Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
Scott Derrick wrote: > Come on! Blame the telcos for the Neo echo!! Thats stretching it. > > I've had numerous phones and about 4 different providers and NEVER had > any repeatable echo, NEVER. I've done quite a bit of work on VOIP on handhelds, and Echo is always a problem. The solution was always to buy an echo cancellation library, I say buy because I never have found a free one. The problem I found on ARM based handhelds is that they don't have an FPU and usually they don't have enough CPU power to do real echo cancellation, so the libraries I have worked with for ARM are usually echo suppression, which usually means detecting when someone is talking and dropping the output volume (sort of half duplex like those old speaker phones). I *suspect* that commercial cell phones have H/W echo cancellation built in via a dedicated DSP, but there is no way to be sure unless you work for a cell phone company like Motorola, Nokia etc etc. Landline phones generally do not have echo cancellation built in as the PO does the echo cancellation, although higher end speaker phones will have echo cancellation built in. I think some high end bluetooth headsets have either echo cancellation or echo suppression built in which would help in our case. I do not expect to be able to do echo cancellation on OM because there is no open source echo cancellation I am aware of (the Speex codecs may have some) and it is doubtful anyone is prepared to write one and make it open source. Workarounds have been mentioned like using BT headset or tweaking volumes to minimize the echo. -- Jim Morris, http://blog.wolfman.com ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
On Wednesday 23 July 2008, Ben wrote: > Is bluetooth working to the degree where a bluetooth headset can be > used instead? Don't know, don't have one. There are instructions in the wiki but people are reporting problems. The wired headset should work, but I haven't got one of those to test either. > While it isn't perfect, I have an Aliph JawBone headset and it works > reasonably well when there's no wind around. Also have a Sony Ericsson > HBH 300 but people always say I sound too quiet - maybe I could > amplify the volume on the FreeRunner in ways I can't on regular > phones? Possibly - the Mono mixer setting should control the level from the bluetooth into the GSM > On Tue, Jul 22, 2008 at 6:33 PM, Al Johnson > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > On Tuesday 22 July 2008, Scott Derrick wrote: > >> Come on! Blame the telcos for the Neo echo!! Thats stretching it. > > > > Take a breath. Reread what I said. I'm not blaming them, but they may be > > a factor in why people report widely differing levels of echo. > > > > > > > > ___ > > Openmoko community mailing list > > community@lists.openmoko.org > > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
Is bluetooth working to the degree where a bluetooth headset can be used instead? While it isn't perfect, I have an Aliph JawBone headset and it works reasonably well when there's no wind around. Also have a Sony Ericsson HBH 300 but people always say I sound too quiet - maybe I could amplify the volume on the FreeRunner in ways I can't on regular phones? On Tue, Jul 22, 2008 at 6:33 PM, Al Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Tuesday 22 July 2008, Scott Derrick wrote: >> Come on! Blame the telcos for the Neo echo!! Thats stretching it. > > Take a breath. Reread what I said. I'm not blaming them, but they may be a > factor in why people report widely differing levels of echo. > > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
On Tuesday 22 July 2008, Scott Derrick wrote: > Come on! Blame the telcos for the Neo echo!! Thats stretching it. Take a breath. Reread what I said. I'm not blaming them, but they may be a factor in why people report widely differing levels of echo. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
Come on! Blame the telcos for the Neo echo!! Thats stretching it. I've had numerous phones and about 4 different providers and NEVER had any repeatable echo, NEVER. I say repeatable, since I can remember maybe 5 calls in the last 10 years when I got a bad connection, and I live in the Tullies, where there was distortion. I hung up, dialed again and it was gone. Never a repeatable event. Its the phone, period. Whether its bad hardware design, bad software design or improper combination of settings is is to be determined. Scott signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
