Clojure.org: Concurrency screencast 404
Hello, Concurrency screencast link to blip.tv is throwing a 404. Is this a temporary thing or has it moved permanently? Most of this is covered in more detail in the concurrency screencasthttp://blip.tv/file/812787 . -- Queer little twists and quirks go into the making of an individual. To suppress them all and follow clock and calendar and creed until the individual is lost in the neutral gray of the host is to be less than true to our inheritance Life, that gorgeous quality of life, is not accomplished by following another man's rules. It is true we have the same hungers and same thirsts, but they are for different things and in different ways and in different seasons Lay down your own day, follow it to its noon, your own noon, or you will sit in an outer hall listening to the chimes but never reaching high enough to strike your own. - Angelo Patri -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: map vs map in core.async
Thanks, that's very helpful! -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Clojure.org: Concurrency screencast 404
On a related note, why is the 301 Moved Permanently HTTP status never used in actual practice? Instead, when things move you always get 404s and have to hunt them down manually. :P On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 3:44 AM, abhi abhiji...@gmail.com wrote: Hello, Concurrency screencast link to blip.tv is throwing a 404. Is this a temporary thing or has it moved permanently? Most of this is covered in more detail in the concurrency screencasthttp://blip.tv/file/812787 . -- Queer little twists and quirks go into the making of an individual. To suppress them all and follow clock and calendar and creed until the individual is lost in the neutral gray of the host is to be less than true to our inheritance Life, that gorgeous quality of life, is not accomplished by following another man's rules. It is true we have the same hungers and same thirsts, but they are for different things and in different ways and in different seasons Lay down your own day, follow it to its noon, your own noon, or you will sit in an outer hall listening to the chimes but never reaching high enough to strike your own. - Angelo Patri -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
ANN Langohr 2.0 is released
Langohr [1] is a small RabbitMQ client. 2.0 is a major release that introduces automatic topology recovery (exchanges, queues, bindings, consumers). Release notes: http://blog.clojurewerkz.org/blog/2013/12/15/langohr-2-dot-0-0-is-released/ There's also a new documentation guide to accompany this release: http://clojurerabbitmq.info/articles/error_handling.html 1. http://clojurerabbitmq.info -- MK http://github.com/michaelklishin http://twitter.com/michaelklishin -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Is Clojure more functional then Scala?
Clojure targets multiple platforms, Scala - one. Clojure is Lisp. That means almost any programming paradigm/DSL is just a library. But if you are interested in FP per se, I think Scala illustrates it better. With strong type system, pattern matching it's much closer to Haskell, which is the best language to learn in such case. Haskell literally serves as a definition of what FP is and almost every academic paper in FP field is written with Haskell nowadays. понедельник, 16 декабря 2013 г., 7:33:35 UTC+4 пользователь John Kida написал: I jumped on the FP bandwagon over a year ago and have been using Scala both at work and for personal interest. Recently however I decided to take a closer look at Clojure and see if it is something i actually like. I have to admit at first the syntax form was awkward, but im starting to really see the simplicity behind it. I have heard many people claim that Clojure sets you up and supports you for FP more so then Scala does. However they never provide any examples of something Clojure does that is more supporting of FP then the way idiomatic Scala does it. Here are some things that I have heard people say when comparing Clojure vs Scala in reference to FP Clojure has immutable persistance data structures. but so does Scala Scala also tries to get you to use its immutable collections, like Vectors, and are also persistent data structures. However they are not as uniform as Clojures Seq i agree with that. Also Scala recommends using vals and not vars, which gives you immutable references points I am certainly learning towards dropping Scala for a bit and giving Clojure a real shot. The reason i even picked up Scala was because i wanted to learn more about FP, and if there is a better tool for both doing and learning FP then i want it. So tell me, if you have used both Scala and Clojure, do you have some real examples of some things where Clojure really does support you better when doing FP, where Scala really leads you no way, or worse the imperative way? -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: cider status
Tim Visher tim.vis...@gmail.com writes: So, I have used MELPA before, but I found living on the bleeding edge for all of my packages is bit painful; the overall stability of my Emacs setup dropped considerably. I fear this will remain while many package developers use a dirty head versioning system (myself included). That has completely been my experience. Continuous Deployment _requires_ Continuous Integration and pretty much all of the emacs package developers out there don't have the time to do CI correctly so Continuous Deployment simply equals lots of pain on the users end as things get broken accidentally. I am not sure that I would say this. Pulling stuff out of people's repos without an understanding of how they use the repo is, I think, the problem. I don't mind doing this for one or two packages where I want bleeding edge, but I haven't worked out how to get package.el to pick packages from different repos. You might consider playing with something that I've had in my incubator file for awhile: https://github.com/timvisher/.emacs.d/blob/c8fa14315825f722f9995e8dd1e888c6b81321e9/timvisher/timvisher_incubator.el#L16-L28 Yeah, that's interesting, although I would be worried about getting duplicates of dependencies. I agree with you about problems with marmalade. What we need is a way for devs to specify the latest stable version (by commit, branch or tag) in their Emacs packages. That would mean that, like marmalade, the developer would control which version is considered stable, but could do so purely with their VC. Wordpress plugins use something similar. I assume you mean something over and above the `Version` ELPA header? Obviously, that depends on package maintainers following things like SNAPSHOT versioning (which ELPA doesn't accept) or Semantic Versioning to tip people off as to what is considered stable. So, the way wordpress use their subversion is that head is dirty, and that tags are stable (not a bad way to do things!). At the same time, though, you put a stable tag into your file. Now, with Version it means the current version, so when you have a dirty head this will point either to a snap version or the next version. With the wordpress approach you know where the head is (because it's, er, the head) and you know what the last stable version was (because you look at the head, and it tells you). I think the general attitude I'm seeing amongst some of the package maintainers out there is that the idea of versioning is a farse because they always intend to maintain stable HEADs so HEAD is as stable as your ever going to get. That's a shame, but I get the sentiment. For me, I maintain the sentiment that my version control system is, well, mine. I use it to support my development. I am happy to use it as a distribution system so long as that does not interfere. Github generates releases from tag information. This isn't a bad technique, but works on a repo basis while I maintain all of my emacs in one repo. Phil -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Is Clojure more functional then Scala?
