Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > Am I asking stupid questions to get no answers? I am not sure exactly what you are doing, but I am going to be posting some videos next week (hopefully) showing how to install centos 6 on a machine as a virtual host. The second video in that series will show all the steps of installing a centos 6 guest on that very host. the guest will have all the needs of a webserver, php, apache, postifx, dovecot, etc and cover each step from network to firewall. You should be able to do a guest install, fully operational, by hand, in less than an hour. secure, safe, (at least as much as it can be). I will post a link to the youtube videos when I finish and upload them.. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
*ph ph* http://www.hydrotoys.com/wavs/TrollSpray.jpg ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
A good start would be to download and install ConfigServer Security and Firewall. http://configserver.com/cp/csf.html That will help you on the security side. But if you're completely new to the game, you should consider hosting your sites on a shared host somewhere and use the VPS as a learning tool -- unless the sites are not production and you don't care what happens to them occasionally. On Feb 23, 2012, at 2:06 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > I did and they asked for a 150 usd per hour ... and I do not have that > money and each time I am asking for a thing I will need to pay again and > counting. > > On 23/02/2012 06:49 PM, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: >> John R Pierce wrote: >>> On 02/23/12 5:19 AM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: I am afraid if I get hacked and do not know what should i do to setup the whole vps the right way. >>> there is no single 'right way'. security requires a thorough >>> understanding of all aspects of the system, this is not something that >>> can be dealt with by a 'how to' walkthrough. hire a systems >>> adminstrator with a background in security. >> Or, since it's a VPS, call your ISP's support line and ask them. >> >> mark >> >> ___ >> CentOS mailing list >> CentOS@centos.org >> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On Thursday, February 23, 2012 07:25:09 PM Rob Kampen wrote: > On 02/24/2012 12:25 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > > Is it advised to install on a virtual machine like vmware or a real > > computer? > If you are going to use CentOS 6 - as a VM host it must be installed on > a 64 bit architecture! I think he was asking more about a guest install rather than a host. I'd echo the comment Les made and recommend to the OP to 'try both.' Virtual installs and physical installs are a tad different, but virtual has some distinct advantages, especially in terms of quick cloning, snapshotting with rollback capabilities for testing, etc. But virtualization brings with it another layer; and I would go as far as saying that, once you've gotten some experience, and if you have 64-bit hardware at your disposal, that you might want to attempt duplicating your hosted VPS environment completely, on you own 'host' as then you can test with the exact configuration you're using in production. That would mean the same VPS packages, the same 'guest' install options, and the same host OS packages. But before throwing so many new layers in the mix try I'd recommend to the OP to get familiar with it one layer at a time; too many layers at once can be very confusing if you don't know enough to separate the effects of each layer. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On Friday 24 February 2012 00:17:15 Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > This is a fortune ! > Sure you deserve but it i s beyond my ability. > But thanks for offering By the love of God, haven't you noticed that everybody is writing *below* your emails? Please, do not top-post (as you've been already told). Anyway... good luck with your webserver! :) Regards ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 5:25 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > Is it advised to install on a virtual machine like vmware or a real > computer? Both. It is quick and easy to test a lot of different variations of things and emulate network connections under vmware, and relatively cheap to hold a bunch of images on a big disk or two. It will make learning a lot quicker. But, real hardware has its own quirks. -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
But I will install cent os 6 32 bit on the vps later on. On 24/02/2012 02:25 AM, Rob Kampen wrote: > On 02/24/2012 12:25 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> Is it advised to install on a virtual machine like vmware or a real >> computer? > If you are going to use CentOS 6 - as a VM host it must be installed on > a 64 bit architecture! >> On 24/02/2012 01:22 AM, Lamar Owen wrote: >>> On Thursday, February 23, 2012 05:35:32 PM Wuxi Ixuw wrote: Ok, I've found many versions from it, one for 700 MB and others for a DVD, which one I should get? >>> While I specifically stated the installation media, you should get both the >>> DVD1 and DVD2; specifically, assuming a 32-bit system (you mentioned trying >>> on a Pentium 4 or Pentium D, so 64-bit may not be an option, and isn't >>> really necessary for a 'lab' machine anyway; you do need as much memory as >>> you can cram in that old Optiplex, with an absolute minimu of 1GB (and it's >>> going to top out less than 4GB anyway)), you need to download, from a >>> mirror: >>> CentOS-6.2-i386-bin-DVD1.iso >>> CentOS-6.2-i386-bin-DVD2.iso >>> >>> While DVD2 is somewhat optional, it won't hurt to have it on hand just in >>> case. >>> >>> The LiveDVD and LiveCD options boot up to a usable desktop, and you can >>> install from them, but if you're wanting the *server* install experience >>> you need the others, not the LiveDVD or LiveCD. >>> >>> Now, go give it a whirl, make sure you read the documentation