
> > Do you remember the episode?
> >
> > Sellam
> >
> > On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 10:37 AM ED SHARPE via cctalk <
> > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> >
> > Having a good hi Def scan would indeed be nice.
> > Having this thing show up on pawn stars probably helped kick the price
> > up.Ed#
> >
> > Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
> >
> >  On Sat, Dec 10, 2022 at 6:18 PM, Don R via cctalk >
> > wrote:  I’m surprised no one has scanned one for upload to archive.org.
> > Would that reduce its auction value? ;)
> >
> > Don Resor
> >
> > Sent from someone's iPhone
> >
> > > On Dec 10, 2022, at 5:01 PM, Warner Losh via cctalk <
> > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > >
> > > On Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 5:59 PM Bill Gunshannon via cctalk <
> > > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > >
> > >>> On 12/10/22 18:27, John Foust via cctalk wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> Well, she went for $810 to a map dealer in London, and he had to pay
> > >>> about another $200 for the eBay global shipping program and duties.
> > >>>
> > >>> I asked one of the other losing bidders about what I had here and why
> > it
> > >>> was popular...  he said "Dealers are collecting them and
> > >>> trying to sell them at various price points. So far sales
> > >>> have been pretty minimal at anything over $1000. The
> > >>> exception is that some libraries are starting to collect
> > >>> them with an eye on the future."
> > >>>
> > >>> I'll see if I can stitch a good scan before I ship it out.
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >> I wonder what my Unix Wizard poster is worth? (not that I would ever
> > >> part with it!!)
> > >>
> > >
> > > Last I priced mine, they were going for 100-200 USD. But there aren't
> > many
> > > for sale ...
> > >
> > > Warner
> > >
> > >>
> > >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
  

[cctalk] Re: Old Silicon Valley poster

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Sellam, Yes the episode was there special  held in San Francisco  in the pawn 
stars do America series that aired a week or so before  the list member was 
selling these?  Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 12:40 PM, Sellam Abraham 
wrote:   Ed,
Do you remember the episode?
Sellam
On Sun, Dec 11, 2022 at 10:37 AM ED SHARPE via cctalk  
wrote:

Having a good hi Def scan would indeed be nice.
Having this thing show up on pawn stars probably helped kick the price up.Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 

  On Sat, Dec 10, 2022 at 6:18 PM, Don R via cctalk 
wrote:   I’m surprised no one has scanned one for upload to archive.org.  Would 
that reduce its auction value? ;)

Don Resor 

Sent from someone's iPhone

> On Dec 10, 2022, at 5:01 PM, Warner Losh via cctalk  
> wrote:
> 
> On Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 5:59 PM Bill Gunshannon via cctalk <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> 
>>> On 12/10/22 18:27, John Foust via cctalk wrote:
>>> 
>>> Well, she went for $810 to a map dealer in London, and he had to pay
>>> about another $200 for the eBay global shipping program and duties.
>>> 
>>> I asked one of the other losing bidders about what I had here and why it
>>> was popular...  he said "Dealers are collecting them and
>>> trying to sell them at various price points. So far sales
>>> have been pretty minimal at anything over $1000. The
>>> exception is that some libraries are starting to collect
>>> them with an eye on the future."
>>> 
>>> I'll see if I can stitch a good scan before I ship it out.
>>> 
>> 
>> I wonder what my Unix Wizard poster is worth? (not that I would ever
>> part with it!!)
>> 
> 
> Last I priced mine, they were going for 100-200 USD. But there aren't many
> for sale ...
> 
> Warner
> 
>> 
> 



  

[cctalk] Re: Old Silicon Valley poster

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Having a good hi Def scan would indeed be nice.
Having this thing show up on pawn stars probably helped kick the price up.Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Sat, Dec 10, 2022 at 6:18 PM, Don R via cctalk 
wrote:   I’m surprised no one has scanned one for upload to archive.org.  Would 
that reduce its auction value? ;)

Don Resor 

Sent from someone's iPhone

> On Dec 10, 2022, at 5:01 PM, Warner Losh via cctalk  
> wrote:
> 
> On Sat, Dec 10, 2022, 5:59 PM Bill Gunshannon via cctalk <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> 
>>> On 12/10/22 18:27, John Foust via cctalk wrote:
>>> 
>>> Well, she went for $810 to a map dealer in London, and he had to pay
>>> about another $200 for the eBay global shipping program and duties.
>>> 
>>> I asked one of the other losing bidders about what I had here and why it
>>> was popular...  he said "Dealers are collecting them and
>>> trying to sell them at various price points. So far sales
>>> have been pretty minimal at anything over $1000. The
>>> exception is that some libraries are starting to collect
>>> them with an eye on the future."
>>> 
>>> I'll see if I can stitch a good scan before I ship it out.
>>> 
>> 
>> I wonder what my Unix Wizard poster is worth? (not that I would ever
>> part with it!!)
>> 
> 
> Last I priced mine, they were going for 100-200 USD. But there aren't many
> for sale ...
> 
> Warner
> 
>> 
> 

  

[cctalk] Re: Old Silicon Valley poster

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Watch PAWN stars do America WITH CHUM LEE  ETC. . The SF. Episode that ran.  
That poster was in it I believe 

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Mon, Dec 5, 2022 at 12:27 AM, Alexander Huemer via 
cctalk wrote:   It would be cool if those could be 
scanned before disappearing 
somewhere.

-Alex

On Sun, Dec 04, 2022 at 09:11:44PM -0600, John Foust via cctalk wrote:
> 
> I'm cleaning out my warehouse bit by bit, and started selling posters
> on the eBay.
> 
> I have two of these:
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/334649989332
> 
> I sold one of these posters last week for $95+20 s/h.  
> 
> I listed the second one and the buyer of the first one submitted 
> an offer for $300 and then for $500.  Then a second guy offered $350.
> I declined all three, then did the rotten move of jacking the price 
> to $350 because no one had yet bid, and now the second guy 
> has bid $350. 
> 
> Not to humble brag, but what do I have here?  I probably got 
> them for free at a trade show.
> 
> - John
> 
  

[cctalk] Re: RIP Fred Brooks (1931-2022)

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Alas another one gone.



Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Fri, Nov 18, 2022 at 7:34 PM, Tomasz Rola via 
cctalk wrote:   As the subject (and wikipedia) say:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Brooks

-- 
Regards,
Tomasz Rola

--
** A C programmer asked whether computer had Buddha's nature.      **
** As the answer, master did "rm -rif" on the programmer's home    **
** directory. And then the C programmer became enlightened...      **
**                                                                **
** Tomasz Rola          mailto:tomasz_r...@bigfoot.com            **
  

[cctalk] Re: Beehive Topper help needed

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Iam looking for the beehive has detached keyboard upper case oly tanish caseI 
was king of uppercase only on the hp2000 with that.  Needs to be clean an if 
working that is a bonus!  Upper case forsever ubies.  Hah!
Drop me a line  with photo, condition and price!Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Sat, Nov 5, 2022 at 4:05 PM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk 
wrote:   On 11/5/22 15:45, Liam Proven via cctalk wrote:
> On Sat, 5 Nov 2022 at 17:17, Harten via cctalk  wrote:
>>
>> Hi folks!
>>
>> Is there anyone out there, who can help me with my Beehive Topper
>> CP/M machine?
> 
> 
> One of these?
> 
> https://www.reddit.com/r/retrocomputing/comments/vud92z/weve_found_a_beehive_international_bee_1_or_b1_in/

Isn't that just a B1 terminal?

http://bitsavers.org/pdf/beehive/ads/Beehive_Micro_B1.jpg

--Chuck
  

[cctalk] Re: LC:M+L (Living Computer Museum)

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Yea they are squatting on something SMECC museum would dearly love Ed 
Sharpe - Archivist for SMECC

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Sun, Oct 30, 2022 at 9:13 PM, Tomasz Rola via 
cctalk wrote:   On Sun, Oct 30, 2022 at 12:34:29PM 
-0400, Paul Koning via cctalk wrote:
> 
[...]
> 
> Even if it doesn't reopen, I'd hope that its collection would not
> simply be scrapped.  I imagine a lot of people here would be
> interested in parts of it.  I'm one of them...

If I was a donator, I would now be writing an rather officially
looking letter to let them know, that if they have intention to misuse
my donation then I have intention to have it back.

So they have to stuff this paper into their files and maybe even be
nice to donator.

I have no idea how this seems from the side of the law - is it at all
possible that donator can claim his donation back? If there is a good
reason for this, of course. It was given to the museum, with purpose
to have it exhibited or otherwise used by some group of people. If
museum is being scrapped for good, then this purpose is not going to
be fulfilled, so???...

Or, if museum decided to give it to some artistic movement, which used
it in their performances - say, peeing on olde computer, making it puff
and throw sparks, under the slogans painted on the wall, claiming this
very computer enabled certain pitiful aspects of western civilization
(which I will not name, so as to not have attention of bots).

How is that called in English law-speak, abuse of good faith?

