Re: [css-d] IE6 vs IE7

[david]

Barney Carroll wrote:
> Chris Ovenden wrote:
>> I have to disagree. According to the BBC
>> (http://www.bbc.co.uk/guidelines/newmedia/technical/browser_support.shtml),
>> only 23% of their visitors have XP SP2 installed (ie only about a
>> third of XP users). Even if we assume all those people accept the IE7
>> upgrade (and it's likely most will), it will remain a minority browser
>> for many years, if not forever. (I am skeptical about Vista ever being
>> widespread, which would be the main factor in further adoption, and
>> still contingent upon an as-yet undetected slowdown in Firefox use.)
> 
> I have to agree with this. There was a silent consensus of panic where I 
> work when I found that Microsoft were about to make IE7 a 'recommended 
> download'... Luckily IE7 is very well behaved over-all and I only had to 
> spend a couple of ours updating all our websites for it.
> 
> However, the assertion that Microsoft's announcement meant that everyone 
> will soon be using IE7 was not a reasonable one. As well as the factors 
> Chris points to, we have to consider the notion of people looking to 
> Vista PCs as alternatives to Macs - which in the popular eye are the new PC.

Another thing to think about re upgrades from IE6 to IE7. I've worked in 
large corporate environments the past 15 years. NONE of them use Windows 
update to update their PCs. They have techs and analysts who test any 
proposed update from MS - primarily to make sure that the update doesn't 
break anything of corporate importance. I think this means that the 
uptake of IE7 will be much slower than MS thinks. For an indication 
about corporate uptake of updates - the last corporate place I worked, a 
very large medical care system, was just now getting around to rolling 
out Windows XP. Windows 2000 was still their de facto standard ...

-- 
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Re: [css-d] IE6 vs IE7

[Jason Pruim]

On Nov 8, 2006, at 10:24 AM, Chris Ovenden wrote:


On 11/8/06, Barney Carroll <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Chris Ovenden wrote:

I have to disagree. According to the BBC
(http://www.bbc.co.uk/guidelines/newmedia/technical/ 
browser_support.shtml),

only 23% of their visitors have XP SP2 installed (ie only about a
third of XP users). Even if we assume all those people accept the  
IE7
upgrade (and it's likely most will), it will remain a minority  
browser
for many years, if not forever. (I am skeptical about Vista ever  
being

widespread, which would be the main factor in further adoption, and
still contingent upon an as-yet undetected slowdown in Firefox use.)


I have to agree with this. There was a silent consensus of panic  
where I
work when I found that Microsoft were about to make IE7 a  
'recommended
download'... Luckily IE7 is very well behaved over-all and I only  
had to

spend a couple of ours updating all our websites for it.

However, the assertion that Microsoft's announcement meant that  
everyone
will soon be using IE7 was not a reasonable one. As well as the  
factors

Chris points to, we have to consider the notion of people looking to
Vista PCs as alternatives to Macs - which in the popular eye are  
the new PC.


It certainly would be a very good time for Apple to loudly reduce
their notoriously high prices.

I don't want to start a holy war here and if anyone has any comments  
about what I'm going to type, please feel free to e-mail me off list  
to avoid such another debate on a public list that isn't appropriate  
for it.


Macs cost no more then similarly equipped windows based computers.  
there have been many articles about the new Mac Pro (The Tower)  
actually coming in quite a bit CHEAPER then a similar windows based  
alternative. But even if they did cost more up front, the TCO (Total  
Cost of Ownership) is by far less when you factor in the anti-virus,  
and a couple spyware/adware/malware detecters.



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Send these, the homeless tempest-tost to me,
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From “The New Colossus,” by Emma Lazarus



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Re: [css-d] IE6 vs IE7

[Chris Ovenden]

On 11/8/06, Barney Carroll <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Chris Ovenden wrote:
> > I have to disagree. According to the BBC
> > (http://www.bbc.co.uk/guidelines/newmedia/technical/browser_support.shtml),
> > only 23% of their visitors have XP SP2 installed (ie only about a
> > third of XP users). Even if we assume all those people accept the IE7
> > upgrade (and it's likely most will), it will remain a minority browser
> > for many years, if not forever. (I am skeptical about Vista ever being
> > widespread, which would be the main factor in further adoption, and
> > still contingent upon an as-yet undetected slowdown in Firefox use.)
>
> I have to agree with this. There was a silent consensus of panic where I
> work when I found that Microsoft were about to make IE7 a 'recommended
> download'... Luckily IE7 is very well behaved over-all and I only had to
> spend a couple of ours updating all our websites for it.
>
> However, the assertion that Microsoft's announcement meant that everyone
> will soon be using IE7 was not a reasonable one. As well as the factors
> Chris points to, we have to consider the notion of people looking to
> Vista PCs as alternatives to Macs - which in the popular eye are the new PC.

It certainly would be a very good time for Apple to loudly reduce
their notoriously high prices.

-- 
Chris Ovenden

http://thepeer.blogspot.com
"Imagine all the people / Sharing all the world"
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Re: [css-d] IE6 vs IE7

[Barney Carroll]

Chris Ovenden wrote:
> I have to disagree. According to the BBC
> (http://www.bbc.co.uk/guidelines/newmedia/technical/browser_support.shtml),
> only 23% of their visitors have XP SP2 installed (ie only about a
> third of XP users). Even if we assume all those people accept the IE7
> upgrade (and it's likely most will), it will remain a minority browser
> for many years, if not forever. (I am skeptical about Vista ever being
> widespread, which would be the main factor in further adoption, and
> still contingent upon an as-yet undetected slowdown in Firefox use.)

