Re: [CTRL] Fwd: Muslim Cleric Calls for Death of Author Who Wrote on Islam

2001-07-01 Thread YnrChyldzWyld

-Caveat Lector-

On Sat, 30 Jun 2001 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
You better buy an American history book that was written at least
50 years ago-if you want any thing near the  truth. Anything written
later than that is a waste of paper.

Generally, true...but ANY history book will show that the American
colonists did NOT 'go to war over the Declaration of Independence' as
Aleisha opined, since the Declaration wasn't written and ratified until
over a year AFTER hostilities broke out...


June

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Re: [CTRL] Fwd: Muslim Cleric Calls for Death of Author Who Wrote on Islam

2001-07-01 Thread YnrChyldzWyld

-Caveat Lector-

On Sun, 1 Jul 2001, Aleisha Saba wrote:
Now Benjamin Franklin and William
Hogarth  see their hand in this document for this Article I, Section 8

The Declaration of Independence doesn't have any Articles or Sections...


you can be sure - well look at all the stuff Benjamin Franklin invented
even unto almost getting knocked on his can with a kite...

Franklin 'invented' nothing with his infamous experiment, neither the
kite, the key, nor the theory that prompted his experiment.  Such
experiments had been done throughout Europe for more than a decade before
Franklin's attempt, and he was merely trying to recreate what had already
been done.

But Franklin was his own best publicist, and succeeded in 'selling' the
idea that he'd 'discovered' something that no one else had...

Because the other experimenters had only published their findings in
obscure scientific journals; Franklin trumpeted his feat to the general
public...   ;-)



Finally, a decade of conflicts between the British government and the
colonists, beginning with the Stamp Act crisis in 1765, led to the
outbreak of war in 1775 and the Declaration of Independence in 1776.

So you see, Aleisha, you were wrong to state that the war BEGAN over 'a
piece of paper' called the Declaration of Independence.


  ©2001 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.  Terms of
Use   Advertise   TRUSTe Approved Privacy Statement

If you think any history book printed in the past 50 years is
questionable, then you should be pretty leery of any history courtesy of
Microsoft...



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[CTRL] Fwd: Muslim Cleric Calls for Death of Author Who Wrote on Islam

2001-06-30 Thread Aleisha Saba

Now this is the way to sell a book; like when we were kids if it was
banned in Boston -you knew it was a best seller.

But then people went to war over a Document entitled the Declaration of
Independence and a war was fought over an ear once.

So how to sell a book - send yourself a lot of death threats, all the
police, the FBI,  and terrorize yourself with death threats..throw
in a little bit of sex - or earthy matters and people will be panting
and fighting to get the book.

Saba


Welcome, saba22  
Sign Up for Newsletters  |  Log Out    Go to Advanced Search

June 30, 2001
Muslim Cleric Calls for Death of Author Who Wrote on Islam

By DEAN E. MURPHY

 The New York Times Khalid Duran, a Muslim author who has been called an
apostate.
Expanded Coverage
In Depth: Religion radical Muslim cleric in Jordan has issued a
religious opinion that advocates the death of a Muslim scholar in the
United States in punishment for a book he wrote about Islam.

The cleric, Sheik Abdel Moneim Abu Zant, declared the author, Khalid
Duran, an apostate and called on Muslims in the United States to unify
against him, a Jordanian newspaper aligned with the cleric reported.
The paper also reported that Mr. Abu Zant urged two prominent Sunni
Islamic religious institutions to issue judgments of apostasy against
Mr. Duran, the equivalent of a death sentence.

The book, Children of Abraham, an introduction to Islam, was
commissioned by the American Jewish Committee as part of a project to
promote better understanding between Jews and Muslims. It was reported
to be offensive for distorting Islam by focusing too much on issues
like female circumcision, the relationship between men and woman,
whether Ramadan observances decreased productivity and whether head
scarves contributed to marital infidelity.

The edict was reported on June 6 in the weekly Arabic newspaper Al-
Shahed, or The Observer, which is aligned with the Islamic Action Front,
the party of the Muslim Brotherhood, to which Mr. Abu Zant belongs. It
is the main political opposition party in Jordan.