-- 
Regards,
Tomasz Rola

--
** A C programmer asked whether computer had Buddha's nature.      **
** As the answer, master did "rm -rif" on the programmer's home    **
** directory. And then the C programmer became enlightened...      **
**                                                                **
** Tomasz Rola          mailto:tomasz_r...@bigfoot.com            **
  

[cctalk] Re: Great Vintage Computer Heist of 2012

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Re below. why would they refuse cash?
 And vy the way, as soon as I had it, I offered it, but
they refused the tender.




of the building.  The landlord doesn't get to keep a million dollars of
property over $4,000 of missed rent.  It is not lawful to liquidate any of
the tenant's property to offset the debt, unless they go through a long and
drawn out legal process.

Sellam

On Mon, Oct 17, 2022 at 2:11 PM Mike Stein via cctalk 
wrote:

> Shoulda paid the rent.
>
> A sad tale indeed.
>
> On Mon, Oct 17, 2022 at 4:11 PM Sellam Abraham via cctalk <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
>
> > The good news is that most of my best stuff was either already with me
> or I
> > was able to get out, including my two Lisa 1's, my (straight) PDP-8, and
> > several other precious items.  I long since sold off most of this to pay
> to
> > live, since at the same time they destroyed my collection they destroyed
> my
> > business (not to mention my life's work).
> >
> > I've gone on to build a new collection out of the old, one that is--like
> my
> > original collection--unrivaled anywhere on the planet.  But this time
> I've
> > erected castle walls around it, surrounded by a moat filled with
> > alligators.
> >
> > Sellam
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 17, 2022 at 11:58 AM Ryan de Laplante via cctalk <
> > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> >
> > > I didn’t know you were able to recover 20% of the collection before
> being
> > > locked out again.  I know losing any of it is terrible, but I’m
> guessing
> > > you prioritized the very best pieces of the collection when recovering
> > the
> > > 20%, such as your Lisa 1?
> > >
> > > I kept my collection in storage lockers for years.  I kept moving to
> > > larger and larger lockers, then eventually two large lockers, because
> my
> > > collecting got out of control.  Prices kept going up every year and it
> > was
> > > a nightmare having to pay what I did just to store the collection.
> > >  Fortunately I was able to move to a house and relocated the collection
> > to
> > > the basement.  Not everything could come home with me, so I sold the
> > > remaining lower priority pieces to the first person who could clear the
> > > locker over a weekend.  I didn’t get much for it, but at least it
> didn’t
> > go
> > > to a recycler.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > On Oct 17, 2022, at 4:54 AM, Sellam Abraham via cctalk <
> > > cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Long story very short:
> > > >
> > > > Landlords evicted me from their warehouse where my collection was
> > stored
> > > > and wouldn't let me back in.  Had to go to court.  Regained access
> and
> > > was
> > > > able to pull out 20% of the collection before they locked me out
> again
> > > for
> > > > good.  Then sold the rest to computer recyclers, who proceeded to
> > scatter
> > > > it to the wind.
> > > >
> > > > Sellam
> > > >
> > > > On Mon, Oct 17, 2022 at 1:43 AM Ali via cctalk <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> You had to ask..I was there 3000 years ago (or about 10 years
> ago
> > in
> > > >> non Tolkien meme terms) and it wasn't pretty
> > > >>  Original message From: Tom Hunter via cctalk <
> > > >> cctalk@classiccmp.org> Date: 10/17/22  1:31 AM  (GMT-08:00) To:
> > > "General
> > > >> Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts" 
> Cc:
> > > Tom
> > > >> Hunter  Subject: [cctalk] Great Vintage
> Computer
> > > >> Heist of 2012 Sellam Abraham referred to a "Great VintageComputer
> > Heist
> > > of
> > > >> 2012". What was that about? Who stole what and where andwhy?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
  

[cctalk] Re: Data General Nova and Eclipse Hobbyist License...

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Wild Hare Rocks!!!Thanks guys!Ed Sharpe archivist for smecc

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Mon, Oct 24, 2022 at 5:23 PM, Bruce Ray via cctalk 
wrote:   G'day Paul -


It is not a sublicense - Wild Hare Computer Systems, Inc., now has full 
IP rights and title to Data General software pursuant to a transfer 
agreement by DG/EMC[/Dell] and Wild Hare.



Bruce Ray
Wild Hare Computer Systems, Inc.


On 10/24/2022 5:35 PM, Paul Koning via cctalk wrote:
> Very nice!  So I take it that's a sublicense of Dell/EMC IP?  It doesn't say 
> that.
> 
>     paul
> 
> 
>> On Oct 24, 2022, at 6:26 PM, Bruce Ray via cctalk  
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Wild Hare Computer Systems, Inc., is pleased to announce that a
>> "Hobbyist License" is now available for legacy Data General
>> Nova and Eclipse software.  This license allows educational, hobbyist,
>> non-commercial use of the vast amount of DG software - software
>> that changed the world in many ways.
>>
>> The initial archives are currently available at:
>>
>> www.NovasAreForever.org/dgsw
>>
>> and includes documentation for the corresponding software.
>>
>>
>> This October announcement also honors the 54th anniversary of the original
>> Data General Nova. An international celebration of the Nova's 50th 
>> anniversary was
>> hosted by Wild Computer Systems in Colorado, USA.  Some of the festivities
>> can be seen at:
>>
>> www.Nova-At-50.org
>>
>> and
>>
>> www.Nova-At-50.org/album/index.html
>>
>>
>> To complement this Hobbyist License, a Nova and Eclipse emulator that can 
>> run all of the
>> software will be introduced later this week.
>>
>>
>> Wild Hare Computer Systems is dedicated to preserving Data General's
>> significant contributions to computer history.  We seek DG hardware, 
>> software, documentation,
>> sales literature - basically "anything DG" - that can be added to the
>> archives for posterity.
>>
>>
>>
>> Bruce Ray
>> Wild Hare Computer Systems, Inc.
>> Denver, Colorado USA
>> b...@wildharecomputers.com
>>
>> ...preserving the Data General legacy: www.NovasAreForever.org
>>
>> www.WildHareComputers.com
>>
>> www.NovasAreForever.org
> 
  

[cctalk] Re: Bubble Memory

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

What's the story of this pirate shipping on kind of an interesting name but I 
don't know what what kind of reputation do they have? thanks Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Thu, Oct 20, 2022 at 6:39 PM, Sellam Abraham via 
cctalk wrote:   If you want I can buy them for you and 
ship them to you.  Since shipping is
free it'll only cost you for the overseas shipping, and I can get
good rates through PirateShip.

If you're interested, e-mail me off-list and we'll work out the details.

Sellam

On Thu, Oct 20, 2022 at 6:24 PM Doug Jackson via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> Sigh...
>
> Yet another American seler who doesn't understand how simple overseas
> shipping is.
>
> Kindest regards,
>
> Doug Jackson
>
> em: d...@doughq.com
> ph: 0414 986878
>
> Check out my awesome clocks at www.dougswordclocks.com
> Follow my amateur radio adventures at vk1zdj.net
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, 21 Oct 2022 at 03:12, Douglas Taylor via cctalk <
> cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:
>
> > On 10/19/2022 5:49 PM, Anders Nelson via cctalk wrote:
> > > On eBay, 10pcs for $75: https://www.ebay.com/itm/394216367144
> > >
> > > =]
> > > --
> > > Anders Nelson
> >
> > This reminded me that I have a qbus Bubble Tek (or something) board in
> > my collection.  It emulates an RX01 device, however it uses the Intel
> > 7110 bubble memory and contains 1M bit of data. That is 128 KB!
> >
> > Formatted you get a 128KB RX01, and you thought the 256KB RX01 was a
> > small space to work in.
> >
> > Doug
> >
> >
> >
>
  

[cctalk] Re: Bendix G-15 Restoration

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

GE PROCESSS CONTROL COMPUTERS WENT TO A THIRD PARTY LARGE CORE STORE TO REPLACE 
SOME OF THE VERMONT RESEARCH DRUMS.
SMECC SAVES ANYTHING RELATED TO GE PROCESS CONTROL COMPUTERS. AND ALSO  GE DATA 
SYSTEMS  EMAIL  US WITH ITEMS FOR SALE OR?
GE COMPUTERS. A PRODUCT  OF ARIZONA 
THANKS ED SHARPE ARCHIVIST FOR SMECC 

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Fri, Oct 7, 2022 at 4:14 PM, ben via cctalk wrote:  
 On 2022-10-07 1:09 p.m., paul.kimpel--- via cctalk wrote:
> We'd all like to see the ALGO compiler, but be forewarned -- it's something 
> like 14 passes on paper tape, with intermediate results punched on paper 
> tape. I understand it's a bit more convenient to use if you have magnetic 
> tape drives, but it's still going to be slow -- there's only so much you can 
> do with 2K words of memory.

Trying to hide the fact  the drum makes it slow.
Did any one ever replace the drum with core memory, on the early serial 
computers?
Ben.

