Re: Stus-List Preventer or boom brake for C/1

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

On my boat, I installed two spinnaker pole downhauls, one on each side of the 
boat, on a block attached close to the bow. These downhaul then head back to 
the cockpit. I use these downhaul for the spinnaker of course, but also as a 
preventer, attached to the main sheet eye at the end of the boom. When jibbing, 
I bring back the boom in the center, which allow me to disconnect the preventer 
and attached the other one, granted that the line is long enough to do that. 
The preventer going back to the bow and attached at the end of the boom 
provides the best angle and a strong and safe attachement, with no risk of 
bending the boom.
The other option is a boom brake such as Walder
http://www.boom-brake-walder.com/ 
or Wichard:
http://marine.wichard.com/fiche-A%7CWICHARD%7C7150-02030300-ME.html 


Antoine
C 30 Cousin



> Le 14 juil. 2017 à 20:58, Tortuga via CnC-List  a 
> écrit :
> 
> I'm looking for advice please. I've been thinking for a while about 
> installing permanent preventers or a boom brake on my 30. In the meantime I 
> attach a preventer, when I think it's required, to either the mainsheet eye 
> or to the vang attachment. 
> 
> This week, as I was moving the preventer, we were overtaken by a rain squall 
> which resulted in a nasty gybe. Nobody was injured, but it scared me into 
> rethinking my preventer.
> 
> Our boom has 2 eyes: one at the end, where the mainsheet attaches and the 
> other about a third of the length from the mast, where the vang attaches. I'd 
> like to make a third attachment for a preventer or boom brake about half way 
> along the boom, but I don't know how to do it. A bale, I think, will not 
> withstand the lateral strain of a gybe. A friend recommended a T-ball 
> fitting, but it also is made to withstand strain from one direction only, I 
> think.
> 
> Can anyone recommend a fitting that will attach to the boom and withstand the 
> strain of a forced gybe? Also is there collected wisdom about preventers vs 
> boom brakes, etc.? 
> 
> Thanks
> Derek
> Tortuga, C 30 mk1 #553
> Ballantynes Cove, NS
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Re: Stus-List Fun Race Last Night

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

All of this is based on a old (actually getting very old) coefficient that does 
not take into account that the waterline length is not static, the waterline 
length increases as the boat heal and gain speed.
Moreover, as the prismatic coefficient is now better understood, recent boat 
designs with wide transom can easily go above the theoretical speed. My new 
boat (Alubat 36) can easily achieve speed in the 9-11 knots range under 
spinnaker.
On my C 30, I consider my true hull speed to be 7,4 knots. I good winds, I 
will reach speed above 7 knots, but 7,4 seems to always be the limit for a 
sustained speed.

Antoine 
C 30 Cousin


> Le 19 mai 2017 à 17:47, Bruce Whitmore via CnC-List  a 
> écrit :
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> Keep in mind that the hull speed is not the "maximum" speed that the boat 
> will acheive.  It is the maximum speed at which the amount of energy needed 
> to cause the boat to go fast increases, and yes, it is a steep increase in 
> energy input from the sails.
> 
> That said, our C 27 MKIII regularly sailed above the 6.4 kts. in 
> theoretical hull speed.  That was measured by GPS, and of course, that 
> measures speed over ground which can be significantly affected by current.  
> That said, my sailing experiences on that boat were on Lake Michigan, in all 
> kinds of conditions.
> 
> GPS sustained recorded hull speeds (meaning more than just a surf, but 
> lasting more than a minute at a time) would exceed 7.0 knots multiple times 
> in every season.  Usually this required 12 - 15 knots of speed on an apparent 
> beam reach.  
> 
> On a couple transits between Chicago and Milwaukee, with apparent deep 
> reaches and sustained 15 - 20 kt winds, we had sustained 8.5 kt speeds, and 
> on one memorable night, we had sustained 10's, tracked by a friend's 
> permanently tracked GPS speeds (not just looking at the numbers).  I'm not 
> sure I can dig up that log, but he might be able to find it.  I'm not sure 
> I've heard of a current exceeding 2 kts on Lake Michigan, but others may know 
> better.  
> 
> And, no, even with heal, you might be increasing your waterline length by 
> 10%, but not much more, and considering the formula, that doesn't equate to a 
> 10% faster boat.  
> 
> So, its a guideline, not an absolute maximum.
> 
> Hope you find this helpful (though you might find in unbelievable) 
> 
> Kindest Regards,
> 
> Bruce Whitmore
> 
> (847) 404-5092 (mobile)
> bwhitm...@sbcglobal.net 
> 
> 
> From: RANDY via CnC-List  >
> To: cnc-list > 
> Cc: RANDY >
> Sent: Friday, May 19, 2017 3:03 PM
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Fun Race Last Night
> 
> Ok that made me laugh :D
> 
> That's why I first noticed that speed via the replay.  I sure as hell am not 
> looking at my iPhone in the middle of that kind of chaos :)  In fact this 
> past Wednesday night when I finally got a rail in the water, I even forgot to 
> look at my clinometer in all the excitement - but I suspect she was heeling 
> around 30 degrees.  I know 25 degrees isn't enough to get the rail wet.
> 
> Cheers,
> Randy
> 
> From: "Gary Nylander via CnC-List"  >
> To: "cnc-list" >
> Cc: "Gary Nylander"  >
> Sent: Friday, May 19, 2017 12:11:53 PM
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Fun Race Last Night
> 
> I remember that Randy is on a lake in Colorado. More than likely his burst of 
> speed is the hull settling into the water as it goes faster and thus 
> increasing the waterline – and/or being heeled over which also increases the 
> waterline. When my 30-1 gets the rail in the water in 20-30 knots of wind, I 
> am generally too busy to look at the speed.
>  
> I’m sure all of you nautical types remember the war stories about clipper 
> ships going so fast they literally bury themselves as the make a bigger and 
> bigger hole in the water. I am not interested in trying that.
>  
> Oh well.
> Gary
>  
> From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com 
> ] On Behalf Of Gary Russell via CnC-List
> Sent: Friday, May 19, 2017 2:01 PM
> To: C List >
> Cc: Gary Russell >
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Fun Race Last Night
>  
> Remember your GPS gives you speed over ground, while Hull Speed is speed over 
> the water.  A one knot favorable current can easily explain the difference.
>  
> Gary
> S/V Kaylarah
> '90 C 37+
> East Greenwich, RI, USA
> 
> ~~~_/)~~
>  
> On Fri, May 19, 2017 at 1:16 PM, Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List 
> > wrote:
> GPS is usually in miles per 

Re: Stus-List nature's head

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Just bought one for my new boat. Will install and try in June. I’ll be able to 
provide first hand experience on my return from Bordeaux in July.
Antoine
(C 30, Cousin and now also Ovni36, Maître Bau)

> Le 9 mai 2017 à 16:35, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List  
> a écrit :
> 
> Does anyone have one?
> Thinking about a plumbing reduction.
>  
> Joe
> Coquina
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Re: Stus-List Post question on CnC discussion list

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Hum, putting that back into shape through hammering does not look like an easy 
job to me. Also think that hammering will expand the metal in odd directions 
too. I would keep consulting with people more knowledgeable on this type of 
work.
Antoine

