Re: Stus-List 1973 custom C 43' - hull/deck joint (toe rail replacement?)

[Violeta Ivanova via CnC-List]

Thanks, Rick! I was replying also to you, but forgot to mention you in the
email I just sent the list.

Violeta

On Sun, Nov 13, 2016 at 10:04 PM, Rick Brass via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Ken, et al:
>
>
>
> The illustrations and text in the manual are pretty much the same as what
> is in the manual that came with Imzadi – Hull Number 047 built in January
> 1976. Except that my manual notes that the rubber rub rail was riveted to
> the hull flange.
>
>
>
> The stack up is hull flange, butyl, rub rail, butyl, deck, butyl, toe
> rail. Through bolted on 4” spacing.
>
>
>
> Rick Brass
>
> Washington, NC
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *Ken
> Heaton via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Sunday, November 13, 2016 9:01 PM
> *To:* cnc-list 
> *Cc:* Ken Heaton 
> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List 1973 custom C 43' - hull/deck joint (toe rail
> replacement?)
>
>
>
> The manual for the 1977 C 38 is here: http://www.
> cncphotoalbum.com/download/38manual.pdf
>
>
>
> See page 9 (3.3 Hull Deck Joint) and the illustration on page 35.
>
>
>
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
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Re: Stus-List 1973 custom C 43' - hull/deck joint (toe rail replacement?)

[Violeta Ivanova via CnC-List]

Martin

Great to connect with you! (Hull #1, eh?) Yes, our custom C 43' is X
Dimension. We call her XD. Here is more about her:
http://sailing.mit.edu/bluewater. She sails like a dream! I love that boat.
It will be fantastic to get the C 43' drawings from you. I'll email you
separately about that.

FYI to the list -- I called the maritime museum in Kingston, ON, earlier
today. The museum is relocating, and the archives will be inaccessible at
least until late spring 2017. Since we can't get anything from them until
then, thanks even more for all the help here!

Also answering to Ken, Leslie, Rob, Michael - thanks for the links,
pictures, and related details. Very helpful to finally "see" that joint,
even though ours is slightly different (T shaped toe rail, bolted on both
sides).

I am pretty sure the toe rail on XD is the original one. We have never
changed it, and the previous owner never mentions changing it in the notes
he left for us. It's unlikely that the original owner(s) ever replaced toe
rail that was relatively new at their time. It must be the original.

It seems the consensus is no vinyl. So butyl on the hull flange bonds to
butyl under the deck edge, all that bolted through, incorporating the
aluminum toe rail? More butyl between deck and toe rail, so I guess that
seals the bolts?

Since people asked, I don't have photos of the worst worn out parts on our
toe rail, sorry. The photos I posted show only the corrosion. If we were to
reuse some of the toe rail, how would one clean and treat that? What about
custom extrusion, if we can't find a match for the T-rail?

And wouldn't the hull and deck separate, once the bolts are removed? It
seems essential to do one section at a time. How big a section?

Finally, out of curiosity, I found Evening Star (with the teak rail) listed
for sale online. She is beautiful! But XD is better. :)

Violeta


On Mon, Nov 14, 2016 at 4:27 PM, Martin DeYoung 
wrote:

> Violeta,
>
>
>
> Lee Youngblood forwarded your question and several replies to me.  I have
> been tied up with some business related extra work (long story for another
> time) and have not been able to follow the cnc-list as closely as I would
> like.
>
>
>
> I am one of two owners of a 1971 C 43, hull #1.  We have spent the last
> 2 years restoring the deck after 40+ years or hard use racing and
> cruising.  We have owned it since 1998 and have worked on almost every
> significant system, piece of the rig, and significant areas of the hull and
> deck.
>
>
>
> I have not done any extensive work on the toe rail but am reasonable
> familiar with this era of C's and especially the 43's and 39's. I have
> some pictures of several 43's being built at Bruckmann's that show a little
> detail and I have copies from the Maritime museum of the 43 build drawings.
>
>
> From one of your comments I believe the 43 you are referring to was once
> named X Bar R or something similar and was donated to a college by the
> inventor of the bar code.  If that is the same boat, its construction will
> be very similar to Calypso's (our 43 here in Seattle)
>
>
>
> The deck joint is basically an inward laminated flange that is part of
> the hull, with the outer edge of the deck overlaying it then through
> bolted, through the toe rail.  Butyl tape was normal the factory sealant.
> If your boat has something other than Butyl tape it was added by a past
> owner. One of the other lister's post included a drawing of a C hull to
> deck joint.  Take out the vinyl rub rail and it is much the same concept.
>
>
>
> I have not removed a C aluminum extruded toe rail myself but have read
> some details and discussed with several people who have.  One of the
> important details was controlling the "stored energy" in a long length
> of the bent aluminum toe rail extrusion.  Removing a short section should
> be easy for a person accustom to messing about in boats.  Removing a long
> section may require a little more thought and planning but is not beyond a
> DIY effort.
>
>
>
> Why do you want to remove some toe rail.  If it is to stop a leak, make
> sure all the through bolts are tight first.  On Calypso I have found that
> most hull/deck bolts can use 1/4 to 1/2 turn tightening every few years.
> If it is because of excessive wear and corrosion or a particular slot
> wearing through you may have easier options than removing a length of toe
> rail.  If the toe rail base has corroded enough to weaken one or two bolt
> locations that may justify the extra project.
>
>
> I do know of one "Limited" C 43 from Bruckmann's custom shop, likely
> launched in 1975 or 76 that had its entire aluminum toe rail removed and
> replaced by a teak toe rail.  That boat is now know as "Evening Star".
> It's last known location was San Francisco and was/has been listed for
> sale.  In my opinion, the hull to deck joint modification would not be
> significantly weakened if the new fastenings are correctly sized and
> installed.  I do 

Re: Stus-List Spinnaker (not dented pole...) related.

[Dennis C. via CnC-List]

Regardless of how it used to run, you might consider how I run the pole
downhaul on Touche'.  Warning, it ain't cheap.

I use a single block with snap shackle to attach to the bridle ring.  The
doubled line then runs down to a double block with carabiner that clips to
a Wichard fold down pad eye centered on the foredeck.  The lines run
outboard and down each side along the toe rail through single
block/carabiners and then to cam cleats on either side of the cabin just
forward of the cockpit.  The two ends are tied together and usually tossed
down the companionway.  In essence, it becomes and "endless" downhaul.

Having a double downhaul allows the guy trimmer to trim both the guy and
downhaul from either side.  On Touche' that's his/her job.

The only deck penetrations are the pad eye and cam cleat fasteners.

When not racing, the downhaul is stored in a cockpit locker.

Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA
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Re: Stus-List Spinnaker (not dented pole...) related.

[Charlie Nelson via CnC-List]

My 1995 XL has a port and starboard set of bullseyes for a double ended 
downhaul that can be secured on both sides of the cockpit. 


The bullseye tracks end in a cam cleat at the end of the cabin top and run 
about 1/2 way up the cabin sides to a double block forward under the pole that 
improves the purchase.


Your extra set of bullseyes could be used in this manner.


I also second the the notion of either adding a sleeve where the dent is when 
it is removed or banged out with a tool that is like a reverse hammer(don't 
know its real name) or redoing the entire pole. You already have the most 
expensive parts (end pieces).


Charlie Nelson
C 36 XL/kcb
Water Phantom


cenel...@aol.com




-Original Message-
From: Dave Godwin via CnC-List 
To: C List 
Cc: Dave Godwin 
Sent: Mon, Nov 14, 2016 6:06 pm
Subject: Stus-List Spinnaker (not dented pole...) related.


So, I have a request out to any spinnaker-rigged 37 and 35 MKIII (similar deck 
layout I suspect…) owners about how their pole downhaul line is routed.


