Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke
I'm not sure that what I have to add to this subject is of much value but I've had sailboats for over 40 years and never ran into this issue. Bob Boyer S/V Rainy Days (1983 C Landfall 38 - Hull #230) Blog: dainyrays.blogspot.com Email: dainyr...@icloud.com Annapolis, MD > On Jul 31, 2018, at 5:37 PM, bwhitmore via CnC-List > wrote: > > Ok, let's think about this, and I'm asking a question, not disagreeing. If > one sucks out the oil on an engine at an angle, then there is likely a pool > of old oil left in the rear of the engine, so you don't get all of it out.. > Do you add back the full spec amount per the manual, then be comfortable that > it's right based on the new, presumed correct dipstick level? > > After all this time, why haven't we been told about this before, or even > advised of it by folks like Beta who specialize in marine engines? > > What is the difference in dipstick readings that we would be looking at? > > I've always been told, (and tend to agree) that overfilling oil is worse than > running at the low end of the full range. > > That said my dad had an old jet boat with a gas engine that would take a bit > to get up on plane, and if the oil wasn't kept really full, the engine oil > pump would suck air and it would lose oil pressure... > > I'm very interested in the owners thoughts on this subject, > > Bruce Whitmore > > Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone > > Original message > From: Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List > Date: 7/31/18 2:04 PM (GMT-06:00) > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Cc: Marek Dziedzic > Subject: Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke > > Keep in mind that most of our inboard engines are mounted at an angle. And > also most come from a tractor industry, where they were designed to be used > flat. This means that in many (most?) cases, the dipstick shows an incorrect > level of oil (usually lower than it should be). You have to find out what is > the right level on the dipstick in your particular engine. Sucking out or > draining the oil is certainly one way of figuring this out. > > Marek > > > From: Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List > Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2018 09:06 > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Cc: Della Barba, Joe > Subject: Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke > > Check the dipstick and then suck the oil out and see how much you really have. > > Joe > Coquina > > ___ > > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and > every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use > PayPal to send contribution -- > https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.paypal.me%2Fstumurraydata=02%7C01%7C%7C8f08f828f9d84c5b0bfb08d5f6e6777c%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636686392056691040sdata=YQeNkBDgvu9r4zpxU3J3qeg81gpjNqj9MeB4WfAuiZY%3Dreserved=0 > > ___ > > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and > every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use > PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray > ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke
I dropped Corsair's oil pan during her upper end rebuild. I drained the oil the usual way...via the dipstick. Very little oil in the pan. Maybe a few tablespoons. Dunno if that fact helps to know it the engine being at an angle changes readings, but we are getting 98% of the old oil out. Pan was also clean after 35 years ss well. >From my Android From: CnC-List on behalf of Rick Brass via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2018 10:10:20 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Rick Brass Subject: Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke Josh; The camshaft driven lift pump is sort of a Yanmar thing. Most Cummins, Perkins, Beta, Universal, Mitsubishi, etc. engines built in the last 15-20 years (and the newer high pressure common rail Yanmars) use an electric lift pump. Just like your fuel injected car engine, it is necessary to pressurize the HP injection pump prestart to ensure the reservoir in the pump is full to get proper injector volume. If the seals in the high pressure pump are leaking, you can get fuel into the engine oil. But you’ll notice hard starting, increased vibration, and rough engine operation long before you see much fuel in the oil pan. The most likely source of fuel in the oil is a combination of worn rings and faulty injectors. The later can cause the former, BTW. Excess fuel injected can remove the film of oil that seals the rings and “wash out” the cylinder walls causing loss of compression and wear of the rings and cylinder wall. The excess, unburned, fuel gets into the oil. The resulting fuel/oil mix being splashed or forced into the cylinder by excessive pressure in the oil pan is the likely cause of a runaway engine. Rick Brass Washington, NC From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Josh Muckley via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2018 8:09 PM To: C List Cc: Josh Muckley Subject: Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke To build on