On Monday 21 July 2008, Timo Jyrinki wrote: > 2008/7/21 Al Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > Assuming there is sufficient difference in level between voice level and > > the level from the earpiece it should be possible to set the noise gate > > so that it only triggers when you are actually speaking, stopping the > > echo. The compressor should even out the variations in level. > > So is basically everyone who is being called with a Neo Freerunner > having at least a little echo of her own voice? At some point I had > often the problem that the receiver heard everything she said very > aloud about 1s later, now in at least my own tests it's merely quite > quiet repetition that doesn't always even occur (gets cut off by > something, eg. a noise filter). I used gsmhandset.state from here: > http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=170&start=75#p3277 > and also stored it at /etc/asound.state. That depends ;-) One of the things that contributes to the variety of reports is that you never know what the telcos are doing with the signal between you and the other end. Changes in gain, dynamic range alteration and echo cancellation are all possible, and may not be consistent from call to call. Another problem is that it's rather subjective. I don't know how much sample to sample variation there may be. I think there has been more than one mixer scenario since I got the phone, but with the ones I've actually looked at the noise gate is not enabled. It seems like in the gsmhandset.state the echo has been avoided by setting the mic gain and earpiece volume low, but people complain that they can hardly hear you. A bit of extra mic gain seems to help here without adding too much echo. The gsmspeakerout state has more mic gain and playback through the speaker now. I think it used to play through the earpiece, but in either case it gives some echo, at least when I've tried it. I got as far as checking that the noise gate does operate, but there are a lot of adjustments available in this area. Routing to the ADC/DAC should make measurement of the echo possible. Someone mentioned xoscope which I'll have to look at too. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone? / Audio Codec meddling info
On Monday 21 July 2008, Andy Green wrote: > Somebody in the thread at some point said: snip my comment about alsa settings bypassing the ALC > I don't know why we go around it, but when I looked mic -> GSM routing > some weeks ago I also found a very direct analogue path. If you're > interested to meddle with this, I have some meddling hints. First, the > datasheet is open: > > http://www.wolfsonmicro.com/uploads/documents/en/WM8753.pdf I've been reading it already ;-) One area the wiki does well on is links to the hardware datasheets. > We have fitted 100n in the external ALC path (between ACOP / ACIN) > instead of 1uF recommended, I guess it will impact low end, but in > telephony the low end as well as the high end are chopped out anyway. > Soon, as steve told, you'll be able to see this stuff (and our mistakes) > on the schematics for yourself. I didn't notice a rolled off low end in cursory testing of the ALC, so you're probably right. It's good to know just in case though. Steve's announcement was a pleasant surprise, and I'm looking forward to it. > You can dump the actual codec registers using > > # cat /sys/devices/platform/soc-audio/codec_reg > > and you can meddle with them like this > > # echo "3d 20" > /sys/devices/platform/soc-audio/codec_reg_write > > first one is the register address in hex, second is value to write in > hex. I don't really know what those dozens of alsamixer settings are > doing either, I found it easier to read the datasheet and interpret / > meddle with the codec registers directly. That'll be handy. I'll check my mapping of the ALSA devices and settings against this. I don't want to stick it on the wiki before I know it's right. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
Scott Derrick wrote: > Its hard to believe the distro doesn't come pre-configured with settings > that don't produce echo, very low volume, interference? > > It's hard to believe nobody has come up with Better Than Default settings, uploaded the config, and gotten it in the newest release :) > Scott > > Cédric Berger wrote: > >> People I had on the phone never complained about echo. When I asked, >> they said there was none. >> But they often complained about volume level too low... and maybe >> that's why there was no echo... >> (and they also complained about interference noise, which I heard too) >> >> I need to make more calls and change my volume settings to know more... >> >> > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
Its hard to believe the distro doesn't come pre-configured with settings that don't produce echo, very low volume, interference? Scott Cédric Berger wrote: > People I had on the phone never complained about echo. When I asked, > they said there was none. > But they often complained about volume level too low... and maybe > that's why there was no echo... > (and they also complained about interference noise, which I heard too) > > I need to make more calls and change my volume settings to know more... > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
