Stus-List Re: Racing at night

[Bruno Lachance via CnC-List]

Great writing Martin. Thanks for sharing.

Bruno Lachance
Bécassine 33-2

Envoyé de mon iPhone

Le 26 févr. 2023 à 17:47, Martin DeYoung via CnC-List  a 
écrit :


“A masthead wind instrument works at night.”

Absolutely, except when it doesn’t.  During the 1982 Vic-Maui race on a Britt 
Chance designed 54’ IOR boat in trade winds reinforced by a tropical storm 
nearby (steady high 20’s, gusts to mid 30’s) the wind instruments were lagging 
behind the actual apparent wind enough that we needed to improvise.  It was the 
kind of dark wild night that made Mister Toad’s Wild ride seem tame.  We had a 
reaching spinnaker up (slightly smaller sq area and shoulders) with a full 
mainsail. AWA of 160 was our target.  Boat speeds were running in the low teens 
until a good surf then headed into the high teens.

I was watch captain with two other, experience crew on deck.  We were quickly 
schooled by the wind gods that relying on the wind instruments resulted in 
being caught by the lee at the end of a surf. (The apparent wind goes forward 
while surfing then quickly back to “base line” when the boat slows.)  Naturally 
being caught by the lee in those conditions often resulted in a spin 
out/round-up/broach, mostly to weather. (Spin pole up, boom in the water.)  The 
owner would occasionally stick his head up from below complaining about the 
ride.  I would suggest we were at the top of the spinnaker’s wind range. He 
would indicate maybe we needed better drivers.)

On this particular night we resorted to dividing up the information processing 
tasks.  The helmsman concentrated on the compass using a base line course as a 
guide.  Another crew concentrated on calling out AWA as shown by the lighted 
Windex. (Usually something like “5 high” or similar.  When the Windex indicated 
we were by the lee a noise similar to an aircraft’s stall warning buzzer was 
used.)  Driving was intense enough we stood ½ hour tricks rotating through the 
positions.  This technique allowed us to sail fast, diving deep to ride the 
best waves and limit the spin outs to mostly gentle low impact events.

Until it doesn’t.  At the end of our watch (+-2AM) the new watch gains the deck 
and includes the “hired gun” rock star sailmaker helmsman.  The rock star guy 
total ignored my recommendations on how we got through the last 4 hours.  He 
steps behind the wheel (a very large diameter wheel popular with IOR boats) and 
starts sailing like he was in charge.  Shortly there after he drives into a 
leeward broach that lays the boat flat enough that the mast head was hitting 
the top of waves and most of the deck crew was left hanging by safety 
harnesses.  I imagine it was exciting down below.  The rock star lost his 
footing and rotated “ass over tea kettle” into the leeward corner of the 
cockpit. (Still holding the wheel.)  The mainsail attempted to cross to leeward 
but was trapped by a line wrapped around a coffee grinder winch handle.

As I was in the mid/crew cockpit and closest to the line trapping the mainsail 
I pulled out my trusty sailing knife and cut the line (line was part of a 
failed preventer).  As soon as my knife blade touched the highly loaded line 
the mainsail violently crossed to leeward splashing into the water. Now that 
the boat was freed of the tangled mainsail load it stood up straight (ish), the 
spinnaker popped full, and the boat took off downwind.  Unfortunately the rock 
star was totally disoriented, the rudder still hard over and the boat went into 
another broach therefore completing the coveted “banana split”.

Once we got the boat sorted and back on its feet the owner stuck his head up 
from down below and said “OK boys we can take the spinnaker down now”.  We 
spent the next day or so under twin headsails still making speeds in the low 
teens but under much better control.

