Re: Liberated Calypso docs found
Sebastian Krzyszkowiak d...@dosowisko.net wrote: Calypso wasn't brought by Openmoko Inc. as company. Previously it was part of bigger company, FIC - I guess that's why they got it. It was much later when Openmoko Inc. was splitted into another, standalone company. OK, that's fine. In that regard FIC can be viewed no different from Motorola, Nokia or any other large bourgeois company that made phones based on TI's Calypso/Iota/Rita chipset. However, in order to make this chipset work in the GTA0[12] configuration, the Calypso firmware had to be modified in an application-specific way. Corporate bureaucrats and lawyers are not capable of making such code modifications themselves. Therefore, they must have had at least one qualified embedded system sw/fw engineer who was given access to that secret source code for the purpose of making the necessary code modifications. Unless they were super-paranoid about the security of their NDA and were distrustful of their own employees (unless you are dealing with gov/mil secrets or somesuch, in my experience it's pretty rare for companies to be so tight within their own walls), such access to Calypso fw source code was probably given to more than one of their engineers, more likely to all of them or at least a significant subset. I assume that whoever worked on Calypso firmware for GTA0[12] phones back at Openmoko/FIC is no longer employed by that company: my natural guess is that the phone engineers were probably let go when the phone business got shut down, and even if not, people move to new jobs and companies all the time for all kinds of reasons. I would have a hard time accepting a notion that not one of Openmoko's engineers has taken a personal copy of the secret source code home with him/her on a USB stick. (I for one have no problem admitting quite openly that I have kept personal copies of most of the interesting bits from most of my past employers. And the only reason some of them aren't on my FTP site yet is because they are huge. I'm working on setting up a new FTP server with bigger disks.) So to those one or two ex-Openmoko employees who have a copy of the Calypso fw source stashed away on a personal hard drive somewhere, but who are not admitting to that and not sharing the ware: what is stopping you from sharing? Why are you being Bad Guys by withholding highly valuable material from Humanity? Can't be for fear of being fired, assuming that you are no longer employed by Openmoko/FIC. Can't be for fear of being sued, as that is just not realistic. Gennady Kupava g...@bsdmn.com wrote: It might be good idea to keep political/religional/race difference and concentrate on techinical aspects. Yup, technical aspects such as the Calypso chipset and its firmware. Before we can start improving the latter, we need to obtain a copy of whatever at least partially modifiable source the Openmoko company had. I'll plow through that Chinese mobile phone forum site some more when I get more time to work on it. MS ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Liberated Calypso docs found
Em 27-09-2011 07:37, Michael Sokolov escreveu: So to those one or two ex-Openmoko employees who have a copy of the Calypso fw source stashed away on a personal hard drive somewhere, but who are not admitting to that and not sharing the ware: what is stopping you from sharing? Why are you being Bad Guys by withholding highly valuable material from Humanity? Can't be for fear of being fired, assuming that you are no longer employed by Openmoko/FIC. Can't be for fear of being sued, as that is just not realistic. In principle, I would agree with you, however there are laws in some countries where should they do that and be found, they could get into a lot of trouble. WRT NDAs, I'd guess that after so much time, it's likely the NDA is void now. Can anyone confirm? However... there is still copyright law which has gotten radically harsher these last years. In some places, you are likely to get more years in jail for copying a work than from actually stealing it from a store. As such, this is the kind of information that is not very desireable to be associated with a Free Software project, because even if the developers had no problem publishing it, it would be very likely no distributor would ever like it, and even the ISPs used by SHR and others could be harassed until some action is done. Rui ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: NAND vs SD on GTA02