So, in other words, like most which is the best programming language? questions, the answer to this one is It depends. :) On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 5:31 AM, Эльдар Габдуллин eldar...@gmail.comwrote: Clojure targets multiple platforms, Scala - one. Clojure is Lisp. That means almost any programming paradigm/DSL is just a library. But if you are interested in FP per se, I think Scala illustrates it better. With strong type system, pattern matching it's much closer to Haskell, which is the best language to learn in such case. Haskell literally serves as a definition of what FP is and almost every academic paper in FP field is written with Haskell nowadays. понедельник, 16 декабря 2013 г., 7:33:35 UTC+4 пользователь John Kida написал: I jumped on the FP bandwagon over a year ago and have been using Scala both at work and for personal interest. Recently however I decided to take a closer look at Clojure and see if it is something i actually like. I have to admit at first the syntax form was awkward, but im starting to really see the simplicity behind it. I have heard many people claim that Clojure sets you up and supports you for FP more so then Scala does. However they never provide any examples of something Clojure does that is more supporting of FP then the way idiomatic Scala does it. Here are some things that I have heard people say when comparing Clojure vs Scala in reference to FP Clojure has immutable persistance data structures. but so does Scala Scala also tries to get you to use its immutable collections, like Vectors, and are also persistent data structures. However they are not as uniform as Clojures Seq i agree with that. Also Scala recommends using vals and not vars, which gives you immutable references points I am certainly learning towards dropping Scala for a bit and giving Clojure a real shot. The reason i even picked up Scala was because i wanted to learn more about FP, and if there is a better tool for both doing and learning FP then i want it. So tell me, if you have used both Scala and Clojure, do you have some real examples of some things where Clojure really does support you better when doing FP, where Scala really leads you no way, or worse the imperative way? -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Is Clojure more functional then Scala?
The problem with this question is that Functional Programming means many different things to different people. If we define FP negatively (i.e. the language does not allow anything other than pure functions), then neither Scala or Clojure are FP. I would side here with Doug Hoyte's Let over Lambda (http://letoverlambda.com/index.cl/guest/chap5.html#sec_1) which says As we've seen, macros can invisibly change the meaning of certain forms from being function calls into arbitrary lisp expressions, a technique which is capable of violating referential transparency in many ways that simply aren't possible in other languages. He's talking about Common Lisp, but Clojure is a lisp and it's true there also. If we define it to mean, allows many of techiques that come out of FP, I would say that both do. (Scala recommeds vals not vars, but then so does Clojure in that it only allows vals, which is calls vars or locals). Finally, most functional programming research these days is done in strongly typed systems, and obviously, here, Scala wins hands-down. My conclusion: if you want to learn functional programming, I'd probably just use Haskell. If you want to learn FP and do something with it, I'd pick Scala or Clojure and make the choice on the basis of what it is you want to do. I picked Clojure because I need strong JVM integration, and syntactic plasticity. And, of course, the main reason is that I already knew other lisps, so it was easier. Phil John Kida jdk...@gmail.com writes: I jumped on the FP bandwagon over a year ago and have been using Scala both at work and for personal interest. Recently however I decided to take a closer look at Clojure and see if it is something i actually like. I have to admit at first the syntax form was awkward, but im starting to really see the simplicity behind it. I have heard many people claim that Clojure sets you up and supports you for FP more so then Scala does. However they never provide any examples of something Clojure does that is more supporting of FP then the way idiomatic Scala does it. Here are some things that I have heard people say when comparing Clojure vs Scala in reference to FP Clojure has immutable persistance data structures. but so does Scala Scala also tries to get you to use its immutable collections, like Vectors, and are also persistent data structures. However they are not as uniform as Clojures Seq i agree with that. Also Scala recommends using vals and not vars, which gives you immutable references points I am certainly learning towards dropping Scala for a bit and giving Clojure a real shot. The reason i even picked up Scala was because i wanted to learn more about FP, and if there is a better tool for both doing and learning FP then i want it. So tell me, if you have used both Scala and Clojure, do you have some real examples of some things where Clojure really does support you better when doing FP, where Scala really leads you no way, or worse the imperative way? -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Meta-eX: Power to Complect (featuring Rich Hickey)
Hey everyone, just a quick promotional email, so I'll keep it brief. Meta-eX[1] just pushed a small excerpt from a recent Live Session featuring the voice of Rich Hickey: https://soundcloud.com/meta-ex/power-to-complect It's not every day you get to hear music coded and performed with Clojure featuring Rich, so I thought it not too out of context to mention it on here. Enjoy, and Happy Hacking! Sam [1]: http://meta-ex.com --- http://sam.aaron.name -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Is Clojure more functional then Scala?