Neil's thoughts: diesels typically have an approved lube oil consumption rate - they burn it. So over time the level should go down... Slowly. The GM, QM, and HM series engines (at least) have 2 fatal flaws in the fuel system. -The first and most likely is the lift pump. It is a diaphragm pump the has a drive lever the sticks in the side of the engine block. If the diagram develops a leak then fuel can leak into the oil sump. -The second is the HP fuel pump. Clearances can wear in the pump and leak fuel into the sump. You'll see the sump level increase in both cases and you might smell fuel in the oil. If you put a drop of oil on a paper towel you can observe a halo of fuel develop. The fuel thins the oil potentially damaging the bearings and cylinders. Neglected long enough and accumulating high enough concentrations it might cause a fire or a runaway diesel. Josh Muckley S/V Sea Hawk 1989 C 37+ Solomons, MD ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke
Josh; The camshaft driven lift pump is sort of a Yanmar thing. Most Cummins, Perkins, Beta, Universal, Mitsubishi, etc. engines built in the last 15-20 years (and the newer high pressure common rail Yanmars) use an electric lift pump. Just like your fuel injected car engine, it is necessary to pressurize the HP injection pump prestart to ensure the reservoir in the pump is full to get proper injector volume. If the seals in the high pressure pump are leaking, you can get fuel into the engine oil. But you’ll notice hard starting, increased vibration, and rough engine operation long before you see much fuel in the oil pan. The most likely source of fuel in the oil is a combination of worn rings and faulty injectors. The later can cause the former, BTW. Excess fuel injected can remove the film of oil that seals the rings and “wash out” the cylinder walls causing loss of compression and wear of the rings and cylinder wall. The excess, unburned, fuel gets into the oil. The resulting fuel/oil mix being splashed or forced into the cylinder by excessive pressure in the oil pan is the likely cause of a runaway engine. Rick Brass Washington, NC From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Josh Muckley via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2018 8:09 PM To: C List Cc: Josh Muckley Subject: Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke To build on Neil's thoughts: diesels typically have an approved lube oil consumption rate - they burn it. So over time the level should go down... Slowly. The GM, QM, and HM series engines (at least) have 2 fatal flaws in the fuel system. -The first and most likely is the lift pump. It is a diaphragm pump the has a drive lever the sticks in the side of the engine block. If the diagram develops a leak then fuel can leak into the oil sump. -The second is the HP fuel pump. Clearances can wear in the pump and leak fuel into the sump. You'll see the sump level increase in both cases and you might smell fuel in the oil. If you put a drop of oil on a paper towel you can observe a halo of fuel develop. The fuel thins the oil potentially damaging the bearings and cylinders. Neglected long enough and accumulating high enough concentrations it might cause a fire or a runaway diesel. Josh Muckley S/V Sea Hawk 1989 C 37+ Solomons, MD ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke
Bruce; If you have a Beta, Universal, or Westerbeke engine, there is an oil extraction hose routed from the back of the oil pan (the low point) to the front of the engine that you use for removing the oil. On the Betas, there is a pump connected to that hose (which is a really nice feature). I have a Universal, and drain the hose into an oil change pan; but you can also connect it to a FLOCS (Fast Lube Oil Change) pump to extract the oil. So you basically get all the old oil out. My 36HP Universal M35B is a marinized Kubota 4 cylinder engine (and the 4 cylinder 35 HP Beta uses the same base Kubota engine). The dip stick on my Universal is different than the dipstick on the Kubota tractors. Something I noticed when using a rental Kubota tractor loader backhoe for a landscaping project. An when changing oil, be sure to determine if you should add the volume of the filter you just changed to the listed engine capacity. I found that for my engine, putting 4 quarts of oil in after a change (rather than the 3.5 qts listed capacity) fills the filter and brings the oil level to slightly over the top mark on the dipstick. YMMV Rick Brass Washington, NC From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of bwhitmore via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2018 5:37 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: bwhitmore Subject: Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke Ok, let's think about this, and I'm asking a question, not disagreeing. If one sucks out the oil on an engine at an angle, then there is likely a pool of old oil left in the rear of the engine, so you don't get all of it out.. Do you add back the full spec amount per the manual, then be comfortable that it's right based on the new, presumed correct dipstick level? After all this time, why haven't we been told about this before, or even advised of it by folks like Beta who specialize in marine engines? What is the difference in dipstick readings that we would be looking at? I've always been told, (and tend to agree) that overfilling oil is worse than running at the low end of the full range. That said my dad had an old jet boat with a gas engine that would take a bit to get up on plane, and if the oil wasn't kept really full, the engine oil pump would suck air and it would lose oil pressure... I'm very interested in the owners thoughts on this subject, Bruce Whitmore Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone Original message From: Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> > Date: 7/31/18 2:04 PM (GMT-06:00) To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Cc: Marek Dziedzic mailto:dziedzi...