People I had on the phone never complained about echo. When I asked, they said there was none. But they often complained about volume level too low... and maybe that's why there was no echo... (and they also complained about interference noise, which I heard too) I need to make more calls and change my volume settings to know more... On Mon, Jul 21, 2008 at 17:58, Timo Jyrinki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > 2008/7/21 Al Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: >> Assuming there is sufficient difference in level between voice level and the >> level from the earpiece it should be possible to set the noise gate so that >> it only triggers when you are actually speaking, stopping the echo. The >> compressor should even out the variations in level. > > So is basically everyone who is being called with a Neo Freerunner > having at least a little echo of her own voice? At some point I had > often the problem that the receiver heard everything she said very > aloud about 1s later, now in at least my own tests it's merely quite > quiet repetition that doesn't always even occur (gets cut off by > something, eg. a noise filter). I used gsmhandset.state from here: > http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=170&start=75#p3277 > and also stored it at /etc/asound.state. > > -Timo ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
2008/7/21 Al Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > Assuming there is sufficient difference in level between voice level and the > level from the earpiece it should be possible to set the noise gate so that > it only triggers when you are actually speaking, stopping the echo. The > compressor should even out the variations in level. So is basically everyone who is being called with a Neo Freerunner having at least a little echo of her own voice? At some point I had often the problem that the receiver heard everything she said very aloud about 1s later, now in at least my own tests it's merely quite quiet repetition that doesn't always even occur (gets cut off by something, eg. a noise filter). I used gsmhandset.state from here: http://freeyourphone.de/portal_v1/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=170&start=75#p3277 and also stored it at /etc/asound.state. -Timo ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: anyone using FR as a phone?
> > > > From: steve <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > I use mine. My kids used theirs till I gave it away to somebody else. > > > > > > > > That said, some people have expereince audio issues. Engineering is > > > > on the issue. > > > > > > > > Steve > > > > wow... wish my Dad had your job... that way I'd get to play with cool > > phones! haha j/k. I love my dad. ^_^ > > > > Corey > > > > I will tell you story. My father was a printer and Saturday he had > > to work > > the graveyard shift. > > So, he would come home at 1AM Sunday and bring Sundays' paper with > > him. So I > > was the first kid > > To get to read Sundays' paper. Hours before dawn we would sit there > > reading > > the paper together, > > eating Nestle crunch bars > > > > That was as cool as any new phone. > > > > > > > > Steve Steve, I totally agree. Nothing is better than times such as those! I Didn't mean anything by my post. I wouldn't trade my father for all the tea in china. Memories are wonderful things, aren't they? Thank you for the story, I enjoyed hearing it. ^_^ Corey ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone? / Audio Codec meddling info
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Somebody in the thread at some point said: | On Monday 21 July 2008, Cédric Berger wrote: |> Sound quality during calls is indeed not that good. |> |> 1. Volume is usually too low, but I think it can be modified via |> correct settings. |> Seems like people not always hear me at the same level : sometimes |> quite ok, often really too low. I have yet to try more... | | Volume can be adjusted vi a alsamixer, and the mic can be routed via a | compressor and noise gate. Audio routing is far from simple - see the wiki: | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_1973_audio_subsystem | The route indicated for voice calls on the wiki is via the compressor / noise | gate (ALC) but the state file (2007.2 after opkg upgrade) skips that part. | | Assuming there is sufficient difference in level between voice level and the | level from the earpiece it should be possible to set the noise gate so that | it only triggers when you are actually speaking, stopping the echo. The | compressor should even out the variations in level. | | I don't know yet whether the assumption is true; it maybe that the ALC is | skipped from the state file because it was difficult or impossible to find | settings that reliably blocked echo, but passed voice. I don't know why we go around it, but when I looked mic -> GSM routing some weeks ago I also found a very direct analogue path. If you're interested to meddle with this, I have some meddling hints. First, the datasheet is open: http://www.wolfsonmicro.com/uploads/documents/en/WM8753.pdf We