I have to agree with this. There was a silent consensus of panic where I 
work when I found that Microsoft were about to make IE7 a 'recommended 
download'... Luckily IE7 is very well behaved over-all and I only had to 
spend a couple of ours updating all our websites for it.

However, the assertion that Microsoft's announcement meant that everyone 
will soon be using IE7 was not a reasonable one. As well as the factors 
Chris points to, we have to consider the notion of people looking to 
Vista PCs as alternatives to Macs - which in the popular eye are the new PC.
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Re: [css-d] IE6 vs IE7

[Patrick James]

On Mon, 6 Nov 2006 11:50:06 +, Ross Hulford wrote
(in message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>):

> Hi Ian,
> 
> Have been deleloping using ie7 for a few weeks now and will have to say it 
> is much better. Really frustrating things like png alpha transparency are 
> now working whcih although not stricly a css issue does cause problems. A 
> nice feature is the full sceen zoom

When checking out web-sites with IE 7 it is a good idea to use that zoom to 
make sure that everything stays as it should.

The horizontal list at the top here looks great...



...until you zoom in 125% or 150%.

The solution to this is to create a seperate style-sheet for IE 7 and then 
put this declaration:

{ zoom: 100%; }

in the li selector.

In addition you need to create a padding declaration in the style-sheet and 
play around with it a bit until IE 7 behaves itself while zooming.


-- 
Patrick




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Re: [css-d] IE6 vs IE7

[phdm]

2006/11/6, Ross Hulford :
> There are however a few things that do not appear to be resolved and maybe
> someone could confirm this
>
> - double margin float
> - min-width/max-width

Ross,

It is crucial to emphasize that IE7 has a very different behaviour
depending on the mode: if IE7 works in strict mode, it will understand
min-width/max-width, it won't in quirks mode.

I am not sure about the double margin float.

Make a test where you just change the DTD for a page that contains:
#wrapper {
min-width: 740px;
width: 99%;
max-width: 70em;
border: 1px solid red;
}

In strict mode, IE7 will perfectly understand these rules.
-- 
Philippe  DE MOURA
  ><> phdm ><>
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Re: [css-d] IE6 vs IE7

[Ross Hulford]

Hi Ian,

Have been deleloping using ie7 for a few weeks now and will have to say it 
is much better. Really frustrating things like png alpha transparency are 
now working whcih although not stricly a css issue does cause problems. A 
nice feature is the full sceen zoom (which opera has had for a while now), 
this will effect the text size/page break issues and will probably allow 
accessible sites to be more design rich as you will not have to stick to the 
old two column layout for it to be bulletproof.

There are however a few things that do not appear to be resolved and maybe 
someone could confirm this


- double margin float
- min-width/max-width


Ross


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Re: [css-d] IE6 vs IE7

[Chris Ovenden]

On 11/6/06, Erik Harris <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On the bright side, any XP user who has update
> notification turned on will be prompted to install it automatically, so it
> should have pretty wide usage among WinXP users who haven't seen the light
> and downloaded Firefox or Opera. :)
>

I have to disagree. According to the BBC
(http://www.bbc.co.uk/guidelines/newmedia/technical/browser_support.shtml),
only 23% of their visitors have XP SP2 installed (ie only about a
third of XP users). Even if we assume all those people accept the IE7
upgrade (and it's likely most will), it will remain a minority browser
for many years, if not forever. (I am skeptical about Vista ever being
widespread, which would be the main factor in further adoption, and
still contingent upon an as-yet undetected slowdown in Firefox use.)

-- 
Chris Ovenden

http://thepeer.blogspot.com
"Imagine all the people / Sharing all the world"
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Re: [css-d] IE6 vs IE7

[Erik Harris]

At 07:02 PM 11/5/2006, Ian Parsons wrote:
>With regards to CSS, is IE7 more or less friendly than IE6?

More, but still far from perfect.  They appear to have added support for 
fixed positioning, and they've added hover support for more than just  
elements.  Unfortunately, even though it shares a great deal of code with 
IE6, they only released it for WinXP SP2 and later operating 
systems.  Anyone using any DOS-based Windows (98 and ME are still pretty 
common) or even Windows 2000 will be unable to upgrade, limiting its 
userbase quite a bit.  On the bright side, any XP user who has update 
notification turned on will be prompted to install it automatically, so it 
should have pretty wide usage among WinXP users who haven't seen the light 
and downloaded Firefox or Opera. :)

Erik Harrishttp://www.eHarrisHome.com
-AIM: KngFuJoe - Yahoo IM: kungfujoe7 - ICQ: 2610172-
Chinese-Indonesian Martial Arts Club  http://www.kungfu-silat.com

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Re: [css-d] IE6 vs IE7

[Ian Young]

>
>
> So as to remain somewhat on topic, I'll phrase my question carefully ;)
>
>
>
> With regards to CSS, is IE7 more or less friendly than IE6?
>
>
>
> Thanks!
>
>
>
> Ian

That depends on your point of view. If you mean is it more compliant than
IE6, then the answer is yes. Not perfect but a much better offering.

Ian
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[css-d] IE6 vs IE7

[Ian Parsons]

Hi all, 

 

So as to remain somewhat on topic, I'll phrase my question carefully ;) 

 

With regards to CSS, is IE7 more or less friendly than IE6? 

 

Thanks!

 

Ian 

 

 

 

www.k5zm.com

 

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