on >>> installation on the CentOS.org website, and come back in a few days when >>> you've played with that installation a while. >>> ___ >>> CentOS mailing list >>> CentOS@centos.org >>> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos >> ___ >> CentOS mailing list >> CentOS@centos.org >> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On 02/24/2012 12:25 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > Is it advised to install on a virtual machine like vmware or a real > computer? If you are going to use CentOS 6 - as a VM host it must be installed on a 64 bit architecture! > On 24/02/2012 01:22 AM, Lamar Owen wrote: >> On Thursday, February 23, 2012 05:35:32 PM Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >>> Ok, I've found many versions from it, one for 700 MB and others for a >>> DVD, which one I should get? >> While I specifically stated the installation media, you should get both the >> DVD1 and DVD2; specifically, assuming a 32-bit system (you mentioned trying >> on a Pentium 4 or Pentium D, so 64-bit may not be an option, and isn't >> really necessary for a 'lab' machine anyway; you do need as much memory as >> you can cram in that old Optiplex, with an absolute minimu of 1GB (and it's >> going to top out less than 4GB anyway)), you need to download, from a >> mirror: >> CentOS-6.2-i386-bin-DVD1.iso >> CentOS-6.2-i386-bin-DVD2.iso >> >> While DVD2 is somewhat optional, it won't hurt to have it on hand just in >> case. >> >> The LiveDVD and LiveCD options boot up to a usable desktop, and you can >> install from them, but if you're wanting the *server* install experience you >> need the others, not the LiveDVD or LiveCD. >> >> Now, go give it a whirl, make sure you read the documentation on >> installation on the CentOS.org website, and come back in a few days when >> you've played with that installation a while. >> ___ >> CentOS mailing list >> CentOS@centos.org >> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Is it advised to install on a virtual machine like vmware or a real computer? On 24/02/2012 01:22 AM, Lamar Owen wrote: > On Thursday, February 23, 2012 05:35:32 PM Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> Ok, I've found many versions from it, one for 700 MB and others for a >> DVD, which one I should get? > While I specifically stated the installation media, you should get both the > DVD1 and DVD2; specifically, assuming a 32-bit system (you mentioned trying > on a Pentium 4 or Pentium D, so 64-bit may not be an option, and isn't really > necessary for a 'lab' machine anyway; you do need as much memory as you can > cram in that old Optiplex, with an absolute minimu of 1GB (and it's going to > top out less than 4GB anyway)), you need to download, from a mirror: > CentOS-6.2-i386-bin-DVD1.iso > CentOS-6.2-i386-bin-DVD2.iso > > While DVD2 is somewhat optional, it won't hurt to have it on hand just in > case. > > The LiveDVD and LiveCD options boot up to a usable desktop, and you can > install from them, but if you're wanting the *server* install experience you > need the others, not the LiveDVD or LiveCD. > > Now, go give it a whirl, make sure you read the documentation on installation > on the CentOS.org website, and come back in a few days when you've played > with that installation a while. > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On Thursday, February 23, 2012 05:35:32 PM Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > Ok, I've found many versions from it, one for 700 MB and others for a > DVD, which one I should get? While I specifically stated the installation media, you should get both the DVD1 and DVD2; specifically, assuming a 32-bit system (you mentioned trying on a Pentium 4 or Pentium D, so 64-bit may not be an option, and isn't really necessary for a 'lab' machine anyway; you do need as much memory as you can cram in that old Optiplex, with an absolute minimu of 1GB (and it's going to top out less than 4GB anyway)), you need to download, from a mirror: CentOS-6.2-i386-bin-DVD1.iso CentOS-6.2-i386-bin-DVD2.iso While DVD2 is somewhat optional, it won't hurt to have it on hand just in case. The LiveDVD and LiveCD options boot up to a usable desktop, and you can install from them, but if you're wanting the *server* install experience you need the others, not the LiveDVD or LiveCD. Now, go give it a whirl, make sure you read the documentation on installation on the CentOS.org website, and come back in a few days when you've played with that installation a while. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Ok, I've found many versions from it, one for 700 MB and others for a DVD, which one I should get? On 24/02/2012 12:30 AM, Lamar Owen wrote: > On Thursday, February 23, 2012 03:58:10 PM Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> Ok, >> I've made up my mind to dive and learn ... so to learn the right way >> like what professional do ... what shall I do? > First, try not to top post. > > Second, download the CentOS 6.2 installation media and install it on your own > hardware, reading through the excellent upstream documentation (linked from > the www.centos.org website). Read through the CentOS wiki HOWTOs and such. > And play around with your system, feeling free to reinstall it (or re-clone > it, for a VM) at any time. Live with it to learn it, really. > > HowtoForge has some nice articles on setting up servers to do various things; > read through a few that use CentOS 6 as the base, and attempt to implement on > you testing CentOS server. Then attempt on your VPS. > > Expect to spend quite a bit of time on the process; Rome wasn't built in a > day, and neither is admin experience. > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On Thursday, February 23, 2012 03:58:10 PM Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > Ok, > I've made up my mind to dive and learn ... so to learn the right way > like what professional do ... what shall I do? First, try not to top post. Second, download the CentOS 6.2 installation media and install it on your own hardware, reading through the excellent upstream documentation (linked from the www.centos.org website). Read through the CentOS wiki HOWTOs and such. And play around with your system, feeling free to reinstall it (or re-clone it, for a VM) at any time. Live with it to learn it, really. HowtoForge has some nice articles on setting up servers to do various things; read through a few that use CentOS 6 as the base, and attempt to implement on you testing CentOS server. Then attempt on your VPS. Expect to spend quite a bit of time on the process; Rome wasn't built in a day, and neither is admin experience. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