Gennady Kupava g...@bsdmn.com wrote: Interesting point. I noticed that all my last GSM failures with GTA were related to simple fact that CPU itself were working, but GSM do not because simple battery discharge. The set of Calypso docs I have found and put up on my FTP site (see the other thread) includes a spec for the Iota chip. Iota is the Analog Baseband (ABB) component of the chipset, but it also handles power management. The Iota spec says the minimum battery voltage is 3.0 V. The Rita chip (RF transceiver) also draws some power directly from the battery without going through the Iota, and its spec also says 3.0 V is the minimum. That voltage appears to be the design minimum for Calypso/Iota/Rita phones. In comparison, the PCF50633 which provides power management to the AP (application processor) part of the GTA02 claims to be able to handle Vsys going down to 2.8 V. Hence the Calypso/Iota/Rita block appears to be the limiting factor for how low you can drain the battery and still keep the phone functional (as a phone). Use NAND. Yup, that's my plan. If it wears out in few years, you can just buy one more GTA02 cheap as dirt. Hmm, I wouldn't call $468.46 USD (what I've paid for my GTA02 order, after EUR currency conversion, shipping and international bank transfer fees) exactly dirt cheap. Also you can switch to uSD at any time, so if you NAND will fail, you can just start using uSD. Yes, very true. I hope anyone interested can buy GTA04 soon, so no need to worry about GTA02 stock. For some of us GTA02 is a lot more valuable than GTA04! Am I really the only person left in the world who wants his phone to be a PHONE, not a handheld computer, not a PDA, not a Wifi toy and not a GPS navigation device? For a phone that acts as a *phone*, i.e., stays registered with the cell network while drawing the smallest possible amount of power from its battery, receives incoming calls and SMS on its assigned PSTN number, and allows its user to make outgoing calls and SMS, the part that matters the most is the GSM baseband processor. The whole Linux- based application processor becomes essentially superfluous fluff for a basic phone. For someone who wants his phone to be a phone, free your phone means freeing the GSM baseband processor, nothing less. With the leaked/ liberated Calypso bits I've been finding on that Chinese forum site (hoping to find more...), there is now at least a glimmer of a possibility of freeing a Calypso-based phone down to the GSM RF level. But I don't see how anyone would be able to do that with a modern fully-monolithic UMTS module (GTA04 style) any time soon. MS ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Liberated Calypso docs found
Rui Miguel Silva Seabra r...@1407.org wrote: As such, this is the kind of information that is not very desireable to be associated with a Free Software project, because even if the developers had no problem publishing it, it would be very likely no distributor would ever like it, and even the ISPs used by SHR and others could be harassed until some action is done. If I succeed in laying my hands on a forcibly liberated copy of TI's Calypso firmware source, I would proceed as follows: 1. Acting on the authority of the Presidium of the Supreme Soviet of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and the decrees of V. I. Lenin, declare TI's copyright on the ware to be null and void in the USSR jurisdiction; 2. With the starting source thus decreed uncopyrighted, start a Free Software project to modify and improve as we, the community see fit. The community in the above sentence would include anyone in the world who chooses to participate, no discrimination of any kind. But if you choose to exclude yourself because your moral code is incompatible with what I have in mind here, that would be your choice and not my/our fault. This project would be completely separate and independent from SHR and the like. It would be hosted on the Anarchist Software Foundation servers which are very much used to hosting exactly this kind of projects. This is not the first time I'm doing a Free Software / Open Source HW project of this nature. I have led successfully led other projects in which I took formerly-proprietary software that had been liberated by hard-core law-breaking / contract-breaking means, declared its copyright etc to be null and void, and then made and released my own improvements to it which were done just like a normal FOSS project in every aspect other than licensing. MS ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: NAND vs SD on GTA02