Martin DeYoung
Calypso
1971 C 43
Port Ludlow/Seattle

Sent from Mail for Windows

From: dwight veinot via CnC-List
Sent: Sunday, February 26, 2023 12:54 PM
To: Stus-List
Cc: dwight veinot
Subject: Stus-List Re: Racing at night

A masthead wind instrument works at night. Learn your sail trim vs wind speed 
and wind angle in the daylight. Should be the same in the dark

On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 1:01 PM David Knecht via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
I just read an interesting article in Practical Sailor on red vs. white lights 
and night vision.  It reminded me to ask a question of those more experienced 
about night racing.  I have only done this a few times and found upwind 
steering at night to be a real challenge.  I normally steer by the genoa 
telltales.  In light, shifting winds which we inevitably encounter at the 
darkest hours, it is especially important to steer well to keep the boat 
moving, but it is hard.   We used a hand held spotlight to periodically check 
the 

Stus-List Re: Racing at night

[Don Kern via CnC-List]

Martin,

I found a lot of humor in your description in that I pulled a similar 
stunt with a Naval Academy 44 yawl racing from Biloxi to Isla Mujeres 
Mexico. Just NW of Cuba (1967), hit by a squall at oh-dark-thirty, 
spreaders in water, cut spin halyard.  In that race, the only time we 
had significant wind was at night.  We laugh after the fact.


Don Kern
C Mk2, /Fireball/
Bristol, RI


On 2/26/2023 5:46 PM, Martin DeYoung via CnC-List wrote:


“A masthead wind instrument works at night.”

Absolutely, except when it doesn’t.  During the 1982 Vic-Maui race on 
a Britt Chance designed 54’ IOR boat in trade winds reinforced by a 
tropical storm nearby (steady high 20’s, gusts to mid 30’s) the wind 
instruments were lagging behind the actual apparent wind enough that 
we needed to improvise.  It was the kind of dark wild night that made 
Mister Toad’s Wild ride seem tame.  We had a reaching spinnaker up 
(slightly smaller sq area and shoulders) with a full mainsail. AWA of 
160 was our target.  Boat speeds were running in the low teens until a 
good surf then headed into the high teens.


I was watch captain with two other, experience crew on deck.  We were 
quickly schooled by the wind gods that relying on the wind instruments 
resulted in being caught by the lee at the end of a surf. (The 
apparent wind goes forward while surfing then quickly back to “base 
line” when the boat slows.)  Naturally being caught by the lee in 
those conditions often resulted in a spin out/round-up/broach, mostly 
to weather. (Spin pole up, boom in the water.)  The owner would 
occasionally stick his head up from below complaining about the ride. 
 I would suggest we were at the top of the spinnaker’s wind range. He 
would indicate maybe we needed better drivers.)


On this particular night we resorted to dividing up the information 
processing tasks.  The helmsman concentrated on the compass using a 
base line course as a guide.  Another crew concentrated on calling out 
AWA as shown by the lighted Windex. (Usually something like “5 high” 
or similar.  When the Windex indicated we were by the lee a noise 
similar to an aircraft’s stall warning buzzer was used.) Driving was 
intense enough we stood ½ hour tricks rotating through the positions.  
This technique allowed us to sail fast, diving deep to ride the best 
waves and limit the spin outs to mostly gentle low impact events.


Until it doesn’t.  At the end of our watch (+-2AM) the new watch gains 
the deck and includes the “hired gun” rock star sailmaker helmsman.  
The rock star guy total ignored my recommendations on how we got 
through the last 4 hours.  He steps behind the wheel (a very large 
diameter wheel popular with IOR boats) and starts sailing like he was 
in charge.  Shortly there after he drives into a leeward broach that 
lays the boat flat enough that the mast head was hitting the top of 
waves and most of the deck crew was left hanging by safety harnesses.  
I imagine it was exciting down below.  The rock star lost his footing 
and rotated “ass over tea kettle” into the leeward corner of the 
cockpit. (Still holding the wheel.)  The mainsail attempted to cross 
to leeward but was trapped by a line wrapped around a coffee grinder 
winch handle.


As I was in the mid/crew cockpit and closest to the line trapping the 
mainsail I pulled out my trusty sailing knife and cut the line (line 
was part of a failed preventer).  As soon as my knife blade touched 
the highly loaded line the mainsail violently crossed to leeward 
splashing into the water. Now that the boat was freed of the tangled 
mainsail load it stood up straight (ish), the spinnaker popped full, 
and the boat took off downwind. Unfortunately the rock star was 
totally disoriented, the rudder still hard over and the boat went into 
another broach therefore completing the coveted “banana split”.