I am in the process of masking and taping the boat which involves laying out 
the gloss/non-gloss areas. On my boat I have the pole downhaul running along 
the port side from a rope clutch forward to three Harken bulls-eyes to the pole 
bridle. But when going through my box-o-hardware I have four bulls-eyes. Doh!


I can’t remember if there was a fourth used with the downhaul or it went 
somewhere else. And of course, of all the pictures I took to keep track of 
hardware placement there isn’t anything showing forward of the mast.


Now, it may be associated with baby-stay run but…


Thoughts. Pictures?


Best,


Dave Godwin
1982 C 37 - Ronin
Reedville - Chesapeake Bay
Ronin’s Overdue Refit




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Re: Stus-List Thinking of a Wheel to Tiller Conversion

[Bob McLaughlin via CnC-List]

Agreed re single handing 33-2: move the primary winches to the aft pads and use 
self-tailing winches.  I found them to be the perfect spot and you can get a 
lot of leverage as you are standing over the winch rather than kneeling on the 
seat.  Was very easy to single-hand the boat. 

Bob McLaughlin


> On Nov 14, 2016, at 3:17 PM, Bradley Lumgair via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> +1 for the wheel and a second set of winches, that's how I sail my 33-2 
> single handed
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List Winter Project

[Dave via CnC-List]

Well, old school, (rorc rule maybe?) and she certainly won't surf!   At 88' loa 
I guess you can lean things out a bit!   Check out the Deerfoot 62 or sundeer 
for non-IOR proportioned boats.

Dave

Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 14, 2016, at 6:28 PM, Dan Grant  wrote:
> 
> Her beam seems narrow ?
> 1970 c and c  corvette Hull 148
> Puffin 
> Ipswich ,ma
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Nov 14, 2016, at 4:51 PM, Dave S via CnC-List  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Project yacht for sale - why compromise?
>> 
>> Some photos shot in Shelburne Nova Scotia this weekend.
>> 
>> http://aberdeentyger.blogspot.ca/2016/11/photos-of-yacht-tyger-taken-nov-2016.html
>> 
>> Dave  C 33-2 Windstar
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
>> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>> 
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List Winter Project

[Dan Grant via CnC-List]

Her beam seems narrow ?
1970 c and c  corvette Hull 148
Puffin 
Ipswich ,ma
Sent from my iPhone

> On Nov 14, 2016, at 4:51 PM, Dave S via CnC-List  
> wrote:
> 
> Project yacht for sale - why compromise?
> 
> Some photos shot in Shelburne Nova Scotia this weekend.
> 
> http://aberdeentyger.blogspot.ca/2016/11/photos-of-yacht-tyger-taken-nov-2016.html
> 
> Dave  C 33-2 Windstar
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
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Re: Stus-List Thinking of a Wheel to Tiller Conversion

[roderick anderson via CnC-List]

Mike, that's a great idea and that would work well for me. Oddly enough my
32 was never rigged for a spinnaker but I can certainly take care of that.
Thanks!
Rod
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Stus-List Thinking of a Wheel to Tiller Conversion

[Dave S via CnC-List]

Hey Brad,

Ya' got me.   Second set of winches to help 33-2 single handing?  Do tell.
Any photos?  Thanks.

Dave
33-2 windstar






Message: 3
Date: Mon, 14 Nov 2016 21:17:36 +
From: Bradley Lumgair 
To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
Subject: Stus-List  Thinking of a Wheel to Tiller Conversion
Message-ID:


Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

+1 for the wheel and a second set of winches, that's how I sail my 33-2
single handed
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Stus-List Spinnaker (not dented pole...) related.

[Dave Godwin via CnC-List]

So, I have a request out to any spinnaker-rigged 37 and 35 MKIII (similar deck 
layout I suspect…) owners about how their pole downhaul line is routed.

I am in the process of masking and taping the boat which involves laying out 
the gloss/non-gloss areas. On my boat I have the pole downhaul running along 
the port side from a rope clutch forward to three Harken bulls-eyes to the pole 
bridle. But when going through my box-o-hardware I have four bulls-eyes. Doh!

I can’t remember if there was a fourth used with the downhaul or it went 
somewhere else. And of course, of all the pictures I took to keep track of 
hardware placement there isn’t anything showing forward of the mast.

Now, it may be associated with baby-stay run but…

Thoughts. Pictures?

Best,
Dave Godwin
1982 C 37 - Ronin
Reedville - Chesapeake Bay
Ronin’s Overdue Refit 
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Re: Stus-List spinnaker pole repair and refurb

[Dave Godwin via CnC-List]

Dave,

I’d be very wary of any dent fix solution that doesn’t involve a sleeve. Even 
better, simply buy a length of aluminum tube of the same dimensions, cut it to 
length and add all the existing hardware. I don’t have any numbers but I have 
to believe it will be cheaper than having someone try to pull the dent out.

Remember, when that spinnaker is up it will be putting a large amount of strain 
on that pole. Having it fold up at the wrong moment will be un-fun.

Best,
Dave Godwin
1982 C 37 - Ronin
Reedville - Chesapeake Bay
Ronin’s Overdue Refit 
> On Nov 14, 2016, at 5:30 PM, rjcasciato--- via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> Dave.call your local Dr. Dent repair...find him in the automotive 
> services section of your yellow pages..
> Those guys do this on metal all the time.
> Ron C.
> 
> 
> Sent from XFINITY Connect Mobile App
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> 
> From: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: syerd...@gmail.com
> Sent: 2016-11-14 5:26:16 PM 
> Subject: Stus-List spinnaker pole repair and refurb
> 
> Evening all,
> 
> This winter's theme is running rigging, and this includes dealing with the 
> spinnaker pole, which is dented, slightly bent, and needs a new shock cord 
> bridle.   Per recommendations here, I picked up the shock cord tools last 
> weekend in Nova Scotia - that part is easy.  Any suggestions on how to  with 
> the dent/bend?
> 
> See photos here.
> 
> http://cncwindstar.blogspot.ca/2016/11/spinnaker-pole-repair.html 
> 
> 
> Thanks, Dave '85 33-2 Windstar
> 
> 
> 
> ___ This list is supported by the 
> generous donations of our members. If you wish to make a contribution to 
> offset our costs, please go to: https://www.paypal.me/stumurray All 
> Contributions are greatly appreciated! 
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> 
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

___

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Re: Stus-List spinnaker pole repair and refurb

[rjcasciato--- via CnC-List]

Dave.call your local Dr. Dent repair...find him in the automotive services section of your yellow pages..Those guys do this on metal all the time.Ron C.Sent from XFINITY Connect Mobile App-Original Message-From: cnc-list@cnc-list.comTo: cnc-list@cnc-list.comCc: syerd...@gmail.comSent: 2016-11-14 5:26:16 PM Subject: Stus-List spinnaker pole repair and refurbEvening all,This winter's theme is running rigging, and this includes dealing with the spinnaker pole, which is dented, slightly bent, and needs a new shock cord bridle.   Per recommendations here, I picked up the shock cord tools last weekend in Nova Scotia - that part is easy.  Any suggestions on how to  with the dent/bend?See photos here.http://cncwindstar.blogspot.ca/2016/11/spinnaker-pole-repair.htmlThanks, Dave '85 33-2 Windstar
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Stus-List spinnaker pole repair and refurb

[Dave S via CnC-List]

Evening all,

This winter's theme is running rigging, and this includes dealing with the
spinnaker pole, which is dented, slightly bent, and needs a new shock cord
bridle.   Per recommendations here, I picked up the shock cord tools last
weekend in Nova Scotia - that part is easy.  Any suggestions on how to
 with the dent/bend?

See photos here.

http://cncwindstar.blogspot.ca/2016/11/spinnaker-pole-repair.html

Thanks, Dave '85 33-2 Windstar
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Stus-List Winter Project

[Dave S via CnC-List]

Project yacht for sale - why compromise?

