swtpc, mikeholley, early computer stores

[jwest--- via cctalk]

Contacts have been made to secure disposition of Bill Dawson and Mike
Holley's site/contents. As part of that effort, I pointed swtpc.org to what
used to be swtpc.com (and also swtpc.org). So if you go to swtpc.org you can
traverse both sites. But that is not why I'm posting..

 

So in doing this and fixing a few links, I noticed there was a lot of
pictures and info on "first computer store in..." information, apparently
written by Mike Holley and we were just talking about that topic here. Some
may want to go hunting for the computer store that was an adult movie place
heh

 

J

Re: Computer stores

[Eric Smith via cctalk]

On Tue, Aug 25, 2020 at 10:28 PM Hagstrom, Paul via cctalk <
cctalk@classiccmp.org> wrote:

> The circuit boards say "Apple Computer 1" on them.  So they had the
> optimistic "1" in the name originally.
>

The user manual, schematic, and some but not all advertisements also say
"Apple 1" or "Apple-1".

I haven't seen any official documents or communication that used the roman
numeral "I", though some third-party material does.

Re: Computer stores

[Alan Frisbie via cctalk]

Fred Cisin  wrote:

> On Tue, 25 Aug 2020, Alan Frisbie via cctalk wrote:

> > A few months later, two guys named Steve showed up at a meeting
> > with a kit they called the "Apple I", for the grand price of
> > $666.66.  I wish I had had the foresight to buy one!

> Q: although WE call it "Apple I", did the Steves call it "Apple I" or
> "Apple Computer"? The answer tells us whether they were explicitly
> planning on  making other models later!

I honestly do not recall if they used the "I" or not.  This was,
after all, 45 years ago!

At that time there were many tiny startup companies trying to get
our attention, most of which sank without a trace.  If I had been
asked back then which ones I thought would survive, I probably
would not have picked Apple.  Not my first mistake, and certainly
not my last.  :-)

Those *were* exciting days, with new products and developments
happening every month.  I looked forward to every SCCS meeting,
with people showing off their latest homebrew project, swapping
tips, and buying parts & boards.  For a while, there was even
a large wheel of cheese which we eagerly devoured.  :-)

Alan Frisbie

Re: Computer stores

[Fred Cisin via cctalk]

Q: although WE call it "Apple I", did the Steves call it "Apple I" or "Apple 
Computer"?
The answer tells us whether they were explicitly planning on  making other 
models later!
Wikipedia (a terrible choice of citation in anything DISPUTED) says that the 
'1' came later, and says that the first demonstration was by Woz at the Palo 
Alto Homebrew Computer Club.   (Started by Gordon French and Fred Moore, with 
Lee Felsenstein soon after)

For example, what we call "TRS80 Model 1" was NOT called "Model 1" until the "Model 
2" (and then 3) was announced
What we call "World War 1" was not called "1", nor even "World War", until "World 
War 2" was obvious.
What we call "single density" was not called "single density" until MFM was developed, 
and the MARKETING people called MFM "double density".


On Wed, 26 Aug 2020, Hagstrom, Paul wrote:

Kind of hopping in in the middle of an ongoing discussion that I haven't been 
following, but:
The circuit boards say "Apple Computer 1" on them.  So they had the optimistic 
"1" in the name originally.


Thank you.
That is more trustworthy and definitive than Wikipedia.
It shows that they considered the possibility that it was not solely a 
one-shot venture.
It may seem like an irrelevaant piece of trivia, but it is interesting to 
go back to what our expectations had been.