  

[cctalk] Re: Minicomputer front panel.

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

I am quite sure the recipient was very happy to get it. Especially with i/o 
cards etc.Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Fri, Sep 23, 2022 at 12:19 PM, Chris Zach via 
cctalk wrote:   Earlier this spring. I posted about it, 
and the general opinion was that 
a HP1000 wasn't really worth anything so I just gave it to someone.

If things aren't worth anything I will chuck them. No point in keeping 
junk around.

C

On 9/23/2022 10:22 AM, Adrian Stoness via cctalk wrote:
> When was that?
  

[cctalk] Re: HP 150 software

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Agreed! I used to sell 150s and all the HP PC models that followed...  when we 
had the computer biz and some of these compilers I never head of!  We do not 
have the odd balls at SMECC MUSEUM  either... so Stan haams a task ahead and 
should save some of this stuff  off.Ed Sharpe Archividt for SMECC MUSEUM

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Wed, Sep 7, 2022 at 3:15 PM, Rob Jarratt via cctalk 
wrote:   I have a HP-150 but I am in the UK. I think it would be good to get 
the images made and archived before sending the floppies anywhere at all.

Regards

Rob

> -Original Message-
> From: Stan Sieler via cctalk 
> Sent: 07 September 2022 01:51
> To: ba...@googlegroups.com; General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic
> Posts 
> Cc: Stan Sieler 
> Subject: [cctalk] HP 150 software
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I found a bunch of original HP 150 software on 3.5" floppies ...
> any HP 150 collectors here?    Free, pickup, Cupertino.
> 
> Includes the following.  About 1/2 are original disks.
> 
> The most unusual are probably the compilers from Prospero, and the
> IMAGE-like database (Mirage?) from Datasoft International (the developer
> was likely Michel Kohon, from France, and a member of the HP 3000
> community).
> 
> Datacom:
>    DSN/Link
>    HP PCLink
>    Kermit
>    PC2622
>    Reflection 1 Plus
> 
> Misc / Unknown:
>    Ally/150
>    Application Master Extended I/O Application
>    Cardfile (full app)
>    Cardfile demo
>    Computer tutor 150
>    Edit/150 from KSD systems Limited
>    Infocom sampler
>    Interex CSL/100 volume 56
>    Interex CSL150  (contributed library)
>    Mentor version 1.E.1 from KSD systems Limited
>    System demo
>    Thinkjet demo
>    Visicalc
> 
> Games:
>    Tick Tock, Radar, Othello, others
>    Type attack, Temple of Apshai, Ricochet
>    Winning Deal
>    Zork
> 
> Programming...
>    C (unknown...just says "C" on label)
>    Lattice C
>    MASM
>    Modula 2
>    MVP Forth (on misc games floppy)
>    Pro Fortran from Prospero
>      Pro For 1  (possibly same as above)
>    Pro Pascal from Prospero
>    Borland Turbo Pascal 2.0
> 
>    ISV Development  (from HP)
>    ISV revision A.1.2 (Independent Software Vendor toolkit from HP?)
>    Programmers Toolkit  (HP)
>    Programmers tools: debug, sort, find, edlin, ece2bin, ...more... (HP)
> 
> Database: ???
>    Mirager Version ii 2.A.1 Datasoft International
>    Mirage Library
>    Mirage I
> 
> //

  

[cctalk] Re: HP 150 software

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

A pity! Too far from az for pickup   Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Tue, Sep 6, 2022 at 10:56 PM, Stan Sieler via 
cctalk wrote:   Hi,

I found a bunch of original HP 150 software on 3.5" floppies ...
any HP 150 collectors here?    Free, pickup, Cupertino.

Includes the following.  About 1/2 are original disks.

The most unusual are probably the compilers from Prospero, and the
IMAGE-like database (Mirage?) from Datasoft International (the developer
was likely Michel Kohon, from France, and a member of the HP 3000
community).

Datacom:
  DSN/Link
  HP PCLink
  Kermit
  PC2622
  Reflection 1 Plus

Misc / Unknown:
  Ally/150
  Application Master Extended I/O Application
  Cardfile (full app)
  Cardfile demo
  Computer tutor 150
  Edit/150 from KSD systems Limited
  Infocom sampler
  Interex CSL/100 volume 56
  Interex CSL150  (contributed library)
  Mentor version 1.E.1 from KSD systems Limited
  System demo
  Thinkjet demo
  Visicalc

Games:
  Tick Tock, Radar, Othello, others
  Type attack, Temple of Apshai, Ricochet
  Winning Deal
  Zork

Programming...
  C (unknown...just says "C" on label)
  Lattice C
  MASM
  Modula 2
  MVP Forth (on misc games floppy)
  Pro Fortran from Prospero
      Pro For 1  (possibly same as above)
  Pro Pascal from Prospero
  Borland Turbo Pascal 2.0

  ISV Development  (from HP)
  ISV revision A.1.2 (Independent Software Vendor toolkit from HP?)
  Programmers Toolkit  (HP)
  Programmers tools: debug, sort, find, edlin, ece2bin, ...more... (HP)

Database: ???
  Mirager Version ii 2.A.1 Datasoft International
  Mirage Library
  Mirage I

//
  

[cctalk] Re: "Revival" of a dedicated Micropolis webpage on internet

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

You all need to make sure you archive a copy of this site.

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Tue, Aug 16, 2022 at 12:43 AM, P Gebhardt via 
cctalk wrote:   Hello list, 

by coincidence, I came across this website:

https://www.micropolis.com/

It seems to have been set up by a former employee of Micropolis with 
information about Micropolis products done until the late 90s.

Cheers, 
Pierre

-
http://www.digitalheritage.de
  

[cctalk] Re: Posts Blocked

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

I watched it... thanks for link!   Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Tue, Aug 2, 2022 at 11:36 AM, Fred Cisin via cctalk 
wrote:   On Tue, 2 Aug 2022, Ali via cctalk wrote:
> Hello All,
> Since the new hosting has taken over I am having a ton of issues posting to
> the list. Anyone else experiencing legit posts being blocked as spam?

I generally have no problems at all with the list.
BUT, yesterday, when I posted about "Hyperland" (BBS ephemera thread), it 
didn't go through (silently, with no bounce message), and I had to send 
it again.  First time that that has ever happened to me on this list.
My apologies to anybody who got it twice.

--
Grumpy Ol' Fred            ci...@xenosoft.com
  

[cctalk] Re: BBS memorabilia (fwd)

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Ok I know  what I am watching  tonight! Thanks!  Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Mon, Aug 1, 2022 at 5:22 PM, Fred Cisin via cctalk 
wrote:   The greatest ever video about pre-WWW internet was "Hyperland".
a 1991 BBC documentary by Douglas Adams and Ted Nelson, and also starring Tom 
Baker.
A few years BEFORE WWW, it predicted the future of the internet.

https://archive.org/details/DouglasAdams-Hyperland


If you want subtitles/captions, 5 years ago, I created an .SRT (camptions file 
of it!

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B4hCJm9ZEADCblVSVlBxdmZyREU/view?usp=drive_web
(400MB video with subtitles burned in)
.SRT file:
http://www.xenosoft.com/HyperlandCAPS_En_US_0_77.srt

  

[cctalk] Re: Heath h-100 h-200 computer added to SMECC with discs books etc anyone else running one like this? Ours is version with built in keyboard builtin dual floppies 8085 plus 8888 and monitor i

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Wow great!  Location???

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Mon, Jul 18, 2022 at 11:21 AM, Robert Ollerton wrote: 
  I've got a H89 I could cut loose

On Sun, Jul 17, 2022 at 4:40 PM ED SHARPE via cctalk  
wrote:

Heath h-100 h-200 computer added to SMECC with discs books etc anyone else 
running one like this? Ours is version with built in keyboard builtin dual 
floppies 8085 plus  and monitor is separate unit sitting on top...Ed#  P.S. 
We never  got the H89  that  was  headed  our way some   guy  absconded  
with it  I  guess... alas  so  once  we  get that think  we have  THE SET  
except  for the analog computers that Heath Produced ( still looking??? Help???)

  

Heath h-100 h-200 computer added to SMECC with discs books etc anyone else running one like this? Ours is version with built in keyboard builtin dual floppies 8085 plus 8888 and monitor is separate un

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Heath h-100 h-200 computer added to SMECC with discs books etc anyone else 
running one like this? Ours is version with built in keyboard builtin dual 
floppies 8085 plus  and monitor is separate unit sitting on top...Ed#  P.S. 
We never  got the H89  that  was  headed  our way some   guy  absconded  
with it  I  guess... alas  so  once  we  get that think  we have  THE SET  
except  for the analog computers that Heath Produced ( still looking??? Help???)

Re: List migration

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

20 years... congrats Jay!
Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Mon, Jul 11, 2022 at 6:55 PM, Cameron Kaiser via 
cctalk wrote:   > The new hosting is provided by the 
Chicago Classic Computing group.
> 
> Many thanks to Jay West for hosting the lists for 20 years!