Once we got the boat sorted and back on its feet the owner stuck his 
head up from down below and said “OK boys we can take the spinnaker 
down now”.  We spent the next day or so under twin headsails still 
making speeds in the low teens but under much better control.


Martin DeYoung

Calypso

1971 C 43

Port Ludlow/Seattle

Sent from Mail  for 
Windows


*From: *dwight veinot via CnC-List 
*Sent: *Sunday, February 26, 2023 12:54 PM
*To: *Stus-List 
*Cc: *dwight veinot 
*Subject: *Stus-List Re: Racing at night

A masthead wind instrument works at night. Learn your sail trim vs 
wind speed and wind angle in the daylight. Should be the same in the dark


On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 1:01 PM David Knecht via CnC-List 
 wrote:


I just read an interesting article in Practical Sailor on red vs.
white lights and night vision.  It reminded me to ask a question
of those more experienced about night racing.  I have only done
this a few times and found upwind steering at 

Stus-List Re: Racing at night

[Dave S via CnC-List]

Lol….  Really great writeup Martin, thanks.

For my fellow mere mortals I’ll chime in to support for the masthead 
light/windex reflector approach.  I discovered it by accident one blustery 
night, works well.  

Dave 33-2 windstar.  


Sent from my iPhone

> On Feb 26, 2023, at 5:47 PM, Martin DeYoung via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> “A masthead wind instrument works at night.”
>  
> Absolutely, except when it doesn’t.  During the 1982 Vic-Maui race on a Britt 
> Chance designed 54’ IOR boat in trade winds reinforced by a tropical storm 
> nearby (steady high 20’s, gusts to mid 30’s) the wind instruments were 
> lagging behind the actual apparent wind enough that we needed to improvise.  
> It was the kind of dark wild night that made Mister Toad’s Wild ride seem 
> tame.  We had a reaching spinnaker up (slightly smaller sq area and 
> shoulders) with a full mainsail. AWA of 160 was our target.  Boat speeds were 
> running in the low teens until a good surf then headed into the high teens.
>  
> I was watch captain with two other, experience crew on deck.  We were quickly 
> schooled by the wind gods that relying on the wind instruments resulted in 
> being caught by the lee at the end of a surf. (The apparent wind goes forward 
> while surfing then quickly back to “base line” when the boat slows.)  
> Naturally being caught by the lee in those conditions often resulted in a 
> spin out/round-up/broach, mostly to weather. (Spin pole up, boom in the 
> water.)  The owner would occasionally stick his head up from below 
> complaining about the ride.  I would suggest we were at the top of the 
> spinnaker’s wind range. He would indicate maybe we needed better drivers.)
>  
> On this particular night we resorted to dividing up the information 
> processing tasks.  The helmsman concentrated on the compass using a base line 
> course as a guide.  Another crew concentrated on calling out AWA as shown by 
> the lighted Windex. (Usually something like “5 high” or similar.  When the 
> Windex indicated we were by the lee a noise similar to an aircraft’s stall 
> warning buzzer was used.)  Driving was intense enough we stood ½ hour tricks 
> rotating through the positions.  This technique allowed us to sail fast, 
> diving deep to ride the best waves and limit the spin outs to mostly gentle 
> low impact events.
>  
> Until it doesn’t.  At the end of our watch (+-2AM) the new watch gains the 
> deck and includes the “hired gun” rock star sailmaker helmsman.  The rock 
> star guy total ignored my recommendations on how we got through the last 4 
> hours.  He steps behind the wheel (a very large diameter wheel popular with 
> IOR boats) and starts sailing like he was in charge.  Shortly there after he 
> drives into a leeward broach that lays the boat flat enough that the mast 
> head was hitting the top of waves and most of the deck crew was left hanging 
> by safety harnesses.  I imagine it was exciting down below.  The rock star 
> lost his footing and rotated “ass over tea kettle” into the leeward corner of 
> the cockpit. (Still holding the wheel.)  The mainsail attempted to cross to 
> leeward but was trapped by a line wrapped around a coffee grinder winch 
> handle.
>  
> As I was in the mid/crew cockpit and closest to the line trapping the 
> mainsail I pulled out my trusty sailing knife and cut the line (line was part 
> of a failed preventer).  As soon as my knife blade touched the highly loaded 
> line the mainsail violently crossed to leeward splashing into the water. Now 
> that the boat was freed of the tangled mainsail load it stood up straight 
> (ish), the spinnaker popped full, and the boat took off downwind.  
> Unfortunately the rock star was totally disoriented, the rudder still hard 
> over and the boat went into another broach therefore completing the coveted 
> “banana split”.
>  
> Once we got the boat sorted and back on its feet the owner stuck his head up 
> from down below and said “OK boys we can take the spinnaker down now”.  We 
> spent the next day or so under twin headsails still making speeds in the low 
> teens but under much better control.
>  
> Martin DeYoung
> Calypso
> 1971 C 43
> Port Ludlow/Seattle
>  
> Sent from Mail for Windows
>  
> From: dwight veinot via CnC-List
> Sent: Sunday, February 26, 2023 12:54 PM
> To: Stus-List
> Cc: dwight veinot
> Subject: Stus-List Re: Racing at night
>  
> A masthead wind instrument works at night. Learn your sail trim vs wind speed 
> and wind angle in the daylight. Should be the same in the dark
>  
> On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 1:01 PM David Knecht via CnC-List 
>  wrote:
> I just read an interesting article in Practical Sailor on red vs. white 
> lights and night vision.  It reminded me to ask a question of those more 
> experienced about night racing.  I have only done this a few times and found 
> upwind steering at night to be a real challenge.  I normally steer by the 
> genoa telltales.  In light, shifting winds which we inevitably 