Yeah.  I know.  Like how I felt that it was important to create captions 
for "Hyperland"


--
Grumpy Ol' Fred ci...@xenosoft.com

Re: Computer stores

[Hagstrom, Paul via cctalk]

Kind of hopping in in the middle of an ongoing discussion that I haven't been 
following, but:

> On Aug 25, 2020, at 10:51 PM, Fred Cisin via cctalk  
> wrote:
> 

> Q: although WE call it "Apple I", did the Steves call it "Apple I" or "Apple 
> Computer"?
> The answer tells us whether they were explicitly planning on  making other 
> models later!
> Wikipedia (a terrible choice of citation in anything DISPUTED) says that the 
> '1' came later, and says that the first demonstration was by Woz at the Palo 
> Alto Homebrew Computer Club.   (Started by Gordon French and Fred Moore, with 
> Lee Felsenstein soon after)
> 
> 
> For example, what we call "TRS80 Model 1" was NOT called "Model 1" until the 
> "Model 2" (and then 3) was announced
> What we call "World War 1" was not called "1", nor even "World War", until 
> "World War 2" was obvious.
> What we call "single density" was not called "single density" until MFM was 
> developed, and the MARKETING people called MFM "double density".

The circuit boards say "Apple Computer 1" on them.  So they had the optimistic 
"1" in the name originally.

 -Paul

Re: Computer stores

[Fred Cisin via cctalk]

On Tue, 25 Aug 2020, Alan Frisbie via cctalk wrote:

Dick was a regular fixture at meetings of the Southern California
Computer Society (SCCS), often making deliveries and taking orders
there.  In those days, SCCS monthly meetings were *the* place for
computer geeks to get together and exchange news and get help.

A few months later, two guys named Steve showed up at a meeting
with a kit they called the "Apple I", for the grand price of
$666.66.  I wish I had had the foresight to buy one!  Instead,
I wound up joining the SCCS group purchase of DEC LSI-11 systems.
I still have that system, with a case and power supply from a
TRW surplus sale.  It isn't worth nearly as much as an original
Apple I, though!  :-)


"Worth"??
Value can be more than what price they currently sell for.

Q: although WE call it "Apple I", did the Steves call it "Apple I" or 
"Apple Computer"?
The answer tells us whether they were explicitly planning on  making other 
models later!
Wikipedia (a terrible choice of citation in anything DISPUTED) says that 
the '1' came later, and says that the first demonstration was by Woz at 
the Palo Alto Homebrew Computer Club.   (Started by Gordon French and Fred 
Moore, with Lee Felsenstein soon after)



For example, what we call "TRS80 Model 1" was NOT called "Model 1" until 
the "Model 2" (and then 3) was announced
What we call "World War 1" was not called "1", nor even "World War", 
until "World War 2" was obvious.
What we call "single density" was not called "single density" until MFM 
was developed, and the MARKETING people called MFM "double density".



--
Grumpy Ol' Fred ci...@xenosoft.com

Re: Computer stores

[Alan Frisbie via cctalk]

On 8/22/20 8:52 AM, Murray McCullough via cctalk wrote:
> 45 yrs. ago last month, mid-July, Dick Heiser started a new industry, 
> the retail computer store. It opened in West L.A. under the name

> Arrow Head Computer Company. aka, The Computer Store. This began the
> direct marketing of microcomputers to hobbyists, later to the masses
> of the middle class.

Slight correction:  The name was Arrowhead (one word, not two) Computer
Company.

I remember this very well.  I was living in Santa Monica at the time,
and drove down Pico Boulevard almost every day.  Needless to say, I
immediately noticed the "Computer Store" sign and stopped in, soon
becoming one of the regular "hangers on".

Dick Heiser and his wife Lois were taking a big chance, but it
proved to be a good bet.  Initially, their business consisted of
buying Altair 8800 kits and assembling them in the back of the
store.  A lot of people were happy to pay extra to not have to
solder all those hundreds of connections.

Dick was a regular fixture at meetings of the Southern California
Computer Society (SCCS), often making deliveries and taking orders
there.  In those days, SCCS monthly meetings were *the* place for
computer geeks to get together and exchange news and get help.