On Tuesday 27 September 2011 09:23:17 msoko...@ivan.harhan.org wrote: Use NAND. Yup, that's my plan. If you want to have the system stable NAND is good choice. I never had single filesystem corruption with JFFS2 even after pulling battery. With SD card and ext2/ext3 you will probably hit filesystem corruption after unclean resets. I hope anyone interested can buy GTA04 soon, so no need to worry about GTA02 stock. For some of us GTA02 is a lot more valuable than GTA04! Am I really the only person left in the world who wants his phone to be a PHONE, not a handheld computer, not a PDA, not a Wifi toy and not a GPS navigation device? For a phone that acts as a *phone*, i.e., stays registered with the cell network while drawing the smallest possible amount of power from its battery, receives incoming calls and SMS on its assigned PSTN number, and allows its user to make outgoing calls and SMS, the part that matters the most is the GSM baseband processor. The whole Linux- based application processor becomes essentially superfluous fluff for a basic phone. I can see your point, but if the hardware and power management is done right, you can power off Wifi, GPS and all unused things. Since you will have most of the time phone in suspend, you should care only about power consumed in suspend - which is power drawed by GSM+RAM+PMU. And btw do you think that your phone will draw less battery if you remove web browser from the system? For someone who wants his phone to be a phone, free your phone means freeing the GSM baseband processor, nothing less. With the leaked/ liberated Calypso bits I've been finding on that Chinese forum site (hoping to find more...), there is now at least a glimmer of a possibility of freeing a Calypso-based phone down to the GSM RF level. But I don't see how anyone would be able to do that with a modern fully-monolithic UMTS module (GTA04 style) any time soon. I doubt it is legal and if your phone operator would be happy with hand-made GSM firmware. Regards Radek ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
GTA04A3 Early Adopter boards in final production test stage
Hi all, the production of the remaining pre-ordered GTA04 Early Adopter boards is now running and we have received the first three of them. So we were able to attach them to the new GTA04-Tester, that has been set up. Since a Video shows more than we can describe - here is one showing the Tester and how the boards are tested: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCjM48BqfYo Enjoy! All 3 boards have passed the test and the others are expected to arrive this week. Let's cross fingers that they also pass the tests and that there is no severe issue in the areas that are not tested... Nikolaus Schaller Plot: The test equipment consists of some old MacMini (PowerPC based) with USB cable, a SD card with the hardware-validation Linux kernel and a battery. Testing starts by inserting the SD card, adding a wire to hold the battery, connect USB and finally insert the Battery. Soon after doing this, U-Boot switches on the Power LED to red/yellow/green. The test software thinks that there is no connection on USB, since the kernel is still booting and setting up the musb driver and the ethernet gadget. After a while, the first ping to the board becomes successful, and the detailled tests start. Tests include reading the IMEI from the UMTS modem module, configuring WLAN and scanning for the MacMini's WLAN and Bluetooth transmitters. Finally, almost all tests are passed, except the one for the Camera module - which is not plugged in. Please note, that this test is not really complete. Amongst the areas not tested are: Display, Audio, UMTS transmission, Vibracall, GPS sensitivity. Typical Test Report === Report from GTA04 Tester - 2011-09-26 21:21:05 +0200 BMA180: Ok 201,-22,-3742 BMP085: Ok 77152 GTM601: Ok GTM601-IMEI:Ok 354154040021088 HMC5883L: Ok ITG3200:Ok 6168 6168 6168 6168 LIS302: Ok M24LR64:Ok OV9655: Nok Si47xx: Ok TCA6507:Ok TPS61050: Ok TSC2007:Ok 0,0,0,0,0,0,1228,1507,106,65535 USB:Ok W2CBW003-BT:Ok W2CBW003-BT-scan: Ok 00:23:12:3D:07:A2 MacMini W2CBW003-WLAN: Ok W2CBW003-WLAN-libertas: Ok W2CBW003-WLAN-scan: Ok ESSID:MacMini W2SG0004: Ok $GPGGA,06.046,0,00,,,M,0.0,M,,*52 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: [Gta04-owner] GTA04A3 Early Adopter boards in final production test stage
Nikolaus, Since a Video shows more than we can describe - here is one showing the Tester and how the boards are tested: Very interesting video, thanks (as always) for keeping us informed (as always)! Christ van Willegen -- 09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0 ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Liberated Calypso docs found
msoko...@ivan.harhan.org (Michael Sokolov) writes: Yup, technical aspects such as the Calypso chipset and its firmware. Before we can start improving the latter, we need to obtain a copy of whatever at least partially modifiable source the Openmoko company had. But why? All OM had were some loosy sources for the gpio (and such) init plus AT intepreter. No lower layers at all, only blobs. OsmocomBB is already doing _much more_, so those original sources would add nothing to it. -- Be free, use free (http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html) software! mailto:fercer...@gmail.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: NAND vs SD on GTA02
