Re: Stus-List Non-Slip

[Russ & Melody via CnC-List]

Damn.

The plan did seem a bit risky but I was looking 
forward to hear how it turned out.


Cheers, Russ
Sweet 35 mk-1

At 09:31 PM 26/02/2015, you wrote:

I have one word. Kiwi Grip.

OK, it's two. Sue me. Pressing a mold into 
rapidly curing gelcoat sounds like an incredibly 
painful thing to do to yourself.


Jim Watts
Paradigm Shift
C&C 35 Mk III
Victoria, BC

On 26 February 2015 at 17:48, Paul Hood via 
CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:


I was wondering if anyone has ever ventured to 
do the following project that I’m working 
through. I bought my boat from the original 
owner 2 years ago and am in the middle of redoing my non-slip.


Â

I have removed all deck hardware with the 
exception of the toe rail, sanded down the 
existing non-slip so that all is smooth and am 
preparing to spray gelcoat over the entire 
deck.  Once sprayed smooth, I will tape off 
areas for pattern and spread a layer of gelcoat 
followed immediately by the pressing of the 
Gibco flex mould to create the non-slip.


Â

www.gibcoflexmold.com

Â

I know this is different than the original 
roll-on finish, but I think the Gibco wears 
better, is easier to clean, is easier on bear 
skin, and looks much better to boot.  My hope 
is that the grip is better than rolled as it is 
more consistent throughout.  There are dozens 
of patterns and since I’m not matching, I’m 
getting the one claiming to have the best 
grip.  It will be definitely better than 
current as the surface is chalked throughout and 
worn in many areas.  In addition, there was a 
deck repair some years back and the color is 
visibly different and the surface below the 
non-slip repair is thin and almost see through.Â


Â

I’m waiting for this months -20c temperatures 
to move out before I start heating and spraying surface.  Canadian winters….


Â

Has anyone ever tackled such a project and if 
so, do you have any hints.  I’m sure there 
are lots of opinions here and I know I’m about 
to open the can of worms on many levels but I’d like to hear what you think.


Â

Thanks,

Paul Hood

1982 C&C34

Â

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Re: Stus-List Non-Slip

[Jim Watts via CnC-List]

I have one word. Kiwi Grip.

OK, it's two. Sue me. Pressing a mold into rapidly curing gelcoat sounds
like an incredibly painful thing to do to yourself.

Jim Watts
Paradigm Shift
C&C 35 Mk III
Victoria, BC

On 26 February 2015 at 17:48, Paul Hood via CnC-List 
wrote:

> I was wondering if anyone has ever ventured to do the following project
> that I’m working through. I bought my boat from the original owner 2 years
> ago and am in the middle of redoing my non-slip.
>
>
>
> I have removed all deck hardware with the exception of the toe rail,
> sanded down the existing non-slip so that all is smooth and am preparing to
> spray gelcoat over the entire deck.  Once sprayed smooth, I will tape off
> areas for pattern and spread a layer of gelcoat followed immediately by the
> pressing of the Gibco flex mould to create the non-slip.
>
>
>
> www.gibcoflexmold.com
>
>
>
> I know this is different than the original roll-on finish, but I think the
> Gibco wears better, is easier to clean, is easier on bear skin, and looks
> much better to boot.  My hope is that the grip is better than rolled as it
> is more consistent throughout.  There are dozens of patterns and since I’m
> not matching, I’m getting the one claiming to have the best grip.  It will
> be definitely better than current as the surface is chalked throughout and
> worn in many areas.  In addition, there was a deck repair some years back
> and the color is visibly different and the surface below the non-slip
> repair is thin and almost see through.
>
>
>
> I’m waiting for this months -20c temperatures to move out before I start
> heating and spraying surface.  Canadian winters….
>
>
>
> Has anyone ever tackled such a project and if so, do you have any hints.
> I’m sure there are lots of opinions here and I know I’m about to open the
> can of worms on many levels but I’d like to hear what you think.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Paul Hood
>
> 1982 C&C34
>
>
>
> ___
>
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> bottom of page at:
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>
>
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Re: Stus-List cockpit drains freezing

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

Another thing you should change is your yard, if you use the same yard for 
winter storage. Part of the process for launching, before the Travel Lift 
straps are removed from under the boat, should be to go below to check for 
leaks and to “burp” the shaft seal if that is needed.

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Tom Lochhaas 
via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 8:25 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Subject: Re: Stus-List cockpit drains freezing

 

Here's my sad story of a cockpit drain hose freezing 11 years ago, the first 
winter in New England after I bought my Landfall 38.  I had it "professionally" 
shrinkwrapped and asked the wrappers not to go too before below the toe rail 
because I'd heard the film could stick to the Awlgrip hull paint. The day 
before they wrapped, I ran antifreeze through all drains in case there were low 
spots. So.. the crew did a lousy job with the shrinkwrap, the "hem" of which 
was too loose and high and let snow and freezing rain blow into the cockpit all 
winter. New to the boat, I didn't worry come spring, but after launching found 
my bilge filling and the pump running. The water the shrinkwrappers had let 
into the cockpit displaced my antifreeze in a low spot in the hose, which froze 
and burst the hose (below the waterline) - I'm just glad I discovered it on my 
mooring after launching and had a functioning seacock, or I'd have wondered 
where the boat was when I next time dinghied out to the mooring. (Worst part 
was it was really hard to run that thick, inflexible replacement hose down 
beside the engine.) The next year, I got together with some other guys, bought 
a heat gun, and we've shrinkwrapped our own boats every year since at a small 
fraction of the cost - and I've never had water ingress again. Lesson learned. 




Tom Lochhaas

C&C Landfall 38

Newburyport, MA 01950

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of mike 
amirault via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, February 23, 2015 7:09 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com  
Subject: Stus-List cockpit drains freezing

 

NS has seen many freeze thaw cycles this winter. After a fairly substantial 
rainfall this weekend, I found the bilge on my C&C 33mkii was full to the top. 
This seemed like too much water to have run down the mast so I investigated and 
found that one of the hoses on my cockpit drains was frozen solid and popped 
the hose off the barbs of the drain. My boat is not covered at this time(tarp 
was sagging too much) so there is a lot of water in the cockpit.  I'm thinking 
there may be a low spot in the hose causing water to freeze there rather than 
draining. The drains on my C&C are criss-crossed, i.e., port drainst to stbd, 
&stbd to port. Just wondering how other owners in a freezing climate deal with 
this issue?

 

 

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Re: Stus-List Starting Battery

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

Josh;

 

What you say is correct. Here is some amplification:

 

For a given battery chemistry, the capacity of the battery is proportional
to the weight of material in it. For a lead-acid battery that means more
lead, more capacity.

 

Basic Amp Hour ratings for deep cycle and marine batteries are published
using a 20 amp discharge rate because that is an industry standard.
Similarly Reserve Capacity ratings for automotive batteries are always for
25 amp currents. Some manufacturers publish capacity number in addition to
the standard 20 amp rate.

 

As far as Amp Hour capacity goes, the lower the current draw, the longer the
battery will deliver that current. But it would not be a straight line on a
graph of current vs. time. So a battery delivering 5 amps (typical for one
of our boats) may well deliver 5 amps for significantly longer than the
published AH rating divided by 5.

 

There really is no relationship between Amp Hour capacity and cranking amps.
For a given weight of lead, the more surface area in the plates (more and
thinner, plus some refinements for conductor length and shape) the higher
the cranking amps. The thicker and fewer the plate, the lower the cranking
amps and the longer the battery will deliver lower current flow (Reserve
Capacity). But a given weight of lead can only produce a given amount of
free electrons, so the tradeoff is between cranking amps and reserve, not
Amp Hour, capacity.

 

An automotive starting battery has more thin plates, and is less suitable
for the environment of a boat with vibration and deeper discharge cycles.
Conversely, a deep cycle battery has fewer thick plate to deliver lower
current for a long time. 

 

A marine start battery is sort of a compromise between the two, in an
attempt to provide a happy medium between the two, and really is most
desirable for inboard V8 applications in smaller powerboats. Remember that
we don't usually try to start our boats at below freezing temperatures, so
high CCA isn't generally needed. For that reason, the standard for marine
cranking amps is determined at a higher temperature than CCA and the two
ratings are not comparable.

 

For the engines in our boats, delivering 200 amps or so to the starter is
well within the capability of just about any deep cycle or marine starting
battery, and will result in more durability and battery life and in longer
hours on the hook between engine use. If your need lighter weight or smaller
batteries for racing or day sailing, go with a smaller marine start battery
like a group 24.

 

Rick Brass

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Josh
Muckley via CnC-List
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2015 9:49 PM
To: C&C List; Edd Schillay
Subject: Re: Stus-List Starting Battery

 

I checked my Yanmar manual and it looks like it calls for a 100 Ahr battery
for my 3 cyl 35hp diesel.  

So now you ask yourself, how do I compare CCA to Ahrs.  The short answer is,
you don't.  

CCA is a bit arbitrary but to achieve higher CCA in the same size you have
to have more and thinner plates.  This makes them more fragile and decreases
their ability to be deaply discharged as well as survive vibration and
uncovering.  If you seek higher CCA exclusively then you will find a battery
which is less suited for a marine environment.  

AHrs is a less arbitrary spec but still a small bit of fuzzy math since C/20
= 100 and C/10 = 80 and C/1 = 60 could all be Ahr ratings for the same
battery.  Most manufacturers provide their rating based on C/20.
Ultimately, the best batteries (regarless of all other ratings) are the ones
which are heaviest.  These will have the most lead and subsequently the
strongest plates.  They will usually also be at the top end of the Ahr
ratings but not the highest CCA (if those ratings are even mutually
present).  

Disregard CA and RC ratings.  

A sufficiently large deep cycle battery is better than a smaller, lighter,
starting battery.

The weight is only an accurate comparison if the chemistry is the same.

Josh

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Re: Stus-List cockpit drains freezing

[John Pennie via CnC-List]

That used to be one of the best party weekends when we lived aboard.  We 
usually had 4-5 boats wrapping at the same time. One boat owned the 
gun/torch/flame thrower and the rest would provide the propane and 
refreshments.  We usually did a group order for the wrap to lower the price 
somewhat.  Amazing how creative folks would get on doors.  Good times.

John



On Feb 26, 2015, at 8:24 PM, Tom Lochhaas via CnC-List  
wrote:

> Here's my sad story of a cockpit drain hose freezing 11 years ago, the first 
> winter in New England after I bought my Landfall 38.  I had it 
> "professionally" shrinkwrapped and asked the wrappers not to go too before 
> below the toe rail because I'd heard the film could stick to the Awlgrip hull 
> paint. The day before they wrapped, I ran antifreeze through all drains in 
> case there were low spots. So.. the crew did a lousy job with the shrinkwrap, 
> the "hem" of which was too loose and high and let snow and freezing rain blow 
> into the cockpit all winter. New to the boat, I didn't worry come spring, but 
> after launching found my bilge filling and the pump running. The water the 
> shrinkwrappers had let into the cockpit displaced my antifreeze in a low spot 
> in the hose, which froze and burst the hose (below the waterline) - I'm just 
> glad I discovered it on my mooring after launching and had a functioning 
> seacock, or I'd have wondered where the boat was when I next time dinghied 
> out to the mooring. (Worst part was it was really hard to run that thick, 
> inflexible replacement hose down beside the engine.) The next year, I got 
> together with some other guys, bought a heat gun, and we've shrinkwrapped our 
> own boats every year since at a small fraction of the cost - and I've never 
> had water ingress again. Lesson learned. 
> 
> Tom Lochhaas
> C&C Landfall 38
> Newburyport, MA 01950
> 
> 
>> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of mike 
>> amirault via CnC-List
>> Sent: Monday, February 23, 2015 7:09 PM
>> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
>> Subject: Stus-List cockpit drains freezing
>> 
>>  
>> NS has seen many freeze thaw cycles this winter. After a fairly substantial 
>> rainfall this weekend, I found the bilge on my C&C 33mkii was full to the 
>> top. This seemed like too much water to have run down the mast so I 
>> investigated and found that one of the hoses on my cockpit drains was frozen 
>> solid and popped the hose off the barbs of the drain. My boat is not covered 
>> at this time(tarp was sagging too much) so there is a lot of water in the 
>> cockpit.  I'm thinking there may be a low spot in the hose causing water to 
>> freeze there rather than draining. The drains on my C&C are criss-crossed, 
>> i.e., port drainst to stbd, &stbd to port. Just wondering how other owners 
>> in a freezing climate deal with this issue?
>> 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> Email address:
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com
> To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the bottom 
> of page at:
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> 

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Re: Stus-List cockpit drains freezing

[robert via CnC-List]

Tom:

You said it " So.. the crew did a lousy job with the shrinkwrap".

