Re: How do I upgrade nREPL?
Yeah, other have noticed this as well https://github.com/clojure-emacs/cider/issues/961 Not sure if this is a Lein bug or a feature. On 30 March 2015 at 10:09, Shannon Severance s...@s53.me wrote: Through some additional experimentation, I have found when I start Leiningen repl within a Leiningen project, the nrepl dependency from ~/.lien/profiles.clj is being used. nREPL 0.2.10 is started. This is true if I start via `lein repl` or `cider-jack-in`. The problem exists when starting free of a project. -- Shannon -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: How do I upgrade nREPL?
I saw no difference in behavior, if I understood how to create the :dev
profile:
{:user {:plugins [[cider/cider-nrepl 0.9.0-SNAPSHOT]
[lein-pprint 1.1.2]]
:dependencies [[org.clojure/tools.nrepl 0.2.10]]}
:dev {:dependencies [[org.clojure/tools.nrepl 0.2.10]]}}
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Re: How do I upgrade nREPL?
Shannon Severance s...@s53.me writes: I would like to upgrade nREPL, but it appears I am still using version 0.2.6. Yes, that's the version Leiningen depends on, so I think we all have to wait until the next Leiningen upgrade to satisfy CIDER. Bye, Tassilo -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: How do I upgrade nREPL?
You can use a newer version by putting your nrepl dep under the :dev profile, which will override the version that leiningen wants. On Sunday, March 29, 2015 at 11:46:55 PM UTC-7, Tassilo Horn wrote: Shannon Severance s...@s53.me javascript: writes: I would like to upgrade nREPL, but it appears I am still using version 0.2.6. Yes, that's the version Leiningen depends on, so I think we all have to wait until the next Leiningen upgrade to satisfy CIDER. Bye, Tassilo -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: How do I upgrade nREPL?
Through some additional experimentation, I have found when I start Leiningen repl within a Leiningen project, the nrepl dependency from ~/.lien/profiles.clj is being used. nREPL 0.2.10 is started. This is true if I start via `lein repl` or `cider-jack-in`. The problem exists when starting free of a project. -- Shannon -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
Bozhidar Batsov bozhi...@batsov.com writes: Anti-Emacs stuff really gets to me. i too find it somewhat tiresome. It makes me wonder how many people have actually stopped and asked themselves: Given that Emacs seems like a crusty ancient artifact from The Land That Time Forgot, why do so many people keep using it? i can't speak for other Emacs users, of course, but here are some of the main reasons i prefer to use (GNU) Emacs[1]: * i don't have to learn and use a distinct, possibly resource-hungry, IDE[2] for every new programming language or environment i need/want to work in. (When the Swift language was released, for example, basic Swift support in the form of `swift-mode` became available within less than a week.) * Further to the resource-usage issue, i can more easily use Emacs remotely over low-bandwidth links than i could use an IDE. * IDEs typically don't allow one to change their basic behaviours whilst they're running. Related: if there's a bug fix or feature i want applied, i can apply it myself, rather than having to hope that the maintainers will (a) accept that it's something that /should/ be applied, and (b) actually apply it. * In my experience, Emacs tends to be less of a 'black box' than some IDEs, in that i can more easily get a better sense of what's going on behind the scenes. This in turn means that i've got a better sense of the relevant build system, and how to fix and/or tune it in particular circumstances. * Emacs is available for a wider range of platforms than most IDEs, meaning it's more likely to be available to me should i need to work on a particular platform. * Emacs is the product of approximately three decades of constant development, such that it handles many corner-cases of many scenarios (e.g. in the area of i18n) and continues to adapt to new ones. * Emacs is, in my experience, one of the best-documented pieces of software i've encountered. Absent or poor documentation is typically treated as a bug. * The Emacs ecosystem is growing rapidly; http://melpa.org/ currently lists ~2400 packages (extensions or addons) available for easy installation via Emacs' package.el UI. * Clojure-oriented point #1: since ~80%[3] of Emacs is written in Emacs Lisp, a lot of work has been put into support for sexp-based languages; cf. `paredit`. * Clojure-oriented point #2: having a polyglot dev system written in an easily-modifiable Lisp environment makes it more attractive to me as someone with a Lisp mindset, as per my interest in Clojure. :-) Yes, there can be a steeper initial learning curve with Emacs than with IDEs, e.g. things like 'frames' and 'windows' not meaning what one might expect (which is hardly surprising, given that GNU Emacs predates the existence of GUIs-as-standard, and the Web). Yet this is a one-time cost that, in my experience, is rapidly amortised as one starts to use Emacs in an increasingly wider variety of contexts. For example: being able to use CIDER when i wanted to start learning Clojure meant that i could focus on learning Clojure itself, rather than an entire new dev system. Emacs is surely not the best tool for all developers in all contexts, but i also feel it's something that developers - and Clojure developers in particular - should perhaps at least give a second look. Alexis. --- [1] Or Vim, if Emacs isn't an option. Some things i mention here are also applicable to use of Vim. [2] In the /literal/ sense of the phrase, Emacs can indeed provide an Integrated Development Environment. But obviously, i'm here referring to highly graphical IDEs such as Eclipse. [3] According to David A. Wheeler's sloccount(1) run on the Emacs 24.5.1 sources. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
Colin Yates colin.ya...@gmail.com writes: I used it a few years back [snip] [and] even after man-months spent tinkering, hunting down the right version on MELPA or MARMALADE (or whatever it is called) MELPA and Marmalade are two separate ELPAs (Emacs Lisp Package Archives) - others include MELPA Stable, GNU ELPA and quelpa. i basically only use MELPA and GNU ELPA. In terms of the ~200 packages i've installed from MELPA, i can't remember having to deal with versioning issues at all. Further, despite some people fretting about the theoretical lack of stability of packages on MELPA, i've only rarely had to deal with broken packages - and those breakages have been fixed very rapidly by the maintainers. (i maintain a few ELisp packages myself, and also work to address issues with my packages promptly.) I still couldn't get close to what Cursive gives me OOTB. *nod* However, Emacs configuration management has, i feel, improved significantly over the last couple of years, with things like `use-package`: https://github.com/jwiegley/use-package or `pallet`: https://github.com/rdallasgray/pallet enabling one to create easily-reproducible config setups across environments/machines. Alexis. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
On Monday, March 30, 2015 at 4:18:03 AM UTC-4, Alexis wrote: Bozhidar Batsov bozh...