Some photos shot in Shelburne Nova Scotia this weekend.

http://aberdeentyger.blogspot.ca/2016/11/photos-of-yacht-tyger-taken-nov-2016.html

Dave  C 33-2 Windstar
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Stus-List C for sale

[Donald Blumer via CnC-List]

I would like to posy my C for sale and not sure how to do so on this site. 
Any help would be appreciated.
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Stus-List Thinking of a Wheel to Tiller Conversion

[Bradley Lumgair via CnC-List]

+1 for the wheel and a second set of winches, that's how I sail my 33-2 single 
handed

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Re: Stus-List 1973 custom C 43' - hull/deck joint (toe rail replacement?)

[Leslie Paal via CnC-List]

Violeta,

based on the picture, I think you can clean up the corrosion and apply paint 
(Rustoleum was used successfully by some on the list).  They do not look 
structurally compromised, but of course the rails would have to be removed, 
inspected then replaced.  

C used butyl tape under those rails, and works well.

Leslie.


On Sun, 11/13/16, Violeta Ivanova via CnC-List  wrote:

 Subject: Re: Stus-List 1973 custom C 43' - hull/deck joint (toe rail 
replacement?)
 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
 Cc: "Violeta Ivanova" 
 Date: Sunday, November 13, 2016, 5:45 PM
 
 Gary, Leslie: thanks. As I understand,
 parts of the toe rail on our boat are also very worn out. To
 be honest, I never noticed, but I wasn't looking for it
 when I sailed the boat earlier this year. I am not near her
 at present. I am only helping with the research. 
 
 South Shore/Bob
 seems like an excellent resource. We'll check that out.
 
 
 How does one know if
 the old sealant is butyl or something else? Can you tell
 from this photo?
 
 https://www.dropbox.com/s/jdwc8k7tem6s39r/toerail1.jpg?dl=0
 
 The photo also
 shows how toe rail corrosion affects the topsides of our
 C 43. Repainting the topsides is on the to do list,
 too. 
 
 Violeta
 
 
 
 
 On Sun, Nov 13, 2016 at
 3:53 PM, Gary Nylander via CnC-List 
 wrote:
 I got a quote for on piece of toe
 rail from South Shore, that is Rob. It is an exact
 replacement for the bow piece of my rail, and is 15.5 feet
 long. I would take the old one off and look before spending
 the not trivial amount on a new one, you may have leaks
 because the original 40 year old butyl is
 gone. Gary From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-bounces@cnc-
 list.com] On Behalf Of Violeta Ivanova via
 CnC-List
 Sent: Sunday, November 13,
 2016 2:46 PM
 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
 Cc: Violeta Ivanova 
 Subject: Re: Stus-List 1973 custom
 C 43' - hull/deck joint (toe rail
 replacement?) Thanks, Bob. This is great
 information! I was wondering where one might find scale
 drawings. I will contact the museum.
 Good to hear removing the toe
 rail will not affect the joint structurally. I thought it
 might, but it doesn't seem to be the case.
  Thanks for all the links to
 vendors! I am replying here to everyone who responded, so I
 don't send multiple emails. 
 
 Ken - yes, it is the slotted aluminum toe rail.
 As far as I know, the reasons for replacement are leaks and
 corrosion. I was not involved in the decision to replace the
 toe rail. The C 43' belongs to my university, and
 I am one of her skippers. Great boat!
 
 I had not seen the do it yourself album yet -
 very useful, thanks. I am poking around the website now -
 great resource!
 
 We tried
 Holland Marine already, but they didn't have our toe
 rail. Rob McLaughlin and Klacko Spars are new names for me -
 thanks for the links. If anyone can think of other possible
 sources for that toe rail, please let me know.    
  Violeta 
   On Sun, Nov 13, 2016 at 10:19
 AM, robertlmazza via CnC-List 
 wrote:Violeta, All the drawings for the
 C 43 reside in the C collection in the archives
 if the Marine Museum of the Great Lakes at Kingston
 (Ontario). If you contact the museum curator through the
 website you can order a copy  of the construction plan
 which most likely show the toe rail and hull to deck joint.
 If you know which 43 you own (original name of boat or her
 first owner) you most can likely get copies of the drawings
 relating specifically to your
 43. However, merely removing and
 replacing the toe rail will not jeopardize the structural
 integrity of the hull to deck joint over that
 period. A replacement rail may be
 available from Rob McLaughlin at South Shore Yachts in St.
 Catherines, ON.  Rob
 Mazza  Sent from Samsung
 Mobile  Original message
 From: Violeta Ivanova via
 CnC-List Date:11-12-2016 2:19 PM
 (GMT-05:00) To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
 Cc: Violeta Ivanova
 Subject: Stus-List 1973
 custom C 43' - hull/deck joint (toe rail
 replacement?)  Greetings all.
 Might someone here help with
 questions about the custom C 43' from 1973? This
 was a limited edition and I think only fourteen boats were
 ever built. We would like to replace the toe rail on our
 boat, but are unsure how that might affect the hull/deck
 joint. 
 
 Some specific
 questions:1 - What is the structure of
 the hull/deck joint on the 1973 C 43'?
 2
 - How is the toe rail integrated with the hull/deck
 joint?3 - What happens if we remove
 the toe rail (or part of it)?
  Good advice will be
 appreciated.Thanks,Violeta
 
 
  
 
 __
 _
 
 This list
 is supported by the generous donations of our members. If
 you wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please
 go to:  https://www.paypal.me/
 stumurray
 
 All
 Contributions are greatly
 appreciated! 
 

Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

[Leslie Paal via CnC-List]

 and I doubt yours sails fast 12+ knots.

;-)

Leslie.


On Sun, 11/13/16, Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List  wrote:

 Subject: Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay
 To: "cnc-list@cnc-list.com" 
 Cc: "Ronald B. Frerker" 
 Date: Sunday, November 13, 2016, 9:06 PM
 
 Looks
 a lot like my regular C 30-1.  Sure hate to see
 prices that low.RonWild
 CheriSTL
 
 
 
   From: Dennis C. via
 CnC-List 
 
 To: CnClist
  
 Cc: Dennis C.
 
  Sent: Sunday, November
 13, 2016 7:04 PM
  Subject: Stus-List
 Awesome C race boat on eBay
   
 
 I
 want this!  Wonder what the PHRF rating is?  You'll
 win every regatta with this boat.
 
 
http://www.ebay.com/itm/30FT-C-C-RED-WING-SAILBOAT-SAILS-FAST-12-KNOTS-/322326679472?forcerrptr=true=item4b0c2acfb0:g:PHgAAOSwA3dYHUuD=322326679472
 
 Dennis C.
 Touche' 35-1 #83
 Mandeville, LA
 
 ___
 
 This list is supported by the
 generous donations of our members. If you wish to make a
 contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
 
 All Contributions are greatly
 appreciated!
 
 

 
 -Inline Attachment Follows-
 
 ___
 
 This list is supported by the
 generous donations of our members. If you wish to make a
 contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
 
 All Contributions are greatly
 appreciated!
 

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Stus-List 30-1 Mast Step Rebuild (was Re: Propeller)

[RANDY via CnC-List]

Thanks Ron. One question - how did you scribe the edges of the new third 
cross-member to the contours of the sump shoulders? 