have fitted 100n in the external ALC path (between ACOP / ACIN) instead of 1uF recommended, I guess it will impact low end, but in telephony the low end as well as the high end are chopped out anyway. Soon, as steve told, you'll be able to see this stuff (and our mistakes) on the schematics for yourself. You can dump the actual codec registers using # cat /sys/devices/platform/soc-audio/codec_reg and you can meddle with them like this # echo "3d 20" > /sys/devices/platform/soc-audio/codec_reg_write first one is the register address in hex, second is value to write in hex. I don't really know what those dozens of alsamixer settings are doing either, I found it easier to read the datasheet and interpret / meddle with the codec registers directly. - -Andy -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.9 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Fedora - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iEYEARECAAYFAkiEWNIACgkQOjLpvpq7dMrPUgCeKs86CiONfAJ3tVGwOdWXyib/ TcoAnib9G+BfEEOZxzZsS8vy7Vvr0aw3 =H3+x -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
On Monday 21 July 2008, Cédric Berger wrote: > Sound quality during calls is indeed not that good. > > 1. Volume is usually too low, but I think it can be modified via > correct settings. > Seems like people not always hear me at the same level : sometimes > quite ok, often really too low. I have yet to try more... Volume can be adjusted vi a alsamixer, and the mic can be routed via a compressor and noise gate. Audio routing is far from simple - see the wiki: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_1973_audio_subsystem The route indicated for voice calls on the wiki is via the compressor / noise gate (ALC) but the state file (2007.2 after opkg upgrade) skips that part. Assuming there is sufficient difference in level between voice level and the level from the earpiece it should be possible to set the noise gate so that it only triggers when you are actually speaking, stopping the echo. The compressor should even out the variations in level. I don't know yet whether the assumption is true; it maybe that the ALC is skipped from the state file because it was difficult or impossible to find settings that reliably blocked echo, but passed voice. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
Sound quality during calls is indeed not that good. 1. Volume is usually too low, but I think it can be modified via correct settings. Seems like people not always hear me at the same level : sometimes quite ok, often really too low. I have yet to try more... 2. There also is this annoying noise (sounds like interferences), that both caller and callee can here. But what I found very interesting is that sometimes, for a few seconds, it suddenly totally went away !! I could talk and hear without this noise, but not for long. It happened more than once, at different locations. I was not moving, not near identified sources of perturbation, not running special background applications, not connected via wifi nor bluetooth (it was disabled via gui didn't check if it was really off). The person I called, as far as I can tell didn't do anything special either (was also not moving). This was tested with Qtopia (not ASU). (booted from SD) On Mon, Jul 21, 2008 at 04:55, Greg Bonett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Have there been any developments with this issue? How many people are > experiencing this? I'm experiencing very poor audio quality (lots of > noise, very low volume for incoming audio). I'm still not sure if its a > hardware thing of if I've just got bad gsm.handset.state settings. I'm > using the qtopia image right now. > > - -Greg ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Joerg Reisenweber wrote: > Am Mo 14. Juli 2008 schrieb Tim Schmidt: >> On Sun, Jul 13, 2008 at 9:28 PM, Joerg Reisenweber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: >>> Meanwhile we are about to improve the hw to cope with this (a little > difficult >>> without exact idea of the way this happens). >> Meaning, the improvement will show up in a new rev of the Freerunner, >> or in the next model phone? > > Depends on which kind of improvement we are ending with. Obviously sth like a > metal case for shielding can't be done as a simple FR product revision - just > for example. Simple change of a component value is a completely different > story. > For now no results thus no statement. ;-) > > /jOERG > Have there been any developments with this issue? How many people are experiencing this? I'm experiencing very poor audio quality (lots of noise, very low volume for incoming audio). I'm still not sure if its a hardware thing of if I've just got bad gsm.handset.state settings. I'm using the qtopia image right now. - -Greg -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFIg/q/R7UPrMLya90RAr8xAJ96q3SWHvCmEiehPNVWHNnBz/1l4gCgl6Pa lOCXrlc/dakphbUB1//dL4k= =IizC -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Anyone using FR as a phone?