@batsov.com javascript: writes: Anti-Emacs stuff really gets to me. i too find it somewhat tiresome. It makes me wonder how many people have actually stopped and asked themselves: Given that Emacs seems like a crusty ancient artifact from The Land That Time Forgot, why do so many people keep using it? i can't speak for other Emacs users, of course, but here are some of the main reasons i prefer to use (GNU) Emacs[1]: * i don't have to learn and use a distinct, possibly resource-hungry, IDE[2] for every new programming language or environment i need/want to work in. (When the Swift language was released, for example, basic Swift support in the form of `swift-mode` became available within less than a week.) Eclipse has plugins for a wide variety of languages. * Further to the resource-usage issue, i can more easily use Emacs remotely over low-bandwidth links than i could use an IDE. Typical home and mobile connection speeds are multiple MBPS these days. * IDEs typically don't allow one to change their basic behaviours whilst they're running. Related: if there's a bug fix or feature i want applied, i can apply it myself, rather than having to hope that the maintainers will (a) accept that it's something that /should/ be applied, and (b) actually apply it. The second, at least, applies to every open source IDE, including a certain EPL-licensed one. * In my experience, Emacs tends to be less of a 'black box' than some IDEs, in that i can more easily get a better sense of what's going on behind the scenes. This in turn means that i've got a better sense of the relevant build system, and how to fix and/or tune it in particular circumstances. Unfortunately, one MUST do all of that and CANNOT use it as a black box, because it is the software analogue of a computer with no keyboard or monitor or anything else resembling a user interface, so one must toggle everything in and know the hardware internals backwards and forwards to get anything done. :) * Emacs is available for a wider range of platforms than most IDEs, meaning it's more likely to be available to me should i need to work on a particular platform. Of course, there are some IDEs that run on top of the JVM, and are thus as widely available platform-wise as the JVM ... * Emacs is the product of approximately three decades of constant development, such that it handles many corner-cases of many scenarios (e.g. in the area of i18n) and continues to adapt to new ones. Three decades worth of accumulated legacy code. I can barely begin to imagine what horrors must be lurking in some of the darker and less well-traveled corners of that thing's /src directory. But you could probably form a fairly accurate basic picture by reading the collected works of one H. P. Lovecraft ... :) And what kind of i18n corner cases tend to arise with a 7-bit 80x24 character-based display (or emulation of same)? Just out of curiosity. * Emacs is, in my experience, one of the best-documented pieces of software i've encountered. Absent or poor documentation is typically treated as a bug. The issue with its documentation isn't, of course, its existence or comprehensiveness. Rather, the last time I tried using emacs, I seem to recall always ending up with this sequence of events: a) I am trying to do some task X, for which the obvious key combination bleeps or does something weird but definitely doesn't do X for some reason. b) Soon, I have a split pane with my document on the left and the help files on the right, with the latter open to a page on task X and the input focus in it. c) A little bit later, I have a split pane with my document on the left, the input focus in my document, and the help pane on the right open to a page on how to switch focus between panes, and I don't remember the long and complicated sequence of keystrokes needed to perform task X any more because it was deleted from my brain's short term memory to remember the long and complicated sequence of keystrokes that is how one says alt+tab in the obscure and archaic dialect known as emacsese. d) Repeat b) and c) a few times, while experiencing an acute event of abnormal pre-menopausal hair loss. e) Give up and fire up Notepad, Eclipse, or whatever seems best suited to current task. ;) * The Emacs ecosystem is growing rapidly; http://melpa.org/ currently lists ~2400 packages (extensions or addons) available for easy installation via Emacs' package.el UI. I wonder how anyone can find anything in that mess. The Java and Clojure IDEs are probably each sandwiched amongst hundreds of consecutive entries all the rest of which are for languages nobody has ever heard of outside of one obscure city near Bernhöfen, or that nobody has used since 1987,
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
For me personally, I absolutely admire emacs - I really do. I used it a few years back when I first started in Clojure before Cursive was around and when it was configured correctly it was absolutely great. From an engineering POV, yeah, it rocks. I am sure that for anything I can do in IDE-X I can do it in emacs. The major difference is, and the reason that I no longer use emacs is that IDE-X _probably_ ships it out of the box (or at least is one or two plugins away), and this is very important when you end up re-installing stuff a lot on your machine and co-developers. Yeah, I know, git your .emacs or use one of the curated packs (of which Batsov's is absolutely great), but even after man-months spent tinkering, hunting down the right version on MELPA or MARMALADE (or whatever it is called) I still couldn't get close to what Cursive gives me OOTB. Emacs to me was something that could be absolutely great, but I just ran out of time making it so. Do I feel part of the 'I'm-not-clever-enough-to-make-emacs-work-properly' club - sure :). Emacs is great if you want to build your own editor, anything else is great if you need to work now. On 30 March 2015 at 05:32, Alexis flexibe...@gmail.com wrote: Bozhidar Batsov bozhi...@batsov.com writes: Anti-Emacs stuff really gets to me. i too find it somewhat tiresome. It makes me wonder how many people have actually stopped and asked themselves: Given that Emacs seems like a crusty ancient artifact from The Land That Time Forgot, why do so many people keep using it? i can't speak for other Emacs users, of course, but here are some of the main reasons i prefer to use (GNU) Emacs[1]: * i don't have to learn and use a distinct, possibly resource-hungry, IDE[2] for every new programming language or environment i need/want to work in. (When the Swift language was released, for example, basic Swift support in the form of `swift-mode` became available within less than a week.) * Further to the resource-usage issue, i can more easily use Emacs remotely over low-bandwidth links than i could use an IDE. * IDEs typically don't allow one to change their basic behaviours whilst they're running. Related: if there's a bug fix or feature i want applied, i can apply it myself, rather than having to hope that the maintainers will (a) accept that it's something that /should/ be applied, and (b) actually apply it. * In my experience, Emacs tends to be less of a 'black box' than some IDEs, in that i can more easily get a better sense of what's going on behind the scenes. This in turn means that i've got a better sense of the relevant build system, and how to fix and/or tune it in particular circumstances. * Emacs is available for a wider range of platforms than most IDEs, meaning it's more likely to be available to me should i need to work on a particular platform. * Emacs is the product of approximately three decades of constant development, such that it handles many corner-cases of many scenarios (e.g. in the area of i18n) and continues to adapt to new ones. * Emacs is, in my experience, one of the best-documented pieces of software i've encountered. Absent or poor documentation is typically treated as a bug. * The Emacs ecosystem is growing rapidly; http://melpa.org/ currently lists ~2400 packages (extensions or addons) available for easy installation via Emacs' package.el UI. * Clojure-oriented point #1: since ~80%[3] of Emacs is written in Emacs Lisp, a lot of work has been put into support for sexp-based languages; cf. `paredit`. * Clojure-oriented point #2: having a polyglot dev system written in an easily-modifiable Lisp environment makes it more attractive to me as someone with a Lisp mindset, as per my interest in Clojure. :-) Yes, there can be a steeper initial learning curve with Emacs than with IDEs, e.g. things like 'frames' and 'windows' not meaning what one might expect (which is hardly surprising, given that GNU Emacs predates the existence of GUIs-as-standard, and the Web). Yet this is a one-time cost that, in my experience, is rapidly amortised as one starts to use Emacs in an increasingly wider variety of contexts. For example: being able to use CIDER when i wanted to start learning Clojure meant that i could focus on learning Clojure itself, rather than an entire new dev system. Emacs is surely not the best tool for all developers in all contexts, but i also feel it's something that developers - and Clojure developers in particular - should perhaps at least give a second look. Alexis. --- [1] Or Vim, if Emacs isn't an option. Some things i mention here arealso applicable to use of Vim. [2] In the /literal/ sense of the phrase, Emacs can indeed provide an Integrated Development Environment. But obviously, i'm herereferring to highly graphical IDEs such as Eclipse. [3] According to David A. Wheeler's sloccount(1) run on the Emacs 24.5.1 sources.
Re: how do you re-load a clojure library?