Cheers, 
Randy 

- Original Message -

From: "Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List"  
To: "cnc-list"  
Cc: "Ronald B. Frerker"  
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2016 10:15:51 AM 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Propeller 

I only had two members holding up the block. When I replaced the horizontal 
plate the 2nd time (don't ask) I put in a 3rd, right between the two original 
members. Just like the originals, I cut and formed the 3rd to rest on the 
shoulder of the bilge sump. I used 2in thick paela (sp?) which is a mexican 
wood that's dense like ironwood and very oily. Mexicans use it for fence posts 
and it lasts a hundred years without rotting. It's hell to cut; broke a band 
saw blade and ruined two jig saw blades. Didn't do the table saw blade much 
good either. Maybe I should have found a better method for cutting??? 
The two originals were doubled marine plywood about 3/4in thick (1.5in total) 
sandwiched between two smaller metal trapezoids (leaving a 1in border of 
plywood) bolted through. They were getting soft in spots on top, but still had 
some integrity, so I left them alone. No sign of distortion where they rested 
on the shoulder. 
Used paela for the horizontal plate that the mast rests on as well. Been two 
years now and it's showing no deflection with rig tuned up. 
Ron 
Wild Cheri 
C 30-1 
STL 




From: RANDY via CnC-List  
To: cnc-list  
Cc: RANDY  
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 2:51 PM 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Propeller 

Thanks Gary. My RSA gives +6 for a fixed two-blade prop, and other guys in my 
club think a folding prop is worth even more than that. There's at least one 
RSA (NCPHRF I think) that gives +12. 

Thanks also for the info on the mast step. I'll go with three cross-members if 
I can, while still getting a pump into that sump and not covering up a keel 
bolt. Otherwise two non-rotting, non-deflecting cross-members made out of 
fiberglass board, and properly designed and installed, ought to be better than 
the original setup, and certainly better than my current two cross-members. 

Cheers, 
Randy 


From: "Gary Nylander via CnC-List"  
To: "cnc-list"  
Cc: "Gary Nylander"  
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 1:11:26 PM 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Propeller 

Our PHRF rules give you 3 seconds/mile for a fixed prop. I didn’t think that 
was enough, so went with a flex-o-fold. 
On the mast step, I have three cross members under the oak block (which looks 
just like yours) but do not have that big oak block assembly at all. I think 
some previous owner built that thing to make up for the lack of support and the 
fact that the fiberglass guys at the factory didn’t seal the bottom of the 
cross members, which do a great job of wicking up any stray water in the bilge. 
Gary 
#593 


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Re: Stus-List Ontario Sailor Magazine

[Allan Rheaume via CnC-List]

I read a few issues of this magazine, pretty well shows most of what you 
mentioned: cruising, racing, some maintenance articles and a 
classified/advertising section. Decent sailing magazine if your local to this 
area.
Allan RheaumeDrumroll 30-2



  From: Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List 
 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
Cc: Chuck Gilchrest 
 Sent: Monday, November 14, 2016 1:25 PM
 Subject: Stus-List Ontario Sailor Magazine
   
Canadian 
C owners,I was recently approached by a Canadian publication called Ontario 
Sailor regarding a request to advertise in their magazine.  Not being from the 
area, I’m unfamiliar with the publication and hoped that anyone on the list 
that subscribes or buys the magazine might give me some feedback regarding how 
it is viewed and what type of articles they tend to publish. Does the 
publication focus on cruising? Racing?  Dinghy events? DIY repairs?  Any 
feedback would be appreciated.  I’m not affiliated with the magazine in any way 
and if you prefer to contact me off list to keep your comments private, feel 
free to do so.csgilchr...@comcast.net  Thank you,Chuck GilchrestS/V Half 
Magic1983 35 LandfallPadanaram, MA
___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!


   ___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

They go 12 knots without a boom?
Good in 12 knots of wind maybe, but not GOING 12 knots LOL

Joe
Coquina
C 35 MK I
With a boom (so far)


From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Hoyt, Mike 
via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2016 14:19
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Hoyt, Mike 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

Gary

Hate to say it but there are two of “that thing” that race at my club in 
Barrachois Harbour against a number of 30s.  The two Redwing 30s tend to win 
far more often than the C 30s and we were often beat by one in particular.  
Yes they do better when there is at least 12 knots of wind but those venerable 
old C Redwing 30s can be a bitch to beat!

Mike
Persistence
Halifax

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Gary 
Nylander via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2016 3:13 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Gary Nylander
Subject: Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

Owning a 30, the only way that thing, even without a boom, could go 12 knots is 
off a cliff.

Gar

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Della Barba, 
Joe via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2016 9:53 AM
To: 'cnc-list@cnc-list.com' 
>
Cc: Della Barba, Joe >
Subject: Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

It takes some doing to get a 35 over 12 knots, so I am very impressed with 12 
knots and no boom on a 30!
Joe
Coquina
C 35 MK I
15 knots once or twice and we had a boom

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Chuck 
Gilchrest via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2016 09:44
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Chuck Gilchrest >
Subject: Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

Maybe it only sails fast in wind over 12 knots.  Not having a boom must cut 
down on windage.
Chuck Gilchrest
Half Magic
1983 LF 35
Padanaram, MA.

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dennis C. 
via CnC-List
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 8:05 PM
To: CnClist >
Cc: Dennis C. >
Subject: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

I want this!  Wonder what the PHRF rating is?  You'll win every regatta with 
this boat.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/30FT-C-C-RED-WING-SAILBOAT-SAILS-FAST-12-KNOTS-/322326679472?forcerrptr=true=item4b0c2acfb0:g:PHgAAOSwA3dYHUuD=322326679472
Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA
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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

Gary

Hate to say it but there are two of “that thing” that race at my club in 
Barrachois Harbour against a number of 30s.  The two Redwing 30s tend to win 
far more often than the C 30s and we were often beat by one in particular.  
Yes they do better when there is at least 12 knots of wind but those venerable 
old C Redwing 30s can be a bitch to beat!

Mike
Persistence
Halifax

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Gary 
Nylander via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2016 3:13 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Gary Nylander
Subject: Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

Owning a 30, the only way that thing, even without a boom, could go 12 knots is 
off a cliff.

Gar

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Della Barba, 
Joe via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2016 9:53 AM
To: 'cnc-list@cnc-list.com' 
>
Cc: Della Barba, Joe >
Subject: Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

It takes some doing to get a 35 over 12 knots, so I am very impressed with 12 
knots and no boom on a 30!
Joe
Coquina
C 35 MK I
15 knots once or twice and we had a boom

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Chuck 
Gilchrest via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2016 09:44
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Chuck Gilchrest >
Subject: Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

Maybe it only sails fast in wind over 12 knots.  Not having a boom must cut 
down on windage.
Chuck Gilchrest
Half Magic
1983 LF 35
Padanaram, MA.

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dennis C. 
via CnC-List
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 8:05 PM
To: CnClist >
Cc: Dennis C. >
Subject: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

I want this!  Wonder what the PHRF rating is?  You'll win every regatta with 
this boat.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/30FT-C-C-RED-WING-SAILBOAT-SAILS-FAST-12-KNOTS-/322326679472?forcerrptr=true=item4b0c2acfb0:g:PHgAAOSwA3dYHUuD=322326679472
Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA
___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

[Gary Nylander via CnC-List]

Owning a 30, the only way that thing, even without a boom, could go 12 knots is 
off a cliff.

 

Gar

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Della Barba, 
Joe via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2016 9:53 AM
To: 'cnc-list@cnc-list.com' 
Cc: Della Barba, Joe 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

 

It takes some doing to get a 35 over 12 knots, so I am very impressed with 12 
knots and no boom on a 30!

Joe

Coquina

C 35 MK I

15 knots once or twice and we had a boom

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Chuck 
Gilchrest via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2016 09:44
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com  
Cc: Chuck Gilchrest  >
Subject: Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

 

Maybe it only sails fast in wind over 12 knots.  Not having a boom must cut 
down on windage.

Chuck Gilchrest

Half Magic

1983 LF 35

Padanaram, MA.  

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dennis C. 
via CnC-List
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 8:05 PM
To: CnClist  >
Cc: Dennis C.  >
Subject: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

 

I want this!  Wonder what the PHRF rating is?  You'll win every regatta with 
this boat.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/30FT-C-C-RED-WING-SAILBOAT-SAILS-FAST-12-KNOTS-/322326679472?forcerrptr=true
 

 =item4b0c2acfb0:g:PHgAAOSwA3dYHUuD=322326679472

Dennis C.