In 2008 I was reviewing options, we had to move away from Java. I choose Clojure rather than Scala, I found Scala quite confusing. Attempts to pour in FP notions in an OO language looked too me as an attempt to transplant a fifth limb to a four limb made body. Since then I had a few discussions with Scala developers and the answers I got made it clear to me that choosing Clojure is a better choice. The common ground to these answers is 'do not use mutable collections', 'use values...','this is bad practice,...' I never got a satisfying answer to my counter questions 'then why offer all these features (mutation, objects, ...) easily accessible, if they are not to be used ? And how a newbie is suppose to know how to avoid all these sand traps ? If you want to use mutation in Clojure, it's doable but it also colors your code in a way that makes it obvious and exceptional somehow. Clojure sits at the frontier but with a bias toward FP while being pragmatic. We have a problem in this industry, features inflation. At some point it becomes useless to add not so natural features to a language. Scala is OO derived and adding FP features will not change it's DNA. Look at what Java 8 promises and it will end up in some form of chaos. Just thinking at what a mixed Java code base will look like in 10 years gives me nausea :) Yes there's a plan to make Cobol OO aware. It's not because it's doable that we should to do it. http://rotpier.over-blog.com/article-97207983.html Luc P. I jumped on the FP bandwagon over a year ago and have been using Scala both at work and for personal interest. Recently however I decided to take a closer look at Clojure and see if it is something i actually like. I have to admit at first the syntax form was awkward, but im starting to really see the simplicity behind it. I have heard many people claim that Clojure sets you up and supports you for FP more so then Scala does. However they never provide any examples of something Clojure does that is more supporting of FP then the way idiomatic Scala does it. Here are some things that I have heard people say when comparing Clojure vs Scala in reference to FP Clojure has immutable persistance data structures. but so does Scala Scala also tries to get you to use its immutable collections, like Vectors, and are also persistent data structures. However they are not as uniform as Clojures Seq i agree with that. Also Scala recommends using vals and not vars, which gives you immutable references points I am certainly learning towards dropping Scala for a bit and giving Clojure a real shot. The reason i even picked up Scala was because i wanted to learn more about FP, and if there is a better tool for both doing and learning FP then i want it. So tell me, if you have used both Scala and Clojure, do you have some real examples of some things where Clojure really does support you better when doing FP, where Scala really leads you no way, or worse the imperative way? -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- Luc Prefontainelprefonta...@softaddicts.ca sent by ibisMail! -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
IE compatibility of clojurescript, Element undefined problem
hi all, I'm new for clojurescript. I found there is compatibility problem under IE6, closurescript use Element which IE 6 dos not have. Line 34266, Element.prototype.clojure$browser$event$EventType$ = true; Is clojurescript give up IE6? Joe -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Is Clojure more functional then Scala?
The url should have been this one:
http://rotpier27.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/chimc3a8re.jpg
}^}%}%}{[+{^ iPhone screen... too small for my big fingers...
In 2008 I was reviewing options,
we had to move away from Java.
I choose Clojure rather than Scala,
I found Scala quite confusing.
Attempts to pour in FP notions
in an OO language looked too me
as an attempt to transplant a fifth
limb to a four limb made body.
Since then I had a few discussions
with Scala developers and the
answers I got made it clear to me
that choosing Clojure is a better
choice.
The common ground to these answers
is 'do not use mutable collections',
'use values...','this is bad practice,...'
I never got a satisfying answer to
my counter questions 'then why offer
all these features (mutation, objects, ...) easily accessible,
if they are not to be used ?
And how a newbie is suppose to know
how to avoid all these sand traps ?
If you want to use mutation in
Clojure, it's doable but it also
colors your code in a way that makes
it obvious and exceptional somehow.
Clojure sits at the frontier but with
a bias toward FP while being
pragmatic.
We have a problem in this industry,
features inflation. At some point
it becomes useless to add not so
natural features to a language.
Scala is OO derived and adding FP
features will not change it's DNA.
Look at what Java 8 promises and
it will end up in some form of chaos.
Just thinking at what a mixed Java
code base will look like in 10 years
gives me nausea :)
Yes there's a plan to make Cobol
OO aware.
It's not because it's doable that we
should to do it.
http://rotpier.over-blog.com/article-97207983.html
Luc P.
I jumped on the FP bandwagon over a year ago and have been using Scala both
at work and for personal interest. Recently however I decided to take a
closer look at Clojure and see if it is something i actually like. I have
to admit at first the syntax form was awkward, but im starting to really
see the simplicity behind it.
I have heard many people claim that Clojure sets you up and supports you
for FP more so then Scala does. However they never provide any examples of
something Clojure does that is more supporting of FP then the way idiomatic
Scala does it.
Here are some things that I have heard people say when comparing Clojure vs
Scala in reference to FP
Clojure has immutable persistance data structures. but so does Scala
Scala also tries to get you to use its immutable collections, like Vectors,
and are also persistent data structures. However they are not as uniform as
Clojures Seq i agree with that.
Also Scala recommends using vals and not vars, which gives you immutable
references points
I am certainly learning towards dropping Scala for a bit and giving Clojure
a real shot. The reason i even picked up Scala was because i wanted to
learn more about FP, and if there is a better tool for both doing and
learning FP then i want it.
So tell me, if you have used both Scala and Clojure, do you have some real
examples of some things where Clojure really does support you better when
doing FP, where Scala really leads you no way, or worse the imperative way?
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Luc Prefontainelprefonta...@softaddicts.ca sent by ibisMail!