Hey Andy, As a devops, I do appreciate that, thank you for sharing! — Sent from Mailbox On Sun, Mar 29, 2015 at 10:17 PM, Andy- andre.r...@gmail.com wrote: Off topic for this list but I'm sure helpful to some: On Windows: You can see open file handles with MS's Process Explorer. On Linux: There is `lsof`, or if you like interactive: The popular `htop` utility allows you to press `l` to see all open ports, files and cwd of a process. This quickly allows you to figure out where the .jar's are actually loaded from. Both are very good to know in general. HTH On Sunday, March 29, 2015 at 10:11:18 AM UTC-4, Dan Campbell wrote: There it is, in Windows, at c:\Users\DC\.m2\repository, will try that, thanks Juvenn. On Sunday, March 29, 2015 at 8:08:22 AM UTC-4, juvenn wrote: Hi Dan, All jars files are kept at `~/.m2/repositories` on *nix, as far as I know. So you can just find and delete them over there. The next time you run a lein task, it will re-download it. Best, -- Juvenn Woo Sent with Sparrow http://www.sparrowmailapp.com/?sig On Sunday, 29 March, 2015 at 7:43 pm, Dan Campbell wrote: If you wanted to sort of 'clean out' a clojar or any contrib, korma or core.async or whatever, how would you do that? In other words, if you wanted a specific library to be re-downloaded and deployed (i.e., refreshed) on your desktop, what command would you run? Or what folders would you clean out? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clo...@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
That's a good idea, but I'd also like to say a bit more about the pro/con-emacs discussion, which I hope to be constructive. Discussion is often a good idea, but in a dedicated thread. Perhaps it's time to fork the original topic so that this discussion about editors can continue without derailing this thread even further. Timothy On Mon, Mar 30, 2015 at 7:12 AM, Lee Spector lspec...@hampshire.edu wrote: On Mar 30, 2015, at 7:35 AM, Jony Hudson jonyepsi...@gmail.com wrote: I propose, instead of this discussion, everyone channels their energy into writing an open-source data-science library, or blog post/article promoting Clojure for data science. In their favourite editor, of course! Jony That's a good idea, but I'd also like to say a bit more about the pro/con-emacs discussion, which I hope to be constructive. I think I actually agree with most of the comments both by the emacs critics and the emacs proponents in this thread. Even the most intense ones, on both sides. But rather than worrying about who is more correct I want to point out that it's entirely possible, and would be gloriously beautiful, for an emacs-based Clojure environment to be produced that: - Can be downloaded in a single click and run with one more click to do basic Clojure development with no further configuration, on Mac/Windows/Linux. - Provides reasonably standard GUI elements (familiar to any computer user without reading a manual) for triggering core functionality and for discovering additional features. As some have mentioned in this thread, a lot of work has been done on easing configuration (by people on this list among others) and there are some GUI-based packages out there, but as far as I know there's nothing that comes close to meeting both of the bullet points above. I think that most emacs-based folks either don't think this is possible or don't see it as a priority, but something like this must be possible (and there have been things close to this for other Lisps in the past), and if it became a reality that I would switch to it for all of my coding and teaching and I'd evangelize it from the rooftops. I'm not in a position to do development work on this myself, but I believe quite fervently that this would be a fabulous thing for the Clojure community. I'd be happy to discuss this further off-list and/or beta-test projects aimed at these goals. -Lee -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- “One of the main causes of the fall of the Roman Empire was that–lacking zero–they had no way to indicate successful termination of their C programs.” (Robert Firth) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 30.03.2015 15:12, Lee Spector wrote: On Mar 30, 2015, at 7:35 AM, Jony Hudson jonyepsi...@gmail.com wrote: I propose, instead of this discussion, everyone channels their energy into writing an open-source data-science library, or blog post/article promoting Clojure for data science. In their favourite editor, of course! Jony That's a good idea, but I'd also like to say a bit more about the pro/con-emacs discussion, which I hope to be constructive. I think I actually agree with most of the comments both by the emacs critics and the emacs proponents in this thread. Even the most intense ones, on both sides. But rather than worrying about who is more correct I want to point out that it's entirely possible, and would be gloriously beautiful, for an emacs-based Clojure environment to be produced that: - Can be downloaded in a single click and run with one more click to do basic Clojure development with no further configuration, on Mac/Windows/Linux. - Provides reasonably standard GUI elements (familiar to any computer user without reading a manual) for triggering core functionality and for discovering additional features. As some have mentioned in this thread, a lot of work has been done on easing configuration (by people on this list among others) and there are some GUI-based packages out there, but as far as I know there's nothing that comes close to meeting both of the bullet points above. I think that most emacs-based folks either don't think this is possible or don't see it as a priority, but something like this must be possible (and there have been things close to this for other Lisps in the past), and if it became a reality that I would switch to it for all of my coding and teaching and I'd evangelize it from the rooftops. I'm not in a position to do development work on this myself, but I believe quite fervently that this would be a fabulous thing for the Clojure community. I'd be happy to discuss this further off-list and/or beta-test projects aimed at these goals. I have failed to setup Emacs for development and used Vim or Eclipse primarily before entering Clojure-land. emacs-live allowed me to just execute a shell script and get a decent Clojure environment which I have used for 2 years until I have reconfigured my emacs having a better understanding. Its emphasis on live-coding inspired by composing music is a very compelling. The only thing I had to add to emacs live was evil-mode, which wasn't too hard. Also installing packages in emacs 24 is a breeze, no match to Eclipse plugin repository mess and screw-ups and I don't want to use a closed source IDE. No matter how many resources you have, being able to run emacs in a shared tmux session is a big plus. I even have aliased emacs-client as vim, so I don't have to rethink starting vim for quick edits and still do it in a common emacs environment. I also find it interesting that Rich still uses inferior-lisp mode and I think people get too obsessed with tooling. I usually wait until it really hurts and then I try to adjust my tooling. It is really important that the nrepl middleware is shared between IDEs and I had the impression recently that Cursive and others started to integrate features directly into the IDE, which I don't think is a good strategy. A thankful shoutout again to the emacs-live maintainers! https://github.com/overtone/emacs-live Christian -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1 iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJVGU+dAAoJEKel+aujRZMkMRIH+gJJ1rLqB4NZNDZHmZSz6E2W 7OwsDXcn7bqZeaGv/s/VRjZ9Hk6saxS2hJP+PEzWSnXU48fBvYSAU8tu657U85tk wFuWqm2A5kl/RyKwukYY1o05GYmVQvkGA2cKM63rTItXL/4pkhMpMQhwkOZHe1Zt ZesL4A8B1A5jiZqp3bwhHIt/c1Awi33XG2BrFmMqdlSINJ3t0ADDNZra5328G1yZ eZDIO+ljRISkfxAOz/u45yi/KT9mDWe7AXqhavKwDFXbFZxmofrPNAHYRkB/+WuY vZAuw+zyVvY8NyBmBNKW1b5oqljQtUBQxSbNdC1sdE9Z1pe2yYsyOD0Jp3EZjR0= =jt1D -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
On Monday, March 30, 2015 at 7:23:00 AM UTC-4, Tassilo Horn wrote: Fluid Dynamics a209...@trbvm.com javascript: writes: * Further to the resource-usage issue, i can more easily use Emacs remotely over low-bandwidth links than i could use an IDE. Typical home and mobile connection speeds are multiple MBPS these days. Still, running Eclipse or some other IDE via X forwarding isn't too much fun even with X2Go. Most people these days also have all their devices, even the handheld ones, powerful enough to run a decent IDE locally, which can work with local files or connect to a remote git repository. This obviates the need to SSH or telnet into a remote host and run both the editor AND the repository there, or to use X forwarding. Unfortunately, one MUST do all of that and CANNOT use it as a black box, because it is the software analogue of a computer with no keyboard or monitor or anything else resembling a user interface, so one must toggle everything in and know the hardware internals backwards and forwards to get anything done. :) That's nonsense. As soon as you have made yourself acquainted with the basic Emacs terminology and concepts, getting started with Clojure development is a piece of cake. Of course, the devil is in the details. Including the implementation details that leak out all over the place, starting with the ubiquitous use of the term buffer in user-facing documentation. Emacs follows the unicode standard and represents characters as UTF8-encoded codepoints. All very useful, right up until the time comes to display such strings to ttya0 :) Rather, the last time I tried using emacs, I seem to recall always ending up with this sequence of events: a) I am trying to do some task X, for which the obvious key combination bleeps or does something weird but definitely doesn't do X for some reason. b) Soon, I have a split pane with my document on the left and the help files on the right, with the latter open to a page on task X and the input focus in it. c) A