Touche' 35-1 #83

Mandeville, LA

___

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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Propeller

[Charlie Nelson via CnC-List]

I have used a Gori geared folding 2 blade for the last 5+ years without a 
problem. It replaced a feathering 3 blade Maxi-prop which had been rebuilt once 
and was very tired.
 
Of course the 2 blade Gori does not have the thrust in reverse that my Max-prop 
had but I doubt that it is much less than other 2 blade props.
 
I went with it because the article in Yachting magazine showed via various 
tests that its drag when folded was practically zero, which was significantly 
lower than
any of its 2 blade folding competitors.

Charlie Nelson
Water Phantom
C 36 XL/kcb
New Bern, NC
 
cenel...@aol.com

 
 
-Original Message-
From: Gary Russell via CnC-List 
To: C List 
Cc: Gary Russell 
Sent: Mon, Nov 14, 2016 12:50 pm
Subject: Re: Stus-List Propeller



I've had Flexofold, Maxprop and Martec.  I would definitely stay away from 
Martec.  I don't like non-geared folding props.  If one blade doesn't open you 
can do a lot of damage, including bending the shaft.  I've done that with a 
Martec,  Maxprop is a very good prop but very expensive.  I like my now 
Flexofold and it seems to have the best review.  I have no experience with 
Gori, but it doesn't rate as well as the Flexifold.


Gary
S/V Kaylarah



~~~_/)~~




On Mon, Nov 14, 2016 at 12:37 PM, RANDY via CnC-List  
wrote:


Thanks Mike.  I'd like to see a dramatic difference myself :)



I'm getting quotes on new Flex-o-Folds, Goris, and Martecs, and seeing what's 
available on eBay.


Cheers,
Randy



From: "Mike via CnC-List Hoyt" 
To: "cnc-list" 
Cc: "Mike Hoyt" 
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2016 6:50:10 AM
Subject: Re: Stus-List Propeller




Hi Randy
 
A number of years ago friends that we race against switched from a fixed 2 
blade prop on an OMC saildrive installed in a C 25 to a folding propeller.  
The difference was dramatic.  I agree the performance increase will be more 
than 6 sec/mile.
 
We recently purchased a new propeller for Persistence.  The boat came to us 
with a  2 blade folding Martec propeller.  This is not geared so that the 
closing or opening of one blade is independent of the other.  In light winds 
this could often result in one blade hanging down in the open position.  We had 
great forward thrust with this prop but when shifting from forward to reverse 
it took a very long time to stop the boat (think docking).  We purchased a 
flex-o-fold 2 blade geared folding propeller.  There are other brands of geared 
folding propellers as well but it is important to have the gearing.  
Flex-o-fold was very good to deal with and spec’d out the appropriate prop 
based on the information I gave them (current prop make, diameter, pitch and 
rotation as well as boat model and engine model).  Once ordered the prop 
arrived from Denmark in just over three business days as advertised.  There was 
a COD payment at the door of $242 CAD (thanks UPS) but that was for our 
provincial sales tax.
 
Installation was very straight forward.  Removal of the old prop a bit 
difficult (needed a puller and some heat).
 
There is a link on the flex-o-fold site to a sailing magazine test of various 
folding and feathering props.  It is a good comparison. 
 
I feel that our new prop will be very slightly faster than the Martec while 
sailing but a whole lot better for motoring – especially in reverse.  Also 
supposed to have less vibration
 
Mike
Persistence
Halifax
 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com]On Behalf Of RANDY via 
CnC-List
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 4:51 PM
To: cnc-list
Cc: RANDY
Subject: Re: Stus-List Propeller

 

Thanks Gary.  My RSA gives +6 for a fixed two-blade prop, and other guys in my 
club think a folding prop is worth even more than that.  There's at least one 
RSA (NCPHRF I think) that gives +12.

 

Thanks also for the info on the mast step.  I'll go with three cross-members if 
I can, while still getting a pump into that sump and not covering up a keel 
bolt.  Otherwise two non-rotting, non-deflecting cross-members made out of 
fiberglass board, and properly designed and installed, ought to be better than 
the original setup, and certainly better than my current two cross-members.

 

Cheers,

Randy


___



This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray



All Contributions are greatly appreciated!





___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!





___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our 

Stus-List Ontario Sailor Magazine

[Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List]

Canadian C owners,

I was recently approached by a Canadian publication called Ontario Sailor
regarding a request to advertise in their magazine.  Not being from the
area, I'm unfamiliar with the publication and hoped that anyone on the list
that subscribes or buys the magazine might give me some feedback regarding
how it is viewed and what type of articles they tend to publish. 

Does the publication focus on cruising? Racing?  Dinghy events? DIY repairs?
Any feedback would be appreciated.  I'm not affiliated with the magazine in
any way and if you prefer to contact me off list to keep your comments
private, feel free to do so.

csgilchr...@comcast.net  

 

Thank you,

Chuck Gilchrest

S/V Half Magic

1983 35 Landfall

Padanaram, MA

___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Propeller

[Gary Russell via CnC-List]

I've had Flexofold, Maxprop and Martec.  I would definitely stay away from
Martec.  I don't like non-geared folding props.  If one blade doesn't open
you can do a lot of damage, including bending the shaft.  I've done that
with a Martec,  Maxprop is a very good prop but very expensive.  I like my
now Flexofold and it seems to have the best review.  I have no experience
with Gori, but it doesn't rate as well as the Flexifold.

Gary
S/V Kaylarah

~~~_/)~~


On Mon, Nov 14, 2016 at 12:37 PM, RANDY via CnC-List 
wrote:

> Thanks Mike.  I'd like to see a dramatic difference myself :)
>
> I'm getting quotes on new Flex-o-Folds, Goris, and Martecs, and seeing
> what's available on eBay.
>
> Cheers,
> Randy
>
> --
> *From: *"Mike via CnC-List Hoyt" 
> *To: *"cnc-list" 
> *Cc: *"Mike Hoyt" 
> *Sent: *Monday, November 14, 2016 6:50:10 AM
> *Subject: *Re: Stus-List Propeller
>
> Hi Randy
>
>
>
> A number of years ago friends that we race against switched from a fixed 2
> blade prop on an OMC saildrive installed in a C 25 to a folding
> propeller.  The difference was dramatic.  I agree the performance increase
> will be more than 6 sec/mile.
>
>
>
> We recently purchased a new propeller for Persistence.  The boat came to
> us with a  2 blade folding Martec propeller.  This is not geared so that
> the closing or opening of one blade is independent of the other.  In light
> winds this could often result in one blade hanging down in the open
> position.  We had great forward thrust with this prop but when shifting
> from forward to reverse it took a very long time to stop the boat (think
> docking).  We purchased a flex-o-fold 2 blade geared folding propeller.
> There are other brands of geared folding propellers as well but it is
> important to have the gearing.  Flex-o-fold was very good to deal with and
> spec’d out the appropriate prop based on the information I gave them
> (current prop make, diameter, pitch and rotation as well as boat model and
> engine model).  Once ordered the prop arrived from Denmark in just over
> three business days as advertised.  There was a COD payment at the door of
> $242 CAD (thanks UPS) but that was for our provincial sales tax.
>
>
>
> Installation was very straight forward.  Removal of the old prop a bit
> difficult (needed a puller and some heat).
>
>
>
> There is a link on the flex-o-fold site to a sailing magazine test of
> various folding and feathering props.  It is a good comparison.
>
>
>
> I feel that our new prop will be very slightly faster than the Martec
> while sailing but a whole lot better for motoring – especially in reverse.
> Also supposed to have less vibration
>
>
>
> Mike
>
> Persistence
>
> Halifax
>
>
>
> *From:* CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] *On Behalf Of *RANDY
> via CnC-List
> *Sent:* Sunday, November 13, 2016 4:51 PM
> *To:* cnc-list
> *Cc:* RANDY
> *Subject:* Re: Stus-List Propeller
>
>
>
> Thanks Gary.  My RSA gives +6 for a fixed two-blade prop, and other guys
> in my club think a folding prop is worth even more than that.  There's at
> least one RSA (NCPHRF I think) that gives +12.
>
>
>
> Thanks also for the info on the mast step.  I'll go with three
> cross-members if I can, while still getting a pump into that sump and not
> covering up a keel bolt.  Otherwise two non-rotting, non-deflecting
> cross-members made out of fiberglass board, and properly designed and
> installed, ought to be better than the original setup, and certainly better
> than my current two cross-members.
>
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Randy
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
>
___

This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!