> Le 15 avr. 2017 à 23:29, tom via CnC-List  a écrit :
> 
> Dave & Antoine,
> What it seems like is that there should be some upward angle but better at 
> the mast fitting.
> So it seems that I'm best checking at the mast to see if there is an angle at 
> the fitting or not. My spreaders are pictured in the link below trying to 
> show the bend in them.
> Would hammering them back to shape cause damage or is this a pro job only?
> 
> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/dx8rxhya2dyummc/AACODZtg41WU01YI-AxHtfAIa?dl=0 
> 
> 
> Thanks, 
> Tom
> 
> 
> On Sat, Apr 15, 2017 at 5:49 PM, David Kaseler  > wrote:
> Tom.
> I'm no rigger but I too have a C 33-1. Also, ours is not the original mast 
> so things are different and I do suggest you discuss this issue with a 
> professional rigger. I believe the spreader should be angled up as you see on 
> yours. The trick is to direct the load evenly from the shroud so there is no 
> tendency for the spreader tip to move up or down or for it to buckle under 
> load, and there is a lot of load. The reason the end needs to angled up is 
> because the angle of the shroud above the spreader is smaller than that below 
> the spreader. 
> Dave.
> SLY C 33-1
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
> On Apr 15, 2017, at 11:30 AM, tom via CnC-List  > wrote:
> 
>> Stu,
>> Can the following be posted on the CnC List?
>> 
>> Mast, Turnbuckles and Spreader for C 33-1
>> Hi Everyone,
>> Having my mast down this season for rigging check and LED lights and wiring 
>> replacement the rod seems to be original as well as the turnbuckles and I 
>> have been advised to replace and not just re-head. While this is under 
>> consideration awaiting estimate, the spreaders come in to question. Showing 
>> a bit of looseness and shake (that might have been somewhat lessened by 
>> tightening the holding screws) when removed showed some bending and slight 
>> malformation of the spreader housing where it attaches to the mast fitting. 
>> What is questionable is there is a noticeable angle (10 degrees or so) at 
>> the edge of both  spreaders where they attach to the mast fitting that would 
>> give the spreaders an upward bias. 
>> My question: is this angle along the length of the spreader supposed to be 
>> there or is the spreader supposed to be straight? If it is supposed to be 
>> straight is reforming ok to do or do they need replacement?
>> Thanks much. Any help is appreciated, ,
>> Tom Oryniak
>> Carry On C 33-1
>> Raritan Bay NJ
>> ___
>> 
>> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
>> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
>> https://www.paypal.me/stumurray 
>> 
>> All Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> 
> ___
> 
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Re: Stus-List Post question on CnC discussion list

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Hi Tom,
Yes, the spreader should be upward biased and 10 degrees is the correct angle. 
That is to ensure the angle formed between the spreader and the shroud are the 
same above and below the spreader.
Now, this angle is usually obtained through the fitting on the mast. I’m 
unclear from your post if you’re saying the spreader itself is bent, which is 
less desirable.

Antoine
C 30 Cousin
And now Alubat OVNI 36 too (recent acquisition)

> Le 15 avr. 2017 à 14:30, tom via CnC-List  a écrit :
> 
> Stu,
> Can the following be posted on the CnC List?
> 
> Mast, Turnbuckles and Spreader for C 33-1
> Hi Everyone,
> Having my mast down this season for rigging check and LED lights and wiring 
> replacement the rod seems to be original as well as the turnbuckles and I 
> have been advised to replace and not just re-head. While this is under 
> consideration awaiting estimate, the spreaders come in to question. Showing a 
> bit of looseness and shake (that might have been somewhat lessened by 
> tightening the holding screws) when removed showed some bending and slight 
> malformation of the spreader housing where it attaches to the mast fitting. 
> What is questionable is there is a noticeable angle (10 degrees or so) at the 
> edge of both  spreaders where they attach to the mast fitting that would give 
> the spreaders an upward bias. 
> My question: is this angle along the length of the spreader supposed to be 
> there or is the spreader supposed to be straight? If it is supposed to be 
> straight is reforming ok to do or do they need replacement?
> Thanks much. Any help is appreciated, ,
> Tom Oryniak
> Carry On C 33-1
> Raritan Bay NJ
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you wish 
> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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> 
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Re: Stus-List Planning a transpacific sail with a C 110

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Hi Bruce and Nancy,
Countless boat of all kinds with no watertight bulkheads have crossed ocean. I 
firmly believe that the key is preparation of the crew and preparation of the 
boat. In that order.
Preparation of the crew mean:
- Understanding the forces at play on your boat and how your boat reacts to it
- Understanding all the systems on your boat, how to fix them or do without.
- Experiencing multiple weather patterns at sea and how to cope with them
- Understanding all risks and mitigation strategies
- Understanding how you and your crew will react under stress and fatigue. When 
the weather turns bad, sleep is the first victim. How to maintain good 
decisions making in those conditions is key.

At sea, our full time job is divided over three tasks: take care of the boat 
(sail handling, boat maintenance, anticipating problems before they happen), 
take care of the crew (feed well, well rested, well entertained to keep good 
moral) and, maintain navigation (analyzing weather conditions and forecast and 
their impact on your routing requires easily two to three hours a day)

Preparation of the boat mean:
- Understanding the weakness of your boat and any boat and fix everything that 
could be fixed. At sea, your boat will do kore and under greater stress that 
what most boats experience in ten years of summer sailing.
- Whatever needs to be replaced should be replaced. You need a boat in top 
shape.
- Equip properly, understanding that technology should never/ever be a 
substitute for knowledge and skills, only a complement.

Have fun preparing.

Antoine
C 30 Cousin

> Le 8 mars 2017 à 20:24, Bruce Carter via CnC-List  a 
> écrit :
> 
> I’ve been watching this forum for a while -  I have an issue that I need help 
> with. 
>  
> I would like to take my C 110 (1999- hull number 8) to  Australia via 
> Tahiti. My C has been set up for coastal sailing and I now sail in the 
> Great Lakes. Is this boat seaworthy to do a transpacific sail? I’m concerned 
> about hull integrity and the lack of water tight bulkheads. All other things 
> are a matter of investing $$ into things like AIS, Liferaft, etc. But if this 
> boat is not seaworthy without the proper hull and watertight bulkheads, I 
> think I should purchase another boat. 
>  
> What do you guys think?
>  
> Is it seaworthy for a transpacific sail? Can it be – or should it be- 
> retrofitted with watertight bulkheads? If so, how can this be done without 
> affecting the integrity of the boat?
>  
> Bruce and Nancy Carter
> 55804 Rivershores Est
> Elkhart, IN 46516
>  
> mob- Bruce- 574-361-9437
> mob- Nancy- 574-304-9009
>  
> ___
> 
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Re: Stus-List C 24 spinnaker project

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Hi Dave,
i would suggest you keep your pole for now. The six inch difference is not much 
and means two things: with the wind fully aback, the six inch difference will 
mean a slight deficit in opening of the spinnaker and; on a close-reach, when 
you have to pull down the pole, the shorter pole will interfere more quickly 
with the stay.
But in racing conditions, you have much more to gain in learning how to set it 
properly and  streamlining the manouvers around buoys than wondering about the 
shorter pole. It will still be time to change it later if you wish. When racing 
(or not racing as well), the wind fully aback is not often the fastest solution.