Corey I will tell you story. My father was a printer and Saturday he had to work the graveyard shift. So, he would come home at 1AM Sunday and bring Sundays' paper with him. So I was the first kid To get to read Sundays' paper. Hours before dawn we would sit there reading the paper together, eating Nestle crunch bars That was as cool as any new phone. Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Corey Young Sent: Sunday, July 13, 2008 7:05 PM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Anyone using FR as a phone? > > From: steve <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > I use mine. My kids used theirs till I gave it away to somebody else. > > > > That said, some people have expereince audio issues. Engineering is > > on the issue. > > > > Steve wow... wish my Dad had your job... that way I'd get to play with cool phones! haha j/k. I love my dad. ^_^ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
Hello, Offray Vladimir Luna Cárdenas wrote: > Hi, > > Diego Fernández Durán escribió: > >> I use the FR as a phone. >> >> And I trying to figure out where can I apply my C, C++, Gtk knowledge to >> help in the development. >> >> A list of "small things that must be done" will be appreciated, so >> anybody of us can use our free time to read the code, write a small >> patch and summit it to a om developer. :) >> >> >> > > I have using it also as a phone, almost as soon as I get one. It works > fine. After a while I reflash it and screw it, but seems nothing > serious. I will play with it tomorrow finding a solution. > > I also use it as a phone. Even with all the glitches it's better than my old one which I had by accident manhandled over a long time :). For me it works ok. The main problem is that now and then, after a boot, I can't call or receive calls even if I seem to be connected. Another boot usually solves this. With some kernel/image combination, I also had the problem that the gsm doesn't work after it goes to sleep... I have heard that my sound quality is poor though, but I haven't done further testing. Cheers. Kalle > Cheers, > > Offray > > > >> El dom, 13-07-2008 a las 10:11 +0200, Yorick Moko escribió: >> >> >>> there is some talk about this on the devel-list: >>> >>> http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003560.html >>> http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003562.html >>> http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003563.html >>> >>> On Sat, Jul 12, 2008 at 9:40 PM, Randy S. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> wrote: >>> I am curious to know if anyone is using their FR as a phone. >>> Mine has such poor audio quality, it is unfortunately useless >>> as a phone. The audio I hear is clear but at a very low >>> volume; the other person hears my voice very distorted and >>> with a buzz. >>> >>> I am on T-Mobile in Texas, USA. >>> >>> ___ >>> Openmoko community mailing list >>> community@lists.openmoko.org >>> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community >>> >>> >>> >>> ___ >>> Openmoko community mailing list >>> community@lists.openmoko.org >>> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community >>> >>> > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
Hi, Diego Fernández Durán escribió: > I use the FR as a phone. > > And I trying to figure out where can I apply my C, C++, Gtk knowledge to > help in the development. > > A list of "small things that must be done" will be appreciated, so > anybody of us can use our free time to read the code, write a small > patch and summit it to a om developer. :) > > I have using it also as a phone, almost as soon as I get one. It works fine. After a while I reflash it and screw it, but seems nothing serious. I will play with it tomorrow finding a solution. Cheers, Offray > > El dom, 13-07-2008 a las 10:11 +0200, Yorick Moko escribió: > >> there is some talk about this on the devel-list: >> >> http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003560.html >> http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003562.html >> http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003563.html >> >> On Sat, Jul 12, 2008 at 9:40 PM, Randy S. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> wrote: >> I am curious to know if anyone is using their FR as a phone. >> Mine has such poor audio quality, it is unfortunately useless >> as a phone. The audio I hear is clear but at a very low >> volume; the other person hears my voice very distorted and >> with a buzz. >> >> I am on T-Mobile in Texas, USA. >> >> ___ >> Openmoko community mailing list >> community@lists.openmoko.org >> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community >> >> >> >> ___ >> Openmoko community mailing list >> community@lists.openmoko.org >> http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community >> ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Anyone using FR as a phone?