Re: Stus-List Propeller

[RANDY via CnC-List]

Thanks Mike. I'd like to see a dramatic difference myself :) 

I'm getting quotes on new Flex-o-Folds, Goris, and Martecs, and seeing what's 
available on eBay. 

Cheers, 
Randy 

- Original Message -

From: "Mike via CnC-List Hoyt"  
To: "cnc-list"  
Cc: "Mike Hoyt"  
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2016 6:50:10 AM 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Propeller 



Hi Randy 



A number of years ago friends that we race against switched from a fixed 2 
blade prop on an OMC saildrive installed in a C 25 to a folding propeller. 
The difference was dramatic. I agree the performance increase will be more than 
6 sec/mile. 



We recently purchased a new propeller for Persistence. The boat came to us with 
a 2 blade folding Martec propeller. This is not geared so that the closing or 
opening of one blade is independent of the other. In light winds this could 
often result in one blade hanging down in the open position. We had great 
forward thrust with this prop but when shifting from forward to reverse it took 
a very long time to stop the boat (think docking). We purchased a flex-o-fold 2 
blade geared folding propeller. There are other brands of geared folding 
propellers as well but it is important to have the gearing. Flex-o-fold was 
very good to deal with and spec’d out the appropriate prop based on the 
information I gave them (current prop make, diameter, pitch and rotation as 
well as boat model and engine model). Once ordered the prop arrived from 
Denmark in just over three business days as advertised. There was a COD payment 
at the door of $242 CAD (thanks UPS) but that was for our provincial sales tax. 



Installation was very straight forward. Removal of the old prop a bit difficult 
(needed a puller and some heat). 



There is a link on the flex-o-fold site to a sailing magazine test of various 
folding and feathering props. It is a good comparison. 



I feel that our new prop will be very slightly faster than the Martec while 
sailing but a whole lot better for motoring – especially in reverse. Also 
supposed to have less vibration 



Mike 

Persistence 

Halifax 




From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of RANDY via 
CnC-List 
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 4:51 PM 
To: cnc-list 
Cc: RANDY 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Propeller 





Thanks Gary. My RSA gives +6 for a fixed two-blade prop, and other guys in my 
club think a folding prop is worth even more than that. There's at least one 
RSA (NCPHRF I think) that gives +12. 





Thanks also for the info on the mast step. I'll go with three cross-members if 
I can, while still getting a pump into that sump and not covering up a keel 
bolt. Otherwise two non-rotting, non-deflecting cross-members made out of 
fiberglass board, and properly designed and installed, ought to be better than 
the original setup, and certainly better than my current two cross-members. 





Cheers, 


Randy 

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Re: Stus-List Propeller

[Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List]

I only had two members holding up the block.  When I replaced the horizontal 
plate the 2nd time (don't ask) I put in a 3rd, right between the two original 
members.  Just like the originals, I cut and formed the 3rd to rest on the 
shoulder of the bilge sump.  I used 2in thick paela (sp?) which is a mexican 
wood that's dense like ironwood and very oily.  Mexicans use it for fence posts 
and it lasts a hundred years without rotting.  It's hell to cut; broke a band 
saw blade and ruined two jig saw blades.  Didn't do the table saw blade much 
good either.  Maybe I should have found a better method for cutting???The two 
originals were doubled marine plywood about 3/4in thick (1.5in total) 
sandwiched between two smaller metal trapezoids (leaving a 1in border of 
plywood) bolted through.  They were getting soft in spots on top, but still had 
some integrity, so I left them alone.  No sign of distortion where they rested 
on the shoulder.Used paela for the horizontal plate that the mast rests on as 
well.  Been two years now and it's showing no deflection with rig tuned 
up.RonWild CheriC 30-1STL


  From: RANDY via CnC-List 
 To: cnc-list  
Cc: RANDY 
 Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 2:51 PM
 Subject: Re: Stus-List Propeller
   
Thanks Gary.  My RSA gives +6 for a fixed two-blade prop, and other guys in my 
club think a folding prop is worth even more than that.  There's at least one 
RSA (NCPHRF I think) that gives +12.

Thanks also for the info on the mast step.  I'll go with three cross-members if 
I can, while still getting a pump into that sump and not covering up a keel 
bolt.  Otherwise two non-rotting, non-deflecting cross-members made out of 
fiberglass board, and properly designed and installed, ought to be better than 
the original setup, and certainly better than my current two cross-members.
Cheers,Randy
From: "Gary Nylander via CnC-List" 
To: "cnc-list" 
Cc: "Gary Nylander" 
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 1:11:26 PM
Subject: Re: Stus-List Propeller

#yiv1369932643 #yiv1369932643 _filtered #yiv1369932643 
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.yiv1369932643MsoChpDefault {font-size:10.0pt;} _filtered #yiv1369932643 
{margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}#yiv1369932643 div.yiv1369932643WordSection1 
{}#yiv1369932643 Our PHRF rules give you 3 seconds/mile for a fixed prop. I 
didn’t think that was enough, so went with a flex-o-fold. On the mast step, I 
have three cross members under the oak block (which looks just like yours) but 
do not have that big oak block assembly at all. I think some previous owner 
built that thing to make up for the lack of support and the fact that the 
fiberglass guys at the factory didn’t seal the bottom of the cross members, 
which do a great job of wicking up any stray water in the bilge. Gary#593 
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Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

[Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List]

It takes some doing to get a 35 over 12 knots, so I am very impressed with 12 
knots and no boom on a 30!
Joe
Coquina
C 35 MK I
15 knots once or twice and we had a boom

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Chuck 
Gilchrest via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2016 09:44
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Chuck Gilchrest 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

Maybe it only sails fast in wind over 12 knots.  Not having a boom must cut 
down on windage.
Chuck Gilchrest
Half Magic
1983 LF 35
Padanaram, MA.

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dennis C. 
via CnC-List
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 8:05 PM
To: CnClist >
Cc: Dennis C. >
Subject: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

I want this!  Wonder what the PHRF rating is?  You'll win every regatta with 
this boat.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/30FT-C-C-RED-WING-SAILBOAT-SAILS-FAST-12-KNOTS-/322326679472?forcerrptr=true=item4b0c2acfb0:g:PHgAAOSwA3dYHUuD=322326679472
Dennis C.
Touche' 35-1 #83
Mandeville, LA
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Re: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

[Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List]

Maybe it only sails fast in wind over 12 knots.  Not having a boom must cut 
down on windage.

Chuck Gilchrest

Half Magic

1983 LF 35

Padanaram, MA.  

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Dennis C. 
via CnC-List
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 8:05 PM
To: CnClist 
Cc: Dennis C. 
Subject: Stus-List Awesome C race boat on eBay

 

I want this!  Wonder what the PHRF rating is?  You'll win every regatta with 
this boat.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/30FT-C-C-RED-WING-SAILBOAT-SAILS-FAST-12-KNOTS-/322326679472?forcerrptr=true
 

 =item4b0c2acfb0:g:PHgAAOSwA3dYHUuD=322326679472

Dennis C.

