Re: Thoughts on resource oriented computing (ROC)

[Tom Hicks]

I view ROC (as defined by 1060Research and instantiated in NetKernel) as a 
systems architecture which attempts to bring some of the RESTful principles 
of the Web into application and systems programming. Every architecture has 
its points of "fit" which make it good for some problems and not so good 
for others. A direct comparison of architecture and language is difficult 
and the Clojure language has proven itself applicable across a wide variety 
of architectures. While Clojure and NetKernel share some underlying 
philosophies of software construction, I don't think that makes Clojure 
significantly "better" than other languages for implementing ROC (and 
NetKernel was designed to be polyglot, at least across JVM languages).

I would be amenable to more discussion about my experiences with NetKernel 
offline, but I don't think this really belongs in the Clojure forum.
regards,
   -t


On Tuesday, June 4, 2019 at 12:49:16 PM UTC-7, Kyle Wilt wrote:
>
> Thanks for the response. What is your opinion of it/experience with it? 
> I'm really wondering how it meshes (if at all) with the way in which people 
> think about software design/construction in the clojure "world".
>
> On Monday, June 3, 2019 at 8:04:57 PM UTC-4, Tom Hicks wrote:
>>
>> Hi Kyle,
>>
>> My memory is that Peter and Tony started 1060 Research almost 20 years 
>> ago. They used to publish a fairly frequent email newsletter (
>> http://wiki.netkernel.org/wink/wiki/NetKernel/News/) about their 
>> activities but I haven't seen a newsletter from them in over a year and a 
>> half.
>>
>> I mentioned NetKernel to Rich Hickey several years ago and found that he 
>> was familiar with it, at the time.
>>
>> re Clojure: I would caution you that I wrote that initial, limited 
>> Clojure module a *long* time ago (2009, I think). It was not multi-tenant 
>> capable and should have been rewritten to keep up with the evolution of 
>> Clojure. You should check with 1060 Research directly to find out what the 
>> current status of the module is.
>>regards,
>>-t
>>
>>
>> On Monday, June 3, 2019 at 9:48:14 AM UTC-7, Kyle Wilt wrote:
>>>
>>> I have been a "secret admirer" of clojure and the clojure approach to 
>>> problem solving for quite some time now even though I'm not really a direct 
>>> practitioner. I do try to convert my C# code into as "clojure like" a model 
>>> as reasonably possible given all of my constraints. I have been a big fan 
>>> of the design approach behind core.async and channels in general.
>>>
>>> Recently I came across an approach to building systems that I am very 
>>> curious what the clojure community would make of. There's a company called 
>>> 1060research that has been using what they call "Resource Oriented 
>>> Computing" for over a decade now I believe.  One of its goals is to bring 
>>> the economics of the model of the web into the level of software 
>>> components. Their implementation of this approach is called NetKernel which 
>>> as far as I can tell uses typical Java OO at its core but that 
>>> implementation detail doesn't completely directly pervade the model it's 
>>> trying to provide. It does create limitations for those of us who don't use 
>>> the JVM however. They actually have a clojure language module to support 
>>> running clojure code in their definition of components.
>>>
>>> Here are some links for anyone who might be interested in starting to 
>>> dig into it:
>>>
>>> http://resources.1060research.com/docs/ROCForDevelopers.pdf
>>>
>>> You tube video about the high level concepts 
>>> 
>>>
>>>
>>> So to repeat the purpose of my post here, I'm really interested in how 
>>> the community perceives this concept of "resource oriented computing" and 
>>> how it meshes with the clojure mindset to design of systems. From my 
>>> perspective it doesn't directly clash and in some ways is very 
>>> complimentary.
>>>
>>> I apologize of this topic is inappropriate to this group, I've never 
>>> posted to any clojure related groups before.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>

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Re: [ANN] Clojure 1.10.1

[Alex Miller]

Correct, no changes were made between 1.10.1-RC1 and 1.10.1.

On Thu, Jun 6, 2019 at 11:31 AM Sean Corfield  wrote:

> Thanks for all the work on this!
>
> Can you confirm that this is the same as 1.10.1-RC1?
>
> Sean
>
> On Thursday, June 6, 2019 at 8:28:17 AM UTC-7, Alex Miller wrote:
>>
>> Clojure 1.10.1 is a small release focusing on two issues: working around
>> a Java performance regression and improving error reporting from
>> clojure.main.
>>
>> Java
>> performance regression
>>
>> Recent builds of Java 8 (u202), 11 (11.0.2), 12, and 13 included some
>> changes that drastically affect optimization performance of calls from
>> static initializers to static fields. Clojure provides support for loading
>> code on startup from a user.clj file and this occurred in the static
>> initializer of the Clojure runtime (RT) class and was thus affected.
>>
>> This issue may eventually be resolved in Java, but in Clojure we have
>> modified runtime initialization to avoid loading user.clj in a static
>> initializer, which mitigates the case where this caused a performance
>> degradation.
>>
>> clojure.main
>> error reporting
>>
>> clojure.main is frequently used as a Clojure program launcher by external
>> tools. Previously, uncaught exceptions would be automatically printed by
>> the JVM, which would also print the stack trace.
>>
>> This release will now catch exceptions and use the same error triage and
>> printing functionality as the Clojure repl. The full stack trace, ex-info,
>> and other information will be printed to a target specified by the
>> configuration. See clojure.main docs
>>  for
>> configuration details.
>> Changelog
>>
>> See the change log
>> 
>>  for
>> a complete list of all changes in Clojure 1.10.1.
>>
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Re: [ANN] Clojure 1.10.1

[Sean Corfield]

Thanks for all the work on this!

Can you confirm that this is the same as 1.10.1-RC1?

Sean

On Thursday, June 6, 2019 at 8:28:17 AM UTC-7, Alex Miller wrote:
>
> Clojure 1.10.1 is a small release focusing on two issues: working around a 
> Java performance regression and improving error reporting from clojure.main.
>
> Java
>  
> performance regression
>
> Recent builds of Java 8 (u202), 11 (11.0.2), 12, and 13 included some 
> changes that drastically affect optimization performance of calls from 
> static initializers to static fields. Clojure provides support for loading 
> code on startup from a user.clj file and this occurred in the static 
> initializer of the Clojure runtime (RT) class and was thus affected.
>
> This issue may eventually be resolved in Java, but in Clojure we have 
> modified runtime initialization to avoid loading user.clj in a static 
> initializer, which mitigates the case where this caused a performance 
> degradation.
>
> clojure.main
>  
> error reporting
>
> clojure.main is frequently used as a Clojure program launcher by external 
> tools. Previously, uncaught exceptions would be automatically printed by 
> the JVM, which would also print the stack trace.
>
> This release will now catch exceptions and use the same error triage and 
> printing functionality as the Clojure repl. The full stack trace, ex-info, 
> and other information will be printed to a target specified by the 
> configuration. See clojure.main docs 
>  for 
> configuration details.
> Changelog
>
> See the change log 
> 
>  for 
> a complete list of all changes in Clojure 1.10.1.
>

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Re: [ANN] cpython bindings for clojure

[Daniel Carleton]

Excellent! I'd just been considering with trepidation trying to use jython
for something when your message appeared.

On Wed, Jun 5, 2019, 5:40 PM Alan Moore  wrote:

> Awesome!
>
> Alan
>
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