A few months later, two guys named Steve showed up at a meeting
with a kit they called the "Apple I", for the grand price of
$666.66.  I wish I had had the foresight to buy one!  Instead,
I wound up joining the SCCS group purchase of DEC LSI-11 systems.
I still have that system, with a case and power supply from a
TRW surplus sale.  It isn't worth nearly as much as an original
Apple I, though!  :-)

Alan "Hindsight is 20-20" Frisbie

Re: 1U VAX, was: Re: Computer stores

[John H. Reinhardt via cctalk]

On 8/25/2020 3:00 PM, David Brownlee via cctalk wrote:

On Tue, 25 Aug 2020 at 19:46, John Klos via cctalk
 wrote:

I was going to comment that the only way I could see a 1U VAX was if
someone rack mounted a 4000/VLC.  Is that the stock VLC power supply?
My cluster doesn?t even have that much space.

What do you use to go from SATA to SCSI (SCSI-1 even)?

It's a standard 1U power supply with a custom adapter. You can see it
better here:

https://twitter.com/AnachronistJohn/status/1294725819038752768

I use a SATA to IDE adapter, then an IDE to UW-SCSI adapter, then an
UW-SCSI cable and terminator, then finally a 68 to 50 pin adapter.

The previous drive was a Samsung SSD, but I think that constant, non-stop
swap use wore it out. This was the smallest new spinning rust drive I
could find.

SCSI2SD would work for a while, but, again, swap usage would wear out an
SD card in no time, I'm sure.

Wow, I'm surprised the VLC could generate enough traffic to wear out
an SSD - compared to a modern box running heavy compiles and suchlike.

Very cool box :)

Thinking about SCSI devices for my collection of older boxes - I
wonder if rascsi set to use the pi's RAM rather than an SD card to
provide a swap device would work out.
Actually, could be interesting to run a modern *nix box with the right
type of scsi adapter in target mode and have it "export" devices and
or ramdrives to older boxes...

David

Make sure you use a higher quality SD card.  Something labeled "High Endurance" or 
"Industrial".  They have internal wear leveling firmware to spread the writes/erases out 
over the memory array and help keep it from getting any hot spots that wear out quickly.  It won't 
last forever but it will help it last longer.

Examples: High Endurance: 


Industrial: 

It may seem wasteful, but if planning on long life for an SD card that is the 
O/S drive then get something big and only use a portion of it so that the wear 
leveling can work with more.  So if you want a 16GB disk, then get a 32GB or 
even 64GB SD card and use SCSI2SD's internal partitioning to only use 1/2 or 
1/4 of the full drive.

That's my theory anyway.  I'll let you know in a year or three if it worked. I 
have SCSI2SD in two AlphaServer DS10's, a MicroVAX 3100 and a PDP-11.  I also 
use the same theory in a couple Raspberry Pi's.  The Pi's use log2ram for the 
/var/log files to help also. They don't actually swap much.

--
John H. Reinhardt

Re: 1U VAX, was: Re: Computer stores

[David Brownlee via cctalk]

On Tue, 25 Aug 2020 at 19:46, John Klos via cctalk
 wrote:
>
> > I was going to comment that the only way I could see a 1U VAX was if
> > someone rack mounted a 4000/VLC.  Is that the stock VLC power supply?
> > My cluster doesn?t even have that much space.
> >
> > What do you use to go from SATA to SCSI (SCSI-1 even)?
>
> It's a standard 1U power supply with a custom adapter. You can see it
> better here:
>
> https://twitter.com/AnachronistJohn/status/1294725819038752768
>
> I use a SATA to IDE adapter, then an IDE to UW-SCSI adapter, then an
> UW-SCSI cable and terminator, then finally a 68 to 50 pin adapter.
>
> The previous drive was a Samsung SSD, but I think that constant, non-stop
> swap use wore it out. This was the smallest new spinning rust drive I
> could find.
>
> SCSI2SD would work for a while, but, again, swap usage would wear out an
> SD card in no time, I'm sure.

Wow, I'm surprised the VLC could generate enough traffic to wear out
an SSD - compared to a modern box running heavy compiles and suchlike.

Very cool box :)

Thinking about SCSI devices for my collection of older boxes - I
wonder if rascsi set to use the pi's RAM rather than an SD card to
provide a swap device would work out.
Actually, could be interesting to run a modern *nix box with the right
type of scsi adapter in target mode and have it "export" devices and
or ramdrives to older boxes...