The newspaper reported that the book's publication was evidence of an
evil intention to besmear the image of Islam in the United States. The
intended result of the edict was that Mr. Duran's blood will be shed,
the newspaper said.

Michael J. Wildes, Mr. Duran's lawyer, said that Mr. Duran, 61, had been
moved from his suburban Washington home and was being provided 24-hour
private security.

The American Jewish Committee condemned the threat but said it had no
plans to withdraw the book, which is for sale on the Internet and will
be in bookstores soon.

In a free society no one should tolerate the threat to kill an author,
said David A. Harris, executive director of the Jewish group, which is
also publishing a book about Judaism for Muslims.

All Americans, not least Muslims, should immediately speak out against
this outrage and assault on democratic society.

Mr. Duran, who was born in Germany and moved to the United States in the
1980's, said yesterday that he had received death threats over the years
because of writings that criticize extremist Islamic groups. But he had
never been the target of a religious edict.

He said the edict surprised him because unlike much of his academic and
journalistic work, Children of Abraham was meant to have no particular
point of view. Its aim was to present a variety of opinions.

One thing is clear: He has not read the book, Mr. Duran said of Mr.
Abu Zant. I hear every day from other Muslims who have read the book
that they like the book.

David Schenker, a research fellow at the Washington Institute for Near
East Policy, said the edict by Mr. Abu Zant did not carry the same
religious authority as the one against Salman Rushdie, which was issued
in 1989 by the Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini. Mr. Schenker described Mr.
Abu Zant as more of a populist religious figure than an accomplished
Islamic religious scholar.

Even before its publication, the book and its author were criticized by
some Muslims in the United States, including the Council on
American-Islamic Relations, or CAIR, an advocacy group in Washington
that often sides with Muslim hard-liners on Middle East issues.

The groups questioned Mr. Duran's credentials and suggested that the
book sensationalized some issues, like the treatment of women in Islamic
societies.

Officials at the American Jewish Committee said that attacks by CAIR
most likely laid the foundation for Mr. Abu Zant's edict, particularly
since the article in Al-Shahed mentioned the American group.

But Ibrahim Hooper, a spokesman for CAIR, said the Jewish organization
was making too much of the Al- Shahed article. Mr. Hooper described the
article as an editorial in a party newspaper that nobody ever heard
of. He said that Mr. Abu Zant was making a recommendation to the Sunni
religious authorities, not issuing a death sentence of his own.

Even if he said what the American Jewish Committee says he said, it is

Re: [CTRL] Fwd: Muslim Cleric Calls for Death of Author Who Wrote on Islam

2001-06-30 Thread YnrChyldzWyld

-Caveat Lector-

On Sat, 30 Jun 2001, Aleisha Saba wrote:
But then people went to war over a Document entitled the Declaration of
Independence

This statement once again proves what an idiot you are.

I suggest you go to your local college and buy and READ their textbook
for American Colonial History 101...

I'll even give you a clue, Aleisha, as an early Independence Day gift:

The American Revolutionary War started in April 1775; the Declaration
of Independence wasn't drafted until the late spring of 1776 and ratified
in July of 1776.



June

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Re: [CTRL] Fwd: Muslim Cleric Calls for Death of Author Who Wrote on Islam

2001-06-30 Thread c.

-Caveat Lector-

- Original Message -
From: Aleisha Saba [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, June 30, 2001 12:47 PM
Subject: [CTRL] Fwd: Muslim Cleric Calls for Death of Author Who Wrote on
Islam


..throw
in a little bit of sex - or earthy matters and people will be panting
and fighting to get the book.

Saba


sex OR earthy matters?
i didn't know you had an interest in the geosciences aleisha
me too, gets me hot to read about a tasty bit of stratigraphy now and
again

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Re: [CTRL] Fwd: Muslim Cleric Calls for Death of Author Who Wrote on Islam

2001-06-30 Thread Aleisha Saba

-Caveat Lector-

Well c. June is our expert here on sodomy, lesbianism, homosexuality and
things like that.