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Re: IE compatibility of clojurescript, Element undefined problem
Everyone should give up IE6. And, preferably, every other version of IE. On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 7:59 AM, Xiangtao Zhou tao...@gmail.com wrote: hi all, I'm new for clojurescript. I found there is compatibility problem under IE6, closurescript use Element which IE 6 dos not have. Line 34266, Element.prototype.clojure$browser$event$EventType$ = true; Is clojurescript give up IE6? Joe -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: IE compatibility of clojurescript, Element undefined problem
The clojure.browser namespace does try to extend a protocol to js/EventType - which IE6 doesn't have, but if you use third party alternatives, raw javascript DOM manipulation, or Google Closure, then things should work in IE6. On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 12:59 PM, Xiangtao Zhou tao...@gmail.com wrote: hi all, I'm new for clojurescript. I found there is compatibility problem under IE6, closurescript use Element which IE 6 dos not have. Line 34266, Element.prototype.clojure$browser$event$EventType$ = true; Is clojurescript give up IE6? Joe -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: IE compatibility of clojurescript, Element undefined problem
hi David, Thanks. You're right, I delete dommy, it works. On Monday, December 16, 2013 9:10:18 PM UTC+8, David Powell wrote: The clojure.browser namespace does try to extend a protocol to js/EventType - which IE6 doesn't have, but if you use third party alternatives, raw javascript DOM manipulation, or Google Closure, then things should work in IE6. On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 12:59 PM, Xiangtao Zhou tao...@gmail.comjavascript: wrote: hi all, I'm new for clojurescript. I found there is compatibility problem under IE6, closurescript use Element which IE 6 dos not have. Line 34266, Element.prototype.clojure$browser$event$EventType$ = true; Is clojurescript give up IE6? Joe -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clo...@googlegroups.comjavascript: Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com javascript: For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com javascript:. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Clojure for the Brave and True, an online book for beginners
I've written a chapter on namespaces and ns: http://www.braveclojure.com/organization/. I hope it clears up some of the confusion :) On Thursday, September 5, 2013 5:39:03 PM UTC-4, Bruno Kim Medeiros Cesar wrote: I would like to add to Roberto's request, a thorough treatment of ns would be great. It has its specific syntax that takes some time to understand, but that you don't use enough to imprint in your brain. It differs between the REPL and the file source, and is a showstopper when you want to try something new and get it wrong. The threads some days ago about :usehttps://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/clojure/can$20we$20please$20deprecate/clojure/i2VzAlT6oqM/1_ayNkgVF6gJand a proposal to simplify nshttps://groups.google.com/forum/#!searchin/clojure/simplified$20ns/clojure/sIMeJgyPqlM/jp6eBHUGS80Jmay be of interest in detailing their problems. On Thursday, September 5, 2013 4:32:20 PM UTC-3, Roberto Guerra wrote: Sorry if my comment came across the wrong way. I wasn't meaning you specifically, just the general clojure community in general. Keep up the good work. BTW, something that confuses me a lot in clojure is 'require' vs 'import'. There seem to be different ways of 'importing' or 'requiring' a package, I never know when to use what or if it even matters. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: IE compatibility of clojurescript, Element undefined problem
Hi Xiangtao, If you needed to delete dommy in order to get thing working in IE6, _please_ file a bug report. I like dommy a lot and finding everywhere that it breaks compatibility with older browsers is crucial for its success. On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 8:28 AM, Xiangtao Zhou tao...@gmail.com wrote: hi David, Thanks. You're right, I delete dommy, it works. On Monday, December 16, 2013 9:10:18 PM UTC+8, David Powell wrote: The clojure.browser namespace does try to extend a protocol to js/EventType - which IE6 doesn't have, but if you use third party alternatives, raw javascript DOM manipulation, or Google Closure, then things should work in IE6. On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 12:59 PM, Xiangtao Zhou tao...@gmail.com wrote: hi all, I'm new for clojurescript. I found there is compatibility problem under IE6, closurescript use Element which IE 6 dos not have. Line 34266, Element.prototype.clojure$browser$event$EventType$ = true; Is clojurescript give up IE6? Joe -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clo...@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Meta-eX: Power to Complect (featuring Rich Hickey)
On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 6:41 AM, Samuel Aaron samaa...@gmail.com wrote: just a quick promotional email, so I'll keep it brief. Meta-eX[1] just pushed a small excerpt from a recent Live Session featuring the voice of Rich Hickey: https://soundcloud.com/meta-ex/power-to-complect It's not every day you get to hear music coded and performed with Clojure featuring Rich, so I thought it not too out of context to mention it on here. Enjoy, and Happy Hacking! There is a thing in the Christian world (perhaps other religions as well) called a Sermon Jam, where a message is taken and put to music, usually as an artistic way to drive the point home further. I'm now anticipating eagerly an outpouring of CS Jams from the Overtone community, wherein CS Messages are put to music creatively. Can you imagine The Mother of All Demos? Guy Steele? Alan Kay? Dijkstra? Grace Hopper? All put to delicious electronic beats? Go for it, Overtone Hackers! -- In Christ, Timmy V. http://blog.twonegatives.com/ http://five.sentenc.es/ -- Spend less time on mail -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Othello from PAIP in Clojure
I look forward to your critique :) -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Othello from PAIP in Clojure