Stus-List Re: Secondary winches

[Don Kern via CnC-List]

Peter,

I have a C 35-2 with approx. the same fore triangle.  The boat has 
Barient 28s (aft) as primaries and Barient 26s as secondaries (fwd on 
cockpit coaming).  In light to moderate there is no problem with the 
secondaries being used for spin guys and sheets and for doing headsail 
changes. The only con with my setup is that the spin sheet are lead from 
blocks in the aft most position on the rail to the forward secondaries, 
thus are kept aft going upwind and in seting up for the spin run have to 
be rigged over working genoa sheet.  There is no problem with the guys 
since the come aboard amidship, run inboard under the genoa sheets and 
dropped down the companionway.  In preparing for a spin run they are 
just pulled up from the companion way and placed on the secondaries. In 
heavy air we put the spin sheet on the primary, and keep the guys on the 
secondaries. In really heavy air we will switch to the primaries for 
both the spin guy and sheets.


Don kern
C Mk2, /Fireball/
Bristol, RI

On 2/26/2023 1:16 PM, Peter McMinn via CnC-List wrote:


Hey all,

I have the original Barient 28s as primaries on my ‘85 37’ and with 
regular maintenance, they’re still working well and looking ok. Within 
a year, I’ll be acquiring a pair of B 26s of the same vintage that may 
need some work but hey, free winches:)


I’d like to use the 26s as secondaries for spinnaker and sometimes 
headsail sheeting/furling. There’s room on the combing, and the angle 
from a rail block seems workable.


Will this size be suitable for secondary winches? Also, for those who 
use secondaries, what are the pros and cons from your perspective?



Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu
Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu

Stus-List Re: Racing at night

[Martin DeYoung via CnC-List]

“A masthead wind instrument works at night.”

Absolutely, except when it doesn’t.  During the 1982 Vic-Maui race on a Britt 
Chance designed 54’ IOR boat in trade winds reinforced by a tropical storm 
nearby (steady high 20’s, gusts to mid 30’s) the wind instruments were lagging 
behind the actual apparent wind enough that we needed to improvise.  It was the 
kind of dark wild night that made Mister Toad’s Wild ride seem tame.  We had a 
reaching spinnaker up (slightly smaller sq area and shoulders) with a full 
mainsail. AWA of 160 was our target.  Boat speeds were running in the low teens 
until a good surf then headed into the high teens.