little bit later, I have a split pane with my document on the left, the input focus in my document, and the help pane on the right open to a page on how to switch focus between panes, and I don't remember the long and complicated sequence of keystrokes needed to perform task X any more because it was deleted from my brain's short term memory to remember the long and complicated sequence of keystrokes that is how one says alt+tab in the obscure and archaic dialect known as emacsese. d) Repeat b) and c) a few times, while experiencing an acute event of abnormal pre-menopausal hair loss. e) Give up and fire up Notepad, Eclipse, or whatever seems best suited to current task. ;) I think with help pane you mean a window showing the Emacs info manual. Oh, if only. If it had been an actual window, I'd have been able to use OS-native window switching to switch between it and the document I was working on, and leave the help window open to something other than the how to switch panes topic! :) You can have as many of them open as you like, say, one for task X, and one for switching focus between windows. And then have what, two 27x24 and a 26x24 keyhole to squint through at everything? :) Less a couple of lines at the bottom for status notifications and the little command input area, of course. * The Emacs ecosystem is growing rapidly; http://melpa.org/ currently lists ~2400 packages (extensions or addons) available for easy installation via Emacs' package.el UI. I wonder how anyone can find anything in that mess. Searching might be a start. If searching in emacs was as intuitive as control-F and type in a substring to look for, it likely would be. :) The Java and Clojure IDEs are probably each sandwiched amongst hundreds of consecutive entries Yes, of course. Hey, how to people use apt-get/packman/yum/whatever? The packages needed for task X are sandwiched between tens of thousands of unrelated packages. For something like Ubuntu, there's probably a nicely designed searchable website not entirely unlike the Firefox addons site Moz runs. Given the vintage of the emacs user experience (I use this term loosely), its version probably is a textual alphabetical list with a blinking prompt at the bottom, with no perceived affordances of any way to search or jump nonlinearly within the list, and unless you're lucky perhaps not even an obvious way to page down and page up. (The keys on every keyboard bearing those precise labels, no doubt, beep and do nothing else, or else do things entirely unrelated to paging down and up, this being emacs we're discussing after all.) all the rest of which are for languages nobody has ever heard of outside of one obscure city near Bernhöfen, or that nobody has used since 1987, or that nobody has used
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
On Mar 30, 2015, at 7:35 AM, Jony Hudson jonyepsi...@gmail.com wrote: I propose, instead of this discussion, everyone channels their energy into writing an open-source data-science library, or blog post/article promoting Clojure for data science. In their favourite editor, of course! Jony That's a good idea, but I'd also like to say a bit more about the pro/con-emacs discussion, which I hope to be constructive. I think I actually agree with most of the comments both by the emacs critics and the emacs proponents in this thread. Even the most intense ones, on both sides. But rather than worrying about who is more correct I want to point out that it's entirely possible, and would be gloriously beautiful, for an emacs-based Clojure environment to be produced that: - Can be downloaded in a single click and run with one more click to do basic Clojure development with no further configuration, on Mac/Windows/Linux. - Provides reasonably standard GUI elements (familiar to any computer user without reading a manual) for triggering core functionality and for discovering additional features. As some have mentioned in this thread, a lot of work has been done on easing configuration (by people on this list among others) and there are some GUI-based packages out there, but as far as I know there's nothing that comes close to meeting both of the bullet points above. I think that most emacs-based folks either don't think this is possible or don't see it as a priority, but something like this must be possible (and there have been things close to this for other Lisps in the past), and if it became a reality that I would switch to it for all of my coding and teaching and I'd evangelize it from the rooftops. I'm not in a position to do development work on this myself, but I believe quite fervently that this would be a fabulous thing for the Clojure community. I'd be happy to discuss this further off-list and/or beta-test projects aimed at these goals. -Lee -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
Without wanting to get involved in this discussion, I'd just like to point out that there's plenty of anti-IntelliJ trolling goes on in the Clojure community as well. The trick is just to ignore it, something that I mostly manage to do. I'd also like to second Jony's suggestion that we also talk a bit about data science, which was the original question. On 31 March 2015 at 01:53, Fluid Dynamics a2093...@trbvm.com wrote: On Monday, March 30, 2015 at 7:23:00 AM UTC-4, Tassilo Horn wrote: Fluid Dynamics a209...@trbvm.com writes: * Further to the resource-usage issue, i can more easily use Emacs remotely over low-bandwidth links than i could use an IDE. Typical home and mobile connection speeds are multiple MBPS these days. Still, running Eclipse or some other IDE via X forwarding isn't too much fun even with X2Go. Most people these days also have all their devices, even the handheld ones, powerful enough to run a decent IDE locally, which can work with local files or connect to a remote git repository. This obviates the need to SSH or telnet into a remote host and run both the editor AND the repository there, or to use X forwarding. Unfortunately, one MUST do all of that and CANNOT use it as a black box, because it is the software analogue of a computer with no keyboard or monitor or anything else resembling a user interface, so one must toggle everything in and know the hardware internals backwards and forwards to get anything done. :) That's nonsense. As soon as you have made yourself acquainted with the basic Emacs terminology and concepts, getting started with Clojure development is a piece of cake. Of course, the devil is in the details. Including the implementation details that leak out all over the place, starting with the ubiquitous use of the term buffer in user-facing documentation. Emacs follows the unicode standard and represents characters as UTF8-encoded codepoints. All very useful, right up until the time comes to display such strings to ttya0 :) Rather, the last time I tried using emacs, I seem to recall always ending up with this sequence of events: a) I am trying to do some task X, for which the obvious key combination bleeps or does something weird but definitely doesn't do X for some reason. b) Soon, I have a split pane with my document on the left and the help files on the right, with the latter open to a page on task X and the input focus in it. c) A little bit later, I have a split pane with my document on the left, the input focus in my document, and the help pane on the right open to a page on how to switch focus between panes, and I don't remember the long and complicated sequence of keystrokes needed to perform task X any more because it was deleted from my brain's short term memory to remember the long and complicated sequence of keystrokes that is how one says alt+tab in the obscure and archaic dialect known as emacsese. d) Repeat b) and c) a few times, while experiencing an acute event of abnormal pre-menopausal hair loss. e) Give up and fire up Notepad, Eclipse, or whatever seems best suited to current task. ;) I think with help pane you mean a window showing the Emacs info manual. Oh, if only. If it had been an actual window, I'd have been able to use OS-native window switching to switch between it and the document I was working on, and leave the help window open to something other than the how to switch panes topic! :) You can have as many of them open as you like, say, one for task X, and one for switching focus between windows. And then have what, two 27x24 and a 26x24 keyhole to squint through at everything? :) Less a couple of lines at the bottom for status notifications and the little command input area, of course. * The Emacs ecosystem is growing rapidly; http://melpa.org/ currently lists ~2400 packages (extensions or addons) available for easy installation via Emacs' package.el UI. I wonder how anyone can find anything in that mess. Searching might be a start. If searching in emacs was as intuitive as control-F and type in a substring to look for, it likely would be. :) The Java and Clojure IDEs are probably each sandwiched amongst hundreds of consecutive entries Yes, of course. Hey, how to people use apt-get/packman/yum/whatever? The packages needed for task X are sandwiched between tens of thousands of unrelated packages. For something like Ubuntu, there's probably a nicely designed searchable website not entirely unlike the Firefox addons site Moz runs. Given the vintage of the emacs user experience (I use this term loosely), its version probably is a textual alphabetical list with a blinking prompt at the bottom, with no perceived affordances of any way to search or jump nonlinearly within the list, and unless you're lucky perhaps not even an obvious way to page down and page up. (The keys
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
