[Computer-go] Is Go group pattern recognition by CNN possible?

2016-04-20 Thread djhbrown . 
Surely, someone, somewhere, has used, or tried to use, a CNN to label
groups in a Go game 361-pixellation?

Q: what's the point of Go?
A: 361

(you would have thought someone else would have already thought of that one)

Minsky and Papert threw a spanner into the works of the NN Magi of the
day, but whose grandchildren are now basking in the reflected glow of
their triumphal triumphant  Man Who Would be King Apollo
Al(pha)exander who has conquered further far East than Kaffiristan -
Peace Be Upon Her prophet Kipling.

The spanner was that the MPs found out that Perceptrons were Baron
Munchausen Walter Mittys who couldn't see the hole in a doughnut,
which meant that although they could learn to out-Pong space invaders,
they would become lost in a Pacman maze.  As they did, as Dm hirelings
let slip out of the bag.

Later, or before, depending on how you look at it, Backpropagators
claimed to have overcome this clog in their Jaquard's Loom in a Simple
Twist of Fate by claiming that Minsky was ancient history just as he
had claimed that they would so become [1], and now the new religion of
Stratified Convolutionism is claiming columnar accession to the throne
of AI, after Marchly breaking the back of the monster Orwellian
Goldstein gold standard Enemy of the Statespace, so it's just a few
weeks left to the Singularity, say the homeopathic snake-oil homology
self-promotional entrepreneurial salesmen.

Sir Humphrey: "Everything is connected... who said that?"
Bernard: "The Cabinet Secretary?"
Sir H: "Nearly right; actually, it was Lenin"

Norman Mailer once ranted that critics should be shot, but The Prince
Vespasian Flavius was cunninger, seeing the wisdom of his
Machiavelli-of-the-day Josephus that rather than claim to be the Sun
incarnate (as had his predecessors and as would his son's successors)
and attempt ViViVi by enfilade brute force, he could rule over the
southern desert troublemakers more easily and cheaply by spin
propaganda alone, simply by pretending he and his son Titus were the
earthly allegory of the heavenly born-again Messiah they yearned for
and put into that character's mouth the platitude that they should
render unto Caesar what is Caesar's, and love their enemies rather
than stone them.

And it worked, for two thousand years, and is still going strong
despite a few seminal whacky  leaks, just as Monty Python's Black
Adder Baldrick C(u)NN(ing) Plan has created a Reich that will last a
thousand years and upon which the sun will never set, so let us parrot
Hymn Number google in the Good Bok of Not the Nine O-Clock News [2]
and that other one:

 "it (symbolic reasoning) is an ex-parrot; it has ceased to be.  Monty
is Great!  I avow that there is no Go but Monty.".

Apologies to those unfamiliar with the various historical allusions
that are variously common and uncommon knowledge among readers of A
History of the English-Speaking Peoples, to whom it will be somewhat
illusory without Googling the Gogglebox. which may cause the more
insecure among them to jump on the bandwagon of striking the first
blow and casting the first stone for the umpteenth time, anxious for
attention and the comfort blanket of communal hatred of any straw man
that stumbles across their blinkered monochrome landscape, so to
relieve the burden of thought, Sherpa the Sean suggests somewheres to
start:

1. http://www.webofstories.com/play/marvin.minsky/25

2. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kqilW8OpeGc

Only a Dostoyevskian Idiot-ic lone wolf apostate would dare leave the
quiet safety of the silent steppes to risk the monotonic ugly-mouthed
egg-throwing of self-righteous smug lion camp followers snug in their
schooled mutual hatred of anything or anyone with more melanin or a
different perspective than their straightjacket mindset.

The record's stuck, the record's stuck.
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Re: [Computer-go] OmegaGo

2016-04-20 Thread Jim O'Flaherty 
The td;lr I got from his "treatise" was "be cautious investing in mimicking
AlphaGo's success, or you will be electrocuted by some Jacob fella"

djhbrown's been doing pretty well recently staying related and relevant to
the subject area. This is the first time in awhile he's wandered this far
off into his kind of free association space again. I sense he's looking to
be useful and taking stabs at being so. Everyone desires to be respected
and admired. Some people want it a bit more aggressively than others, and
some even more especially as they enter the latter stages of life.