I was watch captain with two other, experience crew on deck.  We were quickly 
schooled by the wind gods that relying on the wind instruments resulted in 
being caught by the lee at the end of a surf. (The apparent wind goes forward 
while surfing then quickly back to “base line” when the boat slows.)  Naturally 
being caught by the lee in those conditions often resulted in a spin 
out/round-up/broach, mostly to weather. (Spin pole up, boom in the water.)  The 
owner would occasionally stick his head up from below complaining about the 
ride.  I would suggest we were at the top of the spinnaker’s wind range. He 
would indicate maybe we needed better drivers.)

On this particular night we resorted to dividing up the information processing 
tasks.  The helmsman concentrated on the compass using a base line course as a 
guide.  Another crew concentrated on calling out AWA as shown by the lighted 
Windex. (Usually something like “5 high” or similar.  When the Windex indicated 
we were by the lee a noise similar to an aircraft’s stall warning buzzer was 
used.)  Driving was intense enough we stood ½ hour tricks rotating through the 
positions.  This technique allowed us to sail fast, diving deep to ride the 
best waves and limit the spin outs to mostly gentle low impact events.

Until it doesn’t.  At the end of our watch (+-2AM) the new watch gains the deck 
and includes the “hired gun” rock star sailmaker helmsman.  The rock star guy 
total ignored my recommendations on how we got through the last 4 hours.  He 
steps behind the wheel (a very large diameter wheel popular with IOR boats) and 
starts sailing like he was in charge.  Shortly there after he drives into a 
leeward broach that lays the boat flat enough that the mast head was hitting 
the top of waves and most of the deck crew was left hanging by safety 
harnesses.  I imagine it was exciting down below.  The rock star lost his 
footing and rotated “ass over tea kettle” into the leeward corner of the 
cockpit. (Still holding the wheel.)  The mainsail attempted to cross to leeward 
but was trapped by a line wrapped around a coffee grinder winch handle.

As I was in the mid/crew cockpit and closest to the line trapping the mainsail 
I pulled out my trusty sailing knife and cut the line (line was part of a 
failed preventer).  As soon as my knife blade touched the highly loaded line 
the mainsail violently crossed to leeward splashing into the water. Now that 
the boat was freed of the tangled mainsail load it stood up straight (ish), the 
spinnaker popped full, and the boat took off downwind.  Unfortunately the rock 
star was totally disoriented, the rudder still hard over and the boat went into 
another broach therefore completing the coveted “banana split”.

Once we got the boat sorted and back on its feet the owner stuck his head up 
from down below and said “OK boys we can take the spinnaker down now”.  We 
spent the next day or so under twin headsails still making speeds in the low 
teens but under much better control.

Martin DeYoung
Calypso
1971 C 43
Port Ludlow/Seattle

Sent from Mail for Windows

From: dwight veinot via CnC-List
Sent: Sunday, February 26, 2023 12:54 PM
To: Stus-List
Cc: dwight veinot
Subject: Stus-List Re: Racing at night

A masthead wind instrument works at night. Learn your sail trim vs wind speed 
and wind angle in the daylight. Should be the same in the dark

On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 1:01 PM David Knecht via CnC-List 
mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
I just read an interesting article in Practical Sailor on red vs. white lights 
and night vision.  It reminded me to ask a question of those more experienced 
about night racing.  I have only done this a few times and found upwind 
steering at night to be a real challenge.  I normally steer by the genoa 
telltales.  In light, shifting winds which we inevitably encounter at the 
darkest hours, it is especially important to steer well to keep the boat 
moving, but it is hard.   We used a hand held spotlight to periodically check 
the telltales, but that destroys night vision.  Are there better solutions?  
Thanks- Dave