On Monday, March 30, 2015 at 7:29:36 AM UTC-4, Alexis wrote: Fluid Dynamics a209...@trbvm.com javascript: writes: * i don't have to learn and use a distinct, possibly resource-hungry, IDE[2] for every new programming language or environment i need/want to work in. (When the Swift language was released, for example, basic Swift support in the form of `swift-mode` became available within less than a week.) Eclipse has plugins for a wide variety of languages. True, but i don't think i've ever heard that one of Eclipse's main selling points is that it's light on resource usage. Its resource usage as a percentage of what's available with a typical developer's hardware now is probably comparable to emacs's as a percentage of what was available with a typical developer's hardware circa 1985. Of course, on modern hardware that percentage can do a whole heck of a lot more, such as presenting an actual user interface. :) * Further to the resource-usage issue, i can more easily use Emacs remotely over low-bandwidth links than i could use an IDE. Typical home and mobile connection speeds are multiple MBPS these days. You respond to me saying that /i/ like Emacs for its ease-of-use across low-bandwidth links (which i regularly have to deal with) by what, implying that i should be a so-called 'typical' home/mobile connection user instead? Forgive me for assuming that you meant to suggest that as a general selling point, rather than a personal idiosyncracy or something. :) Anyway, 'typical' varies from geographic location to geographic location. My home connection is ADSL2+, but my mobile provides 4G speeds only within a limited geographic area - and when i visited the city of Newcastle, New South Wales, recently, with it's population of ~300,000, my mobile data connection was intermittent, let alone of a decent speed. In such a situation, i've found being able to use a text-based UI, rather than being forced to use a graphical UI (even using something like NoMachine) quite a boon. In such a situation, I'd find using infrequent and discrete network accesses, such as checkins and checkouts from a remote repository, and working with local copies of checked-out files with a local editor on my own device, to be quite a boon. And who wants their UI to have noticeable latency anyways? If you're trying to arrow to a position (or worse, backspace or delete to one), it's like skating on ice: you're prone to overshoot and spend ages playing golf with the damn cursor. If you have a local laggy UI, such as due to something else abruptly hogging the CPU unexpectedly (svchost.exe being the standard culprit on Windows), at least you can resort to the mouse to click the cursor into position in one move, but with a remote terminal emulation you won't even have that option. Further, even ADSL2+ bandwidth can be heavily saturated when other people on the connection are e.g. streaming HD movies at the same time as one is trying to work on a remote system Isn't that cable you're thinking of? Which is why sane people use DSL/4G for most needs, unless they download a shitton of giant .mkvs themselves. * IDEs typically don't allow one to change their basic behaviours whilst they're running. Related: if there's a bug fix or feature i want applied, i can apply it myself, rather than having to hope that the maintainers will (a) accept that it's something that /should/ be applied, and (b) actually apply it. The second, at least, applies to every open source IDE, including a certain EPL-licensed one. Not quite, at least not insofar as i understand what you're saying. i'm talking about not having to patch the source tree and recompile, even across new versions. In my Emacs config, i've redefined a few different Emacs functions to behave the way i want, such that, even when i install a new version of Emacs, i don't need to make any changes to the source itself to get the desired behaviour. That sounds unbelievably fragile. Like monkey-patching clojure.core or a major Ruby class, and then updating Clojure/Ruby. Unfortunately, one MUST do all of that and CANNOT use it as a black box, because it is the software analogue of a computer with no keyboard or monitor or anything else resembling a user interface, so one must toggle everything in and know the hardware internals backwards and forwards to get anything done. :) A strong claim, considerably stronger than the weaker claim that Emacs needs tweaking to get to one's 'ideal' workflow, or even that Emacs needs more tweaking than other software to get to that workflow. To get to something that so much as vaguely resembles your normal workflow appears to take an astonishing amount of tweaking, enough that the word tweaking no longer fits nearly as well as
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 30.03.2015 13:35, Jony Hudson wrote: I propose, instead of this discussion, everyone channels their energy into writing an open-source data-science library, or blog post/article promoting Clojure for data science. In their favourite editor, of course! I have started working on R integration with the help of rinancanter (1) and it was nice to have dedicated R code cells with at least syntax highlighting that I can mix with Clojure code in the same JVM environment. http://viewer.gorilla-repl.org/view.html?source=githubuser=ghubberrepo=cncpath=rincanter.clj I am not sure whether this fits the design atm. though. I also had a look at renjin, but I think the native plugins mandate an RVM integration atm. Sadly JyNI has made little progress towards Numpy support, (2) otherwise Clojure could integrate more mature data science platforms like R and Python more easily and leverage its integrative JVM advantage more. The fragmentation on runtime level is really stupid imo. It can be difficult to address some data science techniques in Clojure, because you have to reimplement them from R, Python or something else compared to Clojure being able to use Java libraries directly and sitting on top of the hill by default for business problems. Java is just not a good data science language and hated by many people in my environment. But gorilla is really nice in combination with ggplot already, so I think if one could at least integrate R there, the disadvantages would shrink significantly. I also have taken a paper I liked and implemented a quick version of SNE, which was fairly nice to do in Gorilla REPL: http://viewer.gorilla-repl.org/view.html?source=githubuser=ghubberrepo=cncpath=stochastic-neighbour-embedding.clj A problem seems to be unicode support, I tried to use some math symbols from the notation in the paper directly, but the viewer seems to have a problem with it. Christian (1) https://github.com/jolby/rincanter (2) https://github.com/Stewori/JyNI/issues/2# -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1 iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJVGVPFAAoJEKel+aujRZMkLBYIAKp+kzS7l0iiKdKVhRl1e0wP utRHY+KFwmIRpc0vBf1Y5I5Lo2jFlemslDlWmQb5iPcYfALpLrzhHVP4CL4nRy+c SMfnHPOS4nD6usAbTjyi3ZP8/wTbL3Du6oGQmwQMcMpklTgh+qgBsLmLdYabwXcm YMifMYZVjSEtFcAz/FLxukLGGOSa86Nld79Wgj9hu2kTpS3ZFIx2gSpNzeeyiZBU O+QtKTVAM603vBDQF0dgYu5u45pfsW/SZ0dThOvKN9632MX8Xb+SzzS34pxtxGWr /JMpffYOIZ7kw0qto1zKKwewoO0zmhCjmOXDS063wYfHWvEqhcia9ChdT/4rxvY= =0XIe -END PGP SIGNATURE- -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: State of the Art in Clojure Debugging
I've been using Spacemacs with great success https://github.com/syl20bnr/spacemacs and I heard some rave things from Vim aficionados. So you can get all the good stuff from bbastov's hardwork and still use Vim like environment :) ./Vijay On Monday, March 30, 2015 at 4:27:32 PM UTC+2, Bozhidar Batsov wrote: This is a newish REPL debugger that's editor agnostic - https://github.com/razum2um/clj-debugger (and accidentally it's powering CIDER's own debugger). I'm pretty sure Cursive has the most sophisticated debugger right now, so the question is whether you dislike Intellij IDEA as much as Emacs. :-) On 30 March 2015 at 15:20, Matthew West matthew...@gmail.com javascript: wrote: What is the current preferred strategy for debugging Clojure code? I'd prefer a solution that doesn't involve Emacs, as I already know vim pretty well and don't really want to switch. What are my options that are still actively maintained? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clo...@googlegroups.com javascript: Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com javascript: For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com javascript:. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Easy-install/GUI emacs for Clojure (was: Re: clojure, not the go to for data science)
[Forked the thread as per suggestion by Timothy Baldridge.] On Mar 30, 2015, at 9:29 AM, Christian Weilbach whitesp...@polyc0l0r.net wrote: I have failed to setup Emacs for development and used Vim or Eclipse primarily before entering Clojure-land. emacs-live allowed me to just execute a shell script and get a decent Clojure environment which I have used for 2 years until I have reconfigured my emacs having a better understanding. Its emphasis on live-coding inspired by composing music is a very compelling. The only thing I had to add to emacs live was evil-mode, which wasn't too hard. I agree that emacs-live is a great step forward! I explored it for a while and considered adopting it for my teaching and research work. (I'm not a software developer, I'm a computer science professor/researcher.) I didn't think it got quite far enough towards meeting my needs for me to make the leap, but it came the closest so far. Perhaps it'd be a good starting point for someone to take the next step. FWIW I try to survey all of the options every year or so, and I currently teach with and mostly use Counterclockwise, although I sometimes recommend Nightcode for newbies. Both of these are great, and I'm immensely grateful to their developers. But if an emacs-based environment came along with the right usability features (see bullet points below) then I'd almost certainly switch to that. -Lee On 30.03.2015 15:12, Lee Spector wrote: On Mar 30, 2015, at 7:35 AM, Jony Hudson jonyepsi...