Touche' 35-1 #83

Mandeville, LA

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Re: Stus-List Switching to rope halyards

[Chuck Gilchrest via CnC-List]

There’s a fair amount to be considered choosing one high modulus fiber over 
another for running rigging.  I’ve copied some descriptions that were part of a 
study looking at the compatibility of various ropes for static load lifting in 
a mountaineering environment:

 

Kevlar:
Kevlar was one of the first high-strength fibers to be used in rope. It still 
offers high tensile strength and very low elongation, but has poor fatigue 
properties. The fibers inside the rope abrade each other, offering little 
indication of the reduced strength until the rope breaks. Kevlar has a very 
high melting point, 500 °C or 932 °F. Kevlar-core ropes are sold as escape 
lines for firefighters - to be used once and discarded. Manufacturers have had 
some success at solving the self-abrasion problem by combining Kevlar with 
Spectra. 

Technora:
Technora, like Kevlar, is an aramid, but with vastly improved fatigue 
properties. It shares Kevlar's high tensile strength and high melting point. 

Spectra:
Spectra is a very high molecular density form of polyethylene - the same thing 
used to make grocery bags, six-pack carriers and milk jugs. The manufacturing 
process aligns the molecules, which vastly increases the strength of the 
material. It is twice as strong as hardened steel (per unit area) and one-tenth 
the density. Spectra has several difficult issues. The melting point is very 
low, 147 °C or 297 °F, not much warmer than boiling water. The material is 
unbelievably slippery, which makes it difficult for manufacturers to form into 
a workable rope. And, while the modulus of the fibers is comparable to steel, 
they slowly elongate under a continuous load. This process is called "creep." 
It is mostly irrelevant to climbers, but annoying to sailors. Spectra/Nylon is 
also known as Dyneema (a trade name of Beal Ropes) in Europe. 

Vectran:
Vectran is a liquid crystal polymer - its properties are between those of 
crystalline solids and liquids. It has similar strength to Spectra, but without 
the creep problems. It has poor UV resistance, which is not a problem when used 
as the core in kernmantel rope construction.  

 

While not specifically applied to sailing, it still weighs the plusses and 
minuses of each fiber.  How you choose is relative to the application.  When 
looking at how a rope fails, remember that friction results in far more rope 
failures than breakage due to elongation, thus buying a rope with better 
abrasion resistance may ultimately yield the stronger rope in a yachting 
application.  Also, remember that in a double braided rope, friction occurs 
within the rope, not solely on the cover.

 

Cost can be a deciding factor too.   For recreational sailors, buying a blended 
core rope will give sufficient performance without breaking the bank.

Chuck Gilchrest

S/V Half Magic

1983 35 Landfall

Padanaram, MA

 

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Gary Russell 
via CnC-List
Sent: Monday, November 14, 2016 7:24 AM
To: C List 
Cc: Gary Russell 
Subject: Re: Stus-List Switching to rope halyards

 

My rigger recommended Technora over Dyneema.  I think they said it was a 
durability issue, but not sure.  So far, I'm happy with the Technora over wire. 
 They bulked up the genoa halyard in the clutch area.  That seemed to work 
well, also.  Remember to take those lines down for the winter and replace with 
tag lines.  I must say, they don't give that stuff away!

 

Gary

S/V Kaylarah

'90 C 37+

East Greenwich, RI, USA




~~~_/)~~

 

 

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Re: Stus-List Propeller

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

Hi Randy

A number of years ago friends that we race against switched from a fixed 2 
blade prop on an OMC saildrive installed in a C 25 to a folding propeller.  
The difference was dramatic.  I agree the performance increase will be more 
than 6 sec/mile.

We recently purchased a new propeller for Persistence.  The boat came to us 
with a  2 blade folding Martec propeller.  This is not geared so that the 
closing or opening of one blade is independent of the other.  In light winds 
this could often result in one blade hanging down in the open position.  We had 
great forward thrust with this prop but when shifting from forward to reverse 
it took a very long time to stop the boat (think docking).  We purchased a 
flex-o-fold 2 blade geared folding propeller.  There are other brands of geared 
folding propellers as well but it is important to have the gearing.  
Flex-o-fold was very good to deal with and spec’d out the appropriate prop 
based on the information I gave them (current prop make, diameter, pitch and 
rotation as well as boat model and engine model).  Once ordered the prop 
arrived from Denmark in just over three business days as advertised.  There was 
a COD payment at the door of $242 CAD (thanks UPS) but that was for our 
provincial sales tax.

Installation was very straight forward.  Removal of the old prop a bit 
difficult (needed a puller and some heat).

There is a link on the flex-o-fold site to a sailing magazine test of various 
folding and feathering props.  It is a good comparison.

I feel that our new prop will be very slightly faster than the Martec while 
sailing but a whole lot better for motoring – especially in reverse.  Also 
supposed to have less vibration

Mike
Persistence
Halifax

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of RANDY via 
CnC-List
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 4:51 PM
To: cnc-list
Cc: RANDY
Subject: Re: Stus-List Propeller

Thanks Gary.  My RSA gives +6 for a fixed two-blade prop, and other guys in my 
club think a folding prop is worth even more than that.  There's at least one 
RSA (NCPHRF I think) that gives +12.

Thanks also for the info on the mast step.  I'll go with three cross-members if 
I can, while still getting a pump into that sump and not covering up a keel 
bolt.  Otherwise two non-rotting, non-deflecting cross-members made out of 
fiberglass board, and properly designed and installed, ought to be better than 
the original setup, and certainly better than my current two cross-members.

Cheers,
Randy
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make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List Thinking of a Wheel to Tiller Conversion

[Hoyt, Mike via CnC-List]

Rod

Another thought entirely.  Rather than convert to wheel why not run jib sheets 
back to where spinnaker winches are normally located?  If you do not have the 
second set of winches you could add them since there is a spot on most C for 
them to be mounted.  Many people sailing short handed prefer this setup.

Mike
Persistence
Halifax, NS

From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of roderick 
anderson via CnC-List
Sent: Friday, November 11, 2016 8:31 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: roderick anderson
Subject: Re: Stus-List Thinking of a Wheel to Tiller Conversion


Colin, thanks for the welcome! Chuck, I'm not totally married to the tiller 
idea but find the wheel a real nuisance when trying to get to the sheets. I do 
have an Autohelm 3000 that came with the boat so maybe that could help. David, 
I do have the emergency tiller for the boat but it looks like a big vertical 
crank with a square drive on the end. I can't imagine trying to steer with it 
for any length of time. Thanks everyone for the ideas and input!
Rod
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Re: Stus-List Cleat "covers"

[Joel Aronson via CnC-List]

Duct tape.
Joel

On Sunday, November 13, 2016, Eric Baumes via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> I use these
> http://www.solvingideas.com/index.html
> and they work really well. they do wear out after a season or two.
>
> Eric Baumes
> 34/36+
>
> On Sun, Nov 13, 2016 at 5:04 PM, Josh Muckley via CnC-List <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> > wrote:
>
>> Someone on the list found a bunch of cleat chocks on their boat after
>> purchasing.  They were made of wood, could've even been homemade.  They
>> couldn't figure out what they were so they asked the list.  Looked similar
>> to the ones from APS.
>>
>> Josh Muckley
>> S/V Sea Hawk
>> 1989 C 37+
>> Solomons, MD
>>
>> On Nov 13, 2016 4:30 PM, "Ken Heaton via CnC-List" > > wrote:
>>
>> A USA source for the second one I included in my previous email:
>>
>> http://www.apsltd.com/cleat-chocks-pair.html
>>
>> Ken H.
>>
>> On 13 November 2016 at 17:23, Ken Heaton > > wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> On 13 November 2016 at 16:37, Charlie Nelson via CnC-List <
>>> cnc-list@cnc-list.com
>>> > wrote:
>>>
 cleat covers
>>>
>>>
>>> Charlie,
>>>
>>> Would something like this work?
>>>
>>> http://www.solvingideas.com/index.html
>>>
>>> or this?
>>>
>>> http://www.yachtingsolutions.co.uk/cleat-boot-cleat-cover-2-
>>> pack.ir?cName=boat-classes-squib-accessories
>>>
>>> Ken H.
>>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>>
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
>> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>>
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
>> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>>
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>>
>>
>

-- 
Joel
301 541 8551
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Re: Stus-List Switching to rope halyards

[Gary Russell via CnC-List]

My rigger recommended Technora over Dyneema.  I think they said it was a
durability issue, but not sure.  So far, I'm happy with the Technora over
wire.  They bulked up the genoa halyard in the clutch area.  That seemed to
work well, also.  Remember to take those lines down for the winter and
replace with tag lines.  I must say, they don't give that stuff away!

Gary
S/V Kaylarah
'90 C 37+
East Greenwich, RI, USA