S/V Aries
1990 C 34+
New London, CT

[cid:image001.png@01D949EB.17A0B2D0]

Please show 

Stus-List Re: Racing at night

[Don Kern via CnC-List]

David,

I have raced at night and use a combination of wind instruments, 
masthead wind indicator and a red LED flashlight with zoom to look at 
the lower two genoa telltales.  Also feel of the helm and boat tells me 
when I am getting into trouble.  Being an East Coast boat my mast head 
wind inst. project forward of the mast with a Davis wind indicator on 
the aft portion of the masthead.  The Davis indicator is higher than my 
white masthead running light and its red reflectors can easily be seen 
from the helm (looking up does cause a neck ache).  The two vanes I have 
set at approx 36 deg.  Since my mast is down each year, I carefully 
align the Davis so the vanes are equally off the mast's centerline.


Don Kern

On 2/26/2023 12:01 PM, David Knecht via CnC-List wrote:
I just read an interesting article in Practical Sailor on red vs. 
white lights and night vision.  It reminded me to ask a question of 
those more experienced about night racing.  I have only done this a 
few times and found upwind steering at night to be a real challenge. 
 I normally steer by the genoa telltales.  In light, shifting winds 
which we inevitably encounter at the darkest hours, it is especially 
important to steer well to keep the boat moving, but it is hard.   We 
used a hand held spotlight to periodically check the telltales, but 
that destroys night vision.  Are there better solutions?  Thanks- Dave


S/V Aries
1990 C 34+
New London, CT



Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu
Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu

Stus-List Re: Racing at night

[dwight veinot via CnC-List]

A masthead wind instrument works at night. Learn your sail trim vs wind
speed and wind angle in the daylight. Should be the same in the dark

On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 1:01 PM David Knecht via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> I just read an interesting article in Practical Sailor on red vs. white
> lights and night vision.  It reminded me to ask a question of those more
> experienced about night racing.  I have only done this a few times and
> found upwind steering at night to be a real challenge.  I normally steer by
> the genoa telltales.  In light, shifting winds which we inevitably
> encounter at the darkest hours, it is especially important to steer well to
> keep the boat moving, but it is hard.   We used a hand held spotlight to
> periodically check the telltales, but that destroys night vision.  Are
> there better solutions?  Thanks- Dave
>
> S/V Aries
> 1990 C 34+
> New London, CT
>
>
> Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and
> help me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> Thanks for your help.
> Stu

-- 
Sent from Gmail Mobile
Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu

Stus-List Re: Secondary winches

[ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List]

My primaries are Barient 28. My secondaries are Barient 23ST. I like to use
my secondaries for genoa sheeting when single-handing when the wind isn't
too strong. Barient 26 should be good for you. I do dip pole gybes. I use
the primaries (forward on the coaming) for the afterguys, and I use the
secondaries for spinnaker sheets.

Alan Bergen
35 Mk III Thirsty
Rose City YC
Portland, OR



On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 10:16 AM Peter McMinn via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> Hey all,
>
> I have the original Barient 28s as primaries on my ‘85 37’ and with
> regular maintenance, they’re still working well and looking ok. Within a
> year, I’ll be acquiring a pair of B 26s of the same vintage that may need
> some work but hey, free winches:)
>
> I’d like to use the 26s as secondaries for spinnaker and sometimes
> headsail sheeting/furling. There’s room on the combing, and the angle from
> a rail block seems workable.
>
> Will this size be suitable for secondary winches? Also, for those who use
> secondaries, what are the pros and cons from your perspective?
> Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and
> help me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
>
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.paypal.me/stumurray__;!!LIr3w8kk_Xxm!r6NFnjSm4fnTe34lZYe6fTYQorHASrXt6EoRqbA6AiHpi6PTMt0Q_1VCeJ49bvhaT33LPII6-Gx1Yaz2uir1jOM$
> Thanks for your help.
> Stu
Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu

Stus-List Secondary winches

[Peter McMinn via CnC-List]

Hey all,

I have the original Barient 28s as primaries on my ‘85 37’ and with regular 
maintenance, they’re still working well and looking ok. Within a year, I’ll be 
acquiring a pair of B 26s of the same vintage that may need some work but hey, 
free winches:) 

I’d like to use the 26s as secondaries for spinnaker and sometimes headsail 
sheeting/furling. There’s room on the combing, and the angle from a rail block 
seems workable. 