I look forward to your critique! On Friday, December 13, 2013 1:41:08 PM UTC, Sean Chalmers wrote: I'm running out of break time so I'll have to give this a look over a bit later, looks pretty good from a quick scan though! Interested to dive in the guts of it! :) If you're interested, this is my not-yet-finished implementation of Othello: https://github.com/mankyKitty/clojure-othello . I had the pleasure of joining a group of like-minded Clojure types for a book club reading of Joy of Clojure, and this was one of our 'hard' problems. Sean On Friday, 13 December 2013 13:50:17 UTC+1, edw...@kenworthy.info wrote: One of my favourite computer science / programming books is Peter Norvig’s “Paradigms of Artificial Intelligence Programming: Case Studies in Common Lisp” (PAIP). And the extended Othello example had always fascinated me so when I was looking for something to write to help me learn Clojure it was an obvious candidate: re-write Norvig’s Othello in Clojure. I thought the group might be interested; I'd also appreciate any feedback (except 'you should have used if-let' ;-) Thanks http://edwardkenworthy.wordpress.com/2013/12/05/othello-from-paradigms-of-artificial-intelligence-programming-re-written-in-clojure/ -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: cider status
Just to inject another sample into the population: As another hacker who lives in Emacs, I found the nrepl - cider transition to be quite painless. It took me maybe an hour of reading the website docs, installing/uninstalling packages with package.el, and updating the relevant sections of my .emacs.d/init.el file. Not to poo-poo on anyone's parade, but it really did seem pretty straightforward to me. So maybe some of the pain points people are feeling have to do with general challenges with configuring Emacs rather than specific problems with following the online cider docs. As a final note, ac-nrepl is documented on the cider page as working with cider. The nrepl-ritz package incompatibility is the only real issue missing from the docs. On the other hand, it's come up repeatedly on this mailing list, so at least some of us are likely to be aware of it at this point. ~Gary On Friday, December 13, 2013 4:04:08 PM UTC-5, Bozhidar Batsov wrote: On Friday, December 13, 2013 at 7:17 PM, Sean Corfield wrote: On Thu, Dec 12, 2013 at 11:43 PM, Adrian Mowat adrian...@gmail.comjavascript: wrote: Is cider just a new release of nrepl.el or a different thing entirely? Well, it's a new release insofar as it's an updated version of nrepl.el. In order to switch to it, however, you have to remove nrepl.el _and all packages that depend on it_ (which packages are not specified in the upgrade instructions so that would be a hit'n'miss process) If someone is not clear it should be improved. I can’t know what problems people encounter is they don’t tell me. cider has both an issue tracker and it’s own mailing list. , then you install cider.el and then you also have to update various parts of .emac.d/init.el depending on how you had customized nrepl. And that part isn't really described in the upgrade instructions either so that's also pretty hit'n'miss. All configuration options are documented in the README, so I’d say updating the init.el is an easy task. And then you have to reinstall newer versions of the packages you deleted that depended on nrepl.el and hope you get versions that depend on cider.el instead (since there's no way of telling, based solely on their package description I suspect). The list of package dependencies is more informative than a package's name. And if you use Ritz, that hasn't been updated so you have to stay with nrepl.el anyway. Frankly, I think it was a mistake to rename it and rename various functions in it, forcing breakage on dependent packages (which have not changed their names as far as I can tell). You’re thinking short term, but you should be thinking long term. Nobody will remember this transition is a few months. I’m confident that in the greater scheme of things the rename was a good solution. I use ac-nrepl and the latest version still says it is for nrepl so I've no idea whether it will work with cider. I also use nrepl-ritz ac-nrepl supports only cider. but I could live without it. My nrepl-related init.el file contains: https://www.refheap.com/21729 and it's not clear how that would need changing and whether it would continue to work properly. Your eval-in-repl function is obsolete, since similar functionality lives in cider itself. I have no idea why you’re modifying clojure-mode’s keymap when you should be modifying cider-mode’s keymap instead (+ set-ns is bound to a keycombo by default). Consulting the Changelog would reveal that `nrepl-mode` is now named `cider-repl-mode` and `nrepl-interaction-mode` is now `cider-mode` (it’s basically the same in SLIME). The migration is really simple and I think that people are blowing this problem out of proportion. Of course, I basically live in Emacs, so this is obviously affecting my POV. Less experienced Emacs users might find even simple changes challenging. And this isn't just for me - my team all has the same base configuration of Emacs and so we'd have to go thru this switch process for each team member. As I said previously - if you’re not certain about something you should stop by either cider’s google group or the GitHub project. :-) -- Sean A Corfield -- (904) 302-SEAN An Architect's View -- http://corfield.org/ World Singles, LLC. -- http://worldsingles.com/ Perfection is the enemy of the good. -- Gustave Flaubert, French realist novelist (1821-1880) -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clo...@googlegroups.com javascript: Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com javascript: For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the Google Groups Clojure
Re: AnNN: ClojureScript 0.0-2120
Wait a minute... #js data literal support added Holy $#%^!!! Where is this documented?! MUST...USE...NOW! -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: clojure.java.jdbc 3.0 reusing connections
Just to follow up on this: 0.3.0-rc1 introduces with-db-connection to allow multiple operations on a shared connection easily: (with-db-connection [db-con db-spec] ... operate on db-con multiple times ...) Sean On Tue, Dec 10, 2013 at 4:06 PM, Sean Corfield seancorfi...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Dec 10, 2013 at 2:17 PM, Andrey Antukh n...@niwi.be wrote: In my opinion, this has a lot of boilerplate for basic operation like this (reuse a connection for few operations). I'm open to suggestions for idiomatic enhancements (via JIRA). The deprecated api of clojure.java.jdbc had some useful methods for do it more concise and intuitive, you can use it. The deprecated API relied heavily on dynamically rebound global variables which are poor style (which is _why_ that API is deprecated). Also, you can try use a connection pool for avoid this boilerplate or find a more concise alternative to clojure.java.jdbc library. I would certainly recommend using a connection pool. There are two examples of that in the (community-editable) docs: http://clojure-doc.org/articles/ecosystem/java_jdbc/home.html#how-to-use-connection-pooling -- Sean A Corfield -- (904) 302-SEAN An Architect's View -- http://corfield.org/ World Singles, LLC. -- http://worldsingles.com/ Perfection is the enemy of the good. -- Gustave Flaubert, French realist novelist (1821-1880) -- Sean A Corfield -- (904) 302-SEAN An Architect's View -- http://corfield.org/ World Singles, LLC. -- http://worldsingles.com/ Perfection is the enemy of the good. -- Gustave Flaubert, French realist novelist (1821-1880) -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: [ClojureScript] Re: AnNN: ClojureScript 0.0-2120
