Re: [crossfire] GTK V2 client default layout and map size
On Tue, 12 Feb 2008 21:44:02 -0800, Mark Wedel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If you only have a display that does 1024x768, then the Oroboros is the likely winner. But if you have a higher res display, that probably isn't a first choice, as you have a lot more display area than it uses. It depends. Since I play from time to time using different computers, I end up using different screen resolutions: 1024x768, 1280x1024, 1600x1200, etc. I think that the original gtk v2 layout isn't too bad and I can even use it at 1024x768 using a few tricks to save space. If you look carefully, you will see that the gtk v2 and the Oroboros layout are almost the same, except that the map area is moved from the top left to the bottom right. Otherwise, both are based on a basic 2-columns layout, with one column containing the same 3 rows (messages, inventory, floor view) and the other other one containing the map and the stats/skills/etc. One difference is that Oroboros puts the HP/SP/Gr/Food/Exp bars inside one of the tabs instead of besides the tabs. I do not like this choice because it means that I cannot view these very important bars as easily when I am viewing the other tabs, so that's why I still prefer the v2 layout. I think that before we try to pick the best layout, there are two things that should be investigated: 1) What information is important to the players? What should always be visible on the screen and what can be toggled in/out of view using tabs or using any other appropriate mechanism? I would like to have a discussion on what we need to show before having a discussion about how it should be shown. 2) Is it possible to make the layout more flexible? Instead of having to select among a predefined set of layouts, could we find a way to provide a good default layout while still allowing the user to change it easily? After discussing these two points, then we can go back to the selection of the best layout if this is still relevant. I will start with a few comments on point 2) because this is related to what Mark wrote: Now it may be that the client should try and be smart and choose a best default layout based on various factors, like screen resolution. Same could be said for things like map size. A better approach may be to have a basic configuration program (or window) that is used first time client is run by user (no .crossfire file). A fair number of commercial games use that approach - configure the display resolution/quality you want to use, configure sound, etc. This is not an ideal approach because it forces to to select (automatically or via some configuration program) among a set of predefined layouts and maybe none of them is perfect for you. Instead, I would prefer to start with a good layout that can work well at low resolutions (a 2-columns layout) and then allow the user to add or remove a third column at any time and pick the tabs that should be in that column. I have some experience with that in GIMP: instead of having a fixed layout for all tools and dialogs, you can create any number of docks and drag tabs into these docks or out of them. GIMP uses separate top-level windows for the docks, but this could also be done using columns belonging to the same top-level window. Once you have done the initial effort to replace/subclass the GtkNotebook widgets, you get a lot more flexibility and then you do not have to worry anymore about what layout is best, because you know that the users will be able to re-organize the tabs according to their preferences. The main concern would be to select the best initial layout, but we would not need to worry about how a 2-columns layout wastes space on a widescreen display because we will know that it is easy to add a third column if the user wants it. I'm also not wild about the way the stats are displayed in all the layouts (which really isn't changed) - that is to say being in a single row: Str 5 Dex 6 Con 10, etc as that never seems really easy to find for me, and I can't think of any other game that displays them - doing them as a column, with column to the right (or maybe several) may be more readable and more effective use of space, eg: Str 6 Speed 0.50 Dex 10Weapon Speed0.80 Con 18Damage 15 Int 14WC 6 and so on. As an aside, since exp now has its own statbar, there really isn't much reason for there also to be a display in the stat area. A column layout might be nice for the stats. But regarding the point 1) that I mentioned above, I would be interested in a discussion about what we consider to be the most important information. Besides the map, messages and inventory, I would consider the following information to be important especially during combat and I would like a layout that allows me to see all of these things at the same time: Most important (sorted
Re: [crossfire] Using svnmerge for backporting to branch?