@hotmail.com> > Subject: Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke Keep in mind that most of our inboard engines are mounted at an angle. And also most come from a tractor industry, where they were designed to be used flat. This means that in many (most?) cases, the dipstick shows an incorrect level of oil (usually lower than it should be). You have to find out what is the right level on the dipstick in your particular engine. Sucking out or draining the oil is certainly one way of figuring this out. Marek From: Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2018 09:06 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Cc: Della Barba, Joe Subject: Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke Check the dipstick and then suck the oil out and see how much you really have. Joe Coquina ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.paypal.me%2Fstumurray <https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.paypal.me%2Fstumurraydata=02%7C01%7C%7C8f08f828f9d84c5b0bfb08d5f6e6777c%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636686392056691040sdata=YQeNkBDgvu9r4zpxU3J3qeg81gpjNqj9MeB4WfAuiZY%3Dreserved=0> data=02%7C01%7C%7C8f08f828f9d84c5b0bfb08d5f6e6777c%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636686392056691040sdata=YQeNkBDgvu9r4zpxU3J3qeg81gpjNqj9MeB4WfAuiZY%3Dreserved=0 ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke
To build on Neil's thoughts: diesels typically have an approved lube oil consumption rate - they burn it. So over time the level should go down... Slowly. The GM, QM, and HM series engines (at least) have 2 fatal flaws in the fuel system. -The first and most likely is the lift pump. It is a diaphragm pump the has a drive lever the sticks in the side of the engine block. If the diagram develops a leak then fuel can leak into the oil sump. -The second is the HP fuel pump. Clearances can wear in the pump and leak fuel into the sump. You'll see the sump level increase in both cases and you might smell fuel in the oil. If you put a drop of oil on a paper towel you can observe a halo of fuel develop. The fuel thins the oil potentially damaging the bearings and cylinders. Neglected long enough and accumulating high enough concentrations it might cause a fire or a runaway diesel. Josh Muckley S/V Sea Hawk 1989 C 37+ Solomons, MD On Tue, Jul 31, 2018, 7:04 PM schiller via CnC-List wrote: > I think you are all overthinking this. Most dipsticks have a full to add > range that is nearly a quart of oil. The engine oil pump will work quite > fine as long as the oil level remains above the pump pickup. > > I agree with Dennis. Most dipsticks are mid engine. > > My 2010 Ford Powerstroke Diesel 1 ton is well know to make oil due to the > Diesel Particulate Filter regeneration cycle pumping raw diesel fuel into > the exhaust stroke to burn soot in the filter. It is common for the 16 > quart oil pan to drain up to 24 quarts out. This mostly happens when the > DPF Regeneration cycle is interrupted. It is just something to watch. > > I put so few hours on the engine that I must admit that I don't check it > more than two or three times a year. > > Neil Schiller > 1983 C 35-3, #028 > "Grace" > Whitehall, Michigan > WLYC > > On 7/31/2018 5:54 PM, Dennis C. via CnC-List wrote: > > In my opinion, the dipstick rules. On my Universal 25XPB, the dipstick is > located in the center of the block lengthwise. So, dead level, tilted > front up or tilted front down, the dipstick should still read close to the > same. > > On a related note, the manual for my 25XPB specifies the following maximum > angles: > > Installation 14 degrees (tilt up or down) > Rotation 25 degrees > > That implies you could operate the 25XPB at 25 degrees of heel. Remember, > many marine engines are marinized tractor engines. Tractors are designed > to operate on a certain amount of side slope. > > Dennis C. > Touche' 35-1 #83 > Mandeville, LA > > On Tue, Jul 31, 2018 at 4:37 PM, bwhitmore via CnC-List < > cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > >> Ok, let's think about this, and I'm asking a question, not disagreeing. >> If one sucks out the oil on an engine at an angle, then there is likely a >> pool of old oil left in the rear of the engine, so you don't get all of it >> out.. Do you add back the full spec amount per the manual, then be >> comfortable that it's right based on the new, presumed correct dipstick >> level? >> >> After all this