Thanks, Jay, CCC and Dennis!

-- 
 personal: http://www.cameronkaiser.com/ --
  Cameron Kaiser * Floodgap Systems * www.floodgap.com * ckai...@floodgap.com
-- An intellectual is someone whose mind watches itself. -- Albert Camus --

  

Re: Information on Trend UTR 700 Paper Tape Reader and Facit 4060 Punch

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

THAT  IS  NEAR  RAGE  OF  DATES  I   THINK OF NOOK  NO PROMISES BUT  WILL SEE 
IF  I CAN FOND  WHERE I STASHED  THE BOOK!
 ED#
In a message dated 7/11/2022 12:42:03 AM US Mountain Standard Time, 
mjd.bis...@emeritus-solutions.com writes: 
The Facit 4060 appears to be from the 1968 - 1969 period

The Trend UTR 700 from ~1980, based on IC date codes

Martin

-Original Message-
From: ED SHARPE via cctalk [mailto:cctalk@classiccmp.org] 
Sent: 11 July 2022 08:02
To: cctalk@classiccmp.org
Cc: ED SHARPE 
Subject: Re: Information on Trend UTR 700 Paper Tape Reader and Facit 4060 Punch

SOMEWHERE I  HAVE  THIS AMAZING FACIT  PUNCH AN READER CATALOG  BOOK THING,,,  
TONS OF  UNITS BEAUTY PHOTOS    WHAT IS THE DATE ON THE UNITS  YOU SEEK 
INFO ON??
THANKS ED#
In a message dated 7/10/2022 11:32:29 PM US Mountain Standard Time, 
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes: Google turns up very little specific information 
on either of these devices, e.g. nil return from bit savers. The best leads I 
have are:- The UTR 700 was badge engineered by Ferranti into FM1600B systems, 
one of which fetched up at the Centre for Computer History, Cambridge, England; 
perhaps with documentation.  Also, as it was used in government systems some 
maintenance documentation may have fetched up in the PRO, at Kew.- Some Facit 
4060 documentation, for the 4060, its 4061 & 4063 chums and the 5106 interface, 
look to be lodged in Box 52 of the ICL Collection at the Science Museum 
Library. The UTR 700 reader looks to be parallel interfaced, 10 single ended 
outputs from an interface card.  The jokes start with manufacturer codes, 
rather than OEM part numbers on the 14 pin DIL ICs.  However, a little scope 
work should identify tape out, data 0..7 and strobe lines.  More interesting 
questions are lubrication and capacitor replacement - where a schematic would 
be a great assistance in deciding how to proceed.  etc etc The Facit 4060 punch 
contains no more than the electro-mechanical mechanism : AC drive motor, 
solenoids and rotary position sensors.  The 4070 documentation (on BitSavers) 
may read across, in terms of sensor characteristics, solenoid operating 
voltages and snubbing needs, or it may not.  That reconstructing the schematic 
would be straightforward simply identifies how much is missing, and the 
difficulty of specifying it in the abscence of documentation.  A classic tape 
punch interface from data latch and ready, through position sensing, solenoid 
drivers and done logic is required, together with auxiliary indications, e.g. 
tape out.  etc etc Any information, wisdom, documentation or pointers to 
sources would be very much appreciated. To state the obvious, I was passed 
these devices by Philip Belben Martin

Re: Information on Trend UTR 700 Paper Tape Reader and Facit 4060 Punch

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

https://gesrepair.com/products/4070-facit-tape-punch/
YIKES   EXPENSIVE TO FIX
In a message dated 7/10/2022 11:32:29 PM US Mountain Standard Time, 
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes: 
UTR 700

Re: Information on Trend UTR 700 Paper Tape Reader and Facit 4060 Punch

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

SOMEWHERE I  HAVE  THIS AMAZING FACIT  PUNCH AN READER CATALOG  BOOK THING,,,  
TONS OF  UNITS BEAUTY PHOTOS    WHAT IS THE DATE ON THE UNITS  YOU SEEK 
INFO ON??
THANKS ED#
In a message dated 7/10/2022 11:32:29 PM US Mountain Standard Time, 
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes: 
Google turns up very little specific information on either of these devices, 
e.g. nil return from bit savers. The best leads I have are:- The UTR 700 was 
badge engineered by Ferranti into FM1600B systems, one of which fetched up at 
the Centre for Computer History, Cambridge, England; perhaps with 
documentation.  Also, as it was used in government systems some maintenance 
documentation may have fetched up in the PRO, at Kew.- Some Facit 4060 
documentation, for the 4060, its 4061 & 4063 chums and the 5106 interface, look 
to be lodged in Box 52 of the ICL Collection at the Science Museum Library. The 
UTR 700 reader looks to be parallel interfaced, 10 single ended outputs from an 
interface card.  The jokes start with manufacturer codes, rather than OEM part 
numbers on the 14 pin DIL ICs.  However, a little scope work should identify 
tape out, data 0..7 and strobe lines.  More interesting questions are 
lubrication and capacitor replacement - where a schematic would be a great 
assistance in deciding how to proceed.  etc etc The Facit 4060 punch contains 
no more than the electro-mechanical mechanism : AC drive motor, solenoids and 
rotary position sensors.  The 4070 documentation (on BitSavers) may read 
across, in terms of sensor characteristics, solenoid operating voltages and 
snubbing needs, or it may not.  That reconstructing the schematic would be 
straightforward simply identifies how much is missing, and the difficulty of 
specifying it in the abscence of documentation.  A classic tape punch interface 
from data latch and ready, through position sensing, solenoid drivers and done 
logic is required, together with auxiliary indications, e.g. tape out.  etc etc 
Any information, wisdom, documentation or pointers to sources would be very 
much appreciated. To state the obvious, I was passed these devices by Philip 
Belben Martin

Re: Who/what is Molecular Electronics Branch Electronic Technology Division

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

YEP THAT IS  PART OF  TE PICTURE THX   ED#

In a message dated 5/12/2022 3:22:23 AM US Mountain Standard Time, 
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes: 
https://archive.computerhistory.org/resources/access/text/2018/11/102740473-05-01-acc.pdf

??

On Wed, May 11, 2022 at 3:08 AM ED SHARPE via cctalk
 wrote:
>
> Were did you find that reference. Gavin?
>
> Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
>
>  On Tue, May 10, 2022 at 5:02 PM, Gavin Scott wrote:  
>Perhaps: "Molecular Electronics Branch, Electronic Technology
> Division, Air Force Avionics Laboratory, Wright-Patterson Air Force
> Base, Ohio."
>
> On Tue, May 10, 2022 at 5:31 PM ED SHARPE via cctalk
>  wrote:
> >
> > Who/what is Molecular Electronics Branch Electronic Technology Division 
> > thanks Ed#
> >
> > Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
>


-- 
-Jon
+44 7792 149029 

Re: Who/what is Molecular Electronics Branch Electronic Technology Division

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Were did you find that reference. Gavin?

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Tue, May 10, 2022 at 5:02 PM, Gavin Scott wrote:   
Perhaps: "Molecular Electronics Branch, Electronic Technology
Division, Air Force Avionics Laboratory, Wright-Patterson Air Force
Base, Ohio."

On Tue, May 10, 2022 at 5:31 PM ED SHARPE via cctalk
 wrote:
>
> Who/what is Molecular Electronics Branch Electronic Technology Division 
> thanks Ed#
>
> Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
  

Who/what is Molecular Electronics Branch Electronic Technology Division

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Who/what is Molecular Electronics Branch Electronic Technology Division thanks 
Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android

Re: IMSAI SIO2 cable part number

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

probably others  out  there   that  can use  some of these cables  too... sad  
but  true  I  wish  I had   bought up all the loose IMSAI  parts  Micro-age 
redistribution  had  way back  then in  the  early 1980s    they had  parts  
and pieces  of leftovers and  half disassembled  IMSAI atuff stuff their techs  
screwed up! Ed#  In a message dated 4/18/2022 10:45:44 PM US Mountain Standard 
Time, cct...@classiccmp.org writes: 
Bill, Let me know right quick if you'll be at VCF East and I'll make you a 
pair, I have both kinds of IDC ends. I'm heading out first thing tomorrow 
morning though as I have work in the northeast before VCF East. Thanks,Jonathan 
   --- Original Message ---On Monday, April 18th, 2022 at 15:03, Bill 
Degnan via cctech  wrote:  >>> Hi all...> What is the 
cable partnumber for the IMSAI SIO2? I need to order a> set of cables. I 
thought in all of my boxes and boxes of cables I> might have one...but nope.>> 
Here is a picture:>> https://deramp.com/downloads/mfe_archive/010-S100 
Computers and Boards/00-Imsai/10-Imsai S100 Boards/Imsai SIO-2 dual serial 
IO/SIO with cables.JPG>> Thanks in advance.>> BIll

NEW CONTRIBUTION TO US CALL-A-COMPUTEER BIG 3 INCH 3 RING AS NEW TIMESHARE MANUAL

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

NEW CONTRIBUTION TO US "CALL-A-COMPUTER"  PILLSBURY  TIMESHARE...   WHAT  
SYSTEM WAS  THIS  RUN ON ?     IT IS A  BIG 3 INCH 3 RING AS NEW TIMESHARE 
MANUAL.  THANKS  ED#    SMECC MUSEUM

Re: restoring a Silent 700 Model 765

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

incoming UPI or  outgoing   yea  remember   source  was  big  NY times  
database  as one selling  features and   these may hive been UPI  stories  from 
 that or??  maybe not!!!   Be interesting  to  see!   Ed#

In a message dated 3/19/2022 10:40:44 PM US Mountain Standard Time, 
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes: 
> I understand  many Bubble memoryTi's were used by press. Does anyone have
> adverts or articles on this?  Need some backup material for our tools of the
> journalist section  weave one of the units to put in the display

I'm not sure if the prior owner was a writer or just an interested subscriber,
but there are United Press International transcripts here. On one of them (s)he
compares what was entered into the bubble memory with what actually got
transmitted. Couldn't say much more about it though from these.