Get an experienced/qualified tradesman.

Rob Abbott
AZURA
C&C 32 - 84
Halifax, N.S.

On 2015-02-26 9:24 PM, Tom Lochhaas via CnC-List wrote:
Here's my sad story of a cockpit drain hose freezing 11 years ago, the 
first winter in New England after I bought my Landfall 38.  I had it 
"professionally" shrinkwrapped and asked the wrappers not to go too 
before below the toe rail because I'd heard the film could stick to 
the Awlgrip hull paint. The day before they wrapped, I ran antifreeze 
through all drains in case there were low spots. So.. the crew did a 
lousy job with the shrinkwrap, the "hem" of which was too loose and 
high and let snow and freezing rain blow into the cockpit all winter. 
New to the boat, I didn't worry come spring, but after launching found 
my bilge filling and the pump running. The water the shrinkwrappers 
had let into the cockpit displaced my antifreeze in a low spot in the 
hose, which froze and burst the hose (below the waterline) - I'm just 
glad I discovered it on my mooring after launching and had a 
functioning seacock, or I'd have wondered where the boat was when I 
next time dinghied out to the mooring. (Worst part was it was really 
hard to run that thick, inflexible replacement hose down beside the 
engine.) The next year, I got together with some other guys, bought a 
heat gun, and we've shrinkwrapped our own boats every year since at a 
small fraction of the cost - and I've never had water ingress again. 
Lesson learned.


Tom Lochhaas
C&C Landfall 38
Newburyport, MA 01950



*From:*CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On
Behalf Of *mike amirault via CnC-List
*Sent:* Monday, February 23, 2015 7:09 PM
*To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
*Subject:* Stus-List cockpit drains freezing

NS has seen many freeze thaw cycles this winter. After a
fairly substantial rainfall this weekend, I found the bilge
on my C&C 33mkii was full to the top. This seemed like too
much water to have run down the mast so I investigated and
found that one of the hoses on my cockpit drains was frozen
solid and popped the hose off the barbs of the drain. My boat
is not covered at this time(tarp was sagging too much) so
there is a lot of water in the cockpit.  I'm thinking there
may be a low spot in the hose causing water to freeze there
rather than draining. The drains on my C&C are criss-crossed,
i.e., port drainst to stbd, &stbd to port. Just wondering how
other owners in a freezing climate deal with this issue?






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Stus-List Non-Slip

[Paul Hood via CnC-List]

I was wondering if anyone has ever ventured to do the following project that
I'm working through. I bought my boat from the original owner 2 years ago
and am in the middle of redoing my non-slip.

 

I have removed all deck hardware with the exception of the toe rail, sanded
down the existing non-slip so that all is smooth and am preparing to spray
gelcoat over the entire deck.  Once sprayed smooth, I will tape off areas
for pattern and spread a layer of gelcoat followed immediately by the
pressing of the Gibco flex mould to create the non-slip.

 

www.gibcoflexmold.com   

 

I know this is different than the original roll-on finish, but I think the
Gibco wears better, is easier to clean, is easier on bear skin, and looks
much better to boot.  My hope is that the grip is better than rolled as it
is more consistent throughout.  There are dozens of patterns and since I'm
not matching, I'm getting the one claiming to have the best grip.  It will
be definitely better than current as the surface is chalked throughout and
worn in many areas.  In addition, there was a deck repair some years back
and the color is visibly different and the surface below the non-slip repair
is thin and almost see through.  

 

I'm waiting for this months -20c temperatures to move out before I start
heating and spraying surface.  Canadian winters..

 

Has anyone ever tackled such a project and if so, do you have any hints.
I'm sure there are lots of opinions here and I know I'm about to open the
can of worms on many levels but I'd like to hear what you think.

 

Thanks,

Paul Hood

1982 C&C34

 

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Re: Stus-List cockpit drains freezing

[Tom Lochhaas via CnC-List]

Here's my sad story of a cockpit drain hose freezing 11 years ago, the
first winter in New England after I bought my Landfall 38.  I had it
"professionally" shrinkwrapped and asked the wrappers not to go too before
below the toe rail because I'd heard the film could stick to the Awlgrip
hull paint. The day before they wrapped, I ran antifreeze through all
drains in case there were low spots. So.. the crew did a lousy job with the
shrinkwrap, the "hem" of which was too loose and high and let snow and
freezing rain blow into the cockpit all winter. New to the boat, I didn't
worry come spring, but after launching found my bilge filling and the pump
running. The water the shrinkwrappers had let into the cockpit displaced my
antifreeze in a low spot in the hose, which froze and burst the hose (below
the waterline) - I'm just glad I discovered it on my mooring after
launching and had a functioning seacock, or I'd have wondered where the
boat was when I next time dinghied out to the mooring. (Worst part was it
was really hard to run that thick, inflexible replacement hose down beside
the engine.) The next year, I got together with some other guys, bought a
heat gun, and we've shrinkwrapped our own boats every year since at a small
fraction of the cost - and I've never had water ingress again. Lesson
learned.

Tom Lochhaas
C&C Landfall 38
Newburyport, MA 01950


 *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com
> ] *On Behalf Of *mike amirault via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Monday, February 23, 2015 7:09 PM
> *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> *Subject:* Stus-List cockpit drains freezing
>
>
>
> NS has seen many freeze thaw cycles this winter. After a fairly
> substantial rainfall this weekend, I found the bilge on my C&C 33mkii was
> full to the top. This seemed like too much water to have run down the mast
> so I investigated and found that one of the hoses on my cockpit drains was
> frozen solid and popped the hose off the barbs of the drain. My boat is not
> covered at this time(tarp was sagging too much) so there is a lot of water
> in the cockpit.  I'm thinking there may be a low spot in the hose causing
> water to freeze there rather than draining. The drains on my C&C are
> criss-crossed, i.e., port drainst to stbd, &stbd to port. Just wondering
> how other owners in a freezing climate deal with this issue?
>
>
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Re: Stus-List Starting Battery

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

Most V8 car engines need only 400 amps or so in normal conditions.

 

I remember one REALLY cold day in Chicago when I was working for the
construction machinery company in the 80s. We put an 8D diesel start battery
on a cart to boost cars in the employee lot at the warehose, and burned out
the starters on two or three cars that were cranked for too long.

 

The need for high CCAs is vastly overrated.

 

Rick Brass

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Josh
Muckley via CnC-List
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2015 8:42 PM
To: C&C List; Edd Schillay
Subject: Re: Stus-List Starting Battery

 

35 hp is smaller.  V-8 auto engines usually take as little as 800 cca.  Many
small auto engines 1.9 liter (~100hp) take as little as 200 cca.  Your
battery selection will work fine.  It might even be overkill.

Josh

On Feb 25, 2015 8:33 PM, "Edd Schillay via CnC-List" mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

Dennis,

 

Define "smaller" -- I have a Universal M-35 in the Enterprise. 

 

I'm thinking a Trojan Group 27 with 400 CCA as a starting battery. 

 

All the best,

 

Edd

 

---

Edd M. Schillay

Starship Enterprise

NCC-1701-B

C&C 37+ | City Island, NY

www.StarshipSailing.com  

---

914.332.4400| Office

914.774.9767| Mobile

---

Sent via iPhone 6

iPhone. iTypos. iApologize


On Feb 25, 2015, at 8:14 PM, Dennis C. mailto:capt...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Edd,

Most smaller marine diesels only need 200-250 cranking amps.

Dennis C.

 

On Wed, Feb 25, 2015 at 6:57 PM, Edd Schillay via CnC-List
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

All, 

 

So, on a related topic, what CCA rating is the battery you use for your
starting battery? 

 

All the best,

 

Edd

 

---

Edd M. Schillay

Starship Enterprise

NCC-1701-B

C&C 37+ | City Island, NY

www.StarshipSailing.com  

---

914.332.4400| Office

914.774.9767| Mobile

---

Sent via iPhone 6

iPhone. iTypos. iApologize

 


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Re: Stus-List Starting Battery

[dwight veinot via CnC-List]

nearly any decent 12 V battery has more than enough CCA to start our small
sailboat engines at the outdoor temperatures that we normally operate
in...if not the battery is no good or the engine needs service

Dwight Veinot
C&C 35 MKII, *Alianna*
Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS
d.ve...@bellaliant.net


On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 9:06 PM, Rick Brass via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Edd;
>
>
>
> The installation manual for my M35B, in the specs for the battery cables,
> says the starter draws 175 amps max.
>
>
>
> Remember that CCA is based on the battery at 32 degrees, if I recall
> correctly. At the temps where we use our boats, the output from the battery
> would be quite a bit higher.
>
>
>
> Rick Brass
>
>
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *Edd
> Schillay via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 25, 2015 8:33 PM
> *To:* Dennis C.
> *Cc:* CnClist
> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List Starting Battery
>
>
>
> Dennis,
>
>
>
> Define "smaller" -- I have a Universal M-35 in the Enterprise.
>
>
>
> I'm thinking a Trojan Group 27 with 400 CCA as a starting battery.
>
>
>
> All the best,
>
>
>
> Edd
>
>
>
> ---
>
> Edd M. Schillay
>
> Starship Enterprise
>
> NCC-1701-B
>
> C&C 37+ | City Island, NY
>
> www.StarshipSailing.com
>
> ---
>
> 914.332.4400  | Office
>
> 914.774.9767  | Mobile
>
> ---
>
> Sent via iPhone 6
>
> iPhone. iTypos. iApologize
>
>
> On Feb 25, 2015, at 8:14 PM, Dennis C.  wrote:
>
> Edd,
>
> Most smaller marine diesels only need 200-250 cranking amps.
>
> Dennis C.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Feb 25, 2015 at 6:57 PM, Edd Schillay via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> All,
>
>
>
> So, on a related topic, what CCA rating is the battery you use for your
> starting battery?
>
>
>
> All the best,
>
>
>
> Edd
>
>
>
> ---
>
> Edd M. Schillay
>
> Starship Enterprise
>
> NCC-1701-B
>
> C&C 37+ | City Island, NY
>
> www.StarshipSailing.com
>
> ---
>
> 914.332.4400  | Office
>
> 914.774.9767  | Mobile
>
> ---
>
> Sent via iPhone 6
>
> iPhone. iTypos. iApologize
>
>
>
>
> ___
>
> Email address:
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com
> To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the
> bottom of page at:
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>
>
>
> ___
>
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> To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the
> bottom of page at:
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>
>
>
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Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