On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 12:33 PM, Gary Johnson gwjoh...@uvm.edu wrote: Wait a minute... #js data literal support added Holy $#%^!!! Where is this documented?! MUST...USE...NOW! https://groups.google.com/d/msg/clojurescript/mUVbtdnAvHA/Voa86mDnNGwJ -- In Christ, Timmy V. http://blog.twonegatives.com/ http://five.sentenc.es/ -- Spend less time on mail -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Othello from PAIP in Clojure
I don't really have anything to critique, merely observe... ;) I find your implementation interesting because you chose to use two dimensional arrays to represent the board, I initially went down that road with mine but in the end went with a single list because I found it easier to handle the individual sequences of moves, and the application of a successful move was a single replace call on the board to replace the affected pieces. Unless I'm reading it wrong, you traverse the entire board to locate legal moves for the player, given you know the calculations required to move in each direction, wouldn't it be simply to start from the desired move and determine the valid moves that way? Different strokes for different folks, obviously, but just seems unnecessary. :) Probably disappointing but I don't have too much to say... since our implementations are actually surprisingly similar, the differences seem to come from how we structured the board and everything that stems from that. I won't speak to writing 'idiomatic Clojure' as my code can attest. :P Nice work ! -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Is Clojure more functional then Scala?
I think you're right that all or nearly all of the functional aspects of Clojure have counterparts in Scala. On top of that, Scala provides mutable flavors of everything, so you can pick and choose your approach. So that makes Scala better, right? But the difference between Clojure and Scala is bigger than a feature-to-feature comparison -- they have very different philosophies, and programs developed in Clojure consequently have a very different feel to them than those developed in Scala. I find Clojure programs to be dramatically simpler. Just as one example, consider modeling a deck of cards. In Clojure, you'd be more likely to come up with a simple representation for a card, perhaps: [10 :spades]. Depending on the card game, you might choose to represent a face card as [:king :clubs] or [13 :clubs]. A deck would likely be modeled as just a sequence of cards, and all the built-in sequence functions would apply, for example, shuffle, take, drop, etc. Serializing the data (for example, if you want to keep a database tracking all the shuffled decks you've ever used in a given game) comes for free. On the other hand, in Scala, you'd be more likely to create a card Class with a rank and suit field. The Suit class would be comprised of four case classes, because the philosophy is to enumerate all the possible suits as separate entities -- there's nothing in Scala like Clojure's convenient keywords. For the rank, you'd be steered towards representing all the ranks as integers. The possibility of representing face cards with a name would likely never occur to you, because it would be too complicated to go through the effort of defining the type of a rank to be a integer or a class comprised of four case classes -- jack,queen,king,ace. For modeling the deck, you probably wouldn't say a Deck is-a sequence, because composition is favored over inheritance. So you'd probably have a Deck class which would *contain* a sequence of cards. This means that you'd have to reimplement methods like shuffle, take, and drop on your Deck class to turn around and dispatch those methods to the underlying sequence of cards. If you're not careful, years of object-oriented training might kick in and before you know it, you're representing the deck as a class where methods like shuffle, take, and drop *destructively update* the underlying sequence -- it feels so natural to do that once you've encapsulated the underlying sequence of cards in a class. If you want to serialize a deck, that's more code to write (although general pickling of a Scala object is an *active area of research*). This example pretty much sums up what I prefer about Clojure. I like to tell people that a big part of what makes Clojure special is its philosophy of *lightweight data modeling*. It leads to delightfully simple systems. Scala remains deeply rooted in the OO philosophy, which all too often leads to an over-engineered muddle. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Clojure.org: Concurrency screencast 404
blip.tv killed the Clojure account. Many of the videos were moved to YouTube under the ClojureTV account: http://www.youtube.com/user/ClojureTV I suspect this is the talk you're referring to: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dGVqrGmwOAw On Monday, December 16, 2013 2:44:53 AM UTC-6, Abhijith wrote: Hello, Concurrency screencast link to blip.tv is throwing a 404. Is this a temporary thing or has it moved permanently? Most of this is covered in more detail in the concurrency screencasthttp://blip.tv/file/812787 . -- Queer little twists and quirks go into the making of an individual. To suppress them all and follow clock and calendar and creed until the individual is lost in the neutral gray of the host is to be less than true to our inheritance Life, that gorgeous quality of life, is not accomplished by following another man's rules. It is true we have the same hungers and same thirsts, but they are for different things and in different ways and in different seasons Lay down your own day, follow it to its noon, your own noon, or you will sit in an outer hall listening to the chimes but never reaching high enough to strike your own. - Angelo Patri -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Is Clojure more functional then Scala?