On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 2:12 PM, uurtamo .  wrote:

> Pamphlets <= treatises
> On Apr 20, 2016 11:17 AM, "David Ongaro"  wrote:
>
>> Some of "Dr. Browns" pamphlets remind me of Herman Hesse's Steppenwolf.
>> But Hesse's text was much more refined and enjoyable to read, so I think
>> "SPAM" is a fitting categorisation.
>>
>>
>>
>> > On 20 Apr 2016, at 00:57, Michael Markefka 
>> wrote:
>> >
>> > Can I flag this as spam?
>> >
>> > On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:23 PM, djhbrown . 
>> wrote:
>> >> 6D out of the blue is no mean achievement,...  60+ years ago, the
>> >> market for gizmos in UK was flooded with cheap Japanese copies of
>> >> European products; but whilst innovation and product quality
>> >> improvement by European manufacturers faded as their fat cat owners
>> >> complacently went cocacola-soaked soft,  Japanese industry, unlike its
>> >> USA counterpart, was listening attentively to the wise words of
>> >> W.Edwards Deming (eg [1,2]) and beginning to improve the reliability,
>> >> efficiency and efficacy of its products, and by about 30 years ago,
>> >> Japanese engineering was the equal or better of even German
>> >> technology.
>> >>
>> >> Korean, Formosan and Hong Kong e-tigers followed hotfoot in Japan's
>> >> footsteps, and now the same thing is happening in China, so we can
>> >> expect to see a vast array of Shanghai-teenager-bedroom-produced
>> >> shanghaied miniclones of Alpha, most with unimaginative copycat names
>> >> like Beta, Eta, Theta, AIota etc, skulking around the corridors of the
>> >> Internet, all of which will at first be cheap imitations, but sowing
>> >> the seeds of in-house and inter-house R quality circles, so that
>> >> their own descendants will before very long become to Californian IT
>> >> as Japanese fuel-efficient reliable engines are to US unreliable
>> >> gas-guzzlers.
>> >>
>> >> Watch out Google Cloud byte-guzzlers, teenage rebels with the lessons
>> >> of Deming in their notebooks, who have learned from history and from
>> >> the sterling modus operandi of Steve Jobs and Uncle Tom Cobley et al,
>> >> are on their way up your Jacob's ladder...
>> >>
>> >> 1.  Charles A. Barclay (1993) Quality Strategy and TQM Policies:
>> >> Empirical Evidence.
>> >> MIR: Management International Review Vol. 33, Strategic Quality
>> Management.
>> >> 2.
>> http://asq.org/learn-about-quality/total-quality-management/overview/deming-points.html
>> >>
>>  Anybody knows who is the author of BetaGo? It is playing with account
>>  GoBeta on KGS, and is 6d.
>> >> ___
>> >> Computer-go mailing list
>> >> Computer-go@computer-go.org
>> >> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
>> > ___
>> > Computer-go mailing list
>> > Computer-go@computer-go.org
>> > http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
>>
>> ___
>> Computer-go mailing list
>> Computer-go@computer-go.org
>> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
>
>
> ___
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Re: [Computer-go] OmegaGo

2016-04-20 Thread uurtamo . 
Pamphlets <= treatises
On Apr 20, 2016 11:17 AM, "David Ongaro"  wrote:

> Some of "Dr. Browns" pamphlets remind me of Herman Hesse's Steppenwolf.
> But Hesse's text was much more refined and enjoyable to read, so I think
> "SPAM" is a fitting categorisation.
>
>
>
> > On 20 Apr 2016, at 00:57, Michael Markefka 
> wrote:
> >
> > Can I flag this as spam?
> >
> > On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:23 PM, djhbrown .  wrote:
> >> 6D out of the blue is no mean achievement,...  60+ years ago, the
> >> market for gizmos in UK was flooded with cheap Japanese copies of
> >> European products; but whilst innovation and product quality
> >> improvement by European manufacturers faded as their fat cat owners
> >> complacently went cocacola-soaked soft,  Japanese industry, unlike its
> >> USA counterpart, was listening attentively to the wise words of
> >> W.Edwards Deming (eg [1,2]) and beginning to improve the reliability,
> >> efficiency and efficacy of its products, and by about 30 years ago,
> >> Japanese engineering was the equal or better of even German
> >> technology.
> >>
> >> Korean, Formosan and Hong Kong e-tigers followed hotfoot in Japan's
> >> footsteps, and now the same thing is happening in China, so we can
> >> expect to see a vast array of Shanghai-teenager-bedroom-produced
> >> shanghaied miniclones of Alpha, most with unimaginative copycat names
> >> like Beta, Eta, Theta, AIota etc, skulking around the corridors of the
> >> Internet, all of which will at first be cheap imitations, but sowing
> >> the seeds of in-house and inter-house R quality circles, so that
> >> their own descendants will before very long become to Californian IT
> >> as Japanese fuel-efficient reliable engines are to US unreliable
> >> gas-guzzlers.
> >>
> >> Watch out Google Cloud byte-guzzlers, teenage rebels with the lessons
> >> of Deming in their notebooks, who have learned from history and from
> >> the sterling modus operandi of Steve Jobs and Uncle Tom Cobley et al,
> >> are on their way up your Jacob's ladder...
> >>
> >> 1.  Charles A. Barclay (1993) Quality Strategy and TQM Policies:
> >> Empirical Evidence.
> >> MIR: Management International Review Vol. 33, Strategic Quality
> Management.
> >> 2.
> http://asq.org/learn-about-quality/total-quality-management/overview/deming-points.html
> >>
>  Anybody knows who is the author of BetaGo? It is playing with account
>  GoBeta on KGS, and is 6d.
> >> ___
> >> Computer-go mailing list
> >> Computer-go@computer-go.org
> >> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
> > ___
> > Computer-go mailing list
> > Computer-go@computer-go.org
> > http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
>
> ___
> Computer-go mailing list
> Computer-go@computer-go.org
> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
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Re: [Computer-go] OmegaGo

2016-04-20 Thread David Ongaro 
Some of "Dr. Browns" pamphlets remind me of Herman Hesse's Steppenwolf. But 
Hesse's text was much more refined and enjoyable to read, so I think "SPAM" is 
a fitting categorisation.



> On 20 Apr 2016, at 00:57, Michael Markefka  wrote:
> 
> Can I flag this as spam?
> 
> On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:23 PM, djhbrown .  wrote:
>> 6D out of the blue is no mean achievement,...  60+ years ago, the
>> market for gizmos in UK was flooded with cheap Japanese copies of
>> European products; but whilst innovation and product quality
>> improvement by European manufacturers faded as their fat cat owners
>> complacently went cocacola-soaked soft,  Japanese industry, unlike its
>> USA counterpart, was listening attentively to the wise words of
>> W.Edwards Deming (eg [1,2]) and beginning to improve the reliability,
>> efficiency and efficacy of its products, and by about 30 years ago,
>> Japanese engineering was the equal or better of even German
>> technology.
>> 
>> Korean, Formosan and Hong Kong e-tigers followed hotfoot in Japan's
>> footsteps, and now the same thing is happening in China, so we can
>> expect to see a vast array of Shanghai-teenager-bedroom-produced
>> shanghaied miniclones of Alpha, most with unimaginative copycat names
>> like Beta, Eta, Theta, AIota etc, skulking around the corridors of the
>> Internet, all of which will at first be cheap imitations, but sowing
>> the seeds of in-house and inter-house R quality circles, so that
>> their own descendants will before very long become to Californian IT
>> as Japanese fuel-efficient reliable engines are to US unreliable
>> gas-guzzlers.
>> 
>> Watch out Google Cloud byte-guzzlers, teenage rebels with the lessons
>> of Deming in their notebooks, who have learned from history and from
>> the sterling modus operandi of Steve Jobs and Uncle Tom Cobley et al,
>> are on their way up your Jacob's ladder...
>> 
>> 1.  Charles A. Barclay (1993) Quality Strategy and TQM Policies:
>> Empirical Evidence.
>> MIR: Management International Review Vol. 33, Strategic Quality Management.
>> 2.  
>> http://asq.org/learn-about-quality/total-quality-management/overview/deming-points.html
>> 
 Anybody knows who is the author of BetaGo? It is playing with account
 GoBeta on KGS, and is 6d.
>> ___
>> Computer-go mailing list
>> Computer-go@computer-go.org
>> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
> ___
> Computer-go mailing list
> Computer-go@computer-go.org
> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go

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Re: [Computer-go] Lee Sedol's reviews on AlphaGo games

2016-04-20 Thread Ingo Althöfer 
Oliver, my new friend!
Thanks a lot for the link.