[dwight veinot via CnC-List]

nothing much corrosive in those off gases... maybe something else could be
causing the corrosion

Dwight Veinot
C&C 35 MKII, *Alianna*
Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS
d.ve...@bellaliant.net


On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 8:43 PM, Rick Brass via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Josh;
>
>
>
> The off gassing from a battery is primarily:
>
>
>
> 1)  Water vapor as the water evaporates with heat. This happens even
> when not charging (to a very small degree) on days when the relative
> humidity in the air is low. But then low relative humidity is a pretty rare
> event in the air around a boat that is in the water. In most flooded
> batteries this water vapor is condensed in the caps and drips back into the
> cells.
>
> 2)  Hydrogen gas that is released when the SO4 part of the sulfuric
> acid bonds to the lead plates as a result of high temperatures while
> charging or as the plates sulfate during longer periods of storage.
>
> 3)  Hydrogen and oxygen gas from electrolysis at higher charge rates.
>
>
>
> Electrolysis isn’t usually much  of a factor at normal charge rates.
>
>
>
> Rick Brass
>
>
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *Josh
> Muckley via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 26, 2015 10:38 AM
> *To:* C&C List; dwight
> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?
>
>
>
> Dwight,
> I think the theory is that the same electroisys that is breaking the
> molecular bond in the water is breaking the bonds in the sufuric acid
> resulting in corrosive sulfer gas.
>
> Josh
>
> On Feb 26, 2015 7:49 AM, "dwight veinot via CnC-List" <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Jake
>
> Not sure you can attribute that corrosion to off-gassing from your
> batteries...what gases do you think cause this corrosion?  Off gassing from
> batteries under charging conditions usually means hydrogen gas...
>
>
> Dwight Veinot
>
> C&C 35 MKII, *Alianna*
>
> Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS
>
> d.ve...@bellaliant.net
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 7:51 AM, Jake Brodersen via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
> Edd,
>
>
>
> I prefer AGM.  No noxious gases to be vented into the cabin.  I have a lot
> of corrosion on my electrical panel that I directly attribute to being
> bathed in off-gassing from old batteries.  Plus, they’re safer from an
> explosion perspective, as well as if you ever end up inverted for a short
> period of time.
>
>
>
> Jake
>
>
>
> *Jake Brodersen*
>
> *“Midnight Mistress”*
>
> *C&C 35 Mk-III*
>
> *Hampton VA*
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *Edd
> Schillay via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 25, 2015 11:17 AM
> *To:* 
> *Subject:* Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?
>
>
>
> Listers,
>
>
>
> As you know, I’m redoing the electrical systems on the
> Enterprise (thanks to all for diagrams and advice).
>
>
>
> So now comes the question of what type of battery to use in my
> house bank — Flooded, Sealed or AGM? What do you have on your C&C and why
> do you prefer it?
>
>
>
> And, if you have flooded, how often do you top them off with
> distilled water?
>
>
>
> The countdown has begun!
> http://enterpriseb.blogspot.com/2015/02/launch-of-enterprise-countdown.html
>
>
>
>
> All the best,
>
>
>
> Edd
>
>
>
>
>
> Edd M. Schillay
>
> Starship Enterprise
>
> C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
>
> City Island, NY
>
> Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log
> 
>
>
>
>
> ___
>
> Email address:
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com
> To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the
> bottom of page at:
> http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
>
>
>
>
> ___
>
> Email address:
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com
> To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the
> bottom of page at:
> http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
>
>
> ___
>
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> To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the
> bottom of page at:
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>
>
>
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Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

[dwight veinot via CnC-List]

agree with that

Dwight Veinot
C&C 35 MKII, *Alianna*
Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS
d.ve...@bellaliant.net


On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 8:18 PM, Rick Brass via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Edd;
>
>
>
> Like several others, I would endorse the choice of going with golf cart
> batteries (I’d use GC5s, not GC2s, but I’d have flooded golf cart batteries
> in my boats if there was enough room in the locker that the batteries are
> housed in to accommodate the height of the batteries.
>
>
>
> You have raised the question of the batteries freezing. A fully charged
> wet cell battery has a freezing temperature of 76 degrees below zero
> Fahrenheit. It is true that the liquid in a flooded battery that is fully
> discharged is around 30 degrees, since the liquid is almost 100% distilled
> water. But I don’t think I’ve ever seen a frozen battery – even is a winter
> stint at the GM Arctic Proving Grounds years ago. Unless New Jersey is
> expecting an Ice Age, I wouldn’t worry.
>
>
>
> Storage on the boat over the winter is also not a real problem – although
> there are a lot of old wives’ tales about taking batteries home for storage
> and not setting them on concrete floors, and so forth. The accepted
> self-discharge rate for a lead-acid battery is between 1.5 and 3% per
> month, depending on storage conditions. The rate gets higher as the storage
> temperature gets higher, but isn’t really very high until you get over 100
> degrees. AGM batteries are a bit less, but the chemistry is almost the same
> and the lower rate for an AGM battery has more to do with the fact that the
> AGM has less plate surface area in contact with the electrolyte mat, so the
> reaction is slower.
>
>
>
> You may want to think about how you use your boat when you make the
> decision about batteries. You mention wanting 4 to 6 T-105 batteries in
> your house bank. That’s 450 to 675 AH in a 12 volt configuration, and that
> gives you a lot of live aboard time. My 460 AH house bank will power my 38
> for 2 to 3 days on the hook without recharging. (My biggest draw is for
> refrigeration and that is more than half of the total.)
>
>
>
> But  if I recall you mostly daysail and race, so what impact will 400
> pounds of batteries have on trim and performance? Do you need that much
> endurance? Also, you say you only charge with your engine alternator. A 675
> AH bank is going to need a 75 amp (or more) alternator and a smart voltage
> regulator to recharge it in any manageable amount of time, and at least a
> 60 amp charger if you plug into shore power.
>
>
>
> I have many years of experience in the marketing of batteries for
> industrial vehicle, and I have an aversion to AGM batteries, so I’d
> recommend not using them. YMMV.
>
>
>
> Sure, you can lay them on their side. But laying your sailboat on its side
> is slow, and flooded batteries – particularly the maintenance free versions
> – don’t generally leak liquid at normal angles of heel for reasonable
> lengths of time.  AGM batteries are more demanding about proper charging
> voltages (the regulator in your boat is almost certainly designed for
> flooded cells, not AGMs, and will need to be replaced) and less forgiving
> about being stored when partially discharged than flooded cells. And AGM
> batteries have a significantly shorter service life – in terms of
> charge/discharge cycles – than do flooded batteries. Plus they are a lot
> more expensive.
>
>
>
> I looked at the AGM batteries in your post. Trojan T125s from the same
> supplier would have 15% more capacity and cost 15% less than the AGM. Two
> Exide or Interstate 27 deep cycle batteries in parallel would have the same
> capacity as two of these AGM GC2s wired in series and cost about half as
> much.  These particular AGM batteries don’t look like a particularly good
> value to me.
>
>
>
> Good luck making your decision
>
>
>
> Rick Brass
>
>
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *Edd
> Schillay via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 25, 2015 12:16 PM
> *To:* C&C List
> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?
>
>
>
> Josh,
>
>
>
> I’m leaning towards 4 to 6 (depending on the space available)
> Trojan T-105s, but am concerned about the maintenance, especially since I’m
> kinda cut off from the boat all winter long. Alternatively, I was looking
> at these AGMs:
> http://www.atbatt.com/amstron-gc2-6v-agm-deep-cycle-battery.asp?utm_content=Amstron-AP-GC2&utm_term=AP-GC2&utm_category=Sealed-Lead-Acid&gclid=CLy95KfH_cMCFXBp7Aod2WkA2g,
> but won’t bother if AGMs are only going to last a few years.
>
>
>
> My charging system is the alternator, since the Enterprise
> lives on a mooring during the season (yes — we call that "standard orbit").
> I only hook up to shore power a few times a year when cruising.
>
>
>
> The new system will connect the alternator to the house bank
> and use a Blue Seas ACR (
> https://www.bluesea.com/pr

Re: Stus-List Starting Battery

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

Edd;

 

The installation manual for my M35B, in the specs for the battery cables, says 
the starter draws 175 amps max.

 

Remember that CCA is based on the battery at 32 degrees, if I recall correctly. 
At the temps where we use our boats, the output from the battery would be quite 
a bit higher.

 

Rick Brass

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Edd Schillay 
via CnC-List
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2015 8:33 PM
To: Dennis C.
Cc: CnClist
Subject: Re: Stus-List Starting Battery

 

Dennis,

 

Define "smaller" -- I have a Universal M-35 in the Enterprise. 

 

I'm thinking a Trojan Group 27 with 400 CCA as a starting battery. 

 

All the best,

 

Edd

 

---

Edd M. Schillay

Starship Enterprise

NCC-1701-B

C&C 37+ | City Island, NY

www.StarshipSailing.com  

---

914.332.4400  | Office

914.774.9767  | Mobile

---

Sent via iPhone 6

iPhone. iTypos. iApologize


On Feb 25, 2015, at 8:14 PM, Dennis C. mailto:capt...@gmail.com> > wrote:

Edd,

Most smaller marine diesels only need 200-250 cranking amps.

Dennis C.

 

On Wed, Feb 25, 2015 at 6:57 PM, Edd Schillay via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

All, 

 

So, on a related topic, what CCA rating is the battery you use for your 
starting battery? 

 

All the best,

 

Edd

 

---

Edd M. Schillay

Starship Enterprise

NCC-1701-B

C&C 37+ | City Island, NY

www.StarshipSailing.com  

---

914.332.4400| Office

914.774.9767| Mobile

---

Sent via iPhone 6

iPhone. iTypos. iApologize

 


___

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Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

Josh;

 

The off gassing from a battery is primarily:

 

1)  Water vapor as the water evaporates with heat. This happens even
when not charging (to a very small degree) on days when the relative
humidity in the air is low. But then low relative humidity is a pretty rare
event in the air around a boat that is in the water. In most flooded
batteries this water vapor is condensed in the caps and drips back into the
cells.

2)  Hydrogen gas that is released when the SO4 part of the sulfuric acid
bonds to the lead plates as a result of high temperatures while charging or
as the plates sulfate during longer periods of storage.

3)  Hydrogen and oxygen gas from electrolysis at higher charge rates.

 

Electrolysis isn't usually much  of a factor at normal charge rates.

 

Rick Brass

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Josh
Muckley via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 10:38 AM
To: C&C List; dwight
Subject: Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

 

Dwight, 
I think the theory is that the same electroisys that is breaking the
molecular bond in the water is breaking the bonds in the sufuric acid
resulting in corrosive sulfer gas.

Josh

On Feb 26, 2015 7:49 AM, "dwight veinot via CnC-List" mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

Jake



Not sure you can attribute that corrosion to off-gassing from your
batteries...what gases do you think cause this corrosion?  Off gassing from
batteries under charging conditions usually means hydrogen gas...




Dwight Veinot

C&C 35 MKII, Alianna

Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS

d.ve...@bellaliant.net  

 

 

On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 7:51 AM, Jake Brodersen via CnC-List
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

Edd,

 

I prefer AGM.  No noxious gases to be vented into the cabin.  I have a lot
of corrosion on my electrical panel that I directly attribute to being
bathed in off-gassing from old batteries.  Plus, they're safer from an
explosion perspective, as well as if you ever end up inverted for a short
period of time.