David

Re: 1U VAX, was: Re: Computer stores

[Zane Healy via cctalk]

On Aug 25, 2020, at 11:46 AM, John Klos via cctalk  
wrote:
> 
>> I was going to comment that the only way I could see a 1U VAX was if someone 
>> rack mounted a 4000/VLC.  Is that the stock VLC power supply? My cluster 
>> doesn?t even have that much space.
>> 
>> What do you use to go from SATA to SCSI (SCSI-1 even)?
> 
> It's a standard 1U power supply with a custom adapter. You can see it better 
> here:
> 
> https://twitter.com/AnachronistJohn/status/1294725819038752768
> 
> I use a SATA to IDE adapter, then an IDE to UW-SCSI adapter, then an UW-SCSI 
> cable and terminator, then finally a 68 to 50 pin adapter.
> 
> The previous drive was a Samsung SSD, but I think that constant, non-stop 
> swap use wore it out. This was the smallest new spinning rust drive I could 
> find.
> 
> SCSI2SD would work for a while, but, again, swap usage would wear out an SD 
> card in no time, I'm sure.
> 
> John

Thanks!  That is good to know, as the power supply in my VLC has issues.  As it 
stands, the VLC was replaced with a VAXstation 4000/60 a friend gave me.  I’m 
still using DEC drives in a BA350 (originally a DEC BA353).  At some point, I 
should simply move it to a VM, as I’ve done with the rest of my DEC systems.  
I’d like to convert either the VAXstation 4000/vlc or the 4000/60 back to being 
a desktop.  Right now the 4000/60 is mounted in a rack, and is my DECnet Area 
Router.

Zane

Re: 1U VAX, was: Re: Computer stores

[John Klos via cctalk]

I was going to comment that the only way I could see a 1U VAX was if 
someone rack mounted a 4000/VLC.  Is that the stock VLC power supply? 
My cluster doesn?t even have that much space.


What do you use to go from SATA to SCSI (SCSI-1 even)?


It's a standard 1U power supply with a custom adapter. You can see it 
better here:


https://twitter.com/AnachronistJohn/status/1294725819038752768

I use a SATA to IDE adapter, then an IDE to UW-SCSI adapter, then an 
UW-SCSI cable and terminator, then finally a 68 to 50 pin adapter.


The previous drive was a Samsung SSD, but I think that constant, non-stop 
swap use wore it out. This was the smallest new spinning rust drive I 
could find.


SCSI2SD would work for a while, but, again, swap usage would wear out an 
SD card in no time, I'm sure.


John

Re: 1U VAX, was: Re: Computer stores

[emanuel stiebler via cctalk]

On 2020-08-24 23:21, Antonio Carlini via cctalk wrote:
> On 24/08/2020 21:34, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote:
>> On Aug 24, 2020, at 7:06 AM, John Klos via cctalk
>>  wrote:
 OK, I'll bite ;-)
 What is it exactly?
 There was a rtVAX on VME, which could be easily configured as 1U, but
 what do you have?
>>> https://twitter.com/AnachronistJohn/status/1291815674570891264
>>>
>>> It's a VAXstation 4000/30 (also known as VLC) with a 500 gig SATA
>>> drive in a 1U case. It's colocated in a proper datacenter right now :D
>>>
>>> John
>> I was going to comment that the only way I could see a 1U VAX was if
>> someone rack mounted a 4000/VLC.  Is that the stock VLC power supply? 
>> My cluster doesn’t even have that much space.
>>
>> Zane
>>
>>
> What do you use to go from SATA to SCSI (SCSI-1 even)?

I (not John ;-) ) switched on my 4000s to the SCSI2SD, and I'm pretty
happy with them. 6 partitions on one SD, and works nicely ...