~~~_/)~~


On Sun, Nov 13, 2016 at 12:49 PM, Steve Thomas via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Regarding wraps, the Harken halyard restrainer is not specific to Harken
> furlers, it is just a small block with a V shaped sheeve that mounts on the
> mast. I used one to good effect with a Hood 810 furler.
>
> Steve Thomas
> C MKIII
> Port Stanley, ON
>
>  Derek McLeod via CnC-List  wrote:
> Indeed the headsail was shorter than the one it replaced and this led to
> the wrap. I had a wire pennant made up to sort that. No wraps since then.
>
> I'll take a look at zepherworks.
>
> Any line that I should look at for this? I have little knowledge in that
> realm.
>
> Derek McLeod
> Aileron, 1983 C 29-2
> Toronto
>
> > On Nov 12, 2016, at 7:32 PM, Josh Muckley  wrote:
> >
> > I switched to all rope halyards and haven't looked back.
> >
> > Your sheeves at the top are probably 'V' shaped and can box the rope
> halyard.  That is the least of your concerns.  There is a chance that they
> are chewed up from years of service with a wire rope.  Zepherworks.com is
> the place to go for new ones.
> >
> > Additional if you had a wrap on the furler you need to find out why.
> Wraps usually only happen because the halyard is leading to the furler
> swivel at too shallow of an angle.  The halyard may have been removed and
> re-fed incorrectly.  It is also possible to have a headsail that isn't
> hoisted all the way or has a short luff.   Even sails with too short of a
> luff can be flown as long as they have a tack line added to allow full
> hoist.  Otherwise the halyard angle becomes too shallow.
> >
> > Occasionally I'll have a brain fart and not pull the spinnaker halyard
> back to the mast when I'm trying to furl.  The spin halyard gets wrapped
> quick!
> >
> > Josh Muckley
> > S/V Sea Hawk
> > 1989 C 37+
> > Solomons, MD
> >
> >
> > On Nov 12, 2016 7:16 PM, "Derek McLeod via CnC-List" <
> cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > Anyone have experience going from wire/rope halyards to all rope? One of
> my two wire genoa halyards got twisted around the furler this spring
> prompting me to want to replace them.
> >
> > I gather I have to investigate the mast sheaves to see if they are
> appropriate for the job. On the cabin top I have 2 double Lewmar clutches
> on each side. The only marking I could find on them is 9.5-12, which I
> assume is the line size range in mm. From what I have read, if I use a
> smaller dyneema line, it can be bulked up in the clutch area. Any other
> tips or considerations?
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Derek McLeod
> >
> > Aileron, 1983 C 29-2
> > Toronto
> > ___
> >
> > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> >
> > All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> >
>
>
> ___
>
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you
> wish to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
>
> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
>
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Re: Stus-List 1973 custom C 43' - hull/deck joint (toe rail replacement?)

[Michael Clow via CnC-List]

I rebidded the aft half of my toe rail three years ago and the leaks stopped.  
The link below show a diagram from C of my joint along with a few comments I 
made after doing the job.

http://desiresailing.org/ToeRailJointDiagram.pdf

Michael Clow
Desire, C 32, Lake St. Clair



-Original Message-
From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Leslie Paal 
via CnC-List
Sent: Sunday, November 13, 2016 3:49 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Cc: Leslie Paal
Subject: Re: Stus-List 1973 custom C 43' - hull/deck joint (toe rail 
replacement?)

In this case you do not need to replace the toe rail, just re-bed it after 
cleaning up everything.  Still a major job.

Leslie.
Phoenix C 1983


On Sun, 11/13/16, Violeta Ivanova via CnC-List  wrote:

 Subject: Re: Stus-List 1973 custom C 43' - hull/deck joint (toe rail 
replacement?)
 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
 Cc: "Violeta Ivanova" 
 Date: Sunday, November 13, 2016, 11:45 AM
 
 Thanks, Bob. This is
 great information! I was wondering where one might find  scale drawings. I 
will contact the museum. 
 
 Good to hear removing
 the toe rail will not affect the joint structurally. I  thought it might, but 
it doesn't seem to be the case.
 
 
 Thanks for all
 the links to vendors! I am replying here to everyone who  responded, so I 
don't send multiple emails. 
 
 Ken - yes, it is the slotted
 aluminum toe rail. As far as I know, the reasons for  replacement are leaks 
and corrosion. I was not involved in  the decision to replace the toe rail. The 
C 43'
 belongs to my university, and I am one of her skippers.
 Great boat!
 
 I had not seen
 the do it yourself album yet - very useful, thanks. I am  poking around  the 
website now - great resource!
 
 We tried Holland Marine already, but they  didn't have our toe rail. Rob 
McLaughlin and Klacko  Spars are new names for me - thanks for the links. If 
anyone  can think of other possible sources for that toe rail,  please let me 
know. 
 
 Violeta  
 
 
 
 On Sun, Nov 13, 2016 at
 10:19 AM, robertlmazza via CnC-List 
 wrote:
 Violeta,
 All the drawings for the C 43
 reside in the C collection in the archives if the  Marine Museum of the 
Great Lakes at Kingston (Ontario). If  you contact the museum curator through 
the website you can  order a copy  of the construction plan which most likely  
show the toe rail and hull to deck joint. If you know which
 43 you own (original name of boat or her first owner) you  most can likely get 
copies of the drawings relating  specifically to your 43.
 However, merely removing and
 replacing the toe rail will not jeopardize the structural  integrity of the 
hull to deck joint over that  period.
 A replacement
 rail may be available from Rob McLaughlin at South Shore  Yachts in St. 
Catherines, ON.
 
 Rob
 Mazza
 
 Sent from Samsung
 Mobile
 
  Original
 message From: Violeta Ivanova via  CnC-List  Date:11-12-2016  2:19 PM
 (GMT-05:00) To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
 Cc: Violeta Ivanova  Subject:
 Stus-List 1973 custom C 43' - hull/deck joint (toe  rail replacement?)  
Greetings all.
 
 
 Might someone here
 help with questions about the custom C 43' from
 1973? This was a limited edition and I think only fourteen
 boats were ever built. We would like to replace the toe rail
 on our boat, but are unsure how that might affect the
 hull/deck joint. 
 
 Some
 specific questions:
 
 1
 - What is the structure of the hull/deck joint on the 1973
 C 43'? 
 2 - How is the toe
 rail integrated with the hull/deck joint?
 3 - What happens if we remove the toe
 rail (or part of it)? 
 
 Good advice will be appreciated.
 
 Thanks,
 
 Violeta
 
 
 
   
 
 
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All Contributions are greatly appreciated!


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This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish to 
make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray

All Contributions are greatly appreciated!