 

Jake

 

Jake Brodersen

"Midnight Mistress"

C&C 35 Mk-III

Hampton VA

 

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com
 ] On Behalf Of Edd Schillay via
CnC-List
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2015 11:17 AM
To: mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> >
Subject: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

 

Listers,

 

As you know, I'm redoing the electrical systems on the
Enterprise (thanks to all for diagrams and advice). 

 

So now comes the question of what type of battery to use in my
house bank - Flooded, Sealed or AGM? What do you have on your C&C and why do
you prefer it? 

 

And, if you have flooded, how often do you top them off with
distilled water? 

 

The countdown has begun!
http://enterpriseb.blogspot.com/2015/02/launch-of-enterprise-countdown.html 

 

All the best,

 

Edd

 

 

Edd M. Schillay

Starship Enterprise

C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B

City Island, NY 

Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log
 

 


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Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

[Rick Brass via CnC-List]

Edd;

 

Like several others, I would endorse the choice of going with golf cart
batteries (I'd use GC5s, not GC2s, but I'd have flooded golf cart batteries
in my boats if there was enough room in the locker that the batteries are
housed in to accommodate the height of the batteries.

 

You have raised the question of the batteries freezing. A fully charged wet
cell battery has a freezing temperature of 76 degrees below zero Fahrenheit.
It is true that the liquid in a flooded battery that is fully discharged is
around 30 degrees, since the liquid is almost 100% distilled water. But I
don't think I've ever seen a frozen battery - even is a winter stint at the
GM Arctic Proving Grounds years ago. Unless New Jersey is expecting an Ice
Age, I wouldn't worry.

 

Storage on the boat over the winter is also not a real problem - although
there are a lot of old wives' tales about taking batteries home for storage
and not setting them on concrete floors, and so forth. The accepted
self-discharge rate for a lead-acid battery is between 1.5 and 3% per month,
depending on storage conditions. The rate gets higher as the storage
temperature gets higher, but isn't really very high until you get over 100
degrees. AGM batteries are a bit less, but the chemistry is almost the same
and the lower rate for an AGM battery has more to do with the fact that the
AGM has less plate surface area in contact with the electrolyte mat, so the
reaction is slower.

 

You may want to think about how you use your boat when you make the decision
about batteries. You mention wanting 4 to 6 T-105 batteries in your house
bank. That's 450 to 675 AH in a 12 volt configuration, and that gives you a
lot of live aboard time. My 460 AH house bank will power my 38 for 2 to 3
days on the hook without recharging. (My biggest draw is for refrigeration
and that is more than half of the total.)

 

But  if I recall you mostly daysail and race, so what impact will 400 pounds
of batteries have on trim and performance? Do you need that much endurance?
Also, you say you only charge with your engine alternator. A 675 AH bank is
going to need a 75 amp (or more) alternator and a smart voltage regulator to
recharge it in any manageable amount of time, and at least a 60 amp charger
if you plug into shore power.

 

I have many years of experience in the marketing of batteries for industrial
vehicle, and I have an aversion to AGM batteries, so I'd recommend not using
them. YMMV.

 

Sure, you can lay them on their side. But laying your sailboat on its side
is slow, and flooded batteries - particularly the maintenance free versions
- don't generally leak liquid at normal angles of heel for reasonable
lengths of time.  AGM batteries are more demanding about proper charging
voltages (the regulator in your boat is almost certainly designed for
flooded cells, not AGMs, and will need to be replaced) and less forgiving
about being stored when partially discharged than flooded cells. And AGM
batteries have a significantly shorter service life - in terms of
charge/discharge cycles - than do flooded batteries. Plus they are a lot
more expensive.

 

I looked at the AGM batteries in your post. Trojan T125s from the same
supplier would have 15% more capacity and cost 15% less than the AGM. Two
Exide or Interstate 27 deep cycle batteries in parallel would have the same
capacity as two of these AGM GC2s wired in series and cost about half as
much.  These particular AGM batteries don't look like a particularly good
value to me.  

 

Good luck making your decision

 

Rick Brass

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Edd
Schillay via CnC-List
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2015 12:16 PM
To: C&C List
Subject: Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

 

Josh,

 

I'm leaning towards 4 to 6 (depending on the space available)
Trojan T-105s, but am concerned about the maintenance, especially since I'm
kinda cut off from the boat all winter long. Alternatively, I was looking at
these AGMs:
http://www.atbatt.com/amstron-gc2-6v-agm-deep-cycle-battery.asp?utm_content=
Amstron-AP-GC2

&utm_term=AP-GC2&utm_category=Sealed-Lead-Acid&gclid=CLy95KfH_cMCFXBp7Aod2Wk
A2g, but won't bother if AGMs are only going to last a few years. 

 

My charging system is the alternator, since the Enterprise lives
on a mooring during the season (yes - we call that "standard orbit"). I only
hook up to shore power a few times a year when cruising. 

 

The new system will connect the alternator to the house bank and
use a Blue Seas ACR
(https://www.bluesea.com/products/7610/SI-ACR_Automatic_Charging_Relay_-_12_
24V_DC_120A) to also charge the starting battery. That means I'll have a
New-In-Box Echo Charger to sell this Spring. 

 

   All the best,

 

Re: Stus-List doger snaps, drilled hole - resins, tube epoxy etc

[dwight veinot via CnC-List]

those fasteners are difficult...i have them and I used epoxy on the deck
holes...also use a small screw driver to get them apart and a tap hammer to
set them together...not too bad if you do it that way when installing and
removing your dodger...also used Sikaflew to bed the fasteners to make them
water tight...no leaks yet

Dwight Veinot
C&C 35 MKII, *Alianna*
Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS
d.ve...@bellaliant.net


On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 4:29 PM, Lee Youngblood via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hi Steve,
>
> Were you using the right size bit, for the screws?  Were they blowing out
> the gelcoat when you screwed them in?  I think most installers just drill,
> maybe smear a little 101 and screw down the snap.  Are you making it a big
> project? If you need to fill a bunch of small holes, you might want to
> consider the two-part mixing tubes, even if you use one puddy knife to mix
> on another, it's a pretty quick and easy system. I've used the EZ Fair 7050
> Epoxy Fairing Compound: http://www.fisheriessupply.
> com/pettit-paint-ez-fair-7050-epoxy-fairing-compound-7050cart
>
> It's a good way to mix and fill a little hole by hole.  Yes, drilling,
> routing out the balsa, cleaning, prepping and  injecting uncatalyzed resin,
> sucking out, mixing catalyzed resin, and re-injecting may be a better,
> "correct" method, but for little holes an quick fixes, the tube stuff is
> very handy, an should be good for your snap holes and more.
>
> 2 cents, Lee
>
>
>
>
>
>  I bought a used Natty dodger for my boat and am faced with the same task
>> for the 30+ holes to install the Lift-the-Dot® fasteners that it requires
>> to fasten the canvass to the deck.  I did try to counter sink holes in the
>> gelcoat and screw into the top fiberglass layer underneath, but that turned
>> out to be a disaster.
>> I have done lots of through bolting for various things over the years
>> without difficulty, but this was my first experience trying to use self
>> tapping fasteners (look like wood screws) in the deck and it was not a
>> positive experience. The gelcoat is very thick in places, and in spite of
>> my attempts to counter sink the gelcoat, often as not the screw chips out a
>> huge flake. Removing the canvas female fastener from the deck mounted pins
>> can take some force, and the screws pull out of the thin top layer of fiber
>> glass. So I concluded after several failures that I need to stop what I was
>> doing and use the drill and fill procedure. Then came winter.
>>
>> In all of these discussions about drilling and filling over the years,
>> everyone defaults to using West System epoxy resin to fill the areas
>> needing reinforcement.
>> What is it about this product that makes it so superior?
>> Why not use a polyester resin? - at least gelcoat will stick to it.
>> Like most of us older guys I had experience with automotive body fillers
>> in my younger years.
>> They are all polyester. What is wrong with using that?
>>
>> Some of the Lift-the-Dot® fasteners are difficult to release and I don't
>> know how to fix them. I have been thinking about changing over to the flat,
>> 1/4 turn fasteners that are commonly used now. Is it a practical solution?
>> Has anyone tried this?
>>
>> Spring project.
>>
>> Steve Thomas
>> C&C27 MKIII
>>
>
> --
> Lee Youngblood  (425) 444-9109
>
> Your Shilshole Sailboat Broker
>
> Gig Harbor Yacht Sales | Seattle
> Office @ Dockside Solutions
> 7001 Seaview Avenue NW #160
> Seattle, WA 98117
> New Office Phone (206) 707-1778
>
> GHYS website:  http://www.1gigharbor.com/
>
>
> ___
>
> Email address:
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com
> To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the
> bottom of page at:
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>
>
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Stus-List cockpit drains freezing

[robert via CnC-List]

Chuck
Good tip.I bought a roll of construction grade 'vapor barrier 
plastic'.quite adequate stuff for what you are suggesting..I 
bought a 500 sq ft. roll for $30 at Home Depot.


And for purposes of other than covering my boat!   The white plastic our 
boat is wrapped in every Fall costs a lot more than  $30..I wish.


Rob Abbott
AZURA
C&C 32 -84
Halifax, N.S.


On 2015-02-26 7:10 PM, Chuck S via CnC-List wrote:

Maybe throw a plastic tarp over the canvas cover during snow season?



*From: *"Dr. Mark Bodnar via CnC-List" 
*To: *"Mike Hoyt" , cnc-list@cnc-list.com
*Sent: *Tuesday, February 24, 2015 10:42:01 AM
*Subject: *Re: Stus-List cockpit drains freezing


I've noticed the snow sticking to my canvas cover this winter.
I'm wondering about putting some of the silicone water proofing that 
is used on tents on the cover in the spring - hoping to make it a bit 
more "slippery".  Ideally it will shed snow more easily, important if 
I'll be keeping the boat a little further away from home next winter.

Mark
There is no cure for birth and death save to enjoy the interval.
   - George Santayana
On 2015-02-24 9:25 AM, Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List wrote:

Mike

You have just made the pain / hassle of installing and then
maintaining a winter cover seem very much more worthwhile to me. 
I am constantly worrying about the weight of the snow on my deck

at home, at my mom’s place and on roofs this year.  Now on top of
that on my boat cover.  So far has only been one week where I had
to spend hourseclearing snow off the boat cover and reinforcing
the frame – since then has been ok.

One interesting tidbit I learned this year is that snow sticks to
the custom canvas covers much more readily than shrink wrap
covers.  Shrink wrap might be an option for you to try in the
future for this reason ..

Mike

Persistence

Frers 33

Halifax, NS – in the midst of a “freeze” portion of freeze thaw cycle

*From:*CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf
Of *mike amirault via CnC-List
*Sent:* Monday, February 23, 2015 7:09 PM
*To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com
*Subject:* Stus-List cockpit drains freezing

NS has seen many freeze thaw cycles this winter. After a fairly
substantial rainfall this weekend, I found the bilge on my C&C
33mkii was full to the top. This seemed like too much water to
have run down the mast so I investigated and found that one of the
hoses on my cockpit drains was frozen solid and popped the hose
off the barbs of the drain. My boat is not covered at this
time(tarp was sagging too much) so there is a lot of water in the
cockpit. I'm thinking there may be a low spot in the hose causing
water to freeze there rather than draining. The drains on my C&C
are criss-crossed, i.e., port drainst to stbd, &stbd to port. Just
wondering how other owners in a freezing climate deal with this issue?



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Re: Stus-List cockpit drains freezing

[Chuck S via CnC-List]

Maybe throw a plastic tarp over the canvas cover during snow season? 