Will this size be suitable for secondary winches? Also, for those who use 
secondaries, what are the pros and cons from your perspective?
Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu

Stus-List Re: Racing at night

[cenelson--- via CnC-List]

I don’t do much night racing but when I did, I found stanchion flashlight 
mounts very useful.
Aim the pair at your favorite tell tales (or at all of the tell tales if you 
have multiple pairs of mounts and flashlights) with a red filter on them and 
you’re good to go. Don’t remember where I got them any longer.
With more recent led flashlights, the batteries would easily last the night—the 
older non led flashlights usually only lasted until dawn—barely!

FWIW
Charlie NelsonWater Phantom1995 C 36 XL/kcb
Sent from the all new AOL app for iOS


On Sunday, February 26, 2023, 12:01 PM, David Knecht via CnC-List 
 wrote:

I just read an interesting article in Practical Sailor on red vs. white lights 
and night vision.  It reminded me to ask a question of those more experienced 
about night racing.  I have only done this a few times and found upwind 
steering at night to be a real challenge.  I normally steer by the genoa 
telltales.  In light, shifting winds which we inevitably encounter at the 
darkest hours, it is especially important to steer well to keep the boat 
moving, but it is hard.   We used a hand held spotlight to periodically check 
the telltales, but that destroys night vision.  Are there better solutions?  
Thanks- Dave
S/V Aries1990 C 34+New London, CT

Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
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Stu


Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu

Stus-List Re: Racing at night

[Andrew Burton via CnC-List]

Back in the day, some boats had built in spots that shone up along the luff
of the jib. These were very good at destroying night vision.
These days I use my instruments, on which, though calibrated, I check
sailing angle readouts before dark. I also use a small LED flashlight that
I zoom-in to a small square that I focus on the telltale window. I don't
really worry about my night vision; my eyes go from instruments to compass
to telltale window. Others on deck can protect their night vision and keep
a lookout.
Andy

Andrew Burton
26 Beacon Hill
Newport, RI
USA 02840
http://sites.google.com/site/andrewburtonyachtservices/

phone  +401 965 5260


On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 12:01 PM David Knecht via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> I just read an interesting article in Practical Sailor on red vs. white
> lights and night vision.  It reminded me to ask a question of those more
> experienced about night racing.  I have only done this a few times and
> found upwind steering at night to be a real challenge.  I normally steer by
> the genoa telltales.  In light, shifting winds which we inevitably
> encounter at the darkest hours, it is especially important to steer well to
> keep the boat moving, but it is hard.   We used a hand held spotlight to
> periodically check the telltales, but that destroys night vision.  Are
> there better solutions?  Thanks- Dave
>
> S/V Aries
> 1990 C 34+
> New London, CT
>
>
> Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and
> help me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
> Thanks for your help.
> Stu
Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
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Thanks for your help.
Stu

Stus-List Re: Racing at night

[Edd Schillay via CnC-List]

David,

I’ve done quite a lot of night racing.

https://youtu.be/2I69h6fwL1E

Yes, if you use a spotlight to read your telltales, your night vision will be 
shot. Instead, have one of your crew who is sitting more forward, use a 
lower-powered light and have him continuously communicate with you “head up”, 
“head down “, or “good course,” 

You have a team on board. Use them. 