-- 
 personal: http://www.cameronkaiser.com/ --
  Cameron Kaiser * Floodgap Systems * www.floodgap.com * ckai...@floodgap.com
-- Perl: the only language that makes Welsh look acceptable. -- David Cantrell

Re: restoring a Silent 700 Model 765

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

I understand  many Bubble memoryTi's were used by press. Does anyone have 
adverts or articles on this?  Need some backup material for our tools of the 
journalist section  weave one of the units to put in the displayThanks Ed 
Sharpe archivist for SMECC

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Sat, Mar 19, 2022 at 4:09 PM, Cameron Kaiser via 
cctalk wrote:   I found my old Model 745 in storage and 
other than needing a print head clean
and adjusting the printer contrast, it works splendidly. It has the manual and
I've got some plugs to build it an RS-232 connector when I find some more round
tuits.

This whetted my appetite for other 700s, including the (in)famous bubble memory
763/765. I was able to land a set of 765 ASRs. One of them came with Telenet
transcripts from The Source (various logins from 1978 to 1980), which was
really cool reading. I'll scan these.

However, neither of them work. Both power on, but they immediately go into
COMMAND mode and sit there, which appears to be abnormal behaviour based on
what I'm reading in the service manual (thanks, Bitsavers!). The NUM LOCK
switch works and the paper advance works, but nothing else appears to elicit a
response. One of them advances the page and acts like it's printing the command
prompt, but the other one doesn't even do that.

The service manual suggests I need to replace both the TMS 9980 and 8080
boards, which would really suck. I'm hopeful that the one that's "more active"
has a working 9980 board and I can use the 8080 board from the other one. (I
haven't even gotten to the bubble memory yet.) Anyone repaired these units or
have an idea of a repair strategy other than replace damn near everything?

TELENET
303 8A

TERMINAL=

@C 301 24


301 24 CONNECTED
DIALCOM NETWORK SYSTEM 10

-- 
 personal: http://www.cameronkaiser.com/ --
  Cameron Kaiser * Floodgap Systems * www.floodgap.com * ckai...@floodgap.com
-- Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication. -- da Vinci -

  

Re: Found! Ge 115 computer brochure

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

A person that had this ge computer would know.   Anyway this listserv still 
rejects images still ?

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Sat, Mar 12, 2022 at 8:31 AM, Adrian Stoness wrote:  
 Upload a scan would help
On Sat., Mar. 12, 2022, 12:26 a.m. ED SHARPE via cctalk, 
 wrote:

Found! Ge 115 computer brochure where can I find the computer?

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android

  

Found! Ge 115 computer brochure

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Found! Ge 115 computer brochure where can I find the computer?

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android

Found SYSTEM DOCUMENTATION FOR ALUMINUM COMPANY OF AMERICA WARRICK WORKS DATANET -30 REALTIME DATA ACCUMULATOR AND DISTRIBUTOR ... AUG 7 1964

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

SYSTEM DOCUMENTATION
FOR ALUMINUM COMPANY OF AMERICA WARRICK WORKS
DATANET -30 REALTIME DATA ACCUMULATOR AND DISTRIBUTOR ... AUG 7 1964

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android

Re: Speaking of tubes in computers.... 1st Honeywell 1000 computer used some surprise tubes!

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

The H-800  was  pretty  modern compared  to the  1000!
I  marvel at  all of  them! Ed#
In a message dated 2/22/2022 11:27:10 PM US Mountain Standard Time, 
p...@regressive.org writes: 
There's a mention of the Datamatic 1000 in Hugh Blair-Smith's "Left
Brains for the Right Stuff" (on the development of the Apollo Guidance
Computer software), and gives an account that the B D-1000 got
flooded when a rooftop water tank burst, and hot tubes met cold water.

Early work on the AGC was hosted on the D-1000 descendent, the
Honeywell 800 series (replacing an IBM 650).  Blair-Smith describes
the H-800 as having eight execution contexts (sets of registers). 

Speaking of tubes in computers.... 1st Honeywell 1000 computer used some surprise tubes!

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Speaking of  tubes in computers 1st Honeywell 1000 computer used some 
surprise tubes!    Imagine our surprise back then as  we unpacked our  first 
group of  contributed Honeywell 1000 logic and saw  LOCTAL TUBES! Although 
SMECC does not  have  a complete Honeywell
system of  this model  (CPU and  PS would  weigh in at 25,000
pounds  we have been told)  We DO possess  a wonderful
collection  of documentation, parts  and  misc.  material
related  to it, perhaps one of the best. Who else has some?

We  used  to  think our 2 inch QUAD  videotape
was a monster reel of  tape...BUT  WAIT!The First Honeywell Computer used 3 
Inch Wide Tape!
It was like mounting a Volkswagen Tire Wheel
onto your computer tape drive! Channels or tracks on the tape... 31 Channels  
ALWAYS LOOKING  FOR MORE RELATED TO THIS COMPUTER!  See more info on this 
computer at:
http://www.smecc.org/honeywell_datamatic_1000.htm
drop me a note at  couryho...@aol.com 

Re: Retro Chip Tester Pro, done!

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

does it test 4004  and 8008 

In a message dated 2/7/2022 6:32:24 PM US Mountain Standard Time, 
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes: 
You may recall that, a few weeks ago, I requested parts help (shoppingbaskets) 
for the Retro Chip Tester Pro that I got for Christmas.  Well, today's 
mailbrought the last few parts and I have finished and tested it.  Wow!  The 
only thing that itdoesn't do is slice bread.  It's great.  I've put up a few 
pictures here:   http://wsudbrink.dyndns.org:8080/images/RCTPro/   I got the 
4008 and 1702 adapters with it, but I'm pretty sure that I willget the rest 
over the next month or so.  This is the latest HW version with the latest 
releasesoftware.   Bill S.   PS: Thanks to everyone that helped with parts.   
-- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus 
software.https://www.avast.com/antivirus

Looking for CONAR CCTV TV camera CONAR WERE KITS FROM NATIONAL RADIO COMPANY

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

 Looking for CONAR CCTV  TV camera CONAR WERE KITS FROM NATIONAL RADIO COMPANY 
want books parts assembled units whole units  broken units-- I lust for one in 
the box un-assembled too! anything anything anything  related  toi this  camera 
 collecting up stories and folklore from others that may have  built one, owned 
one or  even just lusted  for  one!reply using the  following    SMECC CONAR TV 
CAMERA HISTORY PROJECT      as  email reply  title  and  send  to 
couryhouse@aol.comdrop me a line off list  with  first  word  CONAR  in subj. 
line  thxThanks in advance and stay wellEd Sharpe  Archivist  for  SMECC

Re: 11/785 on ebay (2018) - was Re: VAX 780 on eBay

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Ah yes! And I am in Arizona too.. Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Sun, Jan 2, 2022 at 2:12 PM, emanuel stiebler via 
cctalk wrote:   On 2022-01-02 16:03, Toby Thain via 
cctalk wrote:
> On 2022-01-02 2:48 p.m., Noel Chiappa via cctalk wrote:
>>  > From: Jonathan Chapman
>>
>>  > Last one that went auction-style on eBay went for $1,178.00
>>
>> When was that?
>>
>> Do you have any details of the machine's config?
>>
>> That's a pretty good deal for a 780 (IMO).
> 
> Someone I know won a '785, Feb 10, 2018, but it went for $1,000 (they 
> bid $1,178.50).