You two would make an ideal couple;  that is, however, if you like
females who are taller sitting down than standing up?

Saba

So as the sailor's used to say, put a flag over her head and do it for
Old Gay Pride?

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Re: [CTRL] Fwd: Muslim Cleric Calls for Death of Author Who Wrote on Islam

2001-06-30 Thread c.

-Caveat Lector-

- Original Message -
From: Aleisha Saba [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, June 30, 2001 2:51 PM
Subject: Re: [CTRL] Fwd: Muslim Cleric Calls for Death of Author Who Wrote
on Islam


 -Caveat Lector-

 Well c. June is our expert here on sodomy, lesbianism, homosexuality and
 things like that.

on the contrary, saba baby, if i do a word search on my ctrl archive on
sodomy then guess who's posts show up more than anybody elses, by a large
margin? do i need to tell *you*? hehe



 You two would make an ideal couple;  that is, however, if you like
 females who are taller sitting down than standing up?

another obsession of yours is that you keep using weight as an ad hominem
attack. it happens a lot. that and calling women pig. i guess you are one
of these tall leggy types ( i am myself), but you know something? i really
do prefer short, overweight women. putting her down cause she is (you allege
anyway) short and overwieght makes her more attractive to me. why are your
personal attacks so damn lame? is that all you got in your (ahem) arsenal?
;)
nyah nyah you are a fat pig nyah nyah you are a gay homosexual nyah nyah

when i read your posts i hear cartman's voice. anyone else got a cool
fantasy voice for saba?


 Saba

 So as the sailor's used to say, put a flag over her head and do it for
 Old Gay Pride?

hung around a few harbour bars have we aleisha? *wink*

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Re: [CTRL] Fwd: Muslim Cleric Calls for Death of Author Who Wrote on Islam

2001-06-30 Thread YnrChyldzWyld

-Caveat Lector-

On Sat, 30 Jun 2001, c. wrote:
 You two would make an ideal couple;  that is, however, if you like
 females who are taller sitting down than standing up?

another obsession of yours is that you keep using weight as an ad hominem
attack. it happens a lot. that and calling women pig. i guess you are one
of these tall leggy types

I doubt it.  People who fixate on certain aspects in other people are
really having problems coming to terms with those same aspects in
themselves.

I got the 'short' aspect of her strange analogy, but fail to see where it
relates to weight.


when i read your posts i hear cartman's voice. anyone else got a cool
fantasy voice for saba?

Dana Carvey's Church Lady...

Isn't THATSPECIAL!

Or Lily Tomlin's switchboard operator who speaks in a real nasal
voice and snorts like a pig...


 So as the sailor's used to say, put a flag over her head and do it for
 Old Gay Pride?

hung around a few harbour bars have we aleisha? *wink*

It would seem so.  She seems to have much more knowledge in these
matters than I do.

Me, I'm just a plain old heterosexual female who's never had any
complaints from any of the men I've been with  ;-)



June

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Re: [CTRL] Fwd: Muslim Cleric Calls for Death of Author Who Wrote on Islam

2001-06-30 Thread lassey

-Caveat Lector-

Aleisha,

You better buy an American history book that was written at least
50 years ago-if you want any thing near the  truth. Anything written
later
than that is a waste of paper.

On Sat, 30 Jun 2001 09:35:13 -0400 YnrChyldzWyld [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
 -Caveat Lector-

 On Sat, 30 Jun 2001, Aleisha Saba wrote:
 But then people went to war over a Document entitled the
 Declaration of
 Independence

 This statement once again proves what an idiot you are.

 I suggest you go to your local college and buy and READ their
 textbook
 for American Colonial History 101...

 I'll even give you a clue, Aleisha, as an early Independence Day
 gift:

 The American Revolutionary War started in April 1775; the
 Declaration
 of Independence wasn't drafted until the late spring of 1776 and
 ratified
 in July of 1776.



 June

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 propagandic
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 sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'—with its many half-truths,
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Re: [CTRL] Fwd: Muslim Cleric Calls for Death of Author Who Wrote on Islam

2001-06-30 Thread Aleisha Saba

-Caveat Lector-

Thanks Lassey - I do have some old books here (plus 1000 or more in
addition to those) and some date back to late 1600 period (of English
origin).