@gmail.com wrote: I propose, instead of this discussion, everyone channels their energy into writing an open-source data-science library, or blog post/article promoting Clojure for data science. In their favourite editor, of course! Jony That's a good idea, but I'd also like to say a bit more about the pro/con-emacs discussion, which I hope to be constructive. I think I actually agree with most of the comments both by the emacs critics and the emacs proponents in this thread. Even the most intense ones, on both sides. But rather than worrying about who is more correct I want to point out that it's entirely possible, and would be gloriously beautiful, for an emacs-based Clojure environment to be produced that: - Can be downloaded in a single click and run with one more click to do basic Clojure development with no further configuration, on Mac/Windows/Linux. - Provides reasonably standard GUI elements (familiar to any computer user without reading a manual) for triggering core functionality and for discovering additional features. As some have mentioned in this thread, a lot of work has been done on easing configuration (by people on this list among others) and there are some GUI-based packages out there, but as far as I know there's nothing that comes close to meeting both of the bullet points above. I think that most emacs-based folks either don't think this is possible or don't see it as a priority, but something like this must be possible (and there have been things close to this for other Lisps in the past), and if it became a reality that I would switch to it for all of my coding and teaching and I'd evangelize it from the rooftops. I'm not in a position to do development work on this myself, but I believe quite fervently that this would be a fabulous thing for the Clojure community. I'd be happy to discuss this further off-list and/or beta-test projects aimed at these goals. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: State of the Art in Clojure Debugging
This is a newish REPL debugger that's editor agnostic - https://github.com/razum2um/clj-debugger (and accidentally it's powering CIDER's own debugger). I'm pretty sure Cursive has the most sophisticated debugger right now, so the question is whether you dislike Intellij IDEA as much as Emacs. :-) On 30 March 2015 at 15:20, Matthew West matthewwest...@gmail.com wrote: What is the current preferred strategy for debugging Clojure code? I'd prefer a solution that doesn't involve Emacs, as I already know vim pretty well and don't really want to switch. What are my options that are still actively maintained? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: [ANN][book] Clojure Reactive Programming
I am now a proud owner of your e-book! Congratulations, I am looking forward to reading this latest addition to my Clojure library. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
State of the Art in Clojure Debugging
What is the current preferred strategy for debugging Clojure code? I'd prefer a solution that doesn't involve Emacs, as I already know vim pretty well and don't really want to switch. What are my options that are still actively maintained? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
Fluid Dynamics a2093...@trbvm.com writes: * i don't have to learn and use a distinct, possibly resource-hungry, IDE[2] for every new programming language or environment i need/want to work in. (When the Swift language was released, for example, basic Swift support in the form of `swift-mode` became available within less than a week.) Eclipse has plugins for a wide variety of languages. My experience has been that many plugins except for the really major ones are frequently incompatible. I.e., some cool plugin appears and with the next eclipse release it won't work anymore because its maintainers have a hard time keeping it up-to-date. For that reason, it is not uncommon that people set up separate eclipse installations for each and every project which has the exact version required by the plugins needed for that project. * Further to the resource-usage issue, i can more easily use Emacs remotely over low-bandwidth links than i could use an IDE. Typical home and mobile connection speeds are multiple MBPS these days. Still, running Eclipse or some other IDE via X forwarding isn't too much fun even with X2Go. * In my experience, Emacs tends to be less of a 'black box' than some IDEs, in that i can more easily get a better sense of what's going on behind the scenes. This in turn means that i've got a better sense of the relevant build system, and how to fix and/or tune it in particular circumstances. Unfortunately, one MUST do all of that and CANNOT use it as a black box, because it is the software analogue of a computer with no keyboard or monitor or anything else resembling a user interface, so one must toggle everything in and know the hardware internals backwards and forwards to get anything done. :) That's nonsense. As soon as you have made yourself acquainted with the basic Emacs terminology and concepts, getting started with Clojure development is a piece of cake. Of course, knowing more than that will make it easier to make best use of its features and adapt it to your personal preferences but that's the same with IDEs, too. And what kind of i18n corner cases tend to arise with a 7-bit 80x24 character-based display (or emulation of same)? Emacs follows the unicode standard and represents characters as UTF8-encoded codepoints. * Emacs is, in my experience, one of the best-documented pieces of software i've encountered. Absent or poor documentation is typically treated as a bug. The issue with its documentation isn't, of course, its existence or comprehensiveness. No, but that's the issue many IDEs have. Usually, you have a button or a menu entry for some functionality possibly with some tooltip, and that's as much documentation as you get. Rather, the last time I tried using emacs, I seem to recall always ending up with this sequence of events: a) I am trying to do some task X, for which the obvious key combination bleeps or does something weird but definitely doesn't do X for some reason. b) Soon, I have a split pane with my document on the left and the help files on the right, with the latter open to a page on task X and the input focus in it. c) A little bit later, I have a split pane with my document on the left, the input focus in my document, and the help pane on the right open to a page on how to switch focus between panes, and I don't remember the long and complicated sequence of keystrokes needed to perform task X any more because it was deleted from my brain's short term memory to remember the long and complicated sequence of keystrokes that is how one says alt+tab in the obscure and archaic dialect known as emacsese. d) Repeat b) and c) a few times, while experiencing an acute event of abnormal pre-menopausal hair loss. e) Give up and fire up Notepad, Eclipse, or whatever seems best suited to current task. ;) I think with help pane you mean a window showing the Emacs info manual. You can have as many of them open as you like, say, one for task X, and one for switching focus between windows. * The Emacs ecosystem is growing rapidly; http://melpa.org/ currently lists ~2400 packages (extensions or addons) available for easy installation via Emacs' package.el UI. I wonder how anyone can find anything in that mess. Searching might be a start. The Java and Clojure IDEs are probably each sandwiched amongst hundreds of consecutive entries Yes, of course. Hey, how to people use apt-get/packman/yum/whatever? The packages needed for task X are sandwiched between tens of thousands of unrelated packages. all the rest of which are for languages nobody has ever heard of outside of one obscure city near Bernhöfen, or that nobody has used since 1987, or that nobody has used period because the whole thing was invented as an obscure joke (e.g. Befunge). I don't see how support for niche languages is a bad thing. And all the rest is again
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
i'm assuming this response is a troll, given the use of the sort of gratuitous insults that Bozhidar mentioned; specific examples noted below. (And this somewhat amuses me, given the recent discussion about whether it's possible to critique different technologies without resorting to doing little more than trash-talking them.) If it's /not/ intended to be a troll, then i feel it pretty much providing data which substantiates Bozhidar's complaint. At any rate, on this occasion, i'll respond to a number of the points made; but feel free to have the final word (and sling some more gratuitous insults). Fluid Dynamics a2093...@trbvm.com writes: * i don't have to learn and use a distinct, possibly resource-hungry, IDE[2] for every new programming language or environment i need/want to work in. (When the Swift language was released, for example, basic Swift support in the form of `swift-mode` became available within less than a week.) Eclipse has plugins for a wide variety of languages. True, but i don't think i've ever heard that one of Eclipse's main selling points is that it's light on resource usage. * Further to the resource-usage issue, i can more easily use Emacs remotely over low-bandwidth links than i could use an IDE. Typical home and mobile connection speeds are multiple MBPS these days. You respond to me saying that /i/ like Emacs for its ease-of-use across low-bandwidth links (which i regularly have to deal with) by what, implying that i should be a so-called 'typical' home/mobile connection user instead? Anyway, 'typical' varies from geographic location to geographic location. My home connection is ADSL2+, but my mobile provides 4G speeds only within a limited geographic area - and when i visited the city of Newcastle, New South Wales, recently, with it's population of ~300,000, my mobile data connection was intermittent, let alone of a decent speed. In such a situation, i've found being able to use a text-based UI, rather than being forced to use a graphical UI (even using something like NoMachine) quite a boon. Further, even ADSL2+ bandwidth can be heavily saturated when other people on the connection are e.g. streaming HD movies at the same time as one is trying to work on a remote system * IDEs typically don't