I will install it as the only operating system on this machine. On 24/02/2012 12:08 AM, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: > Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> what do you mean? >> >> On 23/02/2012 11:10 PM, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: >>> It will find more hardware errors > Windows uses hardware sloppily, and not that well. Linux, like all > versions of Unix, uses much more of the hardware's capabilities. Try > running Linux on the same hardware as Windows: my fiancee's 14-yr-old son > is dual booting his T-60 laptop, and *he* sees the difference in speed > (Linux being that much faster). > > mark > > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 4:08 PM, wrote: > > Windows uses hardware sloppily, and not that well. Linux, like all > versions of Unix, uses much more of the hardware's capabilities. Try > running Linux on the same hardware as Windows: my fiancee's 14-yr-old son > is dual booting his T-60 laptop, and *he* sees the difference in speed > (Linux being that much faster). > That doesn't really make any sense. Things that use directx on windows are typically slightly faster than openGL equivalents and everything else should work at hardware/wire speeds. A badly maintained windows box might be more likely to have disk fragmentation or malware, or it might have an intentionally-installed virus scanner wasting time. -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
This is a fortune ! Sure you deserve but it i s beyond my ability. But thanks for offering :) On 23/02/2012 11:49 PM, John R Pierce wrote: > On 02/23/12 12:54 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> Really thanks a lot for your reply. >> Please is it possible if you have a little time to talk in messenger >> or use team viewer to connect to my computer? >> Thanks a lot :) > I wouldn't do that sort of thing for less than US$1000/day. I'm way to > busy to be doing your job too. > > (you can find much cheaper systems adminstrators, I'm an engineer). > > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > what do you mean? > > On 23/02/2012 11:10 PM, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: >> It will find more hardware errors Windows uses hardware sloppily, and not that well. Linux, like all versions of Unix, uses much more of the hardware's capabilities. Try running Linux on the same hardware as Windows: my fiancee's 14-yr-old son is dual booting his T-60 laptop, and *he* sees the difference in speed (Linux being that much faster). mark ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On 02/23/12 12:54 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > Really thanks a lot for your reply. > Please is it possible if you have a little time to talk in messenger > or use team viewer to connect to my computer? > Thanks a lot :) I wouldn't do that sort of thing for less than US$1000/day. I'm way to busy to be doing your job too. (you can find much cheaper systems adminstrators, I'm an engineer). -- john r pierceN 37, W 122 santa cruz ca mid-left coast ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Here at local stores we have a used branded computers like Dell optiPlex GX 620 ... so I mean something like this ... it is sold for 80 usd. On 23/02/2012 11:19 PM, John R Pierce wrote: > On 02/23/12 1:00 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> And do I need a recent computer for the linux one or an old one can do so? >> I mean something like Pentium 4 or Pentium D may fits? > for a SOHO firewall, I would want to use something very reliable and low > power, quiet. CPU isn't at all important, reliability is. > > If I was buying something, I'd probably get a little ITX box like alix > http://www.pcengines.ch/alix2d2.htm > or soekris > http://soekris.com/products/net4501-1.html > >and run pfSense on it, using it strictly as a pure firewall not a > general purpose computer. > > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On 02/23/12 1:00 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > And do I need a recent computer for the linux one or an old one can do so? > I mean something like Pentium 4 or Pentium D may fits? for a SOHO firewall, I would want to use something very reliable and low power, quiet. CPU isn't at all important, reliability is. If I was buying something, I'd probably get a little ITX box like alix http://www.pcengines.ch/alix2d2.htm or soekris http://soekris.com/products/net4501-1.html and run pfSense on it, using it strictly as a pure firewall not a general purpose computer. -- john r pierceN 37, W 122 santa cruz ca mid-left coast ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