Radek Polak pson...@seznam.cz wrote: If you want to have the system stable NAND is good choice. I never had single filesystem corruption with JFFS2 even after pulling battery. With SD card and ext2/ext3 you will probably hit filesystem corruption after unclean resets. Yup, that's what I was thinking too. I can see your point, but if the hardware and power management is done right, you can power off Wifi, GPS and all unused things. Since you will have most of the time phone in suspend, you should care only about power consumed in suspend - which is power drawed by GSM+RAM+PMU. Yup, that's my thinking too. And btw do you think that your phone will draw less battery if you remove web browser from the system? Of course not. However, I prefer to keep the application processor front-end software as simple as possible (in *my* personal sense of simplicity) in order to make it easier for me to tweak it to my peculiar tastes and preferences. I have considered the following question: if I were to succeed in obtaining an illegal copy of the Calypso fw recompilable source, which is what I am really after (i.e., that's what free your phone means to me), do I really need something as fancy as a Neo, or would my needs be better satisfied with something like this: http://bb.osmocom.org/trac/wiki/MotorolaC123 I thought about it, and came to the conclusion that a *simple* Linux-based application processor front-end would be useful even for someone like me: * I would probably have an easier time making the UI look and work exactly the way I want if it's driven by Linux rather than Calypso; * A lot of people with whom I have to interact in my daily life have adopted text/SMS as their primary means of communication, replacing both human voice calls and email. I don't like it, but I need to interact with these people, and making them change their ways is not an option. Therefore, I would like a phone with very powerful SMS handling capabilities. Here's what I have in mind: * I would like to archive *all* sent and received SMS, lots of them. I doubt that doing it the way ancient phones did it (store it all on the SIM I guess?) would cut it; JFFS2 would do the job much better, methinks. * Long messages sent over multiple SMS: my phone needs to be able to receive and reconstitute them at the very least, with full error handling: if only some part(s) arrived, let me see that etc. Would like to be able to send such beasts as well, for communicating with people who don't do email and who would get upset if I actually called them at just the wrong instant... I know there are feature phones (BP only, no AP) that can do it, so I reason it probably *can* be done on the Calypso. But methinks it would be simpler to have the BP view each individual SMS as independent and have the AP handle segmentation and reassembly. * I would like to be able to compose long text messages in vi on my laptop, then inject them into the phone for transmission over USB. * I would like to save the complete log of all sent and received SMS and voice calls in long-term storage outside of the phone, i.e., on a UNIX minicomputer server in my own personal datacenter. In the first version I'll do it indirectly via the laptop (USB between the phone and my laptop, then from the laptop to the mainframe via scp or whatever), but eventually I would like to have the AP wake up on its own once a day or so, establish a circuit-switched data call or GPRS IP connection to my server back in the datacenter, and transfer everything automatically. I doubt it is legal And why should I care? and if your phone operator would be happy with hand-made GSM firmware. How would they know, and how would they enforce it? As long as the phone speaks the exactly correct protocol over the air (which it would if I were to start with a known-working codebase and just tweak it slightly to disable RRLP or whatever), they wouldn't be able to do squat about it. MS ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Liberated Calypso docs found