Hi Mark, A few questions: 1. The point you raise regarding declaring case classes is inherent to the typed nature of Scala, correct? Can that be pointed to as valid strength of Clojure. Since, we are comparing static vs dynamic typing here. 2. I am not super familiar with Scale, but I am assuming Scala can do similar to what we have in ML, which would look like this: datatype rank = Jack | Queen | King | Ace | Num of int Isn't a similar idiomatic case class sufficient to achieve the needed simplicity in Scala? 3. Regarding walking down the path of multiple object hierarchies, I guess that is only a choice in Scala and is not necessitated by idiomatic Scala. So, can't one just use the functional construct to achieve what you define in Clojure? I believe Scala's blending of static typing with OO and FP principles is a exciting area of research and only time will tell if we could have all the features in one big language. Scala's tries to be different language to different people depending on which background one approaches from. I also agree with one other member where it is stated that Scala is just too complex and Clojure's wins by its simplicity and consistent representation. Thanks Guru On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 12:13 PM, Mark Engelberg mark.engelb...@gmail.comwrote: I think you're right that all or nearly all of the functional aspects of Clojure have counterparts in Scala. On top of that, Scala provides mutable flavors of everything, so you can pick and choose your approach. So that makes Scala better, right? But the difference between Clojure and Scala is bigger than a feature-to-feature comparison -- they have very different philosophies, and programs developed in Clojure consequently have a very different feel to them than those developed in Scala. I find Clojure programs to be dramatically simpler. Just as one example, consider modeling a deck of cards. In Clojure, you'd be more likely to come up with a simple representation for a card, perhaps: [10 :spades]. Depending on the card game, you might choose to represent a face card as [:king :clubs] or [13 :clubs]. A deck would likely be modeled as just a sequence of cards, and all the built-in sequence functions would apply, for example, shuffle, take, drop, etc. Serializing the data (for example, if you want to keep a database tracking all the shuffled decks you've ever used in a given game) comes for free. On the other hand, in Scala, you'd be more likely to create a card Class with a rank and suit field. The Suit class would be comprised of four case classes, because the philosophy is to enumerate all the possible suits as separate entities -- there's nothing in Scala like Clojure's convenient keywords. For the rank, you'd be steered towards representing all the ranks as integers. The possibility of representing face cards with a name would likely never occur to you, because it would be too complicated to go through the effort of defining the type of a rank to be a integer or a class comprised of four case classes -- jack,queen,king,ace. For modeling the deck, you probably wouldn't say a Deck is-a sequence, because composition is favored over inheritance. So you'd probably have a Deck class which would *contain* a sequence of cards. This means that you'd have to reimplement methods like shuffle, take, and drop on your Deck class to turn around and dispatch those methods to the underlying sequence of cards. If you're not careful, years of object-oriented training might kick in and before you know it, you're representing the deck as a class where methods like shuffle, take, and drop *destructively update* the underlying sequence -- it feels so natural to do that once you've encapsulated the underlying sequence of cards in a class. If you want to serialize a deck, that's more code to write (although general pickling of a Scala object is an *active area of research*). This example pretty much sums up what I prefer about Clojure. I like to tell people that a big part of what makes Clojure special is its philosophy of *lightweight data modeling*. It leads to delightfully simple systems. Scala remains deeply rooted in the OO philosophy, which all too often leads to an over-engineered muddle. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit
Re: Is Clojure more functional then Scala?
On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 12:30 PM, Guru Devanla grd...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Mark, A few questions: 1. The point you raise regarding declaring case classes is inherent to the typed nature of Scala, correct? Can that be pointed to as valid strength of Clojure. Since, we are comparing static vs dynamic typing here. Well, in Scala, if you wanted to simulate keywords (albeit less efficiently) you could just declare the type of something to be String. But you wouldn't do that because the culture is to enumerate all the possibilities. Yes, that culture comes from the fact that Scala's community believes in the value of static typing and being as precise as possible about the type of a value. But Scala's static typing doesn't inherently prevent you from doing a more general solution. That's why I described it as a philosophy, rather than something intrinsic to static vs dynamic typing. 2. I am not super familiar with Scale, but I am assuming Scala can do similar to what we have in ML, which would look like this: datatype rank = Jack | Queen | King | Ace | Num of int Isn't a similar idiomatic case class sufficient to achieve the needed simplicity in Scala? Yes, although it is more verbose in Scala. I would argue that as we program, hundreds of times every day we make little design choices, and we are subtly influenced by our programming language, generally making the choice that is easiest in the language we are using. I think many programmers, without even thinking about it, would choose Integer over Scala's more verbose equivalent to datatype rank = Jack | Queen | King | Ace | Num of int Keep in mind that the type definition isn't the only place you incur extra complexity: every time you ever process a rank anywhere in your code, the datatype version will need to be unpacked using a match mechanism to ensure you've handled all the cases and only those cases. 3. Regarding walking down the path of multiple object hierarchies, I guess that is only a choice in Scala and is not necessitated by idiomatic Scala. So, can't one just use the functional construct to achieve what you define in Clojure? Yes. Again, the ideas of pinning down your types precisely and encapsulating data is more of a cultural/philosophical issue, driven by the static typing and object-oriented paradigms which Scala fully embraces. You can code Scala in other ways, but if you were the kind of person who didn't like those things, you probably wouldn't be using Scala. I believe Scala's blending of static typing with OO and FP principles is a exciting area of research and only time will tell if we could have all the features in one big language. Scala's tries to be different language to different people depending on which background one approaches from. I admire Scala, I just don't enjoy programming in it as much as I had hoped. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: Meta-eX: Power to Complect (featuring Rich Hickey)