what do you mean? On 23/02/2012 11:10 PM, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: > It will find more hardware errors ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > And do I need a recent computer for the linux one or an old one can do so? > I mean something like Pentium 4 or Pentium D may fits? > > On 23/02/2012 10:58 PM, John R Pierce wrote: >> On 02/23/12 12:47 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >>> Actually I read many times that geek people used to use a Linux >>> computer >>> as a firewall for their network but never figured out how they do so. >> install linux on a computer with two ethernet cards. connect eth0 to >> your internet connection, and eth1 to your local network. configure >> iptables firewall rules in the linux system. or install pfsense on that >> same computer. That's one of the beauties of Linux: unlike a competing "operating system" which shall remain nameless (but is headquartered in Redmond, WA), it'll run on pretty much *anything*. It will find more hardware errors... because it uses the entire system much more efficiently. But if the hardware's ok, it'll run for a *long* time. So, yes, anything you've got should work. mark ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
And do I need a recent computer for the linux one or an old one can do so? I mean something like Pentium 4 or Pentium D may fits? On 23/02/2012 10:58 PM, John R Pierce wrote: > On 02/23/12 12:47 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> Actually I read many times that geek people used to use a Linux computer >> as a firewall for their network but never figured out how they do so. > install linux on a computer with two ethernet cards. connect eth0 to > your internet connection, and eth1 to your local network. configure > iptables firewall rules in the linux system. or install pfsense on that > same computer. > > > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Ok, I've made up my mind to dive and learn ... so to learn the right way like what professional do ... what shall I do? On 23/02/2012 10:56 PM, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: > Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> On 23/02/2012 10:26 PM, John R Pierce wrote: >>> On 02/23/12 12:16 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: I will use Drupal core and mostly no modules. >>> Drupal has had its share of exploits, too. >>> http://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerability-list/vendor_id-1367/product_id-2387/Drupal-Drupal.html >>> >> What shall I use then? >> I did goggled a lot for what I should use and found that Drupal is so >> far the best CMS compared to Joomla or Wordpress. > You need to get your head around the idea that *NOTHING* is ultimately > safe. To paraphrase the stupid phrase, "vigilance is the price of liberty > (of your system from the bad guys)" > > mark > > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On 02/23/12 12:47 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > Actually I read many times that geek people used to use a Linux computer > as a firewall for their network but never figured out how they do so. install linux on a computer with two ethernet cards. connect eth0 to your internet connection, and eth1 to your local network. configure iptables firewall rules in the linux system. or install pfsense on that same computer. -- john r pierceN 37, W 122 santa cruz ca mid-left coast ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > > On 23/02/2012 10:26 PM, John R Pierce wrote: >> On 02/23/12 12:16 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >>> I will use Drupal core and mostly no modules. >> Drupal has had its share of exploits, too. >> http://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerability-list/vendor_id-1367/product_id-2387/Drupal-Drupal.html >> > What shall I use then? > I did goggled a lot for what I should use and found that Drupal is so > far the best CMS compared to Joomla or Wordpress. You need to get your head around the idea that *NOTHING* is ultimately safe. To paraphrase the stupid phrase, "vigilance is the price of liberty (of your system from the bad guys)" mark ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
What shall I use then? I did goggled a lot for what I should use and found that Drupal is so far the best CMS compared to Joomla or Wordpress. On 23/02/2012 10:26 PM, John R Pierce wrote: > On 02/23/12 12:16 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> I will use Drupal core and mostly no modules. > Drupal has had its share of exploits, too. > http://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerability-list/vendor_id-1367/product_id-2387/Drupal-Drupal.html > > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Actually I read many times that geek people used to use a Linux computer as a firewall for their network but never figured out how they do so. On 23/02/2012 09:52 PM, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: > John R Pierce wrote: >> On 02/23/12 11:05 AM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >>> Please suggest a one as I am keep goggling and all result bring books >>> dealing with linux as a real server and not a vps. >> you could do worse than starting here... >> http://docs.redhat.com/docs/en-US/Red_Hat_Enterprise_Linux/6/html/Security_Guide/ >> >> VPS and real hardware work exactly the same once the software is >> installed. >> >> my base level suggestions: >> >>* start with a *minimal* install of the latest release (currently 6.2) >>* create your user account, give both user and root account different >> secure passwords > I was assuming his provider gave him a working system, not virtual bare > metal. > >>* secure the SSH server (no root, key instead of password >> authentication, only allow ssh from your home/office networks or a >> few secure 'bastion' hosts, etc) >>* yum update right after install and reboot > Yup. > >>* install *just* the services you need, only from trustworthy yum >> repositories > YES! For about 10 years, I ran an old rh (NOT RHEL) system as a > firewall/router for my home network. I ran Bastille Linux over it - which > is *not* a distro, but a set of hardening scripts. Great stuff, and NIST > recommendations these days refer to it, last time I looked. > > After running Bastille, *then* I got paranoid: I never installed X > (security holes), or *any* compiler, or language I didn't absolutely need > (no gcc, yes to perl). No nuttin'... and to the best of my knowledge, > though I did see scans, I never had an intrusion, partly due