Re: 1U VAX, was: Re: Computer stores

[emanuel stiebler via cctalk]

On 2020-08-24 16:06, John Klos via cctalk wrote:
>> OK, I'll bite ;-)
>> What is it exactly?
>> There was a rtVAX on VME, which could be easily configured as 1U, but
>> what do you have?
> 
> https://twitter.com/AnachronistJohn/status/1291815674570891264
> 
> It's a VAXstation 4000/30 (also known as VLC) with a 500 gig SATA drive
> in a 1U case. It's colocated in a proper datacenter right now :D

Interesting, I have (after moving) some VLCs with broken fronts,
so his would be nice to pu them in a rack ;-)

Re: 1U VAX, was: Re: Computer stores

[Antonio Carlini via cctalk]

On 24/08/2020 21:34, Zane Healy via cctalk wrote:

On Aug 24, 2020, at 7:06 AM, John Klos via cctalk  wrote:

OK, I'll bite ;-)
What is it exactly?
There was a rtVAX on VME, which could be easily configured as 1U, but
what do you have?

https://twitter.com/AnachronistJohn/status/1291815674570891264

It's a VAXstation 4000/30 (also known as VLC) with a 500 gig SATA drive in a 1U 
case. It's colocated in a proper datacenter right now :D

John

I was going to comment that the only way I could see a 1U VAX was if someone 
rack mounted a 4000/VLC.  Is that the stock VLC power supply?  My cluster 
doesn’t even have that much space.

Zane



What do you use to go from SATA to SCSI (SCSI-1 even)?

Antonio

--
Antonio Carlini
anto...@acarlini.com

Re: 1U VAX, was: Re: Computer stores

[Zane Healy via cctalk]

On Aug 24, 2020, at 7:06 AM, John Klos via cctalk  wrote:
> 
>> OK, I'll bite ;-)
>> What is it exactly?
>> There was a rtVAX on VME, which could be easily configured as 1U, but
>> what do you have?
> 
> https://twitter.com/AnachronistJohn/status/1291815674570891264
> 
> It's a VAXstation 4000/30 (also known as VLC) with a 500 gig SATA drive in a 
> 1U case. It's colocated in a proper datacenter right now :D
> 
> John

I was going to comment that the only way I could see a 1U VAX was if someone 
rack mounted a 4000/VLC.  Is that the stock VLC power supply?  My cluster 
doesn’t even have that much space.

Zane

Re: 1U VAX, was: Re: Computer stores

[John Klos via cctalk]

OK, I'll bite ;-)
What is it exactly?
There was a rtVAX on VME, which could be easily configured as 1U, but
what do you have?


https://twitter.com/AnachronistJohn/status/1291815674570891264

It's a VAXstation 4000/30 (also known as VLC) with a 500 gig SATA drive in 
a 1U case. It's colocated in a proper datacenter right now :D


John

1U VAX, was: Re: Computer stores

[emanuel stiebler via cctalk]

On 2020-08-23 21:06, John Klos via cctalk wrote:

> Relatedly, I have what I think is the only 1U VAX in the world. I've
> mentioned this in many places, but if someone says I'm wrong and shows
> me an example of another, it would please me, not upset me. I'll have
> learned of another :)

OK, I'll bite ;-)
What is it exactly?
There was a rtVAX on VME, which could be easily configured as 1U, but
what do you have?

Re: Computer Stores

[Wayne Smith via cctalk]

The LA Times called it the first computer store in a story in December
1975.  The first ad for the store ran in July of that year.  I've put
scans of the article and the ad here:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/S53vBGs6irzqoLR37 