I didn't bid on it, it was too far, now I'm on the east coast, and there 
is one in Arizona :(
  

Re: HP 1000 A900 ("Magic") Questions

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

SMECC  NEEDS  TO  BEG  BUY  OR  TRADE   FOR  SCSSI    HP  TAPE  REEL  TO REEL  
DRIVES  HELP?  ED#

In a message dated 12/19/2021 12:46:49 AM US Mountain Standard Time, 
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes: 
Are you still in need of any HP1000 RTE equipment? I have a lot of boards, 
chassis’, tape drives, etc. If not and if you know of someone who would be 
interested in this equipment please let me know…Kind Regards…Joe Sent from my 
iPhone

Re: What is this massive binder of computer minutes1955 to 1964. I did cel phone or of text below we have

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

There is eeting one thru 80 something plus other study reports. Page one of 
minutes 1 has  bad spots so I ocr the header  off meeting 2

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Mon, Dec 13, 2021 at 2:14 AM, ED SHARPE via cctalk 
wrote:   May be some errors In ocr..The Second Meeting of the Committee to 
Study Developments in Electronic Computing Machines and Their Application, 
September 22, 1955 The second meeting of the Committee was held on Sept ember 
22, 1955, at 2 P.M. in the Board room at the Dominion Bureau of 
Statistics.Messrs. J.T. Marshall (Chairman);B.G. Ballard; H. Freedman; C.J. 
Gardner; R.W. James ; N. Keyfitz; J.A. Kidd; E.0. Landry; C. Scott; and R. 
Ziola (Secretary ) Present were: The Chairman pointed out that minutesof the 
first meeting of this Committee had been distribut ed to all membersand called 
for comments and correctionsS. were adopted 8s presented The minut es The 
Chairman referred to the Treasury Board letter T.B.486770 which gave approval 
to the setting up of this Committee and expressed appreciation to Messrs. E.0. 
Landry and D.. atters for their assistance in connection with the Committee's 
submission e rea.suryboard. During the sumer months officials representing 
three manufacturers of electronic eqipment met with members of the Commit tee 
to discuss some aspects of the equipment afactured. These included: 2. 
orfieials from Burroughs who explained the operating princ iples of the B.101 
at a meeting held at the Dominion Bureau of Statistics on June 22, 1955. 2. 
Officials of .C.A. who explained the operating principles of BIZMAC at a eeting 
beld at the Jackson Building on July 7, 1955. S.0fficials from IEM ho presented 
a short movie on "Direct line to decisions ", dealing with the type 650 and 700 
series of machinesat a meeting held at the C.h.?. Hess on August 12, 1955. n 
referring to letters received since the first meeting,the Chairman pointed u 
that since they dealt with same of the topics includedon the agenda it might be 
CaairabLeto considerthen when the se topics were under discus sion. 

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android
  

What is this massive binder of computer minutes1955 to 1964. I did cel phone or of text below we have

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

May be some errors In ocr..The Second Meeting of the Committee to Study 
Developments in Electronic Computing Machines and Their Application, September 
22, 1955 The second meeting of the Committee was held on Sept ember 22, 1955, 
at 2 P.M. in the Board room at the Dominion Bureau of Statistics.Messrs. J.T. 
Marshall (Chairman);B.G. Ballard; H. Freedman; C.J. Gardner; R.W. James ; N. 
Keyfitz; J.A. Kidd; E.0. Landry; C. Scott; and R. Ziola (Secretary ) Present 
were: The Chairman pointed out that minutesof the first meeting of this 
Committee had been distribut ed to all membersand called for comments and 
correctionsS. were adopted 8s presented The minut es The Chairman referred to 
the Treasury Board letter T.B.486770 which gave approval to the setting up of 
this Committee and expressed appreciation to Messrs. E.0. Landry and D.. atters 
for their assistance in connection with the Committee's submission e 
rea.suryboard. During the sumer months officials representing three 
manufacturers of electronic eqipment met with members of the Commit tee to 
discuss some aspects of the equipment afactured. These included: 2. orfieials 
from Burroughs who explained the operating princ iples of the B.101 at a 
meeting held at the Dominion Bureau of Statistics on June 22, 1955. 2. 
Officials of .C.A. who explained the operating principles of BIZMAC at a eeting 
beld at the Jackson Building on July 7, 1955. S.0fficials from IEM ho presented 
a short movie on "Direct line to decisions ", dealing with the type 650 and 700 
series of machinesat a meeting held at the C.h.?. Hess on August 12, 1955. n 
referring to letters received since the first meeting,the Chairman pointed u 
that since they dealt with same of the topics includedon the agenda it might be 
CaairabLeto considerthen when the se topics were under discus sion. 

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android

Re: Wanted : HP-150 AND...IBM PC and hp150 compatible 8 or 16 bit Arcnet cards

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

I would also need card for PC also as well as the needed cRds for 
HP-150.NOW IF THE HP HAD REGULAR NETWORK STYLE CARDS  that I could use In 
150 that would be great...  I just do not remember if they were available. Thx. 
Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Sun, Dec 12, 2021 at 3:17 PM, ED SHARPE via cctalk 
wrote:   Ok hearing all this  it makes me want to make HP-150 and a IBM-PC talk 
together!  Does anyone remmber  if hp-150 had  regular like we yse today 
network cards or... if they only had ARCNET cards?
Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Sun, Dec 12, 2021 at 2:59 PM, Jonathan Chapman via 
cctalk wrote:  Mike,

I have some Pure Data PDI508+ ARCnet cards kicking around. I used them to 
develop the repair board for the funky DS1292 "Eliminator" (nonvolatile, 
battery-backed *shift* *register*) that they use.

All,

If you should happen to have Pure Data PDI508+ cards, we have rebuilds for the 
Dallas DS1292 they use -- the rebuilds aren't online yet as we haven't bothered 
to put them into production (this and some versions of the AST RAMpAT! use 
them).

Thanks,
Jonathan

‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐

On Sunday, December 12th, 2021 at 13:06, Grant Taylor via cctalk 
 wrote:

> On 12/12/21 3:05 AM, devin davison via cctalk wrote:
>
> > Greetings,
>
> Hi Devin,
>
> > I had quite a few arcnet cards laying around a while back, I had picked up
> >
> > a ton of them from the back storage of a datacenter that was clearing out
> >
> > surplus equipment. I am uncertain of how many I still have in storage. How
> >
> > many do you need?
>
> I'd like to raise my hand as interested in some ARCNET cards. In a
>
> secondary capacity, after Michael gets his fill.
>
> > If you are able to wait a couple days, I can check how many I have
> >
> > remaining in storage, and I can ship them to you once found.
>
> I can easily wait. I've been occasionally looking for ARCNET cards over
>
> the years as I'd like to play with ARCNET for edutainment purposes. I
>
> have no /need/ for them, only a moderate /desire/.
>
>
> --
>
> Grant. . . .
>
> unix || die
  
  

Re: Wanted : HP-150 AND...IBM PC and hp150 compatible 8 or 16 bit Arcnet cards

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Ok hearing all this  it makes me want to make HP-150 and a IBM-PC talk 
together!  Does anyone remmber  if hp-150 had  regular like we yse today 
network cards or... if they only had ARCNET cards?
Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Sun, Dec 12, 2021 at 2:59 PM, Jonathan Chapman via 
cctalk wrote:   Mike,

I have some Pure Data PDI508+ ARCnet cards kicking around. I used them to 
develop the repair board for the funky DS1292 "Eliminator" (nonvolatile, 
battery-backed *shift* *register*) that they use.

All,

If you should happen to have Pure Data PDI508+ cards, we have rebuilds for the 
Dallas DS1292 they use -- the rebuilds aren't online yet as we haven't bothered 
to put them into production (this and some versions of the AST RAMpAT! use 
them).

Thanks,
Jonathan

‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐

On Sunday, December 12th, 2021 at 13:06, Grant Taylor via cctalk 
 wrote:

> On 12/12/21 3:05 AM, devin davison via cctalk wrote:
>
> > Greetings,
>
> Hi Devin,
>
> > I had quite a few arcnet cards laying around a while back, I had picked up
> >
> > a ton of them from the back storage of a datacenter that was clearing out
> >
> > surplus equipment. I am uncertain of how many I still have in storage. How
> >
> > many do you need?
>
> I'd like to raise my hand as interested in some ARCNET cards. In a
>
> secondary capacity, after Michael gets his fill.
>
> > If you are able to wait a couple days, I can check how many I have
> >
> > remaining in storage, and I can ship them to you once found.
>
> I can easily wait. I've been occasionally looking for ARCNET cards over
>
> the years as I'd like to play with ARCNET for edutainment purposes. I
>
> have no /need/ for them, only a moderate /desire/.
>
>
> --
>
> Grant. . . .
>
> unix || die
  

Re: Wanted: IBM PC compatible 8 or 16 bit Arcnet cards

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

I remember  you  could  get  arcnet   for  HP  150  also   Ed# 

In a message dated 12/11/2021 9:01:15 PM US Mountain Standard Time, 
cctalk@classiccmp.org writes: 
I'm using debug logs to try to debug flow control issues when using mTCPand a 
packet driver that presents itself as Ethernet but actually usesARCNET.  I've 
gotten to the point where I just want to have an Arcnet inthe house.  
Especially since I might just modify mTCP to work with Arcnetpacket drivers and 
cards directly. Before I get too serious with eBay, does anybody want to rehome 
some Arcnethardware?  -Mike

RE: Women of Computing

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Did not see what Liam even said.  I tend to skip anything he posts. As what he 
says do not relate to what I am working on or are corrosive 
Guess I will have to check out the archive! Ed#
Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Sun, Dec 5, 2021 at 9:57 AM, Chris Long via cctalk 
wrote:   The fact I don’t think it is necessary for a Lego set specifically 
endorsing the role of women in computing is unpleasant or mean spirited?