Very interesting photos - and also the
long list of (49) comments is interesting.

Thanks again, Ingo.
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Re: [Computer-go] Lee Sedol's reviews on AlphaGo games

2016-04-20 Thread Oliver Lewis 
Pictures of the charts are available here:
https://www.reddit.com/r/baduk/comments/4cgitz/alphagos_confidence_chart_for_the_5_games_david/
?

They're hard to read in detail but they still give a good impression of how
the evaluation developed during the games.

On Wed, Apr 20, 2016 at 11:26 AM, "Ingo Althöfer" <3-hirn-ver...@gmx.de>
wrote:

> Hi Aja,
>
> thanks for the reply.
>
> > David Silver did show AlphaGo's value graph of game 1 in his talk in UCL.
>
> Was that the talk on March 24?
> A pity, that I missed it...
>
> > AlphaGo's value at move 102 was higher than 60%. I'm not allowed to
> share the graph now
> > but I hope I have answered your question.
>
> Each single bit of information is appreciated :-)
>
> Ingo.
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Re: [Computer-go] Lee Sedol's reviews on AlphaGo games

2016-04-20 Thread Ingo Althöfer 
Hi Aja,

thanks for the reply.
 
> David Silver did show AlphaGo's value graph of game 1 in his talk in UCL. 

Was that the talk on March 24?
A pity, that I missed it...

> AlphaGo's value at move 102 was higher than 60%. I'm not allowed to share the 
> graph now 
> but I hope I have answered your question.
 
Each single bit of information is appreciated :-)

Ingo.
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Re: [Computer-go] OmegaGo

2016-04-20 Thread Michael Markefka 
Can I flag this as spam?

On Tue, Apr 19, 2016 at 11:23 PM, djhbrown .  wrote:
> 6D out of the blue is no mean achievement,...  60+ years ago, the
> market for gizmos in UK was flooded with cheap Japanese copies of
> European products; but whilst innovation and product quality
> improvement by European manufacturers faded as their fat cat owners
> complacently went cocacola-soaked soft,  Japanese industry, unlike its
> USA counterpart, was listening attentively to the wise words of
> W.Edwards Deming (eg [1,2]) and beginning to improve the reliability,
> efficiency and efficacy of its products, and by about 30 years ago,
> Japanese engineering was the equal or better of even German
> technology.
>
> Korean, Formosan and Hong Kong e-tigers followed hotfoot in Japan's
> footsteps, and now the same thing is happening in China, so we can
> expect to see a vast array of Shanghai-teenager-bedroom-produced
> shanghaied miniclones of Alpha, most with unimaginative copycat names
> like Beta, Eta, Theta, AIota etc, skulking around the corridors of the
> Internet, all of which will at first be cheap imitations, but sowing
> the seeds of in-house and inter-house R quality circles, so that
> their own descendants will before very long become to Californian IT
> as Japanese fuel-efficient reliable engines are to US unreliable
> gas-guzzlers.
>
> Watch out Google Cloud byte-guzzlers, teenage rebels with the lessons
> of Deming in their notebooks, who have learned from history and from
> the sterling modus operandi of Steve Jobs and Uncle Tom Cobley et al,
> are on their way up your Jacob's ladder...
>
> 1.  Charles A. Barclay (1993) Quality Strategy and TQM Policies:
> Empirical Evidence.
> MIR: Management International Review Vol. 33, Strategic Quality Management.
> 2.  
> http://asq.org/learn-about-quality/total-quality-management/overview/deming-points.html
>
>>> Anybody knows who is the author of BetaGo? It is playing with account
>>> GoBeta on KGS, and is 6d.
> ___
> Computer-go mailing list
> Computer-go@computer-go.org
> http://computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go
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