Antoine
C 30 Cousin (1973)


> Le 8 mars 2017 à 16:57, David Cady via CnC-List  a 
> écrit :
> 
> I have been lurking on this list for a while, but now it is time for me to 
> post.
> 
> We have been having great success with our C 24 in Wednesday night races 
> here in Buffalo sailing under main and jib. I am looking for a new challenge 
> so we are moving up to the spinnaker fleet this summer.
> 
> That raises a few questions:
> 
> #1 - does anyone have a spinnaker pole they'd like to get rid of? I need a 
> 10.5 foot pole (J dimension on a 24) but my rigger says he could cut down a 
> longer pole, so presumably an 11 foot pole (from a 25, say) would also work.
> 
> #2 - I do currently have a 10 foot pole, would I be sacrificing much by using 
> that one?
> 
> #3 - Finally, I'd like to hear off list from anyone racing a 24 with a 
> spinnaker. I have some questions about deck hardware. Thanks.
> 
> Dave Cady
> "Prickly Pete"
> 1979 C 24
> Buffalo NY
> ___
> 
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> to make a contribution to offset our costs, please go to:  
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Re: Stus-List Grand adventure/ long distance sailing in a C

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Of course there is a prime season. First, forget winter time. Pilot charts for 
North Atlantic definitely don’t look good in January. ;-)
Speaking of Pilot Charts, this is one of first things you need to start 
studying. You can get them for free here: 
http://msi.nga.mil/NGAPortal/MSI.portal?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=msi_portal_page_62=0003
 
<http://msi.nga.mil/NGAPortal/MSI.portal?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=msi_portal_page_62=0003>
You’re looking for fair winds, moderate sea, low occurrences of gales, calms, 
fog …
You will find that combination in June-July. In August, hurricanes start to 
seriously impact the weather on this side of the ocean and lows become fairly 
frequent over Ireland and England, while having an impact on the weather fairly 
far south.

Never heard of the cannon to describe the Saguenay mouth. The Saguenay river is 
a Fjord, with a tiny layer of fresh water running over a trapped thick layer of 
sea water underneath. And that salt layer is at arctic temperature. When the 
Saguenay river meets the St-Lawrence, it refresh it over a large region. Water 
temperature in July is around 6-7 degree celsius (around 45 Fahrenheit) in the 
St-Lawrence. There are a number of consequences to this. First, you need winter 
clothes (I’ve sailed under snow and freezing rain in mid May). Second, the 
moment a warm and humid body of hot air (frequently found in July) passes over 
that body of cold water, fog appears. And I mean FOG. You would barely see a 
wharf if passing a hundred feet from it, and it can last several days in a row. 
Add to that fifteen feet tide twice a day and up to 5-6 knot currents swirling 
around  islands and changing directions in the middle of the St-Lawrence river. 
Quite entertaining if you want to brush up on your navigation skills and dead 
reckoning. This is where I was teaching sailing for several summer thirty years 
ago, at time when we didn’t have satellite stuff, navigating by homing on 
lighthouse fog whistles and gonio signals while using blinking depth sounders. 
I can tell you some tricks if you decide to go there. In fair weather, the 
landscape is absolutely gorgeous.

Have fun looking at the Pilot Charts.
Antoine


> Le 23 août 2016 à 13:07, Free Girls Sailing via CnC-List 
> <cnc-list@cnc-list.com> a écrit :
> 
> Antione,
> Is there a prime season to make that trip? 
> I think I read somewhere that the Tadoussac is called the cannon?
> Jessica 
> 
> On Monday, August 22, 2016, Antoine Rose via CnC-List <cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
> <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote:
> As some other as indicated, I did it (twice) on my C 30-1 (1973). And I’m 
> still on the list, even if I don’t intervene much.
> 2008 Montréal - Quebec city - Gaspé - Faial (Azores) - Brest (France) - La 
> Rochelle (France)
> 2010 Rochefort (France) - Azores - Nova Scotia - Gaspé - Québec (singlehanded 
> this time)
> 
> C can do it but it need a WELL prepared boat to do it. The boat never 
> scared me. I hope to do it again before I’m getting too old.
> 
> I would be happy to answer any question you might have. And yes, the 
> St-Lawrence river and gulf can be cold at the beginning of the summer. The 
> worst part is Tadoussac, where the Saguenay river meets the St-Lawrence.
> But I believe Lake Superior is not specially warm either.
> 
> Cheers
> Antoine
> 
> 
> 
> 
> > Le 22 août 2016 à 12:33, Free Girls Sailing via CnC-List 
> > <cnc-list@cnc-list.com <javascript:;>> a écrit :
> >
> > My partner are planning a trip from where we are at in Superior Wisconsin 
> > through the Great Lakes and to the Atlantic and then south and beyond.
> >
> > What's the furthest anyone has traveled in their C? Any ocean crossings?
> >
> > Jessica
> > 1975 C 33
> > ___
> >
> > This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you 
> > like what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All 
> > Contributions are greatly appreciated!
> 
> 
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!
> ___
> 
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Re: Stus-List Grand adventure/ long distance sailing in a C

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

As some other as indicated, I did it (twice) on my C 30-1 (1973). And I’m 
still on the list, even if I don’t intervene much.
2008 Montréal - Quebec city - Gaspé - Faial (Azores) - Brest (France) - La 
Rochelle (France)
2010 Rochefort (France) - Azores - Nova Scotia - Gaspé - Québec (singlehanded 
this time)

C can do it but it need a WELL prepared boat to do it. The boat never scared 
me. I hope to do it again before I’m getting too old.

I would be happy to answer any question you might have. And yes, the 
St-Lawrence river and gulf can be cold at the beginning of the summer. The 
worst part is Tadoussac, where the Saguenay river meets the St-Lawrence.
But I believe Lake Superior is not specially warm either.

Cheers
Antoine




> Le 22 août 2016 à 12:33, Free Girls Sailing via CnC-List 
>  a écrit :
> 
> My partner are planning a trip from where we are at in Superior Wisconsin 
> through the Great Lakes and to the Atlantic and then south and beyond. 
> 
> What's the furthest anyone has traveled in their C? Any ocean crossings?
> 
> Jessica 
> 1975 C 33
> ___
> 
> This list is supported by the generous donations of our members. If you like 
> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!


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Re: Stus-List C 30 Shoal Draft

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Hi Graham,
I do have the shoal draft version (4’ 3") and race it every Wednesday in our 
club where there is another C 30 with std draft. Yes, he does point higher 
than me for two reasons : deeper keel and his boat is more recent with the 
shorter mainsail and a track for the genoa block sheets. My sheet blocks are 
hooked on the rail, meaning the sail is not trimmed inside as close as his, 
decreasing the ability to point. That said, despite the fact he has a 150% 
genoa while mine is a 135%, I’m always faster than he is on downward legs, 
thanks to shallower draft (less wetted surface) and thanks to the larger 
mainsail.