to firewall > rules of DROP, and partly because they had nothing to use to run their > nasties. > > If it got installed, and you don't need it, don't only turn it off, yum > remove. At work, and home, I certainly don't need either bluetooth or > avahi running, on wired boxen. > >>* secure the services you install as appropriate >>* document your configuration, including what packages you needed to >> install > YES. You do *not* want to be trying to figure out what you'd done, a year > from now, at 17:00 on a Friday, or 02:00 some morning. > >>* script a secure backup of your configuration specific conf and data >> files to reliable offsite storage. > Yup. Or have the full website, and all configuration files for the system, > on your machine at home or work, so you can just upload the whole thing. > >>* plan on regular yum updates, and staying up on security alerts, such >> as CERT > > RH, and this offshot I know of, called CentOS, are pretty good at > announcing security fixes in a timely manner (take a bow, Johnny). > > mark > > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
thanks a lot for these steps, I will follow them and hope to find all up and running. On 23/02/2012 09:41 PM, John R Pierce wrote: > On 02/23/12 11:05 AM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> Please suggest a one as I am keep goggling and all result bring books >> dealing with linux as a real server and not a vps. > you could do worse than starting here... > http://docs.redhat.com/docs/en-US/Red_Hat_Enterprise_Linux/6/html/Security_Guide/ > > VPS and real hardware work exactly the same once the software is installed. > > my base level suggestions: > >* start with a *minimal* install of the latest release (currently 6.2) >* create your user account, give both user and root account different > secure passwords >* secure the SSH server (no root, key instead of password > authentication, only allow ssh from your home/office networks or a > few secure 'bastion' hosts, etc) >* yum update right after install and reboot >* install *just* the services you need, only from trustworthy yum > repositories >* secure the services you install as appropriate >* document your configuration, including what packages you needed to > install >* script a secure backup of your configuration specific conf and data > files to reliable offsite storage. >* plan on regular yum updates, and staying up on security alerts, such > as CERT > > > by far the biggest threat to servers are things installed on top of > them, like web applications... for instance the very popular WordPress > has a long and checkered history of security exploits, ranging from > annoying to root elevation... > http://www.wordpressexploit.com/ > > ANY user written web code has to be designed with security in mind, no > matter how insignificant your little web server is, its valuable to the > black hats as a proxy for their evil, and the worms and exploit scanners > will find a wide range of poor design > > http://xkcd.com/327/ > > > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On 02/23/12 12:16 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > I will use Drupal core and mostly no modules. Drupal has had its share of exploits, too. http://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerability-list/vendor_id-1367/product_id-2387/Drupal-Drupal.html -- john r pierceN 37, W 122 santa cruz ca mid-left coast ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
managed web hosting is really expensive. On 23/02/2012 09:39 PM, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: > Les Mikesell wrote: >> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:08 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >>> I am not using cent os for my daily computing tasks at home or work but >>> just for the vps hosting website. >>> you mean to use web control panel back end or you mean another issue? >> I don't have any idea what a 'web control panel back end is' since >> that is not a stock centos feature. CentOS itself packages updates as > I'd guess he's talking cPanel. > >> soon as possible after they are released and on a non VPS system you >> would use 'yum update' to install them. And normally you want to do >> that as soon as possible because when the updates are published, the >> vulnerabilities that they fix are obvious and often even explained in >> public. > Actually, I assume that my hosting provider is regularly updating system > software. I should probably look, but I think I'm paying for that, as part > of what they do... which is also very much to their own benefit. > > mark > > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
I mean something like ISPConfig , VirtualMin, WebMin, ..etc On 23/02/2012 09:27 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: > On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:08 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> I am not using cent os for my daily computing tasks at home or work but >> just for the vps hosting website. >> you mean to use web control panel back end or you mean another issue? > I don't have any idea what a 'web control panel back end is' since > that is not a stock centos feature. CentOS itself packages updates as > soon as possible after they are released and on a non VPS system you > would use 'yum update' to install them. And normally you want to do > that as soon as possible because when the updates are published, the > vulnerabilities that they fix are obvious and often even explained in > public. > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Actually I used to be on a shared hosting and run out of resources many times. I am expecting about 20 k or may be more per day with 400-600 on the same time visitors. This is why I want to go for a VPS. I did start to learn and keep screwing the whole vps several times. On 23/02/2012 09:23 PM, Peter Peltonen wrote: > Hi, > > On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 9:08 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> I am not using cent os for my daily computing tasks at home or work but >> just for the vps hosting website. > If all you want to do is to host a single website then a VPS is an overkill. > > Just a find a hosting service for a "webhotel": this way your ISP > deals with the security of the server and you don't need to worry > about any operation system level admin stuff. > > It should be a lot cheaper as well. > > Best, > Peter > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