Get a life Liam. I simply expressed my view.

Are we really at a state on this list where when someone posts mentioning 
something, that anyone who expresses any alternative view is behaving 
unacceptably?

Talk about snowflakes.

-Original Message-
From: cctalk  On Behalf Of Liam Proven via cctalk
Sent: 05 December 2021 15:17
To: Doc Shipley ; General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic 
Posts 
Subject: Re: Women of Computing

On Sun, 5 Dec 2021 at 16:09, Doc Shipley via cctalk  
wrote:
>
> On 12/4/21 12:37, Josh Dersch via cctalk wrote:
> >
> > OK, Boomer.
> >
> There's really no call to be nasty about it.
>
> To those of us who are baby boomers, that usage is extremely offensive.

I suspect that was the plan.

Chris Long's email was nasty, unpleasant and a mean-spirited and unpleasant 
thing to say. The fact that they felt the need to say it on a public forum 
indicates either that they do not care what other people feel, or that they 
wanted to cause offence.

When someone is so insensitive that they do not understand that their words can 
hurt others, then sometimes, an effective way to show to them that words can be 
hurtful and that they shouldn't say mean things, is to say something that is 
hurtful to them.

This can illustrate to people who do not normally care about others'
feelings that they do not like it when their own feelings are hurt.

It is, sadly, a common attribute of a certain age group, especially of old 
white straight men, to give little regard to others' feelings like this. They 
typically consider a waste of time any kind of affirmative action that helps, 
boosts, or engages with people who are not old, white, straight and men.

This is a bad way to behave. Nobody should act like that. It violates Wheaton's 
Law, which is a basic principle of how to be a civilised human being.

"OK, Boomer" is just a succinct and clear way of saying "you are an unpleasant 
old man and we do not need to listen to your useless hurtful opinions."

If that sounds like you, then my advice to you is not to complain about it, but 
to engage with it, and learn how not to be such a person, and then go and teach 
other such folk how to be better people.

If it doesn't sound like you, then you should not be bothered by it.

--
Liam Proven ~ Profile: https://about.me/liamproven
Email: lpro...@cix.co.uk ~ gMail/gTalk/FB: lpro...@gmail.com
Twitter/LinkedIn: lproven ~ Skype: liamproven
UK: (+44) 7939-087884 ~ Czech [+ WhatsApp/Telegram/Signal]: (+420) 702-829-053

  

Re: HP 2000 TSB and FORTRAN

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Thank you very much Dave Ave!Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Sun, Nov 21, 2021 at 1:43 PM, David Williams via 
cctalk wrote:   For anyone who is interested, I have 
scanned and posted the OMSI 2000 
FORTRAN manuals to archive.org. Will also post them to my site later.

It looks like there are three manuals. The first is missing the front 
cover and just starts with "Section 1" but seems to be for students who 
are learning to program in FORTRAN with the system. The second is a 
guide and answer key for the instructor and the third appears to be for 
the system operator.

There seems to be two different versions of OMSI 2000 FORTRAN, one for 
TSB B/E and another for TSB C/F which seems to have additional features.

David Williams
www.trailingedge.com
  

Re: Getting files from HP 3000l ll business noretapes (was: Re: HP 2000 TSB and FORTRAN)

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Gavin !Indeed Keven  is great  at 3000 stuff!I  would  love  to  visit   him   
but  I do not  transport   well  any more alas.. Simulated  series III   
yes  more power efficient than  the  real  series III But  we  still seek  a  
eal one  for  display!Ed# 
In a message dated 11/19/2021 7:17:49 PM US Mountain Standard Time, 
ga...@learn.bio writes: 
Ed,

Maybe you could take a vacation to Oregon and meet up with Keven
Miller and get him to convert your tapes to SIMH format for you while
you watch and then wipe any intermediate storage to your satisfaction.
Or just come up with some sort of non-disclosure agreement that would
meet your requirements (bonus points for using a 1980s HP Confidential
Disclosure Agreement form (which no manager at HP could ever fill out
correctly)).

http://www.3kranger.com/3ktapes.shtm

And then when you get home you can make a nice virtual simulated
Series III and restore whatever you want to play with.

Beware of the possibility of delamination and other issues for old
9-track tapes depending on age/manufacturer/storage. Another reason it
might be good to get help from someone with experience in reading very
old tapes.

It would be fun to see the Forum up and running again.

Gavin

On Fri, Nov 19, 2021 at 7:13 PM ED SHARPE via cctalk
 wrote:
>
> Heh!  Now that I have calmed down..I  do wish I had kept a  separate dump of  
> just bbs systems. For 2000 and 3000. And the multi user space war game.
> Actually the 3000 full volume of everything I ever did or said  was 
> discovered in the garage at home 1  year or maybe more back.
> The 800 bpi  tapes for 2000 I knew I had somewhere. But onlyvtefound again 
> last winter and...  in reality it was a miracle they were  saved.
> We haveca Hp 918 that  was recently put of service  And a hp 37 that I assume 
> that still bopys boots  that were graciously  contributed  but the big 
> stumbling block is. TAPEDRIVES!  WELL.I HAVE A DDS-3 CART ON 918 BUT NO 
> WORKEE WITH REEL TAPES @
> I AM GETTING PRETTY. OLD NOW  BUT IN THE FEW YEARS I HAVE LEFT WOULD LIKE TO 
> GET BOTH BBS SYSTEMS BACK OUT THERE
> THE 2000 VERSION  HAD A REGULAR VERSION. THAT MIGRATED INTO A FANITSY  THEMED 
> VERSION BOTH SHOLD BE ON 800 bpi TAPE(This tape set had hardest storage 
> conditions
> The 3000 version  should gave  both converted versions of the 2000  bbs's. 
> Plus The Forum/3000. massive even more  and no non nonsense  but even more  
> massave in features and refinement.
> Security is totally killer on all.There us no way I would be able to recreate 
>  these systems  now due to some brain slowing  but if you have not noticed  I 
> do not type well at all.. part coordination  part tfu hand and finger 
> movement( thanks to those who take time to decipher  what I type ( I worked 
> had to make  this and previous message  readable )
> Anyway seems maybe easiest way  is with simulators  once we get a 800 1600 
> built tape drive on it..
> As always any help ...ideas..hardware appreciated But keep in mind.  Transfer 
> has to take place HERE!Ed Sharpe archivist For SMECC
>
>
>
>
>
>

Smecc hp 2000 enclosed in glass being used as a backdrop for phx business journal cio of the year award. [PDF]Back to the Futuremedia.bizj.us/view/archive/phoenix/pdf/CIOs 2012 Final.pdf

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

http://media.bizj.us/view/archive/phoenix/pdf/CIOs%202012%20Final.pdf
Sent from the all new AOL app for Android

Ogle hpq00q0

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

No. Jay  thought answered this missing disk. A. Hp 2883 20meg 10 platter high 
nice glass top could see heads going in and out. Fun!  Also had 2884 slave 
drive to it. Google hp2000 and smecc for old pix from the 80s.
Would not start  up machines unless I had spare 2100 processor.  
System is on a glassed in area with lots of 80s era hppc related things  my 
business.  Computer Exchange sold.Ah the 80s!  It was the time to be in the biz!
Gaint walk in display case but3 very very filled Last I looked there was acn 
off brand  APL LAPTOP  THAT USEF A MICRO CASSETTE FOR MASS STORAGE!would have 
to clean out and get real power  and a temp air duct into there Maybe hp 
2000emulator and a scssi tape drive?   The 3000 tape has converted  versions  
and the final. FORUM/3000  but those will not run on 2000.. And the 2000 I 
think is the one I get the most request for 
Ed#Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Fri, Nov 19, 2021 at 6:31 AM, jwest--- via cctalk 
wrote:  
Ed# I thought the only thing preventing you from getting one of your systems up 
was memory, which I offered to fix. You need a tape drive too? I may have a 
spare 7970B that needs work but I really need to get down there and do an 
inventory

J


  

RE: Getting files from HP 3000l ll business noretapes (was: Re: HP 2000 TSB and FORTRAN)