- Original Message -

From: "Dr. Mark Bodnar via CnC-List"  
To: "Mike Hoyt" , cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2015 10:42:01 AM 
Subject: Re: Stus-List cockpit drains freezing 


I've noticed the snow sticking to my canvas cover this winter. 
I'm wondering about putting some of the silicone water proofing that is used on 
tents on the cover in the spring - hoping to make it a bit more "slippery". 
Ideally it will shed snow more easily, important if I'll be keeping the boat a 
little further away from home next winter. 
Mark 
There is no cure for birth and death save to enjoy the interval.
  - George Santayana 
On 2015-02-24 9:25 AM, Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List wrote: 





Mike 



You have just made the pain / hassle of installing and then maintaining a 
winter cover seem very much more worthwhile to me. I am constantly worrying 
about the weight of the snow on my deck at home, at my mom’s place and on roofs 
this year. Now on top of that on my boat cover. So far has only been one week 
where I had to spend hourseclearing snow off the boat cover and reinforcing the 
frame – since then has been ok. 



One interesting tidbit I learned this year is that snow sticks to the custom 
canvas covers much more readily than shrink wrap covers. Shrink wrap might be 
an option for you to try in the future for this reason .. 



Mike 

Persistence 

Frers 33 

Halifax, NS – in the midst of a “freeze” portion of freeze thaw cycle 




From: CnC-List [ mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com ] On Behalf Of mike 
amirault via CnC-List 
Sent: Monday, February 23, 2015 7:09 PM 
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Subject: Stus-List cockpit drains freezing 





NS has seen many freeze thaw cycles this winter. After a fairly substantial 
rainfall this weekend, I found the bilge on my C&C 33mkii was full to the top. 
This seemed like too much water to have run down the mast so I investigated and 
found that one of the hoses on my cockpit drains was frozen solid and popped 
the hose off the barbs of the drain. My boat is not covered at this time(tarp 
was sagging too much) so there is a lot of water in the cockpit. I'm thinking 
there may be a low spot in the hose causing water to freeze there rather than 
draining. The drains on my C&C are criss-crossed, i.e., port drainst to stbd, 
&stbd to port. Just wondering how other owners in a freezing climate deal with 
this issue? 


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Re: Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove balsa core from drilled hole

[Chuck S via CnC-List]

On our deck the balsa core is 3/4" thick, so a small chisel worked best to 
remove 1/4" of core around the hole. Just worked on a smaller panel where the 
core is only 1/4" thick. I put the pointy end of a 20 penny nail in a drill 
chuck, bent the headed end over to a 90 degree angle using visegrips and a 
hammer. I figured I wanted about 1/4" for gouging out the balsa, so cut the 
head off at that length. It worked great, and was very quick. I drill the 
oversized hole 3 X the fastener size, so I drilled the 3/4" hole, placed the 
nail into it and started the drill, and gouged out the balsa material, using 
the rim of fiberglass as a guide. 



Chuck 
Resolute 
1990 C&C 34R 
Broad Creek, Magothy River, Md 

- Original Message -

From: "Robert Mazza via CnC-List"  
To: "kelly petew" , "C&C Mailing List" 
 
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 12:27:48 PM 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove balsa core from 
drilled hole 

Pete, 

I've used an Allan Key in a drill chuck to do it, but a bent nails sounded even 
more efficient. 

What you are doing is entirely the right approach. All holes through balsa or 
any other core should be "potted" with epoxy. Use the slow hardener though, the 
fast hardener generates a lot of exotherm on that much filled epoxy and may 
even boil. 

Rob 


On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 11:43 AM, kelly petew via CnC-List < 
cnc-list@cnc-list.com > wrote: 



I want to remove balsa core from some drilled holes and replace it with epoxy. 
I've heard that a bent nail inserted into an electric drill works. But I wonder 
if there is a tool designed specifically to do this job. 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks. 

Pete W. 

Siren Song 
C&C 30-2 
Deltaville, VA 

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Re: Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove balsa core from drilled hole - resins etc

[Jim Watts via CnC-List]

You need exactly the right size pilot hole for self-tapping screws. Trial
and error has led me to two sizes that work reliably.
#10 screws need 11/64 pilot hole, 1/4" fasteners need a 1/4" pilot hole. I
know that sounds very strange, but try it on some scrap glass and see how
it works.

Jim Watts
Paradigm Shift
C&C 35 Mk III
Victoria, BC

On 26 February 2015 at 10:30, Martin DeYoung via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

>  Steve,
>
>
>
> Epoxy (West’s or others) provides a superior secondary bond over
> polyester.  West Systems is often used by DIY boat owners because of their
> very helpful instructions and guide on their web site and the availability
> through retailers.
>
>
>
> Also, polyester based resins and fillers absorb moisture faster than
> epoxies. (Our company uses both in aerospace and mil-spec components that
> are tested for suitability in a wide range of exposures.)
>
>
>
> For short term repairs polyester based fillers and resins will work fine.
> Over 10+ years epoxy based resins and fillers will provide a better bond
> and resist water intrusion/absorption better.
>
>
>
> Both need to be protected from UV.
>
>
>
> Martin DeYoung
>
> Calypso
>
> 1971 C&C 43
>
> Seattle
>
>
> [image: Description: Description: cid:D1BF9853-22F7-47FB-86F2-4115CE0BAF2F]
>
>
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *Steve
> Thomas via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Thursday, February 26, 2015 10:15 AM
> *To:* Josh Muckley; cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove balsa
> core from drilled hole - resins etc
>
>
>
> I bought a used Natty dodger for my boat and am faced with the same task
> for the 30+ holes to install the Lift-the-Dot® fasteners that it requires
> to fasten the canvass to the deck.
>
> I did try to counter sink holes in the gelcoat and screw into the top
> fiberglass layer underneath, but that turned out to be a disaster.
>
> I have done lots of through bolting for various things over the years
> without difficulty, but this was my first experience trying to use self
> tapping fasteners (look like wood screws) in the deck and it was not a
> positive experience. The gelcoat is very thick in places, and in spite of
> my attempts to counter sink the gelcoat, often as not the screw chips out a
> huge flake. Removing the canvas female fastener from the deck mounted pins
> can take some force, and the screws pull out of the thin top layer of fiber
> glass. So I concluded after several failures that I need to stop what I was
> doing and use the drill and fill procedure. Then came winter.
>
>
>
> In all of these discussions about drilling and filling over the years,
> everyone defaults to using West System epoxy resin to fill the areas
> needing reinforcement.
>
> What is it about this product that makes it so superior?
>
> Why not use a polyester resin? - at least gelcoat will stick to it.
>
> Like most of us older guys I had experience with automotive body fillers
> in my younger years.
>
> They are all polyester. What is wrong with using that?
>
>
>
> Some of the Lift-the-Dot® fasteners are difficult to release and I don't
> know how to fix them. I have been thinking about changing over to the
> flat, 1/4 turn fasteners that are commonly used now. Is it a practical
> solution? Has anyone tried this?
>
>
>
> Spring project.
>
>
>
> Steve Thomas
>
> C&C27 MKIII
>
>
>
> ___
>
> Email address:
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com
> To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the
> bottom of page at:
> http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
>
>
>
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Re: Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove balsa core from drilled hole

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

A forstner bit takes one half of the sandwich off too though right?  I
thought the idea was to leave the inner and outer skins intact while
removing the core.

Josh
On Feb 26, 2015 5:20 PM, "svpegasu...@gmail.com" 
wrote:

>  I use a fostner bit to remove coring.
>
> Doug
>
> Pegasus
>
> LF38
>
>
> T-Mobile. America's First Nationwide 4G Network.
>
> -- Original message--
>
> *From: *kelly petew via CnC-List
>
> *Date: *Thu, Feb 26, 2015 08:43
>
> *To: *cnc-list;
>
> *Subject:*Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove balsa core
> from drilled hole
> I want to remove balsa core from some drilled holes and replace it with
> epoxy.  I've heard that a bent nail inserted into an electric drill works.
> But I wonder if there is a tool designed specifically to do this job.
>
> Any advice would be greatly appreciated.   Thanks.
>
> Pete W.
>
> Siren Song
> C&C 30-2
> Deltaville, VA
>
> ___
>
> Email address:
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com
> To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the
> bottom of page at:
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>
>
>
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Re: Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove balsa core from drilled hole

[svpegasus38]

I use a fostner bit to remove coring. DougPegasus LF38
T-Mobile. America's First Nationwide 4G Network.


-- Original message--From: kelly petew via CnC-List Date: Thu, Feb 26, 
2015 08:43To: cnc-list;Subject:Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove 
balsa core from drilled holeI want to remove balsa core from some drilled holes 
and replace it with epoxy.  I've heard that a bent nail inserted into an 
electric drill works.  But I wonder if there is a tool designed specifically to 
do this job.  
 
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.   Thanks.
 
Pete W.
 
Siren Song
C&C 30-2
Deltaville, VA
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Stus-List doger snaps, drilled hole - resins, tube epoxy etc

[Lee Youngblood via CnC-List]

Hi Steve,

Were you using the right size bit, for the 
screws?  Were they blowing out the gelcoat when 
you screwed them in?  I think most installers 
just drill, maybe smear a little 101 and screw 
down the snap.  Are you making it a big project? 
If you need to fill a bunch of small holes, you 
might want to consider the two-part mixing tubes, 
even if you use one puddy knife to mix on 
another, it's a pretty quick and easy system. 
I've used the EZ Fair 7050 Epoxy Fairing 
Compound: 
http://www.fisheriessupply.com/pettit-paint-ez-fair-7050-epoxy-fairing-compound-7050cart


It's a good way to mix and fill a little hole by 
hole.  Yes, drilling, routing out the balsa, 
cleaning, prepping and  injecting uncatalyzed 
resin, sucking out, mixing catalyzed resin, and 
re-injecting may be a better, "correct" method, 
but for little holes an quick fixes, the tube 
stuff is very handy, an should be good for your 
snap holes and more.


2 cents, Lee





I bought a used Natty dodger for my boat and am 
faced with the same task for the 30+ holes to 
install the Lift-the-Dot® fasteners that it 
requires to fasten the canvass to the deck.  
I did try to counter sink holes in the gelcoat 
and screw into the top fiberglass layer 
underneath, but that turned out to be a disaster.
I have done lots of through bolting for various 
things over the years without difficulty, but 
this was my first experience trying to use self 
tapping fasteners (look like wood screws) in the 
deck and it was not a positive experience. The 
gelcoat is very thick in places, and in spite of 
my attempts to counter sink the gelcoat, often 
as not the screw chips out a huge flake. 
Removing the canvas female fastener from the 
deck mounted pins can take some force, and the 
screws pull out of the thin top layer of fiber 
glass. So I concluded after several 
failures that I need to stop what I was doing 
and use the drill and fill procedure. Then came 
winter.


In all of these discussions about drilling and 
filling over the years, everyone defaults to 
using West System epoxy resin to fill the areas 
needing reinforcement.

What is it about this product that makes it so superior?
Why not use a polyester resin? - at least gelcoat will stick to it.
Like most of us older guys I had experience with 
automotive body fillers in my younger years.

They are all polyester. What is wrong with using that?

Some of the Lift-the-Dot® 
fasteners are difficult to release and I don't 
know how to fix them. I have been thinking about 
changing over to the flat, 1/4 turn fasteners 
that are commonly used now. Is it a practical 
solution? Has anyone tried this?


Spring project.