I will use Drupal core and mostly no modules. On 23/02/2012 09:21 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: > On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:05 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> Please suggest a one as I am keep goggling and all result bring books >> dealing with linux as a real server and not a vps. > The difference is only in how much the hosting system forces you to > use certain images and versions, which will likely vary with the > vendor. Books on security are always out of date anyway. The system > security business is very specialized - plan on spending a lot of > either time or money if you are going to do anything out of the > ordinary. But, unless you have something unique and valuable to > attack, you mostly have to worry about known exploits on the platform > you use, and the main thing you can do about it is to keep your > software updated so you get the fixes as soon as they are available. > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
I'd like to learn indeed but feel like lost in a very big ocean. please if you may give any outline that would be awesome or even a title for a good book to start with. On 23/02/2012 09:15 PM, Reindl Harald wrote: > and where is the difference between a real server and a VPS > in the context of a webserver -> hint: there is none! > > you have two choices: > > * read many manuals and learn the needed things > * to not use VPS at all and switch to a maintained hosting > > there is no easy way for " i have no technical knowledge but i > want to have simple instructions for making a secure root-server" > > if you have not the knowledge, not the time to learn > and not the money to let do people who can simply > do not such things! > > Am 23.02.2012 20:05, schrieb Wuxi Ixuw: > > Please suggest a one as I am keep goggling and all result bring books > dealing with linux as a real server and not a vps. > > On 23/02/2012 07:01 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: > >> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 7:19 AM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >>> I am afraid if I get hacked and do not know what should i do to setup >>> the whole vps the right way. >> There are many large books on the subject. If you don't want to spend >> your life staying ahead of the game: >> Use popular software >> Don't change defaults you don't understand >> Keep it up to date >> Use good passwords >> > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos > > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
John R Pierce wrote: > On 02/23/12 11:05 AM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> Please suggest a one as I am keep goggling and all result bring books >> dealing with linux as a real server and not a vps. > > you could do worse than starting here... > http://docs.redhat.com/docs/en-US/Red_Hat_Enterprise_Linux/6/html/Security_Guide/ > > VPS and real hardware work exactly the same once the software is > installed. > > my base level suggestions: > > * start with a *minimal* install of the latest release (currently 6.2) > * create your user account, give both user and root account different > secure passwords I was assuming his provider gave him a working system, not virtual bare metal. > * secure the SSH server (no root, key instead of password > authentication, only allow ssh from your home/office networks or a > few secure 'bastion' hosts, etc) > * yum update right after install and reboot Yup. > * install *just* the services you need, only from trustworthy yum > repositories YES! For about 10 years, I ran an old rh (NOT RHEL) system as a firewall/router for my home network. I ran Bastille Linux over it - which is *not* a distro, but a set of hardening scripts. Great stuff, and NIST recommendations these days refer to it, last time I looked. After running Bastille, *then* I got paranoid: I never installed X (security holes), or *any* compiler, or language I didn't absolutely need (no gcc, yes to perl). No nuttin'... and to the best of my knowledge, though I did see scans, I never had an intrusion, partly due to firewall rules of DROP, and partly because they had nothing to use to run their nasties. If it got installed, and you don't need it, don't only turn it off, yum remove. At work, and home, I certainly don't need either bluetooth or avahi running, on wired boxen. > * secure the services you install as appropriate > * document your configuration, including what packages you needed to > install YES. You do *not* want to be trying to figure out what you'd done, a year from now, at 17:00 on a Friday, or 02:00 some morning. > * script a secure backup of your configuration specific conf and data > files to reliable offsite storage. Yup. Or have the full website, and all configuration files for the system, on your machine at home or work, so you can just upload the whole thing. > * plan on regular yum updates, and staying up on security alerts, such > as CERT RH, and this offshot I know of, called CentOS, are pretty good at announcing security fixes in a timely manner (take a bow, Johnny). mark ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On 02/23/12 11:05 AM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > Please suggest a one as I am keep goggling and all result bring books > dealing with linux as a real server and not a vps. you could do worse than starting here... http://docs.redhat.com/docs/en-US/Red_Hat_Enterprise_Linux/6/html/Security_Guide/ VPS and real hardware work exactly the same once the software is installed. my base level suggestions: * start with a *minimal* install of the latest release (currently 6.2) * create your user account, give both user and root account different secure passwords * secure the SSH server (no root, key instead of password authentication, only allow ssh from your home/office networks or a few secure 'bastion' hosts, etc) * yum update right after install and reboot * install *just* the services you need, only from trustworthy yum repositories * secure the services you install as appropriate * document your configuration, including what packages you needed to install * script a secure backup of your configuration specific conf and data files to reliable offsite storage. * plan on regular yum updates, and staying up on security alerts, such as CERT by far the biggest threat to servers are things installed on top of them, like web applications... for instance the very popular WordPress has a long and checkered history of security exploits, ranging from annoying to root elevation... http://www.wordpressexploit.com/ ANY user written web code has to be designed with security in mind, no matter how insignificant your little web server is, its valuable to the black hats as a proxy for their evil, and the worms and exploit scanners will find a wide range of poor design http://xkcd.com/327/ -- john r pierceN 37, W 122 santa cruz ca mid-left coast ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Les Mikesell wrote: > On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:08 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> I am not using cent os for my daily computing tasks at home or work but >> just for the vps hosting website. >> you mean to use web control panel back end or you mean another issue? > > I don't have any idea what a 'web control panel back end is' since > that is not a stock centos feature. CentOS itself packages updates as I'd guess he's talking cPanel. > soon as possible after they are released and on a non VPS system you > would use 'yum update' to install them. And normally you want to do > that as soon as possible because when the updates are published, the > vulnerabilities that they fix are obvious and often even explained in > public. Actually, I assume that my hosting provider is regularly updating system software. I should probably look, but I think I'm paying for that, as part of what they do... which is also very much to their own benefit. mark ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:08 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > I am not using cent os for my daily computing tasks at home or work but > just for the vps hosting website. > you mean to use web control panel back end or you mean another issue? I don't have any idea what a 'web control panel back end is' since that is not a stock centos feature. CentOS itself packages updates as soon as possible after they are released and on a non VPS system you would use 'yum update' to install them. And normally you want to do that as soon as possible because when the updates are published, the vulnerabilities that they fix are obvious and often even explained in public. -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Hi, On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 9:08 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > I am not using cent os for my daily computing tasks at home or work but > just for the vps hosting website. If all you want to do is to host a single website then a VPS is an overkill. Just a find a hosting service for a "webhotel": this way your ISP deals with the security of the server and you don't need to worry about any operation system level admin stuff. It should be a lot cheaper as well. Best, Peter ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:05 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > Please suggest a one as I am keep goggling and all result bring books > dealing with linux as a real server and not a vps. The difference is only in how much the hosting system forces you to use certain images and versions, which will likely vary with the vendor. Books on security are always out of date anyway. The system security business is very specialized - plan on spending a lot of either time or money if you are going to do anything out of the ordinary. But, unless you have something unique and valuable to attack, you mostly have to worry about known exploits on the platform you use, and the main thing you can do about it is to keep your software updated so you get the fixes as soon as they are available. -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
I am not using cent os for my daily computing tasks at home or work but just for the vps hosting website. you mean to use web control panel back end or you mean another issue? On 23/02/2012 07:01 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: > On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 7:19 AM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> I am afraid if I get hacked and do not know what should i do to setup >> the whole vps the right way. > There are many large books on the subject. If you don't want to spend > your life staying ahead of the game: > Use popular software >Don't change defaults you don't understand >Keep it up to date >Use good passwords > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