All the best, 

Edd

———-
Edd M. Schillay
Captain of the “Starship Enterprise”
Bayliner 3788 | NCC-1701-C
Venice Yacht Club | Venice Island, FL
———-
914.774.9767   |Mobile
———-
Sent via iPhone 14 Pro
iPhone. iTypos. iApologize


On Feb 26, 2023, at 12:01 PM, David Knecht via CnC-List  
wrote:

I just read an interesting article in Practical Sailor on red vs. white lights 
and night vision.  It reminded me to ask a question of those more experienced 
about night racing.  I have only done this a few times and found upwind 
steering at night to be a real challenge.  I normally steer by the genoa 
telltales.  In light, shifting winds which we inevitably encounter at the 
darkest hours, it is especially important to steer well to keep the boat 
moving, but it is hard.   We used a hand held spotlight to periodically check 
the telltales, but that destroys night vision.  Are there better solutions?  
Thanks- Dave

S/V Aries
1990 C 34+
New London, CT



Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
StuPlease show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu

Stus-List Re: Racing at night

[Neil Andersen via CnC-List]

BTW - Our charts are designed to be readable under whit AND red lights.  I 
understand that science has found that green light ie better than red for not 
interfering with night vision.  Anyone else read that??

Neil Andersen, W3NEA
1982 C 32, FoxFire
Rock Hall, MD 21661
484-354-8800

From: David Knecht via CnC-List 
Sent: Sunday, February 26, 2023 12:01:41 PM
To: CnC CnC discussion list 
Cc: David Knecht 
Subject: Stus-List Racing at night

I just read an interesting article in Practical Sailor on red vs. white lights 
and night vision.  It reminded me to ask a question of those more experienced 
about night racing.  I have only done this a few times and found upwind 
steering at night to be a real challenge.  I normally steer by the genoa 
telltales.  In light, shifting winds which we inevitably encounter at the 
darkest hours, it is especially important to steer well to keep the boat 
moving, but it is hard.   We used a hand held spotlight to periodically check 
the telltales, but that destroys night vision.  Are there better solutions?  
Thanks- Dave

S/V Aries
1990 C 34+
New London, CT

[cid:4073BE72-4704-4EA7-8EBA-B73B833F502B]

Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu

Stus-List Re: Racing at night

[ALAN BERGEN via CnC-List]

I no longer race, but when I did, I used my wind instruments when sailing
at night. My previous boat had no wind instruments and I used a spotlight,
like you did, to check the genoa telltales. Try using the wind instruments.
I think you'll find they do fine.

Alan Bergen
35 Mk III Thirsty
Rose City YC
Portland, OR



On Sun, Feb 26, 2023 at 9:01 AM David Knecht via CnC-List <
cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote:

> I just read an interesting article in Practical Sailor on red vs. white
> lights and night vision.  It reminded me to ask a question of those more
> experienced about night racing.  I have only done this a few times and
> found upwind steering at night to be a real challenge.  I normally steer by
> the genoa telltales.  In light, shifting winds which we inevitably
> encounter at the darkest hours, it is especially important to steer well to
> keep the boat moving, but it is hard.   We used a hand held spotlight to
> periodically check the telltales, but that destroys night vision.  Are
> there better solutions?  Thanks- Dave
>
> S/V Aries
> 1990 C 34+
> New London, CT
>
>
> Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and
> help me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
>
> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.paypal.me/stumurray__;!!LIr3w8kk_Xxm!p0QGx3zJxbIoVHx8sUE5kQ51mEmb0sN_WFbmqTxf6bZGyAnGxLEkrsqU1IWUos4kO7B7mWMw-F36xNp-TzKMJOM$
> Thanks for your help.
> Stu
Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu

Stus-List Racing at night

[David Knecht via CnC-List]

I just read an interesting article in Practical Sailor on red vs. white lights 
and night vision.  It reminded me to ask a question of those more experienced 
about night racing.  I have only done this a few times and found upwind 
steering at night to be a real challenge.  I normally steer by the genoa 
telltales.  In light, shifting winds which we inevitably encounter at the 
darkest hours, it is especially important to steer well to keep the boat 
moving, but it is hard.   We used a hand held spotlight to periodically check 
the telltales, but that destroys night vision.  Are there better solutions?  
Thanks- Dave

S/V Aries
1990 C 34+
New London, CT



Please show your appreciation for this list and the Photo Album site and help 
me pay the associated bills.  Make a contribution at:
https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Thanks for your help.
Stu