Antoine (C 30 Cousin)


> Le 10 juil. 2016 à 08:59, Graham Young via CnC-List  a 
> écrit :
> 
> Good morning fellow C owners,
> 
> I'm looking for input from those who have sailed the shoal draft version of 
> the C 30 (draft of 4'2") in comparison to the standard draft version (5').  
> Theoretically, the standard version should point a little better, but in 
> practice is there much difference in performance and sailing characteristics?
> 
> In terms of base handicap on Lake Erie, there is a 6 second difference (183 
> for shoal draft versus 177 for standard).
> 
> 
> Also, does anyone know whether C ever made a deeper draft version of the 
> C 30?  There was a 1976 C 30 for sail in the boatyard next to my boat 
> this spring and the keep was deep and definitely not the 5' swept back keel 
> characteristic of the 30.  Sitting next to my 32 on the cradle, it appeared 
> every bit as tall and I kept looking at it in puzzlement.  The ad for this 
> boat on yachtworld said it had a draft of 5'10".
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Graham
>  
> 
> ___
> 
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> what we do, please help us pay for our costs by donating. All Contributions 
> are greatly appreciated!

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Re: Stus-List 30-1 Displacement (was Re: Early 30-1 Interior Doors)

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

We should remember that the displacement given in the specs is a displacement 
calculated by the designer. Actual weight depends on how much the builder was 
successful in meeting the specs, especially with the hand laying of fiberglass. 
Most boats are actually a little heavier than their specs even before we 
started adding all the extra stuff. Don't forget boat hull also absorb some 
amount of water too. My boat is the 4'3" version, which is heavier too.

Antoine
C 30 Cousin

I've seen in 2000 the C 30 #1 in Collins Bay Marina, near Toronto. I believe 
this original was made for Georges Hinterholler himself. When my boat was 
hauled out, everyone noticed the extra surface added to my rudder to increase 
compensation and told me George had done exactly the same on his boat.



Le 2016-04-23 à 23:39, Randy Stafford via CnC-List a écrit :

> Now that I've launched my boat and weighed my trailer empty, I conclude that 
> my boat weighs ~8700 pounds with absolutely nothing aboard and empty tanks.  
> Put onboard her sail inventory, ground tackle, sheets & dock lines, gas 
> grill, motor oil etc., full tank of gas, and she jumps to 9200.  I don't know 
> how C computed the 8000 pounds in the brochure for a 30-1.
> 
> Cheers,
> Randy
> 
> From: "Randy Stafford via CnC-List" 
> To: "cnc-list" 
> Cc: "randy stafford" 
> Sent: Thursday, February 11, 2016 1:38:38 PM
> Subject: Stus-List 30-1 Displacement (was Re:  Early 30-1 Interior Doors)
> 
> Thanks for the displacement data Michael.
> 
> I have HIN 30007972 - hull #7 laid up in September 1972 if I'm decoding 
> correctly.
> 
> She has tiller steering and the Atomic-4 gasoline engine, rigged for 
> spinnaker (pole chocked on deck) and roller-furling boom.  Two batteries, two 
> sets of primary winches, two danforth anchors with chain / rope rode, fairly 
> extensive sail inventory. Everything else is basic and standard, or very 
> lightweight optional stuff.  For racing I can remove an anchor and many of 
> the sails, and sail with empty tanks, etc.
> 
> I'll report back to the list after I've calculated her weight from truck 
> scale differences between loaded & unloaded trailer.
> 
> Cheers,
> Randy Stafford
> S/V Grenadine
> C 30 MK1 #7
> Ken Caryl, CO
> 
> From: "Michael Brown via CnC-List" 
> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
> Cc: "Michael Brown" 
> Sent: Thursday, February 11, 2016 10:38:37 AM
> Subject: Re: Stus-List Early 30-1 Interior Doors
> 
> I have a C 30  "77" model year.
> From my HIN ZCC304531076 I would guess it is #453 laid up October 1976.
> 
> ...
> 
> At haulout, so no mast and most stuff removed the crane weighs me at 8500 - 
> 8800 lbs.
> Some of the C specs claimed 7,900 lbs which may have been possible stripped 
> out,
> one battery and tiller steering. I think in race trim carrying stuff like 
> flares, anchor and rode,
> #1 - #3 - spinnakers, spin and whisker pole  I would guess 10,000 lbs is 
> reasonable.
> ...
> 
> Michael Brown
> Windburn
> C 30-1
> 
> C Sailors- 
> 
> I noticed the owner of C 30 MK1 hull #1, Rick Bushie, is on this list. It's 
> awesome that boat is still sailing, and that her owner is in this community.
> 
> ...
> 
> Also, Rick, what is the displacement of your boat? Sailboat data.com and the 
> brochures show 8000 pounds. But the previous owner of hull #7 thinks it's 
> higher, like 10,000 pounds. I'll measure her precise displacement by 
> differencing truck scale weights of loaded and unloaded trailer after I 
> launch her this spring, but just wanted to check with you. 
> 
> Cheers, 
> Randy Stafford 
> S/V Grenadine 
> C 30 MK1 #7 
> Ken Caryl, CO 
> 
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Re: Stus-List Replacing through hulls on a 30 MK1

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

I've done it on mine. Don't touch the flange, it's the best part. Inside the 
flange hole there are two notches to help you hold it while unscrewing. Buy a 
cheap socket (for ratchets) of the same size of the inside hole. Then grind a 
slot to allow the socket to slide in and lock itself on the notches.
You'll need to be two for this job to unscrew the thing. It will be fairly easy 
once it starts moving. You'll probably be surprised at how well and healthy the 
hull looks underneath, this was well done. Unless the flange turned rose 
(meaning the zinc inside is gone), keep it and replace everything else.
Antoine (C 30 Cousin)



Le 2016-02-06 à 17:39, Joe at Zialater via CnC-List a écrit :

> Howdy Listers,
> 
> I am replacing the through hull cockpit drains on my 30 MK1.   This project
> started with replacing the old gate valves - and it has sort of expanded
> (shall we say) from there.  Mission creep!
> 
> The flange measures 3.5 inches on the outside of the hull with a 1.25
> diameter hole.  The flange is even with the hull and does not stand proud of
> it.  I have heard that the best plan is to grind off the flange and then
> remove the through hull from the inside.  
> 
> Does anyone know brand of through hull used in 1975 and where I might find
> them?  I want to replace them with the same make and model if I can.
> 
> Also any other tips and tricks would be really welcome.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Joe Boyle
> Annapolis
> 1975 30 MK1 "Zia"
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> 
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> 


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Re: Stus-List sail question

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Hi Joe,
To cross the ocean, I had a 130% genoa specifically cut a bit heavier and 
flatter than a usual 135%. It always worked well, even partially rolled.
One feature you may want to discuss with your sailmaker is the height of the 
clew. I asked for a higher clew for a number of reasons:
- I don't have to change the position of the sheet block when partially 
furling, the angle seems to be always right.
- Much better visibility of what is going on to leeward.
- Avoiding ocean waves filling in the genoa
- Going downwind, the pole is higher. When the boat rolls heavily, the pole is 
farther away from the water and don't plunge into it.
Disadvantage, not as good for racing, but not an issue if you don't race much.
The 130% genoa will tack more easily. If well designed, the first rolls 
basically removes most of the depth and makes the sail flatter.
In the end, it makes the genoa looking more like a yankee. The clew does not 
have to be very high, the clew on mine (for a CC 30) is about 5 feet above 
deck when the sail is fully opened.
For higher winds, the best option is a removable inner forestay with a heavy 
weather jib (#3, 60%) or blade jib.