I did and they asked for a 150 usd per hour ... and I do not have that money and each time I am asking for a thing I will need to pay again and counting. On 23/02/2012 06:49 PM, m.r...@5-cent.us wrote: > John R Pierce wrote: >> On 02/23/12 5:19 AM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >>> I am afraid if I get hacked and do not know what should i do to setup >>> the whole vps the right way. >> there is no single 'right way'. security requires a thorough >> understanding of all aspects of the system, this is not something that >> can be dealt with by a 'how to' walkthrough. hire a systems >> adminstrator with a background in security. > Or, since it's a VPS, call your ISP's support line and ask them. > > mark > > ___ > CentOS mailing list > CentOS@centos.org > http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Please suggest a one as I am keep goggling and all result bring books dealing with linux as a real server and not a vps. On 23/02/2012 07:01 PM, Les Mikesell wrote: > On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 7:19 AM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> I am afraid if I get hacked and do not know what should i do to setup >> the whole vps the right way. > There are many large books on the subject. If you don't want to spend > your life staying ahead of the game: > Use popular software >Don't change defaults you don't understand >Keep it up to date >Use good passwords > ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 7:19 AM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > I am afraid if I get hacked and do not know what should i do to setup > the whole vps the right way. There are many large books on the subject. If you don't want to spend your life staying ahead of the game: Use popular software Don't change defaults you don't understand Keep it up to date Use good passwords -- Les Mikesell lesmikes...@gmail.com ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
John R Pierce wrote: > On 02/23/12 5:19 AM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> I am afraid if I get hacked and do not know what should i do to setup >> the whole vps the right way. > > there is no single 'right way'. security requires a thorough > understanding of all aspects of the system, this is not something that > can be dealt with by a 'how to' walkthrough. hire a systems > adminstrator with a background in security. Or, since it's a VPS, call your ISP's support line and ask them. mark ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On 02/23/12 5:19 AM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > I am afraid if I get hacked and do not know what should i do to setup > the whole vps the right way. there is no single 'right way'. security requires a thorough understanding of all aspects of the system, this is not something that can be dealt with by a 'how to' walkthrough. hire a systems adminstrator with a background in security. -- john r pierceN 37, W 122 santa cruz ca mid-left coast ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
I am afraid if I get hacked and do not know what should i do to setup the whole vps the right way. On 23/02/2012 02:25 PM, Marc Deop wrote: > On Thursday 23 February 2012 12:25:12 Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> Am I asking stupid questions to get no answers? >> > They're not stupid, just way too general. > > We could answer something like "apache gives me this error: blablabla" > > Regards ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Actually I am looking for a tutorial or a guide to follow as I am really newbie to this world. On 23/02/2012 12:37 PM, Rudi Ahlers wrote: > On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 12:25 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> Am I asking stupid questions to get no answers? >> >> On 23/02/2012 09:42 AM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >>> Hello >>> I've got an un managed VPS running CentOS6 >>> I'd like to install 2 websites and secure the whole VPS >>> I've tried tutorials from the how to forge website but things keep >>> screwing all the time. >>> Please if any one can help or give a good working tutorials that would >>> be awesome. >>> Thanks a lot >>> WI, >> ___ > > It would help if you're a LOT more specific asto what you've tried > and what doesn't work. ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On Thursday 23 February 2012 12:25:12 Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > Am I asking stupid questions to get no answers? > They're not stupid, just way too general. We could answer something like "apache gives me this error: blablabla" Regards ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 12:25 PM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > Am I asking stupid questions to get no answers? > > On 23/02/2012 09:42 AM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: >> Hello >> I've got an un managed VPS running CentOS6 >> I'd like to install 2 websites and secure the whole VPS >> I've tried tutorials from the how to forge website but things keep >> screwing all the time. >> Please if any one can help or give a good working tutorials that would >> be awesome. >> Thanks a lot >> WI, > ___ It would help if you're a LOT more specific asto what you've tried and what doesn't work. -- Kind Regards Rudi Ahlers SoftDux Website: http://www.SoftDux.com Technical Blog: http://Blog.SoftDux.com Office: 087 805 9573 Cell: 082 554 7532 Fax: 086 268 8492 ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Re: [CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Am I asking stupid questions to get no answers? On 23/02/2012 09:42 AM, Wuxi Ixuw wrote: > Hello > I've got an un managed VPS running CentOS6 > I'd like to install 2 websites and secure the whole VPS > I've tried tutorials from the how to forge website but things keep > screwing all the time. > Please if any one can help or give a good working tutorials that would > be awesome. > Thanks a lot > WI, ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
[CentOS] Please I'd like to install 2 websites on my un managed VPS on CentOS6
Hello I've got an un managed VPS running CentOS6 I'd like to install 2 websites and secure the whole VPS I've tried tutorials from the how to forge website but things keep screwing all the time. Please if any one can help or give a good working tutorials that would be awesome. Thanks a lot WI, ___ CentOS mailing list CentOS@centos.org http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