> > From: steve <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > I use mine. My kids used theirs till I gave it away to somebody else. > > > > That said, some people have expereince audio issues. Engineering is on the > > issue. > > > > Steve wow... wish my Dad had your job... that way I'd get to play with cool phones! haha j/k. I love my dad. ^_^ ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
Ah -- thanks for the clarification! How does 'running' microwave/hair drier/coffee-grinder affects it? :-) may be some obvious EM noise source like that could create an easily reproducible and controllable environment for troubleshooting/comparison to the reference phone at hands. On Mon, 14 Jul 2008, Joerg Reisenweber wrote: > It's not unit specific. This at least we already can say. > Slight variations in severity, but I didn't get to reproduce it even > with "known bad" devices, here at my lab. This "known bad" FR performed > better than a Nokia6210 I used for reference. At my lab. :-/ > But it's basically a EMI-shielding issue, it seems. We're on it. -- Yaroslav Halchenko Research Assistant, Psychology Department, Rutgers-Newark Student Ph.D. @ CS Dept. NJIT Office: (973) 353-5440x263 | FWD: 82823 | Fax: (973) 353-1171 101 Warren Str, Smith Hall, Rm 4-105, Newark NJ 07102 WWW: http://www.linkedin.com/in/yarik signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
Am Mo 14. Juli 2008 schrieb Yaroslav Halchenko: > then why not to ask Randy S (who already steadily experiencing > such an issue without much of fiddling with weather/location/manner of > holding) to do additional troubleshooting and if it is unit specific, > just to send the unit back for the replacement (and for you to > troubleshoot on a defective unit 'as a reference')? It's not unit specific. This at least we already can say. Slight variations in severity, but I didn't get to reproduce it even with "known bad" devices, here at my lab. This "known bad" FR performed better than a Nokia6210 I used for reference. At my lab. :-/ But it's basically a EMI-shielding issue, it seems. We're on it. /j signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
then why not to ask Randy S (who already steadily experiencing such an issue without much of fiddling with weather/location/manner of holding) to do additional troubleshooting and if it is unit specific, just to send the unit back for the replacement (and for you to troubleshoot on a defective unit 'as a reference')? On Mon, 14 Jul 2008, Joerg Reisenweber wrote: > Am Mo 14. Juli 2008 schrieb Scott Derrick: > > I don't get "some people" have experienced audio issues? > > Is this an indication of the level of quality control in manufacture ring? > > Scott > This is a short form of description of the *very* random and statistic nature > of this issue. We got some reports from customers about this noise. > We are still investigating on what conditions need to come together to > produce > this problem. Seems like carrier, band(850,900,1800,1900), location, time of > day, weather(yeah!), way to hold the device(!), open or closed doors and > windows etc etc etc, all influence this. > On my setups to reproduce, I constantly failed to create this noise on FR, > but > had bad noise on a decent Nokia I used for reference purposes. Mention this, > just to illustrate the problems we see on evaluating the issue. > Thus far we have no clear data on that, and we have no exact reports on > number > of people who experience this problem. > As soon as things are more clear, we will report on it. > Meanwhile we are about to improve the hw to cope with this (a little > difficult > without exact idea of the way this happens). > /jOERG -- Yaroslav Halchenko Research Assistant, Psychology Department, Rutgers-Newark Student Ph.D. @ CS Dept. NJIT Office: (973) 353-5440x263 | FWD: 82823 | Fax: (973) 353-1171 101 Warren Str, Smith Hall, Rm 4-105, Newark NJ 07102 WWW: http://www.linkedin.com/in/yarik signature.asc Description: Digital signature ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
Am Mo 14. Juli 2008 schrieb Tim Schmidt: > On Sun, Jul 13, 2008 at 9:28 PM, Joerg Reisenweber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Meanwhile we are about to improve the hw to cope with this (a little difficult > > without exact idea of the way this happens). > > Meaning, the improvement will show up in a new rev of the Freerunner, > or in the next model phone? Depends on which kind of improvement we are ending with. Obviously sth like a metal case for shielding can't be done as a simple FR product revision - just for example. Simple change of a component value is a completely different story. For now no results thus no statement. ;-) /jOERG signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
On Sun, Jul 13, 2008 at 9:28 PM, Joerg Reisenweber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Meanwhile we are about to improve the hw to cope with this (a little difficult > without exact idea of the way this happens). Meaning, the improvement will show up in a new rev of the Freerunner, or in the next model phone? --tim ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