> Message: 7
> Date: Sat, 22 Aug 2020 22:02:53 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Fred Cisin 
> To: "General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts"
>   
> Subject: Re: Computer stores
> Message-ID: 
> Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=utf-8; format=flowed
> 
> When dozens or hundreds start up within weeks or months of each
> other,
> every one is important, and most are interesting, but "FIRST" or
> "STARTED
> THE TREND" (implying being the "first") cease to really mean
anything.
> 
> It's generally better to never use the word "FIRST"; there is almost
> always a lesser known one that was earlier.
> 
> The trend from being a sideline within a business, to becoming the
> primary focus of the business can seem anticlimactic, but is what
marks
> the core of the transition.
> Think of Fry's, NLS, etc.
> 
> 
> On Sat, 22 Aug 2020, jim stephens via cctalk wrote:
> 
> >
> >
> > On 8/22/2020 9:53 AM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote:
> >> On 8/22/20 8:52 AM, Murray McCullough via cctalk wrote:
> >>> 45 yrs. ago last month, mid-July, Dick Heiser started a new
> industry, the
> >>> retail computer store. It opened in West L.A. under the name
> Arrow Head
> >>> COmputer Company. aka, The Computer Store. This began the
> direct marketing
> >>> of microcomputers to hobbyists, later to the masses of the
middle
> class,
> >>> albeit a small market 45 yrs. ago.
> >>>
> >>> Happy computing.
> >>>
> >>> Murray  ?
> >> Does this precede Paul Terrell's Byte Shop #1 in Mountain View,
> CA?
> >>
> >> --Chuck
> >>
> > Not soon after, Dave and Tom Freeman, Advanced Computer
> Products in Santa
> > Ana, CA.
> > thanks
> > JIm
> 

Re: Computer stores

[John Klos via cctalk]

When dozens or hundreds start up within weeks or months of each other, 
every one is important, and most are interesting, but "FIRST" or 
"STARTED THE TREND" (implying being the "first") cease to really mean 
anything.


It's generally better to never use the word "FIRST"; there is almost 
always a lesser known one that was earlier.


That might be true for discussions where people don't care to do any 
research, or where words like "first" are uses more for hyperbolic 
emphasis, but suggesting someone started an industry on a list like this, 
I think, doesn't seem out of place.


If someone has examples of this being wrong, he / she will say so, and 
we'll all learn. If not, the original message has conveyed useful 
information.


Relatedly, I have what I think is the only 1U VAX in the world. I've 
mentioned this in many places, but if someone says I'm wrong and shows me 
an example of another, it would please me, not upset me. I'll have learned 
of another :)


John

Re: Computer stores

[Fred Cisin via cctalk]

When dozens or hundreds start up within weeks or months of each other, 
every one is important, and most are interesting, but "FIRST" or "STARTED 
THE TREND" (implying being the "first") cease to really mean anything.


It's generally better to never use the word "FIRST"; there is almost 
always a lesser known one that was earlier.


The trend from being a sideline within a business, to becoming the 
primary focus of the business can seem anticlimactic, but is what marks 
the core of the transition.

Think of Fry's, NLS, etc.


On Sat, 22 Aug 2020, jim stephens via cctalk wrote:




On 8/22/2020 9:53 AM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote:

On 8/22/20 8:52 AM, Murray McCullough via cctalk wrote:

45 yrs. ago last month, mid-July, Dick Heiser started a new industry, the
retail computer store. It opened in West L.A. under the name Arrow Head
COmputer Company. aka, The Computer Store. This began the direct marketing
of microcomputers to hobbyists, later to the masses of the middle class,
albeit a small market 45 yrs. ago.

Happy computing.

Murray  

Does this precede Paul Terrell's Byte Shop #1 in Mountain View, CA?

--Chuck

Not soon after, Dave and Tom Freeman, Advanced Computer Products in Santa 
Ana, CA.

thanks
JIm

Re: Computer stores

[jim stephens via cctalk]

On 8/22/2020 9:53 AM, Chuck Guzis via cctalk wrote:

On 8/22/20 8:52 AM, Murray McCullough via cctalk wrote:

45 yrs. ago last month, mid-July, Dick Heiser started a new industry, the
retail computer store. It opened in West L.A. under the name Arrow Head
COmputer Company. aka, The Computer Store. This began the direct marketing
of microcomputers to hobbyists, later to the masses of the middle class,
albeit a small market 45 yrs. ago.

Happy computing.

Murray  

Does this precede Paul Terrell's Byte Shop #1 in Mountain View, CA?