Antoine (CC 30 Cousin)

Le 2015-06-04 à 07:53, Joe Della Barba via CnC-List a écrit :

 My furling jib is utterly beat. I think a bedsheet would have more shape.
 So what size say you all for a replacement? I am thinking going a little 
 small, say 130%, and flying the chute asym style for light air off the wind.
  
 Joe Della Barba
 j...@dellabarba.com
  
 Coquina
 CC 35 MK I
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Re: Stus-List (no subject)

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Easy DIY
Teak is not the only choice. Iroko is an adequate substitute. The original were 
made of mahogany. You can even use recycled pvc planks made for backyard decks 
(not the prettiest, but say adios to varnishing)

DIY, you need a ten feet planks of something, a hole saw (ideally on a 
press-drill) and a router to do the rounding.

Antoine

Le 2015-02-22 à 16:48, Curtis via CnC-List a écrit :

 So I ha no Idea it would be so pricy. Here is what I was quoted. Is this a 
 DIY project? should I try to make my own?
 Help$$$
 
 
 Solid Teak Handrails:
 Qty (2) – 9-Loop
 12” Centers
 112” overall length
 1” Thick
 2-1/2” High
 4” Pad Bases
 Qty (2) – 6-Loop
 12” Centers
 76” overall length
 1” Thick
 2-1/2” High
 4” Pad Bases
 Furnished finish sanded, cleaned, and ready for application of finish coats 
 by others.
 Pricing:
  
 (2) 9-Loop  (2) 6-Loop Solid Teak Handrails - - - - - - - - - - - - $1,070.00
  
 Packaging - - - - - - - - - - - - - -  - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 
 - - - - - $55.00
  
 Packaging  Shipping via Motor Freight - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - $   
 237.00
  
 Total Project - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - 
 - -$1,362.00
  
 Note:
  
 The above prices are valid for thirty (30) days from the date of this 
 proposal. 
  
 Delivery:
  
 Typically 8 - 12 weeks, dependent upon prior commitments at date of order 
 entry.
  
 Payment:
 
 On Sat, Feb 21, 2015 at 8:04 PM, Paul Fountain p...@seasource.ca wrote:
 Had new ones made for Perception by Mark Bruckmann, Bruckmann Yachts, his dad 
 was one of the original 3 builders that formed CC  Ran the custom shop. 
 They look great on the boat!
 
 Sent from my iPad
 
 On Feb 21, 2015, at 5:53 PM, Curtis via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com 
 wrote:
 
 I need to replace the 9 loop deck rails and 6 loop interior hand rails on my 
 CC30 MK1. they where terrible in shape when i bought the boat 2012. I 
 refinished them and rebedded, but they have served the old girl well. I have 
 checked the web found a few sources, but I wonder if any owners have found 
 the exact replacement ones? Let me know. Thanks for your time. Capt Curt.
 -- 
 Best regards,
 
 Curtis McDaniel, 
 
 CC 30-MK1 East Coast Lady
 
 Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you 
 didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away 
 from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. 
 Discover.  -Mark Twain
 http://eastcostlady.blogspot.com/
 
  
 
 cpt.b...@gmail.com
 
  
 
  __/) 
 
 . 
 
 
 
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 -- 
 Best regards,
 
 Curtis McDaniel, 
 
 CC 30-MK1 East Coast Lady
 
 Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you 
 didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away 
 from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. 
 Discover.  -Mark Twain
 http://eastcostlady.blogspot.com/
 
  
 
 cpt.b...@gmail.com
 
  
 
  __/) 
 
 . 
 
 
 
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Re: Stus-List Cunningham

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Hi David,

To answer your question, we need to go back a bit to the origin the cunningham. 
Well, the main sail is up and properly tensioned, which mean that the halyard 
point is close to the mast top block to use the full length of your mast. Wind 
is light, not too much tension is needed on the halyard. As wind increases, 
more is needed. Eventually, the halyard is fully tensioned but the wind still 
get a bit stronger, but not enough to reef and, since you're racing you don't 
want to give any water to that boat just beside yours. As the wind increases, 
the sail draft moves back, increasing heeling and reducing speed. Tensioning 
the cunningham does just that, bringing the draft forward for two reasons: it 
increases the tensioning but also, because the cunningham grommet is slightly 
aft of the sail, pull forward the main foot.

Having the grommet has another advantage. If you have a corresponding grommet 
on the leach side, you can take a six inch reef (sorry, don't how it's called 
in English, ris de fond in French). This very small reef does not reduce 
substantially the size of the sail but removes much of the draft. A flatter 
main points higher and reduce heeling.

Antoine (CC 30 Cousin)

Le 2015-01-25 à 18:32, David Paine via CnC-List a écrit :

 Hi All,
 
 I'm buying a new mainsail and I am going to ask a ridiculous-sounding 
 question.   Do you have a Cunningham grommet in your mainsail?   I do not in 
 my current sail but that is because Hood made the sail with a jack line (or 
 lace line) which serves the purpose.  My new sail definitely won't have a 
 jack-line.  Some adjust luff tension with the halyard, others use a separate 
 Cunningham grommet with a many part tackle (or lead the Cunningham line to a 
 winch) to set the luff tension.  My sailmaker has an opinion but my question 
 is, which do you use?  The Cunningham is useless when reefed, of course.
 
 Cheers,
 
 David
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Re: Stus-List Tuning a CC 30 Mark 1

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Curtis,
The hook is nice to have, not need to have. I don't have one. I simply have one 
line attached to the mast side (lower than the boom). The line then goes up 
through the cunningham grommet, down on the other side to a block located at 
mast base and then back to the cockpit to a winch through a rope clutch. 

Antoine (CC 30 Cousin)

Le 2015-01-25 à 22:20, Curtis via CnC-List a écrit :

 What hooks are they on my CC30 1? if so where?
 
 
 On Sun, Jan 25, 2015 at 9:11 PM, Jim Watts via CnC-List 
 cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote:
 Surprise! You can find a lot of good info on the legendary PhotoAlbum. 
 http://www.cncphotoalbum.com/doityourself/masttuning/tuning.htm
 
 
 Jim Watts
 Paradigm Shift
 CC 35 Mk III
 Victoria, BC
 
 On 25 January 2015 at 17:45, Michael Crombie via CnC-List 
 cnc-list@cnc-list.com wrote:
 Yes, those two innocent little hooks counter the upward pull of the halyards 
 so that there is no net force lifting up on the deck!  I just realized that 
 myself this year.
 Sent wirelessly from my BlackBerry device on the Bell network.
 Envoyé sans fil par mon terminal mobile BlackBerry sur le réseau de Bell.
 