Lol, very cool :) Tim Washington Interruptsoftware.ca http://interruptsoftware.ca On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 6:41 AM, Samuel Aaron samaa...@gmail.com wrote: Hey everyone, just a quick promotional email, so I'll keep it brief. Meta-eX[1] just pushed a small excerpt from a recent Live Session featuring the voice of Rich Hickey: https://soundcloud.com/meta-ex/power-to-complect It's not every day you get to hear music coded and performed with Clojure featuring Rich, so I thought it not too out of context to mention it on here. Enjoy, and Happy Hacking! Sam [1]: http://meta-ex.com --- http://sam.aaron.name -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: IE compatibility of clojurescript, Element undefined problem
Hi Tim, somebody already filed a bug under IE8, https://github.com/Prismatic/dommy/issues/57 according to the absence of js/Element, the fix may not work. I'll test it later. Joe On Tuesday, December 17, 2013 12:34:42 AM UTC+8, Tim Visher wrote: Hi Xiangtao, If you needed to delete dommy in order to get thing working in IE6, _please_ file a bug report. I like dommy a lot and finding everywhere that it breaks compatibility with older browsers is crucial for its success. On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 8:28 AM, Xiangtao Zhou tao...@gmail.comjavascript: wrote: hi David, Thanks. You're right, I delete dommy, it works. On Monday, December 16, 2013 9:10:18 PM UTC+8, David Powell wrote: The clojure.browser namespace does try to extend a protocol to js/EventType - which IE6 doesn't have, but if you use third party alternatives, raw javascript DOM manipulation, or Google Closure, then things should work in IE6. On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 12:59 PM, Xiangtao Zhou tao...@gmail.com wrote: hi all, I'm new for clojurescript. I found there is compatibility problem under IE6, closurescript use Element which IE 6 dos not have. Line 34266, Element.prototype.clojure$browser$event$EventType$ = true; Is clojurescript give up IE6? Joe -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clo...@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clo...@googlegroups.comjavascript: Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com javascript: For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com javascript:. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: [ClojureScript] Re: [ANN] cljs-start 0.0.7 now support source-map
Hi Jussi, I was wondering what sort of performance should I expect with Clojurescript compile. I get 3-20 seconds per file on two different machines. yes, I have similar results When I just change the root cljs file, do you mean the core.cljs file? cljsbuild recompiles three other files (advanced.js, useless.js and simple.js). did you issue the `$ lein cljsbuild auto whitespace` tasks instead of `$ lein compile`? That said, take into account that, if I remember well, there is an open issue on cljsbuild regarding the recompilation of builds non directly interested by a test launched by the lein cljsbuild test name-of-the-test. I have Macbook with Maverick, Lein 2.3.4 on Java 1.6.0_65 and Ubuntu 13.04 with OpenJDK-7, same Lein version. Both should have plenty of resources. yes I know. I personally adopted the following workflow during the early development. 1. comment out all the builds but whitespace 2. comment out all the tests but phantoms-ws 3. lein cljsbuild auto whitespace 4. lein cljsbuild test phantomjs-ws Then, when I reach something stable I uncomment the other builds and tests. one trick is to use `#_` to quickly comment an entire expression. From all the cljs templates yours seem most featureful and easiest to start with, so I'd very much like to see it perform better. Probably when cljsbuild will have an `auto` subtask for the `test` task the response time of a recompilation will be much shorter, because only one build and one test will be recompiled. Sorry about that, but I do not have a better answer. Mimmo signature.asc Description: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail
Re: cider status
On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 12:27 PM, Gary Johnson gwjoh...@uvm.edu wrote: Just to inject another sample into the population: As another hacker who lives in Emacs, I found the nrepl - cider transition to be quite painless. It took me maybe an hour of reading the website docs, installing/uninstalling packages with package.el, and updating the relevant sections of my .emacs.d/init.el file. Not to poo-poo on anyone's parade, but it really did seem pretty straightforward to me. Interesting, isn't it, what emacs users consider to be quite painless. Users of non-legacy tools tend to set the bar rather higher, needless to say, typically expecting upgrading something (other than the operating system itself) to take a few minutes, tops, with most of that spent doing something else while progress meters (first downloading, then installing) crawl to 100% and the result working OOTB without manual config changes or other nursemaiding. So maybe some of the pain points people are feeling have to do with general challenges with configuring Emacs rather than specific problems with following the online cider docs. That much is quite believable. :) -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Re: cider status
On Mon, Dec 16, 2013 at 12:27 PM, Gary Johnson gwjoh...@uvm.edu wrote: It took me maybe an hour of reading the website docs, installing/uninstalling packages with package.el, and updating the relevant sections of my .emacs.d/init.el file. Not to poo-poo on anyone's parade, but it really did seem pretty straightforward to me. I thought I read the website docs thoroughly, I thought I uninstalled the proper packages and I thought I edited my .emacs file correctly. But the repl refused to start-up so I returned to nrepl. I am not even remotely an emacs expert, but until this incident I had years of trouble-free emacs/leningen/nrepl/slime/swank use. regards, naipmoro -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
Comparing core.async and Reactive Extensions
Hello, I seem to be a little bit confused when comparing core.async to the so called Reactive Extensions (Rx). They seem to tackle similar problem of async-icity, so I wonder what are the principal differences and in what cases is one preferred over the other. Can someone please explain? Regards, Michal -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
[ANN] Clojure IDE for OS X
Hi, It's a good news to have a new IDE for Clojure. I wanted to try it but I read it works only on OS X 10.9. I think your target is very limited. So, may be another time. Chris -- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