time, why haven't we been told about this before, or even >> advised of it by folks like Beta who specialize in marine engines? >> >> What is the difference in dipstick readings that we would be looking at? >> >> I've always been told, (and tend to agree) that overfilling oil is worse >> than running at the low end of the full range. >> >> That said my dad had an old jet boat with a gas engine that would take a >> bit to get up on plane, and if the oil wasn't kept really full, the engine >> oil pump would suck air and it would lose oil pressure... >> >> I'm very interested in the owners thoughts on this subject, >> >> Bruce Whitmore >> >> Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone >> >> Original message >> From: Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List >> Date: 7/31/18 2:04 PM (GMT-06:00) >> To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com >> Cc: Marek Dziedzic >> Subject: Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke >> >> Keep in mind that most of our inboard engines are mounted at an angle. >> And also most come from a tractor industry, where they were designed to be >> used flat. This means that in many (most?) cases, the dipstick shows an >> incorrect level of oil (usually lower than it should be). You have to find >> out what is the right level on the dipstick in your particular engine. >> Sucking out or draining the oil is certainly one way of figuring this out. >> >> Marek >> >> >> *From:* Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List >> *Sent:* Tuesday, July 31, 2018 09:06 >> *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com >>
Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke
I think you are all overthinking this. Most dipsticks have a full to add range that is nearly a quart of oil. The engine oil pump will work quite fine as long as the oil level remains above the pump pickup. I agree with Dennis. Most dipsticks are mid engine. My 2010 Ford Powerstroke Diesel 1 ton is well know to make oil due to the Diesel Particulate Filter regeneration cycle pumping raw diesel fuel into the exhaust stroke to burn soot in the filter. It is common for the 16 quart oil pan to drain up to 24 quarts out. This mostly happens when the DPF Regeneration cycle is interrupted. It is just something to watch. I put so few hours on the engine that I must admit that I don't check it more than two or three times a year. Neil Schiller 1983 C 35-3, #028 "Grace" Whitehall, Michigan WLYC On 7/31/2018 5:54 PM, Dennis C. via CnC-List wrote: In my opinion, the dipstick rules. On my Universal 25XPB, the dipstick is located in the center of the block lengthwise. So, dead level, tilted front up or tilted front down, the dipstick should still read close to the same. On a related note, the manual for my 25XPB specifies the following maximum angles: Installation 14 degrees (tilt up or down) Rotation 25 degrees That implies you could operate the 25XPB at 25 degrees of heel. Remember, many marine engines are marinized tractor engines. Tractors are designed to operate on a certain amount of side slope. Dennis C. Touche' 35-1 #83 Mandeville, LA On Tue, Jul 31, 2018 at 4:37 PM, bwhitmore via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote: Ok, let's think about this, and I'm asking a question, not disagreeing. If one sucks out the oil on an engine at an angle, then there is likely a pool of old oil left in the rear of the engine, so you don't get all of it out.. Do you add back the full spec amount per the manual, then be comfortable that it's right based on the new, presumed correct dipstick level? After all this time, why haven't we been told about this before, or even advised of it by folks like Beta who specialize in marine engines? What is the difference in dipstick readings that we would be looking at? I've always been told, (and tend to agree) that overfilling oil is worse than running at the low end of the full range. That said my dad had an old jet boat with a gas engine that would take a bit to get up on plane, and if the oil wasn't kept really full, the engine oil pump would suck air and it would lose oil pressure... I'm very interested in the owners thoughts on this subject, Bruce Whitmore Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone Original message From: Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> Date: 7/31/18 2:04 PM (GMT-06:00) To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com <mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Cc: Marek Dziedzic mailto:dziedzi...@hotmail.com>> Subject: Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke Keep in mind that most of our inboard engines are mounted at an angle. And also most come from a tractor industry, where they were designed to be used flat. This means that in many (most?) cases, the dipstick shows an incorrect level of oil (usually lower than it should be). You have to find out what is the right level on the dipstick in your particular engine. Sucking out or draining the oil is certainly one way of figuring this out. Marek *From:* Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List *Sent:* Tuesday, July 31, 2018 09:06 *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com *Cc:* Della Barba, Joe *Subject:* Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke Check the dipstick and then suck the oil out and see how much you really have. Joe Coquina ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.paypal.me%2Fstumurraydata=02%7C01%7C%7C8f08f828f9d84c5b0bfb08d5f6e6777c%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636686392056691040sdata=YQeNkBDgvu9r4zpxU3J3qeg81gpjNqj9MeB4WfAuiZY%3Dreserved=0 <https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.paypal.me%2Fstumurraydata=02%7C01%7C%7C8f08f828f9d84c5b0bfb08d5f6e6777c%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636686392056691040sdata=YQeNkBDgvu9r4zpxU3J3qeg81gpjNqj9MeB4WfAuiZY%3Dreserved=0> ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray <https://www.paypal.me/stumurray> _
Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke
In my opinion, the dipstick rules. On my Universal 25XPB, the dipstick is located in the center of the block lengthwise. So, dead level, tilted front up or tilted front down, the dipstick should still read close to the same. On a related note, the manual for my 25XPB specifies the following maximum angles: Installation 14 degrees (tilt up or down) Rotation 25 degrees That implies you could operate the 25XPB at 25 degrees of heel. Remember, many marine engines are marinized tractor engines. Tractors are designed to operate on a certain amount of side slope. Dennis C. Touche' 35-1 #83 Mandeville, LA On Tue, Jul 31, 2018 at 4:37 PM, bwhitmore via CnC-List < cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > Ok, let's think about this, and I'm asking a question, not disagreeing. > If one sucks out the oil on an engine at an angle, then there is likely a > pool of old oil left in the rear of the engine, so you don't get all of it > out.. Do you add back the full spec amount per the manual, then be > comfortable that it's right based on the new, presumed correct dipstick > level? > > After all this time, why haven't we been told about this before, or even > advised of it by folks like Beta who specialize in marine engines? > > What is the difference in dipstick readings that we would be looking at? > > I've always been told, (and tend to agree) that overfilling oil is worse > than running at the low end of the full range. > > That said my dad had an old jet boat with a gas engine that would take a > bit to get up on plane, and if the oil wasn't kept really full, the engine > oil pump would suck air and it would lose oil pressure... > > I'm very interested in the owners thoughts on this subject, > > Bruce Whitmore > > Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone > > Original message > From: Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List > Date: 7/31/18 2:04 PM (GMT-06:00) > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Cc: Marek Dziedzic > Subject: Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke > > Keep in mind that most of our inboard engines are mounted at an angle. And > also most come from a tractor industry, where they were designed to be used > flat. This means that in many (most?) cases, the dipstick shows an > incorrect level of oil (usually lower than it should be). You have to find > out what is the right level on the dipstick in your particular engine. > Sucking out or draining the oil is certainly one way of figuring this out. > > Marek > > > *From:* Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List > *Sent:* Tuesday, July 31, 2018 09:06 > *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com > *Cc:* Della Barba, Joe > *Subject:* Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke > > Check the dipstick and then suck the oil out and see how much you really > have. > > Joe > Coquina > > ___ > > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each > and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - > use PayPal to send contribution -- https://nam03.safelinks. > protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.paypal.me% > 2Fstumurraydata=02%7C01%7C%7C8f08f828f9d84c5b0bfb08d5f6e6777c% > 7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636686392056691040sdata= > YQeNkBDgvu9r4zpxU3J3qeg81gpjNqj9MeB4WfAuiZY%3Dreserved=0 > > > ___ > > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each > and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - > use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray > > > ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke
Ok, let's think about this, and I'm asking a question, not disagreeing. If one sucks out the oil on an engine at an angle, then there is likely a pool of old oil left in the rear of the engine, so you don't get all of it out.. Do you add back the full spec amount per the manual, then be comfortable that it's right based on the new, presumed correct dipstick level? After all this time, why haven't we been told about this before, or even advised of it by folks like Beta who specialize in marine engines? What is the difference in dipstick readings that we would be looking at? I've always been told, (and tend to agree) that overfilling oil is worse than running at the low end of the full range. That said my dad had an old jet boat with a gas engine that would take a bit to get up