The Revolutuionary War was the War of Independence.then came the
document where it was as a judge would say in court, reduced to writing.

Old Hells Fire Club had a lot to do with this document as it broke up
because of this upcoming war - some wanted American to be loyal to the
King but John Wilkes sided with Americans in wanting freedom - these
Hogarth prints I have are over 200 years old = some of the plates
engraved in late 1600 period.

They (the prints) tell a history of England and I find too in Art - well
Hogarth prints full of masonic secrets, like the five dollar bills with
hidden dates?

So thanks Lassey - appreciate the thougtht.
Only book I have read as of late is Kris' book BARRY AND THE BOYS and
boy that is a must read if you are sincerly a conspracy advocate...This
was the War of Independence - period.  Now Benjamin Franklin and William
Hogarth  see their hand in this document for this Article I, Section 8
refers to the Arts an Sciences but people do not understand what this
really means...Hogarth was responsible for first copyright act and
you can be sure - well look at all the stuff Benjamin Franklin invented
even unto almost getting knocked on his can with a kite.and he was
Illuminati in the English Club and this is why he is often credited with
being English Spy.his son was, I think loyal to the crown.

Thanks again Lassy and this is a nice item you might enjoy - The War of
Independence, and then, it was reduced to writing?

Saba




American Revolution (1775-1783), conflict between 13 British colonies
in North America and their parent country, Great Britain.

It was made up of two related events:

 the American War of Independence (1775-1783) and the formation of the
American government as laid out by the Constitution of the United States
in 1787.

First, the war achieved independence from Great Britain by the colonies.
Second, the newly created United States of America established a
republican form of government, in which power resided with the people.

The revolution had many causes. Long-term social, economic, and
political changes in the colonies before 1750 provided the basis for an
independent nation with representative political institutions. More
immediately, the French and Indian War (1754-1763) changed the
relationship between the colonies and their mother country.

Finally, a decade of conflicts between the British government and the
colonists, beginning with the Stamp Act crisis in 1765, led to the
outbreak of war in 1775 and the Declaration of Independence in 1776.

Once independent, the new state governments implemented republican
constitutions, and a Continental Congress directed the American war
effort.

Then in 1781 the rebellious states created a loose union under the
Articles of Confederation.
At the end of the war in 1783, Britain recognized its former colonies as
an independent nation. In 1789 the people of the several states ratified
the Constitution that created a stronger central government.
II.

The British Colonies in 1750
Print section

A. The American People
Print section
Britain's 13 North American colonies experienced an extraordinary rate
of population growth. In 1700 the population was about 250,000; seven
decades later there were about 2,500,000 inhabitants, a tenfold
increase. This phenomenal growth was a prerequisite for a successful
independence movement. In 1700 there were 20 people in Britain for every
American colonist; by 1775 this ratio had fallen to 3 to 1.

The American population also changed in composition. The proportion of
the colonists who were of English culture and ancestry steadily declined
during the 1700s as the result of the arrival, by forced or voluntary
migration, of new racial and ethnic groups. Among the 80 percent of
Americans who were of European descent, there were important cultural
divisions. Migrants from Germany, Scotland, and Ireland made up at least
30 percent of the white population.

Members of these groups often settled in their own communities,
especially in the mid-Atlantic colonies of Delaware, New York, New
Jersey, and Pennsylvania. Others migrated into the backcountry regions
of the Southern colonies (Maryland, Virginia, North Carolina, South
Carolina, and Georgia), thus adding ethnic diversity to a region already
divided along racial lines. Only the New England colonies of
Connecticut, Rhode Island, Massachusetts, and New Hampshire remained
predominantly English in composition and culture.

In 1775 about one-fifth of the people of the mainland colonies were of
African ancestry. Unlike Latin America and the West Indies, North
American slaves had a high rate of natural increase. About 250,000
Africans were brought to the mainland colonies before 1775, but the
total black population numbered 567,000 on the eve of independence. Most