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Heh!  Now that I have calmed down..I  do wish I had kept a  separate dump of  
just bbs systems. For 2000 and 3000. And the multi user space war game.
Actually the 3000 full volume of everything I ever did or said  was discovered 
in the garage at home 1  year or maybe more back. 
The 800 bpi  tapes for 2000 I knew I had somewhere. But onlyvtefound again last 
winter and...  in reality it was a miracle they were  saved.
We haveca Hp 918 that  was recently put of service  And a hp 37 that I assume 
that still bopys boots  that were graciously  contributed  but the big 
stumbling block is. TAPEDRIVES!   WELL.I HAVE A DDS-3 CART ON 918 BUT NO WORKEE 
WITH REEL TAPES @
I AM GETTING PRETTY. OLD NOW  BUT IN THE FEW YEARS I HAVE LEFT WOULD LIKE TO 
GET BOTH BBS SYSTEMS BACK OUT THERE 
THE 2000 VERSION  HAD A REGULAR VERSION. THAT MIGRATED INTO A FANITSY  THEMED 
VERSION BOTH SHOLD BE ON 800 bpi TAPE(This tape set had hardest storage 
conditions 
The 3000 version  should gave  both converted versions of the 2000  bbs's. Plus 
The Forum/3000. massive even more  and no non nonsense  but even more   massave 
in features and refinement. 
Security is totally killer on all.There us no way I would be able to recreate  
these systems  now due to some brain slowing  but if you have not noticed  I do 
not type well at all.. part coordination  part tfu hand and finger movement( 
thanks to those who take time to decipher  what I type ( I worked had to make  
this and previous message  readable )
Anyway seems maybe easiest way  is with simulators  once we get a 800 1600 
built tape drive on it..
As always any help ...ideas..hardware appreciated But keep in mind.  Transfer 
has to take place HERE!Ed Sharpe archivist For SMECC




  
  

RE: Getting files from HP 3000l ll business noretapes (was: Re: HP 2000 TSB and FORTRAN)

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

AH NO! JAY! To compare Jay.. it was like if our system was your cell phone 
your pcs and your business computer contents all in one system.
I  doubt you would release  that into public hands.

I used our 2000 and 3000. As my personal. PC Jay!  Letters to my family. Notes 
to myself... poetry articles I wrote for 5. Years  for. THE CHRONICLE (HP 
CENTRIC NEWS PAPER)  anything  a computer was used for is how I always used our 
systems. 
  ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING!


These back ups contain all of all of all!  
Not just a dump of a bbs and multi user spacecraft games  and most of all the 
fun stuff.
Now if you do not understand my wish for personal privacy  we need to 
recalibrate you.  (GRIN!)
so there  you go!


Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Fri, Nov 19, 2021 at 3:43 PM, jw...@classiccmp.org 
wrote:   Ed wrote...

It is solved when I have a tape drive at our physical location to restore our 
tapes to our system buy US.

 Perhaps in the interest of saving history for everyone else, you could meet in 
the middle (figuratively) with a less inward-looking mentality?

Unless you're fine setting conditions that you're unlikely to meet and then the 
bits go to the ether..the loss is your fault yet everyone suffers.

J


  

RE: HP 2000 TSB and FORTRAN

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Jay have a tape drive. On the system... missing the disk. Some how we lost the 
2883 and 2884 drive during business shutdown in 1993.   Currently the 2 Bay  
system sits under glass  with a grouping of other early and 80s era HP PC 
product line. 
 YEA I WOULD WANT TO HAVE ON HAND AN EXTRA PROCESSER TO FOR SPARES. 
  AGE OLD COMPUTER EXCHANGE METHODOLOGY... NEVR START A PROJECT WITHOUT SPARES 
ON HAND!
Maybe the future  is bringing up a fake 2000 in orig form... a PC  as well as a 
 3000. With a scssi... tape drive  that thinks it can be a 7970b  for 2000 
emulation  and 7970e for 3000 program emulation. ... and just crank both on and 
emulator... 
But.  it would  be fun to see the 2000 come alive in some form before I 
croak  and turn the keys of the museum to the next gen.Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Fri, Nov 19, 2021 at 6:31 AM, jwest--- via cctalk 
wrote:   David wrote...

The manual says it was known as OSMI 2000 FORTRAN and was a "series of programs 
written in the BASIC language which run short FORTRAN programs" 
on an HP 2000 BASIC system. Anyone heard of this before?

I still have a few hp2000 systems running. I haven't seen the fortran one yet 
but would be surprised if it wasn't on one of my HIB tapes. But I do remember 
having this on the HP2K systems I used in high school. There was also a free 
contributed library COBOL runtime that was the same deal (implemented in 
BASIC), and there was one in the CSL that also ran HP 2100 assembler. That last 
one I'd love to find just to pour through the listings 

Ed# I thought the only thing preventing you from getting one of your systems up 
was memory, which I offered to fix. You need a tape drive too? I may have a 
spare 7970B that needs work but I really need to get down there and do an 
inventory

J


  

RE: HP 2000 TSB and FORTRAN

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

Yep if is says omsi fortran you are the lucky holder if a copy of it!   
Congrats!;Ed#

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Fri, Nov 19, 2021 at 1:39 PM, Bob brown via cctalk 
wrote:   It looks like I may have the OMNI fortran on "mickey", my publicly 
accessible hp2000 tsb system emulation.

telnet to mickey.publicvm.com
ctl-J, ctl-m till you get PLEASE LOG IN
HEL-T001,HP2000,1


I see some kind of cobol on the system library which may or may not be the 
cobol that was being talked about...
I do see fortran which does seem to claim to be the OMNI fortran.

Since you have the manuals, feel free to play around.

If you need permissions changed or if it would be easier if the programs/files 
were put on a different account, just let me know...I'd be happy to copy/move 
things around for you.

-Bob


-Original Message-
From: cctalk  On Behalf Of David Williams via 
cctalk
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2021 12:42 PM
To: ED SHARPE ; General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic 
Posts 
Subject: Re: HP 2000 TSB and FORTRAN

On 11/19/2021 11:41 AM, ED SHARPE wrote:
> Trying to remembrr how many pages it was?

Looking through what I have here I'm finding out this is actually more than one 
manual. Looks like three so far with each being between about
40-50 pages (single sided photocopies).

First part is just labeled "Section One Standard FORTRAN". The next is "OMSI 
2000 FORTRAN Answer Key and Instructor's Guide" and the third is "OMSI 2000 
FORTRAN Sep 15th, 1973 Manual (Pre-Publication Proof)".

Funny that I was just up in Portland last month and visited OMSI...

David Williams
www.trailingedge.com

  

Re: Getting files from HP 3000 tapes (was: Re: HP 2000 TSB and FORTRAN)

[ED SHARPE via cctalk]

It is solved when I have a tape drive at our physical location to restore our 
tapes to our system buy US. 

Sent from the all new AOL app for Android 
 
  On Fri, Nov 19, 2021 at 12:27 PM, Stan Sieler wrote:   Ed 
writes:   ?If? we? ever? ?get? a? way? to? read? tapes? ? for? the? 2000 and? 
3000?

Well, we can "read" tapes for the HP 3000, and restore the files from HP 3000 
backup tapes ... via Allegro Consultant's "ROSETTA STORE" product (of which I'm 
the primary author).
I'm happy to restore some files for fellow collectors/enthusiasts (as 
time/energy permits) for free.
The problem breaks down into two parts:
1. reading the tape
Although Rosetta can read from a physical tape drive, that capability hasn't 
been tested for a decade (because of loss of hardware).
Every user we know of uses Rosetta to restore files from tape images.
There are a number of formats of tape images ... quite a number.
Rosetta understands many tape image formats, including:    AWS / HET
    STORE-to-disk
    SIMH
    Stromasys tape image
    Tapecopy format (Data Conversion Resources)
(Oddly, I think it doesn't understand Allegro's own proprietary tape image 
format, which records a lot more information than others (e.g., read-retry 
information).)
If  you need an HP 3000 'STORE' tape recovered, and it's in a different format, 
let me know.

2. extracting files from the tape image
Rosetta can read Classic HP 3000 STORE tapes (aka "CM STORE") of various 
versions, and MPE/iX STORE tapes (aka "NM STORE") of various versions (although 
'interleave' has been tested only very lightly).
By "read" I mean that it extracts the desired files, converts some (with some 
controls), and creates either a hierarchical directory structure matching the 
original, or a flattened one.
What about IMAGE databases?On some platforms (Linux, HP-UX, Windows (?)), IMAGE 
databases can be converted to Eloquence databases (Eloquence is a product of 
Marxmeier software).On all platforms, IMAGE databases can be converted to .csv 
or .xml files.
It can also handle SLT tapes, and provide some information on a few other kinds 
of tapes one might see from an HP 3000 (e.g., dump tapes, Serial Disc images), 
SPOOK tapes.
Rosetta runs on Mac, Linux, HP-UX, and Windows.
The HP-UX version can read older versions of ORBiT's Online Backup tapes 
(before they changed the tape record header format)
TL;DR   Ed: for the 3000, it's essentially a solved problem, and has been for 
over 20 years!

Note: I also have a utility to restore files from (older?) Burroughs mainframe 
(e.g., B6700) backup tapes.