on plane, and if the oil wasn't kept really full, the engine oil pump would suck air and it would lose oil pressure... I'm very interested in the owners thoughts on this subject, Bruce Whitmore Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone Original message From: Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List Date: 7/31/18 2:04 PM (GMT-06:00) To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Marek Dziedzic Subject: Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke Keep in mind that most of our inboard engines are mounted at an angle. And also most come from a tractor industry, where they were designed to be used flat. This means that in many (most?) cases, the dipstick shows an incorrect level of oil (usually lower than it should be). You have to find out what is the right level on the dipstick in your particular engine. Sucking out or draining the oil is certainly one way of figuring this out. Marek From: Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2018 09:06 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Della Barba, Joe Subject: Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke Check the dipstick and then suck the oil out and see how much you really have. Joe Coquina ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.paypal.me%2Fstumurraydata=02%7C01%7C%7C8f08f828f9d84c5b0bfb08d5f6e6777c%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636686392056691040sdata=YQeNkBDgvu9r4zpxU3J3qeg81gpjNqj9MeB4WfAuiZY%3Dreserved=0 ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke
Keep in mind that most of our inboard engines are mounted at an angle. And also most come from a tractor industry, where they were designed to be used flat. This means that in many (most?) cases, the dipstick shows an incorrect level of oil (usually lower than it should be). You have to find out what is the right level on the dipstick in your particular engine. Sucking out or draining the oil is certainly one way of figuring this out. Marek From: Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2018 09:06 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: Della Barba, Joe Subject: Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke Check the dipstick and then suck the oil out and see how much you really have. Joe Coquina ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://nam03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.paypal.me%2Fstumurraydata=02%7C01%7C%7C8f08f828f9d84c5b0bfb08d5f6e6777c%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C636686392056691040sdata=YQeNkBDgvu9r4zpxU3J3qeg81gpjNqj9MeB4WfAuiZY%3Dreserved=0 ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke
Check the dipstick and then suck the oil out and see how much you really have. Joe Coquina ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke
o having a >>> replacement built, but that is going to take more time and money to do, so >>> I am wondering what the experience and wisdom of the group is on the issue >>> of repair. Thanks- Dave >>> >>> Aries >>> 1990 C 34+ >>> New London, CT >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ___ >>> >>> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each >>> and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - >>> use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray >>> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.paypal.me_stumurray=DwMFaQ=clK7kQUTWtAVEOVIgvi0NU5BOUHhpN0H8p7CSfnc_gI=9w3G7Cf8YfQnrjmtuNxwDJYr3JMv9f1pAfgAJ9xXYQQ=mJXNaAcpyhHcm-UHdynsBGMWClt7o9ApNe2hK1QQc2U=MWE8uJlrCvap5_k_8NwUfeGye9Ldpa19IcWuPxh_Iwk=> >>> >>> ___ >> >> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each >> and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - >> use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray >> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.paypal.me_stumurray=DwMFaQ=clK7kQUTWtAVEOVIgvi0NU5BOUHhpN0H8p7CSfnc_gI=9w3G7Cf8YfQnrjmtuNxwDJYr3JMv9f1pAfgAJ9xXYQQ=mJXNaAcpyhHcm-UHdynsBGMWClt7o9ApNe2hK1QQc2U=MWE8uJlrCvap5_k_8NwUfeGye9Ldpa19IcWuPxh_Iwk=> >> >> >> ___ >> >> Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each >> and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - >> use PayPal to send contribution -- https://urldefense. >> proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.paypal.me_stumurray= >> DwICAg=clK7kQUTWtAVEOVIgvi0NU5BOUHhpN0H8p7CSfnc_gI=9w3G7 >> Cf8YfQnrjmtuNxwDJYr3JMv9f1pAfgAJ9xXYQQ=mJXNaAcpyhHcm-UHdyn >> sBGMWClt7o9ApNe2hK1QQc2U=MWE8uJlrCvap5_k_8NwUfeGye9Ldpa19IcWuPxh_Iwk= >> >> >> > > > -- Forwarded message -- > From: Glenn Henderson > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Cc: > Bcc: > Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2018 17:32:00 -0600 > Subject: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke > >> I have a 3JH4E on my 41. Strangely, after the engine sits, the dipstick >> for the oil reads nothing unless I "bump" the starter. Then it reads >> normal. I changed the filter and the oil so I know there is the proper >> amount of oil. It just freaks me out to see a dry dipstick after running >> the engine a lot. Has any one else experienced this? >> > > Also, I have a light blue (not much) smoke in operation. I added the > proper amount of "Gumount" fuel