Paul Fertser fercer...@gmail.com wrote: But why? All OM had were some loosy sources for the gpio (and such) init plus AT intepreter. No lower layers at all, only blobs. OsmocomBB is already doing _much more_, so those original sources would add nothing to it. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought OsmocomBB still runs GSM layers 2 and 3 on the external host, not on the Calypso itself, right? And no in-call handover yet, no SMS yet, probably nothing even close to deep sleep mode yet... I would love to be proven wrong on this though. Don't get me wrong, if a free-from-the-start fw stack like OsmocomBB were to actually become 100% as usable as the original proprietary one, I would very eagerly switch to it. But if they aren't there yet, I will *not* abstain from hacking TI's original code, assuming that I can succeed in physically laying my hands on it, however illegal it may be. I have just found out that apparently there used to be a Calypso-based phone called TSM30, and apparently someone had leaked the complete C source for it and put it up on SourceForge, where it stayed for years before being taken down. I can't find it any more. Would anyone happen to know of any place where it can still be found? Would anyone happen to have a copy they have downloaded? If you can share it with me, I can pay you for it with my own blood. A-positive. MS ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
GTA02 fails to charge
I have 2 GTA02v6 Freerunners which don't charge their batteries anymore. The symptoms on both are the same, but it started happening on both phones in different locations and times. The battery state is Charging whether the phone is plugged in to a computer or wall charger, but the battery slowly goes down instead of charging. We use the phones in airplanes, connected to 5V DC power supplies. My wild guess is that both units might have experienced a power surge or something that fried the charging circuit (RT9711BPB chip in socket U4905?). With 2 Freerunners affected and afraid it might happen a third time, I would like to know if anyone else has experienced this problem. -Phil ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Liberated Calypso docs found
msoko...@ivan.harhan.org (Michael Sokolov) writes: But if they aren't there yet, I will *not* abstain from hacking TI's original code, assuming that I can succeed in physically laying my hands on it, however illegal it may be. What exactly do you want to change in it? Disabling RRLP? Having AT command intepreter sources wouldn't help it, also i'm not sure if the original firmware had that functionality implemented in the first place. You're right about the OsmocomBB limitiations, but that's the only way to get a really free phone currently, afaict. Having TI's blobs is not much different from having them all in a single firmware files. If you can share it with me, I can pay you for it with my own blood. A-positive. They give ~$30 (+$15 for meal) for donating a standard amount of blood (350/450ml). Just fyi ;) -- Be free, use free (http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html) software! mailto:fercer...@gmail.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Liberated Calypso docs found
Paul Fertser fercer...@gmail.com wrote: What exactly do you want to change in it? Disabling RRLP? Having AT command intepreter sources wouldn't help it, also i'm not sure if the original firmware had that functionality implemented in the first place. I have no way of knowing a priori whether I would want/need to change anything at all. For me it's a matter of having the source just for the point of it. Perhaps I just want to study it and understand how it works, perhaps I won't need to modify it at all. But being able to rebuild the image from the source is the only way to prove that the source is complete. A piece that's missing altogether is worse than having that piece in the form of an ARM ELF .o file. Having TI's blobs is not much different from having them all in a single firmware files. Are you sure? Have you seen those blobs, as you call them? Without having seen them, my a priori guess would be that it's a big pile of little .o files in ARM ELF format. In order to be linkable with other modules, an ELF file has to be unstripped. Even if TI's blobs were/ are in the form of a few big .o files (on even just one) rather than a big pile of little ones, it still has to be unstripped ELF. That means symbol information: names of functions, names of variables, exactly where one function ends and the next begins, etc. Much better than a fully linked binary with no ELF symbolic information whatsoever. And if it's a big pile of little .o files (perhaps in a .a archive/ library) rather than one really big .o, that would be even better: one could conceivably disassemble these .o's one by one, using module and function names as a guide to where the more interesting bits are more likely to reside... Basically what I'm saying is that reasoning a priori, without having seen the ware, I would not discount the possibilities. MS ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