Steve Thomas
C&C27 MKIII


--
Lee Youngblood  (425) 444-9109

Your Shilshole Sailboat Broker

Gig Harbor Yacht Sales | Seattle
Office @ Dockside Solutions
7001 Seaview Avenue NW #160
Seattle, WA 98117
New Office Phone (206) 707-1778

GHYS website:  http://www.1gigharbor.com/


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Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove balsa core from drilled hole

[Robert Boyer via CnC-List]

I have used a screwdriver and a 1/4-inch wide wood chisel successfully to 
remove balsa cored from drilled holes.  The bent nail in a drill never worked 
very well for me.

Bob

Bob Boyer
S/V Rainy Days / Annapolis MD
1983 C&C Landfall 38 - Hull #230
email: dainyr...@icloud.com 
blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com

"There is nothing--absolutely nothing--half so much worth doing as simply 
messing about in boats."  --Kenneth Grahame___

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Re: Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove balsa core from drilled hole - resins etc

[Martin DeYoung via CnC-List]

Steve,

Epoxy (West's or others) provides a superior secondary bond over polyester.  
West Systems is often used by DIY boat owners because of their very helpful 
instructions and guide on their web site and the availability through retailers.

Also, polyester based resins and fillers absorb moisture faster than epoxies. 
(Our company uses both in aerospace and mil-spec components that are tested for 
suitability in a wide range of exposures.)

For short term repairs polyester based fillers and resins will work fine.  Over 
10+ years epoxy based resins and fillers will provide a better bond and resist 
water intrusion/absorption better.

Both need to be protected from UV.

Martin DeYoung
Calypso
1971 C&C 43
Seattle

[Description: Description: cid:D1BF9853-22F7-47FB-86F2-4115CE0BAF2F]

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Steve Thomas 
via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 10:15 AM
To: Josh Muckley; cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Subject: Re: Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove balsa core from 
drilled hole - resins etc

I bought a used Natty dodger for my boat and am faced with the same task for 
the 30+ holes to install the Lift-the-Dot(r) fasteners that it requires to 
fasten the canvass to the deck.
I did try to counter sink holes in the gelcoat and screw into the top 
fiberglass layer underneath, but that turned out to be a disaster.
I have done lots of through bolting for various things over the years without 
difficulty, but this was my first experience trying to use self tapping 
fasteners (look like wood screws) in the deck and it was not a positive 
experience. The gelcoat is very thick in places, and in spite of my attempts to 
counter sink the gelcoat, often as not the screw chips out a huge flake. 
Removing the canvas female fastener from the deck mounted pins can take some 
force, and the screws pull out of the thin top layer of fiber glass. So I 
concluded after several failures that I need to stop what I was doing and use 
the drill and fill procedure. Then came winter.

In all of these discussions about drilling and filling over the years, everyone 
defaults to using West System epoxy resin to fill the areas needing 
reinforcement.
What is it about this product that makes it so superior?
Why not use a polyester resin? - at least gelcoat will stick to it.
Like most of us older guys I had experience with automotive body fillers in my 
younger years.
They are all polyester. What is wrong with using that?

Some of the Lift-the-Dot(r) fasteners are difficult to release and I don't know 
how to fix them. I have been thinking about changing over to the flat, 1/4 turn 
fasteners that are commonly used now. Is it a practical solution? Has anyone 
tried this?

Spring project.

Steve Thomas
C&C27 MKIII

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Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove balsa core from drilled hole

[kelly petew via CnC-List]

I want to remove balsa core from some drilled holes and replace it with epoxy.  
I've heard that a bent nail inserted into an electric drill works.  But I 
wonder if there is a tool designed specifically to do this job.  
 
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.   Thanks.
 
Pete W.
 
Siren Song
C&C 30-2
Deltaville, VA
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Re: Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove balsa core from drilled hole - resins etc

[Steve Thomas via CnC-List]

I bought a used Natty dodger for my boat and am faced with the same task for 
the 30+ holes to install the Lift-the-Dot® fasteners that it requires to fasten 
the canvass to the deck.  
I did try to counter sink holes in the gelcoat and screw into the top 
fiberglass layer underneath, but that turned out to be a disaster. 
I have done lots of through bolting for various things over the years without 
difficulty, but this was my first experience trying to use self tapping 
fasteners (look like wood screws) in the deck and it was not a positive 
experience. The gelcoat is very thick in places, and in spite of my attempts to 
counter sink the gelcoat, often as not the screw chips out a huge flake. 
Removing the canvas female fastener from the deck mounted pins can take some 
force, and the screws pull out of the thin top layer of fiber glass. So I 
concluded after several failures that I need to stop what I was doing and use 
the drill and fill procedure. Then came winter. 

In all of these discussions about drilling and filling over the years, everyone 
defaults to using West System epoxy resin to fill the areas needing 
reinforcement. 
What is it about this product that makes it so superior?
Why not use a polyester resin? - at least gelcoat will stick to it. 
Like most of us older guys I had experience with automotive body fillers in my 
younger years.
They are all polyester. What is wrong with using that?

Some of the Lift-the-Dot® fasteners are difficult to release and I don't know 
how to fix them. I have been thinking about changing over to the flat, 1/4 turn 
fasteners that are commonly used now. Is it a practical solution? Has anyone 
tried this?

Spring project.

Steve Thomas
C&C27 MKIII

  - Original Message - 
  From: Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
  To: kelly petew ; C&C List 
  Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 12:11
  Subject: Re: Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove balsa core from 
drilled hole


  I just did this for my new stainless steel handrails.  I didn't have real 
good luck with a bent nail so I tried various sizes of allen wrench.  I found 
that a 3/16th or 1/8th inch drill bit through 3/8th holes at various angles 
worked best.  I shop-vaced the chips out.  After that you'll have better luck 
finishing up the hole with anballen wrench.

  If these are new holes, you might try to avoid drilling through the bottom 
skin.  Otherwise you'll have to tape or plug the bottom hole when you go to 
fill with epoxy.  I wet out the hole with clear penitrating epoxy and then fill 
in stages with thickend epoxy.  If you drill through the bottom layer you can 
use masking tape to plug it, then a drop or two of 10 minute epoxy in the void 
to seal it.  That way none of the CPE or thickened epoxy leaks out.

  I was filling the holes in 40-50°F weather so I used the fast hardening 
agent.  In a large flat area this would have been fine but since some of my 
voids were close to 3 or 4 Tbsp (or 45-60ml) this caused a thermal run away in 
some of the holes.

  Josh Muckley
  S/V Sea Hawk
  1989 C&C 37+
  Solomons, MD

  On Feb 26, 2015 11:44 AM, "kelly petew via CnC-List"  
wrote:

I want to remove balsa core from some drilled holes and replace it with 
epoxy.  I've heard that a bent nail inserted into an electric drill works.  But 
I wonder if there is a tool designed specifically to do this job.  
 
Any advice would be greatly appreciated.   Thanks.
 
Pete W.
 
Siren Song
C&C 30-2
Deltaville, VA


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Re: Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove balsa core from drilled hole

[Robert Mazza via CnC-List]

Pete,

I've used an Allan Key in a drill chuck to do it, but a bent nails sounded
even more efficient.

What you are doing is entirely the right approach. All holes through balsa
or any other core should be "potted" with epoxy. Use the slow hardener
though, the fast hardener generates a lot of exotherm on that much filled
epoxy and may even boil.

Rob


On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 11:43 AM, kelly petew via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> I want to remove balsa core from some drilled holes and replace it with
> epoxy.  I've heard that a bent nail inserted into an electric drill works.
> But I wonder if there is a tool designed specifically to do this job.
>
> Any advice would be greatly appreciated.   Thanks.
>
> Pete W.
>
> Siren Song
> C&C 30-2
> Deltaville, VA
>
> ___
>
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Re: Stus-List Need Recommendation for Tool to remove balsa core from drilled hole

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

I just did this for my new stainless steel handrails.  I didn't have real
good luck with a bent nail so I tried various sizes of allen wrench.  I
found that a 3/16th or 1/8th inch drill bit through 3/8th holes at various
angles worked best.  I shop-vaced the chips out.  After that you'll have
better luck finishing up the hole with anballen wrench.

If these are new holes, you might try to avoid drilling through the bottom
skin.  Otherwise you'll have to tape or plug the bottom hole when you go to
fill with epoxy.  I wet out the hole with clear penitrating epoxy and then
fill in stages with thickend epoxy.  If you drill through the bottom layer
you can use masking tape to plug it, then a drop or two of 10 minute epoxy
in the void to seal it.  That way none of the CPE or thickened epoxy leaks
out.

I was filling the holes in 40-50°F weather so I used the fast hardening
agent.  In a large flat area this would have been fine but since some of my
voids were close to 3 or 4 Tbsp (or 45-60ml) this caused a thermal run away
in some of the holes.

Josh Muckley
S/V Sea Hawk
1989 C&C 37+
Solomons, MD
On Feb 26, 2015 11:44 AM, "kelly petew via CnC-List" 
wrote:

> I want to remove balsa core from some drilled holes and replace it with
> epoxy.  I've heard that a bent nail inserted into an electric drill works.
> But I wonder if there is a tool designed specifically to do this job.
>
> Any advice would be greatly appreciated.   Thanks.
>
> Pete W.
>
> Siren Song
> C&C 30-2
> Deltaville, VA
>
> ___
>
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> bottom of page at:
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>
>
>
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Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

[Edd Schillay via CnC-List]

All,

Been seeing a lot of write-ups on gassing, tilting, refilling and other 
concerns to keep me away from flooded batteries. 

I already have an AGM 12V on board, which I’ll use for my starting 
battery, and then add 4-6 (depending on space - which, of course, is the final 
frontier) 6V AGM batteries like these: 
http://www.atbatt.com/amstron-gc2-6v-agm-deep-cycle-battery.asp?utm_content=Amstron-AP-GC2&utm_term=AP-GC2&utm_category=Sealed-Lead-Acid&gclid=CLy95KfH_cMCFXBp7Aod2WkA2g
 

 

Thanks to all for the links and advice. Truly a great list. 


All the best,

Edd


Edd M. Schillay
Starship Enterprise
C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
City Island, NY 
Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log 
> On Feb 26, 2015, at 10:37 AM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Dwight, 
> I think the theory is that the same electroisys that is breaking the 
> molecular bond in the water is breaking the bonds in the sufuric acid 
> resulting in corrosive sulfer gas.
> 
> Josh
> 
> On Feb 26, 2015 7:49 AM, "dwight veinot via CnC-List"  > wrote:
> Jake
> 
> 
> Not sure you can attribute that corrosion to off-gassing from your 
> batteries...what gases do you think cause this corrosion?  Off gassing from 
> batteries under charging conditions usually means hydrogen gas...
> 
> Dwight Veinot
> C&C 35 MKII, Alianna
> Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS
> d.ve...@bellaliant.net 
> 
> 
> On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 7:51 AM, Jake Brodersen via CnC-List 
> mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> Edd,
> 
>  
> 
> I prefer AGM.  No noxious gases to be vented into the cabin.  I have a lot of 
> corrosion on my electrical panel that I directly attribute to being bathed in 
> off-gassing from old batteries.  Plus, they’re safer from an explosion 
> perspective, as well as if you ever end up inverted for a short period of 
> time.
> 
>  
> 
> Jake
> 
>  
> 
> Jake Brodersen
> 
> “Midnight Mistress”
> 
> C&C 35 Mk-III
> 
> Hampton VA
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com 
> ] On Behalf Of Edd Schillay via CnC-List
> Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2015 11:17 AM
> To: mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>>
> Subject: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?
> 
>  
> 
> Listers,
> 
>  
> 
> As you know, I’m redoing the electrical systems on the Enterprise 
> (thanks to all for diagrams and advice). 
> 
>  
> 
> So now comes the question of what type of battery to use in my 
> house bank — Flooded, Sealed or AGM? What do you have on your C&C and why do 
> you prefer it? 
> 
>  
> 
> And, if you have flooded, how often do you top them off with 
> distilled water? 
> 
>  
> 
> The countdown has begun! 
> http://enterpriseb.blogspot.com/2015/02/launch-of-enterprise-countdown.html 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> All the best,
> 
>  
> 
> Edd
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Edd M. Schillay
> 
> Starship Enterprise
> 
> C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
> 
> City Island, NY 
> 
> Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> Email address:
> CnC-List@cnc-list.com 
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> of page at:
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> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> 
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Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

[Josh Muckley via CnC-List]

Dwight,
I think the theory is that the same electroisys that is breaking the
molecular bond in the water is breaking the bonds in the sufuric acid
resulting in corrosive sulfer gas.