additive and it stops. I wonder if that is > telling me anything? I just bought the boat in May and sailed it to Tampa > Bay using the engine quite a bit and she did great. > > Glenn Henderson > > C 41 WeGo > > Alan, > What I mean by "bump the starter" is to turn the engine over but not enough to start it it. After I accomplish that, the dipstick reads the oil level correctly. It was very worrisome at first but I know the oil is in there as I filled it up myself. I did a 1500 nm trip and the engine did great. Thanks! > > -- Forwarded message -- > From: ALAN BERGEN > To: "C" > Cc: > Bcc: > Date: Mon, 30 Jul 2018 16:56:43 -0700 > Subject: Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke > What do you mean by "bump the starter"? If the dipstick is reading dry > when you know you have the proper amount of oil, it sounds like you may > have the wrong dipstick. > > Alan Bergen > 35 Mk III Thirsty > Rose City YC > Portland, OR > > > On Mon, Jul 30, 2018 at 4:32 PM, Glenn Henderson via CnC-List < > cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > >> I have a 3JH4E on my 41. Strangely, after the engine sits, the dipstick >>> for the oil reads nothing unless I "bump" the starter. Then it reads >>> normal. I changed the filter and the oil so I know there is the proper >>> amount of oil. It just freaks me out to see a dry dipstick after running >>> the engine a lot. Has any one else experienced this? >>> >> >> Also, I have a light blue (not much) smoke in operation. I added the >> proper amount of "Gumount" fuel additive and it stops. I wonder if that is >> telling me anything? I just bought the boat in May and sailed it to Tampa >> Bay using the engine quite a bit and she did great. >> >> Glenn Henderson >> >> C 41 WeGo >> >> >> __
Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke
When you say that you put in the "correct" amount of oil when you changed it, did you fill it so that the oil level was in the correct range on the dipstick at that time? This was before or after your trip? Splashing oil on the dipstick by cranking the engine tells you almost nothing, or did you mean that the dipstick reads correctly from that point forward until you start the engine again? i.e. wipe off the dipstick with a rag, put it in, take it out, read the level, and it is ok? If not then the level is too low, unless you really believe that you have the wrong dipstick. If it were me, I would not make that assumption. Blue smoke normally means that the engine is burning lubricating oil, so it is reasonable to expect the oil level to drop after a long run under that condition. The good news is that if an engine has been sitting for a long time, it may burn oil for a while until the rings loosen up and re-seat, and then run with little or no visible smoke. Fresh oil helps too, of course, and you say that the smoke situation has improved, so it should burn less oil in the future. Steve Thomas C MKIII Glenn Henderson via CnC-List wrote: > > I have a 3JH4E on my 41. Strangely, after the engine sits, the dipstick > for the oil reads nothing unless I "bump" the starter. Then it reads > normal. I changed the filter and the oil so I know there is the proper > amount of oil. It just freaks me out to see a dry dipstick after running > the engine a lot. Has any one else experienced this? > Also, I have a light blue (not much) smoke in operation. I added the proper amount of "Gumount" fuel additive and it stops. I wonder if that is telling me anything? I just bought the boat in May and sailed it to Tampa Bay using the engine quite a bit and she did great. Glenn Henderson C 41 WeGo ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Oil pressure and smoke
What do you mean by "bump the starter"? If the dipstick is reading dry when you know you have the proper amount of oil, it sounds like you may have the wrong dipstick. Alan Bergen 35 Mk III Thirsty Rose City YC Portland, OR On Mon, Jul 30, 2018 at 4:32 PM, Glenn Henderson via CnC-List < cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > I have a 3JH4E on my 41. Strangely, after the engine sits, the dipstick >> for the oil reads nothing unless I "bump" the starter. Then it reads >> normal. I changed the filter and the oil so I know there is the proper >> amount of oil. It just freaks me out to see a dry dipstick after running >> the engine a lot. Has any one else experienced this? >> > > Also, I have a light blue (not much) smoke in operation. I added the > proper amount of "Gumount" fuel additive and it stops. I wonder if that is > telling me anything? I just bought the boat in May and sailed it to Tampa > Bay using the engine quite a bit and she did great. > > Glenn Henderson > > C 41 WeGo > > > ___ > > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each > and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - > use PayPal to send contribution -- https://urldefense.proofpoint. > com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.paypal.me_stumurray=DwICAg= > clK7kQUTWtAVEOVIgvi0NU5BOUHhpN0H8p7CSfnc_gI= > 9w3G7Cf8YfQnrjmtuNxwDJYr3JMv9f1pAfgAJ9xXYQQ=jpAWCu4_ > L98MKL6JT40bHgMSh6wuNBghvG9L6slvhA0=qYAy5MMR1EtkD4jUz8FfE88vOwnoB3 > j9AcSmT_IKr6A= > > > ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