allow one to change their basic behaviours whilst they're running. Related: if there's a bug fix or feature i want applied, i can apply it myself, rather than having to hope that the maintainers will (a) accept that it's something that /should/ be applied, and (b) actually apply it. The second, at least, applies to every open source IDE, including a certain EPL-licensed one. Not quite, at least not insofar as i understand what you're saying. i'm talking about not having to patch the source tree and recompile, even across new versions. In my Emacs config, i've redefined a few different Emacs functions to behave the way i want, such that, even when i install a new version of Emacs, i don't need to make any changes to the source itself to get the desired behaviour. Unfortunately, one MUST do all of that and CANNOT use it as a black box, because it is the software analogue of a computer with no keyboard or monitor or anything else resembling a user interface, so one must toggle everything in and know the hardware internals backwards and forwards to get anything done. :) A strong claim, considerably stronger than the weaker claim that Emacs needs tweaking to get to one's 'ideal' workflow, or even that Emacs needs more tweaking than other software to get to that workflow. i actually agree with the latter claim, but also feel that /for me/ the the benefits of doing most of it just once in Emacs have vastly outweighed the costs. i certainly acknowledge, howver, that this is a classic instance of 'YMMV'. Of course, there are some IDEs that run on top of the JVM, and are thus as widely available platform-wise as the JVM ... Granted. * Emacs is the product of approximately three decades of constant development, such that it handles many corner-cases of many scenarios (e.g. in the area of i18n) and continues to adapt to new ones. Three decades worth of accumulated legacy code. I can barely begin to imagine what horrors must be lurking in some of the darker and less well-traveled corners of that thing's /src directory. But you could probably form a fairly accurate basic picture by reading the collected works of one H. P. Lovecraft ... :) A gratuitous insult, but sure, see http://emacshorrors.com/ for such examples. Still, it's easy to dismiss the ugliness of legacy code when one doesn't have the luxury of not having to deal with the needs of a diverse user base over an extended period of time: http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/fog69.html And what kind of i18n corner cases tend to arise with a 7-bit 80x24
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
I propose, instead of this discussion, everyone channels their energy into writing an open-source data-science library, or blog post/article promoting Clojure for data science. In their favourite editor, of course! Jony On Sunday, 29 March 2015 10:55:34 UTC+1, Sayth Renshaw wrote: Hi I last learned clojure in 1.2. Just curious why Clojure hasn't developed as a go to for data science? It never seems to get a mention R,Python and now Julia get the attention. By design it would appear that Clojure would be a good fit. Is it a lack of libraries, ease of install, no good default environment (R Rstudio, IPython ) where as you would need to use emacs with clojure, or is there just a better default use of Clojure? Sayth -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
Fluid Dynamics a2093...@trbvm.com writes: You can have as many of them open as you like, say, one for task X, and one for switching focus between windows. And then have what, two 27x24 and a 26x24 keyhole to squint through at everything? :) Less a couple of lines at the bottom for status notifications and the little command input area, of course. You can have as many windows as you want, and you can have as many buffers as you want. Windows display buffers. You can have 2 windows on the same buffer, or you can have one window and a gazillion buffers in which case only one of them is displayed currently, but you can switch from one buffer to another buffer in the current window with `C-x b buffer-name'. It's not uncommon that I have 50 or more buffers at a time, and it's still very manageable. And of course, you don't need to run emacs on the linux console. I run it maximized in X with its graphical UI, and then I can easily have 3 windows side-by-side which are still wider than 80 columns. Anyway, there's no point in discussing with you as it seems you know better anyhow. So the discussion is finished for me. Bye, Tassilo -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: State of the Art in Clojure Debugging
Thanks for this Bozhidar. I just took a look at clj-debugger https://github.com/razum2um/clj-debugger and am excited about several of its features, especially the ability to print locals. Does anyone know if it supports (or could easily support -- I'd post an issue if it seems possible) a way to say something like (print-locals-on-exception (some-fn)) where nothing in some-fn actually calls break or anything else in clj-debugger, and where, if an exception is raised in the execution of some-fn, then the locals at the point of the exception get printed? -Lee On Mar 30, 2015, at 10:27 AM, Bozhidar Batsov bozhi...@batsov.com wrote: This is a newish REPL debugger that's editor agnostic - https://github.com/razum2um/clj-debugger https://github.com/razum2um/clj-debugger (and accidentally it's powering CIDER's own debugger). I'm pretty sure Cursive has the most sophisticated debugger right now, so the question is whether you dislike Intellij IDEA as much as Emacs. :-) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: State of the Art in Clojure Debugging
Because of the blocking nature of vim-fireplace (really of vim itself), you'll have to run most of the debuggers from a live, dedicated repl. I've been slowly evolving my own debug-repl for a few years now. It works in a `user.clj` setting or in a project related file. At a quick glance, it supports the major features found in clj-debugger (file info exists, but no file pretty-print). You can see a recent gist of it here: https://gist.github.com/ohpauleez/4ca0b646b89512f38ea2 Some people may want to rename `debug-repl` to `break`, and `quit-dr` to `continue`. * Locals are in a map, easy to print or consume * The debug repl captures the metadata about the call-site, so you can easily print the file contents based on that information * There's a shorthand to bounce the debugger into the namespace where the call happened, `in-debug-ns` * There's tooling/functions to make any uncaught exception trigger the debugger/repl * There's a `try-repl` (try an expression and launch the debugger/repl on an exception) * There's an `assert-repl` (like `try-repl` but with an assert - useful when testing function contracts/invariants) * One can make the debug repl return a new form into the call-site (at `quit`/`continue`) or establish a default one. * This debug repl nests correctly In a more recent version (not in the gist), I've toyed with capturing stackframes as objects, allowing you to go up/down in the stack within a limited scope. I don't think this is a particularly good idea, but in certain contexts, it works nicely. While I've never used it, you may want to look at vim-redl - https://github.com/dgrnbrg/vim-redl. You could also use emacs with evil, and then use ritz for a true JVM debugger - https://github.com/pallet/ritz Cheers, Paul -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: Update multiple values in vector at once
(defn upd-vec [input-vector ids new-values] (reduce-kv #(assoc %1 %3 (new-values %2)) input-vector ids)) (upd-vec [0 0 0 0 0] [1 3] [1.44 1.45]) ;= [0 1.44 0 1.45 0] On 30 March 2015 at 20:05, Alexandr updates...@gmail.com wrote: Hello everybody, How can I update values in the vector given vector of id-s and new values? For example (defn upd-vec [input-vector ids new-values] ) (upd-vec [0 0 0 0 0] [1 3] [1.44 1.45]) Output: [0 1.44 0 1.45 0] (1st and 3rd elements are replaced) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Update multiple values in vector at once
Hello everybody, How can I update values in the vector given vector of id-s and new values? For example (defn upd-vec [input-vector ids new-values] ) (upd-vec [0 0 0 0 0] [1 3] [1.44 1.45]) Output: [0 1.44 0 1.45 0] (1st and 3rd elements are replaced) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: Clojure ecommerce
I also am interesting in finding a clojure ecommerce library I'm posting here so that I can keep up on this topic and receive an email with any news On Monday, January 5, 2015 at 9:03:52 AM UTC-8, g vim wrote: Are there currently any Clojure ecommerce packages or libraries, preferably open source? Something like Shopify. Failing that, what are Clojure developers using to build ecommerce sites? gvim -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: Update multiple values in vector at once
Thanks a lot! On Monday, March 30, 2015 at 8:11:25 PM UTC+2, Michał Marczyk wrote: (defn upd-vec [input-vector ids new-values] (reduce-kv #(assoc %1 %3 (new-values %2)) input-vector ids)) (upd-vec [0 0 0 0 0] [1 3] [1.44 1.45]) ;= [0 1.44 0 1.45 0] On 30 March 2015 at 20:05, Alexandr updat...@gmail.com javascript: wrote: Hello everybody, How can I update values in the vector given vector of id-s and new values? For example (defn upd-vec [input-vector ids new-values] ) (upd-vec [0 0 0 0 0] [1 3] [1.44 1.45]) Output: [0 1.44 0 1.45 0] (1st and 3rd elements are replaced) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clo...@googlegroups.com javascript: Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com javascript: For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com javascript:. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
http://www.scribd.com/doc/30605092/Saturn-v-Flight-Manual I have tracked down the flight manual of the Saturn-V rocket so we can objectively decide whether emacs is more, or less, difficult. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: Deterministic macro expansion for Clojure?