Am Mo 14. Juli 2008 schrieb Scott Derrick: > I don't get "some people" have experienced audio issues? > > Is this an indication of the level of quality control in manufacture ring? > > Scott This is a short form of description of the *very* random and statistic nature of this issue. We got some reports from customers about this noise. We are still investigating on what conditions need to come together to produce this problem. Seems like carrier, band(850,900,1800,1900), location, time of day, weather(yeah!), way to hold the device(!), open or closed doors and windows etc etc etc, all influence this. On my setups to reproduce, I constantly failed to create this noise on FR, but had bad noise on a decent Nokia I used for reference purposes. Mention this, just to illustrate the problems we see on evaluating the issue. Thus far we have no clear data on that, and we have no exact reports on number of people who experience this problem. As soon as things are more clear, we will report on it. Meanwhile we are about to improve the hw to cope with this (a little difficult without exact idea of the way this happens). /jOERG signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
I don't get "some people" have experienced audio issues? Is this an indication of the level of quality control in manufacture ring? Scott steve wrote: > I use mine. My kids used theirs till I gave it away to somebody else. > > That said, some people have expereince audio issues. Engineering is on the > issue. > > Steve > > -Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Yaroslav > Halchenko > Sent: Sunday, July 13, 2008 8:44 AM > To: community@lists.openmoko.org > Subject: Re: Anyone using FR as a phone? > > wow -- that is very unfortunate... indeed phone which is useless as a phone > would sound like a failure. I hope openmoko engineers and developers resolve > the issue (bug report trace seems to reveal some improvements). > > Thanks for making us aware (my FR is still on its way) > > On Sun, 13 Jul 2008, Yorick Moko wrote: > > >>there is some talk about this on the devel-list: >>[1]http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003560. >>html >>[2]http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003562. >>html >>[3]http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003563. >>html >> > > >>On Sat, Jul 12, 2008 at 9:40 PM, Randy S. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>wrote: >> > > >> I am curious to know if anyone is using their FR as a phone. Mine >> has such poor audio quality, it is unfortunately useless as a >> phone. The audio I hear is clear but at a very low volume; the >> other person hears my voice very distorted and with a buzz. >> I am on T-Mobile in Texas, USA. >> > -- > Yaroslav Halchenko > Research Assistant, Psychology Department, Rutgers-Newark Student Ph.D. @ > CS Dept. NJIT > Office: (973) 353-5440x263 | FWD: 82823 | Fax: (973) 353-1171 > 101 Warren Str, Smith Hall, Rm 4-105, Newark NJ 07102 > WWW: http://www.linkedin.com/in/yarik > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community > > -- - "Just because I sound like an idiot doesn't mean I agree with the president."from an ad on Air America Radio ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
Diego Fernández Durán wrote: > I use the FR as a phone. > > And I trying to figure out where can I apply my C, C++, Gtk knowledge to > help in the development. > > A list of "small things that must be done" will be appreciated, so > anybody of us can use our free time to read the code, write a small > patch and summit it to a om developer. :) > Hi, Maybe look at the bugtracker, looking for bugs marked "enhancements", "task" or "trivial". I know I just filed one myself ;) -- Phyce ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
I use the FR as a phone. And I trying to figure out where can I apply my C, C++, Gtk knowledge to help in the development. A list of "small things that must be done" will be appreciated, so anybody of us can use our free time to read the code, write a small patch and summit it to a om developer. :) El dom, 13-07-2008 a las 10:11 +0200, Yorick Moko escribió: > there is some talk about this on the devel-list: > > http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003560.html > http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003562.html > http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003563.html > > On Sat, Jul 12, 2008 at 9:40 PM, Randy S. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > I am curious to know if anyone is using their FR as a phone. > Mine has such poor audio quality, it is unfortunately useless > as a phone. The audio I hear is clear but at a very low > volume; the other person hears my voice very distorted and > with a buzz. > > I am on T-Mobile in Texas, USA. > > ___ > Openmoko community mailing list > community@lists.openmoko.org > http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community -- Diego Fdez. Durán <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> | http://www.goedi.net GPG : 925C 9A21 7A11 3B13 6E43 50DB F579 D119 90D2 66BB signature.asc Description: Esta parte del mensaje está firmada digitalmente ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
RE: Anyone using FR as a phone?