Josh
On Feb 26, 2015 7:49 AM, "dwight veinot via CnC-List" 
wrote:

> Jake
>
>
> Not sure you can attribute that corrosion to off-gassing from your
> batteries...what gases do you think cause this corrosion?  Off gassing from
> batteries under charging conditions usually means hydrogen gas...
>
> Dwight Veinot
> C&C 35 MKII, *Alianna*
> Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS
> d.ve...@bellaliant.net
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 7:51 AM, Jake Brodersen via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>> Edd,
>>
>>
>>
>> I prefer AGM.  No noxious gases to be vented into the cabin.  I have a
>> lot of corrosion on my electrical panel that I directly attribute to being
>> bathed in off-gassing from old batteries.  Plus, they're safer from an
>> explosion perspective, as well as if you ever end up inverted for a short
>> period of time.
>>
>>
>>
>> Jake
>>
>>
>>
>> *Jake Brodersen*
>>
>> *"Midnight Mistress"*
>>
>> *C&C 35 Mk-III*
>>
>> *Hampton VA*
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *Edd
>> Schillay via CnC-List
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 25, 2015 11:17 AM
>> *To:* 
>> *Subject:* Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?
>>
>>
>>
>> Listers,
>>
>>
>>
>> As you know, I'm redoing the electrical systems on the
>> Enterprise (thanks to all for diagrams and advice).
>>
>>
>>
>> So now comes the question of what type of battery to use in
>> my house bank -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM? What do you have on your C&C and
>> why do you prefer it?
>>
>>
>>
>> And, if you have flooded, how often do you top them off with
>> distilled water?
>>
>>
>>
>> The countdown has begun!
>> http://enterpriseb.blogspot.com/2015/02/launch-of-enterprise-countdown.html
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> All the best,
>>
>>
>>
>> Edd
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Edd M. Schillay
>>
>> Starship Enterprise
>>
>> C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
>>
>> City Island, NY
>>
>> Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log
>> 
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>>
>> Email address:
>> CnC-List@cnc-list.com
>> To change your list preferences, including unsubscribing -- go to the
>> bottom of page at:
>> http://cnc-list.com/mailman/listinfo/cnc-list_cnc-list.com
>>
>>
>>
>
> ___
>
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> bottom of page at:
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>
>
>
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Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

[Joe Della Barba via CnC-List]

Wet cells definitely can emit corrosive acid fumes. My wife's car battery
does this, it gets the nasty sulfur-metal-acid crystals all over the battery
connections. I solved that by spraying them with engine fogging oil.

You have some form-factor issues with wet vs. gel/AGM. A wet cell needs to
be in a battery container that can hold spilled acid. A gel/AGM cannot leak
and you could even cut it in half and use the half that still had the
terminals. The 35 MK I can fit a 4D into the battery space, but not a 4D in
a container, so if you want to go that way a wet battery is out. We once did
have a wet battery not in a case and it cracked in half during a hurricane
and leaked acid into the bilge. That was not a nice smell - sulfur and
chlorine gas :(

Speaking of battery size, "golf cart" is not always a wet cell. You can get
them in gel and AGM too. Two golf carts are a LOT easier to move around than
one 8D and the AHs are about the same. You also can fit 3 group 24s in an 8D
case.

 

Joe Della Barba

j...@dellabarba.com  

Coquina

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Josh
Muckley via CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 10:38 AM
To: C&C List; dwight
Subject: Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

 

Dwight, 
I think the theory is that the same electroisys that is breaking the
molecular bond in the water is breaking the bonds in the sufuric acid
resulting in corrosive sulfer gas.

Josh

On Feb 26, 2015 7:49 AM, "dwight veinot via CnC-List" mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

Jake



Not sure you can attribute that corrosion to off-gassing from your
batteries...what gases do you think cause this corrosion?  Off gassing from
batteries under charging conditions usually means hydrogen gas...




Dwight Veinot

C&C 35 MKII, Alianna

Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS

d.ve...@bellaliant.net  

 

 

On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 7:51 AM, Jake Brodersen via CnC-List
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > wrote:

Edd,

 

I prefer AGM.  No noxious gases to be vented into the cabin.  I have a lot
of corrosion on my electrical panel that I directly attribute to being
bathed in off-gassing from old batteries.  Plus, they're safer from an
explosion perspective, as well as if you ever end up inverted for a short
period of time.

 

Jake

 

Jake Brodersen

"Midnight Mistress"

C&C 35 Mk-III

Hampton VA

 

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com
 ] On Behalf Of Edd Schillay via
CnC-List
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2015 11:17 AM
To: mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> >
Subject: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

 

Listers,

 

As you know, I'm redoing the electrical systems on the
Enterprise (thanks to all for diagrams and advice). 

 

So now comes the question of what type of battery to use in my
house bank - Flooded, Sealed or AGM? What do you have on your C&C and why do
you prefer it? 

 

And, if you have flooded, how often do you top them off with
distilled water? 

 

The countdown has begun!
http://enterpriseb.blogspot.com/2015/02/launch-of-enterprise-countdown.html 

 

All the best,

 

Edd

 

 

Edd M. Schillay

Starship Enterprise

C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B

City Island, NY 

Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log
 

 


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Re: Stus-List cockpit drains freezing

[Dr. Mark Bodnar via CnC-List]

  
  

  I've noticed the snow sticking to my canvas cover this winter.
  I'm wondering about putting some of the silicone water proofing
  that is used on tents on the cover in the spring - hoping to make
  it a bit more "slippery".  Ideally it will shed snow more easily,
  important if I'll be keeping the boat a little further away from
  home next winter.
  Mark
  

There is no cure for birth and death save to enjoy the interval.
  - George Santayana
  On 2015-02-24 9:25 AM, Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List wrote:


  
  
  
  
Mike
 
You
have just made the pain / hassle of installing and then
maintaining a winter cover seem very much more worthwhile to
me.  I am constantly worrying about the weight of the snow
on my deck at home, at my mom’s place and on roofs this
year.  Now on top of that on my boat cover.  So far has only
been one week where I had to spend hourseclearing snow off
the boat cover and reinforcing the frame – since then has
been ok.
 
One
interesting tidbit I learned this year is that snow sticks
to the custom canvas covers much more readily than shrink
wrap covers.  Shrink wrap might be an option for you to try
in the future for this reason ..
 
Mike
Persistence
Frers
33
Halifax,
NS – in the midst of a “freeze” portion of freeze thaw cycle
 

  
From:
CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com]
On Behalf Of mike amirault via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, February 23, 2015 7:09 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Subject: Stus-List cockpit drains freezing
  

 

  NS
  has seen many freeze thaw cycles this winter. After a
  fairly substantial rainfall this weekend, I found the
  bilge on my C&C 33mkii was full to the top. This
  seemed like too much water to have run down the mast so I
  investigated and found that one of the hoses on my cockpit
  drains was frozen solid and popped the hose off the barbs
  of the drain. My boat is not covered at this time(tarp was
  sagging too much) so there is a lot of water in the
  cockpit.  I'm thinking there may be a low spot in the hose
  causing water to freeze there rather than draining. The
  drains on my C&C are criss-crossed, i.e., port drainst
  to stbd, &stbd to port. Just wondering how other
  owners in a freezing climate deal with this issue?

  
  
  
  
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Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

[David Knecht via CnC-List]

The one I got is a Renogy 50W mono crystalline : 
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00DVPPFDS/ref=pe_385040_30332200_pe_309540_26725410_item

And the 10’ extension that I wired to a Blue Sea plug:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00DGXGKWA/ref=pe_385040_30332200_pe_309540_26725410_item


On Feb 25, 2015, at 5:03 PM, David via CnC-List  wrote:

> May I ask which unit?
> 
> David F. Risch
> (401) 419-4650 (cell)
> 
> 
> Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2015 16:58:45 -0500
> To: efran...@mac.com; cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?
> From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> 
> I installed a 50W solar panel last summer to keep batteries topped off at the 
> mooring.  I bought one sized to fit the sliding companionway hatch.   I ran 
> the wires to a 12v outlet plug near the start panel and from there to a 
> charge controller mounted in the lazarette.   I leave it just sitting on the 
> hatch when gone and unplug it and throw it on the rear mattress when I get to 
> the boat. It is heavy enough that it is not going anywhere short of a serious 
> gale, but light enough that it is easy to move around.  It worked great last 
> season and well worth the time investment to get the wiring installed.  Dave
> 
> On Feb 25, 2015, at 3:36 PM, Eric Frank via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Ed,
> But it takes only a small panel to provide adequate current to keep them 
> topped off. You will need your alternator when using the batteries for 
> cruising, of course, but sitting on the mooring, even 0.5 - 1 amp is 
> sufficient.  That's all I use on Cat's Paw (kept on a mooring); I have a 
> small solar panel on the forward hatch.  Even with a small panel, though, I 
> recommend a simple charge regulator to stop the charging when the batteries 
> are topped up. 
> 
> Eric Frank
> Cat's Paw, C&C 35 Mk II
> 
> One thing to keep in mind is wet cells can lose up to 10% of charge per month 
> and gels only lose around 1%. For a boat on a mooring or otherwise off shore 
> power this can be a factor.
> If you go wet cells on a mooring you will want a solar panel to keep them 
> topped off.
> 
> Joe Della Barba
> Coquina
> C&C 35 MK I
> 
> 
> ___
> 
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> 
> Aries
> 1990 C&C 34+
> New London, CT
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ___ Email address: 
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Aries
1990 C&C 34+
New London, CT



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Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

[dwight veinot via CnC-List]

I use much the same procedure that Robert described with my wet cell Great
Northern batteries (2 six V golf cart and 1 group 24, all deep cycle, group
24 used mostly for starting and backup)...in fact Robert may have started
using this procedure after discussing with me...my batteries have remained
onboard ever since I got them about 9 years ago...one other inportant issue
though is to check electrolyte level in fall before that winterizing
charge...if it's low and especially if you can see that any plates are not
covered with electrolyte then replenish with distilled water before
applying the charge...and another  guideline that I find useful as an
indicator is that if in spring after having done absolutely nothing to the
batteries all winter long, a battery has not held most of its charge then
it is likely time to get a new battery...the voltages that Robert reported
measuring in his batteries just lately are characteristic of good lead acid
batteries and about what I would expect to see in my batteries come spring,
maybe a bit lower to around 12.4 but not much if the battery is good.  Such
batteries have started my little M4-30 diesel each spring without further
charging but I will apply a 24 hour slow charge to each before launch. I do
not have shore power so the only charging my batteries see during the
sailing season comes from my alternator...after 9 years on these batteries
no problems yet...I still have incandescent lights throughout and I run an
Adler barbour refrigerator while cruising but not continuously...I also add
ice to my ice box when it is available and we start all cruises with frozen
fresh drinking water in the ice box and frozen meets as well.  Works good
for us in August here in Nova Scotia.