 -Original Message-
 From: Alan Lombard via CnC-List cnc-list@cnc-list.com
 Sender: CnC-List cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com
 Date: Sun, 25 Jan 2015 18:01:52
 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
 Reply-To: Alan Lombard alan.lomb...@sympatico.ca, cnc-list@cnc-list.com
 Subject: Stus-List Tuning a CC 30 Mark 1
 
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 -- 
 Best regards,
 
 Curtis McDaniel, 
 
 CC 30-MK1 East Coast Lady
 
 Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you 
 didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away 
 from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. 
 Discover.  -Mark Twain
 
 
 cpt.b...@gmail.com
 
  
 
  __/) 
 
 . 
 
 
 
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Re: Stus-List Bilge pump parts for C C 30-1

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

I support all the recommendations to disassemble it first. 
By the way, when I disassembled it, this simple pump taught an history lesson.
It is a British made Whale Gusher, a very good pump. My only problem was the 
nut, totally eaten out by corrosion. Simple, I'll find another nut. Well, the 
nut I purchased didn't fit. Might be a metric one. Nope.  Doing some research, 
I found out that the nut coming from England was made using the Whitworth 
standard, not available in North America. I contacted the importer who wanted 
to sell me a kit for 70$. Are you nut? I won't purchase a 70$ kit to replace a 
simple nut. 
Ok, let's go on wiki, to find out that the Whitworth was the very first 
standard for nuts and bolt.
The Whitworth thread was the world's first national screw thread standard,[1] 
devised and specified by Joseph Whitworth in 1841. Until then, the only 
standardization was what little had been done by individual people and 
companies, with some companies' in-house standards spreading a bit within their 
industries. Whitworth's new standard specified a 55° thread angle and a thread 
depth of 0.640327p and a radius of 0.137329p, where p is the pitch. The thread 
pitch increases with diameter in steps specified on a chart. The Whitworth 
thread system was later to be adopted as a British Standard to become British 
Standard Whitworth. An example of the use of the Whitworth thread is the Royal 
Navy's Crimean War gunboats. These are the first instance of mass-production 
techniques being applied to marine engineering as the following quotation from 
the obituary from The Times of 24 January 1887 to Sir Joseph Whitworth 
(1803–1887) shows:
The Crimean War began, and Sir Charles Napier demanded of the Admiralty 120 
gunboats, each with engines of 60 horsepower, for the campaign of 1855 in the 
Baltic. There were just ninety days in which to meet this requisition, and, 
short as the time was, the building of the gunboats presented no difficulty. It 
was otherwise however with the engines, and the Admiralty were in despair. 
Suddenly, by a flash of the mechanical genius which was inherent in him, the 
late Mr John Penn solved the difficulty, and solved it quite easily. He had a 
pair of engines on hand of the exact size. He took them to pieces and he 
distributed the parts among the best machine shops in the country, telling each 
to make ninety sets exactly in all respects to the sample. The orders were 
executed with unfailing regularity, and he actually completed ninety sets of 
engines of 60 horsepower in ninety days – a feat which made the great 
Continental Powers stare with wonder, and which was possible only because the 
Whitworth standards of measurement and of accuracy and finish were by that time 
thoroughly recognised and established throughout the country.

An original example of the gunboat type engine was raised from the wreck of the 
SS Xantho by the Western Australian Museum. On disassembly, all its threads 
were shown to be of the Whitworth type.[2]

How did it ended up? I was traveling to England for vacation that summer. I 
found a shop in Portsmouth and had a great conversation with the shop owner who 
sold me a pair of half inch whitworth treaded nuts. I keep the second one 
preciously in my garage.

Antoine (CC Cousin)

Le 2014-11-17 à 10:31, Ronald B. Frerker via CnC-List a écrit :

 On the subject of bilge pumps, mine is not working.  It's the original pump 
 located on the cockpit floor.  I suspect the diaphram is ruptured.
 I'm an hour from the boat and freezing; I believe it's a Whale gusher???
 Any idea where parts can be found?
 Ron
 Wild Cheri
 STL
 
 
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Stus-List CC 37 built in Italy

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Hi guys,
I visited Corsica during my vacations in September. Walking along the docks in 
Calvi, I was surprised by a familiar boat design, Watching more closely, yes, 
this is a CC 37, but not really looking exactly like a Canadian one. I chatted 
with the owner who confirmed that is was a CC 37 built in Livourno in Italy. I 
knew some CCs were built in Germany, but Italy?
See for yourself: 
http://s118.photobucket.com/user/roseant/media/DSC_2200_3580.jpg.html?sort=3o=4
 

Antoine (CC 30, Cousin)

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Re: Stus-List CC30 MK1 to windward

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Hi Curtis,
When I crossed the Atlantic with my CC 30-1, I had hope that I would be doing 
much more downwind than what I got. I almost crossed twice on windward.
A couple of observations on the behavior when going to windward in rough 
weather:
- First and foremost, forget roller furling, the boat will behave much better 
if you fly the sail designed for the correct weather. With a brand new, 
especially designed for offshore roller furling genoa, my boat would 
progressively slow down and lose pointing ability as I roll in the genoa. Good 
power is needed to make progress in heavier seas. Inexperienced sailor tend to 
reduce too much and get the boat underpowered. Instead of a partially rolled 
furling, flying a good blade jib with reefs on it's dedicated sail tracks would 
be my choice in heavy weather. When weather was getting rough, flying the jib 
instead of the genoa gave me better pointing and more speed instantly. An inner 
forestay not only allow you to fly hank on jibs, it also moves the center of 
the sail closer to the mast.

- In heavier weather with 2 meter seas, the boat will, once in a while, fall 
abruptly in the waves and will make scary sounds. It cannot be totally avoided 
but trimming can improve. Don't try to point too much, the boat require speed 
to handle the waves well. The main car is set off to windward, halyard is 
tight. Putting the car in the middle allows the main too much freedom to move 
and slam from time to time, with the potential to damage the sheet rigging. 
Moving the jib car aft allows the top of the sail to fall off the wind, 
reducing heeling while keeping good power.

- Never delay reefing the main. Much easier to remove it. Most important, 
reefing should be damn easy. If it's not, fix it before going out for real. Try 
heavy weather  under controlled conditions as soon as you can to test yourself 
and the boat. In heavy weather, noise is impressive and forces are surprising. 
Rolling a flapping genoa is a real challenge and may require the use of the 
winch. Expect that simple maneuver will take much longer

- When thing gets rougher, you can drop the main et the boat sails very well 
under jib alone.

- The mast step must be strong and rock solid to endure the slamming in the 
waves. Heavier seas requires tighter rigging. The mast is subject to sudden and 
quick acceleration  when the boat tip on top of waves. Loose rigging is good 
for racing in light air, not on the ocean. When tightening shrouds, the rule of 
thumbs is, that the shrouds to leeward to become soft but not slack when 
healing at about 15 to 20 degrees. Make it 25 degrees for the ocean.