--Chuck

Not soon after, Dave and Tom Freeman, Advanced Computer Products in 
Santa Ana, CA.

thanks
JIm

Re: Computer stores

[Will Cooke via cctalk]

> On August 22, 2020 at 12:15 PM Lyle Bickley via cctech 
>  wrote:
> 
> On Sat, 22 Aug 2020 11:52:19 -0400Murray McCullough via cctalk 
>  wrote:
> > 45 yrs. ago last month, mid-July, Dick Heiser started a new industry, 
> > theretail computer store. It opened in West L.A. under the name Arrow 
> > HeadCOmputer Company. aka, The Computer Store. This began the direct 
> > marketingof microcomputers to hobbyists, later to the masses of the middle 
> > class,albeit a small market 45 yrs. ago.
> > Happy computing.Claiming "First" in computer "anything" is just about 
> > always a dangerous thing;)



> But for sure, several personal computer stores existed 45 years ago!
> Personal Computer Corporation (whom Stan Veit wrote created the term 
> "PersonalComputer") was formed by Everett Holland on Jan 4, 1976 as an "S" 
> Corp. Thebusiness started with a store in Frazier, PA in March of 1976. The 

He didn't directly claim first.  Just that Heiser started an industry.  
However, July 75 (45 years ago) is certainly before Terrel's Byte shop (Dec 75 
according to Wikipedia) and the March 76 listed above.

Will

Re: Computer stores

[Lyle Bickley via cctalk]

On Sat, 22 Aug 2020 11:52:19 -0400
Murray McCullough via cctalk  wrote:

> 45 yrs. ago last month, mid-July, Dick Heiser started a new industry, the
> retail computer store. It opened in West L.A. under the name Arrow Head
> COmputer Company. aka, The Computer Store. This began the direct marketing
> of microcomputers to hobbyists, later to the masses of the middle class,
> albeit a small market 45 yrs. ago.
> 
> Happy computing.

Claiming "First" in computer "anything" is just about always a dangerous thing
;)

But for sure, several personal computer stores existed 45 years ago!

Personal Computer Corporation (whom Stan Veit wrote created the term "Personal
Computer") was formed by Everett Holland on Jan 4, 1976 as an "S" Corp. The
business started with a store in Frazier, PA in March of 1976. The first
employee (and "tech") was Dave Hilton. I became an "angel" investor about 1977
and ultimately became Ch. of the Bd. of PCC.

At our opening we sold Imsai and Digital Group Computers - plus S-100 boards
from a number of manufacturers.

At the time we opened, there were approximately 15 computer stores in the
U.S., mostly in California.

In the same year we started (1976), Stan Veit opened the Computer Mart of New
York.

Cheers,
Lyle
-- 
73   NM6Y
Bickley Consulting West
https://bickleywest.com

"Black holes are where God is dividing by zero"

Re: Computer stores

[Chuck Guzis via cctalk]

On 8/22/20 8:52 AM, Murray McCullough via cctalk wrote:
> 45 yrs. ago last month, mid-July, Dick Heiser started a new industry, the
> retail computer store. It opened in West L.A. under the name Arrow Head
> COmputer Company. aka, The Computer Store. This began the direct marketing
> of microcomputers to hobbyists, later to the masses of the middle class,
> albeit a small market 45 yrs. ago.
> 
> Happy computing.
> 
> Murray  

Does this precede Paul Terrell's Byte Shop #1 in Mountain View, CA?

--Chuck

Computer stores

[Murray McCullough via cctalk]

45 yrs. ago last month, mid-July, Dick Heiser started a new industry, the
retail computer store. It opened in West L.A. under the name Arrow Head
COmputer Company. aka, The Computer Store. This began the direct marketing
of microcomputers to hobbyists, later to the masses of the middle class,
albeit a small market 45 yrs. ago.

Happy computing.

Murray  

Re: Good Electronic/computer stores SF area

[Robert via cctalk]

Weird Stuff Warehouse? On Jamaica or Caribbean, iirc.