Dwight Veinot
C&C 35 MKII, *Alianna*
Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS
d.ve...@bellaliant.net


On Wed, Feb 25, 2015 at 12:56 PM, robert via CnC-List  wrote:

>  Edd:
>
> We have two Great Northern Group 27 wet cell batteries that are left on
> board all winter.these two batteries get a full charge late in the Fall
> and sometimes a short charge (one hour) at 6 amps during the winter and
> that's it.  They have seen 6 sailing seasons, have spent every winter on
> board, and last week I  went to check the boat, mostly for the build up
> snow and ice on the shrinkwrap, my volt meter said one battery was 12.59V
> the second was 12.57V.  My point is, if fully charged in the Fall, there is
> very little, if any, winter maintenance involved.
>
> A side story.got on a step ladder to board my boat last
> week.didn't realize there was 2 inches of solid ice lying on the white
> shrinkwrap directly above me.when this approx. 3' x 3' piece of solid
> ice started to slide towards me, I got my head and shoulders in the
> gate/companionway just in time before it decapitated me and/or removed all
> my front teeth.  Lesson learned... won't do that again, he says!
>
> Rob Abbott
> AZURA
> C&C32 - 84
> Halifax, N.S.
>
>
>
>
> On 2015-02-25 12:30 PM, Edd Schillay via CnC-List wrote:
>
> I do want to go with 4-6 golf carts. How often do you need to add water to
> them?
>
>  A problem I have is the ability to get to the boat to maintain them
> during the winter months.
>
>
>  All the best,
>
>  Edd
>
>
>  Edd M. Schillay
>  Starship Enterprise
>  C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
>  City Island, NY
>   Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log 
>
>  On Feb 25, 2015, at 11:27 AM, Joe Della Barba  wrote:
>
>  Quick answer: gel is best and wet cells - golf carts - are by FAR the
> best for $$$ per amp hour.  I do not care for AGM
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 25, 2015, at 11:17, Edd Schillay via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
>
>   Listers,
>
>  As you know, I’m redoing the electrical systems on the Enterprise
> (thanks to all for diagrams and advice).
>
>  So now comes the question of what type of battery to use in my house
> bank — Flooded, Sealed or AGM? What do you have on your C&C and why do you
> prefer it?
>
>  And, if you have flooded, how often do you top them off with distilled
> water?
>
>  The countdown has begun!
> http://enterpriseb.blogspot.com/2015/02/launch-of-enterprise-countdown.html
>
>
>
>  All the best,
>
>  Edd
>
>
>  Edd M. Schillay
>  Starship Enterprise
>  C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
>  City Island, NY
>   Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log 
>
>   ___
>
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Stus-List Forward hatches on the 1981 C&C30 MK1

[robert via CnC-List]

In 2009, we replaced our side cabin windows.used Sika 295 UV and 
Sika Primer..never heard of 'Sika UV Shielding Tape'.   When you 
apply the Sika Primer to the new windows and the gelcoat, you should 
understand why it is highly recommended..it 'bites' into surfaces 
you apply it to.  I used a 1/2" painter's brush to apply the Primer and 
you could feel the 'resistance' as you dragged it along the surface(s).
I taped everything, inside and outside, and applied 'more' rather than 
'less' Sika 295UV so that when the windows were fitted into their slots, 
there was adhesive oozing out all around.especially onthe outside.  
And I never used 'spacers'.I bought them but decided at the last 
moment not to use them.I felt they might be a weak point.  I let the 
Sika cure for 3 days before I disturbed anything..the extra adhesive 
that oozed out was easily trimmed off with a razor blade.
One tip...as soon as you install a window and have it secured in 
place, remove the tape before the Sika cures.  If the adhesive cures 
before you remove the tape, you will make the job much more difficult.


As for gaskets, I replaced all of my hatch gaskets.obtained them 
from Hammerheadthe guy there used to work for A&H.very 
knowledgeable..I talked to him on the phoneI said I needed 3/4" 
D-shaped gaskets..he said I needed 1/2" D-shaped gaskets.he was 
right, 1/2" was the perfect size and he sent me a tube of caulking I 
didn't ask for but was grateful for getting.


Rob Abbott
AZURA
C&C 32 - 84
Halifax, N.S.

On 2015-02-26 9:00 AM, Jake Brodersen via CnC-List wrote:


I use the Sika primer, as it is “highly recommended” to ensure a good 
seal.  Yes, it’s expensive, but I hate doing a job twice.  A bottle of 
primer goes a long way.  Sika recommends that the edges of the window 
be painted over where the sealant is used.  This is because exposure 
to light degrades the adhesive.  I’m assuming this would be UV 
exposure.  To date, I have not done this and have had zero problems.  
It could cause premature failure of the seal in the long term though.


I use a dremel tool with a sanding drum to rough up the edges of the 
windows before installing them.  I give the material some tooth, then 
wipe it down with alcohol to remove any contamination.  Don’t be 
afraid to grind into the plexi to get a good surface for the 
adhesive.  It won’t show from the outside.


Jake

*Jake Brodersen*

*/“Midnight Mistress”/*

*C&C 35 Mk-III*

*Hampton VA*

*From:*CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of 
*prf680 via CnC-List

*Sent:* Thursday, February 26, 2015 1:51 AM
*To:* 1 CnC List
*Subject:* Re: Stus-List Forward hatches on the 1981 C&C30 MK1

I have no idea what hardness neoprene one would use ... and best 
adhesive to fix it in place.


Atkins & Hoyle website says 'high density, soft durometer'

I suppose one of us should get off their duffs and call A&H or Hammerhead.

On another note, I notice that the Sika 295UV instructions call for 
'Sika UV Shielding Tape' overlapping the edge of the window and the 
adhesive joint itself, onto the cabinside? Has anyone actually seen 
that or used it themselves? I couldn't find any reference to 
availability in North America either ... even absent from Sika's 
Canadian website.


I also don't see reference on many of the 'how-to' sites to abrading 
the edges of the acrylic sheet and the fiberglass frame area prior to 
install. More discuss use of primer ... but not all state what they 
are using.







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Re: Stus-List Forward hatches on the 1981 C&C30 MK1

[Jake Brodersen via CnC-List]

I use the Sika primer, as it is “highly recommended” to ensure a good seal.  
Yes, it’s expensive, but I hate doing a job twice.  A bottle of primer goes a 
long way.  Sika recommends that the edges of the window be painted over where 
the sealant is used.  This is because exposure to light degrades the adhesive.  
I’m assuming this would be UV exposure.  To date, I have not done this and have 
had zero problems.  It could cause premature failure of the seal in the long 
term though.

 

I use a dremel tool with a sanding drum to rough up the edges of the windows 
before installing them.  I give the material some tooth, then wipe it down with 
alcohol to remove any contamination.  Don’t be afraid to grind into the plexi 
to get a good surface for the adhesive.  It won’t show from the outside.

 

Jake

 

Jake Brodersen

“Midnight Mistress”

C&C 35 Mk-III

Hampton VA

 

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of prf680 via 
CnC-List
Sent: Thursday, February 26, 2015 1:51 AM
To: 1 CnC List
Subject: Re: Stus-List Forward hatches on the 1981 C&C30 MK1

 

I have no idea what hardness neoprene one would use ... and best adhesive to 
fix it in place.

Atkins & Hoyle website says 'high density, soft durometer'

 

I suppose one of us should get off their duffs and call A&H or Hammerhead.

 

On another note, I notice that the Sika 295UV instructions call for 'Sika UV 
Shielding Tape' overlapping the edge of the window and the adhesive joint 
itself, onto the cabinside? Has anyone actually seen that or used it 
themselves? I couldn't find any reference to availability in North America 
either ... even absent from Sika's Canadian website. 

 

I also don't see reference on many of the 'how-to' sites to abrading the edges 
of the acrylic sheet and the fiberglass frame area prior to install. More 
discuss use of primer ... but not all state what they are using.

 






 

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Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

[dwight veinot via CnC-List]

Jake


Not sure you can attribute that corrosion to off-gassing from your
batteries...what gases do you think cause this corrosion?  Off gassing from
batteries under charging conditions usually means hydrogen gas...

Dwight Veinot
C&C 35 MKII, *Alianna*
Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS
d.ve...@bellaliant.net


On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 7:51 AM, Jake Brodersen via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Edd,
>
>
>
> I prefer AGM.  No noxious gases to be vented into the cabin.  I have a lot
> of corrosion on my electrical panel that I directly attribute to being
> bathed in off-gassing from old batteries.  Plus, they’re safer from an
> explosion perspective, as well as if you ever end up inverted for a short
> period of time.
>
>
>
> Jake
>
>
>
> *Jake Brodersen*
>
> *“Midnight Mistress”*
>
> *C&C 35 Mk-III*
>
> *Hampton VA*
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *Edd
> Schillay via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Wednesday, February 25, 2015 11:17 AM
> *To:* 
> *Subject:* Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?
>
>
>
> Listers,
>
>
>
> As you know, I’m redoing the electrical systems on the
> Enterprise (thanks to all for diagrams and advice).
>
>
>
> So now comes the question of what type of battery to use in
> my house bank — Flooded, Sealed or AGM? What do you have on your C&C and
> why do you prefer it?
>
>
>
> And, if you have flooded, how often do you top them off with
> distilled water?
>
>
>
> The countdown has begun!
> http://enterpriseb.blogspot.com/2015/02/launch-of-enterprise-countdown.html
>
>
>
>
> All the best,
>
>
>
> Edd
>
>
>
>
>
> Edd M. Schillay
>
> Starship Enterprise
>
> C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B
>
> City Island, NY
>
> Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log
> 
>
>
>
> ___
>
> Email address:
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> bottom of page at:
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>
>
>
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Stus-List Forward hatches on the 1981 C&C30 MK1

[Robert Boyer via CnC-List]

I recently replaced my hatch seals.  I bought the gaskets from Atkins & Hoyle 
because I didn't have the specs to source otherwise.  I used Sika #291 or 
#295UV--can't recall at the moment.

Bob Boyer
S/V Rainy Days / Annapolis MD
1983 C&C Landfall 38 - Hull #230
email: dainyr...@icloud.com 
blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com

"There is nothing--absolutely nothing--half so much worth doing as simply 
messing about in boats."  --Kenneth Grahame___

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Re: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

[Jake Brodersen via CnC-List]

Edd,

 

I prefer AGM.  No noxious gases to be vented into the cabin.  I have a lot of 
corrosion on my electrical panel that I directly attribute to being bathed in 
off-gassing from old batteries.  Plus, they’re safer from an explosion 
perspective, as well as if you ever end up inverted for a short period of time.

 

Jake

 

Jake Brodersen

“Midnight Mistress”

C&C 35 Mk-III

Hampton VA

 

 

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Edd Schillay 
via CnC-List
Sent: Wednesday, February 25, 2015 11:17 AM
To: 
Subject: Stus-List Batteries -- Flooded, Sealed or AGM?

 

Listers,

 

As you know, I’m redoing the electrical systems on the Enterprise 
(thanks to all for diagrams and advice). 

 

So now comes the question of what type of battery to use in my 
house bank — Flooded, Sealed or AGM? What do you have on your C&C and why do 
you prefer it? 

 

And, if you have flooded, how often do you top them off with 
distilled water? 

 

The countdown has begun! 
http://enterpriseb.blogspot.com/2015/02/launch-of-enterprise-countdown.html 

 

All the best,

 

Edd

 

 

Edd M. Schillay

Starship Enterprise

C&C 37+ | Sail No: NCC-1701-B

City Island, NY 

Starship Enterprise's Captain's Log 
 

 

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