-Have fun

Antoine (CC Cousin)


Le 2014-11-04 à 09:38, Curtis via CnC-List a écrit :

 I have not had a lot of windward experiences with my new CC. Its an old boat 
 but 4 years new to me. It looks like it points well thew I do loose some 
 control of steering and some weather helm. So far most all of sailing her has 
 been in the rivers around Beaufort and Charleston SC. Have not been off shore 
 but a few times with light wind. So I would love to here if these boats 
 handle well in bigger wind and waves like offshore or near shore. Like 29% to 
 so 40% off the nose with 4 to 6 foot seas on the nose? Is it comfortable as 
 far as 30 footer class boats go? Thanks for your incite.
 I cant wate to get some sail-time off shore this winter and spring. Its great 
 living where I dont have to put the boat away in the Winter.
 -- 
 Best regards,
 
 Curtis McDaniel, 
 
 CC 30-MK1 East Coast Lady
 
 Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you 
 didn't do than by the ones you did do. So throw off the bowlines. Sail away 
 from the safe harbor. Catch the trade winds in your sails. Explore. Dream. 
 Discover.  -Mark Twain
 
 
 cpt.b...@gmail.com
 
  
 
  __/) 
 
 . 
 
 
 
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Re: Stus-List Tank fill Key

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Davis is selling a universal key that also fit winch handle socket.
http://www.davisnet.com/marine/products/marine_product.asp?pnum=00381
If you want to try to read French, here is the real thing you're probably 
looking for.
http://www.discount-nautic.com/produit/petite-cle-pour-ouverture-bouchons-hexagone-reduit
You can order online.


Antoine (CC 30 Cousin)


Le 2014-10-18 à 10:25, Kim Brown via CnC-List a écrit :

 Anyone,
 All my tank fills (Diesel, Waters, Waste) require a winch handle to open
 close.  Had a small plastic Barient key that was very handy to use. It is
 MIA. Any source for a replacement? Winch handles work fine but the little
 plastic key fits in the pocket better
 
 Kim Brown 
 Trust Me !!! 35-3
 
 
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Re: Stus-List CC30MK1 sail plan

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Curtis, sorry for the delay, I was away.
The whole standing rigging was dismantled and changed with new wires and 
Stalock fittings. Spreaders were dismantled and inspected but didn't need 
anything. I wouldn't worried about your spreader. Spreaders with some play are 
common on many riggings, as long as the play isn't excessive because or wear or 
a broken part. The tough part was to dismantle the anchor bolt for the upper 
shrouds, The damn thing was hard to get out because of the usual mix of 
aluminum/stainless corrosion. Removal was necessary for inspection and because 
of stories about CC 27 similar bolt being cut through by the wire halyard. The 
bolt was perfect, as good as new.

Longer passages are the ones  when you can choose your weather for departure 
and will have no choice but to cope with whatever comes up after. Usually, 
anything longer than two days is a good candidate. You then really need the 
storm jib, hoping you will not use it.
I grew in sailing with hank-on sails and it took a while adjusting to the 
roller furling, especially when winds builds up. The right sail for the right 
wind really make a big difference. On the ocean, the roller furling combined 
with a removable inner forestay gave me the best of two world. The roller 
furling gives you flexibility in fair winds and the ability to really choose 
the surface area in heavy wind downwind. Up-wind the inner forestay gives the 
ability to fly a jib that will really get your boat moving in heavier weather. 
In costal cruising day to day , the inner forestay is more a nuisance than 
anything else and this is when you want it removable.

I installed a folding prop because my previous prop was a fixed three blades, 
The folding Varifold gave at least half a knot and as much as a full knot 
advantage. Much easier to experience 7 knots speeds with the folding. On an 
ocean crossing, it cut almost one day off for every week.

Waves: I found near shore waves are more frightening than far away ocean waves, 
even if the later can be much bigger. On the ocean, you get three feet as soon 
as there is some wind. Six feet as soon as the wind builds up  a bit and when 
things gets a bit tougher, it jump to 9 feet. I've seen 12 feet and more on a 
number of occasions. The boat behaved well in all circumstances except for a 
set of particular waves in the gulf of Biscay (about 12 feet high), but nasty 
because they had the tendency to turn the boat on the side, attempting to roll 
it. We had a knock-down with one of these waves. The boat does not drive thru 
the waves, it mostly climb them easily. The worst thing is upwind. Once in a 
while, the boat will fall of an irregular wave and slam into the next one. I 
didn't know how well built CCs are before that crossing. To give you and idea, 
when I came back, I dismantled ale main cabin bulkheads to clean and inspect, 
to find out that all screws were bent after the slamming in the waves.

Diesel, I used only half of my 25 gallon reserve between North America and the 
Azores, mostly for battery charging and motoring the final 12 hours to the 
Azores.
Water, with three people on board, we used only half of the 38 gallon reserve 
in 18 days.
Holding tank of 20 gals, with a system to pump out at sea on the ocean.

I don't know what is a larger, more ocean capable boat. An ocean capable boat 
is first a well designed and well built boat that is in top shape. It might be 
40 years old as well if it is in top shape. Top shape means that weaknesses of 
the boat are known and have been addressed, that all system have been reviewed, 
repaired and replaced where needed, that fundamentals such as steering system, 
keel bolts, hull deck join, mast step, chainplates and bulkheads have been 
either inspected, dismantled, repaired, reinforced. The rigging is new or 
recent, sails are new or recent.
Then you need a very well trained crew. Remember that in most stories, crew 
failed first by not knowing how to react.

You have a nice sail inventory, albeit a bit shy in the heavy range, but fine 
for most coastal cruising. How often have you tried your 110% with two reef 
points? Get out in rough weather to try it out and take notes of things such as 
block positions, make marks on the halyard for reef points. Is discovered in a 
rough weather trial that my opening block were breaking open easily when the 
sail was flapping and fixed it. Do not discover these things once you're gone 
on the ocean. Did you ever tried rough weather at night? Go ahead and do it.

Best of luck
Antoine

Le 2014-08-20 à 08:25, Curtis via CnC-List a écrit :

 Thanks Antoine,
  Thanks for the help. I have a question for you. When you and I talked before 
 you told me you upgraded your standing rigging for off-shore sailing, Well 
 did you change your spreaders or do anything to sturdy them up? Both of mine 
 are pined on and will move around a little, like 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch front 
 to back? Is this normal. I had an inspection done 

Re: Stus-List CC30MK1 sail plan

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Curtis,
I still have the original instruction manual for my CC 30-1 (1973), and there 
is no such thing in the manual.
These sail reduction pattern were popular in the era of hank-on sails, when 
boats were carrying more than half a dozen sails to cover various wind 
conditions.
I guess such a sail reduction pattern could be constructed based on collective 
experience, taking into account the fact that most boats today carry roller 
furling sails.

Here is my own reduction pattern followed on the ocean with the following sail 
inventory: main with three reefs, reinforced furling genoa 135%, working jib 
65% permanently hanked-on on removable inner forestay, 20% storm jib stored in 
a bag secured on deck for easy access and, spinnaker. I also had in store a 
110% hank-on genoa which was never used but could have been if anything 
happened to the genoa.

Upwind
Up to Force 4 (16 knots true), full main and full genoa. Getting closer to 16 
knots, the genoa may get a few turns to the first dot (115%)
Up to Force 5 (22 knots true), Main one reef and genoa rolled to second dot 
(100%)
Up to force 6 (26 knots true  on average, meaning that occasional gusts near 26 
knots): Main two reefs and working jib 65%, much more efficient than rolled 
genoa.
Continuous wind 25 knots and above up to 35 knots, Main three reefs on lower 
end of spectrum, and Jib, Jib only in the upper range
Above 35 knots, up to 40 knots and above in gusts, main three reefs and storm 
jib
Above 45 knots, forget the idea of going upwind.