On Sat, Feb 10, 2018 at 10:02 AM, Douglas Taylor via cctalk
 wrote:
> On 2/6/2018 9:13 PM, Mark Linimon via cctalk wrote:
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 06, 2018 at 04:50:02PM -0800, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote:
>>>
>>> but I've been told ACE has gone out of business
>>
>> Their website is now owned by a squatter.
>>
>> mcl
>
>
> Thanks to all who responded, I'm going to try and visit some of them when I
> get out there.
>
> When I was in, I think it might have been Sunnyvale, about 30 years ago,
> there was a converted Safeway Supermarket that was full of surplus computer
> equipment.  It was the old style Safeway with a big arching ceiling held up
> by huge wooden beams.  Does this ring any bells with anyone?
>
>

Re: Good Electronic/computer stores SF area

[Douglas Taylor via cctalk]

On 2/6/2018 9:13 PM, Mark Linimon via cctalk wrote:

On Tue, Feb 06, 2018 at 04:50:02PM -0800, Al Kossow via cctalk wrote:

but I've been told ACE has gone out of business

Their website is now owned by a squatter.

mcl


Thanks to all who responded, I'm going to try and visit some of them 
when I get out there.


When I was in, I think it might have been Sunnyvale, about 30 years ago, 
there was a converted Safeway Supermarket that was full of surplus 
computer equipment.  It was the old style Safeway with a big arching 
ceiling held up by huge wooden beams.  Does this ring any bells with anyone?

Re: Good Electronic/computer stores SF area

[dwight via cctalk]

Arrow and Jamco are mostly retail with some classic parts.

Dwight



From: cctalk <cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org> on behalf of David Collins via 
cctalk <cctalk@classiccmp.org>
Sent: Tuesday, February 6, 2018 3:51:11 PM
To: Douglas Taylor; General Discussion: On-Topic and Off-Topic Posts
Subject: Re: Good Electronic/computer stores SF area

If you are after components Arrow Electronics and Jameco are good.

David Collins


> On 7 Feb 2018, at 10:23 am, Douglas Taylor via cctalk <cctalk@classiccmp.org> 
> wrote:
>
> I haven't been in the San Francisco area in about 30 years.
>
> I remember a number of used computer/electronics stores back then, can't 
> remember any names except Weird Stuff Warehouse.
>
> Are there any stores that are worth a visit?
>
> What about outside of the SF area?
>
> Doug
>

Re: Good Electronic/computer stores SF area

[dwight via cctalk]

Halted may not be too long in following. The guys that run it want to retire. 
If someone doesn't pick up the business they may have to drop it as well.

I hadn't been over to ACE in about a year or more. It is too bad. They had 
parts that no one else had.

Dwight



From: cctalk <cctalk-boun...@classiccmp.org> on behalf of Al Kossow via cctalk 
<cctalk@classiccmp.org>
Sent: Tuesday, February 6, 2018 4:50:02 PM
To: cctalk@classiccmp.org
Subject: Re: Good Electronic/computer stores SF area

http://www.junktronix.com/svss/

but I've been told ACE has gone out of business
that pretty much just leaves Anchor, Excess Solutions, Halted, and Weird Stuff

On 2/6/18 3:23 PM, Douglas Taylor via cctalk wrote:
> I haven't been in the San Francisco area in about 30 years.
>
> I remember a number of used computer/electronics stores back then, can't 
> remember any names except Weird Stuff Warehouse.
>
> Are there any stores that are worth a visit?
>
> What about outside of the SF area?
>
> Doug
>

Re: Good Electronic/computer stores SF area

[Al Kossow via cctalk]

http://www.junktronix.com/svss/

but I've been told ACE has gone out of business
that pretty much just leaves Anchor, Excess Solutions, Halted, and Weird Stuff

On 2/6/18 3:23 PM, Douglas Taylor via cctalk wrote:
> I haven't been in the San Francisco area in about 30 years.
> 
> I remember a number of used computer/electronics stores back then, can't 
> remember any names except Weird Stuff Warehouse.
> 
> Are there any stores that are worth a visit?
> 
> What about outside of the SF area?
> 
> Doug
> 

Good Electronic/computer stores SF area

[Douglas Taylor via cctalk]

I haven't been in the San Francisco area in about 30 years.

I remember a number of used computer/electronics stores back then, can't 
remember any names except Weird Stuff Warehouse.


Are there any stores that are worth a visit?

What about outside of the SF area?

Doug