Thanks! A great suggestion. I'll try it. On Friday, March 27, 2015 at 8:56:21 PM UTC-4, Ben wrote: One way you can get what you want is to give up on the auto-gensym feature of the #-terminated identifiers, and call gensym directly, enabling it to be mocked out with with-redefs. E.g. instead of: (defmacro m1 [x f] `(let [x# ~x] (~f x#))) do (defmacro m1 [x f] (let [x-sym (gensym)] `(let [~x-sym ~x] (~f ~x-sym You can then do something like (defn new-gensym [] (let [counter (atom 0)] (fn [ [extra]] (symbol (str (or extra G_) (swap! counter inc)) (with-redefs [gensym (new-gensym)] (macroexpand-1 '(m1 1 inc))) (not tested) On Fri, Mar 27, 2015 at 5:50 PM, David James david...@gmail.com javascript: wrote: I agree with this motivation behind this request, which I explain in more detail here: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/16745135/how-to-test-a-clojure-macro-that-uses-gensyms We should be able to test the behavior *and* the macroexpansion. (Most things in life are not simple either/or decisions. Don't believe people that tell you otherwise.) On Monday, March 23, 2015 at 12:58:49 PM UTC-4, Chris Ford wrote: I think it's useful to think of macros as an odd form of I/O. Just as you would separate out your templating from your domain functions, separate out your defmacro from regular functions that just happen to manipulate symbols. These functions will be easier to test. On 23 March 2015 at 16:23, Sean Corfield se...@corfield.org wrote: On Mar 22, 2015, at 7:52 PM, myguidingstar phuthuycuo...@gmail.com wrote: I wonder if there is any way to make macro expansion in Clojure deterministic. That would be useful in unit tests. I’d be very interested to understand your use case… Testing what the macro expands to seems like it is test the macro system itself, not your own code. Surely in a unit test you’d want to test the _behavior_ of the code instead? Sean Corfield -- (904) 302-SEAN An Architect's View -- http://corfield.org/ Perfection is the enemy of the good. -- Gustave Flaubert, French realist novelist (1821-1880) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clo...@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clo...@googlegroups.com javascript: Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com javascript: For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+u...@googlegroups.com javascript:. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- Ben Wolfson Human kind has used its intelligence to vary the flavour of drinks, which may be sweet, aromatic, fermented or spirit-based. ... Family and social life also offer numerous other occasions to consume drinks for pleasure. [Larousse, Drink entry] -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: Debugging in CIDER
Awesome. +1 for a new release too, lots of other good stuff in there too. - Matt On Saturday, March 28, 2015 at 1:46:33 PM UTC-4, Bozhidar Batsov wrote: Hey everyone, Just wanted to let you know that the most requested feature for CIDER (a debugger, in case you're wondering) has just landed in the master branch ( https://github.com/clojure-emacs/cider/pull/1019#issuecomment-87240470). The new CIDER debugger is inspired by edebug (Emacs's own debugger) and based on https://github.com/razum2um/clj-debugger It's not super fancy and there's clearly room for improvement in both clj-debugger and CIDER itself, but it's a pretty good first step. Please, take the new debugger out for a spin and let us know what do you think about it. You might also report any problems you've encountered. :-) If all is well, CIDER 0.9 will probably be released in a week or so. P.S. Thanks, Artur (https://github.com/Malabarba), for all the hard work on the debugger! You've once again showed the power of the OSS! There's nothing we can't build together! -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
square brackets
Hi I cannot type square brackets. I tried left Alt key with key right to letter p and nothing appears. I have Croatian keyboard and use Windows 7. Please help. Thanks -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Clojure Jobs Available
We're a stealth startup in the fintech space building consumer-scale, fully distributed systems in Clojure along with cutting edge data storage and transaction technologies. We're Clojure all the way to the edge. We have teams in Seattle, Sydney, and Costa Rica and are looking to hire senior engineers with Clojure/Lisp experience. Many of our engineers come from a CL background and we also have senior engineers who have recently switched to functional programming and LISP. If you're looking for an excellent team and awesome product to work on, then here at SecureOne™ is the best place to be. We care about solid engineering, reliable and resilient systems, low latency distributed processing, streaming analytics, high scalability, and extreme performance… and we're doing all of them. If you're interested, please deliver a resume to jobs at SecureOne.com and Jan Drake (http://www.linkedin.com/in/janman) will get back to you. We hope to hear from you. Jan Drake VP of Engineering Operations SecureOne Corporation -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: square brackets
Hi Haris! Weirdly, this became a source of amusement in our office and we couldn't help but google the answer. Many of us are curious about the state of ever-collapsing international user interfaces. It looks like the keystroke you're looking for should be *[ALT] + F* or *[ALT] + G*. Give that a try? From wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QWERTZ It appears that this is the layout used in a Croatian keyboard: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QWERTZ#/media/File:KB_Slovene.svg You can see a live version here: http://gate2home.com/Croatian-Keyboard We found this by googling croatian keyboard layout windows. :) Steven Deobald -- ⌀ -- nilenso.com On Tue, Mar 31, 2015 at 1:57 AM, haris.bogdano...@gmail.com wrote: Hi I cannot type square brackets. I tried left Alt key with key right to letter p and nothing appears. I have Croatian keyboard and use Windows 7. Please help. Thanks -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: Clojure Jobs Available
On 31 March 2015 at 04:45:39, Jan Drake (jan.s.dr...@gmail.com) wrote: We have teams in Seattle, Sydney, and Costa Rica and are looking to hire senior engineers with Clojure/Lisp experience. Jan, It would help if you clarify what locations/timezones you require candidates to be in. Many talented engineers on this list are not in Seattle or Sydney. The line above suggests your team is distributed but what do I know, maybe Costa Rica is a technology hub these days :) -- @michaelklishin, github.com/michaelklishin -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
New Functional Programming Job Opportunities
Here are some functional programming job opportunities that were posted recently: UPDATED: Senior Software Engineer (Clojure, FP) at SecureOne http://functionaljobs.com/jobs/8801-updated-senior-software-engineer-clojure-fp-at-secureone Cheers, Sean Murphy FunctionalJobs.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
Re: clojure, not the go to for data science
Sayth Renshaw flebber.c...@gmail.com writes: I last learned clojure in 1.2. Just curious why Clojure hasn't developed as a go to for data science? It never seems to get a mention R,Python and now Julia get the attention. By design it would appear that Clojure would be a good fit. Is it a lack of libraries, ease of install, no good default environment (R Rstudio, IPython ) where as you would need to use emacs with clojure, or is there just a better default use of Clojure? I would say, lack of numpy or equivalent. And nice tools to link between Clojure and the many C/Fortran numeric libraries. Python and R do this natively. Maybe if Clojure pulls itself away from the JVM this will change. One big problem with both python and R for data science is that a lot of interactive data visualisation happens on the web these days, and neither python nor R support that so well. An ecosystem with a C hosted clojure at the back end and Clojure script at the front end might work well. Phil -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To post to this group, send email to clojure@googlegroups.com Note that posts from new members are moderated - please be patient with your first post. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/clojure?hl=en --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Clojure group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to clojure+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