Downwind
Up to Force 4 (Main and spinnaker)
Force 5 main and full genoa
Force 6 (Main one reef and genoa getting partially rolled 120%)
Force 7 (Main two reefs and genoa rolled 110%)
Force 8 No main, and genoa less than 100%
Force 9 Genoa about 40%
Above storm jib for a while. Never did that, thankfully.

If I had to change anything in the setting, I would like very much a 100% blade 
jib with two reefs instead of the 65% working jib. Upwind, the genoa would get 
rolled after force 4 to raise the blade, heavier weather can be fun when you 
have the right sails for it.

Antoine (CC 30 Cousin)



Le 2014-08-19 à 10:32, Curtis via CnC-List a écrit :

 Can anybody give me the sailplan for my boat? What sail to use under what 
 wind condition. What is the comfort rating, tern over ratio. I have no paper 
 work with this boat that shows this information. It would be nice to have a 
 printed version of this information.
 
 example on sail -plan 
 The sail plan for a Lagoon 380 in sustained winds is as follows:
 
 Force 5 winds (up to 22 knots): full sail, both main and jib.
 
 Force 6 winds (22 to 26 knots): one reef in the main and full jib.
 
 Force 7 winds (27 to 28 knots): one reef in the main and one reef in the jib.
 
 Force 7 winds (29 to 33 knots): two reefs in both the main and the jib.
 
 Force 8 winds (34 to 38 knots): two reefs in the main and three reefs in the 
 jib.
 
 Force 9 winds (39 to 44 knots): drop mainsail completely and three reefs in 
 jib.
 
 Above 44 knots, all sail is dropped and the mainsail bag and boom will be 
 quite enough sail, thank you.
 
 Thanks for your help...
 -- 
 Best regards,
 
 Curtis McDaniel, 
 
 CC 30-MK1 East Coast Lady
 
 Port Royal,
 
 South Carolina
 
 
 cpt.b...@gmail.com
 
  
 
  __/) 
 
 . 
 
 
 
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Re: Stus-List CC 30 mk1 rudder design

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

Hi Ron,
I have a CC 30 1973 (hull built in 1972) with that exact rudder.
Yes, there are some weather helm, especially on a reach with a tiller.
When I purchased the boat in 2000, I noted that an earlier owner bolted a piece 
of wood in front of the rudder to increase the compensation by adding surface 
forward.
Interestingly, when I hauled out the boat in Collins Bay Marina (Lake Ontario), 
the guys there noted the piece of wood and told me that it was the same as on
the boat hull number one, which was originally owned by Georges Hinterholler, 
the architect of this boat. Hull number was in Collins Bay back in 2000.
Georges added this piece to correct a flaw in the rudder design. Later on, I 
removed the piece of wood because it was rotting slowly
and was also a major source of water infiltration in the rudder.
I shaped a piece of high density styrofoam (used for insulation under house 
foundation floors) and glued it to the forefront of the rudder.
Using various sanders (belt, oscillating and hand) I shaped it to match the 
shape of the rudder and then fiberglassed over with two layers of cloth. I 
finished
it with interprotect over the rudder. In the end, it added about two inches to 
the fore front and reduced noticeably the weather helm.
Not a difficult job if you're handy a bit. Since this rudder has crossed the 
Atlantic ocean twice, I'm not worried about structural integrity.
Wonderful boat, capable of going far, safely.
Points to check:
- Early mast steps needed repair because of rot
- Boom may still be at 5'6. It can be raised with no big problem, meaning the 
boom needs to be shortened. Of course, if you do that the main won't fit 
anymore.
So, plan this for next replacement of the main.
- Later model had a split backstay and earlier had it in the center. It's hard 
to tension the stay properly without observing the stern distorting.
It's easy to shift to a split back stay eventually.
- Check carefully the lamination of the aft starboard bulkhead, in front of the 
stove.
These bulkhead were protected by a white plastics that didn't bonded well to 
fiberglass.

Fair winds
Antoine (CC 30 Cousin)


Le 2014-06-11 à 13:00, Ron and Sharon via CnC-List a écrit :

 Good morning,
 This is my first entry on the cnc-list. I have 40 yrs. of sailing experiece; 
 mostly on Petersons.
 I am presently without a boat and have been looking at older CC 30 mk1's 
 (1973-75).
 There are several for sale in my area; asking price about $16,000.
 They seem to be well built and in good structural cond. Most have diesel 
 engines.
 My only real concern is the rudder design (swept back, scimitar shaped).
 Does this design cause excessive tiller pressure when reaching in heavy air?
 How is it for steering when backing into a marina?
 I see that in 1976 they redesigned the rudder. I have not seen a decent 
 1976-78 mk1 for sale in my area yet.
 Do you think I should forget the 1973-75's and wait for a 1976 or later one?
 I am looking at boats in this era because they are affordable to me.
  
 Thanks for any replies.
  
 Ron
 Nanaimo, BC, Canada
  
  
  
  
  
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Re: Stus-List Replacing the toilet and holding tank in a 1980 CC 30 Mk 1

[Antoine Rose via CnC-List]

I changed the holding tank on my CC 30 because the thing was leaking.
It starts by removing the vanity, the sink. It's fairly easy, everything is 
screwed, not glued.
I had to destroy the back panel because screws were not accessible. I made a 
pattern for the new one before destroying the old one.
Once everything is removed, clean with aggressive stuff and paint. Nothing like 
a new paint to get rid of old odours.
Now that it  took some time to remove all of this, I did a thorough job, 
including replacing old gate valve and thru hulls.
I constructed a new septic tank to use as much space as I could, ending with a 
20 gallon tank instead of 12.
The tank has an odd shape and was made with 1/4 plywood as a support for 
fiberglass inside and outside. I also added a semi transparent window,
to see the level in there. There is also a pump that allow me to empty the tank 
out at sea, far away from coast. Finally, note there are two
air intake,  to ensure a good supply of oxygen in the tank, the recipe to no 
odours.
Here are some pictures:
http://s118.photobucket.com/user/roseant/media/Img_0293.jpg.html?sort=3o=24
http://s118.photobucket.com/user/roseant/media/Img_0296.jpg.html?sort=3o=23

Antoine (CC 30 Cousin)

Le 2014-05-12 à 13:09, Peter Delean via CnC-List a écrit :

 Before I break a sweat, thought I should check in with the group. I know the 
 holding tank is behind the teak wall or vanity but I was curious as to how 
 much had to be removed before gaining access to the tank. If it all needs to 
 be removed, is there anyone out there who can supply photos, nuggets of 
 wisdom, step by step instructions, tips or tricks to getting things apart 
 with minimal destruction?
 
 I know several have done this job on their boats, and replaced the metal 
 holding tank with a plastic one. (I lost the names of tank suppliers). I am 
 looking at installing one of the new Jabsco toilets.
 
 After resetting the hard drive on my computer I lost the link to the archives 
 and my links to suppliers, so I have not checked there yet.
 
 From Peter, in Penetanguishene...running out of Febreze.
 
 Peter Delean
 CC 30 Mk1
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