Hello. After applying a trivial bug fix for the manual pages of the clients, I thought about merging the patch to the 1.x branch. However, it looks like all previous merges have been done by hand (hopefully using svn merge) instead of using automated tools like svnmerge (no space). Or at least, I was unable to find the svn properties that are usually stored by svnmerge when it is used. I have no objection to use svnmerge, but as you point out *everyone* should it if we decide to use it. I would say for current trunk/branch it may not be that required, as I fully expect branch To Die Soon (tm) :) Except for bugfixes, of course. So maybe for the future 3.0 branch? Nicolas -- http://nicolas.weeger.org [Petit site d'images, de textes, de code, bref de l'aléatoire !] signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ crossfire mailing list crossfire@metalforge.org http://mailman.metalforge.org/mailman/listinfo/crossfire
[crossfire] New field: race_restriction
Hello. Just added what I hope is a fun feature: race restriction on items. From the wiki: Everything that can be applied, including items, exits, handles, and thus can have a ‘race_restriction’ key. The value should be set to a : delimited list of races that will be able to use/apply/open this item. The list is in the form: :race1:race2:...:racen: with leading and trailing :. Note that that this only applies to players - monsters can always apply everything. Also, Dungeon Masters are immune. Enjoy :) Nicolas -- http://nicolas.weeger.org [Petit site d'images, de textes, de code, bref de l'aléatoire !] signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ crossfire mailing list crossfire@metalforge.org http://mailman.metalforge.org/mailman/listinfo/crossfire
[crossfire] Race / class animations
Hello. I committed a few days ago a change that enables to have specific animations for all race/classe combinations. The animations should be called base race animation_class_name, so for instance a Fenx warrior will use animation fenx_player_class_warrior. So now we just need pics for all combos :) Nicolas -- http://nicolas.weeger.org [Petit site d'images, de textes, de code, bref de l'aléatoire !] signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part. ___ crossfire mailing list crossfire@metalforge.org http://mailman.metalforge.org/mailman/listinfo/crossfire
Re: [crossfire] GTK V2 client default layout and map size
Raphaël Quinet wrote: ther tabs, so that's why I still prefer the v2 layout. I think that before we try to pick the best layout, there are two things that should be investigated: 1) What information is important to the players? What should always be visible on the screen and what can be toggled in/out of view using tabs or using any other appropriate mechanism? I would like to have a discussion on what we need to show before having a discussion about how it should be shown. 2) Is it possible to make the layout more flexible? Instead of having to select among a predefined set of layouts, could we find a way to provide a good default layout while still allowing the user to change it easily? Agree on both points. There may also be other things that make the client easier to use. Some of how the client works dates all the way back to it just be X11, where some more complicated things would have been very hard to do, but are quite easy to do with the widgets provided by GTK. A better approach may be to have a basic configuration program (or window) that is used first time client is run by user (no .crossfire file). A fair number of commercial games use that approach - configure the display resolution/quality you want to use, configure sound, etc. This is not an ideal approach because it forces to to select (automatically or via some configuration program) among a set of predefined layouts and maybe none of them is perfect for you. Instead, I would prefer to start with a good layout that can work well at low resolutions (a 2-columns layout) and then allow the user to add or remove a third column at any time and pick the tabs that should be in that column. Yes, that is a better solution. I guess it depends on how much work it is to do. One nice thing right now is that all the layout work is done in glade. This makes it very easy to try different things, but also makes it very easy to add onto the layout. So while things could be done better, I'd want to make sure we don't drift away from also being able to manage the layouts within glade. Having thousands of lines of handwritten code to handle ideal layouts may be nice from an end user perspective, but starts to get really unmanagable from a developer perspective. At the same time, the first time a person runs the client, popping up some config options may still not be a bad thing, as right now, for lots of the config options, the client chooses defaults which may not be ideal. A column layout might be nice for the stats. But regarding the point 1) that I mentioned above, I would be interested in a discussion about what we consider to be the most important information. Besides the map, messages and inventory, I would consider the following information to be important especially during combat and I would like a layout that allows me to see all of these things at the same time: I'd make some adjustments even on those key points - inventory can/should be done better. Its been discussed, but what is really needed is ability to make up a custom list of objects I care about. In combat, there are probably less than 20 items I really need to see in my inventory - things like certain scrolls and potions, and maybe a few different weapons. I don't need to see all my items, and in fact, seeing all my items often makes it difficult to get to the ones I really need. Most important (sorted by order of importance): - HP/SP/Gr/Food bars - range (current spell or bow) - important if I have the wrong thing active and I am wondering why the monsters around me are not harmed - protections (percentages for all current protections, armor) - important especially when they change because I have been hit or a spell expires. Pretty much agree. But I also think a better way to manage the protections is needed. While I want to be able to see them, being able to easily notice that my resist fire has gone from 90 to 20 may be difficult. Ideally something like a spell monitor would be nice - protections on my character are almost certainly controlled by various potions the character drinks. Because the duration of these potions can not really change, it is a fairly simple matter for the server to inform the client that 'Joe drank a potion of fire resistance, it will last for 30 seconds'. Clearly it would be done in a more concise term than that, but you get the point. So maybe some space in the statbar area could be used for this. A simple solution would be to use different icons for the different resistances/spell effects, and the client draw a little stat along with the icon, so one can see how much time is left on the spell. - AC - damage - speed - weapon speed - WC While the above are handy, they also typically are not things that change in combat, so I don't really need to see them in a glance. At some point, less