I use mine. My kids used theirs till I gave it away to somebody else. That said, some people have expereince audio issues. Engineering is on the issue. Steve -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Yaroslav Halchenko Sent: Sunday, July 13, 2008 8:44 AM To: community@lists.openmoko.org Subject: Re: Anyone using FR as a phone? wow -- that is very unfortunate... indeed phone which is useless as a phone would sound like a failure. I hope openmoko engineers and developers resolve the issue (bug report trace seems to reveal some improvements). Thanks for making us aware (my FR is still on its way) On Sun, 13 Jul 2008, Yorick Moko wrote: >there is some talk about this on the devel-list: >[1]http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003560. >html >[2]http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003562. >html >[3]http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003563. >html >On Sat, Jul 12, 2008 at 9:40 PM, Randy S. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >wrote: > I am curious to know if anyone is using their FR as a phone. Mine > has such poor audio quality, it is unfortunately useless as a > phone. The audio I hear is clear but at a very low volume; the > other person hears my voice very distorted and with a buzz. > I am on T-Mobile in Texas, USA. -- Yaroslav Halchenko Research Assistant, Psychology Department, Rutgers-Newark Student Ph.D. @ CS Dept. NJIT Office: (973) 353-5440x263 | FWD: 82823 | Fax: (973) 353-1171 101 Warren Str, Smith Hall, Rm 4-105, Newark NJ 07102 WWW: http://www.linkedin.com/in/yarik ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
wow -- that is very unfortunate... indeed phone which is useless as a phone would sound like a failure. I hope openmoko engineers and developers resolve the issue (bug report trace seems to reveal some improvements). Thanks for making us aware (my FR is still on its way) On Sun, 13 Jul 2008, Yorick Moko wrote: >there is some talk about this on the devel-list: >[1]http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003560. >html >[2]http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003562. >html >[3]http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003563. >html >On Sat, Jul 12, 2008 at 9:40 PM, Randy S. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >wrote: > I am curious to know if anyone is using their FR as a phone. Mine > has such poor audio quality, it is unfortunately useless as a > phone. The audio I hear is clear but at a very low volume; the > other person hears my voice very distorted and with a buzz. > I am on T-Mobile in Texas, USA. -- Yaroslav Halchenko Research Assistant, Psychology Department, Rutgers-Newark Student Ph.D. @ CS Dept. NJIT Office: (973) 353-5440x263 | FWD: 82823 | Fax: (973) 353-1171 101 Warren Str, Smith Hall, Rm 4-105, Newark NJ 07102 WWW: http://www.linkedin.com/in/yarik ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
Re: Anyone using FR as a phone?
there is some talk about this on the devel-list: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003560.html http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003562.html http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-devel/2008-July/003563.html On Sat, Jul 12, 2008 at 9:40 PM, Randy S. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I am curious to know if anyone is using their FR as a phone. Mine has such > poor audio quality, it is unfortunately useless as a phone. The audio I > hear is clear but at a very low volume; the other person hears my voice very > distorted and with a buzz. > > I am on T-Mobile in Texas, USA. > ___ Openmoko